from:"dE"


On 03/31/12 14:46, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:

On 31/03/12 11:51, Duncan wrote:

[...]
The kde colorscheme settings have an option to use them for non-kde apps
as well, and with it checked gtk apps fit in well /enough/ for me.  I'd
prefer to have actually workable qt-based or kde apps instead, but for
the above, the gtk-based options are clearly better, so that's what I'm
using.


In case you missed it, you should install the Gtk port of Oxygen: 
x11-themes/oxygen-gtk (and x11-themes/oxygen-gtk3 in case you need Gtk 
3 later.)  This isn't a "fake" theme btw.  It's a real Gtk engine and 
pretty much the official Gtk port of KDE's Oxygen style.


Then, to enable Oxygen for Gtk 3 apps, create the file 
~/.config/gtk-3.0/settings.ini and put this in it:


  [Settings]
  gtk-theme-name = oxygen-gtk

For Gtk 2 apps, use this as your ~/.gtkrc-2.0:

  include "/usr/share/themes/oxygen-gtk/gtk-2.0/gtkrc"
  include "/etc/gtk-2.0/gtkrc"
  gtk-theme-name="oxygen-gtk"
  gtk-icon-theme-name="oxygen"
  gtk-fallback-icon-theme="oxygen"

Now Gtk applications will use Oxygen style widgets.

For Firefox, I recommend this:

  http://kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=117962

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Where's the gtk3 theme? -

eix x11-themes/oxygen
* x11-themes/oxygen-gtk
 Available versions:
(3) 1.0.1 ~1.0.2
(2) 1.2.1 ~1.2.2
{debug doc}
 Homepage:
https://projects.kde.org/projects/playground/artwork/oxygen-gtk

 Description: Official GTK+:2 port of KDE's Oxygen widget style


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Re: [kde] Clear KDE


On 03/31/12 15:37, Duncan wrote:

Nikos Chantziaras posted on Sat, 31 Mar 2012 12:16:06 +0300 as excerpted:


In case you missed it, you should install the Gtk port of Oxygen:
x11-themes/oxygen-gtk (and x11-themes/oxygen-gtk3 in case you need Gtk 3
later.)  This isn't a "fake" theme btw.  It's a real Gtk engine and
pretty much the official Gtk port of KDE's Oxygen style.

Thanks!  I had seen the package mentioned, but FWIW I wasn't clear on
what oxygen bits it ported, etc.  Your clarification that it's oxygen
widgets helps quite a bit there.  (I run oxygen widget-styles but not
window trim or plasma-themes, so being unclear about what it did, plus
the below, I just figured it wasn't worth trying.)

Also, IIRC there were issues with it and for example qt-4.8, according to
the gentoo/qt and/or gentoo/kde project meeting reports, which I follow
when they're posted to the gentoo/desktop list.  IIRC they triggered
segfaults in gtk-based apps for a bit, so I've been a bit cautious about
trying it.  But I think that's fixed now and hopefully there won't be
similar issues in the future, so I might try it.



I also suggest x11-themes/gtk-engines-qtpixmap, so the gtk apps 'adopt' 
the QT app's styling.

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Re: [kde] Tell who did you PAY to include Akonadi?


On 04/01/12 01:03, Serginho wrote:

Thanks for all the answers.

(And the question was -- who _paid_ them to destroy KDE. :) )

--
Serginho
 From Russia with love

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semantic_desktop#Standardization_Effort
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Re: [kde] Tell who did you PAY to include Akonadi?


On 03/31/12 14:28, Kevin Krammer wrote:

On Saturday, 2012-03-31, randomm...@mac.hush.com wrote:

There is Linus Torwalds. And there is me. I was born at the same
holiday as him.
And I will be talking as he.

Who did you PAY to include AKONADI?

I can't speak for the other users on this list, but I for myself did not pay
for it since I am using a gratis distribution (Debian).

Who did you pay for it?

Cheers,
Kevin




Actually, as you know, Akonadi is a good idea, it should remain 
transparent to the user as NetworkManager does.


The problem comes when it encounters it's bugs -- the HUGS number of 
bugs that KDE has which makes it's deployment in enterprise environments 
imposable.


Honestly, KDE is a headache for admins, bugs here, bugs there, and 
there're new bugs with every release and everyone's talking about it.


I think some of it's apps should be suspended form development... like 
'kscd' and 'kmail' etc they never worked, and I don't think they 
ever will. In the mean time serious bugs like the buggy taskbar, 
kdesu/sudo integration and puseaudio input configuration is still broken.


My personal opinion is, for the size of the KDE project, it's surely 
missing sponsors.
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Re: [kde] Clear KDE

2012-04-01 Thread dE .


On 04/01/12 13:32, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:

On 31/03/12 23:51, dE . wrote:

On 03/31/12 14:46, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:

In case you missed it, you should install the Gtk port of Oxygen:
x11-themes/oxygen-gtk (and x11-themes/oxygen-gtk3 in case you need Gtk
3 later.) This isn't a "fake" theme btw. It's a real Gtk engine and
pretty much the official Gtk port of KDE's Oxygen style.


Where's the gtk3 theme? -


Oops, it's in the "kde" overlay.  I didn't notice that it's not in 
portage.


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Humm... thanks, I really needed it.
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[kde] KDE release cycles?

2012-04-01 Thread dE .

Is there any definitive release cycle? Like Debian has 
stable/unstable/testing etc... branches and has general rules and 
regulation on what has to be done at what time, regardless of the 
current release?


Or is it that the rules and regulations change as per the release?
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Re: [kde] KDE release cycles?

2012-04-04 Thread dE .


On 04/02/12 17:13, Kevin Krammer wrote:

On Monday, 2012-04-02, John Woodhouse wrote:

What would be of more interest to many is pure bug fix releases rather
than new features. I for instance am running


Platform Version 4.6.00 (4.6.0) "release 6"

That's the first release of the 4.6 series, which itself is one of the minor
releases so it was allowed to have new features.

Of course new features being allowes doesn't mean some were added or added in
the sense of new functionality [1].

For example IIRC the current release series (4.8.x) is a "no features added"
cycle for KDE Platform but I think KDE Workspaces got some.

This, btw, also shows one of the problems of addressing the summary of all KDE
products with a single name (currently "KDE SC"), since different products
might have had different focus for a certain period.

Cheers,
Kevin

[1] at the developer level things like restructuring are also counted as
features, i.e. usually not allowed in update/patch releases. So it is actually
more about how much can be changed and where (application code vs. library
code).
Sometimes user level features are a for-free consequence of a change like
that, e.g. a change in image loading library because the current one resulted
in too many bugs, can result in more formats being supported without that
being the reason for the change.



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So 'feature release' may mean (apart form including absolutely new 
features) -


1) Restructuring the code (better management).
2) New backend or changed backend which may increase or decrease bugs.

And bug fixes mean fixing small time bugs in library or directly in the app.
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Re: [kde] KDE release cycles?

2012-04-07 Thread dE .


On 04/05/12 13:57, Kevin Krammer wrote:

On Thursday, 2012-04-05, Duncan wrote:

dE . posted on Thu, 05 Apr 2012 07:23:16 +0530 as excerpted:

So 'feature release' may mean (apart form including absolutely new
features) -

1) Restructuring the code (better management).
2) New backend or changed backend which may increase or decrease bugs.

And bug fixes mean fixing small time bugs in library or directly in the
app.

I'll let Kevin respond to that (tho it seems a reasonable summary to this
non-dev, here),

I agree. My guess is that the term "feature release" is used to indicate that
this is not just the same thing again.

 From a developer's perspective it just means that restrictions on what you can
do are less tight. There are still things that are not allowed, e.g. changing
libraries in a way that makes them incompatible with applications, but on the
application level you can do almost anything you want.


but there is certainly one practical limitation of the
bugfix releases as opposed to feature releases:

* Strings are generally frozen during a six-month bugfix series.  This is
to help the various l10n (localization, basically, translation) efforts,
but it DOES mean a tradeoff in terms of fixing things "properly"
sometimes, if that would mean a UI and string change, even if the actual
code fix is reasonably small and "safe" and would otherwise be allowed.

Yes, very good observation. Sometimes an essential bug fix needs a string
change, in which case the translators usually grant an exception [1].


This is actually one reason the distros tend to ship later bugfix
releases instead of newer feature releases

One additional thing might be that distributions themselves use a very similar
development and release model so they have a better understanding what each
step along the way carries with it.

Early bug fix releases of a feature release are basically more like the public
beta of proprietary software, i.e. the beta releases of Free Software products
(and of distributions which do such things) are more like the interal or
private beta.


'Early bug fix' release? I thought that bug fix releases were the minor 
versions like 4.8.1, or 4.8.2 etc...

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Re: [kde] Simple Question KDE

2012-04-07 Thread dE .


On 04/06/12 06:37, Asbenson, Lyndell L wrote:

Why does kde use NFS locking? Thanks Lyndell


Managing file lock is the job of the protocol; it's handled by the 
kernel modules.

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Re: [kde] The proper way to copy all datas and settings from one computer to another?

2012-04-11 Thread dE .


On 04/10/12 12:41, Maxime Haselbauer wrote:

Hi all,

What is the right way to copy all datas and settings from one computer to 
another?
i.e
I have two computer one called netbook and another one called inspiron both 32 
bit Kubuntu 11.10 Kde 4.8.x

I wanted to transfer everything from netbook to inspiron, also I used an 
external Hardrive where I store everything from ~/ of netbook (inclusvie hidden 
files)
and then I copy it from the hard drive to inspiron back

But apparently it is not troubleless

e.g In kmail. when I want to displace a file to the wastebin he tells me "the 
message 48213742r2.R449.netbook:2,S can not been diplaced". Or something like that 
(I am using the German version)

I just suspect there is a problem because the right name of the computer is 
inspiron and not netbook anymore
It is also troublesome with
 importing activities,
 akonadi ressources that are not automatically re-created etc..
 and a lot more 


Also I guess it is not the proper way to do when one want to copy all its datas 
AND applications settings together on a new computer?



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Copy all your ~/.* to your you new home folder in your new PC; this'll 
make the setting identical. In the new PC the KDE version and other 
software versions should be the same or higher.

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Re: [kde] recording voice in kde4

2012-04-13 Thread dE .


On 04/15/12 02:01, sibu xolo wrote:

Greetings

Does any one on list know if sound recording
eg from a microphone is now possible in kde4 and if so what is the name and
whereabouts of the sound recording program.


thanks in advance
sibu xolo
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No dedicated KDE 4 app for that purpose, use likes of audacity, 
recordmydesktop, arecord etc... etc... etc..

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Re: [kde] wtf fucked up power devil

2012-05-26 Thread dE .


On 05/25/12 00:57, Sérgio Basto wrote:

Wtf power devil has no more profiles,
why some many regressions on one thing that was working so well
, now have a stupid check box ,
Power management enable , wtf that means ? what means disable power
management ? is disable this tramp ?  .

Cpu freq , not enter in screen saver (on presentations ) why this
functions was removed ?

I may want power save on AC Power or not want power saver on battery
but is not a choice , who is the brain that think we are all stupids .


Power management enable is the same of "power saved enabled" ?



What version of KDE and in which distro?
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Re: [kde] wtf fucked up power devil

2012-05-26 Thread dE .


On 05/25/12 11:44, Kevin Krammer wrote:

On Friday, 2012-05-25, Duncan wrote:


I've read that the lower level tools themselves changed.  Apparently,
some of the knobs power devil was using weren't designed to to be
individually tweaked, and they either disappeared entirely or there were
bugs related to their use that were closed WONTFIX as they weren't
supposed to be directly tweaked in the first place.

So power devil didn't have much of a choice.  They could either do the
complicated thing and provide a GUI that allowed setting most of what
laptop-mode-tools does, but that was several times more complex than what
they were doing, or go the simple, dumbed-down route.  For now, they went
the dumbed-down route.  It's possible they'll eventually expose the
complex config to those that want it, but that's a lot of code to write
and test, so dumbed-down is what they'd be exposing temporarily, until
the complex code could be written and tested, in any case.

As far as I understand the setup, the UI and the actual power managment code
are separate entities, so if the management code does allow for more fine
grained control somebody could write an alternative UI for it which exposes
those controls.

One could check with the author of the new UI whether it would be possible to
upload the old UI to kde-apps or something.

Cheers,
Kevin



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I just noticed this recently, and this's a complete turn off! There 
should've been profiles!!
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Re: [kde] How to setup dual monitor in kde?

2012-05-26 Thread dE .


On 05/25/12 01:05, Marcelo Magno T. Sales wrote:

2012/5/24 Stef Bon:

On 05/24/2012 07:22 PM, Nowardev-Team wrote:

NB THE bash script must be executable  to do that just do

chmod +x your_name_bashscript_for_xrandr

*to see your aviable options you can just type on konsole


xrandr
*


No,

it's just possible using the display settings in the settings. Select
Display and Monitor, select
Multiple Monitors, and there you are.

It works very good.

Stef

It works, but after a reboot KDE forgets what had been configured and
goes back to clone mode again.
Even if you "Save as default" in System Settings, the configuration is
lost after a reboot.
Is there a way to make it stick?

Thanks,

Marcelo
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This's not reproducible in my case, which version of KDE are you running?
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Re: [kde] Screen saver not working

2012-05-27 Thread dE .

You should check the running services in systemsettings.

-
Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
On May 27, 2012 8:58 PM, "P .NIKOLIC"  wrote:

> Hi ..
>
> I can not get the screen saver to work   automatically
>
> I am running  KDE 4.8.3 (4.8.3) Arch Linux x86_64  kernel 3.3.7
>
> It had been working until the update to 4.8.3   i can set it up test
> it all ok but will not start automatically .  I have most of the power
> control stuff turned off as it is a desktop machine  that runs 24/7  i
> also have dmps set to off  as i have for the last gawd knows how many
> years never have used dmps .
>
> Pete ..
>
>
>
> --
> Linux 7-of-9 3.3.7-1-ARCH #1 SMP PREEMPT Tue May 22 00:26:26 CEST 2012
> x86_64 GNU/Linux
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Re: [kde] wtf fucked up power devil

2012-05-27 Thread dE .

On second though it's a good thing. It simplifies things.

-
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On May 27, 2012 4:19 PM, "Martin Bednar"  wrote:

> Le samedi 26 mai 2012 18:51:23 dE . a écrit :
> >
> > I just noticed this recently, and this's a complete turn off! There
> > should've been profiles!!
>
> There still are sort of profiles, only that now they're linked to
> activities[1]. Meaning depending on your current activity, you can have
> different suspend timeout values. As for cpufreq and other configuration,
> as
> mentioned previously, laptop-mode-tools does it pretty well, I suggest you
> configure it there. IMHO this is the "correct" solution : advanced users
> who
> know what cpufreq is have one place to configure it, those who don't should
> probably not touch those settings and use the distro-provided defaults.
>
> As for the presentation mode, now the app presenting should inhibit it
> itself
> (I think okular does). And this is exactly what the "enable
> powermanagement"
> checkbox does : disable powermanagement features.[2]
>
> Martin
>
> [1]
> http://drfav.wordpress.com/2011/10/02/forge-sprint-2011-power-management-
> and-its-future/
> [2]
> http://drfav.wordpress.com/2012/02/22/fixing-lid-close-suspension-in-4-8-1/
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Re: [kde] How to setup dual monitor in kde?

2012-05-27 Thread dE .

That's what KDE is all about. With each release there're more regressions
than fixes in an attempt to add new 'features'.

You should try XFCE for the ultimate stable experience.

A workaround is to use KDE is Debian stable, that way you can ensure
there're no regressions atleast.

