Re: Video project still on its way.

[Chainlink]

Thank you!

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Re: Master Membership List

[Chainlink]

I'm not sure giving out full contact information is such a good idea in 
2020. I've had credit card fraud happen to me three times now, and I don't 
feel comfortable making it any easier. Posting my address here is not going 
to happen, so what I would suggest is that we need another way.

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Re: Want to put a motor my 1200

[Chainlink]

I don't usually have problems turning 2 and 3 inch square stock to round 
except when I hit a knot. That's when I lose steps; it's catastrophic if I 
lose steps when threading.

I bought a 4 axis kit some years ago for a homemade CNC machine. I 
repurposed that kit on the Legacy. I bought a kit from the following 
company very close to this one:  
https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/g540-stepper-motor-kits/g540-4-axis-kit-115v230vac/
 It's 
listed now at $617, and I probably paid 500 something for it those years 
ago. this company also offers another kit with 570 oz steppers 
https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/g540-stepper-motor-kits/4-axis-stepper-motor-cnc-router/

What would I do different? 
1. I'd start with a geared stepper rather than making a gear reduction with 
pulleys and timing belts. 
2. I really like having some of the axes directly connected to the stepper 
motor because it's so simple and less can go wrong. 
3. I'd add limit switches to avoid crashes on both extents of x y and z 
axes. Right now I have only an x min endstop to avoid crashing into the 3 
jaw chuck.
4. I'd prefer the shortest machine possible for working my dowels, which 
has always been 4 feet. I'm not crazy enough to cut irreplacable rails, so 
I'd try and lock the height and level of the legacy to make it more ridgid 
because I always tend to be a little tapered on one end of a dowel. 
5. I still like using mach3, although its strengths lie in straight lines 
and not in circles and ellipses. I've not used it at all for relief 
carving; everything is turning spindles and threading, which it does well. 
If I were to start over, I'd probably look at how to interface with Vectric 
and more modern controllers so I don't have to rely on parallel port 
connections on ancient computers. I keep 2 spare computers laying around 
just in case, which is silly.

I promise that I will take some pics this week.

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Re: Want to put a motor my 1200

[Chainlink]

Yes, I'll take some photos next time I'm at the shop.

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Re: Want to put a motor my 1200

[Chainlink]

Wes,

I did a conversion to CNC on a legacy 1200 with steppers. I have nema23 
387oz. steppers and a 6:1 gear reduction on the Z and rotary axis, and a 
straight coupling on the X and Y. The setup is adequate on X,Y and Z, but 
the rotary axis needs a lot more torque. I haven't looked into what the 
most powerful nema23 motor that can be run on a Gecko 540 is, but that's 
what I would try next.

My video from years ago doesn't yet have the gear reductions, but it shows 
some of the setup. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlQ46e3gwiA. Next time I 
fire it up, I'll try to shoot a new video for the groups' benefit.

Dustin

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Re: How many of you would use your Legacy to make this?

[Chainlink]

That's pretty darn clever manufacturing on that guys part.

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Re: Evolution Ornamental Mill

[Chainlink]

Wow, thanks for the video link! I really like the upgrades on the 
evolution. I always thought I'd need a longer bed(which is why I bought the 
1200), but the reality is that I almost never run anything over 4 feet, 
with 2 and 3 feet being the norm. This would have been a great machine. I'm 
surprised it wasn't sold longer.

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Re: Questionable E-bay sale

[Chainlink]

I emailed that user to ask for actual pictures of the mill. We will see

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Re: What would you do???

[Chainlink]

I'm in the same boat. Basically, its buying older computers on ebay, like 
pentium 4s from name brand vendors with reinstallation media still intact. 
I agree that $3000 is alot given the technical hurdles. I'd be really 
concerned about the CNC hardware itself inside the box and replacing any of 
it if needed.

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Re: ornamental milling

[Chainlink]

Wow, that's so impressive! Great work!

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Re: What would you do???

[Chainlink]

Hey there, my vote is for CNC all the way! My home made setup controller 
developed a problem and I switched back to manual, and let me tell you that 
its a time consuming change to use the mill manually! There are two main 
advantages of cnc that I miss when going back to manual. First, motor 
holding torque keeps your z height from changing. Going back to manual 
using a digital caliper to measure the z height and then locking it down 
manually is quite annoying in comparison. Secondly, a motorized rotary axis 
is so great that it's hard to go back to manual.

Kind regards,

Dustin

On Sunday, December 23, 2018 at 10:32:53 PM UTC-5, Curt George wrote:
>
> HI Guys. On E-bay there is an 1800 CNC unit.  its a very old cnc.
> I am asking if you were going to buy it, would you use it as a cnc or 
> convert it back to a manual unit. Note, the only thing that is missing form 
> a manual is the gears.(more or less)
>
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Legacy-ornamental-woodworking-mill-1800-Mach-3-computer-controlled/254037768757?hash=item3b25d4ba35:g:T1EAAOSwPrtcIAg9:rk:5:pf:0
>
> Legacy ornamental woodworking mill 1800 Mach 3 computer controlled
> Condition:
> Used
>
> “Very good hardly used condition”
> Time left:
> Time left:4d 18h Friday, 5:13PM
> Starting bid:
> US $3,000.00
> [ 0 bids 
> 
>  ]
>  
> Place bid- 
> 
>
> 
>  
> Enter US $3,000.00 or more
>  
>  
> Add to watch list 
> 
> 100% positive feedback
> Shipping:
> Free Local Pickup | See details 
> 
>  
> Item location:
> Nutley, New Jersey, United States
>  
> Ships to:
> Local pick-up only
> Delivery:
> Varies
> Payments:
> [image: PayPal] [image: Visa] [image: Master Card] [image: Amex] [image: 
> Discover]
> [image: PayPal Credit]
> No Interest if paid in full in 6 months on $99+.  Apply Now 
>   |  See 
> terms 
> Returns:
> Seller does not accept returns |  See details 
> 
> [image: Inline image]
> C.A.G.
>

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Re: Design

[Chainlink]

Yeah, that's it too. There's some great pictures in that post that detail 
the construction. 
>
>

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Re: Design

[Chainlink]

It's 1 1/2" - 5tpi oak.

On Sunday, June 10, 2018 at 7:38:32 AM UTC-4, Richard Ellis wrote:
>
>  Now looks interesting My one concern is the threaded rod TPI and what 
> wood did you use.
>
> On Sunday, June 10, 2018 at 12:28:54 PM UTC+1, Chainlink wrote:
>>
>>
>> <https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-hGzQHTLT4xk/Wx0LCtM9liI/ABY/0n4oHrGqiEQ6Knp4a-EJMmCmPDd12a3owCLcBGAs/s1600/stool.jpg>
>>
>>
>> I can't believe that google has not one image of this, but JR Beall put a 
>> flyer in the wood threading kits that had a plan for an adjustable height 
>> stool that I really like. Here is a photo of the one I made. 
>>
>> The support block under the stool seat is 1.5" thick and has a 1.5" hole 
>> bored in its center for the threaded rod (that end is not threaded, btw). 
>> the frame upper support is also 1.5" thick and is tapped for the threaded 
>> rod. The bottom support has a 1.5" hole to keep the threaded rod centered, 
>> but it is not threaded. The seat really needs to be scooped out for comfort 
>> or padding of some kind needs to be added.
>>
>> Dustin
>>
>>

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Re: New to the group, new owner of a 1200 Mill

[Chainlink]

I've never made a guitar neck with my cnc'd 1200. If I were going to do 
something like that,I would not depend on moving back and forth on the x 
axis; there's just too much backlash. I'd have to go back to x0 and run in 
one direction to get the best result possible.

So, I would trust repeatability if I adjusted my gcode to account for the 
backlash (by avoiding cutting in the x-, and if the work piece was either 
not too long to have whip or deflection from the router bit, or was 
supported from underneath by a roller, or was run slowly enough to not be a 
problem.

My experience is in making long 1.5 inch -5 threaded dowels no longer than 
about 4 feet in length and making small lidded jars with contoured lids.

