Re: How many shops... ?
Great summary, Robert ... I've been involved with z/Linux POC's for well over 10 years and if they died, it was almost always due to vendor products not being certified/supported on z (s390). This is what made it a 'one off' - having to find a different solution for the z platform.IBM has offered programs to help with this, including access to z - but vendors have to make choices about where they spend their time/energy to get the most from their investments too. Scott Rohling On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 6:16 AM, Nix, Robert P. wrote: > ³Once it¹s up, linux is linux²Š > > Right up until you want to install some piece of software. Unless you have > the source, then linux is x86, or linux is arm, or linux is z. > > This is the main issue we ran into in getting acceptance of Linux on z > here, and which ultimately led to its death. Far too many of the things > that people wanted to install were from vendors who supplied the binary > packages, not the source. Our policy for a long time was ³Linux on z > first, until you prove you can¹t go there². Unfortunately, better than 50% > of the projects easily proved that they couldn¹t go there. SO, after a > long period of frustration, management came to the conclusion that Linux > on z was not a viable platform, and we were directed to convert the > remaining images to x86 and shut down zVM. > > There needs to be wider acceptance within the software vendor community > for Linux on z (and / or Linux on ARM, Linux on PPC, Š, Linux on things > beyond x86). The problem is that the vendors can go to HP, or Best Buy, > and buy an x86, but they have to work to get an ARM or a PPC, or a Z. Most > aren¹t willing to make the effort to collect these platforms, and aren¹t > willing to invest in a Z system at all simply to test their product. > > So yes, Linux runs on anything, from a postage stamp sized ARM system to > the mighty Z. But in the case of Linux on Z, unless cost effective, small > scale development boxes become available (basically a commodity style > machine that could run a small load with a modest amount of disk, but > using the Z instruction set and configuration), I don¹t see how a large > scale wide range acceptance will occur. We tried it. We frustrated > management, and were ³punished² for it, being "banished" to the Windows > group for 5 years, where the x86 mantra was ingrained into us. > > As long as there¹s a huge price gap between the largest x86 based server > and the smallest Z system, software vendors won¹t take the leap. And > without software, a computer is just a brick. > -- > Robert P. Nix | Sr IT Systems Engineer | Data Center Infrastructure > Services > > Mayo Clinic | 200 First Street SW | Rochester, MN 55905 > 507-284-0844 | nix.rob...@mayo.edu > "quando omni flunkus moritati" > > > > > On 3/17/16, 6:50 PM, "Linux on 390 Port on behalf of Rick Troth" > wrote: > > >On 03/14/2016 11:29 AM, Ambros, Thomas wrote: > >> To start to contest the perception that Linux on system Z is a > >>'one-off', where would one find out for themselves roughly how many > >>shops in North America are running production implementations of Linux > >>on system Z and what proportion of all zSeries sites that might be? > > > >Might help to instead contest the perception that a "one-off" is somehow > >bad. > >Linux runs on z and it runs on PCs and it runs on ... > > > > * ARM (your smart phone), not necessarily Android > > * PPC (IBM RS/6000 or even older Apple servers) > > * MIPS (your home router and other embedded devices) > > * Itanium > > * HP PA-RISC > > * SPARC > > * Alpha > > * M68K > > > > > > ... and at least a dozen other architectures I've never seen or heard > >of before. Most of these are "one-offs", unless you're invested. So > >perception is all about perspective. (Forgive my tone if it sounds > >snippy. Am trying to leverage your verbiage, not pick on it.) > > > >Might help to instead contest the perception that Linux on z is somehow > >not Linux. Most of the list, not being PC hardware, are quirky to boot. > >But once they're up, Linux is Linux. > > > >The advantage of z hardware is significant. But I figger you already > >know those bullet points. > > > >You are not alone in the fight to get your shop to warm up to zLinux. > >Hang in there! > > > >-- R; <>< > > > > > > > > > >-- > >For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > >send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or > >visit > >http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 > >-- > >For more information on Linux on System z, visit > >http://wiki.linuxvm.org/ > > > > -- > For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or > visit > http://www.mar
Re: How many shops... ?
