Re: Extruded rail material source

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

Other than needing to acquire a longer lead screw, what is there
preventing someone from using two 900s to make a 8 foot system?   I
believe the carriage would still be able to ride through from one
frame to the other.  Clearly one would have to place both systems on a
common platform and perhaps connect them to make sure the two stable.

I have few mechanical skills, but to me seems away around looker for
longer extrusions.  I also think the cost of the alum rails are
roughly $25 a foot thru legacy.  If that's true four 9ft rails would
cost approx $900.  That's a lot if you don't mean use the system to
make money, but not much of an investment if you mean to make columns
for the market.

Moreover, since Legacy decided to withdraw from both the small and the
large ornamental mill market, they have left the door open for
innovation.

Begat

On Dec 5, 4:04 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> Hello everyone
> Shoot Tim I was going to tell everyone about Dependable...
> Finding the Acme screw is not hard, but over 8' the screw starts becoming to 
> flexible and will need some sort of bridge to hold the screw from bending.
> Now the Alum. I still have not found a source.But I know it has to be out 
> there!
> Making a LARGE Legacy type of machine has been a dream of mine for years. 
> (Dreams are for chasing, not catching,its the Drive that keeps you going.) 
> :-) I have no idea on if I will ever be able to make my machine, but it 
> hasn't stopped me for trying to find the sources to get the materials to make 
> the Dream come true.
> The 8/20 system is close to the Alum rail, its not the same, but its easy to 
> find and buy.(http://8020.net/)
>
> Just my two cents worth of it today.
> I have to get to work now.
> have a great day all.
>
> C.A.G.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
>   From: Tim Krause
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Monday, December 05, 2011 12:47 AM
>   Subject: Re: Re: Extruded rail material source
>
>  http://dependableacme.com/class.htm#screwis one source of 5/8-4tpi acme 
> thread in long lengths.   I don't know if they do international shipping or 
> not.
>
>   -Tim
>
>     - Original Message -
>     From: Bill Bulkeley
>     To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>     Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2011 9:27 PM
>     Subject: Re: Re: Extruded rail material source
>
>     interesting, I am very interested in the longer acme thread is it 1/4 
> pitch 4TPI like the legacy one? please can you give me the web sight of that
>
>     Bill
>       - Original Message -
>       From: carstenstig...@verizon.net
>       To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>       Sent: Monday, December 05, 2011 3:54 PM
>       Subject: Re: Re: Extruded rail material source
>
>       Bill, If memory serves me right the tekno slot will take a 3/4 wide 1/4 
> thick piece of bar stock which we used to drill out to either 1/4-20 or 
> 5/16-18 for standard bolts. I do believe that when you download the modutek 
> catalogue is shows the bolt head also sliding in the slot. I have been moving 
> 8 or so 10 foot pieces of the one slot stuff for years and plan on making the 
> panel saw from some plans I have and also looking into longer acme screw 
> material for a longer machine that is about 2 feet longer than the 900 I use 
> now. I have been looking into making a rail extension that will just bolt up. 
> I am looking at moving the carriage onto rollers and making an arm tht bolts 
> to the lead screw bracket that would continue the drive for a longer distance 
> down the rail. Nothing further in planning than the drawing board at this 
> time.
>
>       As a note I am working on a few custom candle holders that are about 4 
> feet high with a hollow spiral in them made from some 4" stock I came into.  
> Pics to follow soon if I can get them finished before the new year.
>
>       In His Service
>
>       Carl Stigers
>
>       WWW.treetothee.com
>
>       On 12/04/11, Bill Bulkeley wrote:
>
>       thank you Carl when you say similar did they have anything with the 
> wide groove in it the same that is in the legacy rails that's the hard one to 
> find the wide groove
>
>       Bill
>         - Original Message -
>         From: carsten stigers
>         To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>         Sent: Monday, December 05, 2011 12:51 PM
>         Subject: Extruded rail material source
>
>         Greetings everyone. If one is looking for extruded aluminum to make 
> rails go tohttp://www.tekno.com/html/downloads_.html.  I used to work at a 
> conveyor company and we used very similiar extrusion. As far as the nuts and 
> bolts you can get those a lot cheaper from a local supplier like Fastenal. 
> the plans from one of the mags for a panel saw used this stuff.
>
>         Carl Stigers
>
>         > yes it does look like a little bit of legacy rail in there I wonder 
> if he
>         > got it from legacy if not id love to know were

Home Made CNC Router Lathe that Looks Like Converted Ornamental Mill

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

I've been out surfing again.  Found an ad for a cnc router-lathe for
sale for 4K.  Looks like someone built a cnc based on the rail system
of the legacy or some similar alum. rails.  He or she is selling it
for 4K.  
http://www.spreadmyad.com/indianapolis/merchandise/tools/10422791-cnc-router-lathe-indpls-4000

There are lots of skilled people out here!

Begat

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Re: Legacy newest offer

[begatbrown]

Hey C.A.G,

The watercooled spindles are very quiet. I use ear protection when I
run the router on my 900, but never do so when using the cnc with the
spindle.

The water cooled spindles are worth the money if you are carving very
detailed drawings.  They run for hours without stopping.  Routers
can't do that.  Plus, I run my spindle while the family sleeps without
waking anyone.  Can't do that with the router.  That did not go over
well the one time I tried! (he, he, he!)

Begat



On Nov 30, 7:29 pm, CURTIS   GEORGEwrote:
> Half Price Spindle Upgrade
> Purchase an Arty CNC woodworking system before December 31 , 2011 and receive 
> a 3HP Liquid Cooled Spindle for Half Price !  That's a savings of $ 1,400 .
>
> I personally have not seen one of these Liquid cooled motors. But I have 
> heard that These baby's are very quite.
> Dose anyone have any First hand info. on these units?
> I know that Legacy has to be buying these motors form someone, Has anyone 
> heard anything from other people that are useing these motors?
> That's a LOT of money,
> curious minds just want to know.  ;-)
>
> C.A.G.
>
>
>

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Re: Interesting Turning Club Article on Legacy Machine

[begatbrown]

Ron,

That's a great story.  I've seen people stuck in their ways, but never
at such a great price.  One of the reasons I like cnc is that it will
allow an individual a good chance of being a truly independent and
successful professional woodworker--something that has been impossible
(with few exceptions) for the average woodworker for over 150 years.

Begat

On Dec 2, 6:13 pm, Ron Taylor  wrote:
> I was the chief inspector for Westland Helicopters hydraulics division for
> about 10 years. This particular division had been owned by a turner and
> sold to Westland after about 20 years of trading and it was almost
> unbelievable the extent to which plans and jigs had been made in order to
> allow the products to be manufactured on a lathe!! After about 1 year,
> product planning and manufacturing processes had been modified to accept
> other more suitable manufacturing methods. This makes me aware of how a
> turner (or perhaps any other machinist) may be driven to make products in a
> way that may represent the one discipline that they are most familiar with.
> I can only say that I believe we should be open to changes, updates and
> improvements to our disciplines and not to be hidebound by that to which we
> are most familiar. Change may be difficult to accept, or it may be
> something we can't afford, but I believe we should all be open to change
> and try to enjoy the fact that the next generation of woodworkers may have
> many methods not open to ourselves. Lets all enjoy our hobbies and
> businesses and learn all we can of the new disciplines as they arrive just
> for the fun of it.. That's my 5 cents for what it's worth.
> Ron.
>
> On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 3:45 PM, begatbrown wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hello,
>
> > Now, that's something I did not understand.  So most people turn
> > primarily for pleasure?  Now, I do understand this better.
>
> > I have seen bowls and vases that are absolute pieces of art, and I can
> > see people who want to do everything with a single device and one they
> > can more easily afford.  Okay.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Dec 2, 3:54 pm, Myck Rych  wrote:
> > > Turners seem to be purists. I am a turner & am not. I use the tool that
> > > best does what I want to achieve. I have a 900 and that is enuf for me. I
> > > think it was worth the $$. Most turners do not, as they want quick
> > projects
> > > and make it from a blown down tree. I sold my turnings for 25 yrs & the
> > > mill made my work stand out. Most folks don't sell. They give away to
> > > family & friends. So the cost of a mill seems very very high to them.
>
> > > On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 12:19 PM, begatbrown  > >wrote:
>
> > > > Why anyone who does woodworking with a power tool has a problem with
> > > > an ornamental mill is beyond me.  I do get why folks who do
> > > > traditional turning can look down on the lack of physical risk taking
> > > > with ornamental mill users just as airplane pilots who fly without
> > > > wind shields can think less of those who pilot planes with windshields
> > > > and jet engines.
>
> > > > Limitations notwithstanding, the ability to turn stock AND work flat
> > > > stock makes ornamental mills worth the while.  One of the reasons I to
> > > > replace my 900 with an 1800 is that it is a eight-foot overhead router
> > > > as well as a column maker.  Anyone who has less than an 8 inch jointer
> > > > should want a legacy for jointing alone. With a 8inch costing between
> > > > $2K and $3K, a legacy is a deal.  I have surfaced 10 inch and 11 inch
> > > > wide boards that a 3K jointer could not have helped me with.
>
> > > > The pictures on the legacy woodworking site showing what the
> > > > ornamental mills can do speak for themselves.  The only shame is that
> > > > the bigger machines did not have enough of a market to continue their
> > > > production.
>
> > > > Begat
>
> > > > On Dec 1, 9:09 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > > > > There's some good links in there.
>
> > > > > Has anyone else noticed that the Legacy products are either not well
> > > > known
> > > > > in turning circles or people think they cost too much and would not
> > be a
> > > > > useful tool?  There also seem to be some bias towards the items
> > created
> > > > on
> > > > > our mills as not being hand crafted.  I would go so far to say the
> > latest
> > > > &

Re: Interesting Turning Club Article on Legacy Machine

[begatbrown]

Hello,

Now, that's something I did not understand.  So most people turn
primarily for pleasure?  Now, I do understand this better.

I have seen bowls and vases that are absolute pieces of art, and I can
see people who want to do everything with a single device and one they
can more easily afford.  Okay.

Begat



On Dec 2, 3:54 pm, Myck Rych  wrote:
> Turners seem to be purists. I am a turner & am not. I use the tool that
> best does what I want to achieve. I have a 900 and that is enuf for me. I
> think it was worth the $$. Most turners do not, as they want quick projects
> and make it from a blown down tree. I sold my turnings for 25 yrs & the
> mill made my work stand out. Most folks don't sell. They give away to
> family & friends. So the cost of a mill seems very very high to them.
>
> On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 12:19 PM, begatbrown 
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Why anyone who does woodworking with a power tool has a problem with
> > an ornamental mill is beyond me.  I do get why folks who do
> > traditional turning can look down on the lack of physical risk taking
> > with ornamental mill users just as airplane pilots who fly without
> > wind shields can think less of those who pilot planes with windshields
> > and jet engines.
>
> > Limitations notwithstanding, the ability to turn stock AND work flat
> > stock makes ornamental mills worth the while.  One of the reasons I to
> > replace my 900 with an 1800 is that it is a eight-foot overhead router
> > as well as a column maker.  Anyone who has less than an 8 inch jointer
> > should want a legacy for jointing alone. With a 8inch costing between
> > $2K and $3K, a legacy is a deal.  I have surfaced 10 inch and 11 inch
> > wide boards that a 3K jointer could not have helped me with.
>
> > The pictures on the legacy woodworking site showing what the
> > ornamental mills can do speak for themselves.  The only shame is that
> > the bigger machines did not have enough of a market to continue their
> > production.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Dec 1, 9:09 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > > There's some good links in there.
>
> > > Has anyone else noticed that the Legacy products are either not well
> > known
> > > in turning circles or people think they cost too much and would not be a
> > > useful tool?  There also seem to be some bias towards the items created
> > on
> > > our mills as not being hand crafted.  I would go so far to say the latest
> > > cnc rage suffers from the same stigma.  It seems people cannot appreciate
> > > the skills involved with our style of products and capabilities.  They
> > > discount all preparation and design work and think the machine did it
> > all.
>
> > > -Tim
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "begatbrown" 
> > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > > Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2011 8:59 AM
> > > Subject: Interesting Turning Club Article on Legacy Machine
>
> > > > Hello All,
>
> > > > Here's a link to a turning club article on a member who has an
> > > > ornamental mill.  This site also has lots of other links.  Really
> > > > wanted to pass that along too.  There's an article on the revo linked
> > > > to this site as well.
>
> > >http://www.dupdf.info/view.php?id=zvwoodturners.org/Newsletters/Zumbr...
>
> > > > Begat
>
> > > > --
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > Groups
>
> > > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
> > > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.> To unsubscribe from this
> > group, send email to
>
> > > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.> For more
> > options, visit this group at
>
> > >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.

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Re: Interesting Turning Club Article on Legacy Machine

[begatbrown]

Why anyone who does woodworking with a power tool has a problem with
an ornamental mill is beyond me.  I do get why folks who do
traditional turning can look down on the lack of physical risk taking
with ornamental mill users just as airplane pilots who fly without
wind shields can think less of those who pilot planes with windshields
and jet engines.

Limitations notwithstanding, the ability to turn stock AND work flat
stock makes ornamental mills worth the while.  One of the reasons I to
replace my 900 with an 1800 is that it is a eight-foot overhead router
as well as a column maker.  Anyone who has less than an 8 inch jointer
should want a legacy for jointing alone. With a 8inch costing between
$2K and $3K, a legacy is a deal.  I have surfaced 10 inch and 11 inch
wide boards that a 3K jointer could not have helped me with.

The pictures on the legacy woodworking site showing what the
ornamental mills can do speak for themselves.  The only shame is that
the bigger machines did not have enough of a market to continue their
production.

Begat


On Dec 1, 9:09 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> There's some good links in there.
>
> Has anyone else noticed that the Legacy products are either not well known
> in turning circles or people think they cost too much and would not be a
> useful tool?  There also seem to be some bias towards the items created on
> our mills as not being hand crafted.  I would go so far to say the latest
> cnc rage suffers from the same stigma.  It seems people cannot appreciate
> the skills involved with our style of products and capabilities.  They
> discount all preparation and design work and think the machine did it all.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2011 8:59 AM
> Subject: Interesting Turning Club Article on Legacy Machine
>
> > Hello All,
>
> > Here's a link to a turning club article on a member who has an
> > ornamental mill.  This site also has lots of other links.  Really
> > wanted to pass that along too.  There's an article on the revo linked
> > to this site as well.
>
> http://www.dupdf.info/view.php?id=zvwoodturners.org/Newsletters/Zumbr...
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>
> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
> legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.> To unsubscribe from this group, 
> send email to
>
> legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.> For more options, 
> visit this group at
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Interesting Turning Club Article on Legacy Machine

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

Here's a link to a turning club article on a member who has an
ornamental mill.  This site also has lots of other links.  Really
wanted to pass that along too.  There's an article on the revo linked
to this site as well.

http://www.dupdf.info/view.php?id=zvwoodturners.org/Newsletters/Zumbro%20Valley%20Woodturners%202007-11.pdf&k=legacy%20ornamental%20mill%20used

Begat

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Column made in sections

[begatbrown]

I'd never run into this guy's work before.  He has a model 1800 and
has made some nice stuff and some interesting jigs and fixtures.
http://lumberjocks.com/projects/46210

Begat

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Re: Legacy 1800 For Sale Update

[begatbrown]

Hello Vince,

I wish you the best in selling your 1800, but I have to move along.

Begat

On Nov 22, 6:28 pm, CB  wrote:
> Hi Gavin. I am getting close to seperating the whole package. The
> interest expressed for going that route has put a claim to a good deal
> of the pakage. Please email me your contact info
> charlesme...@yahoo.com or give me a call (541)  954-9438.
>
> On Nov 22, 12:19 am, Brigitte Graham 
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > *Hi Vince,*
> > *I don't know if I have missed the boat on this item, but, if you are going
> > to split the package up, I am interested in all the router bits. We live in
> > UK and it is difficult to get the Magnate bits, other than new via mail
> > order..*
> > *Regards*
> > *Gavin Graham
> > *
> > On 21 November 2011 20:55, CB  wrote:
>
> > > Thanks for the interest. I will put your name by these items. I have a
> > > some interest from off the mainland for the whole package. I will
> > > probably sit on this for the next week or so. But it looks as though
> > > we are getting enough response to part the package and machine.
>
> > > I will let you know asap
>
> > > Vince
>
> > > On Nov 11, 5:08 pm, begatbrown  wrote:
> > > > Hello CB,
>
> > > > I'm interested, but I own most of the accessories you've listed and
> > > > now have a fairly large assortment of Magnate bits.  For me, I'd
> > > > consider the basic machine (which apparently came with the linear
> > > > drive) plus
>
> > > > 2X multiplier gear set
> > > > Z axis upgrade, never installed (no router or digital scale)
> > > > Assorted documentation, magazines and videos.
>
> > > > Begat
>
> > > > On Nov 11, 1:17 pm, CB  wrote:
>
> > > > > Thanks Bill. I will put you down next to those parts.
>
> > > > > On Nov 8, 6:38 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
>
> > > > > > if you separate I'm interested in the template rail mounting kit
> > > > > > and the thin stock support
>
> > > > > > Bill
>
> > > > > > - Original Message -
> > > > > > From: "Tim Krause" 
> > > > > > To: 
> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2011 1:24 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: Legacy 1800 For Sale Update
>
> > > > > > This is horrible news Vince.  I've put the details back on the Web
> > > site for
> > > > > > those that do not remember this machine and all of the accessories.
>
> > > > > >http://ornamentalmills.com/forsale/rl1800.html
>
> > > > > > Bill is in Australia so I doubt he will be calling anytime soon :-)
>
> > > > > > -Tim
>
> > > > > > - Original Message -
> > > > > > From: "CB" 
> > > > > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" <
> > > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com>
> > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 2:18 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Legacy 1800 For Sale Update
>
> > > > > > > Roger, feel free to give me a call back.
>
> > > > > > > For anyone who would like to email: vi...@renewedcreations.net
>
> > > > > > > Phone is the best way.
>
> > > > > > > Taking Offers
>
> > > > > > > --
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> > > > > > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
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>
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Re: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle

[begatbrown]

Hello JWB,

>From what I've seen by googling, you're right about the weight!  That
just let's me know I'm asking for when I say I want to make 8 foot
columns.

When I get around to it, I'm going to turn a 6"x6" by both my 900 and
my Arty 58 and see.  Never tried anything but hollow thus far.

Begat

On Nov 16, 6:08 pm, jwb...@insightbb.com wrote:
> If I am not mistaking I think oak weighs 50 pounds per cuibic foot. I am not 
> sure if that would be green or dried. If looking at that I would figure the 
> weight at about 700 pounds. And I cannot picture the screw on hubs holding 
> that weight.
> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: "Tim Krause" 
>
> Sender: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:41:43
> To: 
> Reply-To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle
>
> I believe the machine can do up to 13" in diameter.  Does anyone know what
> the weight of a log that's 15' long and 13" in diameter would weigh?  Even a
> hollow column has to be pretty heavy at that size.  It makes me wonder if
> Legacy ever mentioned any weight restrictions on their machine.  I've never
> seen any limits mentioned.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 7:24 PM
> Subject: Re: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle
>
> Hello,
>
> I also thought the swing diameter was incorrect.  If I lived in the
> area, I would drive buy just to see it.
>
> Begat
>
> On Nov 14, 8:54 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > This one just might really be a custom built machine like the ad says. The
> 2200 did have a 8 hp Colombo spindle. It also came with the extra 1/4 hp
> motor for separate spindle drive which this machine has. What seems a little
> off on this machine is the capacity (only 10"?). It should be a larger
> diameter and the length should be shorter length than what they are saying
> judging by the number of legs and panels I'm seeing. I'm also not seeing the
> 4x gear set that would have came with these machines. It's still a great
> price if you need a monster.
>
> > -Tim
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: CURTIS GEORGE
> > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 10:58 AM
> > Subject: Re: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle
>
> > Wow what a machine!!!
>
> > If Im not mistaken that is the 2200. For $6000.00 that is a very good
> deal.
>
> > I realy wish I had to space for that monster. thank for the Heads-Up.
> Beg...
>
> > That's the kind of stuff Dreams are made out of. ;-)
>
> > C.A.G.
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 11:35:02 AM
> > Subject: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle
>
> > Hello All,
>
> > Here's a link for a ebay classified ad for a 15 Foot--yes, 180 inches--
> > capacity custom ornamental mill. It also has a 7.5 hp columbo spindle
> > included in the price. Now that's worth 6K!!! The link:
> >http://kansascity.ebayclassifieds.com/business-industrial/olathe/15-f...
>
> > Tim, you can add this one to your ornamental mill photo collection!!
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
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> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
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> legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
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>
> > --
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Re: dust shield

[begatbrown]

Hello C.A.G.

Looks like a good prototype to me.  I need something, too.  And what
kind of wood are you turning?

Begat

On Nov 16, 6:55 pm, CURTIS   GEORGEwrote:
> Hello guys.
>
> This is my first successful attempt to limit the wood chips from bogging down 
> my rails on my Legacy. (an old 1000ex)
>
> Ive found four different ways that did not work. (but why talk about 
> failures? Even though I did learn from each of them.) ;-)
>
> Here are a few photos of the screen shield. ( I used vinyl window  screening 
> as my chip shield.)
>
> This is a very simple jig.
>
> Even though Im using screen which lets the fine dust through,this idea works 
> to stop most of the stuff flying into my rails. I am planing to
>
> use some soft clear plastic sheeting on my next test run.
>
> But here are the results from this test.  (look at the pictures)
>
> This is to easy. ( I almost cant believe it works as well as it did). I used 
> a piece of vinyl window screen 8"x3" I made a  holder that attached to the 
> router on my Legacy.
>
> On this test I cut from the tail stock end towards the head stock. I cut on 
> the left side of center  (clime milling)
>
> Please let me know what you think.
>
> There is more to come, on this topic.
>
> Until then.
>
> talk to you all latter.
>
> C.A.G.
>
>
>
>  P1040389.JPG
> 603KViewDownload
>
>  P1040388.JPG
> 496KViewDownload
>
>  P1040394.JPG
> 434KViewDownload

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Re: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle

[begatbrown]

Hello,

I also thought the swing diameter was incorrect.  If I lived in the
area, I would drive buy just to see it.

Begat

On Nov 14, 8:54 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> This one just might really be a custom built machine like the ad says.  The 
> 2200 did have a 8 hp Colombo spindle. It also came with the extra 1/4 hp 
> motor for separate spindle drive which this machine has.  What seems a little 
> off on this machine is the capacity (only 10"?).  It should be a larger 
> diameter and the length should be shorter length than what they are saying 
> judging by the number of legs and panels I'm seeing.  I'm also not seeing the 
> 4x gear set that would have came with these machines. It's still a great 
> price if you need a monster.
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: CURTIS GEORGE
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 10:58 AM
>   Subject: Re: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle
>
>   Wow what a machine!!!
>
>   If Im not mistaken that is the 2200. For $6000.00 that is a very good deal.
>
>   I realy wish I had to space for that monster. thank for the Heads-Up. Beg...
>
>   That's the kind of stuff Dreams are made out of. ;-)
>
>   C.A.G.
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: "begatbrown" 
>   To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
>   Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 11:35:02 AM
>   Subject: 15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle
>
>   Hello All,
>
>   Here's a link for a ebay classified ad for a 15 Foot--yes, 180 inches--
>   capacity custom ornamental mill.  It also has a 7.5 hp columbo spindle
>   included in the price.  Now that's worth 6K!!!  The link:
>  http://kansascity.ebayclassifieds.com/business-industrial/olathe/15-f...
>
>   Tim, you can add this one to your ornamental mill photo collection!!
>
>   Begat
>
>   --
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>
>   --
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15 Foot Legacy Mill for 6K with a $2.5K Columbo Spindle

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

Here's a link for a ebay classified ad for a 15 Foot--yes, 180 inches--
capacity custom ornamental mill.  It also has a 7.5 hp columbo spindle
included in the price.  Now that's worth 6K!!!  The link:
http://kansascity.ebayclassifieds.com/business-industrial/olathe/15-foot-legacy-ornamental-mill-router-lathe/?ad=14506609

Tim, you can add this one to your ornamental mill photo collection!!

