KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
Working 64 hours a week makes you crabby Scott. Take a break and drop off the net for a while. Ron Freiberger mailto: rfreiber...@swfla.rr.com FYI: I work in the Boeing Phantom Work's, on a program with a very, VERY compressed, aggressive schedule. For the last 3 weeks, I've been putting in 64+ hour work-weeks. Please believe me: I love my work, and truly enjoy the team of talented people that I have the pleasure of working with., as I'm not complaining. Seems more like being a whiny-ass to UNSUBSCRIBE from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
In a message dated 1/23/2004 9:24:56 PM US Mountain Standard Time, rfreiber...@swfla.rr.com writes: >FYI: I work in the Boeing Phantom Work's, on a program with a very, VERY >compressed, aggressive schedule. For the last 3 weeks, I've been putting in >64+ hour work-weeks SEE! That's all people do in here is fight! Chris Theroux Gilbert, AZ
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
Scott Cable wrote: > Oscar, Joe, and KRNetters, > Your comments are certainly not appreciated and are certainly offensive... Scott, I'm beginning to see a pattern here. Two weeks ago you got all bent out of shape over a good-natured poke that Pat Panzera took at engineers, and quit CorAircraft in a huff, despite the fact that you're just about the ONLY guy on the list that took the comments as offensive. Then you ratcheted up your noise level on KRnet by poo-pooing Corvairs, and automotive conversions in general, in aircraft, which is what 98% of KRnetters are flying. I knew it would just be a matter of before you'd be gone from here too (although I see you're still a member, despite "I'm Outta Here..." subject line). And I had to laugh when you sent me a message the other day about the viability of using a 6 cylinder Porsche engine with bored out monster-sized aftermarket VW cylinders, right after your diatribe on the fallacy of using automotive conversions in aircraft. You've just got to wonder. I pretty much just quit posting because despite the fact that I could have argued all day long about automotive conversions, and several of the other things that you've had "strong" opinions over, I didn't want to waste my time doing it. There comes a point when you just ask yourself "why bother?", and I reached that point about two weeks ago. Often when somebody starts trotting out all their engineering credentials, it's a good sign that their arguments aren't going well, and they're now relying on diplomas or job titles to add credence to their position. You had quite a list. I think the way to convince other list members of your expertise is with well-thought-out advice that makes sense, and after a while they'll KNOW who the experts are. As for the punctuation and capitalization thing, I wish I'd never mentioned it. I never dreamed that it would get blown so far out of proportion. And you were the guy that took it to extremes. When I saw that post where you corrected Mac's spelling, I knew that you'd be gone shortly, so I didn't even comment. As I mentioned earlier, I can understand the spelling problems. Some people's email doesn't even include a spellchecker, or their spellchecker may be in a whole other language. That's understandable. All I was asking for was a capital letter at the beginning and a period at the end. That by itself goes a long way in making a string of words understandable. I sent it to the list in an effort to make all of the offenders aware that it was a concern, but I didn't beat anybody over the head with it! Oscar's point was basically that Mac is a flying member of the KR community, and as such is too valuable to make fun of and run off. We just don't have many of them that will post to the list. I can't think of a single soul that OZ has ticked off over the years, but we can now start that list with you at the top. My guess is that it will remain a short list. The worst thing is that you flamed Mac, but didn't bother to actually ANSWER his question! I'm sure with your background, you knew that temperature changes incurred between summer and winter months can contribute to that (see http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/tirepressure.gif ). Some people read messages to see if they can help answer them, and others looks for things to pick at or get upset about. There are diplomatic or good-natured ways of getting your point across. Face it Scott, you're a bit of a hot-head, despite the fact that you're a talented guy with some good suggestions and advice, emotionally you really don't have what it takes to participate in an internet mailing list. I appreciate your help and advice to other netters, but you'd be better off lurking. Below is a comment I got from a veteran KRnetter this morning, and I agree wholeheartedly. "I don't know how much you've been monitoring the net lately but Scott Cable is gone. I guess my only comment is he who steps in front of Mack trucks should not complain about the surgery to remove chrome bulldog from forehead". Well, there goes another perfectly good hour of KR building time down the drain... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
Scott Shame on you, you misspelt hieroglyphic >take time to read, re-read, and decipher someone's hiroglyphic messages? >meaning that that person's time is more important than someone else's? > this forum is for fun > very, VERY compressed, aggressive schedule. For the last 3 weeks, I've been > putting in 64+ hour work-weeks. > get some rest, decompress It might help you quit being so critical. Maybe you could look at the people beyond the spelling eh? Carlos Romero
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