HTH

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 9:40:19 AM UTC-5, Tim Petersen wrote:
>
> Just a quick hello to introduce my self.
>
> I live in western Washington here is the U.S. of A. and I design and build 
> stuff.
> I have owned a Larken CNC Router or Camtool 24R as they are known for 
> about five years.  I've added an alcohol misting system so I can fairly 
> reliably cut aluminum parts.  I also own a little Sherline CNC lathe/mill 
> for fabricating small parts.  Although I mainly build or modify tools and 
> carve things out of wood.
>
> I was actual looking for a second hand planer when I ran across an 
> Ornamental Mill for sale on the mighty Craig's List.  Thinking I might be 
> able to semi-convert it to CNC and use it in production work I gambled on 
> the purchase.  Hopeful I was not to foolish?
>
> Anybody ever make a guitar neck on one of these babies?
>
> I have not actual called Legacy the company, but their website claims to 
> no longer support these older non-CNC mills.  So that has me a bit worried 
> as there are some parts that seem destine to ware out.
>
> Anyway I am excited to see what this machine can do and as I am new to 
> Google Groups and the Ornamental Mill it may take me some time to navigate 
> and formulate the questions I have.
>
> Thanks to all of you who freely share your knowledge as you represent the 
> best of the internet!
>
> -Tim Petersen
>
>
>

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Re: New Legacy video on youtube

[Chainlink]

Thanks, that's great content!

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Re: Little Lady's table.

[Chainlink]

I have both as well...mine is an ER10. 

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Re: I need to sell my 1200 with CNC

[Chainlink]

Sure, I'll make a list and take more detailed photos. I should have time by 
the weekend. 

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Re: I need to sell my 1200 with CNC

[Chainlink]

Thanks for asking; I don't have a bandsaw. And you are right about it 
hurting to sell the mill. I love using it. I'm still on the fence about 
selling it or my old jeep.
 

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Re: I need to sell my 1200 with CNC

[Chainlink]

Thank you for your interest. Sorry, I should have mentioned my location in 
my post. I'm in Duncansville, PA 16635. I'd like to see what the next week 
brings before I decide whether I want to part it out. If we are talking 
about the steppers, controller, power supply, belts and reduction gears, 
couplers, cabling, mounts, and computer components, then I'd have to take a 
guess at around $900. The mach3 license is trial and not owned.

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Re: power tool

[Chainlink]

I've only made one hollow spiral before, not on the legacy. I wrapped long 
1" wide strips of sandpaper around each spiral segment and just pulled the 
sandpaper back and forth until the inside of the spiral got smooth. I 
should note that I used a drill press to make the hollow spiral, so the 
insides were very rough.

I don't think this tool would help with that kind of sanding.
>
>

-- 

Re: power tool

[Chainlink]

This is the closest I've seen: 
http://www.woodworkingshop.com/product/px38536/



>

-- 

Re: my burnt mill

[Chainlink]

Good morning!

I didn't see it mentioned here, but vxb.com is a great source for bearings. 
You might be able to find what you need there too. I've shopped there 
multiple times with great results.

Dustin




-- 

Re: Legacy Parts

[Chainlink]

It really is kind of a trade off on cost vs. quality. I fully realize that 
this is a sloppy setup for typical CNC tolerances, but it's still better 
than I can turn by hand or by using traditional jigs. that's the sweet spot 
for me; it's a time saver that's also easier to setup.

As for the bushings, I turned them to expose a new edge (are they called 
top hat bushings? I can't remember.) I also added a rectangular UHMW piece 
to the back of the carriage that sits between the carriage and inserts into 
the top back rail. I think I have pictures on here in an earlier post. The 
delrin set screws on the front of the carriage help a little to control the 
racking, but with the constant re-positioning of the X axis, they get loose 
too quickly. I think I also added UHMW square blocks to the front carriage 
top hat bushings. I'm pretty sure I saw that tip here or on the turning 
around site.

I'm using a geckodrive G540 and my 387oz. steppers were sized properly for 
the 48v power supply. Maybe that could be why I'm having good luck with 
mine. I think that the G540 can drive NEMA 34 motors too, but I'm not sure 
of all the calcuations that need to be done anymore. I'm better off just 
buying a kit and saving the hours of time calculating.

Regarding the roller bearing idea, that's also pretty similar to the 
rockcliff cnc design. that plan shows some very detailed ways to use the 
skate bearings and CRS rails . One of my design goals with the CNC 
conversion was to do no harm to the manual machine. I can take it all back 
apart again and make it a plain 1200 again. I think I'm more likely to 
build from scratch than risk any non-reversible change. I have about 3/16" 
of carriage rack, so that's really about half that at the router bit. It 
hasn't been enough to notice on any of my projects so far, and if I was 
being really picky, I'd just make sure I start every pass by moving the 
carriage in the X+ direction to make the rack the same on every pass.

I've got an interesting story that kind of relates to my CNC legacy. My dad 
has an old 60+ year old bulldozer that only he can still drive without it 
falling completely apart. There's a grease fitting that allows you to 
tighten up the tracks, but you can't tighten it up all the way because the 
track will skip right off the idler wheel. You have to run it loose, but 
not too loose. This reminds me of my legacy conversion because nothing I 
did aligns perfectly, but it's just tight enough to work. The entire A-axis 
assembly frame wobbles, but the transmission of power is consistent. If I 
put higher precision parts like linear rails on the X, then I'd have to 
worry about perfect alignment to prevent binding. It's funny, but a little 
loose is working for me.

>
>

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Re: Hello Is there anyone out there?

[Chainlink]

Not much going on here with woodworking. I made some CNC plaques for
the YMCA half marathon at the end of last month. I'm getting old stuff
ready for the auctioneer, so my shop is now off limits for 5 weeks
until the now clean old stuff gets picked up. I'm in no mood to clean
it all over again, so it's easier to just not work out there.

My sweet wife bought me a 98 jeep wrangler to tool around with and
take the kids to school in the winter. It's supplanted my woodshop
time with car repair time. I've really been enjoying it.


Dustin




On Oct 11, 7:49 pm, CURTIS   GEORGEwrote:
> Its day 11 and we have only had two topics this month.(SO FAR!)
>
> I know times are busy, and everyone has stuff to do. But... Come on people! 
> talk to me.
>
> Dose anyone have any new idea that thay would like to shair? Projects that 
> thay want to make?? or any woodworking tips that thay have found useful???
>
> I know that Ive been a little quite as of the last few months. That has been 
> mainly because my computer is down and out, and the man who dose my 
> computer repairs is... well a flake. (he too has his own family problems so I 
> guess that I shouldnt be to hard on him) but typing on my wife lap top is a 
> BIG PAIN!!!  Besides trying to get he time on her computer, this thing has a 
> built in mouse pad, in which I keep hitting the thimg while typeing, making 
> the words and everything go astray at the worst possible min.
>
> As is,If that isnt enough problems, Im now working 7 days a week...   Can I 
> hear someone playing a violin for me? ;-) 
>
> I hope it dosent sound like Im complaining.
>
> Im just stating that Life has int-erupted my normal route en. and for that, I 
> am sorry.
>
> Tonight I have time to talk.
>
> If anyone is still out there. I can talk for about another hour and a half 
> before my bed time. (9pm is lights out for me. 3:30 am is my normal wake up 
> time. YOU do the math. Im not getting a lot of beauty sleep) ;-P
>
> talk to you all latter.
>
> C.A.G.

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Re: Have you guys seen this?

[Chainlink]

Here are a couple links I found:

Pen Wizard:

http://www.bealltool.com/pdfs/PW_gear_layout.pdf

http://www.bealltool.com/pdfs/PW_Instruction.pdf

Lathe Wizard:

http://www.bealltool.com/pdfs/Gear%20drive%20instructions.pdf

http://www.bealltool.com/pdfs/Lathe%20Wizard%20Set%20Up.pdf

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Re: Have you guys seen this?

[Chainlink]

JR Beall deserves a lot of credit for helping me do the kind of
woodwork I love. I have most of his threading jigs. I love the guy's
spirit. On one of his youtube videos, he comes right out and asks you
to buy his stuff and make him rich..haha, gotta love that!

He also made a one time production run of the lathe wizard, which was
a larger version of the pen wizard. It's been several years though,
but I wonder if some photos of it might still exist out there
somewhere.


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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

Thanks for getting that fixed up for me. I added ball bearings on
either side of the lower belt to tension it. I just used the same
mounting holes from the step motor and it tightened up nicely.

The single screw holding the D-rod shaft came loose and had to be
tightened, so that's not the greatest thing. On the bright side, the
holding torque is much stronger and I cut a test cylinder lengthwise
and around the circumference and it did a great job. I also should do
somthing about my scroll chuck because it loosens when I run the axis
counter clockwise. A set screw in it should do fine.