-
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On May 27, 2012 5:02 AM, "Marcelo Magno T. Sales" 
wrote:

> **
>
> Em sábado, 26 de maio de 2012, às 19:01:40, dE . escreveu:
>
> > On 05/25/12 01:05, Marcelo Magno T. Sales wrote:
>
> > > 2012/5/24 Stef Bon:
>
> > >> On 05/24/2012 07:22 PM, Nowardev-Team wrote:
>
> > >>> NB THE bash script must be executable to do that just do
>
> > >>>
>
> > >>> chmod +x your_name_bashscript_for_xrandr
>
> > >>>
>
> > >>> *to see your aviable options you can just type on konsole
>
> > >>>
>
> > >>>
>
> > >>> xrandr
>
> > >>> *
>
> > >>
>
> > >> No,
>
> > >>
>
> > >> it's just possible using the display settings in the settings. Select
>
> > >> Display and Monitor, select
>
> > >> Multiple Monitors, and there you are.
>
> > >>
>
> > >> It works very good.
>
> > >>
>
> > >> Stef
>
> > >
>
> > > It works, but after a reboot KDE forgets what had been configured and
>
> > > goes back to clone mode again.
>
> > > Even if you "Save as default" in System Settings, the configuration is
>
> > > lost after a reboot.
>
> > > Is there a way to make it stick?
>
> > >
>
> > > Thanks,
>
> > >
>
> > > Marcelo
>
> > > ___
>
> > > This message is from the kde mailing list.
>
> > > Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde.
>
> > > Archives: http://lists.kde.org/.
>
> > > More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
>
> >
>
> > This's not reproducible in my case, which version of KDE are you running?
>
> > ___
>
>
>
> Hello,
>
>
>
> I'm running 4.8.2, Ubuntu packages. However, since yesterday, the
> configuration saved as default in System Settings began to stick. Now I can
> logout and login again and the monitors configuration stays as I had left
> it.
>
> I didn't do anything different, there were no updates... Don't know why it
> works now (not complaining, not complaining at all! :) )
>
> However, right after this began to work, this other problem showed up:
>
> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=300642
>
>
>
> It seems I can never have KDE working 100%. Every time I fix a problem,
> another one shows up. Even so, KDE is still better than the available
> alternatives. At least KDE ends up doing what I want after some hard work.
> But Gnome and Unity don't, no matter how hard I try :)
>
>
>
> []'s
>
> Marcelo
>
>
>
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Re: [kde] Screen saver not working

2012-05-29 Thread dE .


On 05/28/12 12:13, P .NIKOLIC wrote:

On Mon, 28 May 2012 11:43:44 +0530
"dE ."  wrote:


You should check the running services in systemsettings.



All running except power management that i do not need  and has been
disabled for ever  but the screensaver has always worked perfectly ..

Pete .



Maybe you should turn it on and try. Maybe things changed recently.
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Re: [kde] wtf fucked up power devil

2012-05-29 Thread dE .

Have mercy on phone users.

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On May 29, 2012 3:08 AM, "Sérgio Basto"  wrote:

> On Seg, 2012-05-28 at 11:47 +0530, dE . wrote:
> >
> > On second though it's a good thing. It simplifies things.
> >
>
> your top posting doesn't help much
>
>
> > -
> > Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
> >
> > On May 27, 2012 4:19 PM, "Martin Bednar"  wrote:
> > Le samedi 26 mai 2012 18:51:23 dE . a écrit :
> > >
> > > I just noticed this recently, and this's a complete turn
> > off! There
> > > should've been profiles!!
> >
> > There still are sort of profiles, only that now they're linked
> > to
> > activities[1]. Meaning depending on your current activity, you
> > can have
> > different suspend timeout values. As for cpufreq and other
> > configuration, as
> > mentioned previously, laptop-mode-tools does it pretty well, I
> > suggest you
> > configure it there. IMHO this is the "correct" solution :
> > advanced users who
> > know what cpufreq is have one place to configure it, those who
> > don't should
> > probably not touch those settings and use the distro-provided
> > defaults.
> >
> > As for the presentation mode, now the app presenting should
> > inhibit it itself
> > (I think okular does). And this is exactly what the "enable
> > powermanagement"
> > checkbox does : disable powermanagement features.[2]
> >
> > Martin
> >
> > [1]
> >
> http://drfav.wordpress.com/2011/10/02/forge-sprint-2011-power-management-
> > and-its-future/
> > [2]
> >
> http://drfav.wordpress.com/2012/02/22/fixing-lid-close-suspension-in-4-8-1/
>
>
> First what is an activity ?  where is documented how activity works ?
>
> "The activity service is running with bare functionalities.
> Names and icons of the activities might not be available."
> wtf this means ?
>
> I have 11 tabs , 4 called desktop , 5 called unnamed and 2 called new
> acitivty .
>
> Before turn off profile , we may setting "power save" or not , enable
> and disable display after certain time or not etc .
>
> How do you do a profile for presentations, not disable screeen , even on
> battery ?
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> --
> Sérgio M. B.
>
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Re: [kde] How to setup dual monitor in kde?

2012-05-29 Thread dE .

If you want a lot of graphical features then XFCE is no option.

And no XFCE has a LOT of less bugs, its a lot more stable even than Gnome
2.

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On May 28, 2012 2:33 PM, "Nowardev-Team"  wrote:

>
>
> 2012/5/28 dE . 
>
>> That's what KDE is all about. With each release there're more regressions
>> than fixes in an attempt to add new 'features'.
>>
>> You should try XFCE for the ultimate stable experience.
>>
> i think xfce is an old lame DE that lacks of a LOTS of features and i ma
> sure that xfce has bugs too. on my eyes has a larger number of bugs because
> it lacks of the most of stuff i use in kde.
>
> i think that saying to try another desktop instead to fix the problem is a
> stupid way to see the situation.
>
>> A workaround is to use KDE is Debian stable, that way you can ensure
>> there're no regressions atleast.
>>
>> -
>> Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
>> On May 27, 2012 5:02 AM, "Marcelo Magno T. Sales" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> Em sábado, 26 de maio de 2012, às 19:01:40, dE . escreveu:
>>>
>>> > On 05/25/12 01:05, Marcelo Magno T. Sales wrote:
>>>
>>> > > 2012/5/24 Stef Bon:
>>>
>>> > >> On 05/24/2012 07:22 PM, Nowardev-Team wrote:
>>>
>>> > >>> NB THE bash script must be executable to do that just do
>>>
>>> > >>>
>>>
>>> > >>> chmod +x your_name_bashscript_for_xrandr
>>>
>>> > >>>
>>>
>>> > >>> *to see your aviable options you can just type on konsole
>>>
>>> > >>>
>>>
>>> > >>>
>>>
>>> > >>> xrandr
>>>
>>> > >>> *
>>>
>>> > >>
>>>
>>> > >> No,
>>>
>>> > >>
>>>
>>> > >> it's just possible using the display settings in the settings.
>>> Select
>>>
>>> > >> Display and Monitor, select
>>>
>>> > >> Multiple Monitors, and there you are.
>>>
>>> > >>
>>>
>>> > >> It works very good.
>>>
>>> > >>
>>>
>>> > >> Stef
>>>
>>> > >
>>>
>>> > > It works, but after a reboot KDE forgets what had been configured and
>>>
>>> > > goes back to clone mode again.
>>>
>>> > > Even if you "Save as default" in System Settings, the configuration
>>> is
>>>
>>> > > lost after a reboot.
>>>
>>> > > Is there a way to make it stick?
>>>
>>> > >
>>>
>>> > > Thanks,
>>>
>>> > >
>>>
>>> > > Marcelo
>>>
>>> > > ___
>>>
>>> > > This message is from the kde mailing list.
>>>
>>> > > Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde.
>>>
>>> > > Archives: http://lists.kde.org/.
>>>
>>> > > More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
>>>
>>> >
>>>
>>> > This's not reproducible in my case, which version of KDE are you
>>> running?
>>>
>>> > ___
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm running 4.8.2, Ubuntu packages. However, since yesterday, the
>>> configuration saved as default in System Settings began to stick. Now I can
>>> logout and login again and the monitors configuration stays as I had left
>>> it.
>>>
>>> I didn't do anything different, there were no updates... Don't know why
>>> it works now (not complaining, not complaining at all! :) )
>>>
>>> However, right after this began to work, this other problem showed up:
>>>
>>> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=300642
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It seems I can never have KDE working 100%. Every time I fix a problem,
>>> another one shows up. Even so, KDE is still better than the available
>>> alternatives. At least KDE ends up doing what I want after some hard work.
>>> But Gnome and Unity don't, no matter how hard I try :)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> []'s
>>>
>>> Marcelo
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
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>>
>
>
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Re: [kde] wtf fucked up power devil

2012-05-30 Thread dE .


On 05/29/12 20:27, Anne Wilson wrote:

On 29/05/12 15:28, dE . wrote:

Have mercy on phone users.


Have mercy on those who try to help you.

Anne





Who's helping me here?
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Re: [kde] How to setup dual monitor in kde?

2012-06-02 Thread dE .

I recently did this too, lets see what happens.

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On Jun 1, 2012 6:13 AM, "James"  wrote:

> On 05/28/12 22:50, Duncan wrote:
> > James posted on Mon, 28 May 2012 20:40:22 -0400 as excerpted:
> >
> > James posted on Mon, 28 May 2012 20:40:22 -0400 as excerpted:
> >
> >> On 05/28/12 19:34, Duncan wrote:
> >>> bjlockie posted on Mon, 28 May 2012 13:39:53 -0400 as excerpted:
> >>>
>  Duncan posted...
> 
> > Turning off semantic-desktop at build-time, no nepomuk, no akonadi
> > (which means no kdepim, I switched mail/contacts and feeds to
> > claws-mail, always used pan for news, and never used the rest of the
> > kdepim stuff), no rasqal or redland, no virtuoso, no mysql, strigi
> > still installed as parts of kde need its headers to build, but
> > without a backend so it's emasculated... turning all that off at
> > build-time and building without it... was the missing magic.  Without
> > it, I can now say kde4's better than kde3!  It's ironic, tho, because
> > all that semantic-desktop stuff was major bullet- point-features of
> > kde4, so to have to build kde4 without it in ordered to finally get a
> > kde4 that not only matches but surpasses kde3 for me, ironic indeed!
> > =:^)
> 
>  Are there instructions for doing that?
> >>>
> >>> On gentoo?  It's just standard gentoo USE flags, in general.  The two
> >>> catches for gentooers are that (1) the semantic-desktop USE flag is an
> >>> "=" dependency, meaning that to turn it off anywhere in kde you must
> >>> turn it off for everything (that's actually somewhat stricter than the
> >>> upstream kde requirements, AFAIK, where if you have it on in say
> >>> dolphin you have to have it on in kdelibs, but to have it on in kdelibs
> >>> doesn't require it in dolphin), and that (2) because pretty much all of
> >>> kdepim requires kdepim-common-libs, kdepim-common-libs in turn requires
> >>> akonadi (akonadi-server on gentoo), and akonadi in turn requires
> >>> USE=semantic- desktop, in ordered to turn semantic-desktop off on
> >>> gentoo you pretty much cannot have anything kdepim (including kmail,
> >>> akregator, kaddressbook, knode, korganizer, etc) installed -- you gotta
> >>> use something else for them.
> >>>
> >>> Then once you turn off USE=semantic-desktop, an emerge --depclean peels
> >>> away a lot of dependencies, and once those are peeled away, other
> >>> formerly required USE flags (like rasqual) can be turned off, which in
> >>> turn allows emerge --depclean to clean out even more formerly required
> >>> packages.
> >>>
> >>> Building from source manually or using non-gentoo scripts? [snip]
> >>>
> >>>
> >> If I remove sematic-desktop from /etc/make.conf, will anything put it
> >> back?
> >
> > OK, so gentoo (or perhaps funtoo or...) then.  Good.  That's easier.
> >
> > FWIW, here what I did is set -semantic-desktop, not simply remove it.
> That
> > way if anything has it set as a package-default-use, the specific
> negative
> > use flag overrides, where simply having it not set won't.
> >
> > With the other, related flags (which generally decide which backends get
> > built, without semantic-desktop the backends aren't needed either):
> >
> > -semantic-desktop -raptor -redland -virtuoso
> >
> > Also -clucene and -hyperestraier, but depending on what else you have
> > installed (especially web-app packages), you may need to keep these on,
> or
> > set the use in make.conf one way and setup package.use for whatever
> > packages you might want the other.
> >
> >
> > Meanwhile, FWIW, I don't have all kde installed.  What I do is take the
> > sets from the kde overlay (I have the portage 2.2 series unmasked here,
> > for full sets support), copy them to /etc/portage/sets and rename them
> > with my initials so I can tell mine from the default overlay sets, then I
> > edit them.  All library lines get commented (see below for why I don't
> > simply delete them) as they'll be pulled in by apps that need them.  Apps
> > lines I don't want/need or that I /know/ are deps of something else
> listed
> > also get commented.
> >
> > Every six-month feature upgrade, so from 4.7 to 4.8, for instance, kde
> > upstream changes some of the names, so gentoo does as well.  Sometimes
> > individual packages will switch sets (so from say kde-utils to kde-
> > graphics or something) too.  Before I do that upgrade, I diff the new set
> > against my initialed set, so I can see what packages got added/deleted,
> > look up what a new package does if necessary, then add that line,
> > commented or uncommented, to my edited set, as well.  By keeping the
> > commented package lines in the set, it keeps the lines lined up between
> my
> > edited copy and the sets from the overlay, so it's easier to see what
> > changed.
> >
> > If you don't have the overlay installed or haven't unmasked portage 2.2
> so
> > don't yet have full sets s

Re: [kde] KTorrent Manual


On 07/11/12 00:54, Burkhard Lück wrote:

Am Dienstag, 10. Juli 2012, 21:20:46 schrieb Sian Mountbatten:

This, apparently, is some kind of joke, because the manual consists of a
list of features, and that's all.
Does that mean that no manual has been written?

Yes.




Do we need one?
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Re: [kde] Screen Lock Error


On 07/11/12 12:34, Zaki Akhmad wrote:

On Wed, Jul 11, 2012 at 1:27 PM, Duncan<1i5t5.dun...@cox.net>  wrote:

Zaki Akhmad posted on Wed, 11 Jul 2012 11:04:24 +0700 as excerpted:


Hello,

I am facing this screen lock error[1] at KDE. The password textbox
suddenly full of password character and I can't erased it (maybe since
it's very long). Trigger of this error is when I do screen lock my KDE
but the error shows randomly.

[1]http://flic.kr/p/cqKs8m

Hope somebody could give me hint. Thanks!

I don't use the screen-locker here (don't have kdm installed, which
provides it), so can't be too specific about that, but in general...

If it's because it's long, try clicking in the input box to give it
focus, then using whatever you have configured for select-all (often ctrl-
a to match MS), then hitting delete (or simply start typing the real
password).  That should do it.

Alternatively, the whole thing /might/ get focus if you simply tab the
focus to the box (clicking in it may or may not do the same thing), after
which you can simply hit delete or even simply start typing the real
password.


I don't know what might be filling it in, and don't know /for/ /sure/
that the above will let you erase the whole long garbage, but it's what
I'd try, given normal GUI input box behavior.

Hi Duncan, thanks for the response

Once, I press Esc button, then the very-long password text is erased.
But when this problem happened again, the Esc button didn't work.

How to see debug error message from this event?

So, my solution from this problem up till now is switch to terminal mode
$ sudo -i reboot :|



As an alternative you may try alt+prt sc/Sys Rq + k
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Re: [kde] Screen Lock Error


On 07/11/12 09:34, Zaki Akhmad wrote:

Hello,

I am facing this screen lock error[1] at KDE. The password textbox
suddenly full of password character and I can't erased it (maybe since
it's very long). Trigger of this error is when I do screen lock my KDE
but the error shows randomly.

[1]http://flic.kr/p/cqKs8m

Hope somebody could give me hint. Thanks!


KDE version and distro?

Try locking screen as a new user? If it doesnt work, try the default 
/etc/kde4/kdm/kdmrc which the distro provided (after talking backup).
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Re: [kde] KTorrent Manual


On 07/13/12 04:27, Sian Mountbatten wrote:

On 12/07/12 08:53, dE . wrote:

On 07/11/12 00:54, Burkhard Lück wrote:

Am Dienstag, 10. Juli 2012, 21:20:46 schrieb Sian Mountbatten:
This, apparently, is some kind of joke, because the manual consists 
of a

list of features, and that's all.
Does that mean that no manual has been written?

Yes.




Do we need one?
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Yes, there are lots of terms on the Ktorrent display which don't 
appear to be explained anywhere. What's
"choked", "snubbed", "DHT" mean? And "score"? And "Upload Slot" and 
"Requests". Maybe you are an
aficionado and know the meaning of all these terms. As a new user of 
Ktorrent, I am impressed with the
functionality of Ktorrent, but not impressed at the lack of help. Yes, 
we DO NEED a manual.


Sincerely



These are generic torrent network terms; even if there was a manual, 
this probably wouldn't be documented.


As far as I remember --

Choked -- All bandwidth of the peer is occupied.

