[IceHorses] Re: E-trade
> Let us know how it goes! and send pictures! > > > > Whatever money we got for the yearlings could be put to work at E- > > trade; with E-trade's new bracket stops and liberal trading policy, > > four of our trading buddies have been doubling their account values > > every month on naked calls. > > E-trade??? Thankyou! I dunno what will happen with the horses; my daughter was going to buy the herd and have it delivered to our farm, but she's been hesitating since her mutual funds took a hit with the recent drop in the stock market. E-trade is an online brokerage house. Formerly, brokerages required traders to have $100,000 or more in their accounts and qualify for a 5 trading level before they would be allowed to do naked calls. With the proliferation of online brokerages, rules are relaxing and benefits are increasing, i.e., E-trade lets traders start with $2000 and a level 4. There are others with no trading level required. With the bracket stops, you can set your trade to close out automatically no matter which direction the market goes. Anyway, even without the stops, about four of our trading friends-one man and three older ladies (people call them the "naked ladies") have been averaging from 100 to 120 percent growth in their brokerage accounts each month doing naked calls using the N2K Terry Harris method, and said they'll be millionaires by summer. We've been getting similar results with virtual trades, but haven't started doing real trades yet because of the $2000 minimum. I'm only a level 3, but could easily qualify for a 4. If the naked trades work with real money, the money from the sale of a yearling really COULD support you; $2000 doubled only ten times is $1,2400! Rachel in E. KY >
Re: [IceHorses] UPDATE FROM ICELAND - Possible cure for eczema in Icelandic horses
On Thu, Mar 08, 2007 at 11:08:13AM -0500, Karen Thomas wrote: > >>> That would be lovely - where can we volunteer to participate in the > study? The article states 20 - 30 percent of exported Icelandic come down > with SE. HAHAHHA - DON'T we all wish that were true! 70-80% is a much > better guestimate. Anneliese > > THERE'S the voice of experience speaking, at least with Icelandics on the > east coast of North America. She's had her own lab study going for 25 > years...domestics and imports. has she? there seems to be a difference between "guesstimate" and "lab study", and i'd really like to know which was done, and how. --vicka
[IceHorses] Holar and Centered Riding
These are some pics from the Icelandic farm that is the contact for the Centered Riding clinic at Holar. At least the noseband in this pic is not dropped. Click on the website link, then "News" then "Svala and her offspring". I wonder how the clinic went...it was this week. http://www.anatomyinmotion.com/fschedule.htm Trish
Re: [IceHorses] Annie and Kat
> Hi Annie - glad to see you posting on this list again. Welcome back! (Kat > and Annie back the same day - how nice!) Thank you for your warm welcome. Annie
Re: [IceHorses] Colt Not Gaiting
On 08/03/07, Judy Ryder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Here's some advice from a trainer in another gaited breed, about getting a > colt to gait on the ground: Nothing much in there about what's going on in that baby's head is there? Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
>I love it, is it pretty thick? >Kim It's nicely made. Cushy, but not so bulky you'd feel perched. It is a bareback pad, Janice. (I wouldn't use a bareback pad on the rides you usually go on either! I like them to do a quick lesson, helps my balance and the horse's) Cherie
[IceHorses] Re: Alois Podhajsky on the young horse...
> > that is a great quote! did he write it in english, or is this translated? > I think that it was originally written in German (~1965), I am reading the translated version (~1967). -Kristen
[IceHorses] Colt Not Gaiting
Here's some advice from a trainer in another gaited breed, about getting a colt to gait on the ground: Yes, it is common in our youngsters, and thank your stars that he is trotting and not pacing under saddle. I am working one of the latter right now, that trots in the round pen but paces under saddle. I personally find that very difficult to work out of a horse. I think I will have to round up some cavelletis to work him over to break up that friggin' stepped pace, and perhaps also teach him to loped before I am going to get the gait out of him that I know is in there. Anyway, on your colt, since you have ridden pasos, the key is the old Paso maxim "restraint and impulsion," ie, you have to restrain him in front and get impulsion from the rear. This is easily seen with colts like him on the lead line, in the paso bella forma position, head up, nose in, butt tucked, restrained in front, driving forward into the restraint from the rear. With pasos they do the bella forma on long lines with usually two, sometimes one very skilled person walking behind the colt with a buggy whip to get them to tuck the hindquarters under them. With our colts, when I am testing for gait in a youngster I haven't been able to see out in the pasture, I put a halter on them and use a butt rope tied in a loop with the knot about in the middle of their back, and the long end or the loop running through the halter ring. Then I have both the rope connected to the loop of the butt rope and the lead line in my hand. I don't pull the colt forward with the lead line, I pull them forward with the butt rope, which has the effect, from the point of view of the colt, of pushing them forward with the butt tucked under them. I use the lead rope to the halter for direction, and to get the head up. I run forward, and if I can, have someone behind them kissing and clapping at them to get them going forward faster than a walk. Most of them will immediately pop up into a step rack for me. After a while, they just learn to run forward in gait beside me. So, apply the same principals to the colt under