Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Thanks Robert, for a 10-year-old organization, some things still seem to be in the early stages (training?). I'm new here so maybe this isn't entirely accurate. Thanks, Cheers . . . . . . . . Spring At 07-05-2015 14:11 Thursday, Robert Banick wrote: Hi All, Excellent points and criticisms all around. The amount of feedback from new contributors during this response has been extremely welcome but also a bit humbling at times. Weâve got so much to do. A few quick responses to key points. 1. OSM is 10 years old but for much of that time was a âby nerds, for nerdsâ project. Only in the past few years have the tools for conventional GIS usage really come into their own. 2. HOT itself has been around for a long time, but only took off 5 years ago after the earthquake in Haiti. Since then itâs been a slow but steady journey towards professionalism. Weâve spent a lot of our energy working with local communities and building up critical technical infrastructure like the Tasking Manager which trust me,, did not appear out of nowhere. Clearly itâs time to invest in training materials. 3. HOTâs contributions are used and makes a difference. I used to work for the Red Cross and we used OSM data from HOT *all the time*. In many cases it was the *only* data for disaster affected areas. Simply put, it was irreplaceable. And if sometimes it was not 100% accurate, that was OK. 90% accurate is better than 0% available. 4. You all bring up such good points and criticisms. Right now a lot of people are working themselves to death just responding, so please donât take it personally if you donât get immediate responses to your suggestions. Please stick around until we have time to follow up and work with you to make things better. It may take a month but it will be so valuable. Cheers, Robert Sent from Mailbox On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 9:31 PM, Pierre Béland pierz...@yahoo.fr wrote: OSM and HOT are volunteer organizations. And we are force to adapt rapidly to the reality of responses like for Nepal. People with experience to develop such material either through a wiki page, github or other are welcomed. With the extent of this response, we organized various support groups to take care of Imagery, Validation, Imports, Routing, etc. We also have a HOT training group. People interested to contribute can write to activation @ hotosm.org. We will follow your contact to the training group. regard  Pierre De : Steve Bower sbo...@gmavt.net à: Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com Cc : HOT hot@openstreetmap.org Envoyé le : Jeudi 7 mai 2015 11h06 Objet : Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions A few thoughts on the training materials, from a 2-week OSM user and long-time GIS user: I have not yet found the single, systematically organized portal for access to all training materials events, This would be great to have, and other training references could point back to it. The closest I have found is the HOT Training working group, current sources and materials: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Humanitarian_OSM_Team/Working_groups/Training#Current_Sources_.26_Materials But, for example, that page does not point to How to get started contributing to a HOT task: https://gist.github.com/meetar/b9929dfec129d1d7f5f2 So yes, Suzan, I think organization and production of comprehensive training material is a great idea - thank you. I think getting the top-down organization right is key. It seems this would be guided by the HOT Training working group (is there a general OSM training working group?). Existing training materials on how to use OSM and the editors is fairly comprehensive, but somewhat scattered. Multiple sources overlap in the material they cover. An OSM/HOT training portal would help identify gaps and guide where new material (including new videos) is needed. Training on how to interpret features from imagery is minimal. This could really be expanded, with examples of special cases, especially for poor-quality imagery where interpretation is difficult. Interpretation issues seem to dominate a lot of quality concerns and newbie questions. I don't think it's reasonable to expect new mappers to be able to take quick start training and jump into contributing, at least for those who have not mapped before. For HOT response in particular, I think the expectation should be that mappers should expect to invest at least a day of on-line training before starting to contribute. Yes, that would turn away some mappers, but with the benefit of fewer quality issues. Yes, you can learn to trace buildings in far less time, but many mappers soon confront more complex tasks and a better training foundation would serve them well. (My opinion on this may evolve...) Cheers, Steve On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Althio and all. I don't understand the shared document format, and don't find it an easy place to express these views, nor do I