Begat

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Re: Legacy 1800 For Sale Update

[begatbrown]

Hello CB,

I'm interested, but I own most of the accessories you've listed and
now have a fairly large assortment of Magnate bits.  For me, I'd
consider the basic machine (which apparently came with the linear
drive) plus

2X multiplier gear set
Z axis upgrade, never installed (no router or digital scale)
Assorted documentation, magazines and videos.

Begat


On Nov 11, 1:17 pm, CB  wrote:
> Thanks Bill. I will put you down next to those parts.
>
> On Nov 8, 6:38 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > if you separate I'm interested in the template rail mounting kit
> > and the thin stock support
>
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Tim Krause" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2011 1:24 PM
> > Subject: Re: Legacy 1800 For Sale Update
>
> > This is horrible news Vince.  I've put the details back on the Web site for
> > those that do not remember this machine and all of the accessories.
>
> >http://ornamentalmills.com/forsale/rl1800.html
>
> > Bill is in Australia so I doubt he will be calling anytime soon :-)
>
> > -Tim
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "CB" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 2:18 PM
> > Subject: Legacy 1800 For Sale Update
>
> > > Roger, feel free to give me a call back.
>
> > > For anyone who would like to email: vi...@renewedcreations.net
>
> > > Phone is the best way.
>
> > > Taking Offers
>
> > > --
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>
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>
> > -
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Re:

[begatbrown]

Hello Michael,

What is the rpm?  If it goes faster than 15000, I would think twice
before going larger than 2 inches in diameter, but tend to play it
safe.  Others might have better advice.  Some bit manufacturers have
recommended speeds on their websites.

Begat

On Nov 11, 12:37 pm, michael holland  wrote:
> Hi all
> I have a Z Axis upgrade on my 900 which has a single speed Porter Cable.
> Does anyone know how large I can safely go with the router bits?
> Thanks
> Michael

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Re: Vertical Mounting Brackets

[begatbrown]

Hello Tim,

Thanks for the visual.  It's what I suspected.  I take it that you're
able to get stability and accuracy with the system attached only to
one rail rather than the two rails utilized on the revo.  I have put
together a wooden jig with t-tracks to cut dovetails using my Arty,
but because it attaches to only one rail I have to use a clamping
system to the jig vertical; it wants to tilt when it's tightened.

Because all of legacy's systems (manual and cnc) use the same tracks,
your brackets might be very useful to many folks.  To surface boards,
I took the horizontal vice and cut off about an inch from each rail to
fit the Arty, and I can quickly set up.

Email me and let me know what you'd charge for a set of your
"vertical" system.  By the way, your after market products (such as
the reversible gear) for legacy only helps make their systems more
valuable.  They would also do well to license out the ability for
people to continue to make their other manual machines like the revo
and the 200.  From what I can see, you enter woodworking at the point
your money allows you and you trade up as you make or get more money.

Begat

On Nov 5, 9:44 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> When I used it, I was adding some dovetail slots to table legs.  I clamped
> the legs to wood and cut the angles in both sides of the leg.  This was
> using the y axis travel.  It was similar to what was being used on the revo
> at the time.  http://legacywoodworking.com/class.cfm?id=42 except they had
> theirs setup on the x-axis.   I don't have the jig near me or I would set it
> up and show you what I did.
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2011 4:01 PM
> Subject: Re: Vertical Mounting Brackets
>
> Tim,
>
> I think I have the concept, but I'd like to see the set up and know
> what you did and could use them to do.
>
> Begat
>
> On Nov 5, 4:56 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > Hello All,
>
> > A long time ago I made these brackets. I don't think I ever showed them to
> the group since they where just a quick solution to a problem I had at the
> time.
>
> > They mounted to the inside of the inner rails. A board connects the two
> and they form a poorman's version of the vertical vises Legacy was selling
> at the time. I just clamped my stock to the wood connecting piece. They did
> the job but they were slow to setup and remove. I was using Legacy's large
> square tabs to mount them to the inner side of the inner rails. I had to
> unscrew them to remove the brackets. I've been thinking there is a better
> way to do this and I've come up with this drawing.
>
> > It still uses a board to connect the two but I'm going to add 1/4-20
> threaded inserts to mount the board to (not shown). The mounts will use my
> HD mounts (1/4-20) for the narrow side rails and location tabs (not shown
> bent) will instantly align the brackets square. They are 4" in total depth
> so they will work on the bench models. Is this a useful idea?
>
> > -Tim
>
> > brackets_pre.jpg
> > 17KViewDownload
>
> > new_vertical_mounting_brackets.jpg
> > 24KViewDownload
>
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Re: Vertical Mounting Brackets

[begatbrown]

Tim,

I think I have the concept, but I'd like to see the set up and know
what you did and could use them to do.

Begat

On Nov 5, 4:56 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> A long time ago I made these brackets.  I don't think I ever showed them to 
> the group since they where just a quick solution to a problem I had at the 
> time.
>
> They mounted to the inside of the inner rails.  A board connects the two and 
> they form a poorman's version of the vertical vises Legacy was selling at the 
> time.  I just clamped my stock to the wood connecting piece.  They did the 
> job but they were slow to setup and remove.  I was using Legacy's large 
> square tabs to mount them to the inner side of the inner rails.  I had to 
> unscrew them to remove the brackets.  I've been thinking there is a better 
> way to do this and I've come up with this drawing.
>
> It still uses a board to connect the two but I'm going to add 1/4-20 threaded 
> inserts to mount the board to (not shown).  The mounts will use my HD mounts 
> (1/4-20) for the narrow side rails and location tabs (not shown bent) will 
> instantly align the brackets square.  They are 4" in total depth so they will 
> work on the bench models.  Is this a useful idea?
>
> -Tim
>
>  brackets_pre.jpg
> 17KViewDownload
>
>  new_vertical_mounting_brackets.jpg
> 24KViewDownload

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Doing Dowels on the Ornamental Mill

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

The other day I was fooling around with my 900 and discovered that if
I put the Legacy clamps from the horizontal vice on the back top rail,
I could easily get the edge of a board flat against it to do doweling
for a table top.  Worked like a charm.  I did the same on my arty, but
the depth of the framework limited me to 7 inch wide boards.  While I
can program the Arty to do them faster, I can do 11 inch wide boards
on the 900.  I don't anticipate any need to do wider boards.

Others have probably thought of this before, but I thought I'd post it
just in case.

Begat

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Re: router bit CAD models

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

This will come in handy.  It takes a long time to use software to draw
the bits.  I tried it once, and I figured, rightly so, that this has
to be somewhere available.  I'll talk to John on Monday.

Thanks,

Begat

On Oct 21, 1:35 pm, Andy  wrote:
> Thanks for the tip Cole! I just called legacy and they will be sending
> them my way shortly!

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Re: Legacy at the Woodworking shows again!!!

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

I should be able to catch them at one of the shows on the east coast.
Something to look forward to.

Begat

On Sep 14, 8:55 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> For those that missed Legacy's latest announcement:
>
> We are happy to announce that Legacy Woodworking Machinery has been invited 
> to be part of The Woodworking Show's exciting education program.  Legacy 
> Woodworking Machinery will provide the "Basics of Computer Controlled 
> Woodworking" classes at this year's Woodworking Shows.  Those who attend the 
> classes will receive Legacy's "CNC Woodworking Resource Kit.  Look for more 
> information on topics and classes covered during the shows.
>
> Show Schedule:
>
> Dallas, TX  Oct 21-32
>
> Southern CA  Oct 28-30
> Sacramento, CA  Nov 4-6
> Portland, OR  Nov 11-13
> Denver, CO  Nov 18-20
> Chicago, IL  Nov 25-27
> Baltimore, MD  Jan 6-8
> New England, MA  Jan 13-15
> Indianapolis, IN  Jan 20-22
> Kansas City, KS  Jan 27-29
> Columbus, OH  Fed 3-5
> St. Louis, MO  Feb 10-12
> Milwaukee, WI  Feb 17-19
> Somerset, NJ  Feb 24-26
> Fredericksburg, VA  Mar 2-4
> Atlanta, GA  Mar 9-11
> Tampa, FL  Mar 16-18
> Charlotte, NC  TBD
> Houston, TX  TBD
>
> I'll be heading to Portland, Oregon show this year for sure.  
>
> -Tim

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Feast Your Eyes on this

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

In case you haven't visited Legacy's new forum, there are pictures
posted by a member who did turnings on a manual Legacy machine that
are truly beautiful.  I'll let others comment on the skills required.

Here's the link:  http://www.legacycncforum.com/viewforum.php?f=15

Begat

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Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay

[begatbrown]

Hello,

The Ebay bid for the 600 ended.  I did not get a chance to bid because
of the hurricane.  I lost my power and my internet connection.  Just
got back on line.

Begat

On Aug 28, 3:53 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> the project demo CD sound interesting what kind of things are on that perhaps 
> there is something some of us have not seen and would like to collect
> Bill
>
>
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: John Becker
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2011 2:43 AM
>   Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
>   Jeff
>   I have some of the project books and the original invoice.  Then show price 
> I paid was $499.00 plus $49 shipping for the 500 model. it cost $82 to 
> upgrade to the 600. I got the first one in 2000 and upgraded it in 2001.  I 
> had the same kind of problems with getting the setup and startup info 
> everyone is having now.  Most of the info is in the firm of notes I have made 
> over the years.  Some ware I still have some of the gears that came with it.. 
> I also have a few of the project demos & CD's
>
>   - Original Message -
>     From: jwb...@insightbb.com
>     To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>     Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:44 AM
>     Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
>     I am reasonably sure he does. I can ask my dad if he has any of the 
> information on it.
>     Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>
>     -Original Message-
>     From: "Tim Krause" 
>     Sender: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>     Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2011 05:34:29
>     To: 
>     Reply-To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>     Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
>     I have heard of the model 500, but it's one of the legacy machines that I
>     don't have a picture or any information on it.  Does your brother still 
> have
>     it?
>
>     -Tim
>
>     - Original Message -
>     From: "Jeff Becker" 
>     To: 
>     Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 2:49 AM
>     Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
>     > This looks like my fathers first machine, it came with plastic gears 
> and I
>     want to say it was a model 500, he gave that to my brother and moved up 
> to a
>     900
>
>     > Jeff
>
>     > - Original Message -
>     > From: "Bill Bulkeley" 
>     > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>     > Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 2:15:08 AM
>     > Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
>     > any one on here buys this please give me first option on the rails and
>     > leadscrew
>     > Bill
>
>     > - Original Message -
>     > From: "begatbrown" 
>     > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
>     > Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 12:02 PM
>     > Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
>     > Tim,
>
>     > I had given some thought to getting the unit for the gears and
>     > indexing plates.  After that I would have parted it out with the
>     > rotary table being the most attractive item to sell.  I did note the
>     > machine's inability to taper, and I have not made one straight leg
>     > yet!
>
>     > Begat
>
>     > On Aug 26, 9:12 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
>     > > That's an interesting model that was only sold for a couple of years
>     > > between
>     > > 2000 and 2002. Originally the model 600 came with only acrylic gears.
>     > > These where direct drive and it gave you 1/2", 1", 2", 3", 6" and .33"
>     per
>     > > rotation. There was no directional gear available that I recall, they
>     > > where all right handed twists. It's interesting to see the owner 
> bought
>     > > the
>     > > extended pitch gears and the pivot arm linkage to make it work. You
>     might
>     > > also notice there is no taper capabilities in this machine (no bed to
>     > > adjust). If you wanted a taper, you where instructed to use a template
>     and
>     > > mill from the side. If you wanted to do flat stock you had to mount it
>     > > under the rails and that was some what limited thickness (2" x *"). If
>     you
>     > > look real closely at the carriage you will see some slots that allowed
>     you
>     > > to raise the y axis rails that essentially also raised the router for
>     > > larger
>     > > capacity. The maximum turning diameter was 5.5". It's a pretty decent
>     > > price if you

Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay

[begatbrown]

Hello Bill and Everyone,

That's good to know.  I'm still pondering what to do.

 Is anyone interested in the rotary table?  If so, I'd like to get a
sense of what someone would pay below the Legacy list price of $365,
and I'm not at all certain whether the rotary table of today is the
same as the one posted.  I think somewhere Tim mentioned there was at
least one variation, but perhaps that was minor.

Begat

On Aug 27, 12:25 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> Im not sure i guess $100 for the rails and maybe $50 for the leadscrew with
> the leadscrew nut & mounts
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 9:47 PM
> Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
> Hello Bill,
>
> What would be an offer for the two rails together and, separately, for
> the leadscrew?  I want the reduction and multiplier gears.
>
> Begat
>
> On Aug 27, 2:15 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > any one on here buys this please give me first option on the rails and
> > leadscrew
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 12:02 PM
> > Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
> > Tim,
>
> > I had given some thought to getting the unit for the gears and
> > indexing plates. After that I would have parted it out with the
> > rotary table being the most attractive item to sell. I did note the
> > machine's inability to taper, and I have not made one straight leg
> > yet!
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Aug 26, 9:12 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > > That's an interesting model that was only sold for a couple of years
> > > between
> > > 2000 and 2002. Originally the model 600 came with only acrylic gears.
> > > These where direct drive and it gave you 1/2", 1", 2", 3", 6" and .33"
> > > per
> > > rotation. There was no directional gear available that I recall, they
> > > where all right handed twists. It's interesting to see the owner bought
> > > the
> > > extended pitch gears and the pivot arm linkage to make it work. You
> > > might
> > > also notice there is no taper capabilities in this machine (no bed to
> > > adjust). If you wanted a taper, you where instructed to use a template
> > > and
> > > mill from the side. If you wanted to do flat stock you had to mount it
> > > under the rails and that was some what limited thickness (2" x *"). If
> > > you
> > > look real closely at the carriage you will see some slots that allowed
> > > you
> > > to raise the y axis rails that essentially also raised the router for
> > > larger
> > > capacity. The maximum turning diameter was 5.5". It's a pretty decent
> > > price if you needed the gears and a rotary table and then part the rest
> > > out
> > > to people in this group.
>
> > > Thanks for pointing that one out and giving me a flashback of the first
> > > Legacy machine that I saw demonstrated at a Woodworking show.
>
> > > -Tim
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "begatbrown" 
> > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 4:05 PM
> > > Subject: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
> > > > Hello,
>
> > > > There is an old legacy model 600 for sale on ebay. The bid is $499
> > > > and it comes with a 2x gear set and a reducer gear set--and a rotary
> > > > table.
>
> > >http://www.ebay.com/itm/150650694269?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid.
>
> > > > Best,
>
> > > > Begat
>
> > > > --
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > > > Groups
>
> > > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
> > > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.> To unsubscribe from this
> > > group,
> > > send email to
>
> > > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.> For more options,
> > > visit this group at
>
> > >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to

Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay

[begatbrown]

Hello Bill,

What would be an offer for the two rails together and, separately, for
the leadscrew?  I want the reduction and multiplier gears.

Begat

On Aug 27, 2:15 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> any one on here buys this please give me first option on the rails and
> leadscrew
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 12:02 PM
> Subject: Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
> Tim,
>
> I had given some thought to getting the unit for the gears and
> indexing plates.  After that I would have parted it out with the
> rotary table being the most attractive item to sell.  I did note the
> machine's inability to taper, and I have not made one straight leg
> yet!
>
> Begat
>
> On Aug 26, 9:12 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > That's an interesting model that was only sold for a couple of years
> > between
> > 2000 and 2002. Originally the model 600 came with only acrylic gears.
> > These where direct drive and it gave you 1/2", 1", 2", 3", 6" and .33" per
> > rotation. There was no directional gear available that I recall, they
> > where all right handed twists. It's interesting to see the owner bought
> > the
> > extended pitch gears and the pivot arm linkage to make it work. You might
> > also notice there is no taper capabilities in this machine (no bed to
> > adjust). If you wanted a taper, you where instructed to use a template and
> > mill from the side. If you wanted to do flat stock you had to mount it
> > under the rails and that was some what limited thickness (2" x *"). If you
> > look real closely at the carriage you will see some slots that allowed you
> > to raise the y axis rails that essentially also raised the router for
> > larger
> > capacity. The maximum turning diameter was 5.5". It's a pretty decent
> > price if you needed the gears and a rotary table and then part the rest
> > out
> > to people in this group.
>
> > Thanks for pointing that one out and giving me a flashback of the first
> > Legacy machine that I saw demonstrated at a Woodworking show.
>
> > -Tim
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 4:05 PM
> > Subject: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
> > > Hello,
>
> > > There is an old legacy model 600 for sale on ebay. The bid is $499
> > > and it comes with a 2x gear set and a reducer gear set--and a rotary
> > > table.
>
> >http://www.ebay.com/itm/150650694269?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid
>
> > > Best,
>
> > > Begat
>
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > > Groups
>
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.> To unsubscribe from this group,
> > send email to
>
> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.> For more options,
> > visit this group at
>
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> To post to this group, send email to
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Re: 600 For Sale on Ebay

[begatbrown]

Tim,

I had given some thought to getting the unit for the gears and
indexing plates.  After that I would have parted it out with the
rotary table being the most attractive item to sell.  I did note the
machine's inability to taper, and I have not made one straight leg
yet!

Begat




On Aug 26, 9:12 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> That's an interesting model that was only sold for a couple of years between
> 2000 and 2002.   Originally the model 600 came with only acrylic gears.
> These where direct drive and it gave you 1/2", 1", 2", 3", 6" and .33" per
> rotation.   There was no directional gear available that I recall, they
> where all right handed twists.  It's interesting to see the owner bought the
> extended pitch gears and the pivot arm linkage to make it work.  You might
> also notice there is no taper capabilities in this machine (no bed to
> adjust).  If you wanted a taper,  you where instructed to use a template and
> mill from the side.   If you wanted to do flat stock you had to mount it
> under the rails and that was some what limited thickness (2" x *").   If you
> look real closely at the carriage you will see some slots that allowed you
> to raise the y axis rails that essentially also raised the router for larger
> capacity.  The maximum turning diameter was 5.5".   It's a pretty decent
> price if you needed the gears and a rotary table and then part the rest out
> to people in this group.
>
> Thanks for pointing that one out and giving me a flashback of the first
> Legacy machine that I saw demonstrated at a Woodworking show.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 4:05 PM
> Subject: 600 For Sale on Ebay
>
> > Hello,
>
> > There is an old legacy model 600 for sale on ebay.  The bid is $499
> > and it comes with a 2x gear set and a reducer gear set--and a rotary
> > table.
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/150650694269?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid...
>
> > Best,
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>
> "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.> To post to this group, send email to
>
> legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.> To unsubscribe from this group, 
> send email to
>
> legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.> For more options, 
> visit this group at
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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600 For Sale on Ebay

[begatbrown]

Hello,

There is an old legacy model 600 for sale on ebay.  The bid is $499
and it comes with a 2x gear set and a reducer gear set--and a rotary
table.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/150650694269?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

Best,

Begat

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Re: Hub Centering Template

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

While I have not had the chance to produce any turnings using the new
template, I have had the chance to compare how much time I can save
with Tim's Hub Centering Template versus using ruler with a 45 degree
angle.

On a perfectly square blank, it normally takes me just over a minute.
With Tim's HCT, it took me between 10 and 15 seconds.

The big savings in time comes in those instances when you have to
joint and/or plane the blank to get two flat sides for using the 45
degree ruler to find the center.  As Tim showed with the photo, you
can skip this whole procedure.

When doing a production run, this should save me hours.  Thanks Tim.

When I get some time, I will compare results and send photos.

Begat



On Jul 18, 11:02 pm, begatbrown  wrote:
> Work has me caught up for a while, but when I get to use the template
> I'll post the results "before" and after.
>
> Begat
>
> On Jul 18, 11:30 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > OK take pics please and show us the improvement when you get it like before
> > and after pics I would be interested to see
>
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 12:15 PM
> > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> > Bill,
>
> > Tapered is not the right word.  THe point I'm making is that when both
> > ends are off-centered, the resulting table leg shows the imperfection
> > where the rounded section begins at the top.  It's perceptable.  It's
> > a centering problem.  I'm hoping the template can help me make up for
> > my lack of skill in getting the punch to hit on center without taking
> > excessive time.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Jul 18, 10:15 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > > I am assuming your talking about already machined wood
> > > if it was wood to be turned then if your machine is set to cut parallel
> > > how
> > > would the center being off a little make a taper as soon as you take a cut
> > > it would be round and strait am I missing something here
> > > to get already machined pieces running true I have often thought of a 4
> > > jaw
> > > independent jaw chuck on the tail stock as well as the head stock that's
> > > how we did it In my steel machining days. or get the end running true in a
> > > steady rest and re drill the center hole
> > > Bill
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "begatbrown" 
> > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 11:01 AM
> > > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> > > Hello All,
>
> > > When I used other centering devices, drew my x's and used the punches
> > > on both ends, I found that I could be off by a couple of degrees when
> > > the stock was mounted. That amounts to slight taper when none was
> > > desired. If you mispunch on the tail stock in one direction and on
> > > the headstock in the opposite direction, you will be off the most. I
> > > found myself lining up the outer holes on the hub to overcome the
> > > error in the middle. This was where I lost too much time. Nothing I
> > > came up with helped center the piece when the tailstock punch was
> > > off.
>
> > > Part of what I'm hoping the template will do is help me control the
> > > placement of the center punch and steady it
>
> > > At present I don't have a drill press, but I can see how Mike''s set
> > > up could eliminate the need for a template.
>
> > > Begat
>
> > > On Jul 18, 7:26 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> > > wrote:
> > > > If I am doing a large job of 10 to 400 of the same size, I make sure the
> > > > stock is consistent and set up the drill press. With a couple "V"
> > > > blocks clamped in place, the stock will cradle in the same every time.
> > > > Now all you have to do is hold it in place and advance the quill. For
> > > > less than 10, I cross mark the ends and hand drill, mount the dogs with
> > > > a center screw and just plow in outer for screws without pre-drilling.
> > > > For smaller stock I use a drive spur.
>
> > > > Mike
>
> > > > On 7/18/2011 5:13 PMBill Bulkeley wrote:
>
> > > > > I think most of us do it that way but if you have many of the same to
> > > > > do I can understand wanting a quicker way I don't know

Re: Front Mounted Template Follower

[begatbrown]

One video is worth a thousand pictures.  Now it all makes sense.
Begat

On Aug 5, 2:52 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> outstanding guys great to put a face to the name too I will be keeping this
> video for reference in my computer
> Bill
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "legacymill" 
> To: 
> Sent: Friday, August 05, 2011 2:05 PM
> Subject: Re: Front Mounted Template Follower
>
> > Well Bill your wish is granted.  I was in Curt's shop today
> > for a playday and took some video of the Front Y axis
> > template follower as well as the rotary table. We had a
> > blast!  Here is the video
> >http://www.youtube.com/user/ok2co#p/u/6/Y29sZ43PwhA Enjoy
>
> > Mike
> > OK
>
> >> I wish we could do it now but unfortunatly its the size of
> >> the file thats the problem even a very low quality is
> >> still too big to post. you tube and a link is the only way
> >> at the moment that i know  I have often wanted to post
> >> video in the past
>
> >> Bill
> >>   - Original Message -
> >>   From: coleandrew...@gmail.com
> >>   To: CURTIS GEORGE ;
> >> legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> >>   Sent: Friday, August 05, 2011 6:29 AM
> >>   Subject: Re: Front Mounted Template Follower
>
> >>   I was kind of kidding about needing a video . One day
> >> the technology will be cheap and easy enough to video and
> >> stream it right to the group. Your follower looks like it
> >> will work real good. On technical stuff I sometimes have
> >> to read and at the picture a couple of times to get it,
> >> but once I do. Lookout here I come.
>
> >>   Sent from my HTC on the Now Network from Sprint!
>
> >>   - Reply message -
> >>   From: "CURTIS GEORGE" 
> >>   Date: Thu, Aug 4, 2011 7:58 am
> >>   Subject: Front Mounted Template Follower
> >>   To: 
>
> >>   I am sorry Cole. But I live back in the Dark ages as far
> >> as Videos and stuff like that goes.
> >>   But I will see if I can figure out a way to get you a
> >> video or something.
> >>   The hole concept is the same as Legacy's original design
> >> , Only moved to the front of the machine for easer use.
> >>   The Uni-sturt is easy to come up with, Home Depot sells
> >> it. (as well as many other do to.) It makes a very solid
> >> platform for my template holder.  I used four "T" bolts to
> >> hold it down onto the Legacy rails. then all that I did
> >> was to make a new follower. (I could have used the
> >> original  one, and still might? latter.)  The only trick
> >> was to make the follower rise up above the Legacy drive
> >> nut, and I did that by the use of a hindge and a block of
> >> wood cut on an angle. It realy is a pretty simple idea.
>
> >>   How do I use it??? By un-locking my Y axis router mount.
> >> I let it move freely  so the router can follow the
> >> template.
> >>   I set my X movement and stops. then all that I have to
> >> do is ingauge the motor, to drive the carrage along the X
> >> movement. (I run my machine from the tail stock end to the
> >> head stock as a general rule.)  The Legacy's motor drive
> >> controls the movement of the carrage , and the template
> >> follows/ router, just follows the pattern of the wave. Its
> >> very simple.
>
> >>   Now how I did it may not be the," Be All End All"
> >> approch  for everyone. But as I see this, Its just a
> >> starting block for other possible adventures and or
> >> projects.
> >>   Basicly  Im  saying . TAG! You are it.  Now its your
> >> turn. ;-)
>
> >>   Talk to you latter.
> >>   C.A.G.
>
> >>   P.S.
> >>   This computer is still not running quite right. So Sorry
> >> for not having spell check here.
> >>   c.a.g. ;-)
> >>   - Original Message -
> >>   From: "cole andrews" 
> >>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> >>   Sent: Wednesday, August 3, 2011 10:11:54 PM
> >>   Subject: Re: Front Mounted Template Follower
>
> >>   Now if we could only have video , I think I understand
> >> whats going on
> >>   but to see it in practice.
>
> >>   On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 5:56 AM, Curtis
> >>  wrote:
> >>   > Hello Everyone (Im at work now.but I have some time
> >> before I have to
> >>   > sign in.)
>
> >>   > Thanks Tim for posting these pictures.
>
> >>   > I have some better pictures of patterns that Ive made,
> >> I am sorry for
> >>   > the crudeness of the patterns shown, At the time that
> >> these pictures
> >>   > were taken I still had some bugs in the works that
> >> needed to be fixed,
> >>   > things like the hand wheel needed to be removed.
> >>   > On the sixth cut ( picture cut 1) the hand wheel
> >> cought the follower
> >>   > and caused the cut acrost the pattern.So although the
> >> picture/pattern
> >>   > is not clear and clean looking, I learned quite a bit
> >> for the mistake.
> >>   > I have some other (much better) pictures comming your
> >> way very soon.
>
> >>   > My PC crashed two weeks ago, and I still have not been
> >> able to get
> >>   > everything up and running as it should.Hopefully I
> >> will be able to get
> >>   > e

Re: Hub Centering Template

[begatbrown]

Work has me caught up for a while, but when I get to use the template
I'll post the results "before" and after.