saddle, get that head up, nose tucked, and use your legs to keep the forward motion going despite the restraint in the front. Raise your hands to get the head up, and tilt your pelvis with the top toward the back of the horse, so that the bottom, your seat, is driving the rear end of the horse to tuck under him, or, as I put it, you are using your body position to drive him "up" into gait. When he understands what you want, all you will have to do is raise your hands a little and tuck your butt under you and he will know to move up in speed into gait. Your horse is laid back, as we want our Mtn Horses to be, so unlike Pasos where if you put your legs into their sides you had best be prepared to hang on tight or the horse will shoot forward out from under you, you may find yourself pounding away on his sides with your legs to get any forward motion at all in the face of the restraint you are applying to the front. One friend of mine that crosses Mtn Horse mares to her conformation champion Paso stallion said of her young Mtn Horse stallion she bought to breed to her Paso mares, that when she went to put him under saddle, she felt like she should get down and push! I laughed because I fully understood her comment after riding Pasos for 8 yrs before going into Mtn Horses in 1990. I told her to get a set of spurs for her Mtn Horse colt to get his attention and get some impulsion going. Spurs on a hot Paso schooling colt at the same point in training has a high chance of provoking an explosion and may get you dumped. Anyway, once you get him framed into the correct position in the front, and get some forward motion into the restraint, your colt will "pop" up into gait, usually the step rack, sometimes the collected intermediate walk or the glide, depends on the conformation of the horse through which the genetics wired into the neural system are expressed, but in any event, all are the evenly timed intermediate 4 beat gaits that are what you are looking for. Even if you get only a couple of steps, praise, praise, praise your horse! They get it very quickly that this is what you want, and they very quickly love it. A young strong gaited Mtn Horse will very quickly develop one speed... FASTER! Then the trick is to slow them downand extend the range of the intermediate 4 beat gait from very slow to fast. That's a whole nother subject. Check your saddle, too. I have seen horses that due to a saddle that was too large or too small, or especially with trotty horses, set too far forward, would throw the horse out of gait to either a trot or a pace. I had one colt I had sold a lady, and she kept complaining he was not gaiting, but he would gait on a lead line for me using the technique described above. So I loaned her a saddle, and that turned out to be her problem. The Circle Y Western saddle she w
Re: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
> > Forgot to send a pic of the saddle pad! Is it a bareback pad or a saddle pad?? I dont do bareback pads... Leopard goes with mink! Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] Horse "bloats" when saddled
Of course Jessica's response is the correct one, but I can't believe there is anyone out there who still thinks a horse should be "kneed in the gut". Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
On 3/8/07, Cherie Mascis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Forgot to send a pic of the saddle pad! > I love it, is it pretty thick? Kim
Re: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
>>>I got a like-new Ron Mar leopard print > saddle pad along with a Skito pad > > Does leopard go with mink? I'm sooo clueless on these things. Of course! Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] Horse "bloats" when saddled / Jessica Jahiel
>Dear Jessica, my horse Rico bloats up whenever I >put the saddle on him. I can hardly tighten the girth he bloats so much. >Then when I get on in a little while I have to get off him again to tighten >the girth again because it is all loose. I don't understand why he does >this. It doesn't get him out of being ridden and it just gets him punished >so he must not be very smart if he keeps on doing this. I am short so it >isn't easy for me to knee him in the gut like I'm supposed to get him to >let his air out, so I always have to get off him again later to tighten the >girth. I wish I didn't have to do it twice every single time I ride. Is >there some way I can get him to stop bloating? Some times I'm thinking >about something else and I don't remember about his trick and my saddle >starts to slipping sideways before I remember and get off and tighten it. I >just know one of these days the whole saddle is going to slide around >underneath him and I'll get hurt just because he pulls this trick every >ride. > >Tammy Hi Tammy! Your horse isn't actually bloating - that is, he isn't taking a deep breath and holding it. What he's doing is tensing his muscles. Horses that tense their muscles when you reach for the girth are typically horses that have learned the hard way that someone is about to make them very uncomfortable by pulling the girth hard and suddenly and trying to make it as tight as possible. It's been a long time since I heard someone say "Knee him in the gut" but there probably ARE some people who still teach this. Don't worry if it's difficult for you to do it - the truth is that you shouldn't do it at all. Your horse isn't inflating with air, and you can't let the air out of him. You can hurt him and frighten him and convince him that being ridden is a miserable experience and that he should worry whenever he sees you, but I'm sure you don't want him to feel that way. You should probably give up the idea that you can fasten your girth once when you first saddle your horse and then make no further adjustments until the ride is over. Girth-fastening should be an incremental, gradual process, not a sudden, extreme movement. Don't punish him when you reach for the girth and he tenses