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Hello althio, I did make quite a few additions to the shared document, that is a good method for consolidating ideas in one place. I am a bit nervous about the 1 min. concept. 1 min. is not very long, most topics are going to require a bit more than that. Surely, we can expect the volunteer's attention span to stretch to perhaps three or 5 min. If the videos are only 1 min. long, hundreds will be required to cover the whole realm. Cataloging them will be a major task and who will want to wade through scores of video listings to find a paltry 1 min. dissertation? Thanks, Cheers . . . . . . . . Spring At 07-05-2015 14:18 Thursday, althio wrote: Springfield, Suzan, all, special mention to Lars, I do encourage you to share your suggestions and experience as newcomers in the shared document where it could be put to much better use than in the mailing list. You have the opportunity to get involved at a very veeery early stage of this videos project. Of course the document is pretty rough, this is collaborative and brainstorming. Seize the day. Make your mark. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing Another disclaimer: this initiative of 1-minute videos is led by MissingMaps. I fully support it and try to foster it but I am not in charge. People in charge may not read or answer in this mailing list. If you want to give feedback and ideas on this: go and edit the shared document. Let me be blunt at this point: in the scope of this video project, when pointed to an external document, any comment left in the mailing list is 100 times less useful and 1000 times more likely to be forgotten. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing As everything in open data and open source, don't be afraid of making some errors. Your input will be reviewed and modified by others, and everything will improve with time and contributions. The instructional materials that do exist also seem to be scattered among many sites and documents; I have given up trying to keep track. That statement applies to all fields of knowledge that I know of. - althio wall of links: active contributor in the Training Working Group train...@hotosm.org http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Humanitarian_OSM_Team/Working_groups/Training member of the LearnOSM team learn...@hotosm.org http://learnosm.org/en/beginner/ HOT is a partner of MSF-UK, British Red Cross and American Red Cross with MissingMaps http://www.missingmaps.org/ http://www.msf.org.uk/missing-maps-project http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Missing_Maps_Project Fresh from today: http://www.msf.org.uk/msf-scientific-day-catch-up Session 1: Keynote speech unchartered territory: mapping for humanitarian responses ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Dear all, I also added a few comments, there are some really great ideas there. However in the meantime, the MapGive videos are already a great resource. One of our volunteers have started to translate the transcript of the video Learn How to Map in OpenStreetMap in French. Do you know who we should get in touch with to have it integrated as subtitles on the video (it's already in Italian so it must be possible) ? And if it'd be possible to get the subtitle file in English, to facilitate the timing? Thanks best regards. -- Martin Noblecourt *m_nobleco...@cartong.org | Bureau/Office: +33 (0)4 79 26 28 82 | Skype: martin.noblecourt* CartONG - Mapping and information management for humanitarian organizations | Cartographie et gestion de l'information pour les organisations humanitaires ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Hi Laura, as I suggested some days ago, I'd like to add these video training (while done) to a moodle course I will support that. And maybe be able to synch the moodle course training with the task manager permission to edit maps. Maybe... but that can be considered later. It is not a must-have from my point-of-view. Let us try first to put good documentation and training. Let us see later if we still need to add permission and locks. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, even better, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needs for training materials... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Training My major problem with the current training, it's long, boring, and slow. A Quick Start Guide would be perfect for someone like me. A video with this information would be great. I could not go through the training because it went too slow, so I missed some information, but found the process for someone like me who works in Photoshop pretty easy and intuitive, but I'm not a usual newbie. An orientation video for the area being mapped. I don't think many mappers know what buildings in remote areas of Nepal look like, or that villages are spread out over a big area, or that paths just end and do not connect in rural Nepal. A video with still and moving images I believe would be a big help. People could then see buildings are not square, built out of piles of rocks, and are often two stories tall with animals below and people above. Roofs are tin, or packed earth. If mappers could see this I think they would do a better job mapping. The video could also go over other details of the project. I'd be willing to help with this. Mentors I have connected with someone who is my mentor and checks my work. Think it would be great if every newbie could have a mentor, or a group of mentors to submit work to. Correcting other's work We all want to do a good job, but I don't think the training gives the most important information up front, i.e. make buildings the right size and square. I've just deleted and redrawn about 100 buildings that were not square nor did they fit on the image footprint. The mappers probably thought a rough polygon would let people know a building existed in that spot, but that's not what's needed. Same with paths that didn't conform to the image. How to do it right would be so helpful if included in the training up front. I don't think most