Upload Slot -- For uploading purposes, how many peers should be 
connected to you at a time.


Others I don't know, you may like to search for the terms.
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Re: [kde] KTorrent Manual

2012-07-17 Thread dE .


On 07/13/12 16:22, Anne Wilson wrote:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 12/07/12 22:26, dE . wrote:

On 07/13/12 04:27, Sian Mountbatten wrote:

On 12/07/12 08:53, dE . wrote:

On 07/11/12 00:54, Burkhard Lück wrote:

Am Dienstag, 10. Juli 2012, 21:20:46 schrieb Sian
Mountbatten:

This, apparently, is some kind of joke, because the manual
consists of a list of features, and that's all. Does that
mean that no manual has been written?

Yes.



Do we need one?
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Yes, there are lots of terms on the Ktorrent display which don't
appear to be explained anywhere. What's "choked", "snubbed",
"DHT" mean? And "score"? And "Upload Slot" and "Requests". Maybe
you are an aficionado and know the meaning of all these terms. As
a new user of Ktorrent, I am impressed with the functionality of
Ktorrent, but not impressed at the lack of help. Yes, we DO NEED
a manual.

Sincerely


These are generic torrent network terms; even if there was a
manual, this probably wouldn't be documented.

As far as I remember --

Choked -- All bandwidth of the peer is occupied.

Upload Slot -- For uploading purposes, how many peers should be
connected to you at a time.

Others I don't know, you may like to search for the terms.

There is a very basic page at http://userbase.kde.org/KTorrent - it
would be very useful to have a glossary attached to that (I can create
a new subpage for it, if there are enough terms to warrant that).  The
advantage of doing it there is that we can get the terms translated
into many languages.  All that would remain, then, would be to have a
link to UserBase in the Help menu.

UserBase is a wiki, so any additional information being added to the
page would be appreciated.

Anne
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Maybe I can try, but I'm no expert.
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Re: [kde] Plasma "upside down" ...

2012-07-18 Thread dE .


On 07/13/12 23:14, Hans Muecke wrote:

Howdy folks,

Ran into a strange problem ...

Kubuntu 12.04LTS/KDE4.8.4 ...

For whatever reason my plasma desktop crashed yesterday. Couldn't get it
to come up again, so I deleted all the plasma files in the home
directory to start from scratch.
I must have done that in the "protected mode" unknowingly ... since
today - when trying to change one of the desktop effects - I was told
that I was running protected mode and should switch to the "normal"
plasma desktop.
Did as requested and ended up with an "upside down" desktop. Visually
everything is upside down, but buttons still seem to be where they are
supposed to be on the desktop (screenshots: http://goo.gl/N4tVF and
http://goo.gl/YjPtc ). Everything looks fine in protected mode ... minus
effects that is.

Anyone have an idea what went wrong here and how to possibly correct it?


As many people pointed out, this might be an X problem, so I'd suggest 
you post output of --


DISPLAY=":0" xrandr

from one of the ttys.
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Re: [kde] convert to kde on Windows 7

2012-07-18 Thread dE .


On 07/17/12 01:50, Doug wrote:
I hope this message falls within the scope of the guidelines you 
published.


I want to convert to the KDE version for Windows.  However, I want to 
be absolutely sure I can get back, if it doesn't work out. 


That cant be done under Windows. The only option you have is 'reformat'.


(There is a program that was very difficult to install, and
I don't want to ever have to do it again!  As well as other paid 
programs.) In order to do that, I would like to copy the entire 
Windows partition to an external drive. On the Windows system,
the drive contains Win 7 plus pclos in dual-boot configuration.  Can I 
do (from the Linux partition) dd if=sda1 of=sdb and, if that is 
correct, would the external drive be bootable?
If not correct, I hope that some kind soul reading this will correct 
me!  Thanx!


--doug



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Re: [kde] KDE lost of settings: "State" field corrupted in all rc files

2012-07-22 Thread dE .


On 07/22/12 15:46, Maxime. Haselbauer wrote:

Hi, Kubuntu 12.04 Kde 4.8.4 32 bit

Interesting thing this morning:
I power up my compute and almost every programm open as if KDE would 
be freshly installed and it  would be the first time I open the programm.
Needless to say, there was no update yesterday and ervything worked 
fine when I shut down the computer yesterday evening


Very annoying because it means all your personal settings are lost
in a short list

Background color of kde
Activities
Amarok collection

The podcast list

All id3 tags you have modified within amarok

Amarok internal database playlist

Amarok .xspf saved playlist

Kdevelop settinggs 
All Akregator podcasts (although, there IS a feeds.opml file in 
~/.kde/share/apps/akregator    which DOES contain all RSS url I 
had ...)

Kmail settings (all your accounts)

etc...


So, it looks like it is not reading all rc configuration files (those 
stored in ~/.kde/share/config) because all information it lacks are 
usually given in those files


Hence I open a couple of rc files and I find an interesting thing:
In each of them, under the [Mainwindow] section there ist something like

State=/wD9AwE4AAAB1PwCAfsOAE0AbwBkAGUA[...]  I 
spare you the rest, this continue like that for long


I guess this is not the true state... but a corrupted field. 
Interesting is that it looks corrupted for all rc files I have open so 
far, even those of programm that I did not open for a while now.


Anyone know something about where it comes from and how to solve it ?

Regards
Maxime Haselbauer



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Sounds like a HDD problem. Did you check using smartctl?
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Re: [kde] Plasma "upside down" ...

2012-07-22 Thread dE .


On 07/21/12 20:18, Hans Muecke wrote:

Am 18.07.2012 17:22, schrieb dE .:


On 07/13/12 23:14, Hans Muecke wrote:

Howdy folks,

Ran into a strange problem ...

Kubuntu 12.04LTS/KDE4.8.4 ...

For whatever reason my plasma desktop crashed yesterday. Couldn't get it
to come up again, so I deleted all the plasma files in the home
directory to start from scratch.
I must have done that in the "protected mode" unknowingly ... since
today - when trying to change one of the desktop effects - I was told
that I was running protected mode and should switch to the "normal"
plasma desktop.
Did as requested and ended up with an "upside down" desktop. Visually
everything is upside down, but buttons still seem to be where they are
supposed to be on the desktop (screenshots: http://goo.gl/N4tVF and
http://goo.gl/YjPtc ). Everything looks fine in protected mode ... minus
effects that is.

Anyone have an idea what went wrong here and how to possibly correct it?

As many people pointed out, this might be an X problem, so I'd suggest
you post output of --

DISPLAY=":0" xrandr

Here we go ...

Sa Jul 21, 09:46:38 hans@armstrong (~)>  DISPLAY=":0" xrandr
xrandr: Failed to get size of gamma for output default
Screen 0: minimum 320 x 240, current 1680 x 1050, maximum 1680 x 1050
default connected 1680x1050+0+0 0mm x 0mm
1680x1050  50.0*90.0
1440x900   51.0 52.0
1400x1050  53.0 54.0
1360x768   55.0 56.0
1280x1024  57.0 58.0
1280x960   59.0
1280x720   60.0
1152x864   61.0 62.0 63.0 64.0
1024x768   65.0 66.0 67.0
960x60068.0
960x54069.0
840x52570.0 71.0 72.0 73.0
832x62474.0
800x60075.0 76.0 77.0 78.0
720x45079.0
700x52580.0 81.0
680x38482.0 83.0
640x48084.0 85.0 86.0 87.0
512x38488.0 89.0
400x30091.0
320x24092.0 93.0
Sa Jul 21, 09:46:43 hans@armstrong (~)>




It didnt give the orientation. In my case it does.
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Re: [kde] Strange behavior of launchers inside task manager after crash

2012-07-26 Thread dE .


On 07/23/12 13:28, JC Francois wrote:

Hi,

I have configured 4 launcher icons in the task manager of the main 
panel on my desktop: Dolphin, Firefox, Thunderbird and Transmission. 
Last week I ran out of disk space on my home partition. I got some 
error messages and the PC crashed. Firefox and Thunderbird were 
running when the crash happened.


I rebooted, deleted some data files but since then the task manager 
does no longer behave as before:


. when I click on the Firefox or Thunderbird icon in the task manager 
the app starts but the icon remains visible instead of disappearing.
. when I click on the Dolphin or Transmission icon the app starts and 
the icon disappears as before (which is fine).


I tried removing the Firefox and Thunderbird icons and re-adding them 
but the behavior does not change. They seem to be the only 2 apps 
affected by the problem.


Can you help me fix this issue? I am running KDE 4.7.2 on openSUSE 12.1

Thanks,

/~jc



Why not just remove and re-add the TM applet?
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Re: [kde] Dots in filenames and automatic file extension completion

2012-07-26 Thread dE .


On 07/25/12 17:31, Mirosław Zalewski wrote:

Thanks for your reply. I'm not sure if I understood everything correctly (may
be my English, though).

That's true, that "Automatically select filename extension" is antoher factor
that I should have taken into account. I forgot about it, sorry. My test was
run with that checkbox enabled (which I believe is default anyway).

On 25/07/2012 at 10:09, Duncan<1i5t5.dun...@cox.net>  wrote:


a) Does LO use native desktop file-save dialogs, kde's file-save
dialogs on kde, gtk's on gtk, and either gtk's or its own on
bare X11?

Yes, they do. KDE file dialog on KDE Plasma, GTK file dialog on GNOME and others
(e.g. Openbox) and pure X11/their own (I'm not sure, I don't know if I have
ever seen pure X11 file dialog) when no KDE/GTK is available.


b) For kde apps, and thus LO too if it uses native kde file dialogs
on kde, does the suggested save-as name change, based on the
filetype filter and/or whether the "automatically select filename
extension" checkbox is selected in the save-as dialog?

Yes, it does change. It looks like this:
Automatic... checked? 1.2.3.4  1.2.3.4.odt
no1.2.31.2.3.4
yes   1.2.pdf  1.2.3.pdf

(I tried "Export to PDF" function.)

For me, it looks pretty much that both KDE and LO strips extension from
filename. If I disable KDE automatic filename extension it does not strip it,
but I have one component stripped anyway.

Unfortunately, disabling "Automatically select filename extension" checkbox is
working system-wide, at least on 4.8.4. Without this drawback, it would be
nice workaround (but I have to think what is more frustrating - handicapped
filenames in LO or being forced to type file extension each time).

I believe that my questions #1 and #2 are pretty much answered (but any other
comments are welcome). Any comments about my question #3?


You may like to disable KDE/QT dialogues in libreoffice-KDE by tools > 
options > [check] Use libreoffice dialogs.


Also this problem does not persist in my setup using KDE dialogues.
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Re: [kde] Dots in filenames and automatic file extension completion

2012-07-30 Thread dE .


On 07/26/12 22:34, Mirosław Zalewski wrote:

On 26/07/2012 at 17:12, "dE ."  wrote:


You may like to disable KDE/QT dialogues in libreoffice-KDE by tools>
options>  [check] Use libreoffice dialogs.

Then I won't have access to "Places".
Yes, I quite complain ;) . The problem is that each method has drawbacks and I
have to choose lesser evil, which I hate.


Also this problem does not persist in my setup using KDE dialogues.

Could you elaborate? What LO/KDE versions? What distribution? How was LO/KDE
installed? Can you point out where exactly your results differs from mine
(please see tables in first message in this thread and table available in LO
bug report[1])?
It would be interesting to know what are differences between mine and your
setup and where does results differ.

[1] https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=52546


You're using Gentoo right? I'm, with (~amd64) libreoffice 3.5.5.3. KDE 
is at 4.8.4.


Yes, I do see the bug now. the proposed name of the file is 1.2.txt 
instead of 1.2.3.4.txt

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Re: [kde] Dots in filenames and automatic file extension completion

2012-08-01 Thread dE .


On 07/31/12 03:52, Mirosław Zalewski wrote:

On 30/07/2012 at 15:50, "dE ."  wrote:


You're using Gentoo right? I'm, with (~amd64) libreoffice 3.5.5.3. KDE
is at 4.8.4.

No, I am using Debian testing (Wheezy) right now. Sorry if I forgot to mention
that.

I have the same architecture, LO and KDE versions as you do.


Actually this's a very small bug. You can just type the name with the 
extension to solve the problem.


And considering this minor nature, this wont be fixed by the LO team for 
years (cause they've much bigger bugs to take care of).

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Re: [kde] Dots in filenames and automatic file extension completion

2012-08-03 Thread dE .


On 08/02/12 16:23, Mirosław Zalewski wrote:

On 02/08/2012 at 05:35, "dE ."  wrote:


Actually this's a very small bug. You can just type the name with the
extension to solve the problem.

And considering this minor nature, this wont be fixed by the LO team for
years (cause they've much bigger bugs to take care of).

Sorry, but I don't see your point here.
What's the difference if this is minor or huge bug? Bug is a bug, developers
should be aware of it. Since they prioritize bug reports, they will not act
upon each bug immediately, but they should at least know where their software
has rough edges.
And personally, I would rather see this fixed in few years than never.

By the way, as you can see in LO bug tracker (link is in one of previous
posts), they actually did commit change that is supposed to fix that (I did not
had opportunity to see if this fix really works).


Yeah I saw that :-[

Looks like the QT code maintainer is not overloaded with bugs.

Also with this version, have you tried opening docx files?
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Re: [kde] Migrating to another computer

2012-08-15 Thread dE .


On 08/13/12 14:56, Peter wrote:

Hi,

In the docs at :

http://userbase.kde.org/KMail/FAQs_Hints_and_Tips#Transfer_mail_and_settings_to_another_computer_.28or_another_user_account_on_the_same_machine.29

it says ...

Everything under ~/.local/share/

but I have ..

:~$ ls ~/.local/share/

akonadi   desktop-directories  local-mailrhythmbox  ubuntuone
applications  Empathy  mime  totem  vlc
contacts  gvfs-metadataquadrapassel  Trash  webkit

surely ONLY the akonadi path, and not the others ??

Regards,

Peter
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Strictly, it depends on the OS. In Gentoo for instance it's in ~/.kde4.

This place stated also has setting for other applications on my system, 
and so is the case with yours --


"rhythmbox", "ubuntuone" etc...

As an alternative, you may like to simply copy over the whole OS from 
your old PC to the new one.

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Re: [kde] Release 4.8.3

2012-08-17 Thread dE .

You didnt find any bigs in 4.6?

Yeah but there're new onces in 4.8.4.

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On Aug 16, 2012 9:41 PM, "Doug"  wrote:

> I have upgraded my "sandbox" from 4.6.5 on PCLOS to 4.8.3, and with the
> exception of a more cluttered systray or "panel" and a somewhat uglier
> desktop, both of which I was fortunate to have
> been able to revert, I see no obvious advantage.  (I don't consider the
> changes I noted to be an advantage.) Please explain why I should upgrade my
> two "work" computers to 4.8.3.
> Thanx--doug
>
> --
> Blessed are the peacekeepers...for they shall be shot at from both sides.
> --A.M. Greeley
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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2012-08-18 Thread dE .

The default browser is used for opening the man page. So you have to set it
to konqueror in order to do so.

the man page bug not opening in other browsers is fixed in KDE 4.9

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On Aug 18, 2012 8:45 PM, "Nikos Chantziaras"  wrote:

> In KDE, I'm very used to simply type "man:foo" and have the man page of
> "foo" pop up immediately in Konqueror without having to open a terminal or
> anything.
>
> However, since I installed Chromium and making it my default browser, now
> "man:" brings up Chromium instead.  That doesn't work; instead of
> displaying the man page, it downloads the *.bz2 from the local file system
> :-/
>
> How can I set Konqueror to be the program that handles KDE's "man:"
> command?
>
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Re: [kde] How to install KDE 4.9 on Debian Squeeze

2012-08-18 Thread dE .

I think its not possible cause of old QT libs.

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On Aug 18, 2012 7:50 PM,  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> How to install KDE 4.9 on Debian Squeeze ?
>
> The command "aptitude install kde .."
> could do that but with the 4.6 version
> and I want the 4.9.
>
> I downloaded the KDE 4.9 package on the KDE site,
> but no howto to compile and install the package.
>
> Thank for a help.
>
> andré
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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2012-08-20 Thread dE .

The svn build I mean.