I also added an X home/limit switch in preparation for auotmated
scripts.

The main frustration I'm having right now is software. I spent hours
setting up an automated cut through modeling software that I could
have done in 15 minutes with manual commands.

On Sep 4, 8:41 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Gracias :-)
>
>
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Okla Mike (Liltwisted)
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2011 5:31 PM
>   Subject: Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC
>
>   Here it is inline and I also attached it
>
>   On 9/4/2011 5:57 PM, Dustin Yoder wrote:
>     Last time I left off, my A-axis didn't have enough holding torque. I 
> tried to research a bigger stepper, but nothing substantially better in the 
> 600-900oz range really fit at 3.5A for my G540 controller, and I didn't want 
> to get into big bucks with another stepper, controller and parallel port, 
> etc. Nema 24 motors claimed better torque, but the price was too high--same 
> with bolt on gear reducers.
>
>     I decided to try a gear reduction as the lowest cost option that I could 
> reuse on the other axes if it didn't work. I ended up putting around $70 into 
> it, which is around my limit that I wanted to spend right now. I'm going to 
> attach a photo, so let me know if you do not see it.
>
>     I used the existing holes in my headstock (one 3/8" hole and the 3/8" 
> hole for the spring point for the indexing gears). I built a 6:1 gear 
> reduction and pretty much eyeballed all the drill holes to get a reasonable 
> result. All shafts on the gears are 1/4" D-shaped shafts that I got from 
> mcmaster. The only modification that I made was to tap a 10-24 hole in the 
> headstock to clamp the 1/4" shaft inserted into it(note the bolt sticking out 
> of the top of the headstock.) I didn't feel like this was making an 
> irreversible modification, so it fit within my guidelines.
>
>     Originally, I wanted to turn down a 5/16" bolt to 1/4" on the end so that 
> I could just screw it into the headstock without having to tap a hole, but my 
> turning skills suck and I have no clue how to run my little metal lathe.
>
>     I pressed oilite bearings into the aluminum frame for the 1/4" shaft. I 
> figured they'd add a little durability.
>
>     In all, this is a very garage shop/jury rigged setup, but it is 
> functional. I'm going to test it out under load hopefully this week.
>
>     Dustin
>
> ---­-
>
>     No virus found in this message.
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>
>
>  hifiahdf.jpg
> 130KViewDownload- Hide quoted text -
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> - Show quoted text -

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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

Tim, I'm running my X and Y at 50ipm and the Z and A at 20ipm; I hope
that's the right way to say it. The Z axis has been working great
today, so maybe I just found it's sweet spot.

Steve, I was going to go with limit switches when the time comes, but
I honestly don't know that I'll add them if all I do is issue commands
manually.

I worked on a 3" diameter by 4" long hexagon (on the end of a 32"
walnut 4x4) that I'm going to turn into an acorn nut for my project.
Clearly, you could see that the holding torque just wasn't enough as
the router ran across the y axis of the workpiece. I ended up
approaching the cut from the end of the workpiece toward the headstock
to make it work out ok. It took forever at .1" depth and 6 passes per
side at .25", but I did end up with a really nice hexagonal workpiece.
I took one final cleanup pass along the y axis to see what would
happen and the bit rotation was too much for the stepper and I got a
little bit of movement. Also, with this kind of gcode, you can really
see the weakness in the slide system as it changed directoins on the X
axis. There's visible racking in the carriage and it doesn't travel
completely smoothly. But, because I started each pass moving the bit
in the same direction, my finished piece looks great.

I've got a few more pieces to make on this table project, and I
suspect that I can get good results with the current setup. I'm really
trading time for some practical learning experience and some slowly
made pieces. I'm ok with that.

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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

I had my first success today with the upgrade. Here is a link to a
video of the carve in action! Sorry about the loud volume; I wasn't in
the mood to edit the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlQ46e3gwiA

Details:

I needed some 1 1/2" dowels for my newest table project, so I decided
to try my best to use my CNC upgrade. I had problems in two areas:
First, my Z-axis stalled when raising. Second, I had to make shallow
passes to keep from stalling the A-axis. One thing I did notice was
that as the motors warmed up, my z-axis was much better behaved and
seemed to work well.

I spent just about 8 minutes per dowel once I got the procedure down.
I even bumped up the A-axis motor speed and ran it so that I could run
some sandpaper over the finished dowel--it's pretty nice to be able to
do that. I must say that I absolutely loved the ease of repeatability
that the CNC commands provided. My Z axis held it's depth without
having to constantly fiddle with locking down the Z axis on every
depth change like I used to do. Small changes to depth are really easy
to make. I ended up just where I wanted to be with my dowels, a bit
undersized at 1.48" to 1.49".

Although I spent most of my evening in the shop, I feel like my time
was at least equally spent vs. manual milling without the added
frustration and effort. It was nice to prepare the next blank while I
was waiting. Next up, the big timesaver would be to cut my threads via
CNC. I don't know where to start with that one, if anyone has any
tips.

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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

Little update:

I got my G540 back and hooked everything up. New shielded cable made
the difference and all axes are now appear to be running smoothly. Now
for the larger hurdle of figuring out how to use mach3.

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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

Hey Tim, thanks for your continued interest.

I got to work on my electronics, but made an error in soldering one of
my cables. Some solder got between two pins on one of my DB9
connections and blew out my G540 controller. I sent it back to
Geckodrives and they told me that repairs were free, which is awesome,
but I'm waiting for the controller to come back.

One of my problems with my first cnc project was a direction error
that would happen when I'd run the axis in mach3. I'd jog any axis and
sometimes it would go the correct direction and sometimes it would
not. Before the change in cabling that blew out my G540, I got to test
each axis and had the same problem.

So, I'm on hold until my G540 comes back, and I'm on vacation next
week. I'm hoping to get back to this August 2.

I'm potentially revising my goals based on the discussion here about
not enough torque for the spindle. Another of my money making projects
are segmented routed bowls. I'd still be happy if I could automate
X,Y,Z to rout the inside of these bowls, which takes me about an hour.

On Jul 21, 1:32 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Where are you at with this project?
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2011 4:37 PM
> Subject: Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC
>
> > Thanks all for all the advice on the gears and stepper sizes and
> > practical advice in general. I'm worried about stalling too, which is
> > why I tried to be as minimal as possible with the physical changes to
> > the Legacy in case it does not work out.
>
> > At any rate, hopefully I'll be able to get everything running this
> > week so we can see what happens.
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>
> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
> legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.> To unsubscribe from this group, 
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>
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> visit this group at
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: Todays barley project

[Chainlink]

Those are really nice!

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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

Thanks all for all the advice on the gears and stepper sizes and
practical advice in general. I'm worried about stalling too, which is
why I tried to be as minimal as possible with the physical changes to
the Legacy in case it does not work out.

At any rate, hopefully I'll be able to get everything running this
week so we can see what happens.

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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

Oh my, I did not think about that! That would also eliminate tapers as
well. I'll be changing that for sure.

On Jul 10, 6:49 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Pro's of the direct drive is no backlash.  My concern is lack of power.  
> That's why most people have timing belts or gearheads (gear heads designed to 
> work with stepper motors)  I believe legacy's first cnc version used laser 
> cut gears and I'm sure that was a source of backlash.  Their latest use 
> gearheads, and I don't know what the Arty is using.  Does anyone else know?
>
> I also noticed that the motor mount for the "A" axis is mounted to the 
> outside rails.  If it was mounted to the inner you would be able to tilt and 
> raise the table.  
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Dustin Yoder
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2011 3:36 PM
>   Subject: RE: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC
>
>   Tim, yes, direct drive, is that a problem? I noticed others going with a 
> belt and pulley system. Is there a reason for that?
>
>   Curt, each axis is attached by a spider shaft coupling, the x, y and z are 
> 5/8" and the spindle (A) is 3/4". I reversed the X axis leadscrew so that I 
> could attach the coupling without interference from the square end that the 
> handle attaches to. Other than that, the couplers just slide on and lock with 
> an allen screw.
>
>   Photo 1: X-axis coupled to stepper.
>   Photo 2: Opposite end of X-axis.
>   Photo 3: Spindle.

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How to you properly reply to your topic from hotmail client?

[Chainlink]

I tried to reply to my build thread today and I copied the topic name
into the subject line, but my post showed up under a new topic rather
than a reply to the existing topic and my inline photos didn't show
up. What am I doing wrong?