³Once it¹s up, linux is linux²Š Right up until you want to install some piece of software. Unless you have the source, then linux is x86, or linux is arm, or linux is z. This is the main issue we ran into in getting acceptance of Linux on z here, and which ultimately led to its death. Far too many of the things that people wanted to install were from vendors who supplied the binary packages, not the source. Our policy for a long time was ³Linux on z first, until you prove you can¹t go there². Unfortunately, better than 50% of the projects easily proved that they couldn¹t go there. SO, after a long period of frustration, management came to the conclusion that Linux on z was not a viable platform, and we were directed to convert the remaining images to x86 and shut down zVM. There needs to be wider acceptance within the software vendor community for Linux on z (and / or Linux on ARM, Linux on PPC, Š, Linux on things beyond x86). The problem is that the vendors can go to HP, or Best Buy, and buy an x86, but they have to work to get an ARM or a PPC, or a Z. Most aren¹t willing to make the effort to collect these platforms, and aren¹t willing to invest in a Z system at all simply to test their product. So yes, Linux runs on anything, from a postage stamp sized ARM system to the mighty Z. But in the case of Linux on Z, unless cost effective, small scale development boxes become available (basically a commodity style machine that could run a small load with a modest amount of disk, but using the Z instruction set and configuration), I don¹t see how a large scale wide range acceptance will occur. We tried it. We frustrated management, and were ³punished² for it, being "banished" to the Windows group for 5 years, where the x86 mantra was ingrained into us. As long as there¹s a huge price gap between the largest x86 based server and the smallest Z system, software vendors won¹t take the leap. And without software, a computer is just a brick. -- Robert P. Nix | Sr IT Systems Engineer | Data Center Infrastructure Services Mayo Clinic | 200 First Street SW | Rochester, MN 55905 507-284-0844 | nix.rob...@mayo.edu "quando omni flunkus moritati" On 3/17/16, 6:50 PM, "Linux on 390 Port on behalf of Rick Troth" wrote: >On 03/14/2016 11:29 AM, Ambros, Thomas wrote: >> To start to contest the perception that Linux on system Z is a >>'one-off', where would one find out for themselves roughly how many >>shops in North America are running production implementations of Linux >>on system Z and what proportion of all zSeries sites that might be? > >Might help to instead contest the perception that a "one-off" is somehow >bad. >Linux runs on z and it runs on PCs and it runs on ... > > * ARM (your smart phone), not necessarily Android > * PPC (IBM RS/6000 or even older Apple servers) > * MIPS (your home router and other embedded devices) > * Itanium > * HP PA-RISC > * SPARC > * Alpha > * M68K > > > ... and at least a dozen other architectures I've never seen or heard >of before. Most of these are "one-offs", unless you're invested. So >perception is all about perspective. (Forgive my tone if it sounds >snippy. Am trying to leverage your verbiage, not pick on it.) > >Might help to instead contest the perception that Linux on z is somehow >not Linux. Most of the list, not being PC hardware, are quirky to boot. >But once they're up, Linux is Linux. > >The advantage of z hardware is significant. But I figger you already >know those bullet points. > >You are not alone in the fight to get your shop to warm up to zLinux. >Hang in there! > >-- R; <>< > > > > >-- >For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or >visit >http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 >-- >For more information on Linux on System z, visit >http://wiki.linuxvm.org/ > -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Open stack on RHEL
Hi Is there any difference running a openstack in Linux running on x86 and open stack on zVM ? Jake -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Re: 2016 VMWORKSHOP registration is now open. Call for papers
The VM Workshop committee is in the process of building the agenda and soliciting presenters. If anyone has a topic they would like to be considered, please post it at http://vmworkshop.org/2016sesp.shtml. As the agenda is built and finalized, it will be posted at http://vmworkshop.org/2016agen.shtml. Regards, Len Leonard J. Santalucia CTO | Business Development Manager | Certified Specialist Vicom Infinity, Inc. IBM Premier Business Partner One Penn Plaza - Suite 2010 New York, New York 10119 Cell…….917-856-4493 eFax413-622-1229 vText……… 9178564...@vtext.com My Blog http://www.infinite-blue.com/blog/ Vicom Infinity http://www.vicominfinity.com Vicom Computer Services http://www.vicomnet.com/ Infinity Systems http://www.infinite-blue.com -Original Message- From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU] On Behalf Of bob christian Sent: Friday, March 18, 2016 9:44 PM To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: 2016 VMWORKSHOP registration is now open. Call for papers hello has the agenda been published yet. On Wednesday, March 16, 2016, Philip Tully wrote: > 2016 VMWORKSHOP registration is now open. > > > > The 2016 VMWorkshop is scheduled for June 23-25, 2016,it is being held > at Rutgers University, Busch Campus Center. 