Re: LOAD/LINK exit
it would be nice to have a non-supervisor-state thingy that did this - similar to what is available via PTRACE. I think (but I am not sure) that PTRACE would fall into the category of "returning to the user in their state". That is very different than an exit, not particularly different than returning from a PC or an SVC. Peter Relson z/OS Core Technology Design -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
Peter Relson wrote: BPX ptrace...Does that mean performance is not an issue in that case? That seems like a logical conclusion. When the system is running in a privileged state, just about the only safe way to give control to non-privileged work running as an exit or extention under that same task is via SYNCH. That is not going to perform well. Returning to the user in their state is a different case. Peter Relson z/OS Core Technology Design Oh - hmm - it would be nice to have a non-supervisor-state thingy that did this - similar to what is available via PTRACE. But - "would be nice" doesn't make for a good business case :-) - Dave Rivers - -- riv...@dignus.comWork: (919) 676-0847 Get your mainframe programming tools at http://www.dignus.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
>BPX ptrace...Does that mean performance is not an issue in that case? That seems like a logical conclusion. When the system is running in a privileged state, just about the only safe way to give control to non-privileged work running as an exit or extention under that same task is via SYNCH. That is not going to perform well. Returning to the user in their state is a different case. Peter Relson z/OS Core Technology Design -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
On 6/28/2019 4:29 AM, Peter Relson wrote: It has nothing to do with "knowing" anything. It has to do with the environment in which the code calling the exit runs, and avoiding crippling the system by doing something differently that would likely have horrendous performance characteristcs.. It is indeed a very difficult/restrictive exit environment due to the local lock being held at entry! :-\ But... thank you, Thank You, THANK YOU for providing it! It has been truly "life altering" for one of our products! -- Phoenix Software International Edward E. Jaffe 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 https://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ This e-mail message, including any attachments, appended messages and the information contained therein, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not an intended recipient or have otherwise received this email message in error, any use, dissemination, distribution, review, storage or copying of this e-mail message and the information contained therein is strictly prohibited. If you are not an intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of this email message and do not otherwise utilize or retain this email message or any or all of the information contained therein. Although this email message and any attachments or appended messages are believed to be free of any virus or other defect that might affect any computer system into which it is received and opened, it is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that it is virus free and no responsibility is accepted by the sender for any loss or damage arising in any way from its opening or use. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
Peter Relson wrote: I suppose there might be security concerns around knowing what gets fetched? It has nothing to do with "knowing" anything. It has to do with the environment in which the code calling the exit runs, and avoiding crippling the system by doing something differently that would likely have horrendous performance characteristcs.. Peter Relson z/OS Core Technology Design Oh - the BPX ptrace facility provides this function, there is a ptrace event when another module is loaded... And - that facility does not require any special priviledge (you're not in supervisor-state just to use BPX ptrace.) Does that mean performance is not an issue in that case? It might be nice to have a similar facility for monitoring/debugging that didn't require supervisor state and also didn't cause a image to be dub'd... - Dave R. - -- riv...@dignus.comWork: (919) 676-0847 Get your mainframe programming tools at http://www.dignus.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
I suppose there might be security concerns around knowing what gets fetched? It has nothing to do with "knowing" anything. It has to do with the environment in which the code calling the exit runs, and avoiding crippling the system by doing something differently that would likely have horrendous performance characteristcs.. Peter Relson z/OS Core Technology Design -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
Steve Thompson wrote: I would say yes. Note the following: CSVFETCH exit routine environment The exit routine receives control in the following environment: In supervisor state with PSW key 0. Yeah... that makes it less useful; but I suppose there might be security concerns around knowing what gets fetched? A debugger/logging system that has to be authorized is just as much of a security issue as simply opening up the entire system, in my opinion. - Dave R. - -- riv...@dignus.comWork: (919) 676-0847 Get your mainframe programming tools at http://www.dignus.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