Thanks :)

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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

I had the problem on the Y-axis as well. I'd try and jog one direction
then back and sometimes it would continue on in the same direction.
That's why I thought it may have been a cabling/parallel port
problem.

Also, I'd be willing to try to rebuild from scratch; I didn't find the
construction difficult. I haven't found any plans to help guide my way
though. Do you have any tips to point me in the right direction?


On Jul 6, 2:50 am, "Art Ransom"  wrote:
> When slaving   A to X, I suspect that your problem is that both motors  are
> turning the same direction.  One should turn clockwise and the other counter
> clockwise.  You built one CNC router why not build an indexer from scratch
> with the strength needed for the job.
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 8:24 PM
> Subject: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >I thought that after the chat in the All New Members thread that I
> > would actually attempt to convert my 1200 to CNC, since it may be of
> > great interest to some of the members.
>
> > On one hand, I hate to reinvent the wheel and try to replicate the
> > work already done by Legacy; I have a certain amount of guilt about
> > this. On the other hand, the CNC upgrade was something like $4000 and
> > is no longer offered by Legacy, so I'm going to modify my machine in
> > the way that I see fit.
>
> > I'd like to explain where I came from to get to where I am today,
> > ready to make this CNC conversion. I was one of the early adopters of
> > the Carvewright when it was first released to Sears. The machine can
> > do truly amazing work that makes me jump up and down with joy...when
> > it works. The other times, and this usually means as soon as I accept
> > a paid job for some CNC project, the machine breaks down in some
> > obscure way and much swearing ensues, followed by opening my wallet to
> > replace parts. In addition to reliabilty, my machine is not capable of
> > routing a round hole. Most of my work tends to be vector cuts(wooden
> > gears, trophies, etc.), so this lack of precision is disturbing.
>
> > With this dubious history in mind, I decided to build a second CNC
> > machine from scratch so that I had a reliable backup that was
> > inherently more precise. I decided to build a Rockcliff Model D based
> > on the ease of use of the plans and the cheap to make rail system. One
> > feature of the Rockcliff D is that it has two stepper motors running
> > the X-axis, the A-axis slaved to the X-axis. My machine was built
> > entirely out of MDF and I was quite happy with the accuracy of my
> > work. Everything was working according to plan until the day I hooked
> > up Mach 3 and tested the different axes. During the test, the X-axis
> > and its slave moved in opposite directions, tearing the gantry apart,
> > ruining the entire build. I think the problem was either the type of
> > cable I used(unshielded) to run from the motors or a weak parallel
> > port on my PC (though I don't understand how direction could get
> > messed up like that, it should have been just missed steps).
>
> > So, there my broken machine sat for a year, $1000+ dollars invested in
> > lead screws, steppers and drivers. Now we have arrived at this summer,
> > and I had a new CNC project to work on, 6 trophies for the YMCA
> > triathlon. I whipped them out on the carvewright and sure enough, it
> > broke down with 2 to carve! I managed to solve the problem and
> > finished the carvings, but I realized something important. Building
> > another 3-axis machine doesn't really help me do anything different
> > from my current capabilities with the Carvewright (when it works). My
> > money and time would better serve me by adding something new to my
> > toolbox, and that is ultimately why I've decided to try to apply CNC
> > to the legacy.
>
> > --
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Re: Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

I'll admit that my expectations are low especially because I read up
on some of the posts here that were more comprehensive than what I'm
doing; also my lack of success to this point makes me doubt that I'll
achieve anything. My ultimate goal right now is to create threaded rod
and nuts for my erector set type furniture that's as nice as what I
can do with my current methods.

I do have the Z-axis upgrade, and I do plan on manually tilting the
bed as needed. Regarding my budget, I don't mind spending a few
hundred extra to get some use out of my already purchased equipment. I
am a bit concerned that my steppers are not strong enough based on
other posts here in the group. I'd go so far as buying a new stepper
for the A-axis, but if it's going to take repurchasing 4 steppers, new
bearing system, etc, I won't bother, and I'll go back to building a
different 3-axis machine. I'm also planning on purchasing a
smoothstepper if I continue to have parallel port problems. I thought
I'd give the shielded cabling a try before I fork over for the
smoothstepper. I never tried that on the old machine to see if it
rectified the problem I had.

Here are my goals that will determine success for the project:

1. The upgrade must be completely reversible to restore the Legacy to
its original condition.
2.. Use as many existing parts as possible
4. Be able to cut a 4 foot long, 1 1/2" diameter 5 thread per inch
threaded rod

Here's a list of my starting equipment:

4-387 oz. steppers
Geckodrive G540 4 axis controller
48V power supply
estop and limit switches, shielded cable
Legacy 1200 with z-axis upgrade
spider coupling hubs sized for my motors and legacy lead screws
4 - 3/8" thick x 6" x 8" aluminum plate
a fully stocked woodshop

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Build log of sorts for a 1200 upgrade to CNC

[Chainlink]

I thought that after the chat in the All New Members thread that I
would actually attempt to convert my 1200 to CNC, since it may be of
great interest to some of the members.

On one hand, I hate to reinvent the wheel and try to replicate the
work already done by Legacy; I have a certain amount of guilt about
this. On the other hand, the CNC upgrade was something like $4000 and
is no longer offered by Legacy, so I'm going to modify my machine in
the way that I see fit.

I'd like to explain where I came from to get to where I am today,
ready to make this CNC conversion. I was one of the early adopters of
the Carvewright when it was first released to Sears. The machine can
do truly amazing work that makes me jump up and down with joy...when
it works. The other times, and this usually means as soon as I accept
a paid job for some CNC project, the machine breaks down in some
obscure way and much swearing ensues, followed by opening my wallet to
replace parts. In addition to reliabilty, my machine is not capable of
routing a round hole. Most of my work tends to be vector cuts(wooden
gears, trophies, etc.), so this lack of precision is disturbing.

With this dubious history in mind, I decided to build a second CNC
machine from scratch so that I had a reliable backup that was
inherently more precise. I decided to build a Rockcliff Model D based
on the ease of use of the plans and the cheap to make rail system. One
feature of the Rockcliff D is that it has two stepper motors running
the X-axis, the A-axis slaved to the X-axis. My machine was built
entirely out of MDF and I was quite happy with the accuracy of my
work. Everything was working according to plan until the day I hooked
up Mach 3 and tested the different axes. During the test, the X-axis
and its slave moved in opposite directions, tearing the gantry apart,
ruining the entire build. I think the problem was either the type of
cable I used(unshielded) to run from the motors or a weak parallel
port on my PC (though I don't understand how direction could get
messed up like that, it should have been just missed steps).

So, there my broken machine sat for a year, $1000+ dollars invested in
lead screws, steppers and drivers. Now we have arrived at this summer,
and I had a new CNC project to work on, 6 trophies for the YMCA
triathlon. I whipped them out on the carvewright and sure enough, it
broke down with 2 to carve! I managed to solve the problem and
finished the carvings, but I realized something important. Building
another 3-axis machine doesn't really help me do anything different
from my current capabilities with the Carvewright (when it works). My
money and time would better serve me by adding something new to my
toolbox, and that is ultimately why I've decided to try to apply CNC
to the legacy.

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Re: All New Members

[Chainlink]

Thanks for the tenon tip; I will absolutely try that the next time.
Consistent slow feed rate that doesn't wobble gets the best results
with the Beall jig. I made a couple wooden stools with threaded height
adjustments and I'm so very pleased with the threaded rod strength.

