Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Terry wrote, it is imperative that you have a robust paging subsystem I do not claim great knowledge in z/VM performance matters. Where ignorance is bliss, tis folly to be wise (Thomas Gray) Does z/VM, unlike z/OS, still need to do a lot of paging? In the z/OS world paging has become virtually(no pun intended :-)) non-existent. So what's all this fuss about paging in z/VM. True, you still need enough page space defined on disk to back storage. But after that there should be little to nil paging going on at least in the z/OS, MVS world. I know years ago there were problems with the handshaking between MVS and VM. The problem being it was virtually :-) non-existent, unlike VSE which had the VM/VSE Feature. So that whenever an MVS address space got a page fault, the entire MVS virtual machine was swapped out. But, I thought, that was addressed :-) years ago and today z/VM is aware of such things. So, then why the need for a robust paging subsystem. It all kinda leaves you starry-eyed and vaguely discontented. Martin, Terry R. (CMS/CTR) (CTR) terry.mar...@cms.hhs.gov Sent by: The IBM z/VM Operating System IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU 09/16/2010 09:50 PM Please respond to The IBM z/VM Operating System IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU To IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU cc Subject Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests I would just add that for any significant number of z/Linux guests it is imperative that you have a robust paging subsystem and enough spool space to hold CP dumps as well as other spool files. Having a well configured paging subsystem will greatly reduce the possibility of issues when your system has a high paging rate due to the over commitment of Available Real Memory versus the total memory of all users running in the LPAR combined. The higher this over commitment ratio the more paging is introduced. The good news is as long as you have a sufficient paging subsystem z/VM handles paging nicely even at relatively high rates. So over commitment of real memory in z/VM is good just keep an eye out so that the ratio stays within reason. Thank You, Terry Martin Lockheed Martin - Citic z/OS and z/VM Performance Tuning and Operating Systems Support Office - 443 348-2102 Cell - 443 632-4191 -Original Message- From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel Tate Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
On 9/17/2010 at 09:24 AM, George Henke/NYLIC george_he...@newyorklife.com wrote: Does z/VM, unlike z/OS, still need to do a lot of paging? In the z/OS world paging has become virtually(no pun intended :-)) non-existent. z/VM does very little paging (if not zero) on behalf of itself. Because z/VM allows considerable overcommit of storage among the various guests, it can wind up doing a _lot_ of paging to manage all that. If you ever started using z/OS as a hypervisor, it would have the same problem, unless you strictly limited the amount of virtual storage each guest had to add up to less than the available real storage. Mark Post
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Yes, and the original statement was based on the assumption that the over commitment of real memory was high. Obviously if there is little to no over commitment than you will see very little paging from z/VM on behalf of the users. I will also add that even in z/OS say you are running a good size DB2 environment if you do not have ample real storage you will still see paging for sure to your paging subsystem and without expanded storage no longer available in z/OS it will go right to DASD. Thank You, Terry Martin Lockheed Martin - Citic z/OS and z/VM Performance Tuning and Operating Systems Support Office - 443 348-2102 Cell - 443 632-4191 -Original Message- From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Post Sent: Friday, September 17, 2010 10:53 AM To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests On 9/17/2010 at 09:24 AM, George Henke/NYLIC george_he...@newyorklife.com wrote: Does z/VM, unlike z/OS, still need to do a lot of paging? In the z/OS world paging has become virtually(no pun intended :-)) non-existent. z/VM does very little paging (if not zero) on behalf of itself. Because z/VM allows considerable overcommit of storage among the various guests, it can wind up doing a _lot_ of paging to manage all that. If you ever started using z/OS as a hypervisor, it would have the same problem, unless you strictly limited the amount of virtual storage each guest had to add up to less than the available real storage. Mark Post
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Daniel, your z/VM user id needs to have class D privileges to issue the Q ALLOC PAGE command. On 09/16/2010 10:42 AM, Daniel Tate wrote: CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
(I use MAINT too much..) If your SRM STORBUFF values are as you say, then STORBUFF is unlikely to be causing the problem, although still possible. The next time the problem occurs, do the CP IND and check for an Eligible list. If the E3 numbers are non-zero, then try raising the STORBUFF values further, as Davd suggested (300% 300% 300%). Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:42 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