I would say yes. Note the following: CSVFETCH exit routine environment The exit routine receives control in the following environment: In supervisor state with PSW key 0. In dispatchable unit mode of task, running under the task and request block of the fetch or unfetch processing. In cross memory mode of PASN=HASN=SASN. In AMODE 31. In primary ASC mode. Enabled for I/O and external interrupts. With the local lock held (the exit routine must not release the local lock) With parameter areas in the primary address space. The parameter list is described below. In the address space in which the fetch or unfetch was initiated Under the task in which the fetch or unfetch was initiated CSVFETCH exit routine recovery The exit routine should provide its own recovery, using SETFRR. If the exit routine ends abnormally, its recovery routine will get control before the recovery routine established by the system. I would have it in an APF library with AC(0) if for no other reason than to know it is in a library of code that can get to SupState/Key0. Regards, Steve Thompson On 6/26/19 1:28 PM, Thomas David Rivers wrote: Michael Stein wrote: On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 02:10:32PM -0400, Steve Thompson wrote: I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via an exit. csvfetch https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSLTBW_2.3.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r3.ieaa800/csvfetch01.htm The CSVFETCH exit provides information about the fetching (or unfetching) of a module. The exit is primarily intended to be used as part of monitoring (whether for reporting or debugging). The exit will be called holding the local lock. The exit routine must not release the local lock. Does that require an authorized module because the exit receives control in KEY 0? - Dave R. - -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
Michael Stein wrote: On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 02:10:32PM -0400, Steve Thompson wrote: I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via an exit. csvfetch https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSLTBW_2.3.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r3.ieaa800/csvfetch01.htm The CSVFETCH exit provides information about the fetching (or unfetching) of a module. The exit is primarily intended to be used as part of monitoring (whether for reporting or debugging). The exit will be called holding the local lock. The exit routine must not release the local lock. Does that require an authorized module because the exit receives control in KEY 0? - Dave R. - -- riv...@dignus.comWork: (919) 676-0847 Get your mainframe programming tools at http://www.dignus.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
On Wed, 26 Jun 2019 at 10:04, Charles Mills wrote: > I get the difference between installation exits and other exits. A SYNAD > exit is certainly an exit, but it is not in the same class with an IEFU83 > exit. > > But I fail to get the distinction relative to CSVFETCH. Installation X wants > to monitor every QSAM close, so they write some code and install it as an > IEFU8x exit. Installation Y wants to monitor every LOAD/FETCH, so they write > some code and install it as a CSVFETCH exit. What is the fundamental > difference? UNIX and Windows (and more generally C) programmers would probably call the SYNAD type of exit a "callback". You use some mechanism (function pointer, name, whatever) to make known a routine to a service you call, and the service may, either exceptionally or as a routine part of what it does for a living, call your routine at some point in processing. I'm not sure what UNIX/Windows people call the CSVFETCH or IEFU83 kind of exit. Possibly "plugin"s? Hmmm... I see that for the versions of one of our products that run on UNIX and Windows, we call them "user exits". I don't know if that is standard terminology on those platforms, or something that was borrowed from our z/OS product, which has similar exits. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
@Peter, welcome back.
I get the difference between installation exits and other exits. A SYNAD
exit is certainly an exit, but it is not in the same class with an IEFU83
exit.
But I fail to get the distinction relative to CSVFETCH. Installation X wants
to monitor every QSAM close, so they write some code and install it as an
IEFU8x exit. Installation Y wants to monitor every LOAD/FETCH, so they write
some code and install it as a CSVFETCH exit. What is the fundamental
difference?
> renaming the book is part of the answer ("Installation Exits and other
> exits" -- of course not exactly that)
How about "Exits"?
> A chapter "a list of
> non-installation exits" seems somewhat incongruous in a book of
> "Installation Exits"
Agreed, but would work as an Appendix.
Charles
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On
Behalf Of Peter Relson
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 5:43 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: LOAD/LINK exit
Perhaps we should consider mentioning CSVFETCH in the
MVS Installation Exits book, with a pointer to the book where CSVFETCH
is documented.
CSVFETCH is not an installation exit. It is what I call a program exit
(e.g., the EXITTYPE keyword of CSVDYNEX), for use by applications. There
are dozens (hundreds?) of program exits with documentation scattered
everywhere.
I'm not at all opposed to having a list of all of these exits, but perhaps
"in the ...Installation Exits book" is not the right answer. Perhaps
renaming the book is part of the answer ("Installation Exits and other
exits" -- of course not exactly that). A chapter "a list of
non-installation exits" seems somewhat incongruous in a book of
"Installation Exits" but finding a different home for such a list might
not find any better approaches.
--
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Re: LOAD/LINK exit
Perhaps we should consider mentioning CSVFETCH in the
MVS Installation Exits book, with a pointer to the book where CSVFETCH
is documented.
