[LUTE] Re: Theorboes for sale?
I have three, but they are in Brazil... Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 10.03.2015, à(s) 14:12, David Morales dmorale...@cuerdaspulsadas.com escreveu: Hi, We have an specific section in our blog devoted to second-hand instruments. Take a look: [1]http://cuerdaspulsadas.com/blog/category/mercado/ Translation available by using the top left flags. Regards. 2015-03-10 16:03 GMT+01:00 BENJAMIN NARVEY [2]luthi...@gmail.com: A A Dear Luters, A A Just in case any of you have theorboes to sell, do get in touch! A A Best wishes, A A BenjaminA A A -- A A [1][3]www.luthiste.com A A t [4]+33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98 A A -- References A A 1. [5]http://www.luthiste.com/ To get on or off this list see list information at [6]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- De conformidad con lo dispuesto en la Ley OrgA!nica 15/1999 de ProtecciA^3n de Datos de carA!cter Personal DAVID MORALES DE FRAAS, con domicilio en Salamanca, C/ Luis Vives, 6 - cuarto, le informa que los datos de carA!cter personal que facilite forman parte de un fichero, responsabilidad del mismo, para la gestiA^3n administrativa de los clientes. En el supuesto de que desee ejercitar los derechos que le asisten de acceso, rectificaciA^3n, cancelaciA^3n y oposiciA^3n dirija una comunicaciA^3n por escrito a la direcciA^3n indicada anteriormente o al correo electrA^3nico [7]h...@cuerdaspulsadas.com con la referencia ProtecciA^3n de Datos incluyendo copia de su Documento Nacional de Identidad o documento identificativo equivalente. La informaciA^3n contenida en el presente mensaje de correo electrA^3nico es confidencial y su acceso A-onicamente estA! autorizado al destinatario original del mismo, quedando prohibidos cualquier comunicaciA^3n, divulgaciA^3n, o reenvAo, tanto del mensaje como de su contenido. En el supuesto de que usted no sea el destinatario autorizado, le rogamos borre el contenido del mensaje y nos comunique dicha circunstancia a travA(c)s de un mensaje de correo electrA^3nico a la direcciA^3n [8]h...@cuerdaspulsadas.com -- References 1. http://cuerdaspulsadas.com/blog/category/mercado/ 2. mailto:luthi...@gmail.com 3. http://www.luthiste.com/ 4. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%206%2071%2079%2098%2098 5. http://www.luthiste.com/ 6. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 7. mailto:h...@cuerdaspulsadas.com 8. mailto:h...@cuerdaspulsadas.com
[LUTE] Re: green lute like instrument
Horrible photo, what a shame, poor animal, why post something like this? Where is there any fun? How is it related to the LUTE? Think about it and refrain in the future. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 04.03.2015, à(s) 16:32, John Mardinly john.mardi...@asu.edu escreveu: And nails, not fleshOK, claws? A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E. Principal Materials Nanoanalysis Engineer EMail: john.mardi...@asu.edu Cell: 408-921-3253 (does not work in TEM labs) Titan Lab: 480-727-5651 NION UltraSTEM Lab: 480-727-5652 JEOL ARM 200 Lab: 480-727-5653 2010F Lab: 480-727-5654 Office: 480-965-7946 John Cowley Center for HREM, LE-CSSS B134B Bateman Physical Sciences Building Arizona State University PO Box 871704 Tempe, AZ 85287-1704 -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of John Mardinly Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 2015 12:14 PM To: Dan Winheld; Ed Durbrow; lute list Subject: [LUTE] Re: green lute like instrument Fan bracing as well! A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E. Principal Materials Nanoanalysis Engineer EMail: john.mardi...@asu.edu Cell: 408-921-3253 (does not work in TEM labs) Titan Lab: 480-727-5651 NION UltraSTEM Lab: 480-727-5652 JEOL ARM 200 Lab: 480-727-5653 2010F Lab: 480-727-5654 Office: 480-965-7946 John Cowley Center for HREM, LE-CSSS B134B Bateman Physical Sciences Building Arizona State University PO Box 871704 Tempe, AZ 85287-1704 -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Dan Winheld Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 2015 10:09 AM To: Ed Durbrow; lute list Subject: [LUTE] Re: green lute like instrument Green thumb out! On 3/3/2015 12:52 AM, Ed Durbrow wrote: http://www.boredpanda.com/dragon-lizard-playing-leaf-guitar-aditya-per mana-indonesia/ Ed Durbrow Saitama, Japan http://www.youtube.com/user/edurbrow?feature=watch https://soundcloud.com/ed-durbrow http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/ -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Lyrics by Skaespeare
