Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[maning sambale]

To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are
visible).  Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi,
Africa.
If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.

On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts  wrote:

>
> Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) ..
> there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted to identify them ether to
> digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
>
> [image: --]
>
> Warren Roberts
> [image: http://]
> about.me/gisteacher
> (typos intensional)
> 
> 
>
>
> ___
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>
>


-- 
cheers,
maning
--
"Freedom is still the most radical idea of all" -N.Branden
wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/
blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/
--
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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Pierre Béland]

Hi Warren




Yes these represent construction buildings at the time the image was taken. But 
sometimes, images can be a few years old and we dont know the actual status of 
the building.



I was last year in Limonade, Haiti where I saw many of these buildings. A 
family was living in the first floor. And you would see such structures for an 
eventual second floor. These structures were sometimes built years before.





They can be tagged building=yes or building=construction. But which one should 
we prefer? I myself prefer to tag as building=yes.


 
Pierre 

  De : Warren Roberts 
 À : hot@openstreetmap.org 
 Envoyé le : Lundi 3 novembre 2014 19h41
 Objet : [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
   

Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) .. 
there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted to identify them ether to digitize 
them as buildings.  Thanks
|   |
| 
|  |   | Warren Roberts
| about.me/gisteacher  |


| (typos intensional) |

 |

   |
|   |


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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Ray Kiddy]

On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
maning sambale  wrote:

> To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are
> visible).  Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi,
> Africa.
> If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.

Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to
learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows
how different things appear in different places?

I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb
looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in
Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image
catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with "Casava plant,
Liberia, resolution of image = x"?

I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and some of
this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no context to
figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like (just like
houses?) and so on.

A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the
deserts of Pakistan might be helpful.

We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know what a
yurt looks like from above. Same thing.

I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and got
back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does not
show me, however, how the different types of houses there may appear in
imagery.

I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if
there are suggestions from you all first.

thanx - ray


> On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts 
> wrote:
> 
> >
> > Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without
> > roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted to identify
> > them ether to digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
> >
> > [image: --]
> >
> > Warren Roberts

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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[john whelan]

I suspect they are fenced areas for cattle or cattle pens.  In Cameroon
I've been using the JOSM building tool to map them then changing the tags
to barrier=wall.  Contact with a mapper on the ground would help enormously
with these sort of structures.

Cheerio John

On 3 November 2014 19:41, Warren Roberts  wrote:

>
> Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) ..
> there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted to identify them ether to
> digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
>
> [image: --]
>
> Warren Roberts
> [image: http://]
> about.me/gisteacher
> (typos intensional)
> 
> 
>
>
> ___
> HOT mailing list
> HOT@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>
>
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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Claire Halleux]

Hi Ray,

For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava

If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the
copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing,
for training purposes.

Cheers

Claire

Claire Halleux
Volunteer and Member of the Board
+243 99 256 9980 (Kinshasa, DRC)
Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team

http://www.hotosm.org/
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_DRC_Ebola_Response

On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy  wrote:

> On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
> maning sambale  wrote:
>
> > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are
> > visible).  Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi,
> > Africa.
> > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
>
> Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to
> learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows
> how different things appear in different places?
>
> I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb
> looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in
> Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image
> catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with "Casava plant,
> Liberia, resolution of image = x"?
>
> I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and some of
> this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no context to
> figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like (just like
> houses?) and so on.
>
> A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the
> deserts of Pakistan might be helpful.
>
> We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know what a
> yurt looks like from above. Same thing.
>
> I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and got
> back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does not
> show me, however, how the different types of houses there may appear in
> imagery.
>
> I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if
> there are suggestions from you all first.
>
> thanx - ray
>
>
> > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts 
> > wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without
> > > roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted to identify
> > > them ether to digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
> > >
> > > [image: --]
> > >
> > > Warren Roberts
>
> ___
> HOT mailing list
> HOT@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>
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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Ray Kiddy]

On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
Claire Halleux  wrote:

> Hi Ray,
> 
> For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
> 
> If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the
> copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and
> Bing, for training purposes.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Claire
> 

I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify
anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite.