EXTENT EXTENT TOTAL PAGES HIGH% VOLID RDEV STARTEND PAGES IN USE PAGE USED -- -- -- -- -- -- VM6PG1 9F86 1 10016 1761K 1175K 1761K 66% VM6PG2 9F87 0 0180180180 100% -- -- SUMMARY1761K 1175K 66% USABLE 1761K 1175K 66% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 11:56:46 On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 11:30 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: (I use MAINT too much..) If your SRM STORBUFF values are as you say, then STORBUFF is unlikely to be causing the problem, although still possible. The next time the problem occurs, do the CP IND and check for an Eligible list. If the E3 numbers are non-zero, then try raising the STORBUFF values further, as Davd suggested (300% 300% 300%). Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:42 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Well, that's why! You need more page space. Preferably volumes with nothing else on them. And spread it over multiple LCUs if you can. Keep it 35%. 50 max - but I prefer 35 in case you add things and aren't paying attention. marcy -Original Message- From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel Tate Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:59 AM To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: [IBMVM] CP unresponsive on certain guests EXTENT EXTENT TOTAL PAGES HIGH% VOLID RDEV STARTEND PAGES IN USE PAGE USED -- -- -- -- -- -- VM6PG1 9F86 1 10016 1761K 1175K 1761K 66% VM6PG2 9F87 0 0180180180 100% -- -- SUMMARY1761K 1175K 66% USABLE 1761K 1175K 66% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 11:56:46 On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 11:30 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: (I use MAINT too much..) If your SRM STORBUFF values are as you say, then STORBUFF is unlikely to be causing the problem, although still possible. The next time the problem occurs, do the CP IND and check for an Eligible list. If the E3 numbers are non-zero, then try raising the STORBUFF values further, as Davd suggested (300% 300% 300%). Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:42 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
-- -- -- -- -- -- VM6PG1 9F86 1 10016 1761K 1175K 1761K 66% VM6PG2 9F87 0 0180180180 100% Mmf. You need to update the allocation bitmap on VM6PG2 to have it use the rest of the disk (assuming it's dedicated for paging). One cylinder doesn't really help much. 8-) PERM 0 1 PAGE 1 END Before you start messing with STORBUF overcommits, make sure you have plenty of page space.
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Depending on your workload, that is not very much paging space at all. Is it enough to back up all the defined virtual storage? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com wrote: EXTENT EXTENT TOTAL PAGES HIGH% VOLID RDEV STARTEND PAGES IN USE PAGE USED -- -- -- -- -- -- VM6PG1 9F86 1 10016 1761K 1175K 1761K 66% VM6PG2 9F87 0 0180180180 100% -- -- SUMMARY1761K 1175K 66% USABLE 1761K 1175K 66% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 11:56:46 On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 11:30 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: (I use MAINT too much..) If your SRM STORBUFF values are as you say, then STORBUFF is unlikely to be causing the problem, although still possible. The next time the problem occurs, do the CP IND and check for an Eligible list. If the E3 numbers are non-zero, then try raising the STORBUFF values further, as Davd suggested (300% 300% 300%). Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:42 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
It appears that you didn't allocate any cylinders VM6PG2 as page space. Not sure how safe it is to detach that volume - or if a DRAIN will even work .. For now - you may want to sacrifice another volume (VM6PG3) - allocate it correctly (PAGE 1 END) -- do the DEF CPOWN SLOT x VM6PG3..Then you can relabel things later so PG2 is being used and has page space. Scott Rohling On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:58 AM, Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com wrote: EXTENT EXTENT TOTAL PAGES HIGH% VOLID RDEV STARTEND PAGES IN USE PAGE USED -- -- -- -- -- -- VM6PG1 9F86 1 10016 1761K 1175K 1761K 66% VM6PG2 9F87 0 0180180180 100% -- -- SUMMARY1761K 1175K 66% USABLE 1761K 1175K 66% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 11:56:46 On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 11:30 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: (I use MAINT too much..) If your SRM STORBUFF values are as you say, then STORBUFF is unlikely to be causing the problem, although still possible. The next time the problem occurs, do the CP IND and check for an Eligible list. If the E3 numbers are non-zero, then try raising the STORBUFF values further, as Davd suggested (300% 300% 300%). Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:42 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