Begat

On Jul 18, 11:30 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> OK take pics please and show us the improvement when you get it like before
> and after pics I would be interested to see
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 12:15 PM
> Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> Bill,
>
> Tapered is not the right word.  THe point I'm making is that when both
> ends are off-centered, the resulting table leg shows the imperfection
> where the rounded section begins at the top.  It's perceptable.  It's
> a centering problem.  I'm hoping the template can help me make up for
> my lack of skill in getting the punch to hit on center without taking
> excessive time.
>
> Begat
>
> On Jul 18, 10:15 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > I am assuming your talking about already machined wood
> > if it was wood to be turned then if your machine is set to cut parallel
> > how
> > would the center being off a little make a taper as soon as you take a cut
> > it would be round and strait am I missing something here
> > to get already machined pieces running true I have often thought of a 4
> > jaw
> > independent jaw chuck on the tail stock as well as the head stock that's
> > how we did it In my steel machining days. or get the end running true in a
> > steady rest and re drill the center hole
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 11:01 AM
> > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> > Hello All,
>
> > When I used other centering devices, drew my x's and used the punches
> > on both ends, I found that I could be off by a couple of degrees when
> > the stock was mounted. That amounts to slight taper when none was
> > desired. If you mispunch on the tail stock in one direction and on
> > the headstock in the opposite direction, you will be off the most. I
> > found myself lining up the outer holes on the hub to overcome the
> > error in the middle. This was where I lost too much time. Nothing I
> > came up with helped center the piece when the tailstock punch was
> > off.
>
> > Part of what I'm hoping the template will do is help me control the
> > placement of the center punch and steady it
>
> > At present I don't have a drill press, but I can see how Mike''s set
> > up could eliminate the need for a template.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Jul 18, 7:26 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> > wrote:
> > > If I am doing a large job of 10 to 400 of the same size, I make sure the
> > > stock is consistent and set up the drill press. With a couple "V"
> > > blocks clamped in place, the stock will cradle in the same every time.
> > > Now all you have to do is hold it in place and advance the quill. For
> > > less than 10, I cross mark the ends and hand drill, mount the dogs with
> > > a center screw and just plow in outer for screws without pre-drilling.
> > > For smaller stock I use a drive spur.
>
> > > Mike
>
> > > On 7/18/2011 5:13 PMBill Bulkeley wrote:
>
> > > > I think most of us do it that way but if you have many of the same to
> > > > do I can understand wanting a quicker way I don't know if the template
> > > > with the lines on it is quicker I guess we will have to wait and see
> > > > what the member who ordered it says after he tries it
> > > > Bill
>
> > > > - Original Message -
> > > > *From:* Donald Pearce <mailto:dw...@hotmail.com>
> > > > *To:* legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > > > <mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com>
> > > > *Sent:* Tuesday, July 19, 2011 4:36 AM
> > > > *Subject:* RE: Hub Centering Template
>
> > > > Simple and easy method that I use- a plastic center finder, spring
> > > > loaded punch and vix-bit. Make an X on the end of your leg or
> > > > whatever with the plastic center finder, make a dimple where the
> > > > lines cross(center) with the spring loaded punch, screw the hub on
> > > > in the center hole, use the vix-bit to drill for the other screws
> > > > where the lines cross in the other holes of the hub. Don
>
> > > > > D

Re: Hub Centering Template

[begatbrown]

Bill,

Tapered is not the right word.  THe point I'm making is that when both
ends are off-centered, the resulting table leg shows the imperfection
where the rounded section begins at the top.  It's perceptable.  It's
a centering problem.  I'm hoping the template can help me make up for
my lack of skill in getting the punch to hit on center without taking
excessive time.

Begat



On Jul 18, 10:15 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> I am assuming your talking about already machined wood
> if it was wood to be turned then if your machine is set to cut parallel how
> would the center being off a little make a taper as soon as you take a cut
> it would be round and strait am I missing something here
> to get already machined pieces running true I have often thought of a 4 jaw
> independent jaw chuck on the tail stock as well as the head stock  that's
> how we did it In my steel machining days. or get the end running true in a
> steady rest and re drill the center hole
> Bill
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 11:01 AM
> Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> Hello All,
>
> When I used other centering devices, drew my x's and used the punches
> on both ends, I found that I could be off by a couple of degrees when
> the stock was mounted.  That amounts to slight taper when none was
> desired.  If you mispunch on the tail stock in one direction and on
> the headstock in the opposite direction, you will be off the most.  I
> found myself lining up the outer holes on the hub to overcome the
> error in the middle.  This was where I lost too much time.  Nothing I
> came up with helped center the piece when the tailstock punch was
> off.
>
>  Part of what I'm hoping the template will do is help me control the
> placement of the center punch and steady it
>
> At present I don't have a drill press, but I can see how Mike''s set
> up could eliminate the need for a template.
>
> Begat
>
> On Jul 18, 7:26 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> wrote:
> > If I am doing a large job of 10 to 400 of the same size, I make sure the
> > stock is consistent and set up the drill press. With a couple "V"
> > blocks clamped in place, the stock will cradle in the same every time.
> > Now all you have to do is hold it in place and advance the quill. For
> > less than 10, I cross mark the ends and hand drill, mount the dogs with
> > a center screw and just plow in outer for screws without pre-drilling.
> > For smaller stock I use a drive spur.
>
> > Mike
>
> > On 7/18/2011 5:13 PMBill Bulkeley wrote:
>
> > > I think most of us do it that way but if you have many of the same to
> > > do I can understand wanting a quicker way I don't know if the template
> > > with the lines on it is quicker I guess we will have to wait and see
> > > what the member who ordered it says after he tries it
> > > Bill
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > *From:* Donald Pearce <mailto:dw...@hotmail.com>
> > > *To:* legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > > <mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com>
> > > *Sent:* Tuesday, July 19, 2011 4:36 AM
> > > *Subject:* RE: Hub Centering Template
>
> > > Simple and easy method that I use- a plastic center finder, spring
> > > loaded punch and vix-bit. Make an X on the end of your leg or
> > > whatever with the plastic center finder, make a dimple where the
> > > lines cross(center) with the spring loaded punch, screw the hub on
> > > in the center hole, use the vix-bit to drill for the other screws
> > > where the lines cross in the other holes of the hub. Don
>
> > > > Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 10:35:36 -0700
> > > > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
> > > > From: darylmichaelsc...@gmail.com
> > > > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>
> > > > Yep. In fact, My biggest problem has been with accurately centering
> > > > the tailstock.
>
> > > > Begat
>
> > > > On Jul 17, 12:08 pm, Jeff Becker  wrote:
> > > > > I asume you relize with the center hole marked you will also
> > > be able to mark for the tail stock end
>
> > > > > - Original Message -
> > > > > From: "begatbrown" 
> > > > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills"
> > > 
> > > > > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 11:55:15 AM
> > > > > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
>

Re: Hub Centering Template

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

When I used other centering devices, drew my x's and used the punches
on both ends, I found that I could be off by a couple of degrees when
the stock was mounted.  That amounts to slight taper when none was
desired.  If you mispunch on the tail stock in one direction and on
the headstock in the opposite direction, you will be off the most.  I
found myself lining up the outer holes on the hub to overcome the
error in the middle.  This was where I lost too much time.  Nothing I
came up with helped center the piece when the tailstock punch was
off.

 Part of what I'm hoping the template will do is help me control the
placement of the center punch and steady it

At present I don't have a drill press, but I can see how Mike''s set
up could eliminate the need for a template.

Begat

On Jul 18, 7:26 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
wrote:
> If I am doing a large job of 10 to 400 of the same size, I make sure the
> stock is consistent and set up the drill press.  With a couple "V"
> blocks clamped in place, the stock will cradle in the same every time.  
> Now all you have to do is hold it in place and advance the quill.   For
> less than 10, I cross mark the ends and hand drill, mount the dogs with
> a center screw and just plow in outer for screws without pre-drilling.  
> For smaller stock I use a drive spur.
>
> Mike
>
> On 7/18/2011 5:13 PMBill Bulkeley wrote:
>
>
>
> > I think most of us do it that way but if you have many of the same to
> > do I can understand wanting a quicker way I don't know if the template
> > with the lines on it is quicker I guess we will have to wait and see
> > what the member who ordered it says after he tries it
> > Bill
>
> >     - Original Message -
> >     *From:* Donald Pearce <mailto:dw...@hotmail.com>
> >     *To:* legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> >     <mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com>
> >     *Sent:* Tuesday, July 19, 2011 4:36 AM
> >     *Subject:* RE: Hub Centering Template
>
> >     Simple and easy method that I use- a plastic center finder, spring
> >     loaded punch and vix-bit.  Make an X on the end of your leg or
> >     whatever with the plastic center finder, make a dimple where the
> >     lines cross(center) with the spring loaded punch, screw the hub on
> >     in the center hole, use the vix-bit to drill for the other screws
> >     where the lines cross in the other holes of the hub.   Don
>
> >     > Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 10:35:36 -0700
> >     > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
> >     > From: darylmichaelsc...@gmail.com
> >     > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>
> >     > Yep. In fact, My biggest problem has been with accurately centering
> >     > the tailstock.
>
> >     > Begat
>
> >     > On Jul 17, 12:08 pm, Jeff Becker  wrote:
> >     > > I asume you relize with the center hole marked you will also
> >     be able to mark for the tail stock end
>
> >     > > - Original Message -
> >     > > From: "begatbrown" 
> >     > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills"
> >     
> >     > > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 11:55:15 AM
> >     > > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> >     > > Hello All,
>
> >     > > I'm the member that ordered the template from Tim, and I'm
> >     glad that
> >     > > he came up with the idea of a single template made of plastic.
>
> >     > > As for using it, it was my plan to use it with an automatic center
> >     > > punch to make guide holes for the screws..  I have one that
> >     fits in
> >     > > the metal hubs that makes a starter hole.  I believe it can
> >     work with
> >     > > the plastic template without smashing into it, but we'll see.
> >      If not,
> >     > > marking accurately with a non-automatic center punch is the most
> >     > > important thing.
>
> >     > > I enlisted Tim's help because I found that I would spend a few
> >     minutes
> >     > > getting hubs mounted and the tailstock lined up.  If you are
> >     making a
> >     > > lot of spindles or legs, the time adds up quickly.
>
> >     > > I can't wait to try this all out and report back.
>
> >     > > Thanks Tim,
>
> >     > > Begat
>
> >     > > On Jul 17, 11:18 am, Jeff Becker  wrote:
> >     > > > Mike you pretty well covered the point I was trying to make,
> >     I was trying to 

Re: Hub Centering Template

[begatbrown]

Yep.  In fact, My biggest problem has been with accurately centering
the tailstock.

Begat

On Jul 17, 12:08 pm, Jeff Becker  wrote:
> I asume you relize with the center hole marked you will also be able to mark 
> for the tail stock end
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 11:55:15 AM
> Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> Hello All,
>
> I'm the member that ordered the template from Tim, and I'm glad that
> he came up with the idea of a single template made of plastic.
>
> As for using it, it was my plan to use it with an automatic center
> punch to make guide holes for the screws..  I have one that fits in
> the metal hubs that makes a starter hole.  I believe it can work with
> the plastic template without smashing into it, but we'll see.  If not,
> marking accurately with a non-automatic center punch is the most
> important thing.
>
> I enlisted Tim's help because I found that I would spend a few minutes
> getting hubs mounted and the tailstock lined up.  If you are making a
> lot of spindles or legs, the time adds up quickly.
>
> I can't wait to try this all out and report back.
>
> Thanks Tim,
>
> Begat
>
> On Jul 17, 11:18 am, Jeff Becker  wrote:
> > Mike you pretty well covered the point I was trying to make, I was trying 
> > to say make the holes small enough to make a small mark in the center then 
> > drill a pilot hole and it would be centered. I just could not come up with 
> > the right words, Now I see Tims point, mark the whole hole place the dog 
> > over the marks and drill with the spring loaded bit. For me his actually is 
> > easier than what I have been doing for years, I use an impact to drive the 
> > screws and a drill to drill the hole, the spring loaded bit will fit in my 
> > impact.
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 11:03:29 AM
> > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> > When I install the dogs, I make the center hole as perfect as possible, 
> > secure the doge with the screw and then use the dog holes as the guide. 
> > They are steal and if the dog is held firmly in place with one screw, the 
> > grain won't pull the drill bit around so much. The rest of the screws will 
> > be a snap to install. On another note there is a thing called friction. The 
> > plastic will wear out fast if the guide snags and heats up the plastic. If 
> > you just use the plastic for marking the hole, it will last forever. Next 
> > get an old hinge or a piece of metal with a hole in it that is big enough 
> > to get ahold of while using it. I just use an old hinge half. Now glue some 
> > sand paper to the bottom of it so it will grip without slip when you hold 
> > it in place. Align it over the marked hole and drill it with the pilot bit, 
> > install the first screw, pilot the last 4 and ahh screw'm.
>
> > Mike
>
> > On 7/17/2011 9:50 AM, Jeff Becker wrote:
>
> > You know now I really feel stupid, I have a set of 12 of those I use for 
> > hinges and never thought about it
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 10:35:56 AM
> > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> > If you need guided holes try the spring loaded pilot hold bit It will save 
> > the 
> > templatehttp://www.diy-cockpits.org/coll/images/self-centering-pilot-drill.png
>
> > On 7/17/2011 1:55 AM, Jeff Becker wrote:
>
> > My comment with the size of wood was considering I when I drill the holes 
> > in the end of the stock I use a 1/8 inch bit, and I know that seeing the 
> > hole in the mount is larger it is not always centered,just off a slight 
> > amount. So if the holes were the size of the bit you would use it would 
> > make it easier to center the hole.. When I am using a piece of wood that is 
> > almost too small for the spindle I take extra time to see to it I have it 
> > centered.
>
> > and about placing marks to 1 inch I see you point about only going to 1 1/2 
> > inch, you could use the holes if you had a need for 1 inch
>
> > Jeff
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Tim Krause" 
> > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2011 11:05:36 PM
> > Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> > Sure, feel

Re: Hub Centering Template

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

I'm the member that ordered the template from Tim, and I'm glad that
he came up with the idea of a single template made of plastic.

As for using it, it was my plan to use it with an automatic center
punch to make guide holes for the screws..  I have one that fits in
the metal hubs that makes a starter hole.  I believe it can work with
the plastic template without smashing into it, but we'll see.  If not,
marking accurately with a non-automatic center punch is the most
important thing.

I enlisted Tim's help because I found that I would spend a few minutes
getting hubs mounted and the tailstock lined up.  If you are making a
lot of spindles or legs, the time adds up quickly.

I can't wait to try this all out and report back.

Thanks Tim,

Begat

On Jul 17, 11:18 am, Jeff Becker  wrote:
> Mike you pretty well covered the point I was trying to make, I was trying to 
> say make the holes small enough to make a small mark in the center then drill 
> a pilot hole and it would be centered. I just could not come up with the 
> right words, Now I see Tims point, mark the whole hole place the dog over the 
> marks and drill with the spring loaded bit. For me his actually is easier 
> than what I have been doing for years, I use an impact to drive the screws 
> and a drill to drill the hole, the spring loaded bit will fit in my impact.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 11:03:29 AM
> Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> When I install the dogs, I make the center hole as perfect as possible, 
> secure the doge with the screw and then use the dog holes as the guide. They 
> are steal and if the dog is held firmly in place with one screw, the grain 
> won't pull the drill bit around so much. The rest of the screws will be a 
> snap to install. On another note there is a thing called friction. The 
> plastic will wear out fast if the guide snags and heats up the plastic. If 
> you just use the plastic for marking the hole, it will last forever. Next get 
> an old hinge or a piece of metal with a hole in it that is big enough to get 
> ahold of while using it. I just use an old hinge half. Now glue some sand 
> paper to the bottom of it so it will grip without slip when you hold it in 
> place. Align it over the marked hole and drill it with the pilot bit, install 
> the first screw, pilot the last 4 and ahh screw'm.
>
> Mike
>
> On 7/17/2011 9:50 AM, Jeff Becker wrote:
>
> You know now I really feel stupid, I have a set of 12 of those I use for 
> hinges and never thought about it
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 10:35:56 AM
> Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> If you need guided holes try the spring loaded pilot hold bit It will save 
> the 
> templatehttp://www.diy-cockpits.org/coll/images/self-centering-pilot-drill.png
>
> On 7/17/2011 1:55 AM, Jeff Becker wrote:
>
> My comment with the size of wood was considering I when I drill the holes in 
> the end of the stock I use a 1/8 inch bit, and I know that seeing the hole in 
> the mount is larger it is not always centered,just off a slight amount. So if 
> the holes were the size of the bit you would use it would make it easier to 
> center the hole.. When I am using a piece of wood that is almost too small 
> for the spindle I take extra time to see to it I have it centered.
>
> and about placing marks to 1 inch I see you point about only going to 1 1/2 
> inch, you could use the holes if you had a need for 1 inch
>
> Jeff
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tim Krause" 
> To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2011 11:05:36 PM
> Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> Sure, feel free to contact me off list for price and availability.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Bill Bulkeley
> To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2011 7:17 PM
> Subject: Re: Hub Centering Template
>
> seems like a good idea are you sugesting that your selling them
> Bill
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Tim Krause
> To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 9:13 AM
> Subject: Hub Centering Template
>
> Hello All,
>
> I made an interesting tool this week for one of our members. He contacted me 
> wanting templates made from steel that have the same hole patterns as the 
> Legacy drive hubs so he could quickly mark the stock with the drilling 
> pattern. I suggested one clear acrylic template that is engraved with 
> graduated sizes so it could be placed over the end of the stock and the holes 
> pattern marked.
>
> Here's what it looks like.
>
> The size range is from 2" to 6" stock. The interesting thing about this tool 
> is if the wood that is not square it's still easy to find the center and mark 
> the pattern. In t

Re: 20% Sale on Legacy CNC

[begatbrown]

Hello Curt,

You're probably right about the sale coming back.  The economy is hard
and any purchase of that size is a major investment.  I had better
show a lot of revenue growth to convince my live in business partner!
Pennies won't do!

Begat

On Jul 7, 1:02 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
> I wouldn't fret. I would bet that you will see something like it again, most
> likely around labor day. (just a guess no inside info here.)  ;-) so save
> your pennies and hopefully...
> When I worked in the machine shop it  took days to set up and test run our
> NC mills and lathes,the programming was slow work. but once set up, No human
> could keep up with them. I would bet the CNC would be much the same.
> I've got the CNC itch my self, but at this time I just cant scratch it.
> Someday!?. We will see.
>
> C.A.G.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 10:24 AM
> Subject: 20% Sale on Legacy CNC
>
> > If one has the cash or a growing business, this is a good time to look
> > at the CNCs from Legacy because they have a 20% sale for a short
> > period.
>
> > I have both an model 900 ornamental mill and an Arty 58.  The 900 is
> > for the hobbiest in me and the Arty is an attempt at a hustle.  As I
> > try to design parts to sell, I often try out things on the 900 to see
> > if they make sense.  And this is where I have the most fun.  Yet, once
> > you have the design and can translate it to the CNC, the speed and
> > accuracy is so much better.
>
> > I hope the sale comes back after I've succeeded in designing parts and
> > getting sales.  I'd buy one the the artisans that would allow me to
> > make 8'x11inch columns.  With the prices I've seen columns go for, I
> > think it would pay for itself fairly quickly--even if you sale them at
> > a discount.
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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To post to this group, send email to legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
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For more options, visit this group at 
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20% Sale on Legacy CNC

[begatbrown]

If one has the cash or a growing business, this is a good time to look
at the CNCs from Legacy because they have a 20% sale for a short
period.

I have both an model 900 ornamental mill and an Arty 58.  The 900 is
for the hobbiest in me and the Arty is an attempt at a hustle.  As I
try to design parts to sell, I often try out things on the 900 to see
if they make sense.  And this is where I have the most fun.  Yet, once
you have the design and can translate it to the CNC, the speed and
accuracy is so much better.

I hope the sale comes back after I've succeeded in designing parts and
getting sales.  I'd buy one the the artisans that would allow me to
make 8'x11inch columns.  With the prices I've seen columns go for, I
think it would pay for itself fairly quickly--even if you sale them at
a discount.

Begat

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Re: what do you think of this???

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

I've been out of the loop for a while.  The price of the Legacy CNCs
may actually go down as the prices for all cnc machines drop in the
face of global competition.  With the ornamental mills the prices
stayed high because they did not (and still do not) have a real
competitor.  (The market was too small for the overseas producers to
get into the game.  The market was so small in fact that they dropped
models all the time for want of adequate sales.)  As you notice, many
of Legacy's cnc videos talk about competition.  As you know Legacy has
introduced a 3 axis cnc, but for the life of me I can't figure out how
they will compete at with the Shopbot and others which are much
cheaper and have large design libraries.  Most flatstock people want
to make signs and kitchen cabinets, which the libraries serve very
well.  Soon there will be other 5 axis machines on the market and
legacy's advantage will probably boil down to its conversational cam
and distance training classes.