CSVFETCH is not an installation exit. It is what I call a program exit
(e.g., the EXITTYPE keyword of CSVDYNEX), for use by applications. There
are dozens (hundreds?) of program exits with documentation scattered
everywhere.
I'm not at all opposed to having a list of all of these exits, but perhaps
"in the ...Installation Exits book" is not the right answer. Perhaps
renaming the book is part of the answer ("Installation Exits and other
exits" -- of course not exactly that). A chapter "a list of
non-installation exits" seems somewhat incongruous in a book of
"Installation Exits" but finding a different home for such a list might
not find any better approaches.
Peter Relson
z/OS Core Technology Design
--
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Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]
Why not IDCAMS? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Jones, Phil <02379a6d81f2-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2019 7:41 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) [SEC=UNOFFICIAL] Ah yes... The good old days, when the question may have been as you wrote: "if you were new to this platform, how would you ever guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?"" The answer would have been IEBGENER if the dataset happened to be SEQUENTIAL, but not if it was PARTITIONED. And certainly not if it was VSAM. Written (half) in jest... :-) Regards; Phil -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Monday, 17 June 2019 4:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) Exactly! You hit on one of the other problems: when you find an answer, how do you know it is THE answer? OGET. OPUT. ISPF 3.3. Etc. In fact the original question here is a matter of finding AN answer (CSVLLIX1 -- but no good, it only does LLA) and then it turning out there was ANOTHER answer that did indeed fill the bill. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:10 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) I thought that the program to copy a dataset was IDCAMS. IEHMOVE? IEBCOPY? The COPY command from COPY, FORMAT, LIST and MERGE (sic)? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Charles Mills Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) Yes! I remembered this exit being added to z/OS. I looked and looked and looked at Installation Exits and when I could not find it, figured I must have read more into CSVLLIXn than really existed. z/OS desperately needs some sort of "master index." IBM has the AI to be able to put up a site that could answer questions like "how do I monitor every FETCH or LOAD?" (or, for that matter, "how do I convert RECFM=U into RECFM=V?"). The platform really needs it. How often do we see questions here where the answer is "it's right in the manual! RTFM you dummy!" The problem is "how would I know to look in that manual?" My favorite example: if you were new to this platform, how would you ever guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?" Just as an experiment, I just keyed "how copy a z/OS file" into KC and got lots of hits, but not one of them was for IEBGENER. Changing file to dataset at least gets me close: the fourth hit is for pervasive encryption and IEBGENER. Maybe we just need to learn to use KC more. You know what? I keyed the original question, "how monitor every fetch and load" into KC and the very first hit was for CSVFETCH. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ** IMPORTANT: This e-mail is for the use of the intended recipient only and may contain information that is confidential, commercially valuable and/or subject to legal or parliamentary privilege. If you are not the intended recipient you are notified that any review, re-transmission, disclosure, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information is prohibited and may result in severe penalties. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the sender immediately and delete all electronic and hard copies of this transmission together with any attachments. Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]
Ah yes... The good old days, when the question may have been as you wrote: "if you were new to this platform, how would you ever guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?"" The answer would have been IEBGENER if the dataset happened to be SEQUENTIAL, but not if it was PARTITIONED. And certainly not if it was VSAM. Written (half) in jest... :-) Regards; Phil -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Monday, 17 June 2019 4:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) Exactly! You hit on one of the other problems: when you find an answer, how do you know it is THE answer? OGET. OPUT. ISPF 3.3. Etc. In fact the original question here is a matter of finding AN answer (CSVLLIX1 -- but no good, it only does LLA) and then it turning out there was ANOTHER answer that did indeed fill the bill. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:10 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) I thought that the program to copy a dataset was IDCAMS. IEHMOVE? IEBCOPY? The COPY command from COPY, FORMAT, LIST and MERGE (sic)? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Charles Mills Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) Yes! I remembered this exit being added to z/OS. I looked and looked and looked at Installation Exits and when I could not find it, figured I must have read more into CSVLLIXn than really existed. z/OS desperately needs some sort of "master index." IBM has the AI to be able to put up a site that could answer questions like "how do I monitor every FETCH or LOAD?" (or, for that matter, "how do I convert RECFM=U into RECFM=V?"). The platform really needs it. How often do we see questions here where the answer is "it's right in the manual! RTFM you dummy!" The problem is "how would I know to look in that manual?" My favorite example: if you were new to this platform, how would you ever guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?" Just as an experiment, I just keyed "how copy a z/OS file" into KC and got lots of hits, but not one of them was for IEBGENER. Changing file to dataset at least gets me close: the fourth hit is for pervasive encryption and IEBGENER. Maybe we just need to learn to use KC more. You know what? I keyed the original question, "how monitor every fetch and load" into KC and the very first hit was for CSVFETCH. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ** IMPORTANT: This e-mail is for the use of the intended recipient only and may contain information that is confidential, commercially valuable and/or subject to legal or parliamentary privilege. If you are not the intended recipient you are notified that any review, re-transmission, disclosure, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information is prohibited and may result in severe penalties. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the sender immediately and delete all electronic and hard copies of this transmission together with any attachments. Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit)
Just to step back a thought or two: Why is it that MVS Utilities is a bad name? Why is it that ADRDSSU requires a PDF advanced search after downloading all the z/os 2.x PDFs before you can find it? Sent from my iPhone — small keyboarf, fat fungrs, stupd spell manglr. Expct mistaks > On Jun 16, 2019, at 2:52 PM, Charles Mills wrote: > > Exactly! You hit on one of the other problems: when you find an answer, how > do you know it is THE answer? > > OGET. OPUT. ISPF 3.3. Etc. > > In fact the original question here is a matter of finding AN answer > (CSVLLIX1 -- but no good, it only does LLA) and then it turning out there > was ANOTHER answer that did indeed fill the bill. > > Charles > > > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On > Behalf Of Seymour J Metz > Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:10 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Subject: Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) > > I thought that the program to copy a dataset was IDCAMS. IEHMOVE? IEBCOPY? > The COPY command from COPY, FORMAT, LIST and MERGE (sic)? > > > -- > Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz > http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 > > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of > Charles Mills > Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:17 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Subject: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) > > Yes! I remembered this exit being added to z/OS. I looked and looked and > looked at Installation Exits and when I could not find it, figured I must > have read more into CSVLLIXn than really existed. > > z/OS desperately needs some sort of "master index." IBM has the AI to be > able to put up a site that could answer questions like "how do I monitor > every FETCH or LOAD?" (or, for that matter, "how do I convert RECFM=U into > RECFM=V?"). The platform really needs it. How often do we see questions here > where the answer is "it's right in the manual! RTFM you dummy!" The problem > is "how would I know to look in that manual?" > > My favorite example: if you were new to this platform, how would you ever > guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and > was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great > if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?" > > Just as an experiment, I just keyed "how copy a z/OS file" into KC and got > lots of hits, but not one of them was for IEBGENER. Changing file to dataset > at least gets me close: the fourth hit is for pervasive encryption and > IEBGENER. > > Maybe we just need to learn to use KC more. You know what? I keyed the > original question, "how monitor every fetch and load" into KC and the very > first hit was for CSVFETCH. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit)
Exactly! You hit on one of the other problems: when you find an answer, how do you know it is THE answer? OGET. OPUT. ISPF 3.3. Etc. In fact the original question here is a matter of finding AN answer (CSVLLIX1 -- but no good, it only does LLA) and then it turning out there was ANOTHER answer that did indeed fill the bill. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:10 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) I thought that the program to copy a dataset was IDCAMS. IEHMOVE? IEBCOPY? The COPY command from COPY, FORMAT, LIST and MERGE (sic)? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Charles Mills Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) Yes! I remembered this exit being added to z/OS. I looked and looked and looked at Installation Exits and when I could not find it, figured I must have read more into CSVLLIXn than really existed. z/OS desperately needs some sort of "master index." IBM has the AI to be able to put up a site that could answer questions like "how do I monitor every FETCH or LOAD?" (or, for that matter, "how do I convert RECFM=U into RECFM=V?"). The platform really needs it. How often do we see questions here where the answer is "it's right in the manual! RTFM you dummy!" The problem is "how would I know to look in that manual?" My favorite example: if you were new to this platform, how would you ever guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?" Just as an experiment, I just keyed "how copy a z/OS file" into KC and got lots of hits, but not one of them was for IEBGENER. Changing file to dataset at least gets me close: the fourth hit is for pervasive encryption and IEBGENER. Maybe we just need to learn to use KC more. You know what? I keyed the original question, "how monitor every fetch and load" into KC and the very first hit was for CSVFETCH. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit)
