Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddy wrote:On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleux wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambale wrote: To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes. Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows how different things appear in different places? I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x? I was editing in #479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan, and some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like (just like houses?) and so on. A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the deserts of Pakistan might be helpful. We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing. I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may appear in imagery. I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if there are suggestions from you all first. thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts wrote: Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone. Wanted to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings. Thanks [image: --] Warren Roberts ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM thatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleux claire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes. Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows how different things appear in different places? I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x? I was editing in #479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan, and some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like (just like houses?) and so on. A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the deserts of Pakistan might be helpful. We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing. I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may appear in imagery. I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if there are suggestions from you all first. thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts gisteac...@gmail.com wrote: Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone. Wanted to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings. Thanks [image: --] Warren Roberts ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Hi, I will get those pages finished up in the next week or so. From the conversation here I see I need to add in something about the buildings with no roofs and maybe something about fences. Any additional recommendations or feedback on the existing items is welcome. Cheers, Blake On 11/4/2014 3:59 PM, Michel Gilbert wrote: Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM thatwo...@hushmail.com mailto:thatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org mailto:r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleux claire.hall...@hotosm.org mailto:claire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org mailto:r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com mailto:emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes. Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows how different things appear in different places? I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x? I was editing in #479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan, and some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 + Michel Gilbert michc...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-) And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list: Video that Best Represents Our Work? This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach mappers how to do better mapping. This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear on the wiki. - ray On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM thatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleux claire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes. Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows how different things appear in different places? I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x? I was editing in #479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan, and some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like (just like houses?) and so on. A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the deserts of Pakistan might be helpful. We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know what a yurt looks like from
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Hi Ray, I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the rest should go pretty quickly. I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find. cheers Blake On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote: On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 + Michel Gilbertmichc...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-) And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list: Video that Best Represents Our Work? This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach mappers how to do better mapping. This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear on the wiki. - ray On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PMthatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddyr...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleuxclaire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddyr...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambaleemmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes. Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows how different things appear in different places? I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x? I was editing in #479
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Hi Blake revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing attention to various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand. Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager to help beginners. Pierre De : Blake Girardot bgirar...@gmail.com À : Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org Cc : hot@openstreetmap.org Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 16h39 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings? Hi Ray, I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the rest should go pretty quickly. I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find. cheers Blake On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote: On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 + Michel Gilbertmichc...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-) And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list: Video that Best Represents Our Work? This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach mappers how to do better mapping. This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear on the wiki. - ray On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PMthatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddyr...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleuxclaire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddyr...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambaleemmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Would there be any problem linking it from somewhere in learnosm? I'd be happy to have a check through for somewhere suitable and do the work. Regards Nick On 04/11/14 22:09, Pierre Béland wrote: Hi Blake revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing attention to various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand. Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager to help beginners. Pierre *De :* Blake Girardot bgirar...@gmail.com *À :* Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org *Cc :* hot@openstreetmap.org *Envoyé le :* Mardi 4 novembre 2014 16h39 *Objet :* Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings? Hi Ray, I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the rest should go pretty quickly. I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find. cheers Blake On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote: On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 + Michel Gilbertmichc...@gmail.com mailto:michc...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-) And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list: Video that Best Represents Our Work? This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach mappers how to do better mapping. This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear on the wiki. - ray On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PMthatwo...@hushmail.com mailto:thatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddyr...@ganymede.org mailto:r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleuxclaire.hall...@hotosm.org mailto:claire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Hi Nick As a first step, yes it could be linked. But eventually, would the best be to integrate the content directly into a LearnOsm section? As I said before, I think that we should have short sections for each task ie, buildings, roads, etc. The content could also be easily adapted to show side by side ID and JOSM when possible. For example, about the buildings, you give examples how to trace buildings, orthogonalize them. Then a step further, you show the Build plugin from JOSM. Then a contributor would be able to compare the features of the two editors. Pierre De : Nick Allen nick.allen...@gmail.com À : hot@openstreetmap.org Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 17h41 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings? Would there be any problem linking it from somewhere in learnosm? I'd be happy to have a check through for somewhere suitable and do the work. Regards Nick On 04/11/14 22:09, Pierre Béland wrote: Hi Blake revisiting your page, it is already quite instructive bringing attention to various aspects. It is clear and easy to understand. Even if not yet completed, we could link to this in the Task Manager to help beginners. Pierre De : Blake Girardot bgirar...@gmail.com À : Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org Cc : hot@openstreetmap.org Envoyé le : Mardi 4 novembre 2014 16h39 Objet : Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings? Hi Ray, I think the only reason my mapping tips page hasn't made it anywhere else is because I haven't finished it yet and I was sort of waiting until it got done and was given a final once over by everyone to make sure I am not pointing out anything incorrectly before sharing it widely as a resource. I have most of the data for the remaining sections so the rest should go pretty quickly. I have been spending most of my time on validating and trying to help with a data import which is almost done and then I can finish up the tips page(s) and get them somewhere easier to find. cheers Blake On 11/4/2014 4:27 PM, Ray Kiddy wrote: On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 20:59:57 + Michel Gilbertmichc...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel It seems an obvious suggestion that a link to the page above could appear on the page which some of the Instructions are linking to: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/2014_West_Africa_Ebola_Response Obviously BGirardot's brain is not automatically hooked to all the wiki pages it should be hooked up with, more's the pity. :-) And this whole discussion could tie into the thread on the list: Video that Best Represents Our Work? This thread seems to end up discussing ways to use video to help teach mappers how to do better mapping. This may be a good time for a straw-man catalog/training tool to appear on the wiki. - ray On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PMthatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddyr...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleuxclaire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Michel, Thanks for the link, although I had already seen that page. It's very useful, but I still think mappers would benefit from seeing examples of individual structures (or non-structures) that aren't part of residential areas-- structures that are standing alone or in groups too small to be enclosed in a residential area, but which still need to be traced, as well as things that many mappers might think should be labeled buildings, but which shouldn't be. Take care, -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 1:00 PM, Michel Gilbert wrote:Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddy wrote:On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleux wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambale wrote: To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes. Is there a place on a wiki to place pictures that can be examined to learn to recognize some of the local structures? A catalog that shows how different things appear in different places? I have had similar questions. I had a pic and the round honeycomb looking things were identified as casava plants growing in bunches in Liberia. Is there a logical place on one of the wikis, a sort of image catalog, where I could add this pic and mark it with Casava plant, Liberia, resolution of image = x? I was editing in #479 Tharparkar Drought, Sindh, Pakistan, and some of this stuff could have been on the moon. I just have no context to figure out the shapes of houses, what wells look like (just like houses?) and so on. A catalog of the structure types one might find in, for example, the deserts of Pakistan might be helpful. We could me mapping in Mongolia and I am also not going to know what a yurt looks like from above. Same thing. I went to the wiki and did a search, for example, on Pakistan and got back, as you might expect, the page on Pakistan. This page does not show me, however, how the different types of houses there may appear in imagery. I can, of course, start something, and will. I just wanted to see if there are suggestions from you all first. thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts wrote: Does anyone have an idea if these are
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