Begat

On Jun 28, 9:07 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hi Mike,
>
> Yes, they really left the owners of the ITR-33, Woodchuck MA, Models 200, 
> 400,500, 600, 800, 1000, 1500, 1800, 2000, 2200, and Revo owners in the dust! 
>  Curt's was the only model with an actual upgrade part available!   
> hahahahaha!!!
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Okla Mike (Liltwisted)
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 5:55 PM
>   Subject: Re: what do you think of this???
>
>   That would be the path less traveled i am afraid.  Pretty funny though.
>   Mike
>
>   On 6/28/2011 7:29 PM, Tim Krause wrote:
>     Hate to be cynical, but when you're ready to convert the frame to the cnc 
> version your going to end up paying more than the machine would have cost.  
> Why not step up to the plate and get a loan and buy the fully loaded version. 
>   I'd be willing to bet Legacy will offer a trade in program for some of the 
> parts to help you with the upgrade path.
>
>     Your 1000 is upgradeable, they made the z-axis conversion kit for that 
> model.  They did offer the standard and performance cnc packages until they 
> took it to the next level with the black machines.   Where's Mike's 
> (woodchuck owner) upgrade path :-)
>
>     -Tim
>
>     - Original Message -
>       From: curt george
>       To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>       Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 6:07 AM
>       Subject: Re: what do you think of this???
>
>       Hello Bill
>       I wrote Tracy a private e-mail and asked if I could buy a DVD of this 
> shadow.  We will see soon what will happen?
>
>       Now the funny thing here is when I bought my 1000ex. I was told it too 
> was fully upgradeable too. As times change even this new toy will become 
> Obsolete someday. I guess the big question / 's are, will this machine hold 
> up to the test of time, and will Legacy continue makeing this unit in the 
> future? I guess time will tell.
>
>       talk to you all latter.
>
>       C.A.G.
>         - Original Message -
>         From: Bill Bulkeley
>         To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>         Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 12:03 AM
>         Subject: Re: what do you think of this???
>
>         perhaps they will do a demo video on the legacy cnc sight for every 
> one to see
>         it will be interesting to see how they work the gears for spirals
>         Bill
>           - Original Message -
>           From: curt george
>           To: Legacy Google group
>           Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 11:01 AM
>           Subject: what do you think of this???
>
>            The new manual Ornamental Mill (code named "Shadow") is based on 
> the Arty CNC frame shown above.  Although the system will be manually driven, 
> it is CNC ready allowing you the options of upgrading to CNC at a later time. 
>  Designed to replace the popular model 1200, the Shadow CNC is available in 
> two sizes and features a wider welded and fully assembled frame, linear 
> bearings and shafts, Z-Axis and Legacy's exclusive Adjustable Bed.  Now for 
> the good news - The 36" system cost less than the model 1200 with a Z-Axis 
> upgrade did 3 years ago. Originally designed as a CNC system, the Shadow 
> Ornamental Mill is ready for CNC when you are.
>
>           36" Shadow Ornamental Mill $3,500
>           58" Shadow Ornamental Mill $4,200
>
>           I think this is a pretty neat system, I would like to see it with 
> the gears and all.
>           If I were going to replace the 1200 searies, I think the 58" unit 
> would be a must.
>           Dose anyone have first hand info on this system.
>           I personaly would like to see it up and running.
>
>           Tracy or Andy. do you guys have a DVD of this unit? I would buy one 
> just to get a better look.
>
>           talk to you all latter.
>           Have a good night.
>
>           C.A.G.
>
> -

Re: Look Ye Here!

[begatbrown]

Tim,

It has to do with feed rates, stepovers, and comfort levels.  I've
seen the videos go very fast, but they are clearly pushing past the
recommended feed rate for the 2704.  Perhaps I will get that kind of
confidence with experience, but staying within the recommended limits
it's not nearly as fast.  And the stepover on the finishing pass is
not so quick.

For me setups take additional time.  If your offsets are wrong, you'll
be buying new bits or rails (and dodging flying metal).  Offsets are a
software function, which means you have to be careful of program
glitches and operator errors. So when I create the g-code, I put a
stop function in my programs that halts the spindle where it's
supposed to begin cutting.  If an offset error is wrong in the
beginning you might swipe the headstock, too far ahead and you might
carve the tail stock,  (which I did once.  My tail stock on the Arty
now has a little character and is none the worse for it.  But the
barley twist bit, well it now hangs around as a reminder that a
carbide tip can bite into steel before it peels back.)Over time,
I'll push the feed rate and step overs, but using the stop function
before cutting is just one of my permanent habits.  It's a safety
issue.

In contrast, on the manual, you line up everything and get to spinning
the handle.  And even if you get carried away, there is a physical
stop between the bit and the tailstock. While the depth of cut is less
aggressive, the stepover is smooth enough even when you work out your
arms.

Finally, if you're making a number of parts, it's best to create a
division of labor if you have a manual and a cnc.  Thus far, I turn
round blanks, and the Arty does the flutes and spirals.  It's much,
much faster at both.  And I need not mention the advantage of not
having to set up gears and index wheels and calculating pitches.  In
short, it's really fast at the important stuff.  Now when I put a
tailstock on the wall and do 8 foot posts, it'll just have to do all
the cutting and I'll do the flipping!

Begat


On May 5, 10:04 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Couple more things,
>
> I would have to guess acme leadscrew as well.  The pictures I've seen of the
> rack and pinion shows they are bolted on.
>
> I'm really surprised that you can round stock faster on the 900 than you can
> on the arty?  Can you explain that.  How are you turning them round on the
> machines?  The arty is more rigid and I would think you can make the spindle
> turn at a greater speed than the 900 and take a much more aggressive cut.
>
> As for the John Henry concept, I can turn square stock to semi round in
> seconds compared to minutes the 900 takes.  The flip side of that is my
> legacy takes minutes to make a specific diameter cylinder compared to many
> more minutes hand turning and even that is not that accurate.
>
> I was wondering about the rotary table myself and thinking they could make
> an adapter to make the original one work.
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 10:33 AM
> Subject: Re: Look Ye Here!
>
> Hello All,
>
> As one who owns both a 900 and an Arty 58", this development is
> something worth watching.  I'm relatively new to both, and I would not
> trade my 900 for an Arty alone, and would not own a cnc unless I
> wanted to make some money.
>
> Unless the middle rails are realigned and the brackets lowered, the
> max. turn size on the Shadow would be six inches.
>
> Presumably, the Shadow would come with rack-and-pinion, especially if
> it's going to be an easy upgrade.  This would mean that the leadscrew
> is history as well as the router table as we know it.
>
> By the way, I use my 900 to make almost all my blanks round.  It moves
> faster than the cnc, which has the edge for accuracy in turning.  (Of
> course, you seasoned woodworkers--the John Henry's of sawdust--can
> probably out do the cnc in terms of quality and speed!)

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Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts

[begatbrown]

too soft and slick.  
> Plus mine had a small surface area and I couldn't decide where to mount it so 
> I did nothing.  I don't remember if I shared this photo with the group or 
> talked about the idea on the list or not.  Here's a photo.
>
>         It could have been on the left rear corner as well.
>
>         The only thing that I don't like about the whole idea is the side 
> ways pressure that is being put on the gear.  It might cause things to go out 
> of alignment when activated.  That's why I was thinking of a downward 
> pinching grip.
>
>         Oh, I also see a vise grip on the left side of the table will work 
> too.  Faster than the c-clamp :-).  Place a spacer under the large gear so it 
> wont compress when you close the vice grip.  
>
>         Finally, at the risk of offending people, magnets seem goofy no 
> matter how they are used.  Unless you are using an electromagnet that really 
> grips things I would think the rare earth ones would fail.  I know it's easy 
> to slide the magnets but difficult to pull apart and that is the exact motion 
> we are trying to prevent.
>
>         It's really nice to see this topic move forward with some action!
>
>         -Tim
>
>         - Original Message -
>
>         From: "begatbrown" 
>
>         To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> 
>
>         Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 4:43 AM
>
>         Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make 
> straight cuts
>
>         Hello All,
>
>         Curt's solution of using attaching a fixture to the headstock then
>         utilizing the index wheel seems workable.  As does Bill's table-
>         locking jig, though as he points out it would need modification for a
>         table not made for the Revo.
>
>         Begat
>
>         On May 1, 1:15 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
>         > I know my rotary table is different than all you guys its off the 
> revo and
>         > made wider to fit my 900,
>         > but similar could be done on the 900 rotary table i'm sure
>         > anyway this is what I use for a brake it took me about 10 min to 
> make
>         > if I really what to hold things tight I put one on the other side 
> as well
>         > Bill
>
>         > - Original Message -
>         > From: "curt george" 
>         > To: 
>         > Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 7:25 AM
>         > Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
>         > straight cuts
>
>         
> >http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=19597&filter=destayco%20clamps
>
>         > Hello Tim
>         > Ive bought these before, thay are under 3/4" tall. I belive that 
> thay would
>         > sit just below or at the same level as the top of the table?
>         > If not a key lach lock that could engauge the teeth of the gear 
> would be a
>         > much smaller profile. or a cam lock may also work.
>         > Just playing around with some ideas.
>         > I can wait to see your new turn table!
>
>         > talk to you more latter.
>         > C.A.G.
>         > - Original Message -
>         > From: "Tim Krause" 
>         > To: 
>         > Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 5:02 PM
>         > Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
>         > straight cuts
>
>         > I think any Destaco clamp would sit too high and interfere with the 
> router
>         > carriage, IMHO. That's why I've been looking for a really low 
> profile
>         > solution. Feel free to prove me wrong :-).
>
>         > -Tim
>
>         > - Original Message -
>         > From: "curt george" 
>         > To: 
>         > Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 1:56 PM
>         > Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
>         > straight cuts
>
>         > Hello Everyone!
>         > Just got home.
>         > I like the idea of locking the table onto the main spindle shaft. I 
> find
>         > that it makes everything much easer, the spindle or Indexing pin 
> then can be
>         > used to lock the table at any degree. And Mike's indexing gears 
> concept also
>         > comes into play with this method of controlling your table.
>         > As far as a locking tool for the table? could you just use a small 
> DeStayCo
>         > push clamp with a rubber tip, Having the tip so that is can engage 

Re: Look Ye Here!

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

As one who owns both a 900 and an Arty 58", this development is
something worth watching.  I'm relatively new to both, and I would not
trade my 900 for an Arty alone, and would not own a cnc unless I
wanted to make some money.

Unless the middle rails are realigned and the brackets lowered, the
max. turn size on the Shadow would be six inches.  The way it's made,
it is easier to fix a tailstock on the wall and maker a longer column
on the Arty than the manual machines. (For you alter-the-machine
fellas!) If they move the rails, the column diameter could improve
dramatically.  But then again, that would make it harder to upgrade to
the cnc.  So the decision that they make will be interesting.

Presumably, the Shadow would come with rack-and-pinion, especially if
it's going to be an easy upgrade.  This would mean that the leadscrew
is history as well as the router table as we know it.

I like the 900, including the rotary table that I originally thought
I'd sell.

As for the cost of the CNC.  Folks, the 179 tax break Legacy talks
about is real.  And the use of your shop for business purposes creates
another write off for the home.  And shops do not have to be finished
to get the tax write off. (Of course, this is USA tax stuff thanks to
current tax laws.)  Sell a few posts, and a number of people here do
seem to sell parts and finished stuff, and you will have a cnc for
less than the price of the old 1800.  Do fairly well, and the machine
will pay for itself quickly enough.

By the way, I use my 900 to make almost all my blanks round.  It moves
faster than the cnc, which has the edge for accuracy in turning.  (Of
course, you seasoned woodworkers--the John Henry's of sawdust--can
probably out do the cnc in terms of quality and speed!)  For me, the
combo is working out well.  I don't mean to quit my day job, but it's
nice to make side money in an economy in which pay raises don't exist
and to keep more of what I make on my day job through tax write offs.

If I had to have one machine, it would be the 1200 with a motor and
it's tailstock on the garage wall  It would be more limited in
designing than a CNC, but it could turn 11 inch columns something that
you'd have to buy an Artisan to do.

By the way, where did you guys see the ad for the Shadow?
Begat




On May 5, 3:31 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> I dough it Jeff.
> Since you own a 1200 what length is it? 56" sounds a little short to me?
> My 1000 ex was 48" and I extended it to 56" but? isn't the 1200, 72" long?
> I still cant wait to see how that they handles the gearing.
> And they said the frame was wider. I wonder what dia. this unit will turn?
> As I said earlier, this is a Neat concept. there are a lot of bonus's here,
> but so far...
> This is to new, and I would like to see more about it before I completely
> jump on this band wagon.
> Neat but un-proven. :-)
> (Sorta sounds like "Trust but Verify" the former Gov. policy that the US
> used
> when dealing with other countries, when I was still in the military. )
>
> Have a great day.
> Jeff call Legacy and find out for sure if they are willing to trade. :-)
> Trust but Verify!
>
> C.A.G.
> .
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Love to turn in Oregon" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2011 11:50 PM
> Subject: Re: Look Ye Here!
>
> I wonder of legacy would consider a trade straight across. My 1200 is
> in great shape.
>
> Jeff
>
> On May 4, 4:59 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > yes it will be very interesting to see
> > possibly a way of poorer people to get cnc first the manual machine then
> > maybe later upgrade to the computer part
> > still beyond me im afraid the shipping would be staggering for overseas on
> > a pre assembled machine but for all you guys in the states who knows
> > like I said I will be very interested to see it
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: curt george
> > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 8:46 AM
> > Subject: Re: Look Ye Here!
>
> > Hello Bill!
> > we must have seen the same thing at pretty much the same time. I didnt see
> > you new mill until after I posted pretty much the same thing.
> > I sure would like to get better look at this gizmo.
>
> > talk to you more latter.
> > C.A.G.
> > - Original Message -
> > From: curt george
> > To: Legacy Google group
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2011 6:42 PM
> > Subject: Look Ye Here!
>
> > Coming Soon - Legacy Shadow
>
> > The new manual Ornamental Mill (code named "Shadow") is based on the Arty
> > CNC frame shown above. Although the system will be manually driven, it is
> > CNC ready allowing you the options of upgrading to CNC at a later time.
> > Designed to replace the popular model 1200, the Shadow CNC is available in
> > two sizes and features a wider welded and fully assembled frame, linear
> > bearings and shafts, Z-Axis and Legacy's exclusive Adjustable Bed. Now for
> > the good news - The 36" 

Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts

[begatbrown]

Hello Mike,

The magswitches were just what I had in mind for the long run.  I
never doubt Tim about the problems he raises, especially with the non-
magswitch magnets that I'm now using as a stop gap measure.  What I'm
thinking of is making a jig like Bill's (long enough to grab lots of
teeth) on both sides of the table.  It will be held down with
magswitches.  I tried the magswitches once in Woodcraft and they were
very difficult to move once engaged.  And, of course, it's amazing to
see how demagnetizing them allows you to simply pick the jig up.  It
would make setting up and taking down the jig in a breeze.  I don't
have the precision drilling equipment to drop a whole in my table.

Thanks,

Begat

On Apr 30, 2:31 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
wrote:
> I was going to suggest magnets as well.  Here are some magnetic switches
> that are 
> awesome!http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2020128/19448/Magswitch-MagJig-150-S...
> Lock these in 2 places under the gear and when you want it to hold down,
> all you have to do is give it a turn and it magnetizes.  You will have
> 300 pounds of lock without having to worry about a pin hole.
>
> Mike
> <http://www.woodcraft.com/Images/products/147833.jpg>
> On 4/30/2011 1:06 PM, begatbrown wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hello JWB and Tim,
>
> > Thanks,  I was able to get away without drilling holes!  I have two
> > strong (really strong) magnets and they were able pin in the small
> > gear on either side.  The small gear is the more important gear to
> > attack.  If you can hold its teeth still, then it locks its teeth into
> > those on the larger gear. It also has the benefit of immobilizing the
> > handle.
>
> > Tim, I can see why you didn't create a device to lock down the small
> > gear because it would be hard to get to.  But if you could create a
> > clamp that is screwed into the table and folds down on top of the
> > small gear and meshes with its teeth, then it would truly stop all
> > movement.
>
> > It would also be a smaller device with the need for fewer teeth.
>
> > Begat.
>
> > On Apr 30, 12:57 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> >> Begat,
>
> >> First you might want to look into why your rotary table is so loose.  
> >> Tightening the four mounting screws and adding shims might tighten the 
> >> table up.
>
> >> Locking the table is something we have talked about but never really found 
> >> a solution.  One thing that prevents the table from moving is hooking it 
> >> up to the main spindle.  With the gears engaged it will only move the 
> >> amount of the backlash in the rotary table gears.  
>
> >> Another simple idea that came up in the past is to use a "C" clamp between 
> >> the waste board and the base to hold it in place.   simple, cheap but may 
> >> not be fast enough for you.
>
> >> Using a pin to lock the table in place with the aid of the large gear 
> >> teeth gives you 2.25� increments.  So you can index 1, 2, 4, 5, 8, 10, 
> >> 16, 20, 32, 40, 80, and 160 places.  That might be too limiting.  Is this 
> >> what you where thinking or do you have the guts to actually drill index 
> >> holes in your rotary table in the right place?
>
> >> I've been working on a clamping idea for way too long that just grabs the 
> >> edge of the large gear but with my degree wheel that only leaves a small 
> >> portion of the teeth to grab.  This could be adequate but I have not tried 
> >> it yet.  I wanted something that would stay in place and is lever operated 
> >> for fast on and off response.  It also needs to be low profile in my 
> >> opinion.  
>
> >> On this same path, I came up with a way to mount index wheels on the 
> >> bottom of the table and use a spring loaded pin to index the table.  I 
> >> have not decided how easy it was going to be to use so I've not taken it 
> >> any further than thinking.  Along with that idea comes a way to disengage 
> >> the small gear from the table so it can be freely rotated quickly for the 
> >> next index.
>
> >> Index plates added to the rotary table is not a new idea.  I made a custom 
> >> index plate for one of our members that had a boat load of holes.  Here's 
> >> a photo.
>
> >> He made his own version of the rotary table that exceeded the cost of 
> >> legacy's but the design is more flexible and easier to use.  The table can 
> >> be used in a freely spinning mode or driven by a gear.  He made a custom 
> >> spring loaded arm that al

Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

No offense taken, especially sense the magnet solution got me through
a problem without taking the day off.

Bill, how do your clamps grip the teeth?  Are they serrated?  Can't
tell from the photo.

Begat

On May 1, 11:46 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> my clamp does hold quite tight with little pressure due to the large surface 
> area clamping, you would have to really be doing some hard cutting vibration 
> for it to move. and as you say lots of pressure will move the large gear 
> slightly but as i said one each side seems to stop that. but really how hard 
> do you need to clamp it
> I have had no trouble with movment or slip and with just light clamping
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Tim Krause
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Monday, May 02, 2011 1:12 AM
>   Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make 
> straight cuts
>
>   Curt's does not address the backlash in the gears but Bill's is right on.  
> It's a low profile clamp that prevents the large gear from turning.  I think 
> the same thing can be done on the left side of the rotary table using the 
> stock holes in the rotary table.   It would hang over the edge of the rotary 
> table and I would put the clamp in the back left corner and pivot in the 
> front left corner.  
>
>   Bill, will it really slip with all of that surface area?  Would a strip of 
> cork, rubber or sandpaper add to the grip?  
>
>   One problem I had with my cam version I was working on was finding a 
> suitable material that would grip the gear side and not harm the gear or wear 
> out too quickly.  I had started with UHMW and it was too soft and slick.  
> Plus mine had a small surface area and I couldn't decide where to mount it so 
> I did nothing.  I don't remember if I shared this photo with the group or 
> talked about the idea on the list or not.  Here's a photo.
>
>   It could have been on the left rear corner as well.
>
>   The only thing that I don't like about the whole idea is the side ways 
> pressure that is being put on the gear.  It might cause things to go out of 
> alignment when activated.  That's why I was thinking of a downward pinching 
> grip.
>
>   Oh, I also see a vise grip on the left side of the table will work too.  
> Faster than the c-clamp :-).  Place a spacer under the large gear so it wont 
> compress when you close the vice grip.  
>
>   Finally, at the risk of offending people, magnets seem goofy no matter how 
> they are used.  Unless you are using an electromagnet that really grips 
> things I would think the rare earth ones would fail.  I know it's easy to 
> slide the magnets but difficult to pull apart and that is the exact motion we 
> are trying to prevent.
>
>   It's really nice to see this topic move forward with some action!
>
>   -Tim
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: "begatbrown" 
>   To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
>   Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 4:43 AM
>   Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make 
> straight cuts
>
>   Hello All,
>
>   Curt's solution of using attaching a fixture to the headstock then
>   utilizing the index wheel seems workable.  As does Bill's table-
>   locking jig, though as he points out it would need modification for a
>   table not made for the Revo.
>
>   Begat
>
>   On May 1, 1:15 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
>   > I know my rotary table is different than all you guys its off the revo and
>   > made wider to fit my 900,
>   > but similar could be done on the 900 rotary table i'm sure
>   > anyway this is what I use for a brake it took me about 10 min to make
>   > if I really what to hold things tight I put one on the other side as well
>   > Bill
>
>   > - Original Message -
>   > From: "curt george" 
>   > To: 
>   > Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 7:25 AM
>   > Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
>   > straight cuts
>
>   >http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=19597&filter=destayco%20clamps
>
>   > Hello Tim
>   > Ive bought these before, thay are under 3/4" tall. I belive that thay 
> would
>   > sit just below or at the same level as the top of the table?
>   > If not a key lach lock that could engauge the teeth of the gear would be a
>   > much smaller profile. or a cam lock may also work.
>   > Just playing around with some ideas.
>   > I can wait to see your new turn table!
>
>   > talk to you more latter.
>   > C.A.G.
&

Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

Curt's solution of using attaching a fixture to the headstock then
utilizing the index wheel seems workable.  As does Bill's table-
locking jig, though as he points out it would need modification for a
table not made for the Revo.

Begat

On May 1, 1:15 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> I know my rotary table is different than all you guys its off the revo and
> made wider to fit my 900,
> but similar could be done on the 900 rotary table i'm sure
> anyway this is what I use for a brake it took me about 10 min to make
> if I really what to hold things tight I put one on the other side as well
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "curt george" 
> To: 
> Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 7:25 AM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=19597&filter=destayco%20clamps
>
> Hello Tim
> Ive bought these before, thay are under 3/4" tall. I belive that thay would
> sit just below or at the same level as the top of the table?
> If not a key lach lock that could engauge the teeth of the gear would be a
> much smaller profile. or a cam lock may also work.
> Just playing around with some ideas.
> I can wait to see your new turn table!
>
> talk to you more latter.
> C.A.G.
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tim Krause" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 5:02 PM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> I think any Destaco clamp would sit too high and interfere with the router
> carriage, IMHO.  That's why I've been looking for a really low profile
> solution.  Feel free to prove me wrong :-).
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "curt george" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 1:56 PM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> Hello Everyone!
> Just got home.
> I like the idea of locking the table onto the main spindle shaft. I find
> that it makes everything much easer, the spindle or Indexing pin then can be
> used to lock the table at any degree. And Mike's indexing gears concept also
> comes into play with this method of controlling your table.
> As far as a locking tool for the table? could you just use a small DeStayCo
> push clamp with a rubber tip, Having the tip so that is can engage with the
> large gear? that would lock your table in any locked position that you may
> want.
> Its just an idea. I have not tried it, up I believe it should work.
>
> have to run.
> Good luck.
> C.A.G.
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tim Krause" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 4:25 PM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> All I can say is stay tuned.  I'm working on a rotary table mod right now
> and I'm going to make a lock and see if it works.  It would be a simple
> screw, one hole and a couple pieces of steel or aluminum.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 11:06 AM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> Hello JWB and Tim,
>
> Thanks,  I was able to get away without drilling holes!  I have two
> strong (really strong) magnets and they were able pin in the small
> gear on either side.  The small gear is the more important gear to
> attack.  If you can hold its teeth still, then it locks its teeth into
> those on the larger gear. It also has the benefit of immobilizing the
> handle.
>
> Tim, I can see why you didn't create a device to lock down the small
> gear because it would be hard to get to.  But if you could create a
> clamp that is screwed into the table and folds down on top of the
> small gear and meshes with its teeth, then it would truly stop all
> movement.
>
> It would also be a smaller device with the need for fewer teeth.
>
> Begat.
>
> On Apr 30, 12:57 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > Begat,
>
> > First you might want to look into why your rotary table is so loose.
> Tightening the four mounting screws and adding shims might tighten the table
> up.
>
> > Locking the table is something we have talked about but never really found
> a solution. One thing that prevents the table from moving is hooking it up
> to the main spindle. With the gears engaged it will only move the amount of
> the backlash in the rotary table gears.
>
> > Another simple idea that came up in the past i

Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts

[begatbrown]

Hello all,

All I have to say at this point is that I hope you highly skill tool
guys hurry up and find a good solution because I feel like one of the
Three Stooges every time I try to pull the magnets free to turn the
table LOL. My solution works--works me!  Otherwise I'll have to
buy maglocks and rig something to pin in the small gear.