On Jul 4, 11:12 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hi Dustin,
>
> I got all excited and thought those where done on the Legacy.   For an
> easier time with the Beall threading jig, my thoughts would be save your arm
> and make a tenon on the end of the dowel that will fit a cordless drill and
> make all you want with little effort.  This is assuming your using the one
> that uses the trim router and feeding the dowel in the hole.  Thanks for
> posting the project, I bet it's a real conversation piece.
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Monday, July 04, 2011 6:41 AM
> Subject: Re: All New Members
>
> What I find the most time consuming with the threaded rod is running
> it through the Beall wood threader router jig by hand turning. It's
> around 30 minutes per 4 foot section to thread by hand; if the
> tolerance is a little tight on the rod, then it turns into a forearm
> endurance exercise. I'd love to have 20 or so pre-threaded rods ready
> to go when I get inspired, but I'm just hate doing it after the 3rd or
> 4th one. That's one of those things I'd like to automate a bit.
>
> On Jul 4, 9:12 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > don't worry about what you call cluttering the group it doesn't matter how
> many attempts as long as it gets posted
> > great shelving with the threads I like it. my guess is Tim will soon post
> a tutorial on how to successfully post pictures
> > to remind us all how its done I just hit reply to the email when it
> arrives and attach them that way.
> > at the moment the finest thread a can do on the legacy is 2 threads per
> inch. if I can figure out a way of doing finer I will post it for you
> > how do you do the threads now?
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: Dustin Yoder
> > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > Sent: Monday, July 04, 2011 10:38 PM
> > Subject: All New Members
>
> > 4th try at placing photos. Sorry for cluttering the group if it doesn't
> work.
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group
> athttp://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
> > --
> 
>
> > No virus found in this message.
> > Checked by AVG -www.avg.com
> > Version: 10.0.1388 / Virus Database: 1516/3742 - Release Date: 07/03/11
>
> --
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Re: All New Members

[Chainlink]

What I find the most time consuming with the threaded rod is running
it through the Beall wood threader router jig by hand turning. It's
around 30 minutes per 4 foot section to thread by hand; if the
tolerance is a little tight on the rod, then it turns into a forearm
endurance exercise. I'd love to have 20 or so pre-threaded rods ready
to go when I get inspired, but I'm just hate doing it after the 3rd or
4th one. That's one of those things I'd like to automate a bit.

On Jul 4, 9:12 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> don't worry about what you call cluttering the group it doesn't matter how 
> many attempts as long as it gets posted
> great shelving with the threads I like it. my guess is Tim will soon post a 
> tutorial on how to successfully post pictures
> to remind us all how its done I just hit reply to the email when it arrives 
> and attach them that way.
> at the moment the finest thread a can do on the legacy is 2 threads per inch. 
> if I can figure out a way of doing finer I will post it for you
> how do you do the threads now?
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Dustin Yoder
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Monday, July 04, 2011 10:38 PM
>   Subject: All New Members
>
>   4th try at placing photos. Sorry for cluttering the group if it doesn't 
> work.
>
>   --
>   You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
>   To post to this group, send email to 
> legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
>   To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
> legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>   For more options, visit this group 
> athttp://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
> --
>
>   No virus found in this message.
>   Checked by AVG -www.avg.com
>   Version: 10.0.1388 / Virus Database: 1516/3742 - Release Date: 07/03/11

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Re: All New Members

[Chainlink]

Tim,

I wanted to chime in regarding not posting often. The only
disappointment that I have regarding the group is the difficulty
posting pictures, which has everything to do with google and nothing
to do with the talented members of this group. This certainly doesn't
keep me from posting when I have a question though.

The daily email from the group that I get in my inbox keeps me
informed on current topics, so I often feel caught up with the latest
happenings on the group. A lot of my lack of posting mirrors my actual
time woodworking, which is very infrequent anymore except for
commissioned projects or a special fun project I've been thinking
about. You're also correct in that I'm one of those second hand owners
of a legacy (1200).

As far as my interests go in the group, every post made here is
meaningful to me. My interests are:

1. Learning techniques
2. Seeing others' projects
3. Modifying the Legacy
4. CNC, or CNC-ifying the Legacy

Numbers 3 and 4 are the big directions that I want to head. I've got a
half built 3-axis CNC machine in my garage that I worked on as a
backup to my Carvewright when it breaks down during an important
project. I'm really interested in automating the Legacy and trying to
do my own Performance package CNC conversion to it with my existing
equipment. Other baby steps that I'd like to achieve would be
automating the x-axis to speed up making dowels (I thread 1 1/2"
dowels for erector set type furniture projects). I also have not
researched this, but I'd like to be able to cut an automated 1 1/2"-5
thread on the legacy. I have no idea if the gears support that, and I
suspect that they do not at this time and I'll have to wait for CNC
conversion.

Dustin

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Re: veranda posts

[Chainlink]

Thanks! I wasn't aware that you could do different profiles like that
with the same bits.

Dustin

On May 29, 1:45 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> ok now that the email has arrived I will attach the pics. as always sorry
> for the clarity I only have the camera in my phone.
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "aussiman" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2011 3:42 PM
> Subject: veranda posts
>
> >I had a guy wanted a couple of veranda posts so i made 3 different
> > types using the 6inch combination barley bits its the first time i
> > have used them so a clicked a couple of pics during machining showing
> > how the same bits can make different designs  I know many have seen
> > this already but there may be a few who have not.the wood is 4x4 inch
> > pine.  will attach the pics shortly
>
> > Bill
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
>
>
>  ABCD0001.JPG
> 341KViewDownload
>
>  ABCD0020.JPG
> 326KViewDownload
>
>  ABCD0019.JPG
> 313KViewDownload

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Re: Maximum Diameter 900 vs 1200

[Chainlink]

Thank you all for the great replies! I was thinking that as I was
typing rope twist that I've never actually seen one on the outside of
a building in my area. Here in Hollidaysburg, there is an actual
historic board that jumps on everyone if they aren't repairing or
replacing exterior work to the original standards. I'll definitely
head down a couple streets downtown and take some photos; thanks for
that sound and practical advice!

My 1200 bed is 11 3/4", depending on which tape measure I use :) It
looks like the bird's mouth bits are going to be pretty necessary to
keep the wood costs down and the diameter up. I'm actually relieved
that I can make some samples with only the purchase of a router bit or
two. I really didn't want to spend hundreds on accessories for an
unknown.

I guess the biggest hurdle for me is going to be joining my segmented
columns. There are many of those giant entryways out here that have
what look like 10' or higher columns. I can just imagine one of those
being my first job, haha!

Speaking of joining sections, I'm thinking of screwing on a 2" solid
wood cap on each end of a section and making round tenons to join each
section. Does that sound like a good way to go? Is there a better way?

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I've been asked to make some samples, advice please

[Chainlink]

Hey everyone!

I've been asked to make a sample of some columns to demonstrate what I
can make on the legacy. The person that I'm making the samples for has
branched out into home remodeling and does a lot of things like
rebuilding dilapidated front porches and stairways--we live in a town
that has a lot of historic properties. I suggested to him that I could
do 4 sided straight tapers and spiral columns up to 6 feet, solid or
hollow.

I am hoping to discuss profiles as well as accessories for the Legacy
that will help me achieve this goal.

What kinds of samples would you all suggest I make to demonstrate what
I could make for him? Since I'm limited to 6 feet, I was thinking of
making 4 different sections, kind of like a totem pole, with 4
different designs. I believe that my 1200 will turn 11" diameter, but
isn't it more like 9" from square stock?

I'm going to assume that for 9" diameter columns that the 2X gear set
is a necessity to get nice looking rope twists that aren't squashed
looking? Would you agree or suggest another alternative?

I also want to make some baluster samples. Do you think it's necessary
to create ultra ornate samples, or is a simple barley twist in the
middle of a post sufficient? I get the impression that too ornate
isn't really feasible from a time perspective. I can't foresee hollow
spirals being anything he'd use, but should I still make one as an
example?

What size router bits do I need to move up to to make designs in 9"
columns that look proper in scale? I have a 2" bit ( I think it's a
rope, still waiting on my design kit to verify), but do I need to be
looking at larger bits?

Do you recommend ordering direct from Magnate for accessories? It's
been 2 weeks since I ordered my design kit and index set through
legacy, and it hasn't arrived yet.

Thanks everyone for the advice. I'm hoping to have something to
present him around June 15th.

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Re: Headstock and Tailstock Alignment

[Chainlink]

Thanks for the tips!

On May 21, 8:01 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I have not seen this topic covered before in my user manual, or in this 
> group.  I came up with some simple tests and a procedure to align the 
> headstock and tailstock of the ornamental mill.  Out of the four machines 
> that I have recently worked on, all of them have been out of alignment.  At 
> this point, I'm not sure if they are aligned at the factory or not.
>
> http://www.artscopes.com/legacyornamentalmill/tools/hs_ts_tuneup/inde...
>
> I admit that there could be a better way, but my method is simple and easy to 
> perform.  Your results might vary. I would love to hear what you guys think.
>
> -Tim
>
> --
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Re: Toys

[Chainlink]

Thanks for the tips on posting photos. I'll try it next time I need to
post photos.