people have the patience to go through slow training, or my DVD wouldn't have come with a Quick Start Guide! I'm a Newbie, and I recommend newbies be limited to drawing buildings and adding roads and paths. Experts should draw Residential Areas in rural areas and note forests and other features. I've corrected hundreds of buildings and paths. It's a waste of time and energy for the original mapper and the person correcting. We all want to do a good job or we wouldn't be spending hours mapping. Hope this helps. Cheers! Suzan On May 6, 2015, at 11:10 PM, Laura Camellini wrote: Hi all, as I suggested some days ago, I'd like to add these video training (while done) to a moodle course, And maybe be able to synch the moodle course training with the task manager permission to edit maps. Do you think this could help you with your tasks? Regards, LauraC 2015-05-07 3:16 GMT+02:00 Mhairi O'Hara mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org: Dear Hotties, Please see the e-mail from Pete Masters from the Missing Maps project: We are thinking about putting together some video training resources for HOT mapping for newbies. No concrete plans yet, just getting some thoughts together. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, even better, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needs for training materials... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing Cheers, Pete -- Pete Masters Missing Maps Project Coordinator +44 7921 781 518 missingmaps.org @pedrito1414 @theMissingMaps facebook.com/MissingMapsProject -- Mhairi O'Hara Technical Project Manager Email: mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org Indonesian Mobile: +62 822 4701 1475 Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team Using OpenStreetMap for Humanitarian Response Economic Development ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Althio and all. I don't understand the shared document format, and don't find it an easy place to express these views, nor do I understand where I could add to it in a constructive way. That's why I expressed my thoughts here, so that someone who understands the shared document format could incorporate these thoughts if they are useful. I'm sure Im not the only newbie who has the same exact feelings and thoughts. We all want to do a good job, we all want concise, well done training that gets us going quickly, we all want to contribute to a healthy, successful project that helps people. I hope leadership can find people and resources to make good training available. So far, like Spring, I'm a bit confused. Are my hours of work going to do any good for the people who live in the hundreds of houses I've mapped? I hope so. Fingers crossed. All that said, as a designer and writer expert in technical documenting, I would be happy to help with the production of a comprehensive set of training tools. Small group, hopefully? I'm also adept at working in a global environment, cross culturally. Use me if you wish. Suzan On May 7, 2015, at 12:44 AM, althio wrote: Suzan, As you are interested to help with these 1-min video: please join the shared document, read it and update it. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, even better, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needs for training materials... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing Your other comments (about current training) are certainly valid but this is not the best thread for that. Cheers, - althio On 7 May 2015 at 09:30, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Training My major problem with the current training, it's long, boring, and slow. A Quick Start Guide would be perfect for someone like me. A video with this information would be great. I could not go through the training because it went too slow, so I missed some information, but found the process for someone like me who works in Photoshop pretty easy and intuitive, but I'm not a usual newbie. An orientation video for the area being mapped. I don't think many mappers know what buildings in remote areas of Nepal look like, or that villages are spread out over a big area, or that paths just end and do not connect in rural Nepal. A video with still and moving images I believe would be a big help. People could then see buildings are not square, built out of piles of rocks, and are often two stories tall with animals below and people above. Roofs are tin, or packed earth. If mappers could see this I think they would do a better job mapping. The video could also go over other details of the project. I'd be willing to help with this. Mentors I have connected with someone who is my mentor and checks my work. Think it would be great if every newbie could have a mentor, or a group of mentors to submit work to. Correcting other's work We all want to do a good job, but I don't think the training gives the most important information up front, i.e. make buildings the right size and square. I've just deleted and redrawn about 100 buildings that were not square nor did they fit on the image footprint. The mappers probably thought a rough polygon would let people know a building existed in that spot, but that's not what's needed. Same with paths that didn't conform to the image. How to do it right would be so helpful if included in the training up front. I don't think most people have the patience to go through slow training, or my DVD wouldn't have come with a Quick Start Guide! I'm a Newbie, and I recommend newbies be limited to drawing buildings and adding roads and paths. Experts