his muscles. He's anticipating pain, which makes perfect sense if you're always in a hurry when you saddle him. When you pull hard on the girth and try to go from "no girth" to "tight girth" in the course of one or two seconds, it's not a nice experience for your horse. He knows what you're about to do, but instead of stepping away from - or biting or kicking - the person who is about to hurt him, he's just trying to protect his own body. That's actually very nice of him. There's no reason to punish a horse for anticipating discomfort - all that will do is teach him that it's painful AND scary when you get near the girth. Since you have to get off and tighten the girth again anyway, why not make the whole process easier on your horse and yourself? When you tack up, fasten the girth slowly, gently, and loosely, then walk the horse for a few minutes, stop him, and tighten the girth a little. Walk him for another minute or two, and THEN tighten the girth to its final position and mount up. It's possible that you might need to get off in another fifteen minutes and tighten it a little more, but it's also very possible that you won't, and in any case you won't need to tighten it much. If you can teach your horse that you're going to be gentle with him and he doesn't need to brace himself whenever you touch the girth, you'll have an easier time fastening the girth - and you'll be much less likely to find your saddle slipping underneath him later during the ride. Jessica HORSE-SENSE is a subscriber-supported newsletter. If you would like to help support HORSE-SENSE, please visit the website for information. Thank you! Jessica Jahiel's HORSE-SENSE Newsletter http://www.horse-sense.org/ Copyright © 1996-2007. Jessica Jahiel, Holistic Horsemanship® Materials from Jessica Jahiel's HORSE-SENSE Newsletter may be distributed and copied for personal, non-commercial use provided that all authorship and copyright information, including this notice, is retained. Materials may not be republished in any form without express permission of the author. [EMAIL PROTECTED]| Jessica Jahiel, Ph.D. Voice: (217) 684-2570| * Author * Clinician * Consultant * http://www.jessicajahiel.com/ |Holistic Horsemanship®
RE: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
>>>If anyone's interested (Janice?), I got a like-new Ron Mar leopard print saddle pad along with a Skito pad I wanted on Ebay. I'd sell it for $35. I'm putting it on ebay this weekend. Does leopard go with mink? Im sooo clueless on these things. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
Forgot to send a pic of the saddle pad! Cherie <>
Re: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
I use a suede bareback pad with a fleece underside. I like to stick to the pad! If anyone's interested (Janice?), I got a like-new Ron Mar leopard print saddle pad along with a Skito pad I wanted on Ebay. I'd sell it for $35. I'm putting it on ebay this weekend. Cherie
RE: [IceHorses] Enjoying the weather on Scooter
>>> Just took a ride on a new trail I had never been on. It is part of the Arizona trail. Lorraine Beautiful - lucky you! Did you get the new saddle yet? Did you get the blue one? Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [IceHorses] Enjoying the weather
I went off for a ride today on the good horse Hunter - no pictures because I was all by myself in the Oregon mountains. I am so grateful to be riding this sure-footed forward-moving horse (TWH) at this season in my life. Are you in the Cascades, Nancy? I can't remember if there are other mountains in Oregon - I think so?We need some pics from you, too! Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [IceHorses] Video
>>> http://www.tolthorse.com/video.cfm?SHID=65 > > Hi, > No comment on that video. ButI want to comment on the video that > the have on their home page. I really like the video! It shows > Icelandic Horses doing what they do best...trail riding! It's a nice video, but you can see from the individual horse videos that they favor the old style of training and riding, which may not be so kind to the horse. I think in the following video, you can see how the horse is really trying to open it's nostrils to breathe. http://www.tolthorse.com/video.cfm?SHID=68 So, why do they have to tighten the noseband so much? Is it a way for them to gain control of the horse by denying him the natural ability to breathe? I just don't get it... if they were good horsemen, why would they do that? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] E-trade
> If we end up buying the Farnese Farm herd, I was intending to sell > the 8 month olds and maybe break the two year old filly to drive this > summer. Let us know how it goes! and send pictures! > Whatever money we got for the yearlings could be put to work at E- > trade; with E-trade's new bracket stops and liberal trading policy, > four of our trading buddies have been doubling their account values > every month on naked calls. E-trade??? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
> Has anyone tried the Cashel Soft Saddle or another type of bareback pad > with Icelandic horses? Here's the Cashel: http://iceryder.net/cashel.html I also have this pad which is nice: http://baretek.com/ Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Enjoying the weather on Scooter
> Just took a ride on a new trail I had never been on. > It is part of the Arizona trail. How's Scooter doing? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] Enjoying the weather
Lorraine, you ride in some gorgeous country - looks like a postcard. I went off for a ride today on the good horse Hunter - no pictures because I was all by myself in the Oregon mountains. I am so grateful to be riding this sure-footed forward-moving horse (TWH) at this season in my life. Nancy
[IceHorses] Re: in fairness to Curls