Please search for the new Shakespeare edition by Carin Zwiling, a brazilian lute player and shakespeare studiosa. She discovered some exciting new Shakespeare songs stuff while doing her doctor thesis in England. It has been edited in England by Corda Publishing. http://www.cordamusic.co.uk Contact Corda’s Ian at iangam...@cordamusic.org.uk Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 07.10.2014, à(s) 18:14, Wim Loos wjglso...@gmail.com escreveu: Dear lutenists, Today I got Shakespeares-Songbook from my University Library. I was ver disapointed that, except by one song, no tablatures where added. I have reasonal doubt for the autenticity of Some songs. So I Will look for the availebilityA ofA the edition fromA Mignarda. The sample looksA good! Thans you for your comment, Best regards, Wim Op dinsdag 7 oktober 2014 heeft Helen Atkinson [1]helen.atkin...@wordstone.co.uk het volgende geschreven: A A You'reA very kind to say so,A Ron Donna! Thank you. A A Helen A A On Monday, 6 October 2014, Ron Andrico [1][2]praelu...@hotmail.com A A wrote: A A Thanks, Helen for mentioning Mignarda Editions Shakespeare's Lute A A Book.AA We have watched with much delight your live video performances A A of songs from our edition - very well played and sung. A A It is quite a task to collate and present surviving music from A A Shakespeare's plays, and our friend and colleague, Ross Duffin, did in A A fact amass quite a mixture of authenticated and speculative settings of A A songs featured or mentioned in the plays.AA Some of the speculative A A settings, the product of a computer routine that attempted to match A A meter with tunes and lyrics, give one pause if we compare them to the A A elegance of the original surviving settings by Robert Johnson, Robert A A Jones, Thomas Morley and others.AA But it was a nice try and produced A A food for thought.AA For puzzling reasons, Ross omitted the surviving A A lute accompaniments in favor of a melody line that can be harmonized as A A you like it.AA While this is no problem whatsoever for those of us with A A a working familiarity of the original settings, and who possess the A A ability to extemporize, the book requires these things if one wishes to A A create music for performance. A A But modern settings of Shakespeare's song with lute accompaniment, like A A Ed Durbow's offer some interesting alternatives to the more A A conventional period music.AA We should also mention Brian Wright's A A collection, available through the Lute Society. A A As for period settings of songs and lute solos, our edition was created A A for those who wish to actually perform the music, complete with careful A A text underlay for songs with subsequent verses.AA Helen demonstrates A A some wonderful results in her videos. A A Best wishes, A A Donna Stewart Ron Andrico A A Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2014 05:27:19 +0100 A A To: [2][3]wjglso...@gmail.com A A CC: [3][4]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu A A From: [4][5]helen.atkin...@wordstone.co.uk A A Subject: [LUTE] Re: Lyrics by Skaespeare A A A A Please check out Mignarda Editions'A excellent resource (the 5th book A A on this list): A A A A [1][5][6]http://www.mignarda.com/editions/ A A A A I've found it invaluable! A A A A Helen A A A A On Monday, 6 October 2014, Wim Loos [2][6][7]wjglso...@gmail.com A A wrote: A A A A A A Daar friends, A A A A I'm member of a opera workshop aboutA lyrics from Shakespeare. A A A A ShortlyA we have a performance. I like to play and sing lute A A music. A A A A I wonder if there existA luteA music bases on Shakspeare A A lyrics. A A A A Thanks in advance, A A A A Wim Loos A A A A -- A A To get on or off this list see list information at A A [3][7][8]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html A A A A -- A A A A References A A A A 1. [8][9]http://www.mignarda.com/editions/ A A 2. mailto:[9][10]wjglso...@gmail.com A A 3. [10][11]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html A A A A -- References A A 1. mailto:[12]praelu...@hotmail.com A A 2. javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','[13]wjglso...@gmail.com'); A A 3. javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','[14]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu'); A A 4. javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','[15]helen.atkin...@wordstone.co.uk'); A A 5. [16]http://www.mignarda.com/editions/ A A 6. javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','[17]wjglso...@gmail.com'); A A 7. [18]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html A A 8. [19]http://www.mignarda.com/editions/