I thought that the program to copy a dataset was IDCAMS. IEHMOVE? IEBCOPY? The COPY command from COPY, FORMAT, LIST and MERGE (sic)? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Charles Mills Sent: Friday, June 14, 2019 12:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit) Yes! I remembered this exit being added to z/OS. I looked and looked and looked at Installation Exits and when I could not find it, figured I must have read more into CSVLLIXn than really existed. z/OS desperately needs some sort of "master index." IBM has the AI to be able to put up a site that could answer questions like "how do I monitor every FETCH or LOAD?" (or, for that matter, "how do I convert RECFM=U into RECFM=V?"). The platform really needs it. How often do we see questions here where the answer is "it's right in the manual! RTFM you dummy!" The problem is "how would I know to look in that manual?" My favorite example: if you were new to this platform, how would you ever guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?" Just as an experiment, I just keyed "how copy a z/OS file" into KC and got lots of hits, but not one of them was for IEBGENER. Changing file to dataset at least gets me close: the fourth hit is for pervasive encryption and IEBGENER. Maybe we just need to learn to use KC more. You know what? I keyed the original question, "how monitor every fetch and load" into KC and the very first hit was for CSVFETCH. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jim Mulder Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2019 8:27 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: LOAD/LINK exit CSVLLIX1 works only for LLA-managed libraries. I was still looking for the more comprehensive CSVFETCH exit, which was added in z/OS 2.2. Perhaps we should consider mentioning CSVFETCH in the MVS Installation Exits book, with a pointer to the book where CSVFETCH is documented. Jim Mulder z/OS Diagnosis, Design, Development, Test IBM Corp. Poughkeepsie NY -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Need for a z/OS "master index" (Was RE: LOAD/LINK exit)
Yes! I remembered this exit being added to z/OS. I looked and looked and looked at Installation Exits and when I could not find it, figured I must have read more into CSVLLIXn than really existed. z/OS desperately needs some sort of "master index." IBM has the AI to be able to put up a site that could answer questions like "how do I monitor every FETCH or LOAD?" (or, for that matter, "how do I convert RECFM=U into RECFM=V?"). The platform really needs it. How often do we see questions here where the answer is "it's right in the manual! RTFM you dummy!" The problem is "how would I know to look in that manual?" My favorite example: if you were new to this platform, how would you ever guess that the tool to copy a file (oops, dataset) was named IEBGENER and was documented in a manual named "DFSMSdfp Utilities"? Wouldn't it be great if a newbie could just go "Watson! How do I copy a file?" Just as an experiment, I just keyed "how copy a z/OS file" into KC and got lots of hits, but not one of them was for IEBGENER. Changing file to dataset at least gets me close: the fourth hit is for pervasive encryption and IEBGENER. Maybe we just need to learn to use KC more. You know what? I keyed the original question, "how monitor every fetch and load" into KC and the very first hit was for CSVFETCH. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jim Mulder Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2019 8:27 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: LOAD/LINK exit CSVLLIX1 works only for LLA-managed libraries. I was still looking for the more comprehensive CSVFETCH exit, which was added in z/OS 2.2. Perhaps we should consider mentioning CSVFETCH in the MVS Installation Exits book, with a pointer to the book where CSVFETCH is documented. Jim Mulder z/OS Diagnosis, Design, Development, Test IBM Corp. Poughkeepsie NY -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
That would be wonderful. Sent from my iPhone — small keyboarf, fat fungrs, stupd spell manglr. Expct mistaks > On Jun 13, 2019, at 11:26 PM, Jim Mulder wrote: > > CSVLLIX1 works only for LLA-managed libraries. I was still looking for > the more comprehensive CSVFETCH exit, which was added in z/OS 2.2. > Perhaps we should consider mentioning CSVFETCH in the > MVS Installation Exits book, with a pointer to the book where CSVFETCH > is documented. > > Jim Mulder z/OS Diagnosis, Design, Development, Test IBM Corp. > Poughkeepsie NY > > > "IBM Mainframe Discussion List" wrote on > 06/13/2019 06:47:09 PM: > >> From: "Charles Mills" >> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU >> Date: 06/13/2019 11:19 PM >> Subject: Re: LOAD/LINK exit >> Sent by: "IBM Mainframe Discussion List" >> >> @Jim, does CSVLLIX1 satisfy the OP's request? I read that "CSVLLIX1 is >> called each time a program fetch occurs for LLA managed members." >> >> Does not the OP want to be aware of *every* LOAD and FETCH, even those > that >> do not involve LLA-managed members? He specifically says the LLA exits >> appear not to be sufficient. >> >> Or am I missing something? >> >> Charles > > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