How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in
Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no
experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its
structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep
asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently
shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different
structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog.

So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?

thanx - ray

> 
> On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy  wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
> > maning sambale  wrote:
> >
> > > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are
> > > visible).  Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in
> > > Malawi, Africa.
> > > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
> >
> > Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to
> > learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that
> > shows how different things appear in different places?
> >
> > I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb
> > looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches
> > in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of
> > image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with "Casava
> > plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x"?
> >
> > I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
> > some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
> > context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
> > (just like houses?) and so on.
> >
> > A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the
> > deserts of Pakistan might be helpful.
> >
> > We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know
> > what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing.
> >
> > I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and
> > got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does
> > not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may
> > appear in imagery.
> >
> > I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if
> > there are suggestions from you all first.
> >
> > thanx - ray
> >
> >
> > > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts
> > >  wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building
> > > > (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted
> > > > to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
> > > >
> > > > [image: --]
> > > >
> > > > Warren Roberts
> >
> > ___
> > HOT mailing list
> > HOT@openstreetmap.org
> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
> >


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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Claire Halleux]

Hi Ray,

Sorry, I didn't explain much myself neither.
I meant that that page (crop=cassava) is still empty (apart from the
cassava picture from the ground) and I think it would be interesting to
have examples from sat imagery on how to recognize those crops from above.
Blake Girardot actually started to prepare something on that subject. You
can check it here and exchange with him on the subject too:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips#Cassava_.28Manioc.29_Crops

There have been several suggestions to create a catalog of objects found on
sat imagery but it doesn't exist yet + there were still some legal points
to be checked I think + technical points to set it up.
Before this one get created, I think it's worth to store the information at
some place where it can be accessed by all (like in the OSM wiki for
instance).

Best,

Claire

Claire Halleux
Volunteer and Member of the Board
+243 99 256 9980 (Kinshasa, DRC)
Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team

http://www.hotosm.org/
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_DRC_Ebola_Response

On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 12:02 PM, Ray Kiddy  wrote:

> On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
> Claire Halleux  wrote:
>
> > Hi Ray,
> >
> > For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess:
> > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
> >
> > If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the
> > copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and
> > Bing, for training purposes.
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Claire
> >
>
> I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
> picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify
> anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite.
>
> How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
> Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in
> Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no
> experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its
> structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep
> asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently
> shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different
> structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog.
>
> So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
> things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
> there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?
>
> thanx - ray
>
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy  wrote:
> >
> > > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
> > > maning sambale  wrote:
> > >
> > > > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are
> > > > visible).  Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in
> > > > Malawi, Africa.
> > > > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
> > >
> > > Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to
> > > learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that
> > > shows how different things appear in different places?
> > >
> > > I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb
> > > looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches
> > > in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of
> > > image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with "Casava
> > > plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x"?
> > >
> > > I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
> > > some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
> > > context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
> > > (just like houses?) and so on.
> > >
> > > A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the
> > > deserts of Pakistan might be helpful.
> > >
> > > We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know
> > > what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing.
> > >
> > > I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and
> > > got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does
> > > not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may
> > > appear in imagery.
> > >
> > > I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if
> > > there are suggestions from you all first.
> > >
> > > thanx - ray
> > >
> > >
> > > > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts
> > > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building
> > > > > (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted
> > > > > to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
> > > > >
> > > > > [image: --]
> > > > >
> > > > > Warren Roberts
> > >
> > > ___
> > > HOT mailing list
> > > HOT@openstreetmap.org
> > > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
> > >
>
>
> _

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Andrew Buck]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

The ones in the original picture in this thread are definitely
buildings under construction.  we have decided that for most of this
area it just makes sense to tag them as building=yes, since most are
likely completed now anyway.  We have seen some looking exactly like
this in areas with old bing imagery and if you zoom out a bit bing
gives you newer imagery where the building has a roof on it, so we are
confident that is what these are.