[LUTE] Re: OT: Historic Rosin
It may look the same as Aquila’s resin, just the price is double Aquila’s price. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 28.09.2014, à(s) 22:50, theoj89...@aol.com escreveu: While searching for medical remedies, I found that an Remedia Pharmacy (Eisenstadt Austria) also produces a historic Larch rosin for bowed gut strung instruments. The recipe is from Francesco Galeazzi's treatise 'Elementi teorico pratici di Musica' - 1796(?). It is perhaps something to share with histraic bowed string players. http://www.remedia-homeopathy.com/en/homeopathy/Violin-rosin/p2144.html -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I
Besides that she made subtle and rich music which may not have been noted by a passer-by, with a wide range of musicians over time. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 20.12.2013, às 18:40, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk escreveu: Emma Kirkby sings the way she does because she was a product of the English Cathedral choral tradition and does or did emmulate the sound that English choirboys make and are assumed to have made in the past. Whether this is the case is hard to tell but I have heard recordings of the Sistine Chapel Choir and the Choir of Westminster Cathedral made at the beginning of the 20th century and the tone that the boys made was not unlike that of English choirboys today. I don't see where Joan Baez comes into it myself. - Original Message - From: howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Friday, December 20, 2013 6:54 PM Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I On Dec 19, 2013, at 5:27 AM, Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com wrote: This also fits in nicely with Richard Taruskin's often stated thesis that early music performance practice today is really a modern fabrication that seeks to apply 20th (now 21st) century aesthetic preferences to past music. This would make sense only if there were a single 20th-century aesthetic preference. Taruskin's usual lucidity rather deserted him here, floating away in a sea of abstract nouns. It all falls apart when you try to be specific about it. For example, he famously suggested (in his article in Early Music magazine around 1983, if not in Text and Act, a book I've never succeeded in slogging all the way through) that Emma Kirkby's straight delivery had as much to do with Joan Baez as with being historically informed, an odd notion in my view, since I always found Baez' vibrato too intense for my taste. But even assuming Taruskin chose a good example, why did Kirkby emulate Baez, rather than some other singer who was popular in the sixties and early seventies? She could have chosen to sing like Elvis Presley, Frank Sinatra, Rod McKuen, Mick Jagger, Bob Dylan, Janis Joplin (wouldn't you love to hear Jagger and Joplin sing Sweet Kate?), John Lennon, Andy Williams, Merle Haggard, Birgit Nilsson or Beverly Sills, all of whom represented current aesthetic prefere! nc! es. Why not any of them as the model for a modern fabrication? I'm inclined to go for the obvious explanation that answers questions rather than raising them: people in early are doing what they think they're doing. The important thing about 20th-century aesthetic preferences to past music is that the 20th century preferred past music. Audiences turned out for music of the 18th and 19th centuries more than for the new stuff. That had never happened before. Classical music, and the symphony orchestra in particular, became museums preserving music of previous generations, and the logical and inevitable outgrowth of that phenomenon was that some of the curators wanted to do it right, just like the curators who cleaned the old cloudy varnish off the Rembrandt painting called the Night Watch and discovered it wasn't a night scene at all. Indeed, the technically clean, vibrato-less, metronomic, inexpressive character of many performances of early music nowadays seems to be an artistic reflection of mechanized industrialization, assembly lines, Because early musicians spend lots of time in factories Beware the logical fallacy of they exist at the same time, therefore there must be some cause and effect, or you can wind up joining the vaccination causes [insert your favorite ailment here] crowd. Cause and effect requires a mechanism. In any event, mechanized industrialization and assembly lines