Begat
On Apr 30, 5:25 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
> http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=19597&filter=destayco%20clamps
>
> Hello Tim
> Ive bought these before, thay are under 3/4" tall. I belive that thay would
> sit just below or at the same level as the top of the table?
> If not a key lach lock that could engauge the teeth of the gear would be a
> much smaller profile. or a cam lock may also work.
> Just playing around with some ideas.
> I can wait to see your new turn table!
>
> talk to you more latter.
> C.A.G.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tim Krause" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 5:02 PM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> I think any Destaco clamp would sit too high and interfere with the router
> carriage, IMHO.  That's why I've been looking for a really low profile
> solution.  Feel free to prove me wrong :-).
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "curt george" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 1:56 PM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> Hello Everyone!
> Just got home.
> I like the idea of locking the table onto the main spindle shaft. I find
> that it makes everything much easer, the spindle or Indexing pin then can be
> used to lock the table at any degree. And Mike's indexing gears concept also
> comes into play with this method of controlling your table.
> As far as a locking tool for the table? could you just use a small DeStayCo
> push clamp with a rubber tip, Having the tip so that is can engage with the
> large gear? that would lock your table in any locked position that you may
> want.
> Its just an idea. I have not tried it, up I believe it should work.
>
> have to run.
> Good luck.
> C.A.G.
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tim Krause" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 4:25 PM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> All I can say is stay tuned.  I'm working on a rotary table mod right now
> and I'm going to make a lock and see if it works.  It would be a simple
> screw, one hole and a couple pieces of steel or aluminum.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 11:06 AM
> Subject: Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make
> straight cuts
>
> Hello JWB and Tim,
>
> Thanks,  I was able to get away without drilling holes!  I have two
> strong (really strong) magnets and they were able pin in the small
> gear on either side.  The small gear is the more important gear to
> attack.  If you can hold its teeth still, then it locks its teeth into
> those on the larger gear. It also has the benefit of immobilizing the
> handle.
>
> Tim, I can see why you didn't create a device to lock down the small
> gear because it would be hard to get to.  But if you could create a
> clamp that is screwed into the table and folds down on top of the
> small gear and meshes with its teeth, then it would truly stop all
> movement.
>
> It would also be a smaller device with the need for fewer teeth.
>
> Begat.
>
> On Apr 30, 12:57 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > Begat,
>
> > First you might want to look into why your rotary table is so loose.
> Tightening the four mounting screws and adding shims might tighten the table
> up.
>
> > Locking the table is something we have talked about but never really found
> a solution. One thing that prevents the table from moving is hooking it up
> to the main spindle. With the gears engaged it will only move the amount of
> the backlash in the rotary table gears.
>
> > Another simple idea that came up in the past is to use a "C" clamp between
> the waste board and the base to hold it in place. simple, cheap but may not
> be fast enough for you.
>
> > Using a pin to lock the table in place with the aid of the large gear
> teeth gives you 2.25 increments. So you can index 1, 2, 4, 5, 8, 10, 16,
> 20, 32, 40, 80, and 160 places. That might be too limiting. Is this what you
> where thinking or do you have the guts to actually drill index holes

Re: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts

[begatbrown]

Hello JWB and Tim,

Thanks,  I was able to get away without drilling holes!  I have two
strong (really strong) magnets and they were able pin in the small
gear on either side.  The small gear is the more important gear to
attack.  If you can hold its teeth still, then it locks its teeth into
those on the larger gear. It also has the benefit of immobilizing the
handle.

Tim, I can see why you didn't create a device to lock down the small
gear because it would be hard to get to.  But if you could create a
clamp that is screwed into the table and folds down on top of the
small gear and meshes with its teeth, then it would truly stop all
movement.

It would also be a smaller device with the need for fewer teeth.

Begat.






On Apr 30, 12:57 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Begat,
>
> First you might want to look into why your rotary table is so loose.  
> Tightening the four mounting screws and adding shims might tighten the table 
> up.
>
> Locking the table is something we have talked about but never really found a 
> solution.  One thing that prevents the table from moving is hooking it up to 
> the main spindle.  With the gears engaged it will only move the amount of the 
> backlash in the rotary table gears.  
>
> Another simple idea that came up in the past is to use a "C" clamp between 
> the waste board and the base to hold it in place.   simple, cheap but may not 
> be fast enough for you.
>
> Using a pin to lock the table in place with the aid of the large gear teeth 
> gives you 2.25º increments.  So you can index 1, 2, 4, 5, 8, 10, 16, 20, 32, 
> 40, 80, and 160 places.  That might be too limiting.  Is this what you where 
> thinking or do you have the guts to actually drill index holes in your rotary 
> table in the right place?
>
> I've been working on a clamping idea for way too long that just grabs the 
> edge of the large gear but with my degree wheel that only leaves a small 
> portion of the teeth to grab.  This could be adequate but I have not tried it 
> yet.  I wanted something that would stay in place and is lever operated for 
> fast on and off response.  It also needs to be low profile in my opinion.  
>
> On this same path, I came up with a way to mount index wheels on the bottom 
> of the table and use a spring loaded pin to index the table.  I have not 
> decided how easy it was going to be to use so I've not taken it any further 
> than thinking.  Along with that idea comes a way to disengage the small gear 
> from the table so it can be freely rotated quickly for the next index.
>
> Index plates added to the rotary table is not a new idea.  I made a custom 
> index plate for one of our members that had a boat load of holes.  Here's a 
> photo.
>
> He made his own version of the rotary table that exceeded the cost of 
> legacy's but the design is more flexible and easier to use.  The table can be 
> used in a freely spinning mode or driven by a gear.  He made a custom spring 
> loaded arm that allowed him to index specific locations.   The idea was to 
> avoid counting and just move to the next hole.  The increments got smaller as 
> you moved inward.  
>
> Here's his adjustable arm.
>
> It's a real piece of art what he came up with.
>
> I hope this helps in some way to get you thinking.  I think it's a great 
> topic to expand on.
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 8:50 AM
> Subject: Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts
>
> > Hello All,
>
> > I've been working on the template to make glue spars for columns, but
> > have had problems with the rotary table drifting while I make cuts
> > without turning.  There is no lock for the handle and it occurs to me
> > that I could drill a series of small holes in the table between the
> > teeth and place pin in them to fix the table.  (Oh, you alter-the-
> > machine guys are a bad influence.)  Before I get to drilling, I
> > thought I check in to see whether someone has found another solution.
> > I don't want to reinvent the wheel if I don't have to.
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to 
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group 
> > athttp://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mil

Looking for a Means of Locking the Rotary Table to make straight cuts

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

I've been working on the template to make glue spars for columns, but
have had problems with the rotary table drifting while I make cuts
without turning.  There is no lock for the handle and it occurs to me
that I could drill a series of small holes in the table between the
teeth and place pin in them to fix the table.  (Oh, you alter-the-
machine guys are a bad influence.)  Before I get to drilling, I
thought I check in to see whether someone has found another solution.
I don't want to reinvent the wheel if I don't have to.

Begat

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Re: storage for parts on legacy

[begatbrown]

Good idea, but it wouldn't work for me because I use the circle
cutting center. I have been considering putting drawers or baskets
beneath the stand I built.

Begat

On Apr 28, 8:17 am, Groovy Wood LLC  wrote:
>  I was having trouble with where to put all the legacy things, I use peg
> board for other projects and had some left over so I put some Styrofoam
> caulk gap fill in the bottom groove of the rail and then placed the peg
> board in and it working so far, it also give me an added security if
> something flies off while cutting it will hopefully hit the peg board.  
>
>  Legacy 008.jpg
> 160KViewDownload
>
>  Legacy 009.jpg
> 200KViewDownload

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Re: Pilaster and Index Hub alterations

[begatbrown]

Greg,

Tim has a post on this subject which prompted me to buy some derlin
from amazon, but if this is cheaper and lasts then this is probably a
good option--especially when you have a job to do!

Begat

On Apr 25, 11:33 am, Groovy Wood LLC  wrote:
> Sorry if this is a duplicate.
>
> I have some pictures of how I did if anyone is interested it will take a few
> days to for me to write it up if there is interest.
>
> Thanks
>
> Greg
>
>  April 2011 080.JPG
> 1867KViewDownload
>
>  April 2011 082.JPG
> 1373KViewDownload

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Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns

[begatbrown]

Curt,

Thanks for reminding about Dane's arbor. I had forgotten about it.
It's really nice.  I am not in a hurry to do the gazebo.  I have to
recoup some of my investment first.  (I'll be like the barber who
always needs a haircut himself!)  I'm trying to learn how to use CAD
programs so I can design something nice.  I'm learning that you can do
SOME parts and small pieces as you go, but the bigger or the more
intricate, the more you need a good drawing.  (Another learning curve,
but that's why I like getting into this in the first place.)  So it'll
be a while.

Begat

On Apr 24, 8:32 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
> Legacy where your only limitation is your imagination. ;-)
>
> I am sorry if Im a bad influence,But what modification where you thinking
> about trying??? I hope it was the Vertical mill idea? that one I still think
> is a neat concept. There are a few draw backs that I can see with it, but
> honestly it realy doesn't change a lot on the Legacy. it just changes the
> foot print of the machine.For a small shop it might work out well?
> If it was the Monster mill idea. that's not mine. Im just the messenger on
> that one. ;-) (Please don't shoot the messenger!) ;-)
> The hole concept of this group is to explore new ideas, and to help out
> other people who are running into problems.As well as to share new projects
> with the others within this group.
> Please take this with a grain of salt, No bad intent was meant, by any ideas
> that I may have suggested. ;-)
>
> I cant wait to see your Gazebo! what kind of post are you going to use to
> hole up the roof? Roped, fluted, twisted...Danes Chinese looking grape arbor
> look might be nice?http://legacywoodworking.com/galleryItem.cfm?project=208
> Have a good night.
> and please let us know what you think?
>
> C.A.G.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tim Krause" 
> To: 
> Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2011 7:29 PM
> Subject: Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns
>
> > Is the Gazebo to put the Legacy's in? I've heard enough complaints about
> > dust, the open air should solve the problem :-).  Also look at Roger's
> > lengthening mod if you have not seen it.
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills/browse_thread/...
>
> > -Tim
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2011 4:07 PM
> > Subject: Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns
>
> > Bill,
>
> > I like your idea.  Curt almost had me doing an alteration to my 900,
> > which is still to new for me to feel comfortable tinkering with it.
> > Hell, my Arty '58 came the other day and before I could get the 220V
> > put in I was thinking about how I could modify it.  (You guys are a
> > bad influence!)  I think I'll get around to your idea of creating a
> > stand to go behind the existing tail stock.  I like that idea a lot.
> > I want to build a special gazebo for the side of my home.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Apr 23, 6:30 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> >> I bought the bird mouth bits too but I have not tried it yet either
> >> mount your legacy near a wall and put a make shift tails stock on the
> >> wall
> >> so you can fit 8 foot columns in the 900
> >> and do half the column at a time
> >> Bill
>
> >> - Original Message -
> >> From: "cole andrews" 
> >> To: 
> >> Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2011 6:12 AM
> >> Subject: Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns
>
> >> let us know how this turns out , I have already bought a birdmouth bit
> >> to try myself. any pictures?
>
> >> On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 9:18 PM, begatbrown 
> >> wrote:
> >> > Hello All,
>
> >> > I'm working on my first hollow column's. The link that Tim posted on
> >> > the site is indispensable for determining the dimensions of the
> >> > spars. Looking at how Mike Pong and Art have glued up the spars has
> >> > helped me, but it's truly difficult to do them solo as Curt says. I
> >> > created a makeshift jig that goes on both ends of the column that
> >> > allows me to put the spars in place as I glue them. Afterwards I use
> >> > tension clamps. It worked fine for a first try, but that might just be
> >> > because my Legacy 900 allows me to make only short columns--48", not
> >> > the 8 footers. I'm going to work

Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns

[begatbrown]

Tim,

I remember it.  It's hard to forget and it's the kind of thing you can
look at a good number of times.

No, nothing outside is really for me--not even the sun or shade.  I
just do the work out there.  It's a long standing request.  (And it
helped to justify machines!)

Begat


On Apr 24, 7:29 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Is the Gazebo to put the Legacy's in? I've heard enough complaints about
> dust, the open air should solve the problem :-).  Also look at Roger's
> lengthening mod if you have not seen 
> it.http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills/browse_thread/...
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2011 4:07 PM
> Subject: Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns
>
> Bill,
>
> I like your idea.  Curt almost had me doing an alteration to my 900,
> which is still to new for me to feel comfortable tinkering with it.
> Hell, my Arty '58 came the other day and before I could get the 220V
> put in I was thinking about how I could modify it.  (You guys are a
> bad influence!)  I think I'll get around to your idea of creating a
> stand to go behind the existing tail stock.  I like that idea a lot.
> I want to build a special gazebo for the side of my home.
>
> Begat
>
> On Apr 23, 6:30 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > I bought the bird mouth bits too but I have not tried it yet either
> > mount your legacy near a wall and put a make shift tails stock on the wall
> > so you can fit 8 foot columns in the 900
> > and do half the column at a time
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "cole andrews" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2011 6:12 AM
> > Subject: Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns
>
> > let us know how this turns out , I have already bought a birdmouth bit
> > to try myself. any pictures?
>
> > On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 9:18 PM, begatbrown 
> > wrote:
> > > Hello All,
>
> > > I'm working on my first hollow column's. The link that Tim posted on
> > > the site is indispensable for determining the dimensions of the
> > > spars. Looking at how Mike Pong and Art have glued up the spars has
> > > helped me, but it's truly difficult to do them solo as Curt says. I
> > > created a makeshift jig that goes on both ends of the column that
> > > allows me to put the spars in place as I glue them. Afterwards I use
> > > tension clamps. It worked fine for a first try, but that might just be
> > > because my Legacy 900 allows me to make only short columns--48", not
> > > the 8 footers. I'm going to work on the jig because I want to make
> > > lots of them eventually. The basic premise is to create raised slots
> > > on both the interior and exterior of the octagon, which allows the
> > > spars to fit into them and stay in place as they are glued. Has
> > > anyone else tried anything like this?
>
> > > Begat
>
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups
> > > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > > To post to this group, send email to
> > > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
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>
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Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns

[begatbrown]

Bill,

I like your idea.  Curt almost had me doing an alteration to my 900,
which is still to new for me to feel comfortable tinkering with it.
Hell, my Arty '58 came the other day and before I could get the 220V
put in I was thinking about how I could modify it.  (You guys are a
bad influence!)  I think I'll get around to your idea of creating a
stand to go behind the existing tail stock.  I like that idea a lot.
I want to build a special gazebo for the side of my home.

Begat

On Apr 23, 6:30 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> I bought the bird mouth bits too but I have not tried it yet either
> mount your legacy near a wall and put a make shift tails stock on the wall
> so you can fit 8 foot columns in the 900
> and do half the column at a time
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "cole andrews" 
> To: 
> Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2011 6:12 AM
> Subject: Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns
>
> let us know how this turns out , I have already bought a birdmouth bit
>  to try myself. any pictures?
>
> On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 9:18 PM, begatbrown 
> wrote:
> > Hello All,
>
> > I'm working on my first hollow column's. The link that Tim posted on
> > the site is indispensable for determining the dimensions of the
> > spars. Looking at how Mike Pong and Art have glued up the spars has
> > helped me, but it's truly difficult to do them solo as Curt says. I
> > created a makeshift jig that goes on both ends of the column that
> > allows me to put the spars in place as I glue them. Afterwards I use
> > tension clamps. It worked fine for a first try, but that might just be
> > because my Legacy 900 allows me to make only short columns--48", not
> > the 8 footers. I'm going to work on the jig because I want to make
> > lots of them eventually. The basic premise is to create raised slots
> > on both the interior and exterior of the octagon, which allows the
> > spars to fit into them and stay in place as they are glued. Has
> > anyone else tried anything like this?
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
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Re: A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns

[begatbrown]

Cole,

When I made the trial jig, I was so uncertain that it would work that
I didn't bother to take pictures.  I will when I make the improved
version.  I'm going to cut slots in it so that I can use the same jig
to make different size posts.  My 900 has a swing limit of 10 inches
since I built a platform for it.  I'm going to try to max it out and
go as low as 5 or 6 inches.

I was looking at the pictures of Pong's lathe for making columns. (The
one's that Curt posted today.)  I've been on the forum for several
months only and have never seen him post.  But his old projects are
something to behold.

Begat

On Apr 23, 4:12 pm, cole andrews  wrote:
> let us know how this turns out , I have already bought a birdmouth bit
>  to try myself. any pictures?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 9:18 PM, begatbrown  
> wrote:
> > Hello All,
>
> > I'm working on my first hollow column's.  The link that Tim posted on
> > the site is indispensable for determining the dimensions of the
> > spars.  Looking at how Mike Pong and Art have glued up the spars has
> > helped me, but it's truly difficult to do them solo as Curt says.  I
> > created a makeshift jig that goes on both ends of the column that
> > allows me to put the spars in place as I glue them. Afterwards I use
> > tension clamps. It worked fine for a first try, but that might just be
> > because my Legacy 900 allows me to make only short columns--48", not
> > the 8 footers.  I'm going to work on the jig because I want to make
> > lots of them eventually.  The basic premise is to create raised slots
> > on both the interior and exterior of the octagon, which allows the
> > spars to fit into them and stay in place as they are glued.  Has
> > anyone else tried anything like this?
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to 
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group 
> > athttp://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.

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A Jig for Lining Up and Gluing Spars for Hollow Columns

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

I'm working on my first hollow column's.  The link that Tim posted on
the site is indispensable for determining the dimensions of the
spars.  Looking at how Mike Pong and Art have glued up the spars has
helped me, but it's truly difficult to do them solo as Curt says.  I
created a makeshift jig that goes on both ends of the column that
allows me to put the spars in place as I glue them. Afterwards I use
tension clamps. It worked fine for a first try, but that might just be
because my Legacy 900 allows me to make only short columns--48", not
the 8 footers.  I'm going to work on the jig because I want to make
lots of them eventually.  The basic premise is to create raised slots
on both the interior and exterior of the octagon, which allows the
spars to fit into them and stay in place as they are glued.  Has
anyone else tried anything like this?

Begat

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Re: New Spur Drive

[begatbrown]

Hey,

This will come in handy.  And the pictures make the process clear.

Thanks, Bill.

Begat

On Apr 22, 6:37 am, aussiman  wrote:
> Hi all
> a while ago Tim made a new type of Spur Drive for our legacy I really
> liked the idea so i came up with a way of making one will all legacy
> stuff we all should have with our machines
> all you might have to buy is a few cap screws and a nut and washers at
> the local hardware store and a 1/4 tap to match the screws I had all
> this stuff that came with my machines accept the tap i already had one
> anyway I will post pics shortly
> Bill

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Re: For Sale, a 1200 with all accessories

[begatbrown]

Hello Tim,

No, ebay does not always work, and certainly not for everyone.  Lots
of people, however, select the local pickup option rather than
shipping.  By doing so, they get their money in advance and don't have
to deal with telephone calls and the curious who have nothing better
to do than drop by.  Finally, the listing is carried nationally, but
has a regional rather than local reach, making it better than
craigslist.  I was prepared to drive as far as 600 miles with a UHaul
for the right unit, but I'm simply too far from the Northwest.
There's an 1800 in Vermont that has been on ebay's classified for
quite some time.  I imagine the problem there is somewhat similar--too
far in one corner of the country to reach a large market.

Begat

On Apr 12, 9:29 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Who does it work for?  I'm still trying to unload my buddies 1800 with
> linear drive and unused Z-axis upgrade for $3500.  I tried to point him
> towards ebay but he does not want to pay the ebay or pay pal fees.  Plus he
> does not want to ship the beast.  He's old and has health problems.
>
> http://ornamentalmills.com/forsale/rl1800.html
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 4:01 PM
> Subject: Re: For Sale, a 1200 with all accessories
>
> Brian and All,
>
> A legacy 1800 just sold on ebay for 4K.  It had lots of bits and
> accessories, but no motor drive.  Sometimes ebay does work.
>
> Begat
>
> On Apr 11, 12:32 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > that is a good deal hopefully some one here will want to upgrade or pick
> up
> > a cheap machine for them selves
> > remember if you wish to split anything up just let us know im sure most of
> > the accessories will sell im always interested in the odd accessary
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Monday, April 11, 2011 12:18 PM
> > Subject: Re: For Sale, a 1200 with all accessories
>
> > Brian,
>
> > Wow. A couple of months ago, before I bought a 900, I would have
> > hauled down to Charlotte. That's a great deal.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Apr 10, 8:44 pm, The Great One  wrote:
> > > Hello Group:
>
> > > I am sorry to say that due to lack of space, I have to sell my legacy
> 1200
> > > and all accessories, including over $1000 in Magnate bits. It has the
> gear
> > > doubler, rotary table, thin stock follower, advanced Z axis table and
> > > motoroized X axis attachment.
>
> > > The problem is that all parts are in storage and cannot be set up for a
> > > demo.
> > > AS such, and to keep it as a complete machine, I am offering it for
> $2000,
> > > less than the 7K I invested in it.
>
> > > As I live outside Charlotte, NC, and unless you have a trailer, delivery
> > > will have to be local or pay some heavy shipping costs. Still an
> excellent
> > > deal on a barely used unit.
>
> > > You folks in NC and SC please let me know of interest and pass the word.
>
> > > Brian
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
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> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
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>
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Re: For Sale, a 1200 with all accessories

[begatbrown]

Brian and All,

A legacy 1800 just sold on ebay for 4K.  It had lots of bits and
accessories, but no motor drive.  Sometimes ebay does work.

Begat

On Apr 11, 12:32 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> that is a good deal hopefully some one here will want to upgrade or pick up
> a cheap machine for them selves
> remember if you wish to split anything up just  let us know im sure most of
> the accessories will sell im always interested in the odd accessary
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Monday, April 11, 2011 12:18 PM
> Subject: Re: For Sale, a 1200 with all accessories
>
> Brian,
>
> Wow.  A couple of months ago, before I bought a 900, I would have
> hauled down to Charlotte.  That's a great deal.
>
> Begat
>
> On Apr 10, 8:44 pm, The Great One  wrote:
> > Hello Group:
>
> > I am sorry to say that due to lack of space, I have to sell my legacy 1200
> > and all accessories, including over $1000 in Magnate bits. It has the gear
> > doubler, rotary table, thin stock follower, advanced Z axis table and
> > motoroized X axis attachment.
>
> > The problem is that all parts are in storage and cannot be set up for a
> > demo.
> > AS such, and to keep it as a complete machine, I am offering it for $2000,
> > less than the 7K I invested in it.
>
> > As I live outside Charlotte, NC, and unless you have a trailer, delivery
> > will have to be local or pay some heavy shipping costs. Still an excellent
> > deal on a barely used unit.
>
> > You folks in NC and SC please let me know of interest and pass the word.
>
> > Brian
>
> --
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Re: For Sale, a 1200 with all accessories

[begatbrown]

Brian,

Wow.  A couple of months ago, before I bought a 900, I would have
hauled down to Charlotte.  That's a great deal.