- -AndrewBuck



On 11/03/2014 08:05 PM, john whelan wrote:
> I suspect they are fenced areas for cattle or cattle pens.  In
> Cameroon I've been using the JOSM building tool to map them then
> changing the tags to barrier=wall.  Contact with a mapper on the
> ground would help enormously with these sort of structures.
> 
> Cheerio John
> 
> On 3 November 2014 19:41, Warren Roberts 
> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without
>> roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted to identify
>> them ether to digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
>> 
>> [image: --]
>> 
>> Warren Roberts [image: http://] about.me/gisteacher 
>> (typos intensional) 
>>  

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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[thatwoodb]

I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings
that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced
ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated,
and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This
catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by
areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by
typical rural vs urban structures.
If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such
examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional
buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but
these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points
out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a
satellite's POV.
-Ian 

On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"  wrote:On Tue, 4 Nov 2014
09:51:54 +0100
Claire Halleux  wrote:

> Hi Ray,
> 
> For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
> 
> If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the
> copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and
> Bing, for training purposes.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Claire
> 

I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
identify
anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite.

How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well
in
Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no
experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its
structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and
keep
asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently
shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different
structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog.

So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?

thanx - ray

> 
> On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy  wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
> > maning sambale  wrote:
> >
> > > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls
are
> > > visible).  Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in
> > > Malawi, Africa.
> > > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
> >
> > Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined
to
> > learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that
> > shows how different things appear in different places?
> >
> > I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb
> > looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches
> > in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort
of
> > image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with "Casava
> > plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x"?
> >
> > I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
> > some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
> > context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
> > (just like houses?) and so on.
> >
> > A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example,
the
> > deserts of Pakistan might be helpful.
> >
> > We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know
> > what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing.
> >
> > I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and
> > got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page
does
> > not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may
> > appear in imagery.
> >
> > I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see
if
> > there are suggestions from you all first.
> >
> > thanx - ray
> >
> >
> > > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts
> > >  wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building
> > > > (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone.  Wanted
> > > > to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings.  Thanks
> > > >
> > > > [image: --]
> > > >
> > > > Warren Roberts
> >
> > ___
> > HOT mailing list
> > HOT@openstreetmap.org
> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
> >
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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Michel Gilbert]

Hi Ian,

I found this page:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand
the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.

As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.

Michel

On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM  wrote:

>
>
>
> I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page
> of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are
> often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because
> they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that
> are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even
> more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures
> differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures.
>
> If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a
> mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've
> spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this
> part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken
> from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely
> different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV.
>
> -Ian
>
>
> On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"  wrote:
>
> On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
> Claire Halleux  wrote:
>
> > Hi Ray,
> >
> > For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess:
> > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
> >
> > If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the
> > copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and
> > Bing, for training purposes.
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Claire
> >
>
> I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
> picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify
> anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite.
>
> How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
> Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in
> Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no
> experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its
> structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep
> asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently
> shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different
> structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog.
>
> So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
> things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
> there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?
>
> thanx - ray
>
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy  wrote:
> >
> > > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
> > > maning sambale  wrote:
> > >
> > > > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are
> > > > visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in
> > > > Malawi, Africa.
> > > > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
> > >
> > > Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to
> > > learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that
> > > shows how different things appear in different places?
> > >
> > > I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb
> > > looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches
> > > in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of
> > > image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with "Casava
> > > plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x"?
> > >
> > > I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
> > > some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
> > > context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
> > > (just like houses?) and so on.
> > >
> > > A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the
> > > deserts of Pakistan might be helpful.
> > >
> > > We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know
> > > what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing.
> > >
> > > I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and
> > > got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does
> > > not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may
> > > appear in imagery.
> > >
> > > I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if
> > > there are suggestions from you all first.
> > >
> > > thanx - ray
> > >
> > >
> > > > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts
> > > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building
> > > > > (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone. Wanted
> > > > > to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings. Thanks
> > > > >
> > > > > [image: --]
> > > > >
> 

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Blake Girardot]

Hi,

I will get those pages finished up in the next week or so.