604 Bartholomew Rd, > Piscataway Township, NJ 08854. > > This years VMWORKSHOP is the 6 since they were reanimated at Ohio > State in 2010. > > > > Please go to VMWORKSHOP.ORG to register. > > The cost of the conference remains at $100 for 2 ½ days which includes > a polo shirt. > > > > Student attendance cost $10 (no Polo shirt ). > > > > Call for papers is also open. > > > > One of the most valuable parts of the VMWORKSHOP are the sessions > given in small less formal settings with access to the speakers. > Have you done something unique at your shop? Written an interesting > piece of code? Integrated your z/VM, zVSE and/or Linux with other > systems? Are you willing to talk about these? If you have never > presented at the VMWORKSHOP we will be providing some incentives for > new presenters. These presentation do not need to be a full hour, a > solid 20 minute presentation would be valuable. If you need help > brushing up your presentation we have volunteers that can help. > > > > So Register today for the 2016 VMWORKSHOP on your calendar, and submit > your ideas for session now. > > " Virtus in medio stat " > > -- > For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: > INFO LINUX-390 or visit > http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 > -- > For more information on Linux on System z, visit > http://wiki.linuxvm.org/ > -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Blockchain
For those who are interested in blockchain, or openledger, or hyperledger (I can’t keep up with the names) and would like to get their hands dirty; I’ve created an open chain peer container which will allow you to play with it. The instructions may be found at: https://hub.docker.com/r/brunswickheads/openchain-peer/ Neale -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Re: How many shops... ?
On 03/14/2016 11:29 AM, Ambros, Thomas wrote: > To start to contest the perception that Linux on system Z is a 'one-off', > where would one find out for themselves roughly how many shops in North > America are running production implementations of Linux on system Z and what > proportion of all zSeries sites that might be? Might help to instead contest the perception that a "one-off" is somehow bad. Linux runs on z and it runs on PCs and it runs on ... * ARM (your smart phone), not necessarily Android * PPC (IBM RS/6000 or even older Apple servers) * MIPS (your home router and other embedded devices) * Itanium * HP PA-RISC * SPARC * Alpha * M68K ... and at least a dozen other architectures I've never seen or heard of before. Most of these are "one-offs", unless you're invested. So perception is all about perspective. (Forgive my tone if it sounds snippy. Am trying to leverage your verbiage, not pick on it.) Might help to instead contest the perception that Linux on z is somehow not Linux. Most of the list, not being PC hardware, are quirky to boot. But once they're up, Linux is Linux. The advantage of z hardware is significant. But I figger you already know those bullet points. You are not alone in the fight to get your shop to warm up to zLinux. Hang in there! -- R; <>< -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
2016 VMWORKSHOP registration is now open. Call for papers
2016 VMWORKSHOP registration is now open. The 2016 VMWorkshop is scheduled for June 23-25, 2016,it is being held at Rutgers University, Busch Campus Center. 604 Bartholomew Rd, Piscataway Township, NJ 08854. This years VMWORKSHOP is the 6 since they were reanimated at Ohio State in 2010. Please go to VMWORKSHOP.ORG to register. The cost of the conference remains at $100 for 2 ½ days which includes a polo shirt. Student attendance cost $10 (no Polo shirt ). Call for papers is also open. One of the most valuable parts of the VMWORKSHOP are the sessions given in small less formal settings with access to the speakers. Have you done something unique at your shop? Written an interesting piece of code? Integrated your z/VM, zVSE and/or Linux with other systems? Are you willing to talk about these? If you have never presented at the VMWORKSHOP we will be providing some incentives for new presenters. These presentation do not need to be a full hour, a solid 20 minute presentation would be valuable. If you need help brushing up your presentation we have volunteers that can help. So Register today for the 2016 VMWORKSHOP on your calendar, and submit your ideas for session now. " Virtus in medio stat " -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Re: Open stack on RHEL
>>> On 3/19/2016 at 09:34 AM, Jake Anderson wrote: > Hi > > Is there any difference running a openstack in Linux running on x86 and > open stack on zVM ? As far as the interfaces to the hypervisor(s) go, yes. Other than that, there shouldn't be. I haven't heard of Red Hat offering their OpenStack product on z Systems, however. Mark Post -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Re: How many shops... ?