You are paging on one disk only, and that disk is filled too much. My guess is that the one installing VM6PG2 as paging device forgot format that disk. Get a link to a fullpack overlaying VM6PG2 (eg DEFINE MDISK 0 END VM6PG2) Issue ICKDSF press enter twice CPVOL LIST UNIT() VERIFY(VM6PG2) 2010/9/16 Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com EXTENT EXTENT TOTAL PAGES HIGH% VOLID RDEV STARTEND PAGES IN USE PAGE USED -- -- -- -- -- -- VM6PG1 9F86 1 10016 1761K 1175K 1761K 66% VM6PG2 9F87 0 0180180180 100% -- -- SUMMARY1761K 1175K 66% USABLE 1761K 1175K 66% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 11:56:46 On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 11:30 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: (I use MAINT too much..) If your SRM STORBUFF values are as you say, then STORBUFF is unlikely to be causing the problem, although still possible. The next time the problem occurs, do the CP IND and check for an Eligible list. If the E3 numbers are non-zero, then try raising the STORBUFF values further, as Davd suggested (300% 300% 300%). Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:42 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Oh - and make sure you FORMAT the entire volume or that it's already formatted when you do the allocation -- otherwise, you'll get paging errors and likely abend. (That would be CPFMTXA 9F88 - answer FORMAT - answer 0 END - give it label - after format - answer PAGE 1 END - followed by END for the allocation.) Scott Rohling On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 11:10 AM, Scott Rohling scott.rohl...@gmail.comwrote: It appears that you didn't allocate any cylinders VM6PG2 as page space. Not sure how safe it is to detach that volume - or if a DRAIN will even work .. For now - you may want to sacrifice another volume (VM6PG3) - allocate it correctly (PAGE 1 END) -- do the DEF CPOWN SLOT x VM6PG3..Then you can relabel things later so PG2 is being used and has page space. Scott Rohling On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:58 AM, Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.comwrote: EXTENT EXTENT TOTAL PAGES HIGH% VOLID RDEV STARTEND PAGES IN USE PAGE USED -- -- -- -- -- -- VM6PG1 9F86 1 10016 1761K 1175K 1761K 66% VM6PG2 9F87 0 0180180180 100% -- -- SUMMARY1761K 1175K 66% USABLE 1761K 1175K 66% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 11:56:46 On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 11:30 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: (I use MAINT too much..) If your SRM STORBUFF values are as you say, then STORBUFF is unlikely to be causing the problem, although still possible. The next time the problem occurs, do the CP IND and check for an Eligible list. If the E3 numbers are non-zero, then try raising the STORBUFF values further, as Davd suggested (300% 300% 300%). Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:42 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests CP Q ALLOC PAGE gives me invalid option - alloc. I didnt set the SRM variables; the consultant who initially came in to set this up might have. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, Mike At HammockTree m...@hammocktree.us wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 7:09 PM, Kris Buelens kris.buel...@gmail.com wrote: You are paging on one disk only, and that disk is filled too much. My guess is that the one installing VM6PG2 as paging device forgot format that disk. The 180 blocks suggests that he got at least the allocation wrong, using only cylinder 0 as PAGE. Maybe also forget to format, but we can't tell. Since you can't free the volume now to make CP see the rest of it once allocated, just take a new volume and format that completely, allocate 1-END as PAGE. | Rob
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
I would just add that for any significant number of z/Linux guests it is imperative that you have a robust paging subsystem and enough spool space to hold CP dumps as well as other spool files. Having a well configured paging subsystem will greatly reduce the possibility of issues when your system has a high paging rate due to the over commitment of Available Real Memory versus the total memory of all users running in the LPAR combined. The higher this over commitment ratio the more paging is introduced. The good news is as long as you have a sufficient paging subsystem z/VM handles paging nicely even at relatively high rates. So over commitment of real memory in z/VM is good just keep an eye out so that the ratio stays within reason. Thank You, Terry Martin Lockheed Martin - Citic z/OS and z/VM Performance Tuning and Operating Systems Support Office - 443 348-2102 Cell - 443 632-4191 -Original Message- From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel Tate Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Gee Mike, you come to my class and don't learn nothen. the only thing that storbuf does is hurt, turning it off is the only recommendation that anyone ever gives. i look at this thread and So, anyone reading this, IF YOU HAVE A PERFORMANCE PROBLEM, if you send us z/vm monitor data, we will analyze it for you FOR FREE, everybody is guessing, and it really is a whole lot easier if you just collect a few minutes of data and send it to us. We have this really cool tool (ztune) we run the data through to give a full configuration check, health check, and performance analysis. Once we have the data, it's like 2 minutes to get this report. Can we make it any easier? Mike At HammockTree wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Nice pitch.. Scott Rohling On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 9:12 PM, Barton Robinson bar...