That's a mountain dulcimer, an american folk instrument that was
generally popular in the appalachians over the years. It's a very
forgiving instrument to make and a rather easy one to play if you're
not musically inclined. What I find really fascinating about them is
that they sound so different based on the types of wood you use and
the depth of the sides. I have one that's very bright and folksy, and
the one in the photo is more refined and mellow. They're a great
instrument that embodies individuality over the inflexibility of
process involved with traditional instruments. Since I fancy myself a
rather unique individual with eclectic tastes, it's a perfect fit for
a musical intrument to make and play.

On May 20, 3:38 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> Wow! those are some nice things that you have made Dustin!
> I realy like the Lute? (guitar thing) and those claw feet on that table are
> Real nice!
> Good job! ;-)
> Have a great day.
> C.A.G.
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 10:34 PM
> Subject: Re: Toys
>
> I'm not sure how to do photo attachments, so I'll try a couple links.
> I've got some of my woodworking stuff up on Facebook.
>
> http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041771&l=2bf0650881&id=112096...http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041761&l=afdf648b26&id=112096...http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041758&l=f8a1a35605&id=112096...http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041759&l=85d01b1ef9&id=112096...http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041762&l=b7d7f49550&id=112096...http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041770&l=c079e333ba&id=112096...
>
> On May 19, 10:09 pm, Chainlink  wrote:
> > Haha, I just love the puppet show picture! I think I've got about this
> > summer left in my 10 year old before he stops wanting to do those
> > kinds of things with his little sister and brother. That's why I'm
> > hoping the super fort/climbing wall/swingset will keep them all
> > together using their imaginations.
>
> > My dad is big on making hobby horses as well. He's on 40-50, IIRC.
> > There's a wonderful plan from issue #6 of Today's Woodworker (long out
> > of print, but available on ebay) that he's been using for well over 10
> > years now.
>
> > As for myself, I tried developing some tire treading jigs for making
> > monster trucks like the one on the cover of Tremendous Toy Trucks, but
> > it needed a little work. Now that I have the legacy, I'm thinking that
> > making a quick template and using the indexing head will get me the
> > treads on my tires that I want. I made a cool little dune buggy for my
> > son a couple years back. I'll try and dig up a photo or two. I also
> > made the best little circular saw toy that had a clicking mechanism on
> > the inside when you rolled it along the floor to make the blade spin.
>
> > Dustin
>
> > On May 19, 5:54 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
>
> > > Dustin
> > > If you like to make Kids toys and stuff. I have a few pictures of stuff
> > > Ive
> > > made. I enjoy makeing toys! ;-)
> > > Here are just a few. Even though some of these toys are not fancy, every
> > > one
> > > was in some part,was made with the use of Legacy.
> > > Good luck, I am realy looking forward to seeing what you come up
> > > with.Again
> > > good luck and happy woodworking.
> > > C.A.G.
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "Chainlink" 
> > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 12:57 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > > That's right, a princess bed for my daughter. I'm using the Legacy
> > > right now though for some parts on the ginormous playset that I'm
> > > building. Once that is done, I'm going to tackle the bed toward the
> > > end of summer.
>
> > > On May 18, 8:22 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > > > No problem. Your making a bed right? Can't wait to see how it works
> > > > out.
> > > > Post some pictures when you get a chance.
>
> > > > -Tim
>
> > > > - Original Message -
> > > > From: "Chainlink" 
> > > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills"
> > > > 
> > > > Sent: Tuesday

Re: Toys

[Chainlink]

I'm not sure how to do photo attachments, so I'll try a couple links.
I've got some of my woodworking stuff up on Facebook.

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041771&l=2bf0650881&id=1120965318
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041761&l=afdf648b26&id=1120965318
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041758&l=f8a1a35605&id=1120965318
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041759&l=85d01b1ef9&id=1120965318
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041762&l=b7d7f49550&id=1120965318
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041770&l=c079e333ba&id=1120965318


On May 19, 10:09 pm, Chainlink  wrote:
> Haha, I just love the puppet show picture! I think I've got about this
> summer left in my 10 year old before he stops wanting to do those
> kinds of things with his little sister and brother. That's why I'm
> hoping the super fort/climbing wall/swingset will keep them all
> together using their imaginations.
>
> My dad is big on making hobby horses as well. He's on 40-50, IIRC.
> There's a wonderful plan from issue #6 of Today's Woodworker (long out
> of print, but available on ebay) that he's been using for well over 10
> years now.
>
> As for myself, I tried developing some tire treading jigs for making
> monster trucks like the one on the cover of Tremendous Toy Trucks, but
> it needed a little work. Now that I have the legacy, I'm thinking that
> making a quick template and using the indexing head will get me the
> treads on my tires that I want. I made a cool little dune buggy for my
> son a couple years back. I'll try and dig up a photo or two. I also
> made the best little circular saw toy that had a clicking mechanism on
> the inside when you rolled it along the floor to make the blade spin.
>
> Dustin
>
> On May 19, 5:54 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Dustin
> > If you like to make Kids toys and stuff. I have a few pictures of stuff Ive
> > made. I enjoy makeing toys! ;-)
> > Here are just a few. Even though some of these toys are not fancy, every one
> > was in some part,was made with the use of Legacy.
> > Good luck, I am realy looking forward to seeing what you come up with.Again
> > good luck and happy woodworking.
> > C.A.G.
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Chainlink" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 12:57 PM
> > Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > That's right, a princess bed for my daughter. I'm using the Legacy
> > right now though for some parts on the ginormous playset that I'm
> > building. Once that is done, I'm going to tackle the bed toward the
> > end of summer.
>
> > On May 18, 8:22 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > > No problem. Your making a bed right? Can't wait to see how it works out.
> > > Post some pictures when you get a chance.
>
> > > -Tim
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "Chainlink" 
> > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > > Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 4:11 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > > > Yes, once I noticed the washers it was evident that the split nut
> > > > wasn't lined up with the lead screw well at all. The Y-axis lead screw
> > > > bracket was obviously bent, most likely from shipping damage. All I
> > > > did was straighten it out; it just needed a little straightening. It
> > > > sounds worse than it was.
>
> > > > I made a large 3-start rope twist column (well, my largest anyway)
> > > > today that was 4 feet long and 5" diameter (6.5" pitch IIRC).
> > > > Everything worked great and I'm really happy with the overall results.
> > > > I had some very slight misalignment somewhere that created a little
> > > > ridge where one start meets the next, but that's likely from hitting
> > > > some knots in the wood causing the bit depth to jump a little bit.
>
> > > > I think everything is setup properly now. Everything feels right, and
> > > > I'm amazed at how much easier the machine is to use than I expected.
>
> > > > Thanks everyone for the most excellent help in getting me set up and
> > > > running!
>
> > > > Dustin
>
> > > > --
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > > > Groups
>
> > > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post t

Re: Toys

[Chainlink]

I can't figure out how to make an attachment, so I'll post a couple
links to the things I make on facebook.

Dune Buggy: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041771&l=2bf0650881&id=1120965318
/a>

Mountain Dulcimer: 
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30041770&l=c079e333ba&id=1120965318

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Toys

[Chainlink]

Haha, I just love the puppet show picture! I think I've got about this
summer left in my 10 year old before he stops wanting to do those
kinds of things with his little sister and brother. That's why I'm
hoping the super fort/climbing wall/swingset will keep them all
together using their imaginations.

My dad is big on making hobby horses as well. He's on 40-50, IIRC.
There's a wonderful plan from issue #6 of Today's Woodworker (long out
of print, but available on ebay) that he's been using for well over 10
years now.

As for myself, I tried developing some tire treading jigs for making
monster trucks like the one on the cover of Tremendous Toy Trucks, but
it needed a little work. Now that I have the legacy, I'm thinking that
making a quick template and using the indexing head will get me the
treads on my tires that I want. I made a cool little dune buggy for my
son a couple years back. I'll try and dig up a photo or two. I also
made the best little circular saw toy that had a clicking mechanism on
the inside when you rolled it along the floor to make the blade spin.