> it was purely a staged photo op! Good Lord I would have never put a > three year old on curly ray loose! The mom was standing there and had > hold of her waist. That reminds me-in the 80s, Whistle (our ferocious little racking gelding who could rack at 30 mph-hence his name) was tethered in a side field and when I walked down to check on him and move him to better grass, there was city couple, their car parked nearby, posing their 13 month old baby ON WHISTLE'S BACK. Nobody was holding the horse's head, and the parents were taking a picture!! Whistle hadn't moved-maybe he was too taken aback. Horrified, I casually eased up and took hold of Whistle's halter, quietly explaining to the now indignant parents that it wasn't SAFE to put a baby, or anyone else, on a loose horse in a field. I noticed that they kept hanging around, waiting for me to leave so they could resume their folly, but I stayed with Whistle until they drove off in a rage, gravel flying. When I finally let go of Whistle's head, he exploded in a bucking, galloping frenzy (as he was wont to do), streaking to the end of the tether, nearly knocking me flat with the rope, since I had been too distracted to keep my guard up. As I picked myself up, I realized that if I hadn't come along when I did, it could have been disastrous, and the parents probably would have sued ME, although they were trespassing on private land. Later I read that thoroughbred breeders near Lexington had experienced similar incidents from passing tourists wanting to pose their children on colts and even studs, until the owners had to put up high double electric fences to protect themselves from lawsuits. Unbelievable, but I suppose many people who haven't been around them, tend to think of horses as "big doggies." Rachel from E. KY >
[IceHorses] Re: Promotion of the Breed
Gotlands are small, primitive pony sized horses from Sweden, closely related to the Tarpan, not "gaited." Here's a link: http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/horses/gotland/index.htm Rachel from E. KY
[IceHorses] bareback pads, soft saddles
Has anyone tried the Cashel Soft Saddle or another type of bareback pad with Icelandic horses? I used an inexpensive bareback pad and breast collar with my Arabian for about a year, back in 1978, but before, and after, that I only used saddle blankets-which are harder to stabilize on steep inclines. I hate using stirrups, but I don't like to slide forward going downhill either, so probably would have to have one with a girth. At any rate, a bareback type of saddle wouldn't pinch the horse's back, provided you made certain the cinch was wide, and far enough back not to pull on the withers. Anyone had experience in this area? Rachel from E. KY.
RE: [IceHorses] UPDATE FROM ICELAND - Possible cure for eczema in Icelandic horses
>>> That would be lovely - where can we volunteer to participate in the study? The article states 20 - 30 percent of exported Icelandic come down with SE. HAHAHHA - DON'T we all wish that were true! 70-80% is a much better guestimate. Anneliese THERE'S the voice of experience speaking, at least with Icelandics on the east coast of North America. She's had her own lab study going for 25 years...domestics and imports. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [IceHorses] Was promotion, now responsibilities and costs of breeding
>>> For years I never had a single problem with any of my horses health-wise. But its like monopoly. Sometimes you get a go to jail card. This year one little horse cost me about 20,000 bucks. Amazing. Then someone gave me an ancient old stallion with rotten teeth and feet and he is like a big hole in the pasture to pour money into. That seems to be the way it goes. Thank God, though, I've never had a $20,000 tragedy. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Promotion of the Breed
On 3/8/07, kim morton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Where are you staying? I am planning on going unless something totally > unexpeted comes up. A B&B in Loudon. You're welcome to room with me, if you like. It's a nice place with a nice discount for business customers, and the business is paying for this trip! ;) Steph -- "Brutality begins where skill ends." "Correctly understood, work at the lunge line is indispensable for rider and horse from the very beginning through the highest levels." Von Niendorff
Re: [IceHorses] Alois Podhajsky on the young horse...
> expression of youthful gaiety to which the horse is entitled. On no > account should the horse be punished, but the rider must make every > effort not to be thrown off." Good book. Podhajsky on treats: http://iceryder.net/podhajsky.html Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] Re: Promotion of the Breed
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, "Stephanie Caldwell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> YOH Janice, why don't you use that plane ticket you had and > come up to Equine Affair? You can room with me, I'm staying in a 4 > Star B&B. ;) > > Steph Where are you staying? I am planning on going unless something totally unexpeted comes up. Kim
RE: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
>>> where did you get this figure? and what makes you say that the disease is so unmanageable that the horse is guaranteed misery? By talking to people who've actually owned significant numbers of both domestics and imports in a similar climate as I live in, on the east coast. >From seeing horses who suffer with SE. And by having one very reputable breeder/seller refuse to sell me a horse known to have had SE, because I live in an SE zone. From listening to people on these lists, asking for help in placing their horses in other climates, to find the horses some relief. Just ask - but ask people who don't have a vested interest in your believing one way or the other. When I first looked at buying Icelandics, I was lucky enough to find people who owned both domestics and imports for sale. When I've talked to people who only import, I've gotten another story altogether. Karen Karen Thomas
Re: [IceHorses] Alois Podhajsky on the young horse...
