Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
On Fri, 2005-11-11 at 07:24 +0800, Ron and Jenny Hawkins wrote: Someone mentioned striping using more storage, but I understand that B/QSAM buffers with Extended Format datasets go above the line. Hmmm, that's kind of interesting. I distinctly remember having a rash of region size issues with batch jobs when I started to implement striping here -- perhaps I was referring to below-the-line issues of a bygone era. -- David Andrews A. Duda and Sons, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
Did you lose the source code or something ? This is the most common reason I've run in to for not doing a recompile under these circumstances. - Paul Hanrahan -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of john gilmore Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 9:49 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage They [IDMS] may also have some old subroutine that is AMODE 24 which will generally force every thing below the line. If the notion of using a program object instead of a load module does not strike you as intolerably 'cutting-edge', the Binder's SPLIT option was provided to address just this class of problems. I could work up more sympathy for the plight of this AMODE(24) application if it were not aleready being compiled successfully in an Enterprise COBOL V3R2 environment. This being the case, failure to move working storage above the line in inexcusable, as in omitting to recompile the whole shebang as AMODE(31). John Gilmore Ashland, MA 01721-1817 USA John Gilmore Ashland, MA 01721-1817 USA _ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
On Wed, 9 Nov 2005 12:16:52 -0600, JONES, CHARLIE wrote: We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. You might check to see if any of those 16 QSAM files are striped. That will increase your storage requirements appreciably. IDMS shouldn't be a huge factor ~unless~ you're running in local mode. Better to run against CV if possible. -- David Andrews A. Duda and Sons, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
Charlie, 16x5x27998=2MB, so it looks to me like someone has already bumped your BUFNO or Blksize! Lots of ways to skin a cat - If the files are all different sizes then I would set BUFNO=1 for the smaller files, so there will be minimum impact on performance. Someone mentioned striping using more storage, but I understand that B/QSAM buffers with Extended Format datasets go above the line. If so, would it help to convert the files to Extended Format? Finally, you account for 3.5MB of Region. I assume you have a Region of 8-12MB available so what is using the other 4-8MB? Ron -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JONES, CHARLIE Sent: Thursday, 10 November 2005 2:17 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers 1.5meg) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage 2meg) are using about 3.5meg total Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? Charlie -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Program exhausting below the line storage
We have a LARGE application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage) are using about 3.5m Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? Charlie -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Program exhausting below the line storage
What language? COBOL? What compiler version? Help depends on the details. Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 11:55 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Program exhausting below the line storage We have a LARGE application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage) are using about 3.5m Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? Charlie _ This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Program exhausting below the line storage
What kind of files are involved? VSAM, NonVSAM?? Larry Crilley Dino Software, Corp. http://www.dino-software.com/ 412-734-2853. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Program exhausting below the line storage
On Wed, 9 Nov 2005 10:51:17 -0600, JONES, CHARLIE wrote: We have a LARGE application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage) are using about 3.5m Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? How much in subpool 0 and how much in subpool 2? With very modern storage controllers you can probably reduce the file buffers and not impact the performance too much (not like you might have in 1990, for example). At some point in the near-ish future you might want to get that program researched to see how you want to move it above the line though ... it may take a while to do it and, as I like to say, time is nature's way of keeping everything from happening at once. -- Tom Schmidt Madison, WI -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers 1.5meg) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage 2meg) are using about 3.5meg total Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? Charlie -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
Cobol-Compile option DATA(31). Perhaps also LE runtime ALL31(ON) Roland -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JONES, CHARLIE Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 7:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers 1.5meg) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage 2meg) are using about 3.5meg total Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
With such a current compiler release, just recompiling with the COBOL option DATA(31) should put your working storage above the line. Unless your IDMS requires DATA(24), in which case you have no choice but to reduce the number of buffers assigned to each QSAM file (remember, system default is 5 buffers if you don't specify the BUFNO parameter in your JCL). Or, if some of your QSAM files have large BLKSIZE and others are small, reduce the largest ones first (consider using BUFNO=2 or 3). If they are all large (e.g., half-track blocksize 27998 or close to it), reduce all of them to a comfortable number of buffers. Reducing buffer count *may* affect performance, or not, depending on DASD caching, etc. HTH Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 1:35 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers 1.5meg) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage 2meg) are using about 3.5meg total Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? _ This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