should draw Residential Areas in rural areas and note forests and other features. I've corrected hundreds of buildings and paths. It's a waste of time and energy for the original mapper and the person correcting. We all want to do a good job or we wouldn't be spending hours mapping. Hope this helps. Cheers! Suzan On May 6, 2015, at 11:10 PM, Laura Camellini wrote: Hi all, as I suggested some days ago, I'd like to add these video training (while done) to a moodle course, And maybe be able to synch the moodle course training with the task manager permission to edit maps. Do you think this could help you with your tasks? Regards, LauraC 2015-05-07 3:16 GMT+02:00 Mhairi O'Hara mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org: Dear Hotties, Please see the e-mail from Pete Masters from the Missing Maps project: We are thinking about putting together some video training resources for HOT mapping for newbies. No concrete plans yet, just getting some thoughts together. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Hello Suzan, I am very new here and puzzled by some of the processes in place. Not sure if I will even continue, there seems to be a fair bit of turmoil not related to the earthquake. I received one e-mail from someone who said this OSM initiative has only been going 10 years and was still a work in progress! 10 years, and only now someone is starting to put together some training materials? What has been going on? The instructional materials that do exist also seem to be scattered among many sites and documents; I have given up trying to keep track. I went through two introductory videos on the simple editor which was fine and then fired up JOSM which looks quite daunting, even for someone experienced with GIS. I'm still not clear why an emergency response project would need building footprints, especially when it is so labour intensive to create and then correct them. There seem to be some odd priorities, but then I certainly don't know the whole picture. Thanks, Cheers . . . . . . . . Spring At 07-05-2015 00:30 Thursday, Suzan Reed wrote: Training My major problem with the current training, it's long, boring, and slow. A Quick Start Guide would be perfect for someone like me. A video with this information would be great. I could not go through the training because it went too slow, so I missed some information, but found the process for someone like me who works in Photoshop pretty easy and intuitive, but I'm not a usual newbie. An orientation video for the area being mapped. I don't think many mappers know what buildings in remote areas of Nepal look like, or that villages are spread out over a big area, or that paths just end and do not connect in rural Nepal. A video with still and moving images I believe would be a big help. People could then see buildings are not square, built out of piles of rocks, and are often two stories tall with animals below and people above. Roofs are tin, or packed earth. If mappers could see this I think they would do a better job mapping. The video could also go over other details of the project. I'd be willing to help with this. Mentors I have connected with someone who is my mentor and checks my work. Think it would be great if every newbie could have a mentor, or a group of mentors to submit work to. Correcting other's work We all want to do a good job, but I don't think the training gives the most important information up front, i.e. make buildings the right size and square. I've just deleted and redrawn about 100 buildings that were not square nor did they fit on the image footprint. The mappers probably thought a rough polygon would let people know a building existed in that spot, but that's not what's needed. Same with paths that didn't conform to the image. How to do it right would be so helpful if included in the training up front. I don't think most people have the patience to go through slow training, or my DVD wouldn't have come with a Quick Start Guide! I'm a Newbie, and I recommend newbies be limited to drawing buildings and adding roads and paths. Experts should draw Residential Areas in rural areas and note forests and other features. I've corrected hundreds of buildings and paths. It's a waste of time and energy for the original mapper and the person correcting. We all want to do a good job or we wouldn't be spending hours mapping. Hope this helps. Cheers! Suzan On May 6, 2015, at 11:10 PM, Laura Camellini wrote: Hi all, as I suggested some days ago, I'd like to add these video training (while done) to a moodle course, And maybe be able to synch the moodle course training with the task manager permission to edit maps. Do you think this could help you with your tasks? Regards, LauraC 2015-05-07 3:16 GMT+02:00 Mhairi O'Hara mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org: Dear Hotties, Please see the e-mail from Pete Masters from the Missing Maps project: We are thinking about putting together some video training resources for HOT mapping for newbies. No concrete plans yet, just getting some thoughts together. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, even better, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needs for training materials... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing Cheers, Pete -- Pete Masters Missing Maps Project Coordinator +44 7921 781 518 missingmaps.org @pedrito1414 @theMissingMaps facebook.com/MissingMapsProject -- Mhairi O'Hara Technical Project Manager Email: mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org Indonesian Mobile: +62 822 4701 1475 Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team Using OpenStreetMap for Humanitarian Response Economic Development ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Hi all, as I suggested some days ago, I'd like to add these video training (while done) to a moodle course, And maybe be able to synch the moodle course training with the task manager permission to edit maps. Do you think this could help you with your tasks? Regards, LauraC 2015-05-07 3:16 GMT+02:00 Mhairi O'Hara mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org: Dear Hotties, Please see the e-mail from Pete Masters from the Missing Maps project: *We are thinking about putting together some video training resourcesfor HOT mapping for newbies. No concrete plans yet, just getting somethoughts together.There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for theindividual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, evenbetter, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needsfor training materials...https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharingCheers,Pete* -- Pete Masters Missing Maps Project Coordinator +44 7921 781 518 missingmaps.org @pedrito1414 @theMissingMaps facebook.com/MissingMapsProject -- Mhairi O'Hara Technical Project Manager Email: mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org Indonesian Mobile: +62 822 4701 1475 *Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team * *Using OpenStreetMap for Humanitarian Response Economic Development* ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
I don't think it's reasonable to expect new mappers to be able to take quick start training and jump into contributing, at least for those who have not mapped before. If we keep the tasks we ask them to do simple then I think its doable. Mapping rectangular buildings is fairly simple and many projects have lots and lots of them. Cheerio John On 7 May 2015 at 11:06, Steve Bower sbo...@gmavt.net wrote: A few thoughts on the training materials, from a 2-week OSM user and long-time GIS user: I have not yet found the single, systematically organized portal for access to all training materials events, This would be great to have, and other training references could point back to it. The closest I have found is the HOT Training working group, current sources and materials: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Humanitarian_OSM_Team/Working_groups/Training#Current_Sources_.26_Materials But, for example, that page does not point to How to get started contributing to a HOT task: https://gist.github.com/meetar/b9929dfec129d1d7f5f2 So yes, Suzan, I think organization and production of comprehensive training material is a great idea - thank you. I think getting the top-down organization right is key. It seems this would be guided by the HOT Training working group (is there a general OSM training working group?). Existing training materials on how to use OSM and the editors is fairly comprehensive, but somewhat scattered. Multiple sources overlap in the material they cover. An OSM/HOT training portal would help identify gaps and guide where new material (including new videos) is needed. Training on how to interpret features from imagery is minimal. This could really be expanded, with examples of special cases, especially for poor-quality imagery where interpretation is difficult. Interpretation issues seem to dominate a lot of quality concerns and newbie questions. I don't think it's reasonable to expect new mappers to be able to take quick start training and jump into contributing, at least for those who have not mapped before. For HOT response in particular, I think the expectation should be that mappers should expect to invest at least a day of on-line training before starting to contribute. Yes, that would turn away some mappers, but with the benefit of fewer quality issues. Yes, you can learn to trace buildings in far less time, but many mappers soon confront more complex tasks and a better training foundation would serve them well. (My opinion on this may evolve...) Cheers, Steve On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Althio and all. I don't understand the shared document format, and don't find it an easy place to express these views, nor do I understand where I could add to it in a constructive way. That's why I expressed my thoughts here, so that someone who understands the shared document format could incorporate these thoughts if they are useful. I'm sure Im not the only newbie who has the same exact feelings and thoughts. We all want to do a good job, we all want concise, well done training that gets us going quickly, we all want to contribute to a healthy, successful project that helps people. I hope leadership can find people and resources to make good training available. So far, like Spring, I'm a bit confused. Are my hours of work going to do any good for the people who live in the hundreds of houses I've mapped? I hope so. Fingers crossed. All that said, as a designer and writer expert in technical documenting, I would be happy to help with the production of a comprehensive set of training tools. Small group, hopefully? I'm also adept at working in a global environment, cross culturally. Use me if you wish. Suzan On May 7, 2015, at 12:44 AM, althio wrote: Suzan, As you are interested to help with these 1-min video: please join the shared document, read it and update it. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, even better, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needs for training materials... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing Your other comments (about current training) are certainly valid but this is not the best thread for that. Cheers, - althio On 7 May 2015 at 09:30, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Training My major problem with the current training, it's long, boring, and slow. A Quick Start Guide would be perfect for someone like me. A video with this information would be great. I could not go through the training because it went too slow, so I missed some information, but found the process for someone like me who works in Photoshop pretty easy and intuitive, but I'm not a usual newbie. An orientation video for the area being mapped. I don't think many mappers know what buildings in
