Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Fri, Nov 14, 2003 at 03:08:27PM +1100, James McDonald wrote: HTH HAND What does HAND mean? have a nice day -- Myles Green [EMAIL PROTECTED], Calgary, AB, Canada eh? Slackware-9.1 + CLI + Mutt-1.4.1i + Lynx|Links|eLinks With all that power, who needs a bloated GUI ?? Alberta Mirror for Linux-SxS.Org: http://linux-sxs.org/ ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
Myles Green wrote: On Fri, Nov 14, 2003 at 03:08:27PM +1100, James McDonald wrote: HTH HAND What does HAND mean? have a nice day Thanks :) -- James McDonald Singleton Australia 61+ (0)2 65712401 61+ 0428 320 219 Laugh when you can; cry when you must. Linux 2.6.0-test9 #1 Fri Nov 7 22:06:28 EST 2003 athlon i386 GNU/Linux 22:30:00 up 6 days, 23:11, 1 user, load average: 0.07, 0.03, 0.01 ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1 ot
On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 19:50:58 -0700 Collins Richey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And the classic (unknown origin): The optimist believes that we live in the best of all possible worlds; the pessimist believes that this is true. Or my favorite: A man has two sons, an optimist and a pessimist. For Christmas he gives the pessimist a bright shiny new bicycle. The pessimist scowls - it will probably break or get stolen or I'll scrape my knee. He gives the optimist a sack of horse turds. The optomist grins from ear to ear - I know there's a pony here somewhere. The saddest definition of a cynic I've come across (can't remember the derivation at the moment, sorry) is: A cynic is a frustrated romantic I've used that to effect when being accused of being cynical. As for being a pessimist, I always maintain that pessimism is fine because even when you're wrong, it's a good thing! Terence ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
RE: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1 ot
And the classic (unknown origin): The optimist believes that we live in the best of all possible worlds; the pessimist believes that this is true. The saddest definition of a cynic I've come across (can't remember the derivation at the moment, sorry) is: A cynic is a frustrated romantic I've used that to effect when being accused of being cynical. As for being a pessimist, I always maintain that pessimism is fine because even when you're wrong, it's a good thing! I've often said that my wife is gullible pessimist, while I am a cynical optimist, so between us we have all the bases covered. She believes what she is told but expects things to go wrong. I believe that everyone is good, but don't expect them to behave that way. But I like the engineer: The Optimist thinks the glass if half full, The Pessimist thinks the glass is half empty, The Engineer thinks the glass is twice as large as it needs to be! In Harmony's Way and In A Chord, Tom ;-}) Tom Condon Registered Linux User #154358 Plain Text Emails Don't Spread Virii! ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Wednesday 12 November 2003 02:56 pm, Bruce Marshall wrote: On Wednesday 12 November 2003 15:34 pm, Roger Oberholtzer wrote: Has anyone done an update to an existing 8.2 system? Or will I be in a bad mood tomorrow evening? I don't do updates anymore... just new installs but no one over on the SUSE list has had any real problems with an update. Most go just flawlessly and the others may have a niggle or two. How do the existing distros compare regarding upgrades of 1. the core system? 2. applications external to the core system? Andrew Gould ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
RE: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
How do the existing distros compare regarding upgrades of 1. the core system? 2. applications external to the core system? SuSE has an online update utility (through YAST) that will check for updates to any program you have installed and download and include them. It does dependency checking, so if something major has changed you get everything needed to make the system work. I've used it regularly with no problems. OK, that isn't *quite* true. I didn't use it at first, then there was too large a list to do all at once so I had to manually select those I wanted from the list it provided and do the updates in three pieces. Other than that it is quite painless and hasn't ever caused me any problems (nothing broke). Works for both core and applications (if SuSE updates the package it gets an update for the online update). In Harmony's Way and In A Chord, Tom ;-}) Tom Condon Registered Linux User #154358 Plain Text Emails Don't Spread Virii! ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Thursday 13 November 2003 02:27 pm, Condon Thomas A KPWA wrote: How do the existing distros compare regarding upgrades of 1. the core system? 