CSVLLIX1 works only for LLA-managed libraries. I was still looking for the more comprehensive CSVFETCH exit, which was added in z/OS 2.2. Perhaps we should consider mentioning CSVFETCH in the MVS Installation Exits book, with a pointer to the book where CSVFETCH is documented. Jim Mulder z/OS Diagnosis, Design, Development, Test IBM Corp. Poughkeepsie NY "IBM Mainframe Discussion List" wrote on 06/13/2019 06:47:09 PM: > From: "Charles Mills" > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 06/13/2019 11:19 PM > Subject: Re: LOAD/LINK exit > Sent by: "IBM Mainframe Discussion List" > > @Jim, does CSVLLIX1 satisfy the OP's request? I read that "CSVLLIX1 is > called each time a program fetch occurs for LLA managed members." > > Does not the OP want to be aware of *every* LOAD and FETCH, even those that > do not involve LLA-managed members? He specifically says the LLA exits > appear not to be sufficient. > > Or am I missing something? > > Charles -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 02:10:32PM -0400, Steve Thompson wrote: > I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via an exit. csvfetch https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSLTBW_2.3.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r3.ieaa800/csvfetch01.htm The CSVFETCH exit provides information about the fetching (or unfetching) of a module. The exit is primarily intended to be used as part of monitoring (whether for reporting or debugging). The exit will be called holding the local lock. The exit routine must not release the local lock. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
I think I can say with some confidence that nothing in SMF will tell you every LOAD and FETCH, or every module loaded or fetched. SMF 14 will give you every BSAM, QSAM and BPAM CLOSE INPUT, which will give you every load library -- and a whole lot more, unfortunately. SMF 30 now gives you the "high CPU time" module name, but that is hardly an answer. Of course, some modules might be in zFS ... Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2019 11:11 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: LOAD/LINK exit Folks: I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via an exit. But CSV also stands for comma separated values among other things and I keep getting a large number of false positives. None seemingly to do with the MVS Contents Supervisor (maker of CDE chains and the like, right?). I've been looking at the MVS Installation Exits and some other books for a way to do what I need. We know that SMF records are produced for the PGM= module/event in a JOB. We know of no such record produced for LOAD and equivalent. What we need is a way to see what is being pulled into address spaces. We are trying to find all the subroutines being used. And I don't think STEPLIBs are included with the LLA Exits. Now we have a way to scan all the Linkedit listings (that we capture), but we are looking for what one might call "dynamic" loads. It is an effort to do self-audit and over time get rid of software (especially in-house written OLD subroutines) we aren't using/don't need. I'm sure we aren't the first to need this. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
@Jim, does CSVLLIX1 satisfy the OP's request? I read that "CSVLLIX1 is called each time a program fetch occurs for LLA managed members." Does not the OP want to be aware of *every* LOAD and FETCH, even those that do not involve LLA-managed members? He specifically says the LLA exits appear not to be sufficient. Or am I missing something? Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jim Mulder Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2019 12:18 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: LOAD/LINK exit CSVLLIX1 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
My first take was to use GTF, but it's probably cleaner to use an exit that MVS calls regardless of which SVC is used to fetch the module. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Steve Thompson Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2019 2:10 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: LOAD/LINK exit Folks: I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via an exit. But CSV also stands for comma separated values among other things and I keep getting a large number of false positives. None seemingly to do with the MVS Contents Supervisor (maker of CDE chains and the like, right?). I've been looking at the MVS Installation Exits and some other books for a way to do what I need. We know that SMF records are produced for the PGM= module/event in a JOB. We know of no such record produced for LOAD and equivalent. What we need is a way to see what is being pulled into address spaces. We are trying to find all the subroutines being used. And I don't think STEPLIBs are included with the LLA Exits. Now we have a way to scan all the Linkedit listings (that we capture), but we are looking for what one might call "dynamic" loads. It is an effort to do self-audit and over time get rid of software (especially in-house written OLD subroutines) we aren't using/don't need. I'm sure we aren't the first to need this. And I do not want to go write an SVC intercept program to look for things like this Shades of DUO360... ouch. If you have any suggestions on this, or if you know of an ISV product that will do this, I think my management will be interested. Regards, Steve Thompson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