From the conversation here I see I need to add in something about the 
buildings with no roofs and maybe something about fences.


Any additional recommendations or feedback on the existing items is welcome.

Cheers,
Blake



On 11/4/2014 3:59 PM, Michel Gilbert wrote:

Hi Ian,
I found this page:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.

As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.

Michel

On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM mailto:thatwo...@hushmail.com>> wrote:




I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1)
buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less
experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the
uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings,
but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken
down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as
by typical rural vs urban structures.

If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such
examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of
traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my
mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And
as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when
viewing them from a satellite's POV.

-Ian


On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy" mailto:r...@ganymede.org>> wrote:

On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
Claire Halleux mailto:claire.hall...@hotosm.org>> wrote:

>  Hi Ray,
>
>  For cassava, you could add something on the following page I
guess:
>
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
>
>  If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you
keep the
>  copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox,
HIU and
>  Bing, for training purposes.
>
>  Cheers
>
>  Claire
>

I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
identify
anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a
satellite.

How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a
well in
Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one
has no
experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its
structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery
and keep
asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently
shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different
structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog.

So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?

thanx - ray

>
>  On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy mailto:r...@ganymede.org>> wrote:
>
>  > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
>  > maning sambale mailto:emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>  >
>  > > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing
walls are
>  > > visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in
>  > > Malawi, Africa.
>  > > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
>  >
>  > Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be
examined to
>  > learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that
>  > shows how different things appear in different places?
>  >
>  > I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round
honeycomb
>  > looking things were identified as casava plants growing in
bunches
>  > in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a
sort of
>  > image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with
"Casava
>  > plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x"?
>  >
>  > I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
>  > some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
>  > context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
>  > (just like houses?) and so on.
>  >
 

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Ray Kiddy]

On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 +
Michel Gilbert  wrote:

> Hi Ian,
> 
> I found this page:
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
> that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
> understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.
> 
> As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.
> 
> Michel

It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could
appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response

Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki
pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-)

And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list:

  "Video that Best Represents Our Work?"

This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach
mappers how to do better mapping.

This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear
on the wiki.

- ray


> On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM  wrote:
> 
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
> > page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1)
> > buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less
> > experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the
> > uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings,
> > but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further
> > broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as
> > well as by typical rural vs urban structures.
> >
> > If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
> > cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without
> > such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of
> > traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve
> > my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course.
> > And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when
> > viewing them from a satellite's POV.
> >
> > -Ian
> >
> >
> > On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"  wrote:
> >
> > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
> > Claire Halleux  wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Ray,
> > >
> > > For cassava, you could add something on the following page I
> > > guess:
> > > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
> > >
> > > If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep
> > > the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox,
> > > HIU and Bing, for training purposes.
> > >
> > > Cheers
> > >
> > > Claire
> > >
> >
> > I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
> > picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
> > identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a
> > satellite.
> >
> > How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
> > Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a
> > well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when
> > one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one
> > identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite
> > imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps
> > pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which
> > identifies different structures and describes where they appear.
> > Like a catalog.
> >
> > So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
> > things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
> > there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?
> >
> > thanx - ray
> >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy 
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
> > > > maning sambale  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing
> > > > > walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the
> > > > > ground in Malawi, Africa.
> > > > > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
> > > >
> > > > Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be
> > > > examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A
> > > > catalog that shows how different things appear in different
> > > > places?
> > > >
> > > > I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round
> > > > honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants
> > > > growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one
> > > > of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this
> > > > pic and mark it with "Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of
> > > > image = x"?
> > > >
> > > > I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
> > > > some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
> > > > context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
> > > > (just like houses?) and so on.
> > > >
> > > > A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for
> >

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Blake Girardot]

Hi Ray,

I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere 
else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting 
until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make 
sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely 
as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the 
rest should go pretty quickly.