Assuming you can not recompile, and assuming the QSAM buffers are taking a large amount of your region, and assuming your DCBs are not doing LOCATE mode processing... There are several products on the market that can intercept the OPEN and dynamically place your QSAM/VSAM buffers above the 16mb line. StartTool IOO (Serena Software) comes to mind. Larry Crilley Dino Software, Corp. http://www.dino-software.com/ 412-734-2853. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
Reducing block sizes can be *very* costly in performance. Same for buffers. Don't do that. Technically, it is very easy to change a few compile options and recompile. And that is the better choice by far. HTH and good luck. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JONES, CHARLIE Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 12:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers 1.5meg) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage 2meg) are using about 3.5meg total Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? Charlie -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
On Wed, 9 Nov 2005 12:16:52 -0600, JONES, CHARLIE wrote: Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. How many records, on average are in these QSAM files? (Thousands, hundreds- of-thousands, millions, more?) Are any of these files opened/closed/reopened/reclosed during the run? Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Perhaps. Others have commented on general methods, but since you have IDMS involved you may or may not be able to make use of them. Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? I wouldn't reduce the blocking factor but I might (probably would) consider reducing the number of buffers if you have cached DASD on FICON, ferinstance. It won't buy you much for very long though. Do you have JCL overrides for the BUFNO= specified in the JCL today? Just how small is your below-the-line private area, anyway? Is this program loading and executing IDMS in that region, too, or is there some other reason that you have hit a wall at 3.5MB to raise this issue? -- Tom Schmidt Madison, WI -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
I would STRONGLY consider reducing the number of buffers and take the chance that the performance is perhaps less than ideal rather than watch the job ABEND. ABENDs are not considered better performance. On Wed, 9 Nov 2005 14:43:56 -0600, Hal Merritt wrote: Reducing block sizes can be *very* costly in performance. Same for buffers. Don't do that. Technically, it is very easy to change a few compile options and recompile. And that is the better choice by far. HTH and good luck. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JONES, CHARLIE Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. -- Tom Schmidt Madison, WI -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
IDMS does not require DATA(24), although for years they shipped required link time modules as AMODE 24 RMODE 24 and you had to override the linkage editor. We got around it my fixing the module inhouse. I think the name is IDMSCANC. They may also have some old subroutine that is AMODE 24 which will generally force every thing below the line. Isn't there a AMP parm to put the VSAM buffers above the line? also Harold - Original Message - From: Farley, Peter x23353 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 2:13 PM Subject: Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage With such a current compiler release, just recompiling with the COBOL option DATA(31) should put your working storage above the line. Unless your IDMS requires DATA(24), in which case you have no choice but to reduce the number of buffers assigned to each QSAM file (remember, system default is 5 buffers if you don't specify the BUFNO parameter in your JCL). Or, if some of your QSAM files have large BLKSIZE and others are small, reduce the largest ones first (consider using BUFNO=2 or 3). If they are all large (e.g., half-track blocksize 27998 or close to it), reduce all of them to a comfortable number of buffers. Reducing buffer count *may* affect performance, or not, depending on DASD caching, etc. HTH Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 1:35 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage Compiler: PP 5655-G53 IBM Enterprise COBOL for z/OS and OS/390 3.2.0 We have a LARGE COBOL application program that is exhausting below the line storage and abending. There are 16 QSAM files and an IDMS Database. Sub Pool 0 (File Buffers 1.5meg) and Sub Pool 2 (Working Storage 2meg) are using about 3.5meg total Are there any easy tricks to make the entire program run above the line? Or will we simply have to reduce file buffer sizes (Blocking Factor) and reduce Working Storage array sizes? _ This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: COBOL Program exhausting below the line storage
They [IDMS] may also have some old subroutine that is AMODE 24 which will generally force every thing below the line. If the notion of using a program object instead of a load module does not strike you as intolerably 'cutting-edge', the Binder's SPLIT option was provided to address just this class of problems. I could work up more sympathy for the plight of this AMODE(24) application if it were not aleready being compiled successfully in an Enterprise COBOL V3R2 environment. This being the case, failure to move working storage above the line in inexcusable, as in omitting to recompile the whole shebang as AMODE(31). John Gilmore Ashland, MA 01721-1817 USA John Gilmore Ashland, MA 01721-1817 USA _ Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
