Re: [lace-chat] Copyright questions
On 4/17/07 3:46 AM, Jean Nathan wrote: The V & A requires permission to reproduce any postcards you buy from them, so unless they already have permission from a copyright owner, I presume they own the copyright on any paintings they have bought or had donated to them. You can own copyright on a postcard without owning copyright on the painting it was made from. Including open-domain material does not make a work uncopyrightable. Nor does including open-domain work in a copyrighted work give you any claim over the open-domain work -- though you *are* entitled to insist that people find an open-domain copy and do their own cleaning up, arranging, etc. In addition, anyone can make agreeing not to copy a thing a condition of sale. Such agreements usually require a signature, but one often sees "by [opening this package/clicking on this link . . . ] you agree to . . . . " -- Joy Beeson http://joybeeson.home.comcast.net/ http://roughsewing.home.comcast.net/ http://n3f.home.comcast.net/ -- Writers' Exchange http://www.timeswrsw.com/craig/cam/ (local weather) west of Fort Wayne, Indiana, U.S.A. To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace-chat] Copyright
Hello everyone I've just found this with Google: http://painting.about.com/cs/artistscopyright/f/copyrightfaq15.htm not sure if it's British or American, but it does state that copyright remains with the artist when a picture is sold, unless agreed otherwise. This website http://www.arsny.com/other.html#owners makes it clear that in USA copyright is not automatically transferred with the physical painting From all this it does look as though purchase of an original painting does not automatically transfer the copyright with it, so if the artist has retained a good photographic record of his/her work then he/she is still free to sell prints whilst the purchaser of the painting is not. Brenda in Allhallows, Kent http://paternoster.orpheusweb.co.uk/index.html To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace-chat] Copyright questions
Hello Jean The V & A requires permission to reproduce any postcards you buy from them, so unless they already have permission from a copyright owner, I presume they own the copyright on any paintings they have bought or had donated to them. That's because they own the photograph rather than the painting. In much the same way that a printer can own the copyright to the typesetting of, say a work by Shakespeare, even though the work itself is out of copyright. You could legally retype the words yourself but not photocopy them from his typesetting. Brenda in Allhallows, Kent http://paternoster.orpheusweb.co.uk/index.html To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace-chat] Copyright questions
In an edtion of the 'Antiques Roadshow", the owner of a small Kate Greenaway painting said she had had Christmas cards made from it. The expert wasn't worried by this, and they usually put people right if they are doing something illegal - the person was an expert on paintings. From this I assume that in the UK, if you own the painting, you also own the copyright. Admittedly Kate Greenaway died in 1901, so even if the same rules apply that apply to writing, i.e. copyright belongs to the author until 70 years after their death, the painting would be out of copyright. The V & A requires permission to reproduce any postcards you buy from them, so unless they already have permission from a copyright owner, I presume they own the copyright on any paintings they have bought or had donated to them. Jean in Poole, Dorset, UK To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace-chat] copyright
On Sat, 28 Aug 2004 01:25:25 EDT Liz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Now here is a thought, I've been blogging and putting pictures of the lace > that I'm making on my blog - am I infrindging copyright - yes I possibly am - This is a discussion that frequently comes up on the tatting list as one designer did apparently sue someone for posting a picture of the lace she had made from the designer's pattern. She didn't win. Displaying a picture of lace you made from a pattern doesn't infringe upon the copyright any more than posting a picture of yourself wearing a dress made from a pattern. What the designer has the right to is the written material. The "design", the intellectual property, is a much grayer area especially when you consider the diverse countries involved in anythiong posted on the internet. I design tatting patterns for sale, and the money from the patterns keeps me in thread to make more patterns. I would be annoyed if someone called any of my patterns their's, but I'm thrilled if I see someone else has done one of my designs. I've had people take my design and do something new to it and send me pictures to show it off and again I'm thrilled. If someone took a design and made a minor changed and called it their own, I'm not sure how I'd feel. Sharon Briggs In Brampton, Ontario, Canada where it looks like the summer we didn't have, is already gone :( To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace-chat] Copyright - my two penn'th