Begat

On Apr 10, 8:44 pm, The Great One  wrote:
> Hello Group:
>
>  I am sorry to say that due to lack of space, I have to sell my legacy 1200 
> and all accessories, including over $1000 in Magnate bits. It has the gear 
> doubler, rotary table, thin stock follower, advanced Z axis table and 
> motoroized X axis attachment.
>
> The problem is that all parts are in storage and cannot be set up for a demo.
> AS such, and to keep it as a complete machine, I am offering it for $2000, 
> less than the 7K I invested in it.
>
> As I live outside Charlotte, NC, and unless you have a trailer, delivery will 
> have to be local or pay some heavy shipping costs. Still an excellent deal on 
> a barely used unit.
>
> You  folks in NC and SC please let me know of interest and pass the word.
>
> Brian

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Re: double sided tape

[begatbrown]

Bill,

I should have made clear that I have used the glue primarily to
surface boards, not to turn.  I did try once to use the tape on the
rotary table, and when I got to an edge where my taping was clearly
inadequate, the rosette went airborne.  Tim hasn't weighed in, but I
remember his post about replacing his spoil board on the rotary table
because of the damage over time at least in part from glue.  I do know
that the next time I use the table, I will use hot glue rather than
tape!

Begat

On Apr 4, 3:59 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> Re: double sided tapeBill I use hot melt glue. its quick and easy,and works 
> well for smaller projects, For large turning I normally use a paper joint. (I 
> feel its safer) but Hot melt glue has worked well for me in the past.
>
> Have a great day.
>
> C.A.G.
>
> - Original Message -
>   From: Bill Bulkeley
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2011 8:09 PM
>   Subject: RE: double sided tape
>
>   Thank you so far more negative feedback than positive on the double sided 
> tape
>
>   Which sort of confirmed my reluctance to try to use it again
>
>   But what a bout the hot glue how strong do you  find that and how hard or 
> easy is it
>
>   To remove the work and also the glue from the work?
>
>   Bill
>
>   From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of begatbrown
>   Sent: Monday, 4 April 2011 9:19 AM
>   To: Legacy Ornamental Mills
>   Subject: Re: double sided tape
>
>   Hello Bill,
>
>   Thus far I have used double-sided tape about a dozen times, not a
>   lot.  I don't like using it.  It's not cheap, and the times that I've
>   skimped on the tape, I've regretted the results.  I now use hot glue
>   and long for a vacuum clamp.
>
>   Begat
>
>   On Apr 3, 8:30 am, "curt george"  wrote:
>   > Hello Bill
>   > For me Double sided tape is not practical. The tape will not stick well in
>   > temperatures lower than 50 deg. F.
>   > I've used a number of different types from 3" wide carpet tape. to 3/4" 
> wide
>   > 3M double sided (Hang anything tape sold at every hardware store That I've
>   > ever been in.)
>   > When the stuff sticks, it normal sticks well, I have friends that use it a
>   > lot and love the stuff. But for me , since I work in a garage where the
>   > temperatures are normally under 50 deg. most of the year around, I don't
>   > trust the stuff a lot.
>   > That's just my two cents worth of it.
>
>   > Have a great day.
>   > C.A.G.
>
>   > - Original Message -
>   > From: "aussiman" 
>   > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
>   > Sent: Saturday, April 02, 2011 9:07 PM
>   > Subject: double sided tape
>
>   > >I am looking into double sided tape I'm not a great fan of using it
>   > > but others use it quite successfully so.
>   > > please tell me what brands and width tapes do you all use? are some
>   > > better than others?
>   > > and how successful do you all find it?.
>   > > how hard is it to remove the work from it afterwards?, is there any
>   > > movement during machining?
>   > > i'm interested in all your thoughts
>
>   > > Bill
>
>   > > --
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>   > > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
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>   > >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
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Re: double sided tape

[begatbrown]

Bill,

I tend to use a spoil board beneath the piece, and my experience is
that the glue damages the spoil board but not the part.  Then I heat
the glue so it will come off easily.  To date I have not had to come
up with a more sophisticated technique because I'm mostly use glue
when I'm surfacing boards that will next go to the planer.

Begat

On Apr 3, 9:04 pm, "Cole Andrews"  wrote:
> So far I have tried the carpet a dozen times or so. I live in SE Georgia so 
> the climate is usually pretty warm and humid. I haven't had any problems yet. 
> My only complaint is peeling the back off to stick it down.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -Original Message-
> From: "Bill Bulkeley" 
>
> Sender: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2011 10:09:57
> To: 
> Reply-To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: double sided tape
>
> Thank you so far more negative feedback than positive on the double sided
> tape
>
> Which sort of confirmed my reluctance to try to use it again
>
> But what a bout the hot glue how strong do you  find that and how hard or
> easy is it
>
> To remove the work and also the glue from the work?
>
> Bill
>
> From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of begatbrown
> Sent: Monday, 4 April 2011 9:19 AM
> To: Legacy Ornamental Mills
> Subject: Re: double sided tape
>
> Hello Bill,
>
> Thus far I have used double-sided tape about a dozen times, not a
> lot.  I don't like using it.  It's not cheap, and the times that I've
> skimped on the tape, I've regretted the results.  I now use hot glue
> and long for a vacuum clamp.
>
> Begat
>
> On Apr 3, 8:30 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> > Hello Bill
> > For me Double sided tape is not practical. The tape will not stick well in
> > temperatures lower than 50 deg. F.
> > I've used a number of different types from 3" wide carpet tape. to 3/4"
> wide
> > 3M double sided (Hang anything tape sold at every hardware store That I've
> > ever been in.)
> > When the stuff sticks, it normal sticks well, I have friends that use it a
> > lot and love the stuff. But for me , since I work in a garage where the
> > temperatures are normally under 50 deg. most of the year around, I don't
> > trust the stuff a lot.
> > That's just my two cents worth of it.
>
> > Have a great day.
> > C.A.G.
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "aussiman" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Saturday, April 02, 2011 9:07 PM
> > Subject: double sided tape
>
> > >I am looking into double sided tape I'm not a great fan of using it
> > > but others use it quite successfully so.
> > > please tell me what brands and width tapes do you all use? are some
> > > better than others?
> > > and how successful do you all find it?.
> > > how hard is it to remove the work from it afterwards?, is there any
> > > movement during machining?
> > > i'm interested in all your thoughts
>
> > > Bill
>
> > > --
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Re: double sided tape

[begatbrown]

Hello Bill,

Thus far I have used double-sided tape about a dozen times, not a
lot.  I don't like using it.  It's not cheap, and the times that I've
skimped on the tape, I've regretted the results.  I now use hot glue
and long for a vacuum clamp.

Begat

On Apr 3, 8:30 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> Hello Bill
> For me Double sided tape is not practical. The tape will not stick well in
> temperatures lower than 50 deg. F.
> I've used a number of different types from 3" wide carpet tape. to 3/4" wide
> 3M double sided (Hang anything tape sold at every hardware store That I've
> ever been in.)
> When the stuff sticks, it normal sticks well, I have friends that use it a
> lot and love the stuff. But for me , since I work in a garage where the
> temperatures are normally under 50 deg. most of the year around, I don't
> trust the stuff a lot.
> That's just my two cents worth of it.
>
> Have a great day.
> C.A.G.
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "aussiman" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, April 02, 2011 9:07 PM
> Subject: double sided tape
>
> >I am looking into double sided tape I'm not a great fan of using it
> > but others use it quite successfully so.
> > please tell me what brands and width tapes do you all use? are some
> > better than others?
> > and how successful do you all find it?.
> > how hard is it to remove the work from it afterwards?, is there any
> > movement during machining?
> > i'm interested in all your thoughts
>
> > Bill
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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Re: saw blade

[begatbrown]

Hello Bob,

Until I bought a Freud, I'd only known cheap blades.  I cannot imagine
a better one.  It cuts so well that it inspired me to adjust all my
equipment.  I have no idea how long the blades last, but Curt's
response gives me hope.  But I've already saved money by not having
badly cut lumber that has to be replaced.

Begat

On Mar 30, 3:48 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> Hello Bob
> I second the Freud blade. for the money its the best that I've ever played
> with.
> I've never tried  Forrest blades,but like you I've heard only good things
> about there blades.(as well as there sharpening services) I've had chances
> to buy The Forrest blades (when they are on sale.) but for some reason I
> just cant spend that kind of money on one blade. Now perhaps in the long run
> Im wasting my money, but the Freud blade cuts so very nicely, and mine has
> lasted 4 years now,I think I've got my moneys worth from it.
> Another good blade that is out there, is the Black&Dicker Piranha blade. it
> doesn't stay as sharp as long as the Freud blade, but again it Cuts so very
> nice, and at the $25.00 range it is a Great blade.
> Good luck. If you get a chance to buy a Good blade like the Forest WWII I
> say do it. But for me and what I do, Its just not worth it to me. But then
> again??? ;-)
>
> Have a great day.
> C.A.G.
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "BOB" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2011 9:07 PM
> Subject: saw blade
>
> >i know this is not legacy oriented but i value everyone's opinion but
> > first i have to say the ball jig of bill's is the best idea since the
> > pie shape table top i will be making that jig thanks ok so i never had
> > a really good 10" table saw blade until recently i bought a freud glue
> > line rip blade and it has spoiled me so i was looking to buy the Freud
> > combination blade but have noticed in the trade mags all that they
> > talk about is the forrest woodworker 2 you can almost get two Freud
> > for the cost of one Forrest  and I know little about other brands i
> > know that it is a loaded question but wondered what everyone's
> > favorite go to blade is thank you bob
>
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Re: making a ball

[begatbrown]

Bill,

That's a great device and a nice design.. You have effectively created
another axis.  Your accessory will make a great addition to the
ornamental mill site.
Begat



On Mar 27, 8:56 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
> Awesome Bill!
> Keep up the Great work!
>
> C.A.G.
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Bill Bulkeley
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 8:04 PM
>   Subject: Re: making a ball
>
>   here you are Tim just as you requested I still had my test piece set up so 
> it was easy]
>   nice pattern I like it especially the little point at the top .note the 
> stop made quickly from parts, one each way would help too
>   I just stopped when I reached horizontal each time for this test but a stop 
> would make it easier
>   when indexing that way I don't need 3 hands to do the job.
>   Bill
>     - Original Message -
>     From: Tim Krause
>     To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>     Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 3:24 AM
>     Subject: Re: making a ball
>
>     Cool Bill,
>
>     This is something I've talked about with a few people but again you're 
> the first to make it happen.  Now that you have gone this far I have a 
> request.  Make some indexed cuts with a "V" bit on a hemisphere (make a 
> dome).   I'm thinking 24 indexes with light depth of cut.  
>
>     Something along these lines.  
>
>     I can see some detail possibilities that would not be easy to do with 
> side cutting bits.  Templates would have to be made to make it happen for 
> sure.  The bearing would have no place to follow on a curve.
>
>     -Tim
>
>     - Original Message -
>     From: "Bill Bulkeley" 
>     To: 
>     Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 12:09 AM
>     Subject: making a ball
>
>     > here is somthing I was playing with this week end a ball, making 
> attachment
>     > for the legacy.
>
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>
>
>
>  dome_example.jpg
> 37KViewDownload

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Re: making a ball

[begatbrown]

Wow, now that's an accessory.  I can't wait to see the end products
you produce with it.
Begat

On Mar 27, 4:09 am, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> here is somthing I was playing with this week end a ball, making attachment
> for the legacy.
> a way of making balls with out having to use a template and cutting from the
> side
> ajustable hight as well as on the router for balls from very small to the
> largest dia the legacy can cut
>
> and if you turn the router over and mount it from the other side (the triton
> routers have a quick relese for detaching) I suspect i can turn
> hollows like bowls too.
>
> this is the first thing I tryed its about a 2 inch dia ball
>
> Bill
>
>  ABCD0003.JPG
> 120KViewDownload
>
>  ABCD0006.JPG
> 129KViewDownload
>
>  ABCD0004.JPG
> 109KViewDownload
>
>  ABCD0005.JPG
> 118KViewDownload
>
>  ABCD0002.JPG
> 100KViewDownload

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Re: Pilaster Mounting Hubs and Temporary Tailstock Preservation

[begatbrown]

Hello Tim,

Thanks, I made a temporary tailstock hub out of some pvc I had and
went looking for the screws and there was the derlin in the bag with
the screws. It seems that the upgrades never made it in the training
video and the manual.  In any event, I am glad I ordered the derlin
rod, so I can put mounting dogs with a tailstock hub on all the
pilasters.  I wonder whether you were the inspiration for the upgrade?

Begat

On Mar 25, 11:40 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> You move fast.  Any wood would probably hold up just fine but I would think
> to stay in the hardwoods family for durability.
>
> It's a really simple part to make.  Drill the hole in the center first and
> align a hub and make some marks for the added screw holds.  You could skip
> the countersink if they are only used as protection for the cone center on
> the pilasters.  That means it could be as thick as you want.  Just make sure
> things are turning concentric before you start making too many pilasters.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 6:30 AM
> Subject: Re: Pilaster Mounting Hubs and Temporary Tailstock Preservation
>
> Was able to order 1 1/2 inch round derlin from amazon fairly
> inexpensively.  I should be able to make a dozen hubs in an hour after
> all.  In the mean time, I'll slice some poplar and see how long it
> lasts.
>
> Thanks again Tim for the info.
>
> Begat
>
> On Mar 25, 9:43 am, begatbrown  wrote:
> > Tim,
>
> > Before putting my new pilaster mounting dogs to use making column
> > faces, I decided to search on google to see what advice is out there.
> > (One day when you are not fielding questions, you should put a google
> > search function on the ornamental mill site.) Luckily, I did not use
> > the mounting dogs directly after watching the Legacy Training Video.
> > I ran across the page you posted (http://artscopes.com/
> > legacyornamentalmill/tools/tailstock_hub/index.html), which was like
> > watching the jail series "scared straight."
>
> > I will write you offline about getting some derlin hubs that will
> > prevent tailstock damage. ( I don't have the equipment to machine
> > them.) I mean to use lots of half columns on some wainscoting. In the
> > meantime, do you think it will be functional by using a thin round of
> > pine in the mounting hub?
>
> > Begat
>
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Re: Pilaster Mounting Hubs and Temporary Tailstock Preservation

[begatbrown]

Was able to order 1 1/2 inch round derlin from amazon fairly
inexpensively.  I should be able to make a dozen hubs in an hour after
all.  In the mean time, I'll slice some poplar and see how long it
lasts.

Thanks again Tim for the info.

Begat

On Mar 25, 9:43 am, begatbrown  wrote:
> Tim,
>
> Before putting my new pilaster mounting dogs to use making column
> faces, I decided to search on google to see what advice is out there.
> (One day when you are not fielding questions, you should put a google
> search function on the ornamental mill site.)   Luckily, I did not use
> the mounting dogs directly after watching the Legacy Training Video.
> I ran across the page you posted (http://artscopes.com/
> legacyornamentalmill/tools/tailstock_hub/index.html), which was like
> watching the jail series "scared straight."
>
> I will write you offline about getting  some derlin hubs that will
> prevent tailstock damage. ( I don't have the equipment to machine
> them.) I mean to use lots of half columns on some wainscoting.  In the
> meantime, do you think it will be functional by using a thin round of
> pine in the mounting hub?
>
> Begat

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Pilaster Mounting Hubs and Temporary Tailstock Preservation

[begatbrown]

Tim,

Before putting my new pilaster mounting dogs to use making column
faces, I decided to search on google to see what advice is out there.
(One day when you are not fielding questions, you should put a google
search function on the ornamental mill site.)   Luckily, I did not use
the mounting dogs directly after watching the Legacy Training Video.
I ran across the page you posted (http://artscopes.com/
legacyornamentalmill/tools/tailstock_hub/index.html), which was like
watching the jail series "scared straight."

I will write you offline about getting  some derlin hubs that will
prevent tailstock damage. ( I don't have the equipment to machine
them.) I mean to use lots of half columns on some wainscoting.  In the
meantime, do you think it will be functional by using a thin round of
pine in the mounting hub?

Begat

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Re: Removing the Index Drive Center from the Headstock Spindle Properly or at Least W/O Damage

[begatbrown]

As usual, questioned asked, answer provided in advance, problem
solved.  Tim, you're alright.  I thought I had made use of the site,
but it would pay if I would spend more time with it.

Double locking collar installed!

Thanks,

Begat

On Mar 24, 9:53 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> I say no to hammering the drive center.  Here's an article on removal.
>
> http://www.ornamentalmills.com/tips/stuck_headstock_drive/index.html
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 4:48 PM
> Subject: Removing the Index Drive Center from the Headstock Spindle Properly
>
> or at Least W/O Damage
>
> > Hello those with experience,
>
> > I just got a double-locking collar from Legacy so I can align stock.
> > To put it on, I need to remove the index drive center from the
> > headstock spindle.  I have tried a good number of light taps with a
> > rubber mallet without luck, though the rubber mallet might question
> > what I'm calling light taps because it's showing some wear.  Does
> > anyone have a suggested method?  Should I be using a different
> > approach.  Of course, the last thing I want to do is damage either the
> > drive center or the headstock spindle.
>
> > Thanks,
>
> > Begat
>
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Removing the Index Drive Center from the Headstock Spindle Properly or at Least W/O Damage

[begatbrown]

Hello those with experience,

I just got a double-locking collar from Legacy so I can align stock.
To put it on, I need to remove the index drive center from the
headstock spindle.  I have tried a good number of light taps with a
rubber mallet without luck, though the rubber mallet might question
what I'm calling light taps because it's showing some wear.  Does
anyone have a suggested method?  Should I be using a different
approach.  Of course, the last thing I want to do is damage either the
drive center or the headstock spindle.

Thanks,

Begat

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Re: Model 1800 Still For Sale - Priced Reduced

[begatbrown]

Tim,

It may help to post more basic information on the 1800 on the website,
especially since Legacy no longer lists the 1800 on theirs.  I had to
pull up an old page from an archive to remind myself of its features
and the cost ($5962 at one point)   Knowing something about the bits,
especially the overall value, would be helpful to would be buyers as
well.  45 Magnate bits have to be worth well over $1000.

Begat


On Mar 22, 9:57 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> I'm afraid so.
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Ray Leaman
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2011 4:51 AM
>   Subject: Re: Model 1800 Still For Sale - Priced Reduced
>
>   Are the Magnate bits included in his "not wanting to part it out" policy?
>
>   On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 10:24 PM, Tim Krause  wrote:
>
>     Man, this is killing me.  My buddy still needs to sell his model 1800.  
> He's slashing the price to $3500.  It's such a crying shame to see this 
> machine not in use.  
>
>    http://ornamentalmills.com/forsale/rl1800.html 
>
>     Local pickup only and he is still not willing to part it out, but if 
> there was a way I could come up with the cash I would buy it for myself and 
> part it out in this group.  I'm willing to bet everything would get sold 
> except for the actual machine!
>
>     -Tim
>
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Re: Rotary Table Question

[begatbrown]

Tim,

Are you referring to the bottom of the table where the gear for the
handle is also located?  Mine has what appears to be a delrin square
with the corners rounded and four screws with washers.  I bought my
900 used with a rotary table.  The 900 was shipped to its original
owner in August 2009.

Begat

On Mar 14, 11:52 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> I've seen several versions of the rotary table center (the black delrin 
> center piece).  Some have a 1/2" hub that is used to center the large gear.  
> Others the hub is not machined (it's flat across the face).  Mine appears to 
> be sheared off in transit ( a broken crater is in it's place).  Can anyone 
> confirm what the current design that is shipping looks like? Here's a drawing 
> to illustrate what I'm asking about.
>
> -Tim
>
>  alt_rotarytable_center.jpg
> 32KViewDownload

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Re: Bill's Candlestick project

[begatbrown]

Wow!  Were it not for the how-to-pictures, I'd still be scratching my
head wondering how it was done.  Your daughter has no idea of what you
did to add a little light to her life, LOL.  I'm glad Curt brought up
the issue of the tilting Z-Axis, and now I know the reason for a
horizontal router.

Begat

On Mar 13, 1:46 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
> All that I can say is, Bill you have my deepest respect. Great work!  Have to 
> make something like that! Talk about inspiration!
> I think Im starting to turn a little green with envy. ;-)
>
> C.A.G.
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Tim Krause
>   To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2011 1:54 PM
>   Subject: Bill's Candlestick project
>
>   This is one for the record books for sure.  It uses a custom built Z-axis, 
> a Revo and a model 900 to make a very exotic candle stick.  How's that for 
> bringing everyone into the fold :-).  
>
>  http://www.ornamentalmills.com/Bill_Bulkeley/candlestick/index.html
>
>   Thank you Bill for allowing us to see this project and show off your work!
>
>   -Tim
>
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Re: Looking at cutting form the side Again.

[begatbrown]

C.A.G.,

Thanks for the link. The maxis is a very interesting machine. But it
is too expensive for what it does best.  The ability to turn the
router from virtually any overhead angle is something to long for, but
at that price!?

begat

On Mar 12, 8:10 pm, "curt george"  wrote:
> Hay Bill?
> could you cut two spindles at the same time using that set up? Very Kool!
> good work. ;-)
> I've been thinking of making a tilting head on my router. something like
> this...http://www.easyrouter.net/joinery/
>  The Maxis Tooling System  is a very neat machine, but it doesn't do
> ornamental stuff. To bad!
> It dose do some neat things! But do your self a favor, Do Not look at the
> price sheet. there prices are...  (beyond me!)
>
> I have to run.
> Have  a good night. and please keep up the good work Bill!
>
> C.A.G.
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Bill Bulkeley" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 7:08 PM
> Subject: Re: Looking at cutting form the side Again.
>
> > thanks for the wows guys
> > the only thing I would do now is make the router base a little more ridged
> > it doesn't like really aggressive cuts on larger work but still works ok
> > if you take your time. and a bungee strap seems to work to help follow a
> > template to save your arm while holding against the template.
> > Bill
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Tim Krause" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2011 2:17 AM
> > Subject: Re: Looking at cutting form the side Again.
>
> >> Bill the original developer on that one,  It's written up here:
>
> >>http://ornamentalmills.com/Bill_Bulkeley/side_cutting_mod.html
>
> >> He's the only one that I'm aware of.  I think it's brilliant and a good
> >> example to follow.  I wonder what Bill thinks of the mod now years down
> >> the
> >> road.  What would he change or add?
>
> >> -Tim
>
> >> - Original Message -
> >> From: "Curtis" 
> >> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> >> Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 3:16 AM
> >> Subject: Looking at cutting form the side Again.
>
> >>> Hello Everyone.
>
> >>> I remember someone out there who modified a router so that it could
> >>> cut form the side of the Legacy.(horizontal)
> >>> Im just playing around with some ideas, and I wanted to see what has
> >>> already been done before. I see not sence to just repeating other
> >>> peoples mistakes. So if you have any ideas. Please let me know what
> >>> you think on this topic.
> >>> Thank you.
>
> >>> C.A.G.
>
> >>> --
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>
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Re: birdmouth bits

[begatbrown]

Cole,

For the birdmouth bits, I think you are right.  The router fence with
feather boards should make that easy.  I think I'll order a bit soon.