Mark, good rebuttal but get back to work on the KR !. I want to see you flying in to the Gathering this year ! in your own KR , I mean... Cheers Chris Gardiner - Original Message - From: "Mark Langford" <n5...@hiwaay.net> To: "KR builders and pilots" <kr...@mylist.net> Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 11:54 AM Subject: Re: KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here. > Scott Cable wrote: > > > Oscar, Joe, and KRNetters, > > Your comments are certainly not appreciated and are certainly offensive... > > Scott, I'm beginning to see a pattern here. Two weeks ago you got all bent > out of shape over a good-natured poke that Pat Panzera took at engineers, > and quit CorAircraft in a huff, despite the fact that you're just about the > ONLY guy on the list that took the comments as offensive. Then you > ratcheted up your noise level on KRnet by poo-pooing Corvairs, and > automotive conversions in general, in aircraft, which is what 98% of > KRnetters are flying. I knew it would just be a matter of before you'd be > gone from here too (although I see you're still a member, despite "I'm Outta > Here..." subject line). > > And I had to laugh when you sent me a message the other day about the > viability of using a 6 cylinder Porsche engine with bored out monster-sized > aftermarket VW cylinders, right after your diatribe on the fallacy of using > automotive conversions in aircraft. You've just got to wonder. > > I pretty much just quit posting because despite the fact that I could have > argued all day long about automotive conversions, and several of the other > things that you've had "strong" opinions over, I didn't want to waste my > time doing it. There comes a point when you just ask yourself "why > bother?", and I reached that point about two weeks ago. > > Often when somebody starts trotting out all their engineering credentials, > it's a good sign that their arguments aren't going well, and they're now > relying on diplomas or job titles to add credence to their position. You > had quite a list. I think the way to convince other list members of your > expertise is with well-thought-out advice that makes sense, and after a > while they'll KNOW who the experts are. > > As for the punctuation and capitalization thing, I wish I'd never mentioned > it. I never dreamed that it would get blown so far out of proportion. And > you were the guy that took it to extremes. When I saw that post where you > corrected Mac's spelling, I knew that you'd be gone shortly, so I didn't > even comment. As I mentioned earlier, I can understand the spelling > problems. Some people's email doesn't even include a spellchecker, or their > spellchecker may be in a whole other language. That's understandable. All > I was asking for was a capital letter at the beginning and a period at the > end. That by itself goes a long way in making a string of words > understandable. I sent it to the list in an effort to make all of the > offenders aware that it was a concern, but I didn't beat anybody over the > head with it! > > Oscar's point was basically that Mac is a flying member of the KR community, > and as such is too valuable to make fun of and run off. We just don't have > many of them that will post to the list. I can't think of a single soul > that OZ has ticked off over the years, but we can now start that list with > you at the top. My guess is that it will remain a short list. > > The worst thing is that you flamed Mac, but didn't bother to actually ANSWER > his question! I'm sure with your background, you knew that temperature > changes incurred between summer and winter months can contribute to that > (see http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/tirepressure.gif ). > > Some people read messages to see if they can help answer them, and others > looks for things to pick at or get upset about. There are diplomatic or > good-natured ways of getting your point across. Face it Scott, you're a bit > of a hot-head, despite the fact that you're a talented guy with some good > suggestions and advice, emotionally you really don't have what it takes to > participate in an internet mailing list. I appreciate your help and advice > to other netters, but you'd be better off lurking. > > Below is a comment I got from a veteran KRnetter this morning, and I agree > wholeheartedly. > > "I don't know how much you've been monitoring the net lately but > Scott Cable is gone. I guess my only comment is he who steps > in front of Mack trucks should not complain about the surgery to > remove chrome bulldog from forehead". > > Well, there goes another perfectly good hour of KR building time down the > drain... > > Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL > N56ML "at" hiwaay.net > see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford > > > > ___ > to UNSUBSCRIBE from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
Well since I work for Mack Trucks Inc at the World Headquarters in Allentown Pa, I can tell you if that Bulldog gets anywhere near your face some serious plastic surgery will be required. As far as Mac goes I met him at the VAEAA 2 yrs ago and he is far from stupid, but is very enthusiastic about flying his KR. I never went farther than high school but I built a KR2S (6399U) that I'm quite proud of, so if I can't spell aronotical enginear I guess I are one. Lets drop this now please!!! On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 10:54:27 -0600 "Mark Langford"
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