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
OSM and HOT are volunteer organizations. And we are force to adapt rapidly to the reality of responses like for Nepal. People with experience to develop such material either through a wiki page, github or other are welcomed. With the extent of this response, we organized various support groups to take care of Imagery, Validation, Imports, Routing, etc. We also have a HOT training group. People interested to contribute can write to activation @ hotosm.org. We will follow your contact to the training group. regard Pierre De : Steve Bower sbo...@gmavt.net À : Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com Cc : HOT hot@openstreetmap.org Envoyé le : Jeudi 7 mai 2015 11h06 Objet : Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions A few thoughts on the training materials, from a 2-week OSM user and long-time GIS user: I have not yet found the single, systematically organized portal for access to all training materials events, This would be great to have, and other training references could point back to it. The closest I have found is the HOT Training working group, current sources and materials:http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Humanitarian_OSM_Team/Working_groups/Training#Current_Sources_.26_Materials But, for example, that page does not point to How to get started contributing to a HOT task:https://gist.github.com/meetar/b9929dfec129d1d7f5f2 So yes, Suzan, I think organization and production of comprehensive training material is a great idea - thank you. I think getting the top-down organization right is key. It seems this would be guided by the HOT Training working group (is there a general OSM training working group?). Existing training materials on how to use OSM and the editors is fairly comprehensive, but somewhat scattered. Multiple sources overlap in the material they cover. An OSM/HOT training portal would help identify gaps and guide where new material (including new videos) is needed. Training on how to interpret features from imagery is minimal. This could really be expanded, with examples of special cases, especially for poor-quality imagery where interpretation is difficult. Interpretation issues seem to dominate a lot of quality concerns and newbie questions. I don't think it's reasonable to expect new mappers to be able to take quick start training and jump into contributing, at least for those who have not mapped before. For HOT response in particular, I think the expectation should be that mappers should expect to invest at least a day of on-line training before starting to contribute. Yes, that would turn away some mappers, but with the benefit of fewer quality issues. Yes, you can learn to trace buildings in far less time, but many mappers soon confront more complex tasks and a better training foundation would serve them well. (My opinion on this may evolve...) Cheers,Steve On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Althio and all. I don't understand the shared document format, and don't find it an easy place to express these views, nor do I understand where I could add to it in a constructive way. That's why I expressed my thoughts here, so that someone who understands the shared document format could incorporate these thoughts if they are useful. I'm sure Im not the only newbie who has the same exact feelings and thoughts. We all want to do a good job, we all want concise, well done training that gets us going quickly, we all want to contribute to a healthy, successful project that helps people. I hope leadership can find people and resources to make good training available. So far, like Spring, I'm a bit confused. Are my hours of work going to do any good for the people who live in the hundreds of houses I've mapped? I hope so. Fingers crossed. All that said, as a designer and writer expert in technical documenting, I would be happy to help with the production of a comprehensive set of training tools. Small group, hopefully? I'm also adept at working in a global environment, cross culturally. Use me if you wish. Suzan On May 7, 2015, at 12:44 AM, althio wrote: Suzan, As you are interested to help with these 1-min video: please join the shared document, read it and update it. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, even better, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needs for training materials... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing Your other comments (about current training) are certainly valid but this is not the best thread for that. Cheers, - althio On 7 May 2015 at 09:30, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Training My major problem with the current training, it's long, boring, and slow. A Quick Start Guide would be perfect for someone like me. A video with this information would be great. I could not go through