In our case, we had the zVM expertise, and we automated the Linux image installation down to about 120 seconds between request and log in, and anyone (with the privilege) could do it in one command. So the whole expertise issue was removed at that point. Adding disk was mostly a Dirmaint thing. And we used LVM, so even migrating disk could be done without bringing the Linux image down. We had SSI, so linux images survived zVM reboots. It was an ideal environment… That management just wouldn’t embrace. The last nail in to coffin though was the decision to migrate away from zOS. Since that was the “bread and butter” of the mainframe, with it gone, they didn’t want to pay for the expensive system just to run Linux. -- Robert P. Nix | Sr IT Systems Engineer | Data Center Infrastructure Services Mayo Clinic | 200 First Street SW | Rochester, MN 55905 507-284-0844 | nix.rob...@mayo.edu "quando omni flunkus moritati" On 3/18/16, 9:53 AM, "Linux on 390 Port on behalf of James Huckert" wrote: >Great summary Robert and very true. In the case of one shop because z/VM >was costly and a pain to manage, meaning the Linux folks could not easily >use it to provision Linux guests, the project was killed and moved to x86. > >With IBM now introducing KVM for z I am hoping this will open the door >again. X86 folks can have a familiar interface to provision and manage >z/Linux images. Also with IBM porting a large amount of popular software >packages like Chef, GO language, Docker, and Mongo DB to z/Linux one can >hope z/Linux will get a jumpstart. > >Of course as the saying goes "once bitten twice shy". So time will tell >,,, will Rockhopper and Emperor go the way of zBX and slowly fade into >obscurity? > >Regards, >James Huckert > >-Original Message- >From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU] On Behalf Of >Nix, Robert P. >Sent: Friday, March 18, 2016 8:16 AM >To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU >Subject: Re: How many shops... ? > >³Once it¹s up, linux is linux²Š > >Right up until you want to install some piece of software. Unless you >have the source, then linux is x86, or linux is arm, or linux is z. > >This is the main issue we ran into in getting acceptance of Linux on z >here, and which ultimately led to its death. Far too many of the things >that people wanted to install were from vendors who supplied the binary >packages, not the source. Our policy for a long time was ³Linux on z >first, until you prove you can¹t go there². Unfortunately, better than >50% of the projects easily proved that they couldn¹t go there. SO, after >a long period of frustration, management came to the conclusion that >Linux on z was not a viable platform, and we were directed to convert the >remaining images to x86 and shut down zVM. > >There needs to be wider acceptance within the software vendor community >for Linux on z (and / or Linux on ARM, Linux on PPC, Š, Linux on things >beyond x86). The problem is that the vendors can go to HP, or Best Buy, >and buy an x86, but they have to work to get an ARM or a PPC, or a Z. >Most aren¹t willing to make the effort to collect these platforms, and >aren¹t willing to invest in a Z system at all simply to test their >product. > >So yes, Linux runs on anything, from a postage stamp sized ARM system to >the mighty Z. But in the case of Linux on Z, unless cost effective, small >scale development boxes become available (basically a commodity style >machine that could run a small load with a modest amount of disk, but >using the Z instruction set and configuration), I don¹t see how a large >scale wide range acceptance will occur. We tried it. We frustrated >management, and were ³punished² for it, being "banished" to the Windows >group for 5 years, where the x86 mantra was ingrained into us. > >As long as there¹s a huge price gap between the largest x86 based server >and the smallest Z system, software vendors won¹t take the leap. And >without software, a computer is just a brick. >-- >Robert P. Nix | Sr IT Systems Engineer | Data Center Infrastructure >Services > >Mayo Clinic | 200 First Street SW | Rochester, MN 55905 >507-284-0844 | nix.rob...@mayo.edu >"quando omni flunkus moritati" > > > > >On 3/17/16, 6:50 PM, "Linux on 390 Port on behalf of Rick Troth" > wrote: > >>On 03/14/2016 11:29 AM, Ambros, Thomas wrote: >>> To start to contest the perception that Linux on system Z is a >>>'one-off', where would one find out for themselves roughly how many >>>shops in North America are running production implementations of Linux >>>on system Z and what proportion of all zSeries sites that might be? >> >>Might help to instead contest the perception that a "one-off" is >>somehow bad. >>Linux runs on z and it runs on PCs and it runs on ... >> >> * ARM (your smart phone), not necessarily Android >> * PPC (IBM RS/6000 or even older Apple servers) >> * MIPS (your home router and other embedded devices) >> * Itanium >> * HP PA-RISC >> * SPARC >> * Alpha >> * M68K >> >> >> ... and at least
Re: Any z13s boxes out there?