On Thu, Mar 08, 2007 at 04:13:55AM -, djakni1 wrote: > Alois Podhajsky on The young horse in the first phase of training... > > "The first object of training is to make the horse familiar with his > new and unaccustomed work. If this work begins under the rider he > should not forget the youthfulness and inexperience of his horse and > show leniency to his faults, overlooking playful bucking which is an > expression of youthful gaiety to which the horse is entitled. On no > account should the horse be punished, but the rider must make every > effort not to be thrown off." > > I am reading the Complete Training of Horse and Rider In the Principles > of Classical Horsemanship. I found this passage amusing and wanted to > share. I think it is the language that made me laugh. I will look for > a real quote to discuss as I progress. The book interesting so far. that is a great quote! did he write it in english, or is this translated? thanks, --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Horse Knowledge 1
On 3/8/07, Judy Ryder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Here's some questions to test our horse knowledge: > > > Q.: How much does the hoof wall grow per month? > i think that depends on diet and genetics. I have notice GB and Jaspar have a genetic thing to grow lots of hair and they also grow lots of hoof faster and also that thing called a chestnut, I have to actually cut it whereas with other horses it doesnt grow at all... also that weird toenail thing on the back of the pastern on them grows really long. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
On Thu, Mar 08, 2007 at 09:57:58AM -0600, Janice McDonald wrote: > there is an antique store going out of business near my work and > yesterday some of us went there. They have one of those neck wraps > that is actually a whole fox, with his little paws and eyeballs and > snout and everything. I want it so bad! It is seventy bucks, has > toenails and everything. I could wrap it around Tivars and Nasis > necks and put on their big star sunglasses and a harness plume, oh my > gosh it would be a hilarious photo op!! not to mention a great desensitization trick! i can just see them encountering their next fox on the trail, and thinking, "mmm, just what my wardrobe needs" if there are any foxes for cheep at this store i will pick you up one :) --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] UPDATE FROM ICELAND - Possible cure for eczema in Icelandic horses
On 3/8/07 7:41 AM, "Raven" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > "Pathologist Sigurbjörg Thorsteinsdóttir, at the Institute for > Experimental Pathology of the University of Iceland in Reykjavík, said > the vaccine is ready for experimental testing. Fréttabladid reports" > http://tinyurl.com/323763 That would be lovely - where can we volunteer to participate in the study? The article states 20 - 30 percent of exported Icelandic come down with SE. HAHAHHA - DON'T we all wish that were true! 70-80% is a much better guestimate. Anneliese
Re: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
On 3/7/07, Karen Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Does that mean I can ride in shorts or capris? :) I'm afraid *not* to take that serious. ;) I'll give you the same answer I give my mother... You can do whatever you want to do, and I'll still act like I know you. LOL Can't wait for Equine Affair, it's sad we have to travel to Ohio to finally meet up! I'm not going to get to go to Fantasia, my responsibilities won't allow it, and I might be gone for a few hours on Saturday to another conference in the area I want/need to go to. YOH Janice, why don't you use that plane ticket you had and come up to Equine Affair? You can room with me, I'm staying in a 4 Star B&B. ;) Steph -- "Brutality begins where skill ends." "Correctly understood, work at the lunge line is indispensable for rider and horse from the very beginning through the highest levels." Von Niendorff
[IceHorses] Re: Promotion of the Breed
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > or an Icelandic that had a 50+% chance of being miserable half the year > > where did you get this figure? and what makes you say that the disease > is so unmanageable that the horse is guaranteed misery? > Here is an article that gives this kind of figure for horses who have been out of Iceland for more than two years, apparently it doesn't always show up right away: "The exposure to the biting insect Culicoides spp., seems to be the main risk factor for developing SE after export. For horses that were exported for more than two years ago and living in a known habitat of the responsible insect, the prevalence of SE was as high as 54%" I have seen a horse with pretty bad SE, it is horrible, bloody lesions, the itching drives them crazy. "The characteristics and distribution of the skin lesions was described for 43 of the horses. The most common signs were itching (100%), thickening of the skin (100%), alopecia (97%), excoriation (91%), scale (89%) and wounds (71%). Secondary infections were not described. The symptoms were recorded at the mane (93%), tail (72%), abdomen (30%), head (21%), side (9%) and chest (5%)." http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1513129 I would not feel good about taking this risk, it makes them miserable. I really don't know how they are going to be reasonably comfortable without being kept in the house or without being covered in the hot weather. I'd rather just stick to my domestic horses (I'm glad they were available) and be able to let them be free outside and not have to watch them suffer. Kim
Re: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