2. applications external to the core system? SuSE has an online update utility (through YAST) that will check for updates to any program you have installed and download and include them. It does dependency checking, so if something major has changed you get everything needed to make the system work. I've used it regularly with no problems. OK, that isn't *quite* true. I didn't use it at first, then there was too large a list to do all at once so I had to manually select those I wanted from the list it provided and do the updates in three pieces. Other than that it is quite painless and hasn't ever caused me any problems (nothing broke). Works for both core and applications (if SuSE updates the package it gets an update for the online update). In Harmony's Way and In A Chord, Tom ;-}) To clarify: I'm wondering how the distributions compare as to upgrading from one release to the next, rather than updates to the current release. We've had one person state that SUSE's upgrade process hasn't worked well, historically. How about Mandrake and Slackware? RedHat's is a moot point; but what are Fedora's plans? I think Gentoo and Debian can upgrade themselves without release cd's; but how much breakage occurs in the process? Except for Dep's articles on upgrading SUSE, which were enough to keep me from trying (Thank you, Dep.), this isn't an issue that has gotten much press. Andrew Gould ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Thu, 2003-11-13 at 22:09, Andrew L. Gould wrote: I think Gentoo and Debian can upgrade themselves without release cd's; but how much breakage occurs in the process? I have never had breakage in Gentoo. The incremental approach makes it better, I think. I do recall a problem with a glibc update on Gentoo that hosed some systems. That was before my Gentoo days. In the almost 2 years I have used Gentoo, the system has never barfed. I only install stable releases (95% true). -- Roger Oberholtzer [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Thu, 2003-11-13 at 21:03, Andrew L. Gould wrote: On Wednesday 12 November 2003 02:56 pm, Bruce Marshall wrote: On Wednesday 12 November 2003 15:34 pm, Roger Oberholtzer wrote: Has anyone done an update to an existing 8.2 system? Or will I be in a bad mood tomorrow evening? I don't do updates anymore... just new installs but no one over on the SUSE list has had any real problems with an update. Most go just flawlessly and the others may have a niggle or two. How do the existing distros compare regarding upgrades of 1. the core system? 2. applications external to the core system? SuSE will update those that there are updates for, as well as remove those that are no longer supported. It will also backup everything it changes. I have not tried that. But it offered to do so. You have total control over which packages are treated which way. I think SuSE, at least, are decently recent with the versions of software. At least the stuff I use. They even included a 2.6 kernel that you can install and play with. It's on my list. Still, I am a Gentoo fan at heart. I don't have the time to make a Gentoo-based distro that I can install on all production systems. So SuSE fits in there. But at home, it is Gentoo all the way! -- Roger Oberholtzer [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 22:43:37 +0100 Roger Oberholtzer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 2003-11-13 at 22:09, Andrew L. Gould wrote: I think Gentoo and Debian can upgrade themselves without release cd's; but how much breakage occurs in the process? I have never had breakage in Gentoo. The incremental approach makes it better, I think. I do recall a problem with a glibc update on Gentoo that hosed some systems. That was before my Gentoo days. In the almost 2 years I have used Gentoo, the system has never barfed. I only install stable releases (95% true). I've been using gentoo for a lot longer than that. There are occasional rough spots even on the stable release. The beauty with gentoo is that critical bugs get fixed rapidly. If you do as I do, let recommended upgrades age a week or two, you almost never encounter problems. Most of the problems are with new kde/gnome releases (always buggy). Since I don't use either on a regular basis, new releases are not critical for my system. With the complex interrelationships of software, no one can get it 100% right; someone always has the right combination of software to break things, even those things that have been thoroughly tested. Your alternative is the Debian approach, where nothing is declared stable until its too old to be of current interest and operational on every architecture that debian supports. -- Collins Richey - Denver Area if you fill your heart with regrets of yesterday and the worries of tomorrow, you have no today to be thankful for. ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Thu, Nov 13, 2003 at 03:09:45PM -0600, Andrew L. Gould wrote: To clarify: I'm wondering how the distributions compare as to upgrading from one release to the next, rather than updates to the current release. We've had one person state that SUSE's upgrade process hasn't worked well, historically. How about Mandrake and Slackware? RedHat's is a moot point; but what are Fedora's plans? I think Gentoo and Debian can upgrade themselves without release cd's; but how much breakage occurs in the process? Except for Dep's articles on upgrading SUSE, which were enough to keep me from trying (Thank you, Dep.), this isn't an issue that has gotten much press. Andrew Gould I used a package called 'swaret' to upgrade from Slackware 9.0 = 9.1 and it went very smoothly. It's not an 'official' slackware package but it *is* avaliable in the Extras directory. Also, there is 'slapt-get' and 'emerde' out there; I haven't used either one but have heard Good Things(tm) about slapt-get. YMMV HTH HAND Myles -- Myles Green [EMAIL PROTECTED], Calgary, AB, Canada eh? Slackware-9.1 + CLI + Mutt-1.4.1i + Lynx|Links|eLinks With all that power, who needs a bloated GUI ?? Alberta Mirror for Linux-SxS.Org: http://linux-sxs.org/ ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
HTH HAND What does HAND mean? -- James McDonald Systems Engineer Singleton NSW Australia ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