Mark, My employer has a z13s and we would be happy to test your script. Eric On 3/15/16 12:03 PM, Mark Post wrote: Cross-posted to IBMVM and Linux-390... Does anyone on the list have a z13s or the new LinuxONE Rockhopper running Linux that could test an updated cputype script for me? I realize it's just a single line added with a (supposedly) known model number, but I get paranoid about shipping broken stuff. -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
2016 VMWORKSHOP registration and call for papers is now open.
The 2016 VMWorkshop is scheduled for June 23-25, 2016,it is being held at Rutgers University, Busch Campus Center. 604 Bartholomew Rd, Piscataway Township, NJ 08854. This years VMWORKSHOP is the 6 since they were reanimated at Ohio State in 2010. Please go to VMWORKSHOP.ORG to register. The cost of the conference remains at $100 for 2 ½ days which includes a polo shirt. Student attendance cost $10 (no Polo shirt ). Call for papers is also open. One of the most valuable parts of the VMWORKSHOP are the sessions given in small less formal settings with access to the speakers. Have you done something unique at your shop? Written an interesting piece of code? Integrated your z/VM, zVSE and/or Linux with other systems? Are you willing to talk about these? If you have never presented at the VMWORKSHOP we will be providing some incentives for new presenters. These presentation do not need to be a full hour, a solid 20 minute presentation would be valuable. If you need help brushing up your presentation we have volunteers that can help. So Register today for the 2016 VMWORKSHOP on your calendar, and submit your ideas for session now. -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Re: Performance Class Velocity Software June 21st & 22nd at Rutgers University NJ
Hi: I would like to attend your performance class, I am a software developer at Innovation Data Processing here in NJ. Thanks, Ed Gilroy (IDP USA) On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 3:32 PM, Magnelia Necoy wrote: > Once again we are offering the famous Performance Class for z/VM and Linux > on z Systems on June 21st & 22nd, 2016. > > The Class will be held prior to the VM Workshop, scheduled for June 23-25. > Location for both events: Rutgers University, Busch Campus Center. 604 > Bartholomew Rd, Piscataway Township, NJ 08854. > > Don’t miss out on this great opportunity for a full week of excellent > education! > Please send me an email if you would like to attend our class and we will > reserve the seat for you. > > Best wishes and see you in NJ, Maggie > > Magnelia Necoy > Managing Director > Global Sales and Marketing > > Velocity Software Inc. > 196-D Castro St > Mountain View, CA 94041 > > Office Main: (650) 964-8867 > Office Direct: (650 567-4300 > Cell: (303) 999-7646 > International: +49 1727671037 > Email: ne...@velocitysoftware.com > > > > > -- > For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or > visit > http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 > -- > For more information on Linux on System z, visit > http://wiki.linuxvm.org/ > -- For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or visit http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 -- For more information on Linux on System z, visit http://wiki.linuxvm.org/
Re: How many shops... ?
