[LUTE] Spain vs. Italy
Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[BAROQUE-LUTE] More Weiss
Here is another video I did of an insane Weiss work. If you can endure to the end of it you will hear my cadenza that goes up to fret 14 then down to course 13. Sterling [1]Sylvius Leopold Weiss Allegro in D minor--Sterling Price [2]image [3]Sylvius Leopold Weiss Allegro in D minor--Sterling Price [4]View on youtu.be Preview by Yahoo -- References 1. https://youtu.be/Waq79D3pYvs 2. https://youtu.be/Waq79D3pYvs 3. https://youtu.be/Waq79D3pYvs 4. https://youtu.be/Waq79D3pYvs To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Spain vs. Italy
Spain was not an exception regarding free vs. conservative thinking. I mean, Spain was not more conservative than England or France, in regard to what is right or wrong in religion, morality (for instance sexuality ) and so on. Fear was (and is) the explication of nearly everything. Perhaps Jean Delumeau (La peur en Occident, Fayard, 1978) hits the nail when he says, concluding his wonderful book, that Satan was seen everywhere. He is the enemy, he inspires the turks, the witches, the heresies, the plagues, etc. When the attention is focused on jews and 'moriscos' (that is what happens in Spain), the witches are not so closely monitorized. In other european countries, not so much worried with jews, heresies (here the protestants, there the catholics) were prosecuted instead. Only two countries, Delumeau continues, escaped from this general fear: Poland and Italy. The latter perhaps because of being more pagan than his neighbors (that was Erasmus' opinion), or because the church was controlling it better than elsewhere. In any case, it seems that Italy lost his mind because of these fears in a lesser degree than other countries. But if we read Carlo Ginzburg's Il formaggio e i fermi. Il cosmo di un mugnaio del '500 (1976), a seminal work in micro-history, Italy suffered under the inquisition as well. Galileo's case is of course very well known. It's all too easy to project from our present time to that past. Regards from Barcelona, dear lute friends. :-) Manolo El 04/05/2015, a las 19:27, Sean Smith lutesm...@mac.com escribió: That's what I'm thinking, too. The very first piece in Dalza's book is the Caldibi Castigliano and it certainly points to a refined and complex idiom unlike anything else in his Ferrerese or Venetiana dance cycles. Sean On May 4, 2015, at 9:52 AM, Gary Boye wrote: A word of caution here: We are making judgements based primarily on the printed evidence (i.e., the 7 main vihuela tablatures); there was a great deal of music (most of it!) that took place in Spain outside of these formal, published works. Publishing was a big deal in the 16th century. Getting an imprimatur from a conservative and literally Inquisitorial government was unlikely with a large collection of dance music; much easier to play it conservative and stick to sacred intabulations. The vihuela manuscripts hint at a wider repertoire, as does the existence of guitar music from a later period. Who knows what was happening on the streets, but the Inquisition wouldn't have had much to do if everyone in Spain was a straight-laced as the vihuela tablatures make it seem . . . Gary Dr. Gary R. Boye Professor and Music Librarian Appalachian State University On 5/4/2015 12:37 PM, Dan Winheld wrote: In other words, because the only two ethnic/cultural groups that had any rhythm were invited to leave the premises at once. It was said that when all the Jewish Moorish doctors, scholars, scientists, and artists academics showed up on his doorstep, the Sultan of Turkey asked Has the King of Spain lost his mind? Lacking some rhythm myself, I do enjoy the all the great vihuela music a lot- but even I have to sometimes move over to Italy Germany for a little jumping around. Dan On 5/4/2015 3:36 AM, Ron Andrico wrote: Well, the first answer that springs to mind is because Spain had recently kicked out all the dance musicians, who had moved to Italy. They were left with a bunch of upwardly mobile courtiers (Milan), and serious-minded priests with so much time on their hands that they intabulated every piece of vocal polyphony they could put their hands on. Actually, there is quite a bit of dance music in Fuenllana's print, some but much less in the other six published books. Also, there was quite a bit of dance music evident in Naples, which was Spanish at the time. RA Date: Mon, 4 May 2015 09:29:52 +0200 To: l...@cs.dartmouth.edu From: r.ba...@gmx.de Subject: [LUTE] Spain vs. Italy Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- --
[LUTE] Re: BBC and Lute News
Dear Nancy, There are software solutions for listening to the BBC outside the UK (such as Hola). These do obviously rise issues with regard to broadcasting rights. Best Matthew On May 3, 2015, at 20:53, Nancy Carlin na...@nancycarlinassociates.com wrote: A friend sent me a link to the BBC comedy spoof news panel program Have I Got News for You? Each week it includes a game based on some obscure serial publication and this week (Series 49: Episode 4) they chose Lute News. You can watch it on iPlayer. [1]http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b05t66s3/have-i-got-news-for-yo u-series-49-episode-4 Since the BBC has their web site fixed so those of us outside the US can't see this, can anyone tell me what they said? Nancy -- Nancy Carlin Administrator THE LUTE SOCIETY OF AMERICA [2]http://LuteSocietyofAmerica.org lute PO Box 6499 Concord, CA 94524 USA 925 / 686-5800 [3]www.groundsanddivisions.info [4]www.nancycarlinassociates.com -- References 1. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b05t66s3/have-i-got-news-for-you-series-49-episode-4 2. http://LuteSocietyofAmerica.org/ 3. http://www.groundsanddivisions.info/ 4. http://www.nancycarlinassociates.com/ To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Spain vs. Italy
Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Spain vs. Italy
Well, the first answer that springs to mind is because Spain had recently kicked out all the dance musicians, who had moved to Italy. They were left with a bunch of upwardly mobile courtiers (Milan), and serious-minded priests with so much time on their hands that they intabulated every piece of vocal polyphony they could put their hands on. Actually, there is quite a bit of dance music in Fuenllana's print, some but much less in the other six published books. Also, there was quite a bit of dance music evident in Naples, which was Spanish at the time. RA Date: Mon, 4 May 2015 09:29:52 +0200 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: r.ba...@gmx.de Subject: [LUTE] Spain vs. Italy Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Spain vs. Italy
Il 04/05/2015 09:29, Robert Barto ha scritto: Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Because we know how to party! :) Best regards Fabio To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Spain vs. Italy
In other words, because the only two ethnic/cultural groups that had any rhythm were invited to leave the premises at once. It was said that when all the Jewish Moorish doctors, scholars, scientists, and artists academics showed up on his doorstep, the Sultan of Turkey asked Has the King of Spain lost his mind? Lacking some rhythm myself, I do enjoy the all the great vihuela music a lot- but even I have to sometimes move over to Italy Germany for a little jumping around. Dan On 5/4/2015 3:36 AM, Ron Andrico wrote: Well, the first answer that springs to mind is because Spain had recently kicked out all the dance musicians, who had moved to Italy. They were left with a bunch of upwardly mobile courtiers (Milan), and serious-minded priests with so much time on their hands that they intabulated every piece of vocal polyphony they could put their hands on. Actually, there is quite a bit of dance music in Fuenllana's print, some but much less in the other six published books. Also, there was quite a bit of dance music evident in Naples, which was Spanish at the time. RA Date: Mon, 4 May 2015 09:29:52 +0200 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: r.ba...@gmx.de Subject: [LUTE] Spain vs. Italy Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Spain vs. Italy
A word of caution here: We are making judgements based primarily on the printed evidence (i.e., the 7 main vihuela tablatures); there was a great deal of music (most of it!) that took place in Spain outside of these formal, published works. Publishing was a big deal in the 16th century. Getting an imprimatur from a conservative and literally Inquisitorial government was unlikely with a large collection of dance music; much easier to play it conservative and stick to sacred intabulations. The vihuela manuscripts hint at a wider repertoire, as does the existence of guitar music from a later period. Who knows what was happening on the streets, but the Inquisition wouldn't have had much to do if everyone in Spain was a straight-laced as the vihuela tablatures make it seem . . . Gary Dr. Gary R. Boye Professor and Music Librarian Appalachian State University On 5/4/2015 12:37 PM, Dan Winheld wrote: In other words, because the only two ethnic/cultural groups that had any rhythm were invited to leave the premises at once. It was said that when all the Jewish Moorish doctors, scholars, scientists, and artists academics showed up on his doorstep, the Sultan of Turkey asked Has the King of Spain lost his mind? Lacking some rhythm myself, I do enjoy the all the great vihuela music a lot- but even I have to sometimes move over to Italy Germany for a little jumping around. Dan On 5/4/2015 3:36 AM, Ron Andrico wrote: Well, the first answer that springs to mind is because Spain had recently kicked out all the dance musicians, who had moved to Italy. They were left with a bunch of upwardly mobile courtiers (Milan), and serious-minded priests with so much time on their hands that they intabulated every piece of vocal polyphony they could put their hands on. Actually, there is quite a bit of dance music in Fuenllana's print, some but much less in the other six published books. Also, there was quite a bit of dance music evident in Naples, which was Spanish at the time. RA Date: Mon, 4 May 2015 09:29:52 +0200 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: r.ba...@gmx.de Subject: [LUTE] Spain vs. Italy Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Spain vs. Italy
That's what I'm thinking, too. The very first piece in Dalza's book is the Caldibi Castigliano and it certainly points to a refined and complex idiom unlike anything else in his Ferrerese or Venetiana dance cycles. Sean On May 4, 2015, at 9:52 AM, Gary Boye wrote: A word of caution here: We are making judgements based primarily on the printed evidence (i.e., the 7 main vihuela tablatures); there was a great deal of music (most of it!) that took place in Spain outside of these formal, published works. Publishing was a big deal in the 16th century. Getting an imprimatur from a conservative and literally Inquisitorial government was unlikely with a large collection of dance music; much easier to play it conservative and stick to sacred intabulations. The vihuela manuscripts hint at a wider repertoire, as does the existence of guitar music from a later period. Who knows what was happening on the streets, but the Inquisition wouldn't have had much to do if everyone in Spain was a straight-laced as the vihuela tablatures make it seem . . . Gary Dr. Gary R. Boye