I realize that I'm a new member her and as such I might have missed quite a few things but one thing does stand out above all else in this banter and that is people worried about punctuation and unwillingness to "experiment" with new ideas. I have watched with interest the progress Mark has made and the method in which he has gone about his project. First let me qualify myself by stating that had it not been for Mark and many other KR Netters, I would not be here as it was they who piqued my interest in the KR series of aircraft. As a first time builder, long time experimenter and high time helicopter/fixed wing pilot my interest was in a high performance, easy to build, cheap and versatile aircraft to play with and fine tune to my particular flying tastes. I'm sure that is why there are so many of these aircraft flying or under construction. Next, many of us cannot afford to plop down 100 or 200 thousand dollars on a brand spanking new or even used aircraft for that matter. Some people need to be reminded from time to time that these aircraft are not classed as experimental just because the powers to be had no where else to stick them. They also need reminding that the first planes that flew were powered by automotive engines. And yes, they even need reminding that the brilliant minds (engineers?) of their day told Wilbur and Orville that they were nuts. If spelling, grammar, an engineering degree are prerequisites of flying, I do believe that we'd all still be riding trains across the country and ships across oceans. Anyone who has ever read any of Bob Hoover's posting has to laugh at the absurdity of the connection of grammar and flying ability or engineering abilities. Some of the finest contributors to our sport were not engineers, they were what people called "dreamers". If it were not for these dreamers, where would we be? In conclusion I would respectfully submit that anyone that feels the same as Scott should use the delete key or better yet only reply when they have something of value to contribute. Thank you. CW2 Douglas J. Rupert U.S. Army Retired RR # 2 Simcoe Ontario drup...@sympatico.ca -Original Message- From: krnet-boun...@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-boun...@mylist.net] On Behalf Of cgardn628 Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 1:19 PM To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here. Mark, good rebuttal but get back to work on the KR !. I want to see you flying in to the Gathering this year ! in your own KR , I mean... Cheers Chris Gardiner - Original Message - From: "Mark Langford" <n5...@hiwaay.net> To: "KR builders and pilots" <kr...@mylist.net> Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 11:54 AM Subject: Re: KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here. > Scott Cable wrote: > > > Oscar, Joe, and KRNetters, > > Your comments are certainly not appreciated and are certainly offensive... > > Scott, I'm beginning to see a pattern here. Two weeks ago you got all bent > out of shape over a good-natured poke that Pat Panzera took at engineers, > and quit CorAircraft in a huff, despite the fact that you're just about the > ONLY guy on the list that took the comments as offensive. Then you > ratcheted up your noise level on KRnet by poo-pooing Corvairs, and > automotive conversions in general, in aircraft, which is what 98% of > KRnetters are flying. I knew it would just be a matter of before you'd be > gone from here too (although I see you're still a member, despite "I'm Outta > Here..." subject line). > > And I had to laugh when you sent me a message the other day about the > viability of using a 6 cylinder Porsche engine with bored out monster-sized > aftermarket VW cylinders, right after your diatribe on the fallacy of using > automotive conversions in aircraft. You've just got to wonder. > > I pretty much just quit posting because despite the fact that I could have > argued all day long about automotive conversions, and several of the other > things that you've had "strong" opinions over, I didn't want to waste my > time doing it. There comes a point when you just ask yourself "why > bother?", and I reached that point about two weeks ago. > > Often when somebody starts trotting out all their engineering credentials, > it's a good sign that their arguments aren't going well, and they're now > relying on diplomas or job titles to add credence to their position. You > had quite a list. I think the way to convince other list members of your > expertise is with well-thought-out advice that makes sense, and after a > while they'll KNOW who the experts are. > > As for the punctuation and capitalization thing, I wish I'd never mentioned > it. I never dreamed that it would get blown so far out of pro
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
Boy and Girls, Please can we call it all a draw, and end it. And please Scott stay on the net, You all or should I say WE all have the right of free speech, but lets not go over board. I have noticed on many of my postings, and even after I have done a spell check, I was embarrassed when I have read some of the thing I have sent in. We are all not perfect, but please keep up the great KR information network Phil Matheson mathe...@dodo.com.au Australia 61 3 58833588 See our VW Engines and home built Parts and Kits at: http://www.vw-engines.com/ www.homebuilt-aviation.com
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
1. We keep on Mark's nerves. And he may do like Dana and build a spam can. 2 . We can all show up at Dana's party, (I read all invited) an duce it out. 3. Or drop it. I vote for #3 Jim - Original Message - From: "Phillip Matheson" <mathe...@dodo.com.au> To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net> Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 4:38 PM Subject: Re: KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here. > Boy and Girls, > Please can we call it all a draw, and end it. > And please Scott stay on the net, You all or should I say WE all have the > right of free speech, but lets not go over board. I have noticed on many of > my postings, and even after I have done a spell check, I was embarrassed > when I have read some of the thing I have sent in. We are all not perfect, > but please keep up the great KR information network > > Phil Matheson > mathe...@dodo.com.au > Australia > 61 3 58833588 > See our VW Engines and home built Parts > and Kits at: > http://www.vw-engines.com/ > www.homebuilt-aviation.com > > > > ___ > to UNSUBSCRIBE from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html
KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.....