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On Aug 19, 2012 10:08 PM, "Nikos Chantziaras"  wrote:

> I'm using KDE 4.9 and it's not fixed.  Only man pages that don't have
> alternatives are displayed.  But most have POSIX vs Linux versions, and the
> selection page doesn't work.
>
> There should be a way to set the man page viewer in an easy way.
>
>
> On 19/08/12 09:16, dE . wrote:
>
>> The default browser is used for opening the man page. So you have to set
>> it to konqueror in order to do so.
>>
>> the man page bug not opening in other browsers is fixed in KDE 4.9
>>
>> --**---
>> Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
>>
>> On Aug 18, 2012 8:45 PM, "Nikos Chantziaras" > <mailto:rea...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> In KDE, I'm very used to simply type "man:foo" and have the man page
>> of "foo" pop up immediately in Konqueror without having to open a
>> terminal or anything.
>>
>> However, since I installed Chromium and making it my default
>> browser, now "man:" brings up Chromium instead.  That doesn't work;
>> instead of displaying the man page, it downloads the *.bz2 from the
>> local file system :-/
>>
>> How can I set Konqueror to be the program that handles KDE's "man:"
>> command?
>>
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>>
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Re: [kde] How to install KDE 4.9 on Debian Squeeze

2012-08-20 Thread dE .

4.9 will be available on Debian testing once wheezy freezes.

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On Aug 19, 2012 8:15 PM, "Harry Miller"  wrote:

> One can do it, but its going to be a pain as you have to compile qt on
> your own plus all the little deps like strigi which will overwrite your
> distro packages and possibly cause alot of problems later on. I'd suggest
> using a more up-to-date distro since andre evidently isn't that familiar
> with compiling from scratch.
> or hope that someone has a repo with kde 4.9 available for squeeze.
>
> --- On *Sun, 8/19/12, dE . * wrote:
>
>
> From: dE . 
> Subject: Re: [kde] How to install KDE 4.9 on Debian Squeeze
> To: kde@mail.kde.org
> Date: Sunday, August 19, 2012, 12:30 AM
>
> I think its not possible cause of old QT libs.
>
> -
> Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
> On Aug 18, 2012 7:50 PM, 
> http://mc/compose?to=andre_deb...@numericable.fr>>
> wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> How to install KDE 4.9 on Debian Squeeze ?
>
> The command "aptitude install kde .."
> could do that but with the 4.6 version
> and I want the 4.9.
>
> I downloaded the KDE 4.9 package on the KDE site,
> but no howto to compile and install the package.
>
> Thank for a help.
>
> andré
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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2012-08-20 Thread dE .

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=287551

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On Aug 21, 2012 3:26 AM, "Nikos Chantziaras"  wrote:

> I'm not sure where to look for this.  Do you know the commit so I can
> apply it here?
>
>
> On 20/08/12 10:45, dE . wrote:
>
>> The svn build I mean.
>>
>> --**---
>> Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2012 10:08 PM, "Nikos Chantziaras" > <mailto:rea...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I'm using KDE 4.9 and it's not fixed.  Only man pages that don't
>> have alternatives are displayed.  But most have POSIX vs Linux
>> versions, and the selection page doesn't work.
>>
>> There should be a way to set the man page viewer in an easy way.
>>
>>
>> On 19/08/12 09:16, dE . wrote:
>>
>> The default browser is used for opening the man page. So you
>> have to set
>> it to konqueror in order to do so.
>>
>> the man page bug not opening in other browsers is fixed in KDE 4.9
>>
>> --**__---
>> Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
>>
>> On Aug 18, 2012 8:45 PM, "Nikos Chantziaras" > <mailto:rea...@gmail.com>
>> <mailto:rea...@gmail.com <mailto:rea...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>
>>  In KDE, I'm very used to simply type "man:foo" and have the
>> man page
>>  of "foo" pop up immediately in Konqueror without having to
>> open a
>>  terminal or anything.
>>
>>  However, since I installed Chromium and making it my default
>>  browser, now "man:" brings up Chromium instead.  That
>> doesn't work;
>>  instead of displaying the man page, it downloads the *.bz2
>> from the
>>  local file system :-/
>>
>>  How can I set Konqueror to be the program that handles
>> KDE's "man:"
>>  command?
>>
>
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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2012-08-27 Thread dE .


On 08/21/12 10:01, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
Thank you.  I applied it and rebuilt.  It doesn't fix the problem.  It 
only fixes a bug very specific to "man:tar".


This is what happens when I type "man:tar":

  http://i46.tinypic.com/2yll3pl.png

When I then click on the one I want, this happens:

  http://i50.tinypic.com/x4m637.png

So nothing changed.


You've to wait for KDE 4.1, or a bugfix release or build form the GIT.
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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2012-08-28 Thread dE .


On 08/28/12 05:32, Duncan wrote:

dE . posted on Mon, 27 Aug 2012 20:47:10 +0530 as excerpted:


On 08/21/12 10:01, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:

Thank you.  I applied it and rebuilt.  It doesn't fix the problem.  It
only fixes a bug very specific to "man:tar".

This is what happens when I type "man:tar":

   http://i46.tinypic.com/2yll3pl.png

When I then click on the one I want, this happens:

   http://i50.tinypic.com/x4m637.png

So nothing changed.

You've to wait for KDE 4.1, or a bugfix release or build form the GIT.

4.1?  Do you mean 4.9.1, or is this a timewarped post from 2007/2008?

=:^)



Oh... sorry.
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Re: [kde] KDE Desktop effects

2012-09-17 Thread dE .


On 09/15/12 00:29, Bogus Zaba wrote:
I am not desperate to have all possible eye-candy operating, but I 
know that my system is capable of reasonable performance with regard 
to stuff like box-switching etc because it has worked before.


The system has an nvidia GeForce 7300 card and I am using the nvidia 
(proprietary) driver. The KDE is 4.5.5 under Slackware 13.37 which is 
the best I can run under Slack 13.37 without making some other 
significant system changes.


Recently KDE allows me to use only the XRender compositing type which 
provides a jerky experience if desktop effects are turned on. If I try 
and switch to OpenGL I get "Failed to activate desktop effects using 
the given config options" and it reverts to jerky Xrender. I have 
re-installed the nvidia driver and am sure it is working OK because 
the nvidia Server settings utility does what is expected (provides a 
cursor shadow for example). This utility also reports all sorts of 
OpenGL parameters and so it looks like OpenGL should work OK. Why is 
KDE not playing nicely?


Thanks
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Did you try this out with a new user?
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Re: [kde] KDE Desktop effects

2012-09-18 Thread dE .

It's using opengl?

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On Sep 18, 2012 1:39 PM, "Bogus Zaba"  wrote:

> On 09/18/2012 02:21 AM, Duncan wrote:
>
>> Bogus Zaba posted on Mon, 17 Sep 2012 20:13:42 +0100 as excerpted:
>>
>>  Did not work, but maybe there there is a clue here because this middle
>>> tab is...
>>> completely empty! There is a one-line text box into which you can type a
>>> search term and a much bigger box which presumably should contain a long
>>> list of effects which I should be able to play with.
>>> This is weird because the system clearly does know about available
>>> effects because on the first tab I have set (for example) : Effect for
>>> window switching to "Box Switch" from a pick-list.
>>>
>> Wow!  I'd say that probably has something to do with it, for sure!  But
>> it's totally out of the blue, for me.  I've never seen or heard anything
>> like it!
>>
>> Two possibilities and if those (and sdowdy's suggestions) don't pan out,
>> hit bugzilla and see if there's anything close.  I'd say file a bug if
>> you don't find anything like it, but what they're working on now is one
>> and a half to two years of development beyond the 4.6 you're running, so
>> it's probably not worth even thinking about at this point, if there's
>> nothing already there about it.  Once the new Slackware's out and you're
>> on 4.8.x, however, if the bug's still there, I'd file it.
>>
>> There are only two possibilities I can think of that would be anywhere
>> /close/ to that.
>>
>> 1) Check to be sure, you're running kwin as the window manager, correct?
>> Obviously if it somehow got replaced by compiz or the like, there'd be
>> some dramatic loss of window manager configurability within kde, but I've
>> never tried it, so I'm not sure what the symptoms would look like.
>>
>> Probably the easiest way to be sure kwin's your window manager is to run
>> kwin --replace, from krunner or the like.  You might also try from konsole
>> or the like, and see if it spits out any useful information as errors,
>> but if it's like most kde apps, devs apparently don't expect users to be
>> watching STDOUT/STDERR at all, so they print out all kinds of alarming
>> looking stuff even when things are working, for all one can tell.  As a
>> result, that output tends to be useless for troubleshooting unless you
>> have another similarly configured system that's working to try it on as
>> well, and can do a diff to eliminate all the "normal noise".
>>
>>
>>  kwin --replace seemed to work just fine - everything looked exactly like
> it did prior to the command, plus I got the following valuable (?) output
> in konsole. It is clearly warning me that some effects are not supported,
> although it remains a mystery as to why.
>
>
> bogzab:~/Documents> kwin --replace
> OpenGL vendor string:   NVIDIA Corporation
> OpenGL renderer string: GeForce 7300 SE/7200
> GS/PCIe/SSE2/3DNOW!
> OpenGL version string:  2.1.2 NVIDIA 295.33
> OpenGL shading language version string: 1.20 NVIDIA via Cg compiler
> Driver: NVIDIA
> Driver version: 295.33
> GPU class:  NV40/G70
> OpenGL version: 2.1.2
> GLSL version:   1.20
> X server version:   1.9.5
> Linux kernel version:   2.6.37
> Direct rendering:   yes
> Requires strict binding:no
> GLSL shaders:   limited
> Texture NPOT support:   yes
> kwin(1021) KWin::EffectsHandlerImpl::**loadEffect:
> EffectsHandler::loadEffect : Effect  "kwin4_effect_blur"  is not supported
> kwin(1021) KWin::EffectsHandlerImpl::**loadEffect:
> EffectsHandler::loadEffect : Effect  "kwin4_effect_flipswitch"  is not
> supported
> kwin(1021) KWin::EffectsHandlerImpl::**loadEffect:
> EffectsHandler::loadEffect : Effect  "kwin4_effect_startupfeedback" is not
> supported
> kwin(1021) KWin::EffectsHandlerImpl::**loadEffect:
> EffectsHandler::loadEffect : Effect  "kwin4_effect_screenshot"  is not
> supported
> kwin(1021) KWin::EffectsHandlerImpl::**loadEffect:
> EffectsHandler::loadEffect : Effect  "kwin4_effect_coverswitch"  is not
> supported
>
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Re: [kde] drive mount problems only in kde

2012-09-22 Thread dE .

You mean you cant write to the rw mounted FS via dolphin?

-
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On Sep 22, 2012 2:10 PM, "P .NIKOLIC"  wrote:

>
> Hi list
>
>
> Well this is going to be a corker  i am running as in the sig block
> arch Linux  x86_64   KDE 4.9.1  .
>
> When i boot the system and leave KDM to stat kde x ect  and log into
> KDE  i get both  / and /home mounted ro  BUT
>
> If i do not log into KDE but come out to a tty log in as root and
> check then both are mounted correctly mounted rw my question is What
> in KDE 4.9.1 is faffing around and changing the mount status and how
> do i stop it
>
>
> Pete .
>
> --
> Linux 7-of-9 3.5.4-1-ARCH #1 SMP PREEMPT Sat Sep 15 08:12:04 CEST 2012
> x86_64 GNU/Linux
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Re: [kde] THE kde desktop is slow...

2012-10-19 Thread dE .

On 10/11/12 01:57, Nathan England wrote:

On 10/10/2012 7:59 AM, 杜秀涛 wrote:

Hi friends!I am using kde now, I just compiled it. every things seems
fine, but the speed...
tow problems:
1. I takes long time to load the desktop successfully, from pressing
enter to I can see the beautiful desktop background-image, almost
takes 2 minutes;
2. it often hangs for ten or 30 seconds to response to an mouse
action, For example, I want to open the konqueror ,or opera. both of
them takes long time to start up successfully. when they are
"starting", others actions will be affected slow down.

here is some infos about my OS and kde
OS:Gentoo -- the os is totally on a flash disk with 16G capacity
KDE:4.9.2
Graphic:Intel Integrated Mobile 945GSE

So, what could I do?
Thank you for your kindness patience in advance!

I would be willing to bet it is the flash disk at fault. I have built
several systems using various kinds of flash devices for filesystems.
I have always blamed it on KDE's use of tons of small files and poor
small file performance of flash devices. Try moving all your temp
directories to ram and see if that makes a difference.

Try mounting /tmp and /var/tmp to a ramdisk and see if that makes a
difference.

My /etc/fstab looks like this:

tmpfs /tmp tmpfs mode=0777,size=24M,nosuid 0 0
tmpfs /var/tmp tmpfs mode=0777,size=24M,nosuid 0 0

Try doing the same and let us know how it works.

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Yes, the flash disk IS at fault. It gives problems even if you're using
Xfce.

Another thing you might try is clearing /var/tmp/kdecache-username>/*; but this wont give issues unless your KDE installation is old.

You may try flash oriented FS; BTW reiserfs works the fastest on rootfs,
and reiser4 is ~15 times faster (search performance).

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Re: [kde] Kmail HTML rendering: character size

2012-10-29 Thread dE .

Do you face the same problem with konqueror?

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On Oct 30, 2012 4:57 AM, "Renaud (Ron) Olgiati" <
ren...@olgiati-in-paraguay.org> wrote:

> When I (infrequently) read a message that has been sent in HTML, the
> rendering
> uses font sizes so small that it is almost illegible.
>
> Is there a way, as there is in Firefox for instance, to force a minimum
> font
> size ?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ron.
> --
>Don't try to have the last word,
>   you might get it.
> -- Lazarus Long
>
>-- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org --
>
>
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Re: [kde] Kmail HTML rendering: character size

2012-10-29 Thread dE .

Do you face the same problem with konqueror?

-
Support software for non profit, buy Android phones.
On Oct 30, 2012 4:57 AM, "Renaud (Ron) Olgiati" <
ren...@olgiati-in-paraguay.org> wrote:

> When I (infrequently) read a message that has been sent in HTML, the
> rendering
> uses font sizes so small that it is almost illegible.
>
> Is there a way, as there is in Firefox for instance, to force a minimum
> font
> size ?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ron.
> --
>Don't try to have the last word,
>   you might get it.
> -- Lazarus Long
>
>-- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org --
>
>
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Re: [kde] Wrap Firefox in KDE app?

2012-10-31 Thread dE .

If I understand your question correctly, a custum .desktop file should do.

You can make that in a graphical way using kmenuedit.
-
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On Oct 26, 2012 9:19 PM, "Dotan Cohen"  wrote:

> I would like to use different icons for each Firefox profile. Firefox
> does not seem to support this, but all KDE applications support by
> default the --icon flag. Is there a simple way to "wrap" a launcher to
> a specific Firefox profile in a KDE application so that it might be
> possible to change the icon?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> --
> Dotan Cohen
>
> http://gibberish.co.il
> http://what-is-what.com
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Re: [kde] Automated import of camera photos


On 12/08/12 02:46, Alex Schuster wrote:

Hi there!

As some of you may know, I'm a Gentoo user, and I have a KDE which is 
quite well configured. But I'm setting up a PC for a lady who has 
_very_ limited PC experience. She wants to try Linux, because she 
became deprived of e-mail access by her ISP after her account started 
to send SPAM due to some Windows malware. She only uses Firefox 
(mainly for eBay), a mail client for two mail accounts, an image 
viewer, and she needs to import photos from her camera. She also likes 
to play two Windows games, Space Cadet (pinball) and some cards game.


So I installed openSUSE (12.2 I think) on her new PC. For the desktop 
environment, I chose KDE because it is so configurable. There should 
be extra large icons on the desktop for example. I can set the fonts 
to a huge size, which works fine mostly - notifications however show 
up with text lines merged into another, so the text is not readable. 
This happens when I plug in an USB camera, KDE asks if I want to open 
it with Dolphin, or if I want to import pictures with Gwenview or 
Digikam. Maybe I can tune this so only one entry appears.


Photo import is the main problem: She currently has some Windows 
application which allows to import all new images of the camera to a 
folder. I would really REALLY like to have this feature, but it does 
not seem to be possible.


When the camera is plugged in, I can choose to import images with 
Digikam. Works, with a few clicks. But when I do this again, Digikam 
wants to import all images again, not only the new ones. It is working 
fine as long as I do not close Digikam, but when I open it again, it 
will import all images. This make es it basically unusable.
I'm not sure if this also happened when I have Digikam running and 
import manually, but this involves more clicks, and is also not what I 
want.