Professor and Music Librarian Appalachian State University On 5/4/2015 12:37 PM, Dan Winheld wrote: In other words, because the only two ethnic/cultural groups that had any rhythm were invited to leave the premises at once. It was said that when all the Jewish Moorish doctors, scholars, scientists, and artists academics showed up on his doorstep, the Sultan of Turkey asked Has the King of Spain lost his mind? Lacking some rhythm myself, I do enjoy the all the great vihuela music a lot- but even I have to sometimes move over to Italy Germany for a little jumping around. Dan On 5/4/2015 3:36 AM, Ron Andrico wrote: Well, the first answer that springs to mind is because Spain had recently kicked out all the dance musicians, who had moved to Italy. They were left with a bunch of upwardly mobile courtiers (Milan), and serious-minded priests with so much time on their hands that they intabulated every piece of vocal polyphony they could put their hands on. Actually, there is quite a bit of dance music in Fuenllana's print, some but much less in the other six published books. Also, there was quite a bit of dance music evident in Naples, which was Spanish at the time. RA Date: Mon, 4 May 2015 09:29:52 +0200 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: r.ba...@gmx.de Subject: [LUTE] Spain vs. Italy Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Spain vs. Italy
Spain was not an exception regarding free vs. conservative thinking. I mean, Spain was not more conservative than England or France, in regard to what is right or wrong in religion, morality (for instance sexuality ) and so on. Fear was (and is) the explication of nearly everything. Perhaps Jean Delumeau (La peur en Occident, Fayard, 1978) hits the nail when he says, concluding his wonderful book, that Satan was seen everywhere. He is the enemy, he inspires the turks, the witches, the heresies, the plagues, etc. When the attention is focused on jews and 'moriscos' (that is what happens in Spain), the witches are not so closely monitorized. In other european countries, not so much worried with jews, heresies (here the protestants, there the catholics) were prosecuted instead. Only two countries, Delumeau continues, escaped from this general fear: Poland and Italy. The latter perhaps because of being more pagan than his neighbors (that was Erasmus' opinion), or because the church was controlling it better than elsewhere. In any case, it seems that Italy lost his mind because of these fears in a lesser degree than other countries. But if we read Carlo Ginzburg's Il formaggio e i fermi. Il cosmo di un mugnaio del '500 (1976), a seminal work in micro-history, Italy suffered under the inquisition as well. Galileo's case is of course very well known. It's all too easy to project from our present time to that past. Regards from Barcelona, dear lute friends. :-) Manolo El 04/05/2015, a las 19:27, Sean Smith lutesm...@mac.com escribió: That's what I'm thinking, too. The very first piece in Dalza's book is the Caldibi Castigliano and it certainly points to a refined and complex idiom unlike anything else in his Ferrerese or Venetiana dance cycles. Sean On May 4, 2015, at 9:52 AM, Gary Boye wrote: A word of caution here: We are making judgements based primarily on the printed evidence (i.e., the 7 main vihuela tablatures); there was a great deal of music (most of it!) that took place in Spain outside of these formal, published works. Publishing was a big deal in the 16th century. Getting an imprimatur from a conservative and literally Inquisitorial government was unlikely with a large collection of dance music; much easier to play it conservative and stick to sacred intabulations. The vihuela manuscripts hint at a wider repertoire, as does the existence of guitar music from a later period. Who knows what was happening on the streets, but the Inquisition wouldn't have had much to do if everyone in Spain was a straight-laced as the vihuela tablatures make it seem . . . Gary Dr. Gary R. Boye Professor and Music Librarian Appalachian State University On 5/4/2015 12:37 PM, Dan Winheld wrote: In other words, because the only two ethnic/cultural groups that had any rhythm were invited to leave the premises at once. It was said that when all the Jewish Moorish doctors, scholars, scientists, and artists academics showed up on his doorstep, the Sultan of Turkey asked Has the King of Spain lost his mind? Lacking some rhythm myself, I do enjoy the all the great vihuela music a lot- but even I have to sometimes move over to Italy Germany for a little jumping around. Dan On 5/4/2015 3:36 AM, Ron Andrico wrote: Well, the first answer that springs to mind is because Spain had recently kicked out all the dance musicians, who had moved to Italy. They were left with a bunch of upwardly mobile courtiers (Milan), and serious-minded priests with so much time on their hands that they intabulated every piece of vocal polyphony they could put their hands on. Actually, there is quite a bit of dance music in Fuenllana's print, some but much less in the other six published books. Also, there was quite a bit of dance music evident in Naples, which was Spanish at the time. RA Date: Mon, 4 May 2015 09:29:52 +0200 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: r.ba...@gmx.de Subject: [LUTE] Spain vs. Italy Hi all, In the early 1500s, why are dances so common in Italian lute music and so rare in the vihuela rep. ? Thanks -- Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- --
[LUTE] Howard Skempton: Prelude 5 (played on a lute)
A very attractive, enigmatic, modal piece. I think it sounds well on a lute: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1Apxqc-wpk Stuart --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