there is an antique store going out of business near my work and yesterday some of us went there. They have one of those neck wraps that is actually a whole fox, with his little paws and eyeballs and snout and everything. I want it so bad! It is seventy bucks, has toenails and everything. I could wrap it around Tivars and Nasis necks and put on their big star sunglasses and a harness plume, oh my gosh it would be a hilarious photo op!! Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
RE: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
>>> it might interest you to know there's currently a vaccine trial going on in iceland on this issue, as well as much medication work. for me, it wasn't even a question: after i met stjarni, *he* was it, and if he develops sweet itch it'll just be something to deal with, like my own chronic illnesses of various sorts. I can't remember exactly how many times we've heard of some miracle cure/prevention for SE...and so far, none have panned out. IF this one pans out, it will be great, but it will take a while to be sure. I know people who got their hopes up several times before, only to have them dashed. Karen Karen Thomas
Re: [IceHorses] What Gait / Stella
there wasnt a strong enough vee in the legs on one side. Here's some stills taken from video of a fox trot: http://iceryder.net/foxtrot2.html Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] Horse Knowledge 1
Here's some questions to test our horse knowledge: Q.: How much does the hoof wall grow per month? Q.: What sense in the horse functions with the following components: an auricle, tympanic cavity, anvil, hammer, and stirrup? Q.: Do the front legs or hind legs have the most joints in it? Q.: Which is a more serious condition, toed-in or toed-out? Q.: What is the junction of the wall and the sole called? Q.: What term describes a horse that has a complete set of permanent incisors? Q.: What describes the point of the frog towards to the toe? Q.: The horse has how many cervical vertebrae? Q.: What is the largest tissue mass in the horse's body? Q.: What is the external part of the ear called? Q.: The first upper premolars are also called what? Q.: What part of the horse's skeleton consists of the skull, spinal column, ribs and breastbone? _ Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 09:07:09PM -0500, Karen Thomas wrote: > it's not like the information isn't there, and i don't see a whole lot > of use in replacing those who'd rather have say an arab or an appy with an > icelandic. > > That doesn't really make sense. How would someone KNOW they'd "rather have > an arab or an appy" if they haven't seen what Icelandic's really are? didn't someone on this list recently say they made a list and went to the internet? or personally, i had an instructor give me a lesson on my lease-horse at the time (an arab) and end up talking to me about icelandics. in neither case do i think "meeting one" came first. (that said, one of my own hopes for promoting the breed is seeing if stjarni makes a good parade horse -- but then i'm sure i'll take a bundle of grief here for presenting him as a "circus pony".) > >>> there's always going to be a largish supply available from iceland, at > least for the foreseeable future, because of their breeding and rearing > practices. > > I, for one, would never buy an imported Icelandic, not knowing the big risk > a horse coming into the eastern part of the USA has for summer eczema. it might interest you to know there's currently a vaccine trial going on in iceland on this issue, as well as much medication work. for me, it wasn't even a question: after i met stjarni, *he* was it, and if he develops sweet itch it'll just be something to deal with, like my own chronic illnesses of various sorts. > Frankly, I think it's rather cruel that people keep importing them, knowing > how high the chances are that the horses will suffer, when domestic-bred > horses (of all breeds) have very low risks. it's 20-30% in imported iceys, and 3-7% in horses of all breeds. this is certainly a large difference, but i don't know that it's profound. last year at our barn the sweet-itch victim was a morgan/friesian cross, not an icey (and her case was horrible, and *not* being an icey i think delayed her proper diagnosis and treatment). > or an Icelandic that had a 50+% chance of being miserable half the year where did you get this figure? and what makes you say that the disease is so unmanageable that the horse is guaranteed misery? --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 08:54:02PM -0500, Karen Thomas wrote: > *shrug* i have the only icey within spitting distance, > > Vicka, I have to ask in all seriousness, why do you keep posting on this > particular subject, especially when you keep shrugging? If it doesn't > matter to you, why do you comment? i don't shrug because i don't care. i shrug because i know my knowledge is limited, and others may have different perspectives. wrt rehabs...i do cat rehab, i volunteer for siamese rescue, and i own three rescue cats and one rehomed dog. the issues are not unfamiliar to me. i don't see myself as currently qualified to do horse rescue (although i nearly did with one poor starved icey mare; it broke my heart to have to turn away -- some of you may remember me posting her pictures to this list). > I'm glad you're happy with your horse. That's a good thing - I wish ALL > owners were happy with their Icelandics, but unfortunately, not the case. *nod* i guess partly i am trying to serve as an example of how a person *can* be happy with their icey. i'm sure stjarni's not for everyone; the "you mustn't do that"'s i've gotten here testify to that. honestly i think care in choosing a horse and preparing upfront for the upkeep is the biggest issue, but that's something i got from siamese rescue -- we insist on getting references from the adoption candidate's vet, for example. i understand that may not be within the scope of your average icey seller; it's just that we figure these cats have been through enough already, and it's just another phone call's worth of effort. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 06:00:49PM -0600, Janice McDonald wrote: > > *shrug* i have the only icey within spitting distance, and although he > > *will* run like crazy on the rare occasions i allow it, he's certainly > > not tied up to or held onto, and he doesn't wear anything more exciting > > than a french-link snaffle. perhaps in other places it is different. > But gosh Vicka, as caring horse people shouldn't we strive to make a > positive change for all icelandic horses? i say this only because we > are on an icelandic list. personally I am trying to do what I can to > make the world a better place for all horses, in my small way, working > around my belief system, ideology etc. i completely agree with that. in fact i think that focussing "good horsemanship" on a particular breed, esp. a rare one, is not the best use of our efforts in this direction. the thing i'm proudest of in terms of promoting "good horsemanship" this year is in getting one of my students to move his lease-horse from a curb bit with a cricket to a d-ring rubber snaffle, and that wouldn't have happened if i had let it slide because the horse is a quarter horse and not an icelandic. so anyway i don't think we disagree all that much :) > And I am forgiving you for the fur coat jibe. You fur coat jibe is > only serving to make me a better person. *grin* actually there's a used-clothing store near me that's having their end of winter clearance, and i intend to shop for my own fur coat there (i already own two, but they are heirlooms made by my grandmother when she was a furrier, and i can't bring myself to wear them at the barn -- i'm looking for one without the family baggage). so it was at least a friendly, admiring jibe, and i hope you can take it that way. i'm glad to hear it's making you a better person, in any case :) --vicka
[IceHorses] Today's Walk
Wish there were a picture. My husband rescued a litter of kittens from a hole in a ditch bank after he'd seen their mother dead in the road. They were a hissing spitting scratching little group, but the one we kept followed him everywhere. Bruce would go out irrigating with a shovel over one shoulder and Shorty would be walking along with him, tail straight up in the air like a beacon. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Was promotion, now responsibilities and costs of breeding
For years I never had a single problem with any of my horses health-wise. But its like monopoly. Sometimes you get a go to jail card. This year one little horse cost me about 20,000 bucks. Amazing. Then someone gave me an ancient old stallion with rotten teeth and feet and he is like a big hole in the pasture to pour money into. I spend a lot of money on silly things for my horses too! Saddles I think will be good, thats not silly, but stuff like bridles with torquoise or sparkley stuff or HARNESS PLUMES. I dont have teenage children and when I see how much they cost others I realize my horses are my teenage chidren :) When I got the old stallion a friend said "watch out you dont end up with too many" and I said "when the day comes I can't get all their feet done or buy all their shots and wormer I will have to start looking for some to go to good homes..." and I mean that. Janice
Re: [IceHorses] Promotion of the Breed
On 3/7/07, Virginia Tupper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 3/7/07, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I could ride Tivar around the arena with a hula hoop instead of reins. > > janice-- > > yipie tie yie yo > > > Have you been doing that? > V > no gosh, I wish. It is one of my training goals tho and I honestly don't think it would be much work to get him to do that since he is totally good with just a sidepull, in fact very responsive. (as long as no weeds are around to nibble!) janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Promotion of the Breed
what is a Gotland? janice -- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] Alois Podhajsky
This is one of my all-time favorite authors on training, and that quote is one of the reasons. He also dedicated one of his books to his small dogs which had brought him the most pleasure in his life and also the most acute sadness. I suppose he, too, is long dead, but I think of him when one of our dogs comes to an end of his/her days. Nancy
[IceHorses] Re: Today's Walk
This is a very short clip taken yesterday when I walked out to the pasture to get the ponies. A small plane flew very low over us and the ponies got spooked. HA! The pilot must have been trying to get a look at the ponies, that's how low she was. The dark fur ball is Dixie! ~:0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIhtvfg-Mic The video is short and grainy, it was taken with my camera and the battery was low. Raven
Re: [IceHorses] in fairness to Curls
> Anyway, I've discovered why you are so carefree Janiceit's because > you're living at the beach. I can't believe your sandy soil. > > Looks like nice country though, puts me in the holiday mood. Thank you Wanda for making me feel good! I am feeling guilty I have no grass to speak of even tho all my horses are on the edge of too fat! I am taking Gallant Boy to eat grass Friday tho! Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] UPDATE FROM ICELAND - Possible cure for eczema in Icelandic horses
"Pathologist Sigurbjörg Thorsteinsdóttir, at the Institute for Experimental Pathology of the University of Iceland in Reykjavík, said the vaccine is ready for experimental testing. Fréttabladid reports" http://tinyurl.com/323763 Raven Lucy & Molly, the Girl Doggies Huginn, the American Ice Pony Dixie Chic, the Barn Goddess
Re: [IceHorses] Today's Walk
>We must be a silly sighta dog, a pony, a woman and >a kitty following >us. ~:] That brings back memories! Our cat Marilyn used to hike with my husband, my filly, my dog and me, but now she's pretty sedentary (we call her Buddha Belly)! Cherie