Gwenview imports only the new images. Fine, but also with way to many 
clicks. The user needs to open folders named 'DCIM' and such, has to 
pick the right ones, and the dialog asks him to import 'documents', 
not 'pictures' or 'photos'. You might think tis is not a big deal, but 
I fear this will make the user keep using the old Windows PC, where 
everything works as expected.


Any ideas how I could solve this? Is there any possibility to import 
all new images from a camera to a folder? I would not mind scripting 
if necessary.


Sorry, I do not know the exact version of KDE, and I do not have the 
PC here right now. Maybe this is a bug which is already fixed. I do 
not have access to my own PC right now, too, so I cannot simply check 
this. So I'm sorry for asking here, but I'm moving, and only have a 
Windows laptop with me at the moment.


Another disappointment was KMail, which I gave another try. The 
problem was that I did not know the passwords yet, and it (or rather 
Akonadi) kept asking for it, I was not even able to delete the 
resource because of the dialog which would appear over and over 
again.  I guess I could have solved this eventually, but then I 
decided to simply use Thunderbird instead.


What was great about using KDE was the possibility to configure the 
desktop. I removed all window title bar buttons except for the close 
button - minimizing an application to the panel would already be too 
complicated, don't ask :)  A double click on the title bar to maximize 
the window is okay, other stuff is too sophisticated. If she wants to 
use another application, she simply closes the one she is using. She 
is happy with this, and then so be it.
I also disabled features like maximizing windows when they are moved 
to the screen borders, or special effects happening when the mouse 
enters the screen's corners. While I personally like those features 
much, it's great that they are all optional. Thanks for leaving KDE so 
much configurable, I guess this would not be possible with Gnome.


Wonko
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I'd not suggest KDE. Go for Xfce, and I personally give Debian to other 
users (although I myself use Gentoo with KDE and with no buttons on the 
title bar).


Use Thunderbird; it's much simpler than Outlook or it's variants.

For a simple user, he/she doesn't require customization; so Xfce should 
be good. Unlike KDE, it's reliable, stable, bug free, faster but very 
simple.


If you want I can upload the Debain (testing or Wheezy, which's about to 
freeze) squashfs image complete with a 'my computer' location (custom 
build). I also have a KDE variant of the same, which I absolutely not 
recommend for this lady.


As of ensuring the user to use the GNU system, induce fear in her of 
potential threats of using Windows. Show her some penis enlargement SPAM 
and tell her all this must be going from her mailbox to her contacts; 
but

Re: [kde] Automated import of camera photos


On 12/08/12 02:46, Alex Schuster wrote:

Hi there!

As some of you may know, I'm a Gentoo user, and I have a KDE which is 
quite well configured. But I'm setting up a PC for a lady who has 
_very_ limited PC experience. She wants to try Linux, because she 
became deprived of e-mail access by her ISP after her account started 
to send SPAM due to some Windows malware. She only uses Firefox 
(mainly for eBay), a mail client for two mail accounts, an image 
viewer, and she needs to import photos from her camera. She also likes 
to play two Windows games, Space Cadet (pinball) and some cards game.


So I installed openSUSE (12.2 I think) on her new PC. For the desktop 
environment, I chose KDE because it is so configurable. There should 
be extra large icons on the desktop for example. I can set the fonts 
to a huge size, which works fine mostly - notifications however show 
up with text lines merged into another, so the text is not readable. 
This happens when I plug in an USB camera, KDE asks if I want to open 
it with Dolphin, or if I want to import pictures with Gwenview or 
Digikam. Maybe I can tune this so only one entry appears.


Photo import is the main problem: She currently has some Windows 
application which allows to import all new images of the camera to a 
folder. I would really REALLY like to have this feature, but it does 
not seem to be possible.


When the camera is plugged in, I can choose to import images with 
Digikam. Works, with a few clicks. But when I do this again, Digikam 
wants to import all images again, not only the new ones. It is working 
fine as long as I do not close Digikam, but when I open it again, it 
will import all images. This make es it basically unusable.
I'm not sure if this also happened when I have Digikam running and 
import manually, but this involves more clicks, and is also not what I 
want.


Gwenview imports only the new images. Fine, but also with way to many 
clicks. The user needs to open folders named 'DCIM' and such, has to 
pick the right ones, and the dialog asks him to import 'documents', 
not 'pictures' or 'photos'. You might think tis is not a big deal, but 
I fear this will make the user keep using the old Windows PC, where 
everything works as expected.


Any ideas how I could solve this? Is there any possibility to import 
all new images from a camera to a folder? I would not mind scripting 
if necessary.


Sorry, I do not know the exact version of KDE, and I do not have the 
PC here right now. Maybe this is a bug which is already fixed. I do 
not have access to my own PC right now, too, so I cannot simply check 
this. So I'm sorry for asking here, but I'm moving, and only have a 
Windows laptop with me at the moment.


Another disappointment was KMail, which I gave another try. The 
problem was that I did not know the passwords yet, and it (or rather 
Akonadi) kept asking for it, I was not even able to delete the 
resource because of the dialog which would appear over and over 
again.  I guess I could have solved this eventually, but then I 
decided to simply use Thunderbird instead.


What was great about using KDE was the possibility to configure the 
desktop. I removed all window title bar buttons except for the close 
button - minimizing an application to the panel would already be too 
complicated, don't ask :)  A double click on the title bar to maximize 
the window is okay, other stuff is too sophisticated. If she wants to 
use another application, she simply closes the one she is using. She 
is happy with this, and then so be it.
I also disabled features like maximizing windows when they are moved 
to the screen borders, or special effects happening when the mouse 
enters the screen's corners. While I personally like those features 
much, it's great that they are all optional. Thanks for leaving KDE so 
much configurable, I guess this would not be possible with Gnome.


Wonko
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Yeah, and for that camera app, use any of digikam, kamera, gtkam, gthumb 
etc... And ensure you've all gphoto2 dependencies installed.

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Re: [kde] Automated import of camera photos

On 12/10/12 20:45, Anne Wilson wrote:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 10/12/12 14:38, dE . wrote:

I'd not suggest KDE. Go for Xfce, and I personally give Debian to
other users (although I myself use Gentoo with KDE and with no
buttons on the title bar).

As an example of FUD, this message takes some beating. Just to deal
with a few points -

KDE is, for the most part, entirely stable - just stay away from KDE-PIM.

In this release of KDE, I can open odf documents as zip archive.
In the previous release, I lost the ability to hide partitions from
device notifier.

In the previous release, folder view widget lost the scroll bar.
Forgot for previous releases

And all these were 'stable'.

And the reason why this problem exists and will never be fixed cause
devs and key team member never admit to it.

You recommendation to mislead her on the spam subject is objectionable.

Antivirus software definitely does work - as long as it is set up to
receive signature updates regularly. The reason there are so many
infected computers is that many people don't use an AV product at all,
others install one, preferably a free-as-in-beer one, and don't
properly set up updates. I know one user who has used Windows daily
for 20+ years and never had a single infection. Education on key
risks is the key.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flame_%28malware%29 (since 2007, detected
in 2012)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNSChanger
http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Security/Kasperskys-Download-Site-Hacked-Directs-Users-to-Fake-AntiVirus-336193

Most of antivirus vendors dont themselves use Windows, Mcafee uses it
behind Linux.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/142318/hacked_antivirus_site_delivers_a_virus.html
http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Security/Rutkowska-AntiVirus-Software-Is-Ineffective

{Polymorphic virus --
http://www.securelist.com/en/analysis/204792122/Review_of_the_Virus_Win32_Virut_ce_Malware_Sample
Virus makes themselves use antivirus --
http://blog.k7computing.com/2012/01/malware-authors-and-multiple-scanners}
{http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stration
http://books.google.co.in/books?id=H2AEMBAJ&pg=PA10&lpg=PA10&dq=%22Stration%22+undetectable&source=bl&ots=-a1Fo4_QTU&sig=z3vFNBNiQTo17XWik9astg_MJNc&hl=en&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=%22Stration%22%20undetectable&f=false}

http://www.emirates247.com/eb247/companies-markets/technology/rise-in-malware-variants-make-antivirus-solutions-insufficient-2009-11-19-1.20838
http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/2012/05/30/f-flame-virus-detection.html

And if they were confident their tools are fool-proof --

http://www.mcafee.com/us/downloads/free-tools/getsusp.aspx

Wouldn't have existed.

No signature available --
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stars_virus

http://www.theverge.com/2012/2/7/2783575/symantec-source-code-stolen-the-extortion-investigation-and-release

Unprotected rates --
https://blogs.mcafee.com/consumer/family-safety/mcafee-releases-results-of-global-unprotected-rates

https://spyeyetracker.abuse.ch/
Detection rate 27% (last time it was 26%)

I myself have made experimental malware (in VB, as a newbie) which I've
even deployed (after telling my friends); anti-viruses didn't do
anything at all.

And no, Linux isn't safe from malware. Safer than Windows, yes, if
you leave holes in Windows, but an unprotected computer, whichever OS
it is using, is likely to be compromised sooner or later.

Like I don't know that. With apparmour/SElinux, noexec, it's VERY difficult.
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Re: [kde] Automated import of camera photos


On 12/10/12 20:45, Anne Wilson wrote:
Antivirus software definitely does work - as long as it is set up to 
receive signature updates regularly. The reason there are so many 
infected computers is that many people don't use an AV product at all, 
others install one, preferably a free-as-in-beer one, and don't 
properly set up updates. I know one user who has used Windows daily 
for 20+ years and never had a single infection. Education on key risks 
is the key. And no, Linux isn't safe from malware. Safer than Windows, 
yes, if you leave holes in Windows, but an unprotected computer, 
whichever OS it is using, is likely to be compromised sooner or later.


http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c112:S.372.IS:
http://www.ic3.gov/media/2012/120508.aspx

Oh, I did mail you that Norton security breach right?

And another scenario you may not believe. How did Windows 8, Windows 7, 
Windows 7 SP1 released to P2P networks even before MS released anything 
about it?

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Re: [kde] A Helping application for beginners Linux and Open Source in General

2013-01-31 Thread dE .


On 12/13/12 23:08, Mayank Jha wrote:
I was thinking that if there could be an application for kde or linux 
distros in general which could be used to put up a query and you could 
get a set of answers pertaining to your queries.
The source for answering these queries not being one but many, like 
askubuntu.com , askfedora.com 
, ubuntuforums.com  etc.
More generally what I am talking of is to pool in resources from the 
net and then as a "search engine" of sorts to answer the doubts of a 
newbie to open and free software. It would greatly reduce time for 
such a person to get accustomed to the knowhow of Linux.
I know that this sounds against mailing list culture, but if we can 
make some mini-search app for FOSS queries I feel it would be 
welcoming to the newcomer.
Also if someone is willing to mentor me upon this in creating such an 
app, i would gladly be willing to do so.



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It may be too late to answer this, but everyone, including Google came 
to the conclusion that the default Google search is the best for the 
purpose.


Cause at one time, Google too had search engines for certain specific 
purposes, like for Linux, for government issues etc... but it was also 
filtering out results which had the answer.
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Re: [kde] Looking for Information Retrieval / Search Engines project

2013-02-01 Thread dE .


On 01/25/13 07:21, Leonardo Santos Resende wrote:

Hi,
I wanna start developing some KDE project related to Information 
Retrieval. My main focus is Search Engines. Is there any Search Engine 
project? If not, is there something related to Information Retrieval?

Thanks a lot


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Maybe you can integrate Recoll with KDE.
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Re: [kde] Missing Maximize minimize buttons in kde 4.10

2013-02-07 Thread dE .


On 02/07/13 14:12, Shrinivasan T wrote:


Today, I upgraded to kde 4.10
Thanks for the kde community for the awesome work.

I miss the maximize minimize buttons.
Window settings use kwdinc only.

How to display them?



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How about checking out Systemsettings > Workspace appearance > Window 
decoration > configure buttons?
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Re: [kde] kmail and kwallet

2013-02-07 Thread dE .


On 02/08/13 07:47, Robert wrote:

Hello,

Hello,

I am hoping someone will be able to help me out with an issue I am having with 
the above named programs.

On my older system I am running KMail and I like it a lot.  When I got my new 
laptop I decided to install Kmail on it too.  Problem is Kmail is no
longer like the old kmail, I know everyone is going to say it is better but 
that is not my opinion.


Oh no, no one except accepted kde contributes is even going to say any 
of KDE 4's release is stable enough (except 4.6 and 4.9.5 maybe) for 
production use, and when you complain, the KDE contributes scold you.



Any why after it was installed kwallet was used
to track the passwords for the different email accounts.  After giving it a go 
I decided that kmail2 was not for me and I un-installed it.

Now the issue I am having is I keep being prompted for the password for kwallet 
to access my email.  The exact text is as follows;

The application 'X of type POP3 E-Mail Server'
has requested to open the wallet 'kdewallet'. Please enter
the password for this wallet below.

How do I get this to stop?  The email client I am using doesn't use kwallet so 
I know for a fact this is not what is causing this issue.

Thank you for your time.


Go to that kwallet icon and configure it to open up for a few minutes, 
or open up without asking a password if application kmail asks for it.


Also, I myself don't use kmail, but looking at the feedback in this 
mailing list.

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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2013-03-08 Thread dE .

Looks like they didn't fix the bug; or there must've been a bug in this bugfix.

On Sat, Mar 2, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Nikos Chantziaras  wrote:
> On 27/08/12 18:17, dE . wrote:
>>
>> On 08/21/12 10:01, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
>>>
>>> Thank you.  I applied it and rebuilt.  It doesn't fix the problem.  It
>>> only fixes a bug very specific to "man:tar".
>>>
>>> This is what happens when I type "man:tar":
>>>
>>>   http://i46.tinypic.com/2yll3pl.png
>>>
>>> When I then click on the one I want, this happens:
>>>
>>>   http://i50.tinypic.com/x4m637.png
>>>
>>> So nothing changed.
>>
>>
>> You've to wait for KDE 4.1, or a bugfix release or build form the GIT.
>
>
> I'm now on 4.10, and the problem persists :-(
>
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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2013-03-08 Thread dE .

On second thought, it works fine.

How does the problem persist in your case?

On Sat, Mar 9, 2013 at 8:31 AM, dE .  wrote:
> Looks like they didn't fix the bug; or there must've been a bug in this 
> bugfix.
>
> On Sat, Mar 2, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Nikos Chantziaras  wrote:
>> On 27/08/12 18:17, dE . wrote:
>>>
>>> On 08/21/12 10:01, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thank you.  I applied it and rebuilt.  It doesn't fix the problem.  It
>>>> only fixes a bug very specific to "man:tar".
>>>>
>>>> This is what happens when I type "man:tar":
>>>>
>>>>   http://i46.tinypic.com/2yll3pl.png
>>>>
>>>> When I then click on the one I want, this happens:
>>>>
>>>>   http://i50.tinypic.com/x4m637.png
>>>>
>>>> So nothing changed.
>>>
>>>
>>> You've to wait for KDE 4.1, or a bugfix release or build form the GIT.
>>
>>
>> I'm now on 4.10, and the problem persists :-(
>>
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Re: [kde] Klostski do not work

2013-03-08 Thread dE .

Maybe it's a part of game:find and report KDE bugs.

On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 10:52 PM, Carlos Luna  wrote:
> I`ve been trying to play a little with klotski game, but when I give a click 
> the button I try to move is duplicated to the place where I move it so the 
> screen of the game is then, full of blocks, couldn't move anything. What 
> could be the problem?
> Thanks in advance!
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Re: [kde] How can I bring back Konqueror as my man page viewer?

2013-03-10 Thread dE .

See, that's a different problem.

To see how exactly it works, you to refer man's man page; cause I
don't know how exactly man works. It happens that man can have
different man pages with similar names.

However if you try and open a man page pointing to it's exact path,
e.g /usr/share/man/man1/ls.1.bz2, kio wont remove the .bz2 extension.
So this sounds like a new bug.