Great summary Robert and very true. In the case of one shop because z/VM was costly and a pain to manage, meaning the Linux folks could not easily use it to provision Linux guests, the project was killed and moved to x86. With IBM now introducing KVM for z I am hoping this will open the door again. X86 folks can have a familiar interface to provision and manage z/Linux images. Also with IBM porting a large amount of popular software packages like Chef, GO language, Docker, and Mongo DB to z/Linux one can hope z/Linux will get a jumpstart. Of course as the saying goes "once bitten twice shy". So time will tell ,,, will Rockhopper and Emperor go the way of zBX and slowly fade into obscurity? Regards, James Huckert -Original Message- From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU] On Behalf Of Nix, Robert P. Sent: Friday, March 18, 2016 8:16 AM To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: How many shops... ? ³Once it¹s up, linux is linux²Š Right up until you want to install some piece of software. Unless you have the source, then linux is x86, or linux is arm, or linux is z. This is the main issue we ran into in getting acceptance of Linux on z here, and which ultimately led to its death. Far too many of the things that people wanted to install were from vendors who supplied the binary packages, not the source. Our policy for a long time was ³Linux on z first, until you prove you can¹t go there². Unfortunately, better than 50% of the projects easily proved that they couldn¹t go there. SO, after a long period of frustration, management came to the conclusion that Linux on z was not a viable platform, and we were directed to convert the remaining images to x86 and shut down zVM. There needs to be wider acceptance within the software vendor community for Linux on z (and / or Linux on ARM, Linux on PPC, Š, Linux on things beyond x86). The problem is that the vendors can go to HP, or Best Buy, and buy an x86, but they have to work to get an ARM or a PPC, or a Z. Most aren¹t willing to make the effort to collect these platforms, and aren¹t willing to invest in a Z system at all simply to test their product. So yes, Linux runs on anything, from a postage stamp sized ARM system to the mighty Z. But in the case of Linux on Z, unless cost effective, small scale development boxes become available (basically a commodity style machine that could run a small load with a modest amount of disk, but using the Z instruction set and configuration), I don¹t see how a large scale wide range acceptance will occur. We tried it. We frustrated management, and were ³punished² for it, being "banished" to the Windows group for 5 years, where the x86 mantra was ingrained into us. As long as there¹s a huge price gap between the largest x86 based server and the smallest Z system, software vendors won¹t take the leap. And without software, a computer is just a brick. -- Robert P. Nix | Sr IT Systems Engineer | Data Center Infrastructure Services Mayo Clinic | 200 First Street SW | Rochester, MN 55905 507-284-0844 | nix.rob...@mayo.edu "quando omni flunkus moritati" On 3/17/16, 6:50 PM, "Linux on 390 Port on behalf of Rick Troth" wrote: >On 03/14/2016 11:29 AM, Ambros, Thomas wrote: >> To start to contest the perception that Linux on system Z is a >>'one-off', where would one find out for themselves roughly how many >>shops in North America are running production implementations of Linux >>on system Z and what proportion of all zSeries sites that might be? > >Might help to instead contest the perception that a "one-off" is >somehow bad. >Linux runs on z and it runs on PCs and it runs on ... > > * ARM (your smart phone), not necessarily Android > * PPC (IBM RS/6000 or even older Apple servers) > * MIPS (your home router and other embedded devices) > * Itanium > * HP PA-RISC > * SPARC > * Alpha > * M68K > > > ... and at least a dozen other architectures I've never seen or heard >of before. Most of these are "one-offs", unless you're invested. So >perception is all about perspective. (Forgive my tone if it sounds >snippy. Am trying to leverage your verbiage, not pick on it.) > >Might help to instead contest the perception that Linux on z is somehow >not Linux. Most of the list, not being PC hardware, are quirky to boot. >But once they're up, Linux is Linux. > >The advantage of z hardware is significant. But I figger you already >know those bullet points. > >You are not alone in the fight to get your shop to warm up to zLinux. >Hang in there! > >-- R; <>< > > > > >-- >For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send >email to lists...@vm.marist.edu with the message: INFO LINUX-390 or >visit >http://www.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?LINUX-390 >-- >For more information on Linux on System z, visit >http://wiki.linuxvm.org/ > -