Begat

On Mar 6, 9:24 pm, cole andrews  wrote:
> I used the linear table one time. I did not have a problem throwing it
> out but there were what I describe as chatter marks . I wonder if my
> bit speed was right and did I need  a hold down. Either way I will use
> the birdmouth bit on the router table with convential hold downs and
> featherboards, just seems easier to set with fewer variables.
>
> On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 8:11 PM, Bill Bulkeley  wrote:
> > It's been a while since I looked at them I have them here somewhere ill dig
> > them up and refresh my memory thanks
> > Bill
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of begatbrown
> > Sent: Monday, 7 March 2011 11:36 AM
> > To: Legacy Ornamental Mills
> > Subject: Re: birdmouth bits
>
> > Bill,
>
> > It's on one of the training video/dvds.  I also recall one of another
> > of the Legacy folks on the dvd.  But the Videos are pretty good.  They
> > really get you up and going.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Mar 6, 6:51 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> >> I just saw a clip from the demo dvd where Tracy is shoving in wood using
> > the
> >> linear molding table.  It was about 10 seconds.
>
> >> - Original Message -
> >> From: "Bill Bulkeley" 
> >> To: 
> >> Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2011 2:33 PM
> >> Subject: Re: birdmouth bits
>
> >> > is the video you guys are talking about on line some were to look at
> >> after
> >> > hearing these stories id like to see the video
>
> >> > Bill
> >> > - Original Message -
> >> > From: "begatbrown" 
> >> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> >> > Sent: Monday, March 07, 2011 8:24 AM
> >> > Subject: Re: birdmouth bits
>
> >> > Tim,
>
> >> > I, too, saw Tracy's video and decided that using the Legacy as an
> >> > overhead router to work long boards was the ticket.  I had the same
> >> > results--and it happened to me twice as well with similar reasoning
> >> > behind the second effort.  Until now, my workshop and my office are
> >> > one and the same (though I'm working on separating them).  The router
> >> > with the rabbit bit snatched the 48" x 3 1/2" board from my hand and
> >> > shot it across the room.  I only know it's trajectory because of what
> >> > it damaged.  The second time I used a backstop so nothing was
> >> > damaged!  Since then, I have not tried to profile the edge of any
> >> > board on the legacy that's not taped or glued down.  (Nor do I have
> >> > any future plans to do so.  I have had no problems working the middle
> >> > of a board through the router on the Legacy, even with a large larger
> >> > crown molding bit.  This weekend I am actually making a molding jig,
> >> > or a linear table.  I mean to incorporate feather boards or some other
> >> > source of friction and downward pressure, but I will still make sure
> >> > that nothing is down range.
>
> >> > Begat
>
> >> > On Mar 6, 9:43 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> >> > > Hi All,
>
> >> > > Funny story, there is a message by me in the old messages where I
> > talked
> >> > > about using the large birdsmouth bit in my legacy for the first time,
> >> and
> >> > > it
> >> > > turned my machine into a rocket launcher. I tried setting up the
> > legacy
> >> as
> >> > > a linear molding table and then running the pieces through. I was
> >> cutting
> >> > > 3/4" thick piece that where small. I was an absolute novice when I
> > tried
> >> > > all of this, I Tracy doing it on the demo DVD and figured it looked
> >> easy.
>
> >> > > Any way, the first time through I had a piece of wood violently caught
> >> in
> >> > > between the router bit and a slide I was using to guide the wood by
> > the
> >> > > bit.
> >> > > The wood literally exploded and rocked the machine. I did not think
> >> about
> >> > > using finger boards to hold things down so I thought I was taking too
> >> > > aggre

Re: birdmouth bits

[begatbrown]

Bill,

It's on one of the training video/dvds.  I also recall one of another
of the Legacy folks on the dvd.  But the Videos are pretty good.  They
really get you up and going.

Begat

On Mar 6, 6:51 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> I just saw a clip from the demo dvd where Tracy is shoving in wood using the
> linear molding table.  It was about 10 seconds.
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Bill Bulkeley" 
> To: 
> Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2011 2:33 PM
> Subject: Re: birdmouth bits
>
> > is the video you guys are talking about on line some were to look at
> after
> > hearing these stories id like to see the video
>
> > Bill
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "begatbrown" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Monday, March 07, 2011 8:24 AM
> > Subject: Re: birdmouth bits
>
> > Tim,
>
> > I, too, saw Tracy's video and decided that using the Legacy as an
> > overhead router to work long boards was the ticket.  I had the same
> > results--and it happened to me twice as well with similar reasoning
> > behind the second effort.  Until now, my workshop and my office are
> > one and the same (though I'm working on separating them).  The router
> > with the rabbit bit snatched the 48" x 3 1/2" board from my hand and
> > shot it across the room.  I only know it's trajectory because of what
> > it damaged.  The second time I used a backstop so nothing was
> > damaged!  Since then, I have not tried to profile the edge of any
> > board on the legacy that's not taped or glued down.  (Nor do I have
> > any future plans to do so.  I have had no problems working the middle
> > of a board through the router on the Legacy, even with a large larger
> > crown molding bit.  This weekend I am actually making a molding jig,
> > or a linear table.  I mean to incorporate feather boards or some other
> > source of friction and downward pressure, but I will still make sure
> > that nothing is down range.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Mar 6, 9:43 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> > > Hi All,
>
> > > Funny story, there is a message by me in the old messages where I talked
> > > about using the large birdsmouth bit in my legacy for the first time,
> and
> > > it
> > > turned my machine into a rocket launcher. I tried setting up the legacy
> as
> > > a linear molding table and then running the pieces through. I was
> cutting
> > > 3/4" thick piece that where small. I was an absolute novice when I tried
> > > all of this, I Tracy doing it on the demo DVD and figured it looked
> easy.
>
> > > Any way, the first time through I had a piece of wood violently caught
> in
> > > between the router bit and a slide I was using to guide the wood by the
> > > bit.
> > > The wood literally exploded and rocked the machine. I did not think
> about
> > > using finger boards to hold things down so I thought I was taking too
> > > aggressive of a cut and I made an adjustment to the amount of wood I was
> > > cutting off. The same thing happened. So, in one of my not so bright
> > > thinking moments, I thought maybe I was feeding the board the wrong
> > > direction and fed the board from the opposite side of the machine. The
> > > router grabbed the small piece of wood out of my hands and threw it
> > > straight
> > > across the room and embedded it into the wall. No one was hurt, but I
> was
> > > scared enough into not using that big bit in the legacy ever again!
>
> > > Now today I would have a different approach. I would clamp the small
> > > pieces
> > > down and run the bit past the work taking light cuts on the edge. This
> > > involves making a jig to lift the thin piece up so the router bit has
> > > clearance from the waste table. A smaller bit could also be better than
> > > the
> > > huge one I was using. To be perfectly honest, the legacy would be my
> last
> > > choice of equipment to use, I would use a router table, shaper, or table
> > > saw
> > > to make these joints. Now that other router bit makers are selling
> smaller
> > > birdsmouth bits I would also use on that is more appropriately sized
> than
> > > the monster one I was using on the small work.
>
> > > My standard disclaimer applies, this information is for entertainment
> only
> > > :-).
>
> > > -Tim
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "cole" 
> > > To: "Legacy

Re: birdmouth bits

[begatbrown]

Tim,

I, too, saw Tracy's video and decided that using the Legacy as an
overhead router to work long boards was the ticket.  I had the same
results--and it happened to me twice as well with similar reasoning
behind the second effort.  Until now, my workshop and my office are
one and the same (though I'm working on separating them).  The router
with the rabbit bit snatched the 48" x 3 1/2" board from my hand and
shot it across the room.  I only know it's trajectory because of what
it damaged.  The second time I used a backstop so nothing was
damaged!  Since then, I have not tried to profile the edge of any
board on the legacy that's not taped or glued down.  (Nor do I have
any future plans to do so.  I have had no problems working the middle
of a board through the router on the Legacy, even with a large larger
crown molding bit.  This weekend I am actually making a molding jig,
or a linear table.  I mean to incorporate feather boards or some other
source of friction and downward pressure, but I will still make sure
that nothing is down range.

Begat

On Mar 6, 9:43 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> Funny story, there is a message by me in the old messages where I talked
> about using the large birdsmouth bit in my legacy for the first time, and it
> turned my machine into a rocket launcher.  I tried setting up the legacy as
> a linear molding table and then running the pieces through.  I was cutting
> 3/4" thick piece that where small.  I was an absolute novice when I tried
> all of this, I Tracy doing it on the demo DVD and figured it looked easy.
>
> Any way, the first time through I had a piece of wood violently caught in
> between the router bit and a slide I was using to guide the wood by the bit.
> The wood literally exploded and rocked the machine.  I did not think about
> using finger boards to hold things down so I thought I was taking too
> aggressive of a cut and I made an adjustment to the amount of wood I was
> cutting off. The same thing happened.  So, in one of my not so bright
> thinking moments, I thought maybe I was feeding the board the wrong
> direction and fed the board from the opposite side of the machine.  The
> router grabbed the small piece of wood out of my hands and threw it straight
> across the room and embedded it into the wall.  No one was hurt, but I was
> scared enough into not using that big bit in the legacy ever again!
>
> Now today I would have a different approach.  I would clamp the small pieces
> down and run the bit past the work taking light cuts on the edge.  This
> involves making a jig to lift the thin piece up so the router bit has
> clearance from the waste table.  A smaller bit could also be better than the
> huge one I was using.  To be perfectly honest, the legacy would be my last
> choice of equipment to use, I would use a router table, shaper, or table saw
> to make these joints.  Now that other router bit makers are selling smaller
> birdsmouth bits I would also use on that is more appropriately sized than
> the monster one I was using on the small work.
>
> My standard disclaimer applies, this information is for entertainment only
> :-).
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "cole" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2011 6:16 PM
> Subject: Re: birdmouth bits
>
> Thank you ,I spent all day already looking at just about every
> thread . I was certain that had already been brought up . ( the math).
> I have been inspired to make some liturgical items for the
> church( orthodox christain) ,so I am trying for a architectural feel
> and copy things like domes and arches.

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Re: Updated Site

[begatbrown]

Tim,

Thanks for the site update.  Pulling together the posts on making
columns with bird mouth bits is quite helpful and will save me lots of
time and frustration.

Begat

On Mar 5, 9:16 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Added a chart from Mike Pung that shows calculations for birdsmouth joints 
> and added my polygon calculator for stave construction or for creating 
> segmented rings.
>
> http://ornamentalmills.com/tips/polygon_calc/Regular_Polygon_Side_Cal...http://ornamentalmills.com/tips/polygon_calc/column+graph.pdf
>
> All files are currently found at:http://ornamentalmills.com/turningaround/
>
> -Tim

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Re: Rotary table waste board

[begatbrown]

Tim,

I've only attempted a couple of rosettes thus far on mine, so judging
from your experience, I guess mine will last a long time as long as I
don't start using glue to hold down larger pieces.  I had assumed that
if I had to replace the waste board, I would use the existing one as
the waste board for the one I'd create.  But that's an idea that is a
result of virtually no little experience.  If it's wrong, then perhaps
an article is in order--assuming that others are as off base as I
might be.

Begat

On Feb 27, 11:35 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> I'm curious, how pristine do people keep their waste board on the rotary 
> table.  I've had mine for years and it's still the original one.  I'm about 
> to make a replacement one in the near future and I was thinking about taking 
> some photo to show one mans approach to making one.  Is this a needed article?
>
> -Tim

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Re: Wanted- Pictures of old machines and accessories

[begatbrown]

Tim,

Oops.  I re-read your post.  The waybackmachine on the site starts in
1998.  Sorry.

Begat

On Feb 16, 1:16 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> If you have a machine that is pre aluminum rails, I would like to get some 
> photographs for use on a web page on the history the Legacy Ornamental Mills. 
>  If you have a bizarre accessory that you have not seen for a while, please 
> pass a photo of it on to me.  So far I've been able to document machines from 
> 1998 and on.  Does anyone own a horizontal turning center?  That would be a 
> good one to add.
>
> -Tim

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Re: Wanted- Pictures of old machines and accessories

[begatbrown]

Tim,

There is a website that archives websites.  It has a lot of legacy's
early years.  Go to:  http://www.archive.org/web/web.php, then type in
the legacy url.  That's where I would determine how I would determine
the age of the machine someone was selling.

Begat

On Feb 16, 1:16 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> If you have a machine that is pre aluminum rails, I would like to get some 
> photographs for use on a web page on the history the Legacy Ornamental Mills. 
>  If you have a bizarre accessory that you have not seen for a while, please 
> pass a photo of it on to me.  So far I've been able to document machines from 
> 1998 and on.  Does anyone own a horizontal turning center?  That would be a 
> good one to add.
>
> -Tim

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Re: Site Updates

[begatbrown]

Tim,

Let me say I probably never would have ventured to buy an ornamental
mill had it not been for this group and the ornamental mill website.
Your page on how to check the alignment of the head and tail stock is
just what I need at this point.  I did my first pathetic turning
today, and all the while I wondered whether they were lined up
properly.  Now I can put that question behind me without attempting to
create a wheel.  The other pages are over my head right now, but they
are there for when I'll need them.

Thanks a million.

Begat

On Feb 15, 7:33 pm, Bill Hallow  wrote:
> Tim
> I can not overstate how much your efforts are appreciated.   We know that just
> putting your knowledge into writing is a big effort, but the pictures too is
> just over the top
>
> Thanks so very much
> Bill
>
> 
> From: Tim Krause 
> To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Tue, February 15, 2011 6:47:22 PM
> Subject: Re: Site Updates
>
> The thing is, if you where to come to my shop I would toss all of these
> little types of tips at you in a 6 hour period.  My goal would be to pass
> that type of knowledge on.  It's much more time consuming than one would
> think.  Generally I devote the time when a question is asked more than once.
> That's why it's so important that people ask questions to know where we need
> to go as a group.  Thanks for your input, it's greatly appreciated.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "cole andrews" 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2011 3:24 PM
> Subject: Re: Site Updates
>
> I like what you did with these pages ,you problably have more of these
> kind of tutorials in mind. I appreciate what you've put into it. That
> kind of thing cuts a lot of the learning curve down. there is already
> a lot to learn as it is. Thanks.
>
> On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 3:21 PM, Tim Krause  wrote:
> > Hello All,
>
> > Added three pages to ornamentalmills.com
> >http://ornamentalmills.com/tips/hs_ts_tuneup/index.html
> >http://ornamentalmills.com/tips/spindle_shoulder/index.html
> >http://ornamentalmills.com/tips/z_depth_stop/
>
> > Added one image to the gallery. I'm still working on the gallery on so
> many
> > levels. Have patience.
> >http://ornamentalmills.com/gallery/tim_rinehart/peppermill_twist.html
>
> > If you would like to contribute to the gallery section please let me know.
>
> > -Tim
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
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> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.
>
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Re: Dusty Dave's Night Stand and Dresser

[begatbrown]

That's one beautiful and distinctive bedroom set.  Getting the
matching wood could not have been easy, or inexpensive.  That's an
inspiration.

Begat

On Feb 13, 7:34 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Here's a follow up on Dusty Dave's night stand and dresser.  This matches his 
> headboard that he made.
>
> http://www.ornamentalmills.com/Dave_Rutherford/head_board/index.html
>
> -Tim
>
>  night_stand.jpg
> 81KViewDownload
>
>  dresser.jpg
> 79KViewDownload

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Re: Finally got my 900 mill!

[begatbrown]

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for the opportunity to revisit Tim's bed lift page.  Like any
good thief, I had forgotten where I'd come up with the idea of using a
rod to lift both sides of the bed.  Tim, I'll contact you about the
indexed attachment.  The rod is not precise enough and I'm already
worried about its nicking the legs.

Adding a legacy to the shop only added to my need to constantly wear a
respirator.   One can only hope to limit the amount of fine dust in
the air and the direction it will travel.  After reading about air
filtration systems, I bought one for the entire shop.  Yet my
intention is to deal separately with the dust created by the 900, my
router table, and the Arty I have on order.  Once I know how much
working space they will need, I plan on framing off an area  of my
shop for them.  I've already acquired an air exchanger to replace the
air.  This option is rarely discussed in forums.  I guess that's
because most everyone wants to recycle their already heated/cooled air
and are satisfied with collectors and filtration systems that are
"rated" from 1 to 5 microns.  I want the fine dust out the house,
period.  By using built-in cabinets, I mean to limit the volume of air
in the room so that the air exchanger can flush the entire space in
five minutes or less.  That's the goal any way.  None of this is a
substitute for a respirator, just for the need to wear one around the
entire house!  My shop is in my basement and I find wood dust on the
second floor.  ( I'm also going to frame off my hvac system for the
house and use hepa filters in the walls.  The hvac has to pull its air
from the basement and it needs another line of defense.)

Begat



On Feb 13, 11:39 pm, cole andrews  wrote:
> yes dust control is your worst enemy . I built a hood that worked
> pretty good as long as you were close relatively to the work. Doing
> hvac work I figured out I need a huge amount of airflow to truly work.
> Please wear a respirator ,some of these woods make really fine dust
> like cedar.Me and my friend Reese both ended up with respiratory
> issues after that..
>
> On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 10:18 PM, Tim Krause  wrote:
> > Hi Andy,
>
> > The height adjustment problem is annoying.  On the model 900, the bed is so
> > light I don't think a screw adjustment for raising and lowering the bed is
> > really needed, but it's something that I had considered.  What I came up
> > with for easier bed height adjustments was a set of brackets with holes.
> > These holes are for indexing the height of the bed.  I use simple rods to
> > support the table while you are tightening the bolts in the slots.  More
> > details can be found here.
> >http://artscopes.com/legacyornamentalmill/tools/bedheightadjustment/b...
>
> > The 1200 only offer another 1/2" of travel.  You can make the slots on the
> > 900 legs 1/2" longer and get that added travel.  Anything more and you need
> > to clearance a few more parts.  What I came up with was some replacement
> > legs that increase the 900's bed travel another 2".  Now in regards to the
> > gears binding, they will bind well before you reach the 4º the 900 is
> > capable of.  It's more like 2º with the gears engaged.  I posted a note
> > about my new legs, but I have not bothered to make a web page showing the
> > details.  Here's a link to the conversation.
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills/browse_thread/
>
> > The delrin bushing are ok.  Steel would eat the aluminum rail, and brass
> > might do the same.  I've got a new design for the bushings but I'm still
> > testing before I show what I did.
>
> > Dust control is a real problem.  Let's face it, chips are coming off all
> > sides of the bit.  I have not seen a definitive solution.  The vinyl sides
> > get in the way and the 4" DC hooked to the 2" pipe is not enough to really
> > get more than 25% of the chips.  Unfortunately that leads me to where a
> > respirator, and keep the work area clean so the chips can easily be swept
> > up.
>
> > Feel free to contact me off list for price and availability of any custom
> > component that I sell or if you would like to have something made for your
> > new machine.
>
> > -Tim
>
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Andy" 
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2011 5:05 PM
> > Subject: Finally got my 900 mill!
>
> >> OK. I picked up my Legacy 900 from Legacy Woodworking. First thing i'd
> >> like to talk about is the company.
>
> >> I did get a tour of their facility. The lady i've been talking to
> >> there, Cindy, walked me around. The majority of their business is in
> >> CNC'swhich by the way are very cool. I got to see one in action
> >> and their shop was full of them. For those of you that constantly
> >> complain about their service, I think she put it perfectly when she
> >> said "We're not Walmart". Legacy makes everything to order. Thus the
> >> reason for the wait. I personally was very impressed with their
> >> serv

Re: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits

[begatbrown]

Hello Tim,

The extreme extender was not acquired for surfacing flat boards per
se.  I bought it instead of an eliminator chuck, so I use it to keep
from having to use the collet wrenches, which are always a pain.

Begat


On Feb 13, 7:42 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> Refresh my memory why you would need an extension to plane flat boards?
> Just raise the table.  I also don't think I would use the motor to drive the
> router.  In the case of planing, I want to feel and hear the amount of work
> that the router is doing.  The motor would eliminate some of the feedback.
>
> -Tim
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2011 4:24 PM
> Subject: Re: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits
>
>   I spent much of today using my 900 to
> surface boards to I could put them in the planer.  (Talk about wanting
> a motor!)

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Re: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits

[begatbrown]

I meant to say, I would seat the bit fully in the extender on the
legacy.  Begat

On Feb 13, 7:24 pm, begatbrown  wrote:
> Thanks Cole,
>
> I'm definitely going to do the o-ring on my table router and seat the
> bit firmly in the extender.  I spent much of today using my 900 to
> surface boards to I could put them in the planer.  (Talk about wanting
> a motor!)  But it gave the extreme extension a good workout,
> especially since I used magnate's next to largest surfacing bit (2 in
> dia.).  No problems.
>
> Begat
>
> On Feb 13, 6:22 pm, cole andrews  wrote:
>
> > I use a n o ring in my router for the table ,that eliminates the
> > problem of frozen bits in the collet. Somerfeld  gives em away with
> > all of sets. It makes setting the coresponding bit easy. I did not
> > think it was an issue with the extender seeing as there is no collet.
> > I have not seen any bit slippage either.
>
> > On Sat, Feb 12, 2011 at 10:00 PM, begatbrown
>
> >  wrote:
> > > Thanks, Mike.  Nothing beats theory and experience, but hardcore
> > > proof.  I'll continue to seat my bits into bottom of the extender
> > > until one gets helplessly stuck.  But I'm also going to avoid trying
> > > to determine whether my bits are "hand temperature!"  I'll take your
> > > word completely on that!
>
> > >  Begat
>
> > > On Feb 12, 9:05 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> > > wrote:
> > >> There are two ways for a collet to grip a router bit.  One is with a nut
> > >> that will compress a wedged ring that will grip the bit all the way
> > >> around.  It uses wrenches for this.  The second is The quick change type
> > >> that will wedge the bit from the side with the use of an allen wrench.
> > >> The benefit of the first is a very strong and sure hold. The one problem
> > >> with this configuration is the fact that as you are tightening the nut
> > >> you are forcing the bit to set deeper into the center the collet shaft.
> > >> If you had the bit setting in the shaft bottomed out and then tightened
> > >> it, the nut would feel tight as the bit jammed as deep as it would go.
> > >> This is a problem because the bit still is not tight and could vibrate
> > >> out and ruin the project or scare the wood chips out of the operator.
> > >> The o-ring is a good fix for this.  it will allow you set set the bit in
> > >> deep and as the nut was turned the o-ring could compress and allow for
> > >> proper tightening.  Good tip Bill!    In the case of the second type
> > >> though, the allen wrench quick change collet or extender, the bit does
> > >> not move.  The allen system will allow for a wedge to pinch the bit into
> > >> location an secure it into place.  It may rotate a degree or two but it
> > >> will not be effected by the shaft being seated into the collet all the
> > >> way.  I prefer to seat them all the way so if I am doing a plunge, the
> > >> bottom of the collet hole is keeping the bit from trying to move
> > >> anywhere.  The next advantage to having the bit seated in all the way is
> > >> re-setting.  I do very large jobs that require the bit to be sharpened
> > >> or cleaned.  I can pull it out, address the bit and set it right back
> > >> into place without having to set everything back up again.
> > >> Bottom line, if you twist a wrench on a nut, leave a gap, If you use an
> > >> allen wrench, bottom it out.
> > >> Oh and the heat thing?  Hmmm  Doesn't sound right to me.  If you pull a
> > >> hot bit out of the router, you can hold it by the shaft.  So the gap
> > >> helping with heat transfer is questionable.  If the bit is transferring
> > >> heat, sharpen your bit.  Also at the end of a long run, just let the
> > >> router run for 30 seconds off the wood and that will pull the heat into
> > >> the air and away from everything.   Have a good one , everyone.
>
> > >> Mike
> > >> OK
>
> > >> On 2/12/2011 7:14 PM, Bill Hallow wrote:
>
> > >> > From what I�ve read the reason that you should never let the bit to
> > >> > bottom out in the router collet is that when the bit is bottomed out
> > >> > the collet cannot securely grip the bit and with that all of the
> > >> > problems of slippage, misalignment and so on.
>
> > >> > What I�ve seen recommended is to place a small O-ring in the bottom 
> > >> &g

Re: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits

[begatbrown]

Thanks Cole,

I'm definitely going to do the o-ring on my table router and seat the
bit firmly in the extender.  I spent much of today using my 900 to
surface boards to I could put them in the planer.  (Talk about wanting
a motor!)  But it gave the extreme extension a good workout,
especially since I used magnate's next to largest surfacing bit (2 in
dia.).  No problems.