Dear Scott;
I own plans, am restoring from different editions, adding subsequuent
add-ons and am new to KRNet. We appreciate your expert input, especially
being from Boeing
design group. Please don't let this minor incident push you
away from the many appreciative and polite users of this
excellent group. And please have a little patience from those of us who on
occasion get a little out of line, in your
estimation. We will try harder I promise you and the rest of the group. So
please please accept my sincere apoligies for any rudeness you may have
interpeted from
myself.
- Original Message -
From: "Scott Cable" <s2cab...@yahoo.com>
To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 8:05 PM
Subject: Re: KR>spelling, punctuation, and Mac-- & I'm Outta Here.
> Oscar, Joe, and KRNetters,
> Your comments are certainly not appreciated and are certainly offensive.
I have, in fact eaten my share of "Humble Pie" on this one, and you making
further comments such as below is likened to rubbing salt into a wound. The
majority of the commenters had taken my original comments to Mac, out of
context.--Which is the only reason why I apologized to begin with.
>
> But since you seem to want to open this can of worms, then I feel that I
must comment back and for good:
>
> 1.) Seeing's how Mac has all of this flight test experience, does this
somehow exclude him from utilizing the spell checker? Even Mac himself
admits that his English is: (and I quote him) "horrible". So if he knows he
has a problem, an educated person would compensate by utilizing tools at his
easy disposal. Right ?
>
> 2.) So Oscar, does this mean if you're building, test flying aircraft on a
regular basis that everyone on the Net must take time to read, re-read, and
decipher someone's hiroglyphic messages? meaning that that person's time is
more important than someone else's?
>
> I think NOT.
>
> FYI: I work in the Boeing Phantom Work's, on a program with a very, VERY
compressed, aggressive schedule. For the last 3 weeks, I've been putting in
64+ hour work-weeks.
> Please believe me: I love my work, and truly enjoy the team of talented
people that I have the pleasure of working with., as I'm not complaining.
>
> My point being is this:
> Myself and others simply don't have the time in the day to try and
decipher someone's mis-spelled, un-punctuated message. In fact, it's
inconsiderate, self-serving and rude.
>
>
> I was under the impression when I started my project just over a year ago,
that the KRNet was a group dedicated to building and Flying the KR Series
aircraft. Frankly, Oscar, if you don't have the courtesy to do a simple
thing like utilizing a spell check program before you send an eMail comment,
maybe you then should just "FALL OUT".
>
> The KRNet Administrator, just last week, got flamed for this very same
thing. Mark was merely pointing out that these messages reach around the
globe, have a little consideration for others right? That's what I got from
it, as I wouldn't want to speak for Mark Langford.
>
> Lately, all I've been spending my time doing is defending or explaining
something that was taken completely out of context. This is activity that I
actually loathe, as it goes completely against everything I was ever
taught---Never explain yourself, your friends already know, and your enemies
don't care.
>
> My profession, and myself personally have been attacked on this Net by
Panzera, and others. So because of comments such as below, and the fact
that all of this nonsense is only distracting my progress at work, and at
home on my aircraft project, I'm removing myself from this list. I have
real aircraft to design and build.
>
> Oscar Zuniga <taildr...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Folks;
>
> After reading through the anguished posts on spelling, punctuation, and
the
> rest of it, as well as the comment about Mac ("flymaca"), all I ask is the
> following. (1) all those among you who don't own a set of plans and manual
> for a KR, fall out; (2) of those left standing, if you aren't actively
> building an airplane, fall out; (3) of those still standing, if you're not
a
> licensed and current pilot, fall out; (4) of the remaining ones, if you've
> never completed and test-flown a homebuilt aircraft, fall out; (5) the
rest
> of you still standing, turn and offer the right hand of fellowship to the
> very few still around you. Mac is one of them. I am not. Are you?
>
> Point of the exercise: Mac has built and flown his own homebuilt KR
> aircraft, and flies it regularly. That being the case, I not only don't
> care if he can spell, punctuate, or speak English, I am darned fortunate
to
> have his valuable input on this list at all! Most who finish their
projects
> just move on because they aren'