I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help 
with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the 
tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find.


cheers
Blake



On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote:

On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 +
Michel Gilbert  wrote:


Hi Ian,

I found this page:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.

As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.

Michel


It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could
appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response

Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki
pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-)

And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list:

   "Video that Best Represents Our Work?"

This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach
mappers how to do better mapping.

This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear
on the wiki.

- ray



On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM  wrote:





I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1)
buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less
experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the
uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings,
but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further
broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as
well as by typical rural vs urban structures.

If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without
such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of
traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve
my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course.
And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when
viewing them from a satellite's POV.

-Ian


On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"  wrote:

On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
Claire Halleux  wrote:


Hi Ray,

For cassava, you could add something on the following page I
guess:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava

If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep
the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox,
HIU and Bing, for training purposes.

Cheers

Claire



I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a
satellite.

How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a
well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when
one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one
identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite
imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps
pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which
identifies different structures and describes where they appear.
Like a catalog.

So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?

thanx - ray



On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy
wrote:


On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
maning sambale  wrote:


To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing
walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the
ground in Malawi, Africa.
If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.


Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be
examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A
catalog that shows how different things appear in different
places?

I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round
honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants
growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one
of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this
pic and mark it with "Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of
image = x"?

I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
context to figur

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Pierre Béland]

Hi Blake




revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing attention to 
various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand.





Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager to help 
beginners.




 Pierre 

  De : Blake Girardot 
 À : Ray Kiddy  
Cc : hot@openstreetmap.org 
 Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 16h39
 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
   
Hi Ray,

I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere 
else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting 
until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make 
sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely 
as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the 
rest should go pretty quickly.

I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help 
with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the 
tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find.

cheers
Blake



On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote:
> On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 +
> Michel Gilbert  wrote:
>
>> Hi Ian,
>>
>> I found this page:
>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
>> that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
>> understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.
>>
>> As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.
>>
>> Michel
>
> It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could
> appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to:
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response
>
> Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki
> pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-)
>
> And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list:
>
>    "Video that Best Represents Our Work?"
>
> This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach
> mappers how to do better mapping.
>
> This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear
> on the wiki.
>
> - ray
>
>
>> On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
>>> page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1)
>>> buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less
>>> experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the
>>> uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings,
>>> but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further
>>> broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as
>>> well as by typical rural vs urban structures.
>>>
>>> If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
>>> cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without
>>> such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of
>>> traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve
>>> my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course.
>>> And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when
>>> viewing them from a satellite's POV.
>>>
>>> -Ian
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
>>> Claire Halleux  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Ray,
>>>>
>>>> For cassava, you could add something on the following page I
>>>> guess:
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
>>>>
>>>> If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep
>>>> the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox,
>>>> HIU and Bing, for training purposes.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers
>>>>
>>>> Claire
>>>>
>>>
>>> I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
>>> picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
>>> identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a
>>> satellite.
>>>
>>> How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
>>> Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a
>>> well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when
>>> one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one
>>> identify 

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Nick Allen]

Would there be any problem linking it from somewhere in learnosm? I'd be 
happy to have a check through for somewhere suitable and do the work.


Regards

Nick

On 04/11/14 22:09, Pierre Béland wrote:


Hi Blake


revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing 
attention to various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand.



Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager 
to help beginners.



Pierre


*De :* Blake Girardot 
*À :* Ray Kiddy 
*Cc :* hot@openstreetmap.org
*Envoyé le :* Mardi 4 novembre 2014 16h39
*Objet :* Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

Hi Ray,

I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere
else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting
until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make
sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely
as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the
rest should go pretty quickly.