Begat

On Feb 13, 6:22 pm, cole andrews  wrote:
> I use a n o ring in my router for the table ,that eliminates the
> problem of frozen bits in the collet. Somerfeld  gives em away with
> all of sets. It makes setting the coresponding bit easy. I did not
> think it was an issue with the extender seeing as there is no collet.
> I have not seen any bit slippage either.
>
> On Sat, Feb 12, 2011 at 10:00 PM, begatbrown
>
>  wrote:
> > Thanks, Mike.  Nothing beats theory and experience, but hardcore
> > proof.  I'll continue to seat my bits into bottom of the extender
> > until one gets helplessly stuck.  But I'm also going to avoid trying
> > to determine whether my bits are "hand temperature!"  I'll take your
> > word completely on that!
>
> >  Begat
>
> > On Feb 12, 9:05 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
> > wrote:
> >> There are two ways for a collet to grip a router bit.  One is with a nut
> >> that will compress a wedged ring that will grip the bit all the way
> >> around.  It uses wrenches for this.  The second is The quick change type
> >> that will wedge the bit from the side with the use of an allen wrench.
> >> The benefit of the first is a very strong and sure hold. The one problem
> >> with this configuration is the fact that as you are tightening the nut
> >> you are forcing the bit to set deeper into the center the collet shaft.
> >> If you had the bit setting in the shaft bottomed out and then tightened
> >> it, the nut would feel tight as the bit jammed as deep as it would go.
> >> This is a problem because the bit still is not tight and could vibrate
> >> out and ruin the project or scare the wood chips out of the operator.
> >> The o-ring is a good fix for this.  it will allow you set set the bit in
> >> deep and as the nut was turned the o-ring could compress and allow for
> >> proper tightening.  Good tip Bill!    In the case of the second type
> >> though, the allen wrench quick change collet or extender, the bit does
> >> not move.  The allen system will allow for a wedge to pinch the bit into
> >> location an secure it into place.  It may rotate a degree or two but it
> >> will not be effected by the shaft being seated into the collet all the
> >> way.  I prefer to seat them all the way so if I am doing a plunge, the
> >> bottom of the collet hole is keeping the bit from trying to move
> >> anywhere.  The next advantage to having the bit seated in all the way is
> >> re-setting.  I do very large jobs that require the bit to be sharpened
> >> or cleaned.  I can pull it out, address the bit and set it right back
> >> into place without having to set everything back up again.
> >> Bottom line, if you twist a wrench on a nut, leave a gap, If you use an
> >> allen wrench, bottom it out.
> >> Oh and the heat thing?  Hmmm  Doesn't sound right to me.  If you pull a
> >> hot bit out of the router, you can hold it by the shaft.  So the gap
> >> helping with heat transfer is questionable.  If the bit is transferring
> >> heat, sharpen your bit.  Also at the end of a long run, just let the
> >> router run for 30 seconds off the wood and that will pull the heat into
> >> the air and away from everything.   Have a good one , everyone.
>
> >> Mike
> >> OK
>
> >> On 2/12/2011 7:14 PM, Bill Hallow wrote:
>
> >> > From what I�ve read the reason that you should never let the bit to
> >> > bottom out in the router collet is that when the bit is bottomed out
> >> > the collet cannot securely grip the bit and with that all of the
> >> > problems of slippage, misalignment and so on.
>
> >> > What I�ve seen recommended is to place a small O-ring in the bottom of
> >> > the collet to keep the bit from bottoming and you will never have to
> >> > be concerned about the problem.
>
> >> > Bill
>
> >> > 
> >> > *From:* Bill Bulkeley 
> >> > *To:* legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> >> > *Sent:* Sat, February 12, 2011 7:06:07 PM
> >> > *Subject:* Re: Extreme Extend

Re: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits

[begatbrown]

Thanks, Mike.  Nothing beats theory and experience, but hardcore
proof.  I'll continue to seat my bits into bottom of the extender
until one gets helplessly stuck.  But I'm also going to avoid trying
to determine whether my bits are "hand temperature!"  I'll take your
word completely on that!

 Begat

On Feb 12, 9:05 pm, "Okla Mike (Liltwisted)" 
wrote:
> There are two ways for a collet to grip a router bit.  One is with a nut
> that will compress a wedged ring that will grip the bit all the way
> around.  It uses wrenches for this.  The second is The quick change type
> that will wedge the bit from the side with the use of an allen wrench.  
> The benefit of the first is a very strong and sure hold. The one problem
> with this configuration is the fact that as you are tightening the nut
> you are forcing the bit to set deeper into the center the collet shaft.  
> If you had the bit setting in the shaft bottomed out and then tightened
> it, the nut would feel tight as the bit jammed as deep as it would go.  
> This is a problem because the bit still is not tight and could vibrate
> out and ruin the project or scare the wood chips out of the operator.  
> The o-ring is a good fix for this.  it will allow you set set the bit in
> deep and as the nut was turned the o-ring could compress and allow for
> proper tightening.  Good tip Bill!    In the case of the second type
> though, the allen wrench quick change collet or extender, the bit does
> not move.  The allen system will allow for a wedge to pinch the bit into
> location an secure it into place.  It may rotate a degree or two but it
> will not be effected by the shaft being seated into the collet all the
> way.  I prefer to seat them all the way so if I am doing a plunge, the
> bottom of the collet hole is keeping the bit from trying to move
> anywhere.  The next advantage to having the bit seated in all the way is
> re-setting.  I do very large jobs that require the bit to be sharpened
> or cleaned.  I can pull it out, address the bit and set it right back
> into place without having to set everything back up again.
> Bottom line, if you twist a wrench on a nut, leave a gap, If you use an
> allen wrench, bottom it out.
> Oh and the heat thing?  Hmmm  Doesn't sound right to me.  If you pull a
> hot bit out of the router, you can hold it by the shaft.  So the gap
> helping with heat transfer is questionable.  If the bit is transferring
> heat, sharpen your bit.  Also at the end of a long run, just let the
> router run for 30 seconds off the wood and that will pull the heat into
> the air and away from everything.   Have a good one , everyone.
>
> Mike
> OK
>
> On 2/12/2011 7:14 PM, Bill Hallow wrote:
>
>
>
> > From what I�ve read the reason that you should never let the bit to
> > bottom out in the router collet is that when the bit is bottomed out
> > the collet cannot securely grip the bit and with that all of the
> > problems of slippage, misalignment and so on.
>
> > What I�ve seen recommended is to place a small O-ring in the bottom of
> > the collet to keep the bit from bottoming and you will never have to
> > be concerned about the problem.
>
> > Bill
>
> > 
> > *From:* Bill Bulkeley 
> > *To:* legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > *Sent:* Sat, February 12, 2011 7:06:07 PM
> > *Subject:* Re: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits
>
> > I don't know about any one else I always leave a slight gap on both
> > not 1/8 more like 1/32 but that is not for heat reasons I do it
> > because I think it makes every thing run that little bit truer. when I
> > remove and put back my extreme extension I always check it for true
> > with a dial indicator and make sure its running as true as I can get
> > it. if possible perfect it helps so much with vibration when using
> > longer bits like the side reeding type and even some of the bigger dia
> > bits but I wouldn't recommend running really large 3 inch bits in the
> > extension.
> > Bill
>
> > - Original Message - From: "begatbrown"
> > mailto:darylmichaelsc...@gmail.com>>
> > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills"
> >  > <mailto:legacy-ornamental-mi...@googlegroups..com>>
> > Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2011 9:41 AM
> > Subject: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits
>
> > > Hello,
>
> > > With routers without extenders, I've always been told that you do NOT
> > > seat the bit all the way to the bottom of the collet because you want
> > > to avoid transferring the heat generated by the bit t

Re: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits

[begatbrown]

Hello Bill,

Thanks.  I'll remember your advice on both the gap and the 3 inch
bit.   By the way, if you did not get a rotary table, there are two
mills for sale with rotary tables.  There's one on ebay, a 1000EX, out
of NC and one on Craigslist out of Milwaukee, WI.  (It's a 900).
Perhaps one of those two follows will part with the table separately.
Mine never sold at full price, and I've decided to make stuff with
it.  Haven't hooked it up, but I think you were right about keeping
it--at least for now.

Begat

On Feb 12, 7:06 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> I don't know about any one else I always leave a slight gap on both not 1/8
> more like 1/32 but that is not for heat reasons I do it because I think it
> makes every thing run that little bit truer. when I remove and put back my
> extreme extension I always check it for true with a dial indicator and make
> sure its running as true as I can get it. if possible perfect it helps so
> much with vibration when using longer bits like the side reeding type and
> even some of the bigger dia bits but I wouldn't recommend running really
> large 3 inch bits in the extension.
> Bill
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "begatbrown" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2011 9:41 AM
> Subject: Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits
>
> > Hello,
>
> > With routers without extenders, I've always been told that you do NOT
> > seat the bit all the way to the bottom of the collet because you want
> > to avoid transferring the heat generated by the bit to the spindle.
> > The 1/8 in gap keeps the temperature lower.  Does the same advice
> > apply to the Extreme Extender?  With a bit extended an additional inch
> > plus and flying at 21K rpm, I want to make sure that the extender has
> > a firm grip on it, so I've been seating it all the way.  What say you
> > Bill or anyone else with experience with the Extender.  By the way,
> > it's a wonderful thing.  (I certainly would not ever want to try to
> > change bits on the Legacy or any other overhead routing system without
> > it.
>
> > Begat
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills?hl=en.

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Extreme Extender and the Seating of Bits

[begatbrown]

Hello,

With routers without extenders, I've always been told that you do NOT
seat the bit all the way to the bottom of the collet because you want
to avoid transferring the heat generated by the bit to the spindle.
The 1/8 in gap keeps the temperature lower.  Does the same advice
apply to the Extreme Extender?  With a bit extended an additional inch
plus and flying at 21K rpm, I want to make sure that the extender has
a firm grip on it, so I've been seating it all the way.  What say you
Bill or anyone else with experience with the Extender.  By the way,
it's a wonderful thing.  (I certainly would not ever want to try to
change bits on the Legacy or any other overhead routing system without
it.

Begat

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Re: Template Follower

[begatbrown]

DP,

I have put my template follower on yet.  When I put in on, I'll get to
it I'll look into it.

Begat

On Feb 10, 8:23 am, Donald Pearce  wrote:
> Has anyone designed a handle system to pull the router carriage when using 
> the template follower. My arthritic hands are taking a beating just grabbing 
> and pulling the carriage by itself.                                      

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Re: New Box

[begatbrown]

Hello Tim,

That's really small.  Thanks for showing what's possible, because I am
one of those who thinks larger pieces when I think of the legacy.  Are
you making a set?

Begat

On Feb 7, 4:42 am, "curt george"  wrote:
> Very nice job Tim!
> Awesome work as always!
>
> C.A.G.
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Tim Krause
>   To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Monday, February 07, 2011 12:33 AM
>   Subject: New Box
>
>   Hello All,
>
>   I've often heard what I'm starting to believe is a common misconception in 
> the woodturning world.  Those that never used a Legacy think it can only do 
> large work, well here's a small box that shows detail work is right up it's 
> alley.  It's all a matter of scaled bits and cuts in my humble opinion.
>
>   This little box was made using the lathe and the legacy.  It's 2-3/4 high 
> and 2-1/2" diameter.  I started by preparing the stock on the lathe by 
> cutting a solid piece of walnut into two pieces.  One for the top and one for 
> the bottom.  That way if the grain was bolder you could see it was made from 
> one piece of wood.  I left a tenon on each end of the parts so I could grab 
> the work with my 4 jaw chuck.  
>
>   Once the stock was parted I took a forstner bit and drilled a hole for the 
> inside of the box.  I changed the base of the box over to the legacy and made 
> the index cuts using a 3/4" flat bottom bit and stops.  I made a half cove 
> near the bottom and then made the top of the bottom of the box to size with 
> the flat bottom bit.
>
>   I then swapped the bottom back onto the lathe and mounted the top of the 
> box into the 4 jaw chuck and made the tenon for the top to fit into the 
> bottom part of the box.  I made it a tight fit so I could use the top as a 
> jam chuck to hold the bottom of the box so I could finish off the bottom.  I 
> dished the bottom slightly and added some detail rings.  I set this aside for 
> a while.  
>
>   Now I started working on the top part of the box.  I dished the underside 
> of the box and moved the chuck over to the legacy.  I used the same twelve 
> index cuts with the 3/4" flat bottom bit and added a slight cove.  I then 
> removed the top and wrapped masking tape around the tenon that I made that 
> fits inside the box.  I reversed the top and mounted it in the 4 jaw chuck 
> (I'll admit to being lazy, I should have made a jam chuck that works on 
> compression holding the tenon but I'll save that for the real tutorial).  I 
> proceeded to size the diameter with the flat bottom bit.  I then took a 
> spiral two flute cutter and cut the waste off the top (the temporary tenon 
> used to hold the work).  I then took a sign makers bit and cut the angle of 
> the top into the lid.  I did that in two steps.  I took the same bit and 
> bumped it 12 times into the lid.  The little triangles that are left over was 
> a cute touch is you ask me. The little tip finial was an after thought.  I 
> did that on the lathe.  Originally I had a tenon sticking out that I was 
> going to add a finial but I decided it would detract from the design so I 
> trimmed it to the little cone tip on the lathe. In retrospect, I could have 
> done it with a cove bit.
>
>   I took the lid off and finished the box off the lathe with a brushed on 
> shellac to get an antique look to the walnut.  I also buffed the finish to 
> give a smooth but textured look (you still see the brush strokes and dirt.  
> You have to see it to understand.  
>
>   Anyway, pictures should speak the rest of the words that I'm probably 
> forgetting to mention.  I don't have any photos of the work in progress since 
> I was really just playing around.  I can definitely see the Legacy has a lot 
> of hidden potential when combined with a lathe.
>
>   Let me know what you think.  
>
>   -Tim
>
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>
>
>
>  box_front_alt.jpg
> 19KViewDownload
>
>  box_inside.jpg
> 21KViewDownload
>
>  top_and_bottom_box.jpg
> 25KViewDownload
>
>  box_top.jpg
> 19KViewDownload

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Re: Does It Matter if I Use a X-Axis Split-Nut Backer on the Y-Axis Lead Screw?

[begatbrown]

Thanks Everyone,

After placing the scored rail on the outside, I find that the carriage
moves much more easily.

Begat

On Feb 6, 10:54 am, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> The wide channel with the score marks in the middle face outwards.  That's 
> the side that receives the bushings.  The wear issue is inherent in the 
> design.
>
> -Tim
>
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Daryl Scott
>   To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2011 6:18 AM
>   Subject: Re: Does It Matter if I Use a X-Axis Split-Nut Backer on the 
> Y-Axis Lead Screw?
>
>   Hello C.A.G. and BIll,
>
>   Bill, thanks for the tip on checking the rails.  Since I hit this snag, I 
> read the manual (which I normally would read, but who reads when you have a 
> video?), and they mention that one rail is marked and should be the back 
> rail.  It's not, which might explain what appears to be an alignment problem 
> that might wear down the bushings as Tim warns.  

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Re: Does It Matter if I Use a X-Axis Split-Nut Backer on the Y-Axis Lead Screw?

[begatbrown]

Thanks Tim.  I'll put things on pause until I get the right fix.  The 
split-nuts with the threads do have the shoulders. The carriage is probably 
too stiff.  I'll check to see whether it's the bushings.  I'll also give a 
closer inspection to the acme and the screws. I'll take the advice to 
heart.  

Begat

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Re: Does It Matter if I Use a X-Axis Split-Nut Backer on the Y-Axis Lead Screw?

[begatbrown]

Hello Bill, Curt, and Tim,

I'll give Legacy a call on Monday and see whether they have any split nuts 
in stock.  From what I can see, the machine was shipped to the original 
owner in the fall of 2009, so if there were any modifications to the 
split-nut design by then they did not make it into either the video or the 
printed manual. If push comes to shove and it affects performance, I'll try 
Tim's solution.  The router did come, and the backwards set up does not 
interfere with the router controls, and I am able to lock the nut and move 
the carriage along the y-axis.  With the cooperation of family and friends 
and a little luck with following instructions, I might finish the machine 
tomorrow.  I had planned to wait to use the machine until I could frame out 
a small room and put in an exhaust fan, an air filtration system, and 
cyclone (yes, I've been scared straight by the dust issue), but I want to 
see how big a deal the problem is.

By the way, Bill, I took your advice and bought your friend's extreme 
extension.  I should have it Monday.  It gets rave reviews most everywhere.  
Thanks for putting me on to it.

Begat

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Re: Smart Tool

[begatbrown]

Hello Art,

Thanks a million.  I've been looking for a probe.

Begat

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Does It Matter if I Use a X-Axis Split-Nut Backer on the Y-Axis Lead Screw?

[begatbrown]

Hello All,

I've finally got a chance to continue putting together the Model 900 I 
bought off of ebay a couple of weeks ago and discovered that the parts 
package contained two x-axis split-nut backers and no backer for the y-axis 
split nut.  I can install the x-axis backer on the y-axis lead screw, but 
the fork on the split-nut plate faces the router rather than the headstock 
and the knob is on the inside of the y-axis leadscrew.  I can tighten the 
leadscrew with the splitnut, but I am wondering whether this will affect the 
operation in any way. See photo .  (My router is due to arrive today if 
Fed-Ex's tracker can be believed. Getting late here.)  

Also, note that the label with the pitch guide was glued to the unit in the 
wrong direction.  I guess I can live with that!

Begat

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Re: cnc

[begatbrown]

Mike,

I just went through a decision process to buy an Arty over the other
options out there.  From what I could see, I would have bought a
shopbot if I wanted to produce flat part almost exclusively,
particularly projects calling for plywood sheets.  When I went to
their forum, it was largely about signs and kitchen cabinets.  With
its relatively narrow width, the Arty cannot compete--though most
cabinet panels are much narrower than 18 inches.  It's strength seems
to be in making lots of plywood parts from a 4x8 sheet.  I found it
instructive that shopbot found a way for their smaller machines to
process 4x8 sheets of ply and mdf.  Their machine owners must
primarily want more sheet capacity.

As before, Legacy decided to fulfill the niche of manufacturing turned
parts and it seems more geared to folks working with hardwood.  The
Arty is wide enough to surface flat hardwood boards and allow you to
profile and joint them as well.  I'm interested in designing and
making furniture that includes ornamental features and turned parts
made of hardwood. That made my decision easy.  I also think I can make
some money making stair parts.  Were you interested in making a CNC,
then it would be possible to do both flat stock and turning by making
a 5 axis machine. I have never seen the Joe CNC plans, but no Joe CNC
with a 5th axis sticks out in my mind.   I get the sense that more
than a few people here could do that if they wished.  As for me, that
would require more mechanical skills that I have or desire to obtain.
I don't think you can make a four or five axis machine without doing
metal work.  I've spent the better part of a month looking at homemade
cnc machines.  I've seen CNC lathes, and few people venture to make
one that turns and does flat stock.  And I have seen lots of folks who
try to make a shopbot and similar machines do better turning.  On this
point, Legacy's boasts about doing turning better seems right.  If you
go the homemade  cnc turning/flat route, from what I can see you will
be largely left to your own devices.  And even then, you might still
want to look into Legacy's Conversational Cam software for turning.
In the long run the cam software might prove to be their real
contribution.

Begat



On Feb 4, 7:01 pm, mike  wrote:
> does anybody have the arty cnc
> I was considering the shopbot, arty or joes cnc
> any comments on nthese or any other cnc would be helpful,
> thanks

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Re: new lubricant

[begatbrown]

Hello DWP,

Thanks.  And I've been meaning to get in touch with you for the
generous offer you made.  I'll email you.

Begat

On Feb 2, 9:47 am, Donald Pearce  wrote:
> Begat, I could sell dyna-glide for $10./can picked -up in Olney, MD.  DWP
>
> > Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2011 17:46:10 -0800
> > Subject: Re: new lubricant
> > From: darylmichaelsc...@gmail.com
> > To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
>
> > Bill,
>
> > Spoke to the folks at Legacy today. They have dyna-glide in stock.
>
> > Begat
>
> > On Feb 1, 7:15 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> > > yes I know it I even have some it is just like WD40
> > >  but its no dyna-glide its not a dry lube and collects dust and grime
> > > good for most things accept the rails on the legacy
>
> > > Bill
>
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "cole" 
> > > To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> > > Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2011 10:28 AM
> > > Subject: new lubricant
>
> > > >I just saw this new product on Highland woodworking site. They it was
> > > > originally devoloped for Australian salt mines . According to the msds
> > > > it is available in spray or aerosol. It is called InOx MX3 super
> > > > lubricant . It made me think of our partners in crime overseas.
>
> > > > --
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>
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Re: new lubricant

[begatbrown]

Bill,

Spoke to the folks at Legacy today.  They have dyna-glide in stock.

Begat

On Feb 1, 7:15 pm, "Bill Bulkeley"  wrote:
> yes I know it I even have some it is just like WD40
>  but its no dyna-glide its not a dry lube and collects dust and grime
> good for most things accept the rails on the legacy
>
> Bill
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "cole" 
> To: "Legacy Ornamental Mills" 
> Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2011 10:28 AM
> Subject: new lubricant
>
> >I just saw this new product on Highland woodworking site. They it was
> > originally devoloped for Australian salt mines . According to the msds
> > it is available in spray or aerosol. It is called InOx MX3 super
> > lubricant . It made me think of our partners in crime overseas.
>
> > --
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Re: UK Legacy owners.. Accessories for sale..

[begatbrown]

Hey Fast Eddy,

That must have been a big decision.  How will your CNC differ from the
retrofitted Legacy models?  I'd love to see pictures when you done.

Begat

On Feb 1, 4:10 am, fasteddy  wrote:
> Hi All..
>
> Finally finished chopping up my Legacy Mill 1800 to utilize in making
> my cnc.. Now I have all these accessories which are of no more use to
> me.. Suggest this will be of interest to UK mill owners only as
> postage to the states may make these parts expensive..
>
> I will make a list if asked, but I did have an extensive set of
> accessories, from all the full gear sets to vices, moulding plates,
> circle jig etc..
>
> Ask and I will see if I have got it..
>
> Regards
> Steve..

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Re: Legacy 1200 for Sale in Mass.

[begatbrown]

For those on the east side of the country, there is a guy near
Greenville, SC who has a motorized 1800 for sale at $4k firm.
http://greenville.craigslist.org/tls/2143583714.html
It is not outfitted nearly as well as the one Tim is assisting the guy
in selling on the West Coast.

On Jan 30, 12:29 pm, "Tim Krause"  wrote:
> I've got a 1800 for sale with a lot of 
> extra's.http://ornamentalmills.com/forsale/rl1800.html.
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Groovy Wood LLC" 
> To: 
> Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2011 9:19 AM
> Subject: RE: Legacy 1200 for Sale in Mass.
>
> > Oops guess I should hit reply instead of send
>
> > FYI, He said this was sold, sent him email yesterday to ask questions.
>
> > Thanks
> > Greg Knudtson
> > Http://Groovy Wood LLC.com
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
> > [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of begatbrown
> > Sent: Saturday, January 29, 2011 12:24 PM
> > To: Legacy Ornamental Mills
> > Subject: Legacy 1200 for Sale in Mass.
>
> > For anyone who might be interested, earlier this month there was a
> > listing on the American Woodworkers Association forum for a 1200 that
> > has a motor, among other things.
> >http://www.aawforum.org/vbforum/showthread.php?t=8291
>
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Legacy 1200 for Sale in Mass.

[begatbrown]

For anyone who might be interested, earlier this month there was a
listing on the American Woodworkers Association forum for a 1200 that
has a motor, among other things.  
http://www.aawforum.org/vbforum/showthread.php?t=8291

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