I received the Update version SUSE 9.0 Professional yesterday and installed it last night. The first things I noted were: 1. No cool graphical representation of a math formula on the box or cover. (Aha! Already we see the corporate smothering of creativity!) 2. The DVD was bad. (Or do you need a special DVD reader for double-sided DVD's?) I could boot up from the DVD and start the installation; but the installation program could not find the applications. I had to install from the CDROM's. 3. I have a Linksys ethernet PCI card and a Cisco Aironet PCI card. The Cisco card was configured as wlan0. I had to configure the Linksys card to go nowhere (no cable is attached, no do not activate at boot up option seen in yast) and: mv /etc/sysconfig/network/ifcfg-wlan0 /etc/sysconfig/network/ifcfg-eth1 to establish wireless connectivity. 4. An evaluation CD of iAnywhere's (Sybase) SQL Anywhere Studio for Linux was included in the box. Andrew Gould ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
Has anyone done an update to an existing 8.2 system? Or will I be in a bad mood tomorrow evening? -- Roger Oberholtzer [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Wednesday 12 November 2003 15:34 pm, Roger Oberholtzer wrote: Has anyone done an update to an existing 8.2 system? Or will I be in a bad mood tomorrow evening? I don't do updates anymore... just new installs but no one over on the SUSE list has had any real problems with an update. Most go just flawlessly and the others may have a niggle or two. -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 11/12/03 15:55 + ++ Go Hawaiian: Give your gal a lei. ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 12:42:39 -0600 Andrew L. Gould [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1. No cool graphical representation of a math formula on the box or cover. (Aha! Already we see the corporate smothering of creativity!) Do we? 2. The DVD was bad. (Or do you need a special DVD reader for double-sided DVD's?) No. I could boot up from the DVD and start the installation; but the installation program could not find the applications. I had to install from the CDROM's. I had no problems at all with the DVD. 4. An evaluation CD of iAnywhere's (Sybase) SQL Anywhere Studio for Linux was included in the box. Yes, it was. I've yet to play with it. Terence ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Wednesday 12 November 2003 03:03 pm, Terence McCarthy wrote: On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 12:42:39 -0600 Andrew L. Gould [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1. No cool graphical representation of a math formula on the box or cover. (Aha! Already we see the corporate smothering of creativity!) Do we? I forgot the wink. (I hope I'm not **that** cynical.) :-) 2. The DVD was bad. (Or do you need a special DVD reader for double-sided DVD's?) No. I could boot up from the DVD and start the installation; but the installation program could not find the applications. I had to install from the CDROM's. I had no problems at all with the DVD. 4. An evaluation CD of iAnywhere's (Sybase) SQL Anywhere Studio for Linux was included in the box. Yes, it was. I've yet to play with it. Terence ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 15:12:39 -0600 Andrew L. Gould [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I forgot the wink. (I hope I'm not **that** cynical.) :-) Remember Ambrose Beirce (The Devil's Dictionary) A cynic is a man whose faulty vision sees things as they are, and not as they ought to be. :-)) Terence ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1
Consuming 0.5K bytes, Terence McCarthy blathered: On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 15:12:39 -0600 Andrew L. Gould [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I forgot the wink. (I hope I'm not **that** cynical.) :-) Remember Ambrose Beirce (The Devil's Dictionary) A cynic is a man whose faulty vision sees things as they are, and not as they ought to be. :-)) Indeed. Although I personally prefer Bierce's definition of optimist, A proponent of the doctrine that black is white. Kurt -- Heller's Law: The first myth of management is that it exists. Johnson's Corollary: Nobody really knows what is going on anywhere within the organization. ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
Re: SUSE Linux 9.0 Professional Update - night 1 ot
On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 20:44:47 -0500 Kurt Wall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Consuming 0.5K bytes, Terence McCarthy blathered: On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 15:12:39 -0600 Andrew L. Gould [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I forgot the wink. (I hope I'm not **that** cynical.) :-) Remember Ambrose Beirce (The Devil's Dictionary) A cynic is a man whose faulty vision sees things as they are, and not as they ought to be. :-)) Indeed. Although I personally prefer Bierce's definition of optimist, A proponent of the doctrine that black is white. And the classic (unknown origin): The optimist believes that we live in the best of all possible worlds; the pessimist believes that this is true. Or my favorite: A man has two sons, an optimist and a pessimist. For Christmas he gives the pessimist a bright shiny new bicycle. The pessimist scowls - it will probably break or get stolen or I'll scrape my knee. He gives the optimist a sack of horse turds. The optomist grins from ear to ear - I know there's a pony here somewhere. -- Collins Richey - Denver Area if you fill your heart with regrets of yesterday and the worries of tomorrow, you have no today to be thankful for. ___ Linux-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe/Suspend/Etc - http://smtp.linux-sxs.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-users