On Sat, Mar 9, 2013 at 10:08 PM, Nikos Chantziaras  wrote:
> Example, enter "man:ls".  It's opened in Chrome normally, but it says
> there's two "ls" man pages.  Whichever one I select, it simply tries to
> download a temporary *.bz2 file.
>
>
> On 09/03/13 05:06, dE . wrote:
>>
>> On second thought, it works fine.
>>
>> How does the problem persist in your case?
>>
>> On Sat, Mar 9, 2013 at 8:31 AM, dE .  wrote:
>>>
>>> Looks like they didn't fix the bug; or there must've been a bug in this
>>> bugfix.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Mar 2, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Nikos Chantziaras 
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 27/08/12 18:17, dE . wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 08/21/12 10:01, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you.  I applied it and rebuilt.  It doesn't fix the problem.  It
>>>>>> only fixes a bug very specific to "man:tar".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is what happens when I type "man:tar":
>>>>>>
>>>>>>http://i46.tinypic.com/2yll3pl.png
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When I then click on the one I want, this happens:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>http://i50.tinypic.com/x4m637.png
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So nothing changed.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You've to wait for KDE 4.1, or a bugfix release or build form the GIT.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm now on 4.10, and the problem persists :-(
>
>
>
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[kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

2013-03-19 Thread dE .

This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.

I switched to KDE when it was at 4.4.

I personally, don't really mind the bugs, it reminds me how ignorant KDE
release team is; KDE was, is and never will be suited for the enterprise if
it continues these 6 months feature focused release cycles.

This mailing list is full of rants and complains and the KDE teams doesnt
give a damn.

Again --

We DON'T want features pouring@speed of light, we need STABILITY so KDE can
be _used_ by *common* people.

Increase the release cycles to 2 years, or don't have ANY such time
limiting goals; i.e. wait for the new release to become stable enough, and
provide bug backports for the current stable release.

Is Novel listening? I wonder how they manage with KDE.

This mail is for sake of the project, not for MY personal frustrations with
KDE. I deploy Xfce anyway.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=316850
https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=316947
https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=316946
https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=316842

On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 11:59 PM, An Nguyen wrote:

> On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 11:58 PM, dE .  wrote:
> > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
> >
> Any specific bugs?
>
> Just out of my curiosity.
> An.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

One of these appears to be a udisk problem.

On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 11:59 PM, An Nguyen wrote:

> On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 11:58 PM, dE .  wrote:
> > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
> >
> Any specific bugs?
>
> Just out of my curiosity.
> An.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

Gentoo with -semantic-desktop here.

On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 12:07 AM, Duncan <1i5t5.dun...@cox.net> wrote:

> dE . posted on Tue, 19 Mar 2013 22:28:48 +0530 as excerpted:
>
> > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
> >
> > I switched to KDE when it was at 4.4.
>
> That's strange.  Seems quite stable for me.
>
> But then again, I'm on gentoo and building with USE=-semantic-desktop,
> one of the original big bullet items for kde4, and have migrated off of
> anything kdepim related since kmail akonadified and destabilized, and off
> of konqueror when it became clear that even its devs apparently consider
> it no more than a toy, certainly not something worth the security
> attention necessary for online banking and the like (see my earlier posts
> on that).  So after all that's gone, for kde I'm mostly using the base
> desktop, kwin, plasma, and the infrastructure to support them, and while
> plasma in particular was HORRIBLE in early kde4 (even after the kde folks
> were insisting it was ready for ordinary users in 4.3, that was alpha,
> 4.4 was beta, late 4.5 finally stabilized reasonably such that 4.5.4 or
> so was what SHOULD have been released as 4.0), they're all reasonably
> stable now, and have been since 4.5 (with a blip in early 4.6).
>
> Altho plasma does sometimes eat its config for breakfast, a terrible
> thing if you're a heavy customizer as I am.  But I know the files to
> restore from backup when necessary...
>
> Oh, I install and play several of the kde games, too.
>
> But it's somewhat ironic that while late in the kde3 era I was trying to
> find a way to get rid of the last couple gtk2 apps I ran, these days
> nearly all my "mission critical" stuff is gtk2:  I always ran pan as a
> news (nntp) client and it was in fact one of the last gtk2 apps I was
> trying to get rid of in the late kde3 era, and then and now I start it
> with kde and it's seldom not running as long as I'm in X, but I switched
> from kmail and akregator to claws-mail (two separate instances start with
> kde, one for mail, one for feeds), and I run firefox now as my browser of
> choice.  Those are the most important here and they're now all gtk2
> based. Media apps: smplayer2 and vlc are qt4 based as is minitube, for
> video.  I run mpd with various switchable frontends (including mpc CLI
> and qtmpc in X), replacing the jumped-the-shark amarak.  Even my CD
> burner, which was kde-based k3b, is now... it's gtk2 based but actually I
> have to look... graveman, because k3b had a nasty dep on udisks, which
> wouldn't have been bad except for what IT pulled in (parted for udisks2,
> lvm2 for udisks1, both not something I want/need enough to be willing to
> continually build updates from source, as gentoo does.
>
> So now, my main dep on kde is just the core desktop environment itself,
> and that has been reasonably stable, even running the kde prereleases,
> which I can do now without too much fear, since I don't have to worry
> about pre-release kmail eating mail, or pre-release konqueror crashing
> when I need to epay a bill.  So again ironically, I'm freeer now to run
> the kde pre-releases than I was back when I was running more of kde than
> just the core desktop and a few games!
>
> So... while I started out disagreeing with you, I guess in the end, it
> may be that we're not talking about the same overall kde, since some
> parts of it kde4 or later development (cough, the kmail/akonadi fiasco)
> ruined to the point I migrated off of them, so I don't really know much
> about how the wider kde is doing, these days, only the core, which really
> has been quite stable for me, as I said since kde 4.5, with a blip in 4.6.
>
> Anyway, these days I really am quite upbeat about the core kde I actually
> still run, with anything akonadi/kdepim/semantic-desktop configured out
> and no longer allowed anywhere close to my systems. =:^)
>
> --
> Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
> "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
> and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman
>
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

I report all bugs in all projects.

On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 12:50 AM, Vincent-Xavier JUMEL <
endymion+...@thetys-retz.net> wrote:

> Le 19 mars à 17:58 dE . a écrit
>
>  This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
>>
>>  Please give some specific bug references.
>
> Did you ever report any of your bugs ?
>
> Please be more specific, or desist !
> --
> Vincent-Xavier JUMEL GPG Id: 0x2E14CE70 http://thetys-retz.net
>
> Rejoignez les 4870 adhérents de l'April http://www.april.org/adherer
> Parinux, logiciel libre à Paris : http://www.parinux.org
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

2013-03-21 Thread dE .

On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 8:24 PM, Ingo Malchow  wrote:

> Am Dienstag, 19. März 2013, 22:28:48 schrieb dE .:
> > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
> >
> > I switched to KDE when it was at 4.4.
> >
> > I personally, don't really mind the bugs, it reminds me how ignorant KDE
> > release team is; KDE was, is and never will be suited for the enterprise
> if
> > it continues these 6 months feature focused release cycles.
> >
> > This mailing list is full of rants and complains and the KDE teams doesnt
> > give a damn.
>
> This is a KDE user support list. By nature you won't find posts like "Hey,
> plasma is working, can you help me?"...
> But seriously, complaints are always the loudest. Personally i am running
> KDE
> *with* semantic desktop and kdepim, and it works very smooth. Note, this is
> personal experience in my own workflow and machine. This doesn't reflect
> any
> other situation. Do i ever write to such a list about my happyness with it?
> No. Happy users only rarely write something to mailinglists about thanking
> the
> devs.
> So even if this list is full of complaints, and - let's say - there are
> around
> 10 rants per month, nothing else, how does it compare to some million kde
> users worldwide? not at all. Hope you get the point.
>
>
There ain't many bug related complaints about Xfce -- it's a lot more
stable. I personally hardly found any bugs while using it.


> >
> > Again --
> >
> > We DON'T want features pouring@speed of light, we need STABILITY so KDE
> can
> > be _used_ by *common* people.
> >
> > Increase the release cycles to 2 years, or don't have ANY such time
> > limiting goals; i.e. wait for the new release to become stable enough,
> and
> > provide bug backports for the current stable release.
> >
> > Is Novel listening? I wonder how they manage with KDE.
> >
> > This mail is for sake of the project, not for MY personal frustrations
> with
> > KDE. I deploy Xfce anyway.
>
> It pretty much sounds like frustrations. You take your own unstable system
> for
> a global issue. Believe me, it is not. Neither do i say, as my system is
> highly stable every other system is as well.
> As you said you do report bugs, which is highly appreciated. But like with
> all
> bugs, they need to be reproducable, else they are hard to fix. The more
> useful
> information the better.
>
>
I'd the same issue with Debian testing; also distros wont upgrade to the
latest 'stable' KDE; they usually wait for the last bug fix release, or
even skip a whole major release.

Speaking of which KDE maybe an attractive option on Debian stable, cause
the bugs wont increment (with major versions) there.

You're basically trying to say here, I shouldn't complaint; and this's
exactly why the project is in such a horrible state. The reason why I'm
complaining is cause I want the situation to improve -- so does everyone
else.

The moment you open upgraded the KDE desktop you see bugs.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

2013-03-21 Thread dE .

On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 8:50 PM, Sérgio Basto  wrote:

> On Ter, 2013-03-19 at 22:28 +0530, dE . wrote:
> > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
> >
> Fedora 18 push it , and so far no bugs found .

There's a bug in that pager application, and a Fedora 18 user acknowledged
it the day after I filed it. They rather report this upstream cause this's
a KDE problem. I never report Gentoo bugs on these KDE issues.

KDE is at best untested. Bugs are right in front of you standing on the
desktops, and no developer or tester sees it until a bug has been filed and
a lot users complaint. This time, the pager and notification widgets have
bugs and both of them exist on the default desktop, yet no one noticed.

Major bugs persists for years on end with no solution in sight.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 9:03 PM, Ingo Malchow  wrote:

> Am Donnerstag, 21. März 2013, 20:47:12 schrieb dE .:
> > On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 8:24 PM, Ingo Malchow  wrote:
> > > Am Dienstag, 19. März 2013, 22:28:48 schrieb dE .:
> > > > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
> > > >
> > > > I switched to KDE when it was at 4.4.
> > > >
> > > > I personally, don't really mind the bugs, it reminds me how ignorant
> KDE
> > > > release team is; KDE was, is and never will be suited for the
> enterprise
> > >
> > > if
> > >
> > > > it continues these 6 months feature focused release cycles.
> > > >
> > > > This mailing list is full of rants and complains and the KDE teams
> > > > doesnt
> > > > give a damn.
> > >
> > > This is a KDE user support list. By nature you won't find posts like
> "Hey,
> > > plasma is working, can you help me?"...
> > > But seriously, complaints are always the loudest. Personally i am
> running
> > > KDE
> > > *with* semantic desktop and kdepim, and it works very smooth. Note,
> this
> > > is
> > > personal experience in my own workflow and machine. This doesn't
> reflect
> > > any
> > > other situation. Do i ever write to such a list about my happyness with
> > > it?
> > > No. Happy users only rarely write something to mailinglists about
> thanking
> > > the
> > > devs.
> > > So even if this list is full of complaints, and - let's say - there are
> > > around
> > > 10 rants per month, nothing else, how does it compare to some million
> kde
> > > users worldwide? not at all. Hope you get the point.
> >
> > There ain't many bug related complaints about Xfce -- it's a lot more
> > stable. I personally hardly found any bugs while using it.
> >
> > > > Again --
> > > >
> > > > We DON'T want features pouring@speed of light, we need STABILITY so
> KDE
> > >
> > > can
> > >
> > > > be _used_ by *common* people.
> > > >
> > > > Increase the release cycles to 2 years, or don't have ANY such time
> > > > limiting goals; i.e. wait for the new release to become stable
> enough,
> > >
> > > and
> > >
> > > > provide bug backports for the current stable release.
> > > >
> > > > Is Novel listening? I wonder how they manage with KDE.
> > > >
> > > > This mail is for sake of the project, not for MY personal
> frustrations
> > >
> > > with
> > >
> > > > KDE. I deploy Xfce anyway.
> > >
> > > It pretty much sounds like frustrations. You take your own unstable
> system
> > > for
> > > a global issue. Believe me, it is not. Neither do i say, as my system
> is
> > > highly stable every other system is as well.
> > > As you said you do report bugs, which is highly appreciated. But like
> with
> > > all
> > > bugs, they need to be reproducable, else they are hard to fix. The more
> > > useful
> > > information the better.
> >
> > I'd the same issue with Debian testing; also distros wont upgrade to the
> > latest 'stable' KDE; they usually wait for the last bug fix release, or
> > even skip a whole major release.
> >
> > Speaking of which KDE maybe an attractive option on Debian stable, cause
> > the bugs wont increment (with major versions) there.
> >
> > You're basically trying to say here, I shouldn't complaint; and this's
> > exactly why the project is in such a horrible state. The reason why I'm
> > complaining is cause I want the situation to improve -- so does everyone
> > else.
>
> I am quite fine with complaints, and yes, constructive criticism drives a
> project forward. Only that you shouldn't think that when you see bugs
> everyone
> else sees them as well, because...
>
> >
> > The moment you open upgraded the KDE desktop you see bugs.
>
> ... i did not see any showstopper bugs after upgrade. It just works.
>
> Ingo Malchow
>

And the inverse is also true, if you don't see bugs, doesn't mean bugs
don't exist.

KDE is used on different distros and hardware, with different backends;
maximum of which should be tested before deployment.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 9:09 PM, Kevin Krammer  wrote:

> On Thursday, 2013-03-21, dE . wrote:
>
> > I'd the same issue with Debian testing; also distros wont upgrade to the
> > latest 'stable' KDE; they usually wait for the last bug fix release, or
>
> Make sense, doesn't it?
> The x.y.0 version is always the start of a stabilization cycle, just like
> for
> the distributions themselves.
> It is like a slider from newest to stablest, depending on ones needs one
> needs
> to chose the right point in time.
>
> E.g. on my Kubuntu workstation I upgrade a couple of days before a new
> release
> comes up, thus getting the most stable version availale.
> On my Debian laptop I run Debian/Unstable, so I can't do that on
> distribution
> versions, but I can still wait for certain projects x.y.1 or x.y.2 before
> upgrading the respective packages.
>
> Servers with Debian/Stable are also not upgraded on release, admins test on
> separate machines until a minor release appears which meets their criteria.
> As far as I know that is even true for admins of Windows servers, i.e. they
> always wait for at least the first service pack before they consider
> deployment.
>
> I guess one could say that there are two cascades cycles:
> - development cycle: x.y -> x.y+1 -> ...
> - refinement/deployment cycle: x.y.z -> x.y.z+1
>
> The development cycle goes from basic features to advanced features, the
> deployment cycle from unstable to stable.
>
> Or like a matrix with basic/unstable in one corner, advanced/unstable in
> one
> direction, basic/stable in the other and advanced/stable in the opposite
> corner.
> Obviously both dimensions expanding over time :)
>
> Cheers,
> Kevin
>

Cause of this behaviour of distros, KDE gets less chance to get tested. The
only solution is to elongate the release cycles, that way, each version of
the DE gets tested slowly by every advanced users; so they face and report
bugs before the very end user face them.

And look -- Xfce and cdrtools do that. And a no. of bugs and regressions
have been ironed in the alpha release itself.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Myriam Schweingruber wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 4:17 PM, dE .  wrote:
> > On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 8:24 PM, Ingo Malchow  wrote:
> >>
> >> Am Dienstag, 19. März 2013, 22:28:48 schrieb dE .:
> >> > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
>
>
> Can't complain here, I use KDE since 4.2, and so far 4.10.1 runs rock
> stable, using Kubuntu 13.04 beta1
>
>
> >> > I personally, don't really mind the bugs, it reminds me how ignorant
> KDE
> >> > release team is;
>
>
> Calling people who work as volunteers and do contribute to KDE on a
> daily basis ignorants is a bit harsh, don't you think? So far I
> haven't seen you contribute to the release team and help making it
> better.
>
> ...
>
>
I'm asking the devs to work less and in a relaxed manner, and they've
problems with that. Everyone benefits that way. Bugs get fixed, devs are
less pressured on.

I'ld have absolutely not complained if this was not the 'stable' release,
but this's what KDE team calls stable and that's unacceptable.


>
> > There ain't many bug related complaints about Xfce -- it's a lot more
> > stable. I personally hardly found any bugs while using it.
> >
>
> Comparing apples with oranges, Xfce has only a fraction of the
> software that is shipped with a KDE SC release.
> ...
>

Another reason why KDE should have longer release cycle, and another reason
for the no. of bugs. Xfce being smaller, has longer releases, they wait for
years between major release, just testing it; KDE on the other hand, being
many times heavy has shorter release cycles.