@vm1.velocity-software.com wrote: Gee Mike, you come to my class and don't learn nothen. the only thing that storbuf does is hurt, turning it off is the only recommendation that anyone ever gives. i look at this thread and So, anyone reading this, IF YOU HAVE A PERFORMANCE PROBLEM, if you send us z/vm monitor data, we will analyze it for you FOR FREE, everybody is guessing, and it really is a whole lot easier if you just collect a few minutes of data and send it to us. We have this really cool tool (ztune) we run the data through to give a full configuration check, health check, and performance analysis. Once we have the data, it's like 2 minutes to get this report. Can we make it any easier? Mike At HammockTree wrote: Yeah, that is probably where he needs to end up Dave, but I'm a little hesitant to recommend the 300% for Q3 without feeling more comfortable about his paging subsystem... Moving a couple of large guests from the E-list to in-Q could cause a increase in paging that he may or may not be configured to handle. Mike - Original Message - From: Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:08 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Actually, Mike, he may be better off (a bit, at least) by setting STORBUFF 300 300 300. On 09/16/2010 09:58 AM, Mike At HammockTree wrote: Since the STORBUF setting is exactly the values I suggested, I suspect you applied the SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% prior to doing the Q SRM With the current setting for STORBUFF, are you still experiencing the problem? Also, on a related note, what does your zVM paging system look like? The output of CP Q ALLOC PAGE will provide the information Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:52 AM Subject: Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests Output of Q SRM q srm IABIAS : INTENSITY=90%; DURATION=2 LDUBUF : Q1=100% Q2=75% Q3=60% STORBUF: Q1=300% Q2=250% Q3=200% DSPBUF : Q1=32767 Q2=32767 Q3=32767 DISPATCHING MINOR TIMESLICE = 5 MS MAXWSS : LIMIT=% .. : PAGES=99 XSTORE : 0% Ready; T=0.01/0.01 09:49:05 On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Dave Jones d...@vsoft-software.com wrote: Hi, Daniel. The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE command needs to have privilege class A as well. Usually this is done from either MAINT or OPERATOR. The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid. As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given an opportunity to run. To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor (it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now. On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote: We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be? -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544 -- Dave Jones V/Soft Software www.vsoft-software.com Houston, TX 281.578.7544
CP unresponsive on certain guests
We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
FORCE username entered from another user name works well providing another user name has the correct privileges. -Original Message- From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel Tate Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 5:15 PM To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: CP unresponsive on certain guests We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
Q SRM And let us know what that says. -Original Message- From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel Tate Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 3:15 PM To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: [IBMVM] CP unresponsive on certain guests We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?
Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests
When you do the IND LOAD (or just IND), does the E3 field have any non-zero number? If yes, then you have formed a Eligible list. You should investigate and understand the implications, but the quick fix is to set a more reasonable SRM STORBUFF value, for example: CP SET SRM STORBUFF 300% 250% 200% might be a reasonable starting point. Use with a bit of caution as this may invite high paging rates if you have significantly overcommitted storage. Mike - Original Message - From: Daniel Tate daniel.t...@gmail.com To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 6:14 PM Subject: CP unresponsive on certain guests We're starting to run apps on the servers now. From time to time a guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11). not even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged. from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD shows no appreciable load. Two questions from this: 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user? Is this possible? 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?