Dustin


On May 19, 5:54 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
> Dustin
> If you like to make Kids toys and stuff. I have a few pictures of stuff Ive
> made. I enjoy makeing toys! ;-)
> Here are just a few. Even though some of these toys are not fancy, every one
> was in some part,was made with the use of Legacy.
> Good luck, I am realy looking forward to seeing what you come up with.Again
> good luck and happy woodworking.
> C.A.G.
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 12:57 PM
> Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> That's right, a princess bed for my daughter. I'm using the Legacy
> right now though for some parts on the ginormous playset that I'm
> building. Once that is done, I'm going to tackle the bed toward the
> end of summer.
>
> On May 18, 8:22 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > No problem. Your making a bed right? Can't wait to see how it works out.
> > Post some pictures when you get a chance.
>
> > -Tim
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Chainlink" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 4:11 PM
> > Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > > Yes, once I noticed the washers it was evident that the split nut
> > > wasn't lined up with the lead screw well at all. The Y-axis lead screw
> > > bracket was obviously bent, most likely from shipping damage. All I
> > > did was straighten it out; it just needed a little straightening. It
> > > sounds worse than it was.
>
> > > I made a large 3-start rope twist column (well, my largest anyway)
> > > today that was 4 feet long and 5" diameter (6.5" pitch IIRC).
> > > Everything worked great and I'm really happy with the overall results.
> > > I had some very slight misalignment somewhere that created a little
> > > ridge where one start meets the next, but that's likely from hitting
> > > some knots in the wood causing the bit depth to jump a little bit.
>
> > > I think everything is setup properly now. Everything feels right, and
> > > I'm amazed at how much easier the machine is to use than I expected.
>
> > > Thanks everyone for the most excellent help in getting me set up and
> > > running!
>
> > > Dustin
>
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > > Groups
>
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
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>
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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

That's right, a princess bed for my daughter. I'm using the Legacy
right now though for some parts on the ginormous playset that I'm
building. Once that is done, I'm going to tackle the bed toward the
end of summer.

On May 18, 8:22 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> No problem.  Your making a bed right?  Can't wait to see how it works out.
> Post some pictures when you get a chance.
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 4:11 PM
> Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > Yes, once I noticed the washers it was evident that the split nut
> > wasn't lined up with the lead screw well at all. The Y-axis lead screw
> > bracket was obviously bent, most likely from shipping damage. All I
> > did was straighten it out; it just needed a little straightening. It
> > sounds worse than it was.
>
> > I made a large 3-start rope twist column (well, my largest anyway)
> > today that was 4 feet long and 5" diameter (6.5" pitch IIRC).
> > Everything worked great and I'm really happy with the overall results.
> > I had some very slight misalignment somewhere that created a little
> > ridge where one start meets the next, but that's likely from hitting
> > some knots in the wood causing the bit depth to jump a little bit.
>
> > I think everything is setup properly now. Everything feels right, and
> > I'm amazed at how much easier the machine is to use than I expected.
>
> > Thanks everyone for the most excellent help in getting me set up and
> > running!
>
> > Dustin
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>
> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
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>
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>
>
>
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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Yes, once I noticed the washers it was evident that the split nut
wasn't lined up with the lead screw well at all. The Y-axis lead screw
bracket was obviously bent, most likely from shipping damage. All I
did was straighten it out; it just needed a little straightening. It
sounds worse than it was.

I made a large 3-start rope twist column (well, my largest anyway)
today that was 4 feet long and 5" diameter (6.5" pitch IIRC).
Everything worked great and I'm really happy with the overall results.
I had some very slight misalignment somewhere that created a little
ridge where one start meets the next, but that's likely from hitting
some knots in the wood causing the bit depth to jump a little bit.

I think everything is setup properly now. Everything feels right, and
I'm amazed at how much easier the machine is to use than I expected.

Thanks everyone for the most excellent help in getting me set up and
running!


Dustin

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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

I tried to adjust the brackets that hold the X lead screw, but I
didnt' have enough play to make enough difference, but it's still
incrementally better.

My Y split nut was really squirrley. I took a closer look at it and
there were two flat washers underneath the split nut where it attaches
to the carriage. I removed them and had to bend the front bracket that
holds the Y lead screw. It's amazingly smooth now and the backlash
trouble I was having with the split nut is gone. Needless to say, I'm
pretty happy.

I did notice some burrs on the lead screw. I think I'm going to ditch
the stops and go with a T-track stop instead on the X axis.

On May 17, 7:27 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Adjust the screw up or down.  Check the screw at one end of the machine, and
> check the other end.  The middle shouldn't be a problem.  There is enough
> play in the screw holes of the brackets to do this.  The screw on the Y and
> Z axis should be checked for binding too.  When your at it. check all of
> your screws for burrs on the threads.  I've had to take files to the edges
> in some cases.  I also have used 120-220 grit sandpaper to smooth and polish
> the acme screws.  It will save your split nuts in the future.
>
> Don't worry, I don't think those felt pads are important.  If you find out
> different please let us all know.
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 3:37 PM
> Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> Ok, I think the felt pads may have been a large part of the problem.
> I've noticed a few things:
>
> 1. The bottom of my split nut is dragging on the x-axis lead screw,
> especially at both ends.
> 2. the rear felt pad was ripped off the glue strip about an inch and a
> half on the right side. I cut it off.
> 3. The front felt pad, left side, was rolled over 1/4" making a high
> spot.
>
> Just by trimming the felt pads so far, I've eliminated most of the
> front rail bending that I described earlier. I can slide the carriage
> easier now, but I don't think there's much I can do about the split
> nut rubbing on the lead screw.
>
> On May 17, 6:03 pm, Chainlink  wrote:
> > As a matter of fact, the felt pad is coming off about 1" on the back
> > right side of the carriage. I think I'll cut that inch off and see if
> > I can get by until I order a new one. More later...
>
> > On May 17, 5:56 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
>
> > > The bushing in the front are some what shaped like a top hat and the
> bushing
> > > in the back should just be round parts. I mention this just incase it
> was
> > > put together wrong in the first place. Also check that the felt on the
> > > underside of the carriage is not pulling off and sticking on the rails.
> > > Total long shot, but I'm trying to figure out why you have so much drag
> > > myself.
>
> > > A bent rail in the groove could cause a problem, but I would think it
> would
> > > be a stop and seize type affair. Let us know what you find. Think before
> > > you modify anything. If you feel unsure, take a photo and send it along
> > > with your message.
>
> > > Good Luck,
>
> > > -Tim
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "Chainlink" 
> > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > > Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 2:40 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > > > Ok, I'll swap the rails then. I have the proper orientation with the
> > > > score marks facing out already, so I'm banking on that back rail being
> > > > the one that is tuned to the carriage. Who knows, my UPS box with the
> > > > rails had lots of footprints on them. I might be seeing some issues
> > > > from that mishandling as well.
>
> > > > At any rate, I'll spend the evening working on it and report back.
>
> > > > Thanks for all the advice and help!
>
> > > > Dustin
>
> > > > --
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups
>
> > > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
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> group, send email to
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>
> > >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>

Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Another update.

I've got it running pretty smoothly right now.Thanks for mentioning
the felt pad. I didn't realize how critical it was.

I think I also fixed my Z-axis depth issue. I took out both of the
right side black carriage bushings that were stripped and retapped
them with a 10-32 tap. I used a longer allen screw from the extra
parts and that tightened the entire assembly up considerably. My
theory is that those two screws might have been mistakenly used as an
attempt to lock the Z carriage.

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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Ok, I think the felt pads may have been a large part of the problem.
I've noticed a few things:

1. The bottom of my split nut is dragging on the x-axis lead screw,
especially at both ends.
2. the rear felt pad was ripped off the glue strip about an inch and a
half on the right side. I cut it off.
3. The front felt pad, left side, was rolled over 1/4" making a high
spot.

Just by trimming the felt pads so far, I've eliminated most of the
front rail bending that I described earlier. I can slide the carriage
easier now, but I don't think there's much I can do about the split
nut rubbing on the lead screw.

On May 17, 6:03 pm, Chainlink  wrote:
> As a matter of fact, the felt pad is coming off about 1" on the back
> right side of the carriage. I think I'll cut that inch off and see if
> I can get by until I order a new one. More later...
>
> On May 17, 5:56 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > The bushing in the front are some what shaped like a top hat and the bushing
> > in the back should just be round parts.  I mention this just incase it was
> > put together wrong in the first place.  Also check that the felt on the
> > underside of the carriage is not pulling off and sticking on the rails.
> > Total long shot, but I'm trying to figure out why you have so much drag
> > myself.
>
> > A bent rail in the groove could cause a problem, but I would think it would
> > be a stop and seize type affair. Let us know what you find.  Think before
> > you modify anything.  If you feel unsure, take a photo and send it along
> > with your message.
>
> > Good Luck,
>
> > -Tim
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Chainlink" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 2:40 PM
> > Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > > Ok, I'll swap the rails then. I have the proper orientation with the
> > > score marks facing out already, so I'm banking on that back rail being
> > > the one that is tuned to the carriage. Who knows, my UPS box with the
> > > rails had lots of footprints on them. I might be seeing some issues
> > > from that mishandling as well.
>
> > > At any rate, I'll spend the evening working on it and report back.
>
> > > Thanks for all the advice and help!
>
> > > Dustin
>
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
> > legacy-ornamental-mi...@googlegroups.com.> To unsubscribe from this group, 
> > send email to
>
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> > visit this group at
>
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
> > --
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> > - Show quoted text -
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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

As a matter of fact, the felt pad is coming off about 1" on the back
right side of the carriage. I think I'll cut that inch off and see if
I can get by until I order a new one. More later...