RE: [IceHorses] What Gait / Stella
>>> That's what I meant by 'trotty' I know - just kidding. However, I used to notice people on the gaitedhorse list thinking that certain similar pictures were "trot" - not a foxtrot and not a soft gait. I would only shake my head and think, gee, you should see a REAL trot more often if you think that's a trot! I think we do get spoiled sometimes :) Karen Thomas, NC -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.7/711 - Release Date: 3/5/2007 9:41 AM
[IceHorses] Was promotion, now responsibilities and costs of breeding
>>> Even my two 16 hh Tennesse Walkers and llama only eat one bale and two quarts of grain among them a day and cost $1200 last year. I've had a few years where individual horses cost me only about $600 each too. That doesn't mean that's what it costs over the period of their lives though. It doesn't count anything for all the initial fence installation. It doesn't count anything for fence repairs, tractor upkeep, and fertilizer for the field where we cut hay. It doesn't count anything towards paying back the cost of the land. It doesn't count anything towards paying off the initial cost of the horses. It doesn't count anything for my time spent at seminars, on foal-watch, doing farm chores or for my time training the horses. It doesn't pay me back for owning my stallion for two full years before I decided to breed him - to be absolutely sure that he was a good breeding prospect. Yep, maybe I'm a worrywart, but I bought him, and then kept him for two years to be certain I was only breeding quality animals. I can't imagine making foals with weak conformation or faulty gaits, ones that no one would want. I realize that I'm creating little lives that may live on past me. I want to give them every advantage I can. In 2004, one of our horses had a spider bite that cost us $3000 to treat. We've had a couple of Cushing's related laminitis cases that cost us well over $1000 each to treat - two in one year one time. I had a mare with a vague lameness that cost me over $2500 just in her medical costs to diagnose, (I never bothered to go to the ER for MY incurred "lameness" costs due to her problem) about two years of her lost riding time, and an unknown amount in retraining - but she came back and is a sound and healthy riding horse again. We're lucky though, I guess. We've never had a $10,000 colic surgery. I've never lost a horse to colic, and only one horse has died here - at age 24. We've had no cancer in our herd. We vaccinate, so we've had no WNV nor EEE nor rabies. I went with my good friend when she took her beloved nine-year-old gelding to the vet school last fall for a never-diagnosed ailment that caused him to have some neurological symptoms. I think her bill, just for tests, no surgeries, was about $5000-6000...and because she realized how helpless she was because she didn't have her own trailer, the real expense came next: the horse trailer. Luckily she'd just bought a truck that could pull a trailer. So, add in truck and trailer to the necessary expenses to account for... My friend was also lucky. Her gelding recovered with no visible lasting effects. I HAVE dropped some noticeable money into the care of a few rehab and rescue horses. I guess I don't have to count the cost of these into my breeding costs, but I'm a big believer in the old adage, "If you don't rescue, don't breed." I feel a moral obligation to work with some of the already-living creatures with issues, to morally compensate for the new lives I'm bringing into the world. I HOPE if any of my foals ever develop problems for whatever reason and I can't take care of them, I hope there will be someone out there to return the favor for the time I'm spending with the rehabs now. I HOPE so. I believe in finishing a job that I start, figuratively at least, if not literally. My horses that are in their golden years will finish out there lives here. I won't sell them on because I'm "finished" with them. In my mind, they've earned their retirement and they are still my responsibility. I have to count their expenses too, because it's all part of the cycle of breeding...births and deaths... I had four normal deliveries here last spring. All the foals were healthy. However, the blood test the day Landi was born showed that he didn't get his colostrums, so he had to have a plasma transfusion. Counting the extra farm calls and tests that alone cost me about $800 I think - plus a lot of lost sleep and worry. If we hadn't tested him, he most assuredly would have gotten very sick and probably died - and would have cost me still more money, plus agony for the foal and distress for the mare. He is fine now though - no problems, big, strong and healthy. That doesn't include the prenatal care I paid for his mom. It doesn't count the extra shots for her, or the ultrasound to prove when she was due...and to be sure she wasn't carrying twins. All of that has to be done (by my standards) for ALL my broodmares. And of course, pregnant mares can't eat the fescue that is prevalent here, so I have to continue feeding them non-fescue hay, with some vitamin supplements. And of course, that doesn't count a penny for his shots, his wormings, our time in teaching him about halters and leads, the farrier work or for training him to stand for the farrier. Since I own the stallion, I didn't have to pay for a breeding fee - but to be honest in my accounting, I have to figure in how much I paid for him initially, and how much it co
Re: [IceHorses] What Gait / Stella
> I thought so too :) there wasnt a strong enough vee in the legs on one side. > Janice-- > yipie tie yie yo But it was more diagonal than the soft gaits so that's a sure sign that you're looking at a fox trot. That's what I meant by 'trotty' Wanda