have coexisted for nearly a century with continuous vibrato, which is largely a post-World War I development and is still the dominant way of playing and singing classical music -- some higher-level orchestras have taken to playing Mozart differently from the way they play Rachmaninoff, but it hasn't filtered down much to the less exalted professional ranks. and the repeatable, homogenized regularity of product made possible by the use of computers. I'm not sure I follow you here. Are you talking about digital recording, or something else? It would be too much of a stretch to suggest that the approach of Segovia and contemporaries provides a model of early interpretation today, but one might be able to argue that, being older, some aspects of those aesthetic priorities were (un/subconsciously) closer to the spirit of earlier times than the modern performance dogma. True in a very limited way, insofar as the spirit of earlier times was I play the way I play because I like to play that way; I play the best way I can based on my own inclinations and the way I was taught to play. That's essentially
[LUTE] Re: and the early music movement
Christopher, maybe you should start to hear good early music musicians. They all improvise, and are excellent at it. I do not know any recorder, theorbo, cembalo, clarinet, cornetto, etc etc player who does not improvise. They learn it at school, in ensembles, from each other. Take Van Eick, a basic recorder repertoire - full with improvisation. Any Basso Continuo is an improvisation of sorts. On the other hand, all onstage jazz impro's were tried out before in rehearsal. There are very few musicians who do free-impro, total on-the-spot improvisation, onstage. Even Metheny and Coleman's song x, a timeless masterpiece, is not way out free in the utter sense of free improvisation. Bad early music exists as well. I only hear it from amateurs. All pros I heard until now were very good. A huge number of amateurs is excellent as well. Your comments on early music are very unrealistic. Have you ever been to the Basel conservatoire yourself? Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 20.12.2013, às 20:51, Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com escreveu: Howard, On Fri, 12/20/13, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote: On Dec 19, 2013, at 5:27 AM, Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com wrote: This also fits in nicely with Richard Taruskin's often stated thesis that early music performance practice today is really a modern fabrication that seeks to apply 20th (now 21st) century aesthetic preferences to past music. This would make sense only if there were a single 20th-century aesthetic preference. Who is to say there is not? Those alive during a historical period are too sensitive to the trees of plurality to discern the forest of ideology motivating seemingly disparate activities. (I assume most of us on this list are holdovers born in the 20th century. If there are any lutenists age 13 or younger on this list, please feel free to let us know your assessment of the degree of aesthetic cohesion exemplified in artistic movements of the last century. Probably, Uh, you mean that old stuff? Like, I dunno. Don't care.) The important thing about 20th-century aesthetic preferences to past music is that the 20th century preferred past music. Audiences turned out for music of the 18th and 19th centuries more than for the new stuff. That had never happened before. Hardly. Audiences turn out in droves for new popular music: product intended to be enjoyed for a while before being discarded in favor of the next hit. It may come as a shock to us on the list, but very few people in the general population pay attention to classical music at all. We're the oddballs and I'm afraid Beyonce has us lute players beaten by a large margin in terms of broader musical relevance in the present. Because early musicians spend lots of time in factories Yes. In music, they are called conservatories. and the repeatable, homogenized regularity of product made possible by the use of computers. I'm not sure I follow you here. Are you talking about digital recording, or something else? Well, no, I wasn't speaking of digital recording specifically, but that is a new development of the 20th century. While the invention of aural recording and the resultant commodification of the resultant mass-produced product, has certainly had an influence on the way music was performed in the 20th/21st centuries, that is really a much