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Hi All, Excellent points and criticisms all around. The amount of feedback from new contributors during this response has been extremely welcome but also a bit humbling at times. We’ve got so much to do. A few quick responses to key points. 1. OSM is 10 years old but for much of that time was a “by nerds, for nerds” project. Only in the past few years have the tools for conventional GIS usage really come into their own. 2. HOT itself has been around for a long time, but only took off 5 years ago after the earthquake in Haiti. Since then it’s been a slow but steady journey towards professionalism. We’ve spent a lot of our energy working with local communities and building up critical technical infrastructure like the Tasking Manager — which trust me, did not appear out of nowhere. Clearly it’s time to invest in training materials. 3. HOT’s contributions are used and makes a difference. I used to work for the Red Cross and we used OSM data from HOT *all the time*. In many cases it was the *only* data for disaster affected areas. Simply put, it was irreplaceable. And if sometimes it was not 100% accurate, that was OK. 90% accurate is better than 0% available. 4. You all bring up such good points and criticisms. Right now a lot of people are working themselves to death just responding, so please don’t take it personally if you don’t get immediate responses to your suggestions. Please stick around until we have time to follow up and work with you to make things better. It may take a month but it will be so valuable. Cheers, Robert — Sent from Mailbox On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 9:31 PM, Pierre Béland pierz...@yahoo.fr wrote: OSM and HOT are volunteer organizations. And we are force to adapt rapidly to the reality of responses like for Nepal. People with experience to develop such material either through a wiki page, github or other are welcomed. With the extent of this response, we organized various support groups to take care of Imagery, Validation, Imports, Routing, etc. We also have a HOT training group. People interested to contribute can write to activation @ hotosm.org. We will follow your contact to the training group. regard Pierre De : Steve Bower sbo...@gmavt.net À : Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com Cc : HOT hot@openstreetmap.org Envoyé le : Jeudi 7 mai 2015 11h06 Objet : Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions A few thoughts on the training materials, from a 2-week OSM user and long-time GIS user: I have not yet found the single, systematically organized portal for access to all training materials events, This would be great to have, and other training references could point back to it. The closest I have found is the HOT Training working group, current sources and materials:http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Humanitarian_OSM_Team/Working_groups/Training#Current_Sources_.26_Materials But, for example, that page does not point to How to get started contributing to a HOT task:https://gist.github.com/meetar/b9929dfec129d1d7f5f2 So yes, Suzan, I think organization and production of comprehensive training material is a great idea - thank you. I think getting the top-down organization right is key. It seems this would be guided by the HOT Training working group (is there a general OSM training working group?). Existing training materials on how to use OSM and the editors is fairly comprehensive, but somewhat scattered. Multiple sources overlap in the material they cover. An OSM/HOT training portal would help identify gaps and guide where new material (including new videos) is needed. Training on how to interpret features from imagery is minimal. This could really be expanded, with examples of special cases, especially for poor-quality imagery where interpretation is difficult. Interpretation issues seem to dominate a lot of quality concerns and newbie questions. I don't think it's reasonable to expect new mappers to be able to take quick start training and jump into contributing, at least for those who have not mapped before. For HOT response in particular, I think the expectation should be that mappers should expect to invest at least a day of on-line training before starting to contribute. Yes, that would turn away some mappers, but with the benefit of fewer quality issues. Yes, you can learn to trace buildings in far less time, but many mappers soon confront more complex tasks and a better training foundation would serve them well. (My opinion on this may evolve...) Cheers,Steve On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Althio and all. I don't understand the shared document format, and don't find it an easy place to express these views, nor do I understand where I could add to it in a constructive way. That's why I expressed my thoughts here, so that someone who understands the shared document format could
Re: [HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