In a message dated 28/08/2004 18:52:09 GMT Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > By the way, did you know that in the UK you > >aren't supposed to 'charge' someone petrol money to take them somewhere - > that > >makes you a taxi and gives issue with your insurance but they can offer to > fill up > >your petrol tank and pay for it - see, we have laws that go round in > circles > >on other areas too!) > This was changed by British insurance companies some time back. They got > together and changed the relevant clauses in all policies at the same time. > I think that it may have been around the time of the first oil crisis in the > 70's, and the government pressured the insurance companies into doing it. > Actually, you still have to have special clauses in your insurance to regularily carry other people in your car either for work or pleasure - had to go through this last year Regards Liz in London I'm back blogging my latest lace piece - have a look by clicking on the link or going to http://journals.aol.com/thelacebee/thelacebee To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace-chat] Copyright - my two penn'th
Here's another thing on Copyright - I've been doing what we call Lace Porn this afternoon - looking at all the lovely sites and all the things I would like to own at some time. Then I thought I'd have a flick through ebay and found quite a few pieces of lace on there for sale (and I only looked at the UK items) - these people think that they are just getting a bit of pin money by selling 'their' lace - after all they made it - but they are infringing the copyright of the designers because they are selling up someone else's design. I had a look and can say that these people didn't design the lace because looking at their locations they aren't the people who sell the patterns as I have two of those shown and they come from differnt places. Regards Liz in London I'm back blogging my latest lace piece - have a look by clicking on the link or going to http://journals.aol.com/thelacebee/thelacebee To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace-chat] Copyright - my two penn'th
On Sat, 28 Aug 2004 01:25:25 EDT, Liz wrote: >It isn't something that we can police because let's face it, how do you >remember who you've sold patterns to when you see them at a lace day - perhaps it >was bought by a friend as a present - I've had that happen when I've given >someone a lift to a lace fair. (By the way, did you know that in the UK you >aren't supposed to 'charge' someone petrol money to take them somewhere - that >makes you a taxi and gives issue with your insurance but they can offer to fill up >your petrol tank and pay for it - see, we have laws that go round in circles >on other areas too!) This was changed by British insurance companies some time back. They got together and changed the relevant clauses in all policies at the same time. I think that it may have been around the time of the first oil crisis in the 70's, and the government pressured the insurance companies into doing it. -- Another victim of Modem Addictus Steph Peters, Manchester, England [EMAIL PROTECTED] Scanned by WinProxy http://www.Ositis.com/ To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace-chat] Copyright - my two penn'th
In a message dated 27/08/2004 23:32:56 GMT Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > I also know that a lot of people will "share" patterns - > 'we'll buy one each and make copies'. Whilst that's illegal it's > hardly worth making a fuss about. Only if I saw someone selling my > patterns without permission would I get upset. If I go to a lace day > and see one of my designs on a pillow, or finished and on display I get > a kick of pride knowing that I designed it, and I take it as a > compliment that someone else liked the pattern enough to make it up. > > Brenda > http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/paternoster/ > Brenda and the Spiders (ah the rock band is back), I think you have hit the nail on the head here. We all know that copyrights mean we can't give away your 'intellectual property' - the pattern but we also know that it does go on. It isn't something that we can police because let's face it, how do you remember who you've sold patterns to when you see them at a lace day - perhaps it was bought by a friend as a present - I've had that happen when I've given someone a lift to a lace fair. (By the way, did you know that in the UK you aren't supposed to 'charge' someone petrol money to take them somewhere - that makes you a taxi and gives issue with your insurance but they can offer to fill up your petrol tank and pay for it - see, we have laws that go round in circles on other areas too!) The one thing here that Brenda has said that makes me feel great is that she gets a kick out of seeing her pattern on someone else's pillow being made - or on display. Whilst I know that massive financial rewards would be better, that kick must we worth it's weight in gold - I just get a kick from seeing a hankie I made my mum, on her dressing table every time I go round and I didn't even design it! The Aussie asked why I don't design anymore and I said that simply I don't have the time - there are so many things I want to make that to design, at this time, stops me. But if there weren't people like Brenda out there then I would have nothing to make but historical patterns and whilst I love the patterns out of the luton books etc if I wanted to make there I would have to true them up if someone else had not taken the time to do so for me. I taught this woman to make lace and she moaned when she had to spangle her bobbins, and she moaned when she had to wind her bobbins, and she moaned when she had to finish off the lace, and she moaned when she had to mount her lace ... in the end, I asked her why