I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help
with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the
tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find.

cheers
Blake



On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote:
> On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 +
> Michel Gilbertmailto:michc...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>> Hi Ian,
>>
>> I found this page:
>> 
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips

>> that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
>> understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.
>>
>> As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.
>>
>> Michel
>
> It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could
> appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to:
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response
>
> Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki
> pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-)
>
> And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list:
>
>"Video that Best Represents Our Work?"
>
> This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach
> mappers how to do better mapping.
>
> This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear
> on the wiki.
>
> - ray
>
>
>> On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM<mailto:thatwo...@hushmail.com>> wrote:

>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
>>> page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1)
>>> buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less
>>> experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the
>>> uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings,
>>> but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further
>>> broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as
>>> well as by typical rural vs urban structures.
>>>
>>> If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
>>> cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without
>>> such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of
>>> traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve
>>> my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course.
>>> And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when
>>> viewing them from a satellite's POV.
>>>
>>> -Ian
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"<mailto:r...@ganymede.org>> wrote:

>>>
>>> On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
>>> Claire Halleux<mailto:claire.hall...@hotosm.org>> wrote:

>>>
>>>> Hi Ray,
>>>>
>>>> For cassava, you could add something on the following page I
>>>> guess:
>>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
>>>>
>>>> If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep
>>>> the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox,
>>>> HIU and Bing, for training purposes.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers
>>>>
>>>> Claire
>>>>
>>>
>>> I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
>>> picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
>>> identify anything if I am l

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Pierre Béland]

Hi Nick




As a first step, yes it could be linked. But eventually, would the best be to 
integrate the content directly into a LearnOsm section? 





As I said before, I think that we should have short sections for each task ie, 
buildings, roads, etc. The content could also be easily adapted to show side by 
side ID and JOSM when possible. 





For example, about the buildings, you give examples how to trace buildings, 
orthogonalize them. Then a step further, you show the Build plugin from JOSM. 
Then a contributor would be able to compare the features of the two editors.

 Pierre 

  De : Nick Allen 
 À : hot@openstreetmap.org 
 Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 17h41
 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
   
 Would there be any problem linking it from somewhere in learnosm? I'd be happy 
to have a check through for somewhere suitable and do the work.
 
 Regards
 
 Nick
 
 On 04/11/14 22:09, Pierre Béland wrote:
  
 
Hi Blake
 

 
 
revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing attention to 
various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand.
 
 

 
 
Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager to help 
beginners.
 
 

 
   Pierre 
  
  De : Blake Girardot 
 À : Ray Kiddy  
 Cc : hot@openstreetmap.org 
 Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 16h39
 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
   
 Hi Ray,
 
 I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere 
 else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting 
 until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make 
 sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely 
 as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the 
 rest should go pretty quickly.
 
 I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help 
 with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the 
 tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find.
 
 cheers
 Blake
 
 
 
 On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote:
 > On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 +
 > Michel Gilbert  wrote:
 >
 >> Hi Ian,
 >>
 >> I found this page:
 >> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
 >> that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
 >> understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.
 >>
 >> As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.
 >>
 >> Michel
 >
 > It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could
 > appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to:
 >
 > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response
 >
 > Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki
 > pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-)
 >
 > And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list:
 >
 >    "Video that Best Represents Our Work?"
 >
 > This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach
 > mappers how to do better mapping.
 >
 > This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear
 > on the wiki.
 >
 > - ray
 >
 >
 >> On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM  wrote:
 >>
 >>>
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
 >>> page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1)
 >>> buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less
 >>> experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the
 >>> uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings,
 >>> but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further
 >>> broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as
 >>> well as by typical rural vs urban structures.
 >>>
 >>> If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
 >>> cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without
 >>> such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of
 >>> traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve
 >>> my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course.
 >>> And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when
 >>> viewing them from a satellite's POV.
 >>>
 >>> -Ian
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"  wrote:
 >>>
 >>> On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
 >>> Claire Halleux  wrote:
 >>>
 >>>> Hi Ray,
 >>>>
 >>>> For cassava, you could add something on the following page I
 &g

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Pierre Béland]

Adding to my previous comments. 





The development of such learning material has to be taught to facilitate the 
translation to other languages. Images if overlapping text are not easy to 
translate. 





Such images have be available in a way to facilitate tranlation. I am not 
familiar with the tools that would let make distinction between the text and 
the image and let revise the text. Two images? Would Svg format asssure editing 
the text to translate in other languages?