On 11/4/2014 8:11 PM, thatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: Michel, Thanks for the link, although I had already seen that page. It's very useful, but I still think mappers would benefit from seeing examples of individual structures (or non-structures) that aren't part of residential areas-- structures that are standing alone or in groups too small to be enclosed in a residential area, but which still need to be traced, as well as things that many mappers might think should be labeled buildings, but which shouldn't be. Take care, -Ian Hi Ian, As you are mapping, if you could save the url of the locations you think show the types of things you are talking about above and then send them to me or the list I would really appreciate it. It is sometimes hard for me to know what people need examples of as I sort of mentally skip over things I am already familiar with. If you are using iD you can just copy paste the url from the web browser, if you are using JOSM, click on the coordinates in the lower left of the screen and then copy/paste the url from the last box in the dialog that pop up. You can collect some of them together in a list and then send them as a group or individually, whatever works best for you. Anyone can feel free to send URLs to me or the list of things you think should go in an imagery or mapping tips guide. Cheers, blake ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Hi Blake, wonderful effort. Well done. Regards Mark Cupitt If we change the world, let it bear the mark of our intelligence Hire Me on Freelancer See me on Open StreetMap https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/Mark_Cupitt See me on LinkedIn http://ph.linkedin.com/in/markcupitt *See me on StackExchange http://gis.stackexchange.com/users/17846/mark-c* === The contents of this email are intended only for the individual(s) to whom it is addressed and may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not disclose, copy, distribute, or use the contents of this email. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the email and any attachments. === On Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 5:12 AM, Blake Girardot bgirar...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I will get those pages finished up in the next week or so. From the conversation here I see I need to add in something about the buildings with no roofs and maybe something about fences. Any additional recommendations or feedback on the existing items is welcome. Cheers, Blake On 11/4/2014 3:59 PM, Michel Gilbert wrote: Hi Ian, I found this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/West_ African_HOT_Mapping_Tips that is created by BGirardot that provides good tips helping to understand the context for mapping West Africa in terms of features. As an uninitiated HOT mappers I would need more of these. Michel On Tue Nov 04 2014 at 1:27:33 PM thatwo...@hushmail.com mailto:thatwo...@hushmail.com wrote: I agree wholeheartedly with Ray. It would be very helpful to have a page of examples of W. Africa satellite imagery showing, 1) buildings that are often overlooked by mappers, especially the less experienced ones, because they may not look like buildings to the uninitiated, and; 2) things that are often mistaken for buildings, but aren't. This catalog could be even more useful if further broken down by areas/countries whose structures differ somewhat, as well as by typical rural vs urban structures. If s/he has neither visited these countries nor studied their cultures, a mapper's working at a distinct disadvantage without such examples. I've spent some time looking at photos online of traditional buildings in this part of the world to try to improve my mapping, but these shots are taken from ground level, of course. And as Ray points out, it's a completely different experience when viewing them from a satellite's POV. -Ian On 11/4/2014 at 3:03 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org mailto:r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:51:54 +0100 Claire Halleux claire.hall...@hotosm.org mailto:claire.hall...@hotosm.org wrote: Hi Ray, For cassava, you could add something on the following page I guess: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag: crop%3Dcassava If you intend to use a screenshot of imagery, make sure you keep the copyright visible. We got permissions to do so from MapBox, HIU and Bing, for training purposes. Cheers Claire I am not explaining myself well. The page you are pointing to has a picture of casava taken from the ground. This does not help me identify anything if I am looking at casava in a photo taken from a satellite. How does one recognize a mound of casava in Liberia? Or a yurt in Mongolia? Or a well in Pakinstan? From satellite imagery? Does a well in Pakistan look like well in Montana? Probably not. So, when one has no experience with an area of the world, how can one identify its structures? One way is to look at a bunch of satellite imagery and keep asking questions, over and over. Or, perhaps pictures of differently shaped structures can be pulled out which identifies different structures and describes where they appear. Like a catalog. So, is there some catalog of satellite imagery that will show what things look like in various places, for training purposes? Or would there be suggestions on how to create one and where it could be? thanx - ray On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Ray Kiddy r...@ganymede.org mailto:r...@ganymede.org wrote: On Tue, 4 Nov 2014 09:16:50 +0800 maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com mailto:emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: To me, it looks
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
To me, it looks like building=construction (the dividing walls are visible). Nearly the same as what I've seen on the ground in Malawi, Africa. If you're unsure, just tag it as building=yes. On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 8:41 AM, Warren Roberts gisteac...@gmail.com wrote: Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone. Wanted to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings. Thanks [image: --] Warren Roberts [image: http://] about.me/gisteacher http://about.me/gisteacher(typos intensional) http://about.me/gisteacher http://about.me/gisteacher ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
Hi Warren Yes these represent construction buildings at the time the image was taken. But sometimes, images can be a few years old and we dont know the actual status of the building. I was last year in Limonade, Haiti where I saw many of these buildings. A family was living in the first floor. And you would see such structures for an eventual second floor. These structures were sometimes built years before. They can be tagged building=yes or building=construction. But which one should we prefer? I myself prefer to tag as building=yes. Pierre De : Warren Roberts gisteac...@gmail.com À : hot@openstreetmap.org Envoyé le : Lundi 3 novembre 2014 19h41 Objet : [HOT] unknown structures are buildings? Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone. Wanted to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings. Thanks | | | | | | Warren Roberts | about.me/gisteacher | | (typos intensional) | | | | | ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
Re: [HOT] unknown structures are buildings?
I suspect they are fenced areas for cattle or cattle pens. In Cameroon I've been using the JOSM building tool to map them then changing the tags to barrier=wall. Contact with a mapper on the ground would help enormously with these sort of structures. Cheerio John On 3 November 2014 19:41, Warren Roberts gisteac...@gmail.com wrote: Does anyone have an idea if these are walls for building (without roof) .. there are many and in Sierra Leone. Wanted to identify them ether to digitize them as buildings. Thanks [image: --] Warren Roberts [image: http://] about.me/gisteacher http://about.me/gisteacher(typos intensional) http://about.me/gisteacher http://about.me/gisteacher ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot ___ HOT mailing list HOT@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