she was making lace and she said; 'so people can see I'm clever and have a hobby'. Historically, lace makers did all these things because they are part of the craft that we follow and if you don't do them then you don't really make lace (ok, so we all occassionally buy pre spangled bobbins at show and I've got a bobbin winder) but designing lace was not historically part of the lace makers repertoire - if I was a commercial lacemaker then it is something that I would have been given to make from - so for me, people like Brenda are fulfilling a role that has been there as long as lacemaking and if I remove her ability to receive recognition of her time and effort then I am stealing from her - both monetarily and morally - so I pay for my pattern and I should show my appreciation of her pattern when I've made it by letting her know I loved it (or even loathed it but got there if it's a difficult one) and asking her permission to put it on my web site. Now here is a thought, I've been blogging and putting pictures of the lace that I'm making on my blog - am I infrindging copyright - yes I possibly am - but I'm careful to only show the part of the pattern I'm working on and to say where it came from. When I did talk about the equipment I was using it caused the great talk about the green horse shoe that I was using from Kleinhout and infact that was when Brenda, I believe, said that they sell them in the UK and raised awareness of it. To some extent - with lace web sites and blogging we are globally doing what lacemakers have done for years - we are bragging about our favourite lace toys and patterns but instead of doing it with the woman who lives next door - we are doing it with our friends around the world. I come on this site and say, wow, I've got this fabulous book and I've made this piece out of it and you won't believe how gorgeous it is and here is a picture on my website. Now, say 6 people go and look at the piece - which is a reasonable response to an email - and one of them say 'wow' I want to make that and buys the book then we have done a good thing. With bragging about your lace you are putting the copyright laws in a moral quandry - promotion over copyright - and this is where the law is very grey - from what I have seen on looking into this, the law does not condone breaches of copyright (which posting on your web site is) but und
[lace-chat] Copyright - my two penn'th
My understanding of copyright is that you are not permitted to *reproduce* something which is in copyright without permission. In UK, if you own a book, you are allowed to make copies for your own personal use, which means that if the book shows a short length of lace pattern you can make several copies to go around a roller pillow, or make 4 copies of a corner to make a square, plus the (enlarged) working copy which you doodle over etc. Reproduction of a lace pattern, or a dressmaking pattern, could be by photocopying, photography (film or digital), electronic scanning, tracing or skilled detailed drawing. Reproduction of a cookery recipe, or instructions for making the lace or dress could be by photocopying, photography (film or digital), electronic scanning, writing, typing, word processing or audio recording. Using the pattern/recipe to make a piece of lace, a dress or a cake is not reproduction of the original, but using the original as a tool. I can't see that your own photo of the lace you have made, the dress you have sewn, or the cake you have baked is a breach of copyright if you choose to publish it on a personal website. I design most of my own lace patterns, or if I use someone else's it is generally adapted quite a bit. That's because I like being creative and get more satisfaction from working my own designs. Over the years I've made a few pennies from selling BL patterns, but the financial return in consideration of the hours spent designing and making is very minimal. I also know that a lot of people will "share" patterns - 'we'll buy one each and make copies'. Whilst that's illegal it's hardly worth making a fuss about. Only if I saw someone selling my patterns without permission would I get upset. If I go to a lace day and see one of my designs on a pillow, or finished and on display I get a kick of pride knowing that I designed it, and I take it as a compliment that someone else liked the pattern enough to make it up. Brenda http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/paternoster/ To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace-chat] Copyright
For sometime my DH and I have been tracing letters that are in many universities in the UK, such as Edinburgh, Oxford and Cambridge, these are just a few. Now these letters, some were written by DH great grandfather or written to him by famous people. So far we have not been allowed to see these letters, we do have a copy of an interview he gave to the press in 1861. We have to now make an appointment at the National History Museum. We have to take documentation showing that my DH is the great grandson, then we have to go into discussion. What are we trying to do, put together documentation of a man who led a very interesting life, whose great great great grandson has asked us to find out more about his life. Even though some of these letters were written by a family member we have no automatic right to even see the letters. Jean in Newbury To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace-chat [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