 Pierre 

  De : Pierre Béland 
 À : Nick Allen ; "hot@openstreetmap.org" 
 
 Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 18h18
 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
   

Hi Nick




As a first step, yes it could be linked. But eventually, would the best be to 
integrate the content directly into a LearnOsm section? 





As I said before, I think that we should have short sections for each task ie, 
buildings, roads, etc. The content could also be easily adapted to show side by 
side ID and JOSM when possible. 





For example, about the buildings, you give examples how to trace buildings, 
orthogonalize them. Then a step further, you show the Build plugin from JOSM. 
Then a contributor would be able to compare the features of the two editors.

 Pierre 

  De : Nick Allen 
 À : hot@openstreetmap.org 
 Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 17h41
 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
   
 Would there be any problem linking it from somewhere in learnosm? I'd be happy 
to have a check through for somewhere suitable and do the work.
 
 Regards
 
 Nick
 
 On 04/11/14 22:09, Pierre Béland wrote:
  
 
Hi Blake
 

 
 
revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing attention to 
various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand.
 
 

 
 
Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager to help 
beginners.
 
 

 
   Pierre


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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Blake Girardot]

Hi Pierre,

I will see about saving them as something that allows that text to be 
edited.


Regards,
Blake



On 11/4/2014 6:39 PM, Pierre Béland wrote:

Adding to my previous comments.


The development of such learning material has to be taught to facilitate
the translation to other languages. Images if overlapping text are not
easy to translate.


Such images have be available in a way to facilitate tranlation. I am
not familiar with the tools that would let make distinction between the
text and the image and let revise the text. Two images? Would Svg format
asssure editing the text to translate in other languages?



Pierre


*De :* Pierre Béland 
*À :* Nick Allen ; "hot@openstreetmap.org"

*Envoyé le :* Mardi 4 novembre 2014 18h18
*Objet :* Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

Hi Nick


As a first step, yes it could be linked. But eventually, would the best
be to integrate the content directly into a LearnOsm section?


As I said before, I think that we should have short sections for each
task ie, buildings, roads, etc. The content could also be easily adapted
to show side by side ID and JOSM when possible.


For example, about the buildings, you give examples how to trace
buildings, orthogonalize them. Then a step further, you show the Build
plugin from JOSM. Then a contributor would be able to compare the
features of the two editors.

Pierre


*De :* Nick Allen 
*À :* hot@openstreetmap.org
*Envoyé le :* Mardi 4 novembre 2014 17h41
*Objet :* Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?


Would there be any problem linking it from somewhere in learnosm? I'd be
happy to have a check through for somewhere suitable and do the work.

Regards

Nick

On 04/11/14 22:09, Pierre Béland wrote:


Hi Blake


revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing
attention to various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand.


Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager
to help beginners.


Pierre




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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[thatwoodb]

Michel,
Thanks for the link, although I had already seen that page. It's very
useful, but I still think mappers would benefit from seeing examples
of individual structures (or non-structures) that aren't part of
residential areas-- structures that are standing alone or in groups
too small to be enclosed in a residential area, but which still need
to be traced, as well as things that many mappers might think should
be labeled buildings, but which shouldn't be.
Take care,
-Ian

On 11/4/2014 at 1:00 PM, "Michel Gilbert"  wrote:Hi Ian,
 I found this page:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.
As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.
Michel
On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM  wrote:
I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings
that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced
ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated,
and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This
catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by
areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by
typical rural vs urban structures.
If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such
examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional
buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but
these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points
out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a
satellite's POV.
-Ian 

On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy"  wrote:On Tue, 4 Nov 2014
09:51:54 +0100
Claire Halleux  wrote:

> Hi Ray,
> 
> For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava
> 
> If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the
> copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and
> Bing, for training purposes.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Claire
> 

I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a
picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
identify
anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite.

How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well
in
Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no
experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its
structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and
keep
asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently
shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different
structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog.