A few thoughts on the training materials, from a 2-week OSM user and long-time GIS user: I have not yet found the single, systematically organized portal for access to all training materials events, This would be great to have, and other training references could point back to it. The closest I have found is the HOT Training working group, current sources and materials: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Humanitarian_OSM_Team/Working_groups/Training#Current_Sources_.26_Materials But, for example, that page does not point to How to get started contributing to a HOT task: https://gist.github.com/meetar/b9929dfec129d1d7f5f2 So yes, Suzan, I think organization and production of comprehensive training material is a great idea - thank you. I think getting the top-down organization right is key. It seems this would be guided by the HOT Training working group (is there a general OSM training working group?). Existing training materials on how to use OSM and the editors is fairly comprehensive, but somewhat scattered. Multiple sources overlap in the material they cover. An OSM/HOT training portal would help identify gaps and guide where new material (including new videos) is needed. Training on how to interpret features from imagery is minimal. This could really be expanded, with examples of special cases, especially for poor-quality imagery where interpretation is difficult. Interpretation issues seem to dominate a lot of quality concerns and newbie questions. I don't think it's reasonable to expect new mappers to be able to take quick start training and jump into contributing, at least for those who have not mapped before. For HOT response in particular, I think the expectation should be that mappers should expect to invest at least a day of on-line training before starting to contribute. Yes, that would turn away some mappers, but with the benefit of fewer quality issues. Yes, you can learn to trace buildings in far less time, but many mappers soon confront more complex tasks and a better training foundation would serve them well. (My opinion on this may evolve...) Cheers, Steve On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 5:24 AM, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Althio and all. I don't understand the shared document format, and don't find it an easy place to express these views, nor do I understand where I could add to it in a constructive way. That's why I expressed my thoughts here, so that someone who understands the shared document format could incorporate these thoughts if they are useful. I'm sure Im not the only newbie who has the same exact feelings and thoughts. We all want to do a good job, we all want concise, well done training that gets us going quickly, we all want to contribute to a healthy, successful project that helps people. I hope leadership can find people and resources to make good training available. So far, like Spring, I'm a bit confused. Are my hours of work going to do any good for the people who live in the hundreds of houses I've mapped? I hope so. Fingers crossed. All that said, as a designer and writer expert in technical documenting, I would be happy to help with the production of a comprehensive set of training tools. Small group, hopefully? I'm also adept at working in a global environment, cross culturally. Use me if you wish. Suzan On May 7, 2015, at 12:44 AM, althio wrote: Suzan, As you are interested to help with these 1-min video: please join the shared document, read it and update it. There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for the individual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, even better, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needs for training materials... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing Your other comments (about current training) are certainly valid but this is not the best thread for that. Cheers, - althio On 7 May 2015 at 09:30, Suzan Reed su...@suzanreed.com wrote: Training My major problem with the current training, it's long, boring, and slow. A Quick Start Guide would be perfect for someone like me. A video with this information would be great. I could not go through the training because it went too slow, so I missed some information, but found the process for someone like me who works in Photoshop pretty easy and intuitive, but I'm not a usual newbie. An orientation video for the area being mapped. I don't think many mappers know what buildings in remote areas of Nepal look like, or that villages are spread out over a big area, or that paths just end and do not connect in rural Nepal. A video with still and moving images I believe would be a big help. People could then see buildings are not square, built out of piles of rocks, and are often two stories tall with animals below and people above. Roofs are tin, or packed earth. If mappers could see this I think they would do a
[HOT] Missing Maps Training Video Suggestions
Dear Hotties, Please see the e-mail from Pete Masters from the Missing Maps project: *We are thinking about putting together some video training resourcesfor HOT mapping for newbies. No concrete plans yet, just getting somethoughts together.There's a shared doc here, where we're collecting ideas for theindividual modules. Please feel free to add your thoughts and, evenbetter, to encourage newbies to identify where there are most needsfor training materials...https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mo82sCLLnP30SsgRO1VIpGxezWcQhAQ_HxEpCEPh89o/edit?usp=sharingCheers,Pete* -- Pete Masters Missing Maps Project Coordinator +44 7921 781 518 missingmaps.org @pedrito1414 @theMissingMaps facebook.com/MissingMapsProject -- Mhairi O'Hara Technical Project Manager Email: mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org Indonesian Mobile: +62 822 4701 1475 *Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team * *Using OpenStreetMap for Humanitarian Response Economic Development* ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