On May 17, 5:56 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> The bushing in the front are some what shaped like a top hat and the bushing
> in the back should just be round parts.  I mention this just incase it was
> put together wrong in the first place.  Also check that the felt on the
> underside of the carriage is not pulling off and sticking on the rails.
> Total long shot, but I'm trying to figure out why you have so much drag
> myself.
>
> A bent rail in the groove could cause a problem, but I would think it would
> be a stop and seize type affair. Let us know what you find.  Think before
> you modify anything.  If you feel unsure, take a photo and send it along
> with your message.
>
> Good Luck,
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chainlink" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 2:40 PM
> Subject: Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please
>
> > Ok, I'll swap the rails then. I have the proper orientation with the
> > score marks facing out already, so I'm banking on that back rail being
> > the one that is tuned to the carriage. Who knows, my UPS box with the
> > rails had lots of footprints on them. I might be seeing some issues
> > from that mishandling as well.
>
> > At any rate, I'll spend the evening working on it and report back.
>
> > Thanks for all the advice and help!
>
> > Dustin
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>
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>
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>
>
>
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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Ok, I'll swap the rails then. I have the proper orientation with the
score marks facing out already, so I'm banking on that back rail being
the one that is tuned to the carriage. Who knows, my UPS box with the
rails had lots of footprints on them. I might be seeing some issues
from that mishandling as well.

At any rate, I'll spend the evening working on it and report back.

Thanks for all the advice and help!

Dustin

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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Hmm, it's definitely not that easy to move my carriage along the x-
axis freehand. I would estimate 20 pounds of force (a good shove to
get it moving). I'm thinking that I put the rails back together in the
wrong order. They were both labeled top rail, but I didn't know which
was the front or back. I'll bet this is what's up. The black carriage
bushings might be tuned for the back rail as I have it assembled. I
wonder if it would be better to disassemble down to the rails again or
just tune the bushings for the current rail. Any thoughts?

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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

So, I was able to identify what that movement was on the x-axis. The
entire front rail is flexing when I start to crank the handle. I added
some PTFE lube to the rail which helped a little bit, but I think
ultimately I'll be adding some kind of bed to the top rails to stop
the flexion.

I also used the z-axis to level the bed at the four corners. I had
some kind of 60 degree centering tool that came along with the package
that I chucked into the router. I fit a feeler gauge in between it and
the rail to set each corner level. I think next time I'll just use
some kind of 1/2" straight bar stock because the 60 degree center was
a little rough on my feeler gauge and rails.



On May 17, 7:52 am, SteveEJ  wrote:
> I bought a set of the TK Bed Height adjustment tools for my 900 with
> Standard CNC. They were easy to install and made very well. After
> installing them I checked the bed with simple measurements. They were
> right on. Tim might have some more if you are interested.
>
> You will like what the machine can do! Have fun and welcome!
>
> Steve
>
> On May 17, 7:45 am, Chainlink  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Thanks Tim!
>
> > I saw your invention, very nice. I have a baggie with some delrin
> > screws in it, and I saw the page in the manual on installing them that
> > I missed when I assembled everything, so I'm going to revisit that
> > today. I'm confident that things will work out. Thanks for the tip on
> > using the Z-axis DRO for leveling the bed. I would have needed to
> > stare at the mill for a long while before that thought would have
> > occurred to me!
>
> > I'm fired up to make something. Just gotta find the time...
>
> > --
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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Thanks Tim!

I saw your invention, very nice. I have a baggie with some delrin
screws in it, and I saw the page in the manual on installing them that
I missed when I assembled everything, so I'm going to revisit that
today. I'm confident that things will work out. Thanks for the tip on
using the Z-axis DRO for leveling the bed. I would have needed to
stare at the mill for a long while before that thought would have
occurred to me!

I'm fired up to make something. Just gotta find the time...

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Which bottom cleaning router bit?

[Chainlink]

My carbide is chipped on my bottom cleaning bit, and I need to get a
new one. Looking at Magnate.net, why would I choose one diameter of
bit over another? My current bit is 1 1/2", so I'm going to replace
it. I wanted to know what you all thought before I pay for shipping
for just one router bit.

Thanks!

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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Thanks for the advice. I've got a Carvewright, so I'm thinking that it
can take care of the things a rotary table would be good for. If
there's something I'm missing, please advise.

I've got a new issue that may be normal, may be a problem. I took the
Z-axis off and installed the missing depth lock screw on the left side
that was missing. I put the large template follower onto the back of
the z-axis as directed in the manual. It seems like the added weight
of the template follower causes the entire Y/Z assembly to twist when
I start to crank the X-axis. Is this normal and/or is there an
adjustment to eliminate that twist. I'm guessing that is why they
recommend that you only do barley twists cutting from the headstock to
the tailstock and not rout up and back. Is it common practice to leave
the template follower off until you need it, or always leave it on?

Thanks again all!

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Re: Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Thanks all for the quick replies. I'm very pleased that this is an
active community.

I downloaded the PDFs and put them in a binder to read in my free
time. It's a shame that they still aren't made. I could see them being
a great resource for tips and projects of the month type articles.
Ahh, if I only had more free time, I'd take the newsletter thing on
myself.

I've been to Art's website a number of times over the past couple
years. Guys like that are a real creative inspiration.

I took a closer look at my z-axis and referenced it to the manual I
have. It looks like I'm missing the left side locking screw. The allen
screws that hold on the black z-axis bushings (the ones that roll
inside the aluminum track) are stripped. It doesn't look like that was
the proper hardware for it anyway, based on the photo in the manual.
I'm also not seeing how that depth stop could actually function, so it
may also be installed improperly on my machine. I think I'm looking at
re-assembling it to try and tighten things up a bit.

One of the PDFs had the technique for leveling the bed, but at the end
of it there was this dial indicator contraption that slid along the
rails. I could easily make one of those, so I think that's the way
I'll go. When leveling the bed, when you do each corner, do you
tighten the screw so that portion of the bed is now fixed? Would that
mean that sometimes you need to rack the bed a little bit to get it
level all the way around? Does adding the bed spoil board add rigidity
or some other aid to the Legacy? I'm thinking that I could always keep
one on of differing lengths on the tailstock end if it helps.

I was a little concerned about asking too many questions of the Legacy
guys since I bought a used mill. I didn't know if they'd be receptive
to answering questions since I got my mill used. I'd love some
opinions on if I should worry about that or not. I feel bad about it,
but if their mills were cheaper new, it wouldn't have been an issue.

Thanks everyone. I look forward to chatting again later.

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Bought used 1200, need advice please

[Chainlink]

Hello group! After years of searching, I finally found a great deal on
a 1200 with z-axis--about a week before Legacy announced their final
production run deal, DOH! I've got a few issues and would appreciate
some direction. The mill was practically rolled here in boxes by UPS
halfway across the country, so I'm sure some adjustments will be in
order.

1. What's on Training DVD #1? I have DVD #2, but I feel like I'm
missing some pretty important info.

2. My Z-axis depth is walking on me if I take more than a shallow cut.
I read that there's some kind of adjustment that you can make to
tighten up the handwheel, but I could use more details. Any point in
the right direction would be great.

3. I've got some leveliing issues that need some help. I've got a few
hundreths of taper over 2 feet on the tailstock side. I tried leveling
the bed to the frame with an adjustable square (which helped) but the
back bed rail sets 3/16" lower than the front bed rail. I read that
someone else has this issue and that it was considered normal. What
else am I missing? Is it also critically important to have the frame
level to the floor, or is adjusting the bed relative to the frame
sufficient?

4. I heard that there was a magazine or PDF for Legacy owners. What's
in it and how do I get it? Is it a print magazine or PDF? Is it
useful?


Thanks for any help :)

Dustin in PA

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