> >> > This mail is for sake of the project, not for MY personal frustrations
> >> > with
> >> > KDE. I deploy Xfce anyway.
> ...
> >> It pretty much sounds like frustrations. You take your own unstable
> system
> >> for
> >> a global issue. Believe me, it is not. Neither do i say, as my system is
> >>
> >> highly stable every other system is as well.
> >> As you said you do report bugs, which is highly appreciated. But like
> with
> >> all
> >> bugs, they need to be reproducable, else they are hard to fix. The more
> >> useful
> >> information the better.
>
>
> Yep, I went through the bug reports you listed and can't reproduce any
> of those, so maybe something is specific to your installation.
>
> Did you try removing the configuration files from the previous
> installation? It might just be cruft lying around causing this, and
> since configuration files are very individual it is very hard to
> preserve those without any glitches from time to time. KDE upgrade
> don't remove them to avoid people loosing their setups, but sometimes
> it is just a good idea to move those old files out of the way and try
> with a default configuration
>
>
You know, that's practically not possible. No one's gonna do it. Instead
the DE components should checked for this since the bulk of KDE users
upgrade.


> ...
> > You're basically trying to say here, I shouldn't complaint; and this's
> > exactly why the project is in such a horrible state. The reason why I'm
> > complaining is cause I want the situation to improve -- so does everyone
> > else.
>
> Nobody said that, it is just that you are complaining in a very
> unprofessional way, by shouting and calling people ignorants, and
> judging your installation to be the only reference. Please do test
> with a new user to make sure it is not just your setup that has a
> problem before generalizing problems you see to be KDE's fault.
> Because if you want to give lessons on how to make it better, please
> do start doing that yourself :)
>
>
I do that always, unless I misinterpreted the cause of the bug.


>
> > The moment you open upgraded the KDE desktop you see bugs.
>
> Not here, on the contrary, KDE has become more stable and polished
> with every release.
>
> How about joining the testing team and help with testing before the
> release instead of just calling people names afterwards? If you want
> Free Software to get better you can contribute yourself, but please do
> it in a more constructive way.
>
>

I'm running on Gentoo, and I've to build the  release for the purpose,
which almost never works, and then reverting back becomes very difficult.
However I'm using the 'unstable' versions of KDE (relative to Gentoo,
according to which 4.9.5 is sable). This's solely for the purpose of
reporting bugs; but they almost never g

Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 12:45 AM, Anne Wilson  wrote:

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 21/03/13 15:22, dE . wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 8:50 PM, Sérgio Basto  > <mailto:ser...@serjux.com>> wrote:
> >
> > On Ter, 2013-03-19 at 22:28 +0530, dE . wrote:
> >> This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've
> >> seen.
> >>
> > Fedora 18 push it , and so far no bugs found .
> >
> >
> > There's a bug in that pager application, and a Fedora 18 user
> > acknowledged it the day after I filed it. They rather report this
> > upstream cause this's a KDE problem. I never report Gentoo bugs on
> > these KDE issues.
> >
> > KDE is at best untested. Bugs are right in front of you standing
> > on the desktops, and no developer or tester sees it until a bug has
> > been filed and a lot users complaint. This time, the pager and
> > notification widgets have bugs and both of them exist on the
> > default desktop, yet no one noticed.
> >
> > Major bugs persists for years on end with no solution in sight.
> >
> It's not enough to report a bug.  To get anything done you have to
> show exactly how to reproduce it, and this is often neglected.  I've
> seen bug reports with a "Needs Info" ticket stay like that for years.
>  The author of the bug gets an email asking for email, but for some
> reason never responds.  It's disheartening.
>
> You are often told that many developers are volunteers and lack time,
> but the real truth is that they never developed their mind-reading
> skills :-)
>
> Anne
>
>
I always do that, unless I realize the bug is hard to reproduce, and wont
affect many people. My attempt to report bugs is to take the bullet before
the very end user does.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 3:26 PM, Marek Kochanowicz  wrote:

> On sobota, 23 marca 2013 09:55:42 CEST, dE . wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Myriam Schweingruber > >wrote:
>>
>>  Hi all,
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 4:17 PM, dE .  wrote: ...
>>>
>> I'm asking the devs to work less and in a relaxed manner, and they've
>> problems with that. Everyone benefits that way. Bugs get fixed, devs are
>> less pressured on.
>>
>> I'ld have absolutely not complained if this was not the 'stable' release,
>> but this's what KDE team calls stable and that's unacceptable.
>>
>>
>>
>>>  There ain't many bug related complaints about Xfce -- it's a lot more
>>>> stable. I personally hardly found any bugs while using it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Comparing apples with oranges, Xfce has only a fraction of the
>>> software that is shipped with a KDE SC release.
>>> ...
>>>
>>>
>> Another reason why KDE should have longer release cycle, and another
>> reason
>> for the no. of bugs. Xfce being smaller, has longer releases, they wait
>> for
>> years between major release, just testing it; KDE on the other hand, being
>> many times heavy has shorter release cycles.
>>
>>
>>  ...
>>>>>>
>>>>> ... ...
>>>
>> You know, that's practically not possible. No one's gonna do it. Instead
>> the DE components should checked for this since the bulk of KDE users
>> upgrade.
>>
>>
>>  ... ...
>>>
>> I do that always, unless I misinterpreted the cause of the bug.
>>
>>
>>   ...
>>>
>>
>> I'm running on Gentoo, and I've to build the  release for the purpose,
>> which almost never works, and then reverting back becomes very difficult.
>> However I'm using the 'unstable' versions of KDE (relative to Gentoo,
>> according to which 4.9.5 is sable). This's solely for the purpose of
>> reporting bugs; but they almost never get fixed by the final stable
>> release.
>>
>> The best way to test is constant usability testing cause bugs never come
>> up
>> when you're searching for them; they come up when you seriously use it for
>> your real tasks.
>>
>>
>>
>>> Regards, Myriam
>>>
>>> PS. And BTW, you might have seen that we all sing with our names, how
>>> about signing your mails? Or is this on purpose to do anonymous
>>> ramblings? I am not going to call you what Slashdot would, though.
>>>
>>>
>> I prefer to remain anon. And I go by this name only.
>>
>>
>>
> Actually I think that you may be right, although I use 4.10.1 and I think
> it is a great and no new bugs encountred so far (pager works fine). At the
> moment KDE 4.9.5 is really feature complete and fully usable, there is no
> need since 4.6.5 to rush quickly with development cycle. 2 years is very
> long time but if 6 months is not enough then It should be elongated.

Longer release cycles ensure the thing gets tested on various platforms in
various ways, fixing bugs which otherwise developers won't notice.

As of the current time, release cycles are too fast; distro devs don't have
time to provide betas for official testing, and even if they do, it'll only
exist for a few weeks, or maybe a month, so they don't care.

The RC1 tags atlest should last 4 or 5 months so it easily enters the
official unstable (testing/keyworded/beta etc...) repository so people can
test it, and atleast devs should be given enough time to remove regressions
without hindering their personal lives and work.

There's very less time focused on testing; that should be increased, and
there's really no reason to hurry releases, no one complained KDE is empty
and featureless, but a lot complain about it's bugs and stability. This
should point to something.

Sorry:This discussion is getting a bit heavy, I'll take some time to
respond.
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Re: [kde] Plasma-desktop bug, desktop completely black but still able to open windows

On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 9:13 AM, Britt Mathis wrote:

> On 03/21/2013 04:45 PM, Duncan wrote:
>
>> Britt Mathis posted on Thu, 21 Mar 2013 13:29:20 -0400 as excerpted:
>>
>>  This is my first post to a mailing list ever, so I apologize in advance
>>> if this has already been resolved or I am in violation of post etiquette
>>> in some way.
>>>
>> FWIW, your post was quite good, with one exception.  Good: You included
>> the kde version, a reasonable description of the problem, and what you'd
>> done to narrow it down and/or try to fix it yourself (start plasma from
>> the command line, etc).  You'd be surprised at the number of people who
>> include no version information at all, or if they do, it's for some
>> distribution (not for kde) that others may or may not be at all familiar
>> with.  That's always frustrating as it's so simple to include, but takes
>> another round of question and reply to get when it's not included, and
>> there's often several rounds of that as it is.
>>
>> Single bad point:  Many list regulars have been working with computers
>> for quite some time, and are traditional enough to consider HTML messages
>> bad form, at minimum.  I do, but also realize that a lot of people don't
>> even know they're posting in HTML in the first place, until someone
>> requests they don't.  (Sometimes people who don't even like HTML
>> themselves end up posting in it themselves, if they're running a mailer
>> that defaults to HTML and "forgets" their preferences, and I get thanked
>> for pointing it out so they can fix it, so it's easy enough to do.)  From
>> this perspective, if it has to be dressed up in HTML to be worth reading,
>> it's not worth reading at all, and the people who post in HTML can be
>> broken down into four camps:  The spammers, who often use HTML to hide
>> some of their filter avoidance tricks, the malware folks (often a spammer
>> subtype), who use it to obfuscate links and try to trick people, and/or
>> to track readership without permission (web bugs), and/or to exploit a
>> known security vuln in some HTML parsing mail client or other, the people
>> who simply don't realize the problem or that they're doing it, and the
>> rude folks who simply don't care.  Fortunately, many people are in the
>> third category and only need it pointed out and they stop.  After all,
>> irritating the folks who might have your answer isn't generally a good
>> idea.
>>
>> (FWIW, your post had two portions, an HTML and a plain text portion.  But
>> had I been kill-filing all HTML messages as some do, I'd have never seen
>> the message and thus would have never replied...)
>>
>>  I am running KDE 4.10.1. Every time I customize the desktop and reboot,
>>> I still get the splash animation, but I am booted into a completely
>>> black screen. I am then able to use kRunner to open any application and
>>> the applications function normally. As far as I can tell this is
>>> specifically affecting plasma.
>>>
>> Yes.  KDE is deliberately modularized enough so that barring either two
>> different bugs or a single bug so bad it affects both, you'll always have
>> either krunner or plasma available to launch other apps with, even if the
>> other one has crashed, as plasma seems to be doing in your case.
>>
>>  When I try starting plasma for the command line, I get a lengthy error
>>> message (I can replicate this bug and post an exact message if you all
>>> would like). The main error is an X error, BadPixMap invalid parameter -
>>> 4.
>>>
>> Unfortunately, much of kde appears to be designed with the assumption
>> that nobody but the developers runs anything from the command line or
>> with STDOUT/STDERR redirected to a file in ordered to try to debug
>> problems.  As a result, when run from the command line or with STD*
>> captured, kde apps routinely spit out a huge amount of alarming looking
>> but non-fatal "noise" that's arguably of interest to the devs themselves,
>> but is just that, noise, to a power user or admin trying to debug a
>> problem, but who now can't see the real problem due to the volume of
>> "normal" messages, now noise hiding the signal of worth that he's trying
>> to find!
>>
>>  I googled this and didn't really get anything recent. I have managed to
>>> isolate this bug to when I resize my panel or when I add too many icons
>>> to my panel. Everything else survived rebooting several times.
>>>
>>> I appreciate any help you guys can give me. Again, I apologize if this
>>> has already been resolved.
>>>
>> Here's a few hints, anyway:
>>
>> 1) Important!  Please backup your $KDEHOME/share/config/plasma-**desktop-
>> appletsrc file.  ($KDEHOME defaulting to ~/.kde or sometimes ~/.kde4,
>> depending on distro.)  If this file gets corrupted, you lose all the
>> customizations you have and may need to start from the defaults, as while
>> it is a text-based file, it's too complex to /easily/ edit by hand.  At
>> least having a backup will let you easily restore it if necessary.  I've
>> ha

Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Sérgio Basto  wrote:

> On Qui, 2013-03-21 at 20:52 +0530, dE . wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 8:50 PM, Sérgio Basto 
> > wrote:
> > On Ter, 2013-03-19 at 22:28 +0530, dE . wrote:
> > > This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've
> > seen.
> > >
> >
> > Fedora 18 push it , and so far no bugs found .
> >
> > There's a bug in that pager application, and a Fedora 18 user
> > acknowledged it the day after I filed it. They rather report this
> > upstream cause this's a KDE problem. I never report Gentoo bugs on
> > these KDE issues.
> >
> > KDE is at best untested. Bugs are right in front of you standing on
> > the desktops, and no developer or tester sees it until a bug has been
> > filed and a lot users complaint. This time, the pager and notification
> > widgets have bugs and both of them exist on the default desktop, yet
> > no one noticed.
>
> What is the pager bug ? I have a pager very small , so doesn't affect
> me .
> About notifications , when over notification it will appears close
> bottom .
>
> Anything else ?
>

You need to enable it in pager settings>Display icons.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 4:08 PM, Myriam Schweingruber wrote:

> Hi Nikos,
>
> On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Nikos Chantziaras 
> wrote:
> > On 19/03/13 18:58, dE . wrote:
> >>
> >> This release of KDE (4.10.1), is till date the buggiest I've seen.
> >
> >
> > They've all been, in my case.  Not serious crasher bugs, but glitches
> > everywhere.  Of the very annoying, hair-pulling sort.  I did report all
> of
> > them, but no one cares though.
> >
> > The biggest issue is that with each new release, there's more glitches
> while
> > the old ones are still there.  They accumulate over time.  There doesn't
> > seem to be any stabilization going on with KDE.  It's always a race to
> the
> > next major version.
>
> Again, you are concluding from your experience to the general one.
> Please give me the bug reports so I can counter check. And make sure
> you ALWAYS test with a new user or move the old config files elsewhere
> when you do a major upgrade.
>
>
> Regards, myriam
>

If everyone's concluding the same way, there's something wrong with your
conclusions.

Also it doesn't appear to be a to be a coincidence, that only KDE team
members don't complain, and trying to defend the user's argument. The user
is the only one speaking the real thing, and their opinion should be
highest.

Their argument should never be cut, instead more information should be
asked.

Why dont you KDE people realized, that there're computer users out there,
who, after realizing the HUGE no. of bugs in one distro (using KDE as
default), will switch to another one without complaining? They almost the
whole of the KDE userbase.

Even Linus quit cause of too many bugs, and you still don't believe it.

Here, I'll give some e.gs --

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=293766

This's a confirmed Debian bug; that commenter didn't know I confirmed it on
Gentoo first, then reported it.

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=279569
https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=298916

Just look at this in general --

https://bugs.kde.org/buglist.cgi?emailreporter1=1&emailcc1=1&list_id=561527&bug_severity=critical&bug_severity=grave&bug_severity=major&bug_severity=crash&bug_severity=normal&emailtype1=exact&query_format=advanced&email1=de.techno%40gmail.com
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 5:04 PM, Myriam Schweingruber wrote:

> Hi Miroslav,
>
> On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Mirosław Zalewski
>  wrote:
> > On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Nikos Chantziaras 
> wrote:
> >> The biggest issue is that with each new release, there's more glitches
> >> while the old ones are still there.
> >
> > On 22/03/2013 at 11:38, Myriam Schweingruber  wrote:
> >> And make sure you ALWAYS test with a new user or move the old config
> files
> >> elsewhere when you do a major upgrade.
> >
> > Myriam, this is exactly Nikos point. Old config files laying around
> causes
> > various issues with KDE SC. By encouraging him to triage bugs on fresh
> config,
> > you admit that.
> >
> > I think that this is huge drawback of KDE SC. As user, I am forced to
> recreate
> > my carefully crafted configuration from scratch with each major update.
> Do I
> > remember what exactly did I change and where? No, I have better things
> to do.
> > Starting from fresh config, I only discover that something I am used to
> does
> > not work. Then I go into System settings and try to find relevant option.
> > Recreating configuration is not matter of two or three hours; it's
> matter of
> > days during which my work is not effective, because I am constantly
> disturbed
> > with changes I have to make.
> >
> > Or I can save myself some hustle and start from fresh config, but copy
> some old
> > files over. But this way I am forced to dive into KDE SC internals and
> > understand purpose of each file (to be able to judge whether I should
> copy it
> > or not). Do I want to? No, I have other things to do.
> >
> > Honestly, why can't KDE SC support seamless update from previous major
> > release? Is it too much work to rewrite config files whose format has
> changed?
>
> It is almost impossible, since the user can dramatically modify the
> original configuration and automating the process of wading through
> often illogical configuration files with triple definitions and
> contradictory instructions set by the user is a a lot of work. Wiping
> them is not an option as the user would loose configurations. That is
> the downside of a highly customisable desktop environment, and that
> possibility of customisation is one of the main reasons most user
> actually choose KDE over other desktops.
>

There's no project in in the world which expects users to clean configs
manually before installation, except for an overhaul releases; where in
most cases a different config directory is chose.