On 2019-06-13 14:10, Steve Thompson wrote: if you know of an ISV product that will do this The Reference Tracker component of eventACTION does this. -- Regards, Gord Tomlin Action Software International (a division of Mazda Computer Corporation) Tel: (905) 470-7113, Fax: (905) 470-6507 Support: https://actionsoftware.com/support/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
CSVLLIX1 Jim Mulder z/OS Diagnosis, Design, Development, Test IBM Corp. Poughkeepsie NY "IBM Mainframe Discussion List" wrote on 06/13/2019 02:10:32 PM: > From: "Steve Thompson" > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 06/13/2019 03:17 PM > Subject: LOAD/LINK exit > Sent by: "IBM Mainframe Discussion List" > > Folks: > > I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via > an exit. > > But CSV also stands for comma separated values among other things > and I keep getting a large number of false positives. None > seemingly to do with the MVS Contents Supervisor (maker of CDE > chains and the like, right?). > > I've been looking at the MVS Installation Exits and some other > books for a way to do what I need. > > We know that SMF records are produced for the PGM= module/event > in a JOB. We know of no such record produced for LOAD and > equivalent. > > What we need is a way to see what is being pulled into address > spaces. We are trying to find all the subroutines being used. And > I don't think STEPLIBs are included with the LLA Exits. > > Now we have a way to scan all the Linkedit listings (that we > capture), but we are looking for what one might call "dynamic" > loads. > > It is an effort to do self-audit and over time get rid of > software (especially in-house written OLD subroutines) we aren't > using/don't need. > > I'm sure we aren't the first to need this. > > And I do not want to go write an SVC intercept program to look > for things like this Shades of DUO360... ouch. > > If you have any suggestions on this, or if you know of an ISV > product that will do this, I think my management will be interested. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LOAD/LINK exit
The Dorana product from Ubiquity did exactly the sort of audit reporting you’re looking for, with the same end objectives, and for more than just z/OS. Softaudit was another product with similar objectives. I think Softaudit ended up being owned by IBM. Dorana was acquired by IBM some years ago and became some Tivoli component who’s name escapes me. I think its direction/emphasis may have been changed by IBM. Cheers to all Graeme Gibson > On 13 Jun 2019, at 20:10, Steve Thompson wrote: > > Folks: > > I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via an exit. > > But CSV also stands for comma separated values among other things and I keep > getting a large number of false positives. None seemingly to do with the MVS > Contents Supervisor (maker of CDE chains and the like, right?). > > I've been looking at the MVS Installation Exits and some other books for a > way to do what I need. > > We know that SMF records are produced for the PGM= module/event in a JOB. We > know of no such record produced for LOAD and equivalent. > > What we need is a way to see what is being pulled into address spaces. We are > trying to find all the subroutines being used. And I don't think STEPLIBs are > included with the LLA Exits. > > Now we have a way to scan all the Linkedit listings (that we capture), but we > are looking for what one might call "dynamic" loads. > > It is an effort to do self-audit and over time get rid of software > (especially in-house written OLD subroutines) we aren't using/don't need. > > I'm sure we aren't the first to need this. > > And I do not want to go write an SVC intercept program to look for things > like this Shades of DUO360... ouch. > > If you have any suggestions on this, or if you know of an ISV product that > will do this, I think my management will be interested. > > Regards, > Steve Thompson > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
LOAD/LINK exit
Folks: I seem to recall that there is a way to look at a LOAD/FETCH via an exit. But CSV also stands for comma separated values among other things and I keep getting a large number of false positives. None seemingly to do with the MVS Contents Supervisor (maker of CDE chains and the like, right?). I've been looking at the MVS Installation Exits and some other books for a way to do what I need. We know that SMF records are produced for the PGM= module/event in a JOB. We know of no such record produced for LOAD and equivalent. What we need is a way to see what is being pulled into address spaces. We are trying to find all the subroutines being used. And I don't think STEPLIBs are included with the LLA Exits. Now we have a way to scan all the Linkedit listings (that we capture), but we are looking for what one might call "dynamic" loads. It is an effort to do self-audit and over time get rid of software (especially in-house written OLD subroutines) we aren't using/don't need. I'm sure we aren't the first to need this. And I do not want to go write an SVC intercept program to look for things like this Shades of DUO360... ouch. If you have any suggestions on this, or if you know of an ISV product that will do this, I think my management will be interested. Regards, Steve Thompson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