So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would
there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?

thanx - ray

> 
> On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy  wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
> > maning sambale  wrote:
> >
> > > To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls
are
> > > visible).  Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in
> > > Malawi, Africa.
> > > If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes.
> >
> > Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined
to
> > learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that
> > shows how different things appear in different places?
> >
> > I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb
> > looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches
> > in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort
of
> > image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with "Casava
> > plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x"?
> >
> > I was editing in "#479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan", and
> > some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no
> > context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
> > (just like houses?) and so on.
> >
> > A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example,
the
> > deserts of Pakistan might be helpful.
> >
> > We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know
> > what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing.
> >
> > I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and
> > got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page
does
> > not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may
> > appear in imagery.
> >
> > I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see
if
> > there are suggestions from you all first.
> >
> > thanx - ray
> >
> >
> > 

Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Blake Girardot]

On 11/4/2014 8:11 PM, thatwo...@hushmail.com wrote:


Michel,

Thanks for the link, although I had already seen that page. It's very
useful, but I still think mappers would benefit from seeing examples of
individual structures (or non-structures) that aren't part of
residential areas-- structures that are standing alone or in groups too
small to be enclosed in a residential area, but which still need to be
traced, as well as things that many mappers might think should be
labeled buildings, but which shouldn't be.

Take care,

-Ian



Hi Ian,

As you are mapping, if you could save the url of the locations you think 
show the types of things you are talking about above and then send them 
to me or the list I would really appreciate it.


It is sometimes hard for me to know what people need examples of as I 
sort of mentally skip over things I am already familiar with.


If you are using iD you can just copy paste the url from the web 
browser, if you are using JOSM, click on the coordinates in the lower 
left of the screen and then copy/paste the url from the last box in the 
dialog that pop up.


You can collect some of them together in a list and then send them as a 
group or individually, whatever works best for you.


Anyone can feel free to send URLs to me or the list of things you think 
should go in an imagery or mapping tips guide.


Cheers,
blake

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Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?

[Mark Cupitt]

Hi Blake, wonderful effort. Well done.


Regards

Mark Cupitt

"If we change the world, let it bear the mark of our intelligence"

Hire Me on Freelancer

See me on Open StreetMap 

See me on LinkedIn 


*See me on StackExchange *

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On Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 5:12 AM, Blake Girardot  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I will get those pages finished up in the next week or so.
>
> From the conversation here I see I need to add in something about the
> buildings with no roofs and maybe something about fences.
>
> Any additional recommendations or feedback on the existing items is
> welcome.
>
> Cheers,
> Blake
>
>
>
> On 11/4/2014 3:59 PM, Michel Gilbert wrote:
>
>> Hi Ian,
>> I found this page:
>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_
>> African_HOT_Mapping_Tips
>> that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to
>> understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features.
>>
>> As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these.
>>
>> Michel
>>
>> On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM > > wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a
>> page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1)
>> buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less
>> experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the
>> uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings,
>> but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken
>> down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as
>> by typical rural vs urban structures.
>>
>> If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their
>> cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such
>> examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of
>> traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my
>> mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And
>> as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when
>> viewing them from a satellite's POV.
>>
>> -Ian
>>
>>
>> On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, "Ray Kiddy" > > wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100
>> Claire Halleux > > wrote:
>>
>> >  Hi Ray,
>> >
>> >  For cassava, you could add something on the following page I
>> guess:
>> >
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:
>> crop%3Dcassava
>> >
>> >  If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you
>> keep the
>> >  copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox,
>> HIU and
>> >  Bing, for training purposes.
>> >
>> >  Cheers
>> >
>> >  Claire
>> >
>>
>> I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has
>> a
>> picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me
>> identify
>> anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a
>> satellite.
>>
>> How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in
>> Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a
>> well in
>> Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one
>> has no
>> experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its
>> structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery
>> and keep
>> asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of
>> differently
>> shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different
>> structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog.
>>
>> So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what
>> things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or
>> would
>> there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be?
>>
>> thanx - ray
>>
>> >
>> >  On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy > > wrote:
>> >
>> >  > On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800
>>