Also, are these instructions official?

BUT, the bug should be checked as a new user; this helps diagnose the cause
of the problem.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

2013-03-24 Thread dE .

On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 12:19 PM, Felix Miata  wrote:

> On 2013-03-23 02:10 (GMT+0200) Nikos Chantziaras composed:
>
>
>  The way things are, there's never gonna be a stable KDE version.  Not in
>> a billion years.
>>
>
> You mean besides the one that already exists? KDE3 -> TDE, not to mention
> openSUSE's KDE3, where the only work done is keeping it building and
> eradicating bugs, adding no new "features".
>
>
That's MUCH better than the current KDE.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

2013-03-24 Thread dE .

On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 5:58 PM, Ingo Malchow  wrote:

> Am Freitag, 22. März 2013, 13:15:07 schrieb Mirosław Zalewski:
> > On 22/03/2013 at 12:34, Myriam Schweingruber  wrote:
> > > It is almost impossible, since the user can dramatically modify the
> > > original configuration and automating the process of wading through
> > > often illogical configuration files with triple definitions and
> > > contradictory instructions set by the user is a a lot of work
> >
> > I think there are two important things to note:
> > (1) config files are created by KDE SC, not by users with text editors
>
> This is an assumption and hopefully no dev ever thinks the same way. Config
> files are text files and CAN be edited by anyone. And guess what, they are
> quite
> often edited by hand. You need to think in the big picture. What will your
> users do with what you provide?
> But nevertheless...
>

No your's is an assumption and you're guessing.

Off the millions of users, only devs have the patience and knowledge to
edit those. Users edit them to workaround bugs.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

2013-03-24 Thread dE .

On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Kevin Krammer  wrote:

> On Saturday, 2013-03-23, dE . wrote:
>
> > Cause of this behaviour of distros, KDE gets less chance to get tested.
> The
> > only solution is to elongate the release cycles, that way, each version
> of
> > the DE gets tested slowly by every advanced users; so they face and
> report
> > bugs before the very end user face them.
>
> I am not sure I understand this fully, isn't this what already happens?
>
> Due to the way of how distributions undergo their development cycles it
> effectively already increased the testing phase for software they contain.
> First each software is tested by the respective community's beta testers,
> then
> each software is tested even more widely by the distribution's beta phase
> and
> after that by its early upgraders.
> I would guess that at the point a normal user upgrades the software has
> been
> in testing for a couple of months, maybe even half a year.
>
> Lets have a look at the most recent version
> KDE SC 4.10 Beta 1 tag was in November 2012 at which point it is most
> likely
> tested by KDE beta testers. This continues until February 2013 (about three
> months).
>
> If we take openSUSE as an example distribution, its respective release is
> March 2013, adding another monthof testing by people who build from source.
> The test audience at this point has expanded to include early upgraders of
> openSUSE.
>
>
What about beta2?

As stated before, the best way to find bugs is constant usability testing.
Beta 1 and beta 2 have a few days in between releases, so what do you
expect these testers to upgraded every day and yet use their system
normally? Instead they attempt to just see if everything works externally,
and upgrade to the next beta. The same happens with RC releases. These
frequent releases cause confusion. By the time you find a bug for RC1, RC2
is already out, and the devs in the bugzilla will ask for you to upgrade.
Who has that much of patience?

If you want constant usability testing, the target userbase should be
somewhere between devs and end users; these people want a usable system,
and don't mind testing. But for that to happen the releases should be slow,
so it reaches them and it's convenient to them.

The current schedule adds a lot of workload.

Also real testing starts with RC after the freeze -- which ensures no new
bugs. But unfortunately, there's not even a month between RC3 and the
freeze -- how do you expect to find new bugs in a few weeks?

The final (stable) release is hurried up for January; so what do you
expect, a rock solid DE?

Instead there should be 3 or 4 months between RCs, so bug can be collected
and the RC releases reach across layers of users; it shouldn't happen that
before the release reaches the user, it becomes outdated by 2 other
releases.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

7;m now much freeer to run and /enjoy/ running the kde
> pre-releases. =:^)
>
> And it also means if kde pulls the kde4 stunt again, since it's only the
> core kde desktop and a few games I'm running now, it'll be MUCH easier to
> drop it entirely, if I have to.
>
> Fortunately, kde5 aka kde frameworks is supposed to be a much less
> disruptive upgrade, and it's going much more modular as well, so it's
> much less likely.  But THIS time I'm prepared, should it happen.  I won't
> be caught not viably being able to switch, again.
>
> Which is even more proof that kde's not going to drop the ball that way
> again, because I'm actually prepared for it now, so of course it's not
> going to happen. =;^]
>
> Of course there's the possible upcoming xorg -> wayland switch to worry
> about too.  That could really upset the Linux desktop environment status
> quo in all sorts of interesting ways and I think most of the leading DEs
> realize that.  But again, I'm much better prepared now, so regardless of
> how it turns out or what DE and apps I end up running on wayland and what
> kind of promises DEs and their devs make that they ultimately end up
> dropping like yesterday's dead fish in a malfunctioning refrigerator, I
> expect that switch to be far less personally disruptive than the kde3 ->
> kde4 upgrade was.  Which means to a certain extent I'll be able to sit
> back and enjoy the ride instead of sweating it out so badly this time,
> and I really am looking forward to that. =:^)
>
> --
> Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
> "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
> and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman
>
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 5:10 PM, Duncan <1i5t5.dun...@cox.net> wrote:
>
> dE . posted on Sat, 23 Mar 2013 14:25:42 +0530 as excerpted:
>
> >> > The moment you open upgraded the KDE desktop you see bugs.
> >>
> >> Not here, on the contrary, KDE has become more stable and polished with
> >> every release.
> >>
> >> How about joining the testing team and help with testing before the
> >> release instead of just calling people names afterwards? If you want
> >> Free Software to get better you can contribute yourself, but please do
> >> it in a more constructive way.
> >>
> > I'm running on Gentoo, and I've to build the  release for the
> > purpose, which almost never works, and then reverting back becomes very
> > difficult.
>
> (As another gentooer...) Not really.  No need for the live- unless
> you really want it, and that's not what Myriam was referring to.
>
> What Myriam was suggesting (I know because I saw the same testing-team
> invitation in the 4.10-pre-release announcements as well, with similar
> but a bit more detailed wording) was to run the kde pre-release betas and
> release-candidates and if desired, participate in the more organized pre-
> release testing program kde's doing now with them.
>
> While the stable bugfix updates appear on a monthly cycle (with feature
> release updates on a semi-annual cycle), the pre-releases appear on a
> condensed two-week cycle, with 4-5 pre-releases before the 4.y.0 feature
> release.
>
> Beta1 aka 4.x.80 (so the upcoming 4.11 pre-releases will start with beta1
> as 4.10.80) typically appears a week after hard-feature-freeze, with
> 4.11's hard-feature-freeze scheduled for June 5, 2013 and beta1 (aka
> 4.10.80 tagging and release a week later on Wednesday, June 12.
>
> 4.11 beta2 aka 4.10.90 is scheduled two weeks later, Wednesday, June 26.
>
> 4.11 rc1 aka 4.10.95 is due after the hard API/Message/Artwork/Bindings
> and Docs freeze (July 8), with tagging and release scheduled for
> Wednesday July 10, two weeks after beta2.
>
> 4.11 rc2 aka 4.10.97 is due two weeks later, on Wednesday July 24, with
> the final 4.11.0 feature release currently scheduled, assuming everything
> goes well up to then, for Wednesday Aug 7.
>
> However, it's worth noting that for 4.10 some blocker bugs were
> discovered during testing, and a third rc was added, delaying 4.10.0 a
> couple extra weeks to ensure a smoother general release.
>
> KDE's schedules and feature plans are released publicly (with the caveat
> that they're tentative and subject to change), BTW, with links to the
> schedules/plans for each feature release found on kde techbase, here:
>
> http://techbase.kde.org/Schedules
>
> The testing-team invitation I mentioned above appeared with the
> announcement for 4.10-rc1 (I just checked the beta announcements and
> didn't see it there), which can be found here (see the testing and
> getting involved sections):
>
> http://www.kde.org/announcements/announce-4.10-rc1.php
>
> Quoting:
>
> KDE is running an extra detailed beta-testing program throughout the 4.10
> beta and RC releases. [...]   Beta Testing Program is structured so that
> any KDE user can give back to KDE, regardless of their skill level. If
> you want to be part of this quality improvement program, please contact
> the Team on the IRC channel #kde-quality on freenode.net. The Team
> Leaders want to know ahead of time who is involved in order to coordinate
> all of the testing activities. They are also committed to having this
> project be fun and rewarding. After checking in, you can install the beta
> through your distribution package manager. The KDE Community wiki has
> instructions. This page will be updated as beta packages for other
> distributions become available. With the beta installed, you can proceed
> with testing. Please contact the Team on IRC #kde-quality if you need
> help getting started.
>
> There's a link to the mentioned wiki as well as distro-specific testing
> instructions.  For gentoo, the gentoo/kde project overlay, the same place
> you'll find the -live-build versions, carries the pre-releases.
>
> I started running the pre-releases with the 4.7 rcs and have run them all
> since, tho I choose not to run the live-versions.  That's why I know so
> much about them.  However, I don't do IRC and didn't do the special
> testing program; I've just run the betas, filing a couple bugs as I found
> them, but most of the ones I've found have been gentoo/kde project
> packaging bugs (generally minor dependency issues since I run a much
> leaner kde desktop th

Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 6:42 PM, Leon Feng  wrote:
> 2013/3/23 Kevin Krammer 
>>
>> On Saturday, 2013-03-23, dE . wrote:
>>
>> > Cause of this behaviour of distros, KDE gets less chance to get tested.
>> > The
>> > only solution is to elongate the release cycles, that way, each version
>> > of
>> > the DE gets tested slowly by every advanced users; so they face and
>> > report
>> > bugs before the very end user face them.
>>
>> I am not sure I understand this fully, isn't this what already happens?
>>
>> Due to the way of how distributions undergo their development cycles it
>> effectively already increased the testing phase for software they contain.
>> First each software is tested by the respective community's beta testers,
>> then
>> each software is tested even more widely by the distribution's beta phase
>> and
>> after that by its early upgraders.
>> I would guess that at the point a normal user upgrades the software has
>> been
>> in testing for a couple of months, maybe even half a year.
>>
>> Lets have a look at the most recent version
>> KDE SC 4.10 Beta 1 tag was in November 2012 at which point it is most
>> likely
>> tested by KDE beta testers. This continues until February 2013 (about
>> three
>> months).
>>
>> If we take openSUSE as an example distribution, its respective release is
>> March 2013, adding another monthof testing by people who build from
>> source.
>> The test audience at this point has expanded to include early upgraders of
>> openSUSE.
>>
>> Not sure how long each update interval for openSUSE is but if we assume
>> one
>> month, then enthusiastic users who are not early upgraders will probably
>> wait
>> for the first of those, more cautious users even for the second or third.
>>
>> So depending where such users are comfort zone wise, the time between
>> start of
>> testing and deployment will be four and six months.
>
> KDE release time is not the time it hit all users. The testing time is
> very different based on distros.
>
> Usually Arch and [gentoo testing] is the first. They usually start
> using a upstream released version within days or even hours.
>
> Then Fedora, Ubuntu, Opensuse ... They usually have 6 months or 8
> months release time and alpha\beta test. If their is cirtical bugs,
> they usually provide theri own patch. They provide seperate repo for
> advance users to upgrade immediately.
>
> Then Debian. [gentoo stable]. They usually do not release when there
> is still bugs exits. The time between Arch release and Debian release
> can be as long as 1-2 years. For debian stable users, the testing time
> is very long here.
>
> I checked gentoo's wiki here: [http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/KDE] KDE
> 4.10 is still in testing, Gentoo has not releas it yet. So dE, are you
> using testing and complain KDE is not tested before release?
>

4.10 is keyworded, meaning it's lacking testing, but no major bugs
have been found yet.

This's different from KDE release cycles, and the bugs I've complained
about (except 1) are not Gentoo specific.

Besides I'm talking about general KDE stable releases.

> You can tell gentoo KDE maintainer not to mask KDE4.10 as stable if
> you think your bugs will hit normal gentoo users. As far as I see, no
> other distro can reproduce your bugs. Maybe it is distro specific. Or
> if you really really want stable and no bugs, use gentoo stable or
> Debian stable. You should stop using Gentoo testing.
>
> Feng Chao
>

The sole reason why I'm using Gentoo testing is to test the new release.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 7:26 PM, Leon Feng  wrote:
> 2013/3/23 dE . :
>>
>> Longer release cycles ensure the thing gets tested on various platforms in
>> various ways, fixing bugs which otherwise developers won't notice.
>>
>> As of the current time, release cycles are too fast; distro devs don't have
>> time to provide betas for official testing, and even if they do, it'll only
>> exist for a few weeks, or maybe a month, so they don't care.
>>
>> The RC1 tags atlest should last 4 or 5 months so it easily enters the
>> official unstable (testing/keyworded/beta etc...) repository so people can
>> test it, and atleast devs should be given enough time to remove regressions
>> without hindering their personal lives and work.
>>
>> There's very less time focused on testing; that should be increased, and
>> there's really no reason to hurry releases, no one complained KDE is empty
>> and featureless, but a lot complain about it's bugs and stability. This
>> should point to something.
>>
>> Sorry:This discussion is getting a bit heavy, I'll take some time to
>> respond.
>
> There is one proven principle in Open source process: "Release early,
> release often".
>

Ok, now the market share of Linux desktops makes sense.

> The different between Linux world and Windows world is therea are many
> distros to deliver an upstream release software on different time and
> testing coverage. There are users who want new thing. And there are
> users who want stable thing. They fulfill it by chosing different
> distro. We should not block new KDE release from Arch users just
> because Debian stable is still testing and fix bugs.
>

Arch and Gentoo users always have version control; Arch can tag them
like, KDE--25th march etc... like a rolling release.
Alternatively, KDE can tag it with the next release (4.11 as of now)
and release them on periodic bases for testing.

But for the rest, they need time.

> As a long time gentoo user, though now using Arch, I am a little sad
> that such complain comes from a gentoo user.
>
> Gentoo users are the nearest to the source. Every gentoo system is
> building from source. So in the past, when bugs show up, a gentooer
> will not hesitate to check the source and fix it. Then the fix is send
> upstream so other distro will benifit. The portage is most powerful
> building system to assist this work flow. Does this tradition slowly
> go away along with the shrinking user base?
>

Here I didn't mean to talk about Gentoo problems; there are problems
in general. Gentoo and Arch are not the end of testing platforms.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?

On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Anne Wilson
 wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 23/03/13 13:08, dE . wrote:
>> There's very less time focused on testing; that should be
>> increased, and there's really no reason to hurry releases, no one
>> complained KDE is empty and featureless, but a lot complain about
>> it's bugs and stability. This should point to something.
>>
>> Sorry:This discussion is getting a bit heavy, I'll take some time
>> to respond.
>
> No distro forces you to use the latest of everything.  Usually any
> version is supported for at least a few months after the release of a
> new one, so you can always stick with that.
>
> You claim to be happy to help test, yet you complain constantly.
> Let's try for some facts.

I'm complaining right now, cause I see all this in the stable release (4.10.1).

This makes early testing the releases more important, cause it
reflects the state of KDE.

> Have you any idea how many different graphics cards are in use by the
> KDE community - i.e. by all users?  Sound cards?  and that's just the
> obvious ones.  How is any developer going to test every one of those?
>  It's simply not possible.  Early adopters choose to be guinea pigs,
> helping testing.  If you or anyone else doesn't want to be in that
> situation, simply stick with the older version.

Thats's exactly why there should be more time to test RCs and the RC
releases should be slow.

Not everyone runs the same distro, or hardware, so KDE should be
tested for maximum backends and libraries, which may revile new bugs;
which as of the current time hits end users, and after that bugs are
reported, which often lasts for years, cause devs are busy preparing
for the next release.
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?