larger topic. I was rather referring to the psychological mindset incurred when one is able to press a button and have 100 identical pages print versus the old school method of one having to manually press 100 similar, yet slightly distinct pages, or the even older method of writing out 100 pages by hand. We expect the characteristics of like objects to be extremely consistent, if not exact. (See the above remark about conservatory training.) There is every reason to believe that earlier generations neither expected or desired total consistency. Indeed, improvisation and ornamentation WERE the expected tools of all professional musicians. Listeners knew that every hearing of a piece would be unique. We, however, expect our MP3s to sound exactly the same on each playing. Our HIP performers are more influenced by the latter than the former. Consider how many early music performers today improvise in concert. Sure, there are some who can do it, but today, despite the fact that we know of its past importance, it is not at all an obligatory skill for HIP musicians. Improvisation means that occasionally you'll have too many notes in a run or find yourself with the next note of that repeated figure just out of reach, or even - oh, the horror! - play a wrong note. Can't have that. Not consistent. A reviewer, still stinging from the backlash resulting from a negative Segovia review, would relish the opportunity to expostulate that sort of informed, yet anachronistic (for 20th century aesthetics)
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed we got so far away from the [LUTE]-forum
So what are we left with? Personal judgements on what is and what is not interesting music. Or good music, or correct music, or aurally thought music. Harnoncourt wrote it some 40 years ago: HIP is not about doing music as it was done centuries ago but about making lively music for today's listeners. Treatises and other documents help to avoid mistakes which render long-gone music dull, like playing Bach without accents. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 19.12.2013, às 11:27, Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com escreveu: This also fits in nicely with Richard Taruskin's often stated thesis that early music performance practice today is really a modern fabrication that seeks to apply 20th (now 21st) century aesthetic preferences to past music. Indeed, the technically clean, vibrato-less, metronomic, inexpressive character of many performances of early music nowadays seems to be an artistic reflection of mechanized industrialization, assembly lines, and the repeatable, homogenized regularity of product made possible by the use of computers. It would be too much of a stretch to suggest that the approach of Segovia and contemporaries provides a model of early interpretation today, but one might be able to argue that, being older, some aspects of those aesthetic priorities were (un/subconsciously) closer to the spirit of earlier times than the modern performance dogma. Ah ha! says the HIP Police Person, But the Basel crew has something those bloated philistines of Segovia's generation never deigned to consider: we base every choice upon... (At this point the HIP Police Person raises eyes and hands to the heavens. A ray of golden light shines down and a snippet of the scholarly edition of Josquin's Missa Di Dadi, sung by an angelic choir, is heard. Apollo on his chariot begins to descend but he suddenly gets a call on his iPhone reminding him that he is needed for a baroque opera rehearsal in Stockholm.) ...the SOURCES! Ahh... the HIP person sighs with quasi-orgasmic relish. To which I say: Read all the 19th century treatises you can. Absorb them. Many are written so clearly, you'll have be able to form a perfect aural picture of how the music sounded. Then listen to period recordings. Suddenly no one is doing they're supposed to be doing, according to their own sources! The picture you formed was filtered through your own time, not theirs. How great must the gulf between our current intellectual comprehension and their actual practice be for music created in a pre-industrialized age, from which no recorded artifact survives? Chris Dr. Christopher Wilke D.M.A. Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer www.christopherwilke.com On Wednesday, December 18, 2013 6:46 PM, JarosAAaw Lipski jaroslawlip...@wp.pl wrote: WiadomoAAAe napisana przez howard posner w dniu 18 gru 2013, o godz. 23:10: On Dec 18, 2013, at 1:47 PM, Dan Winheld [1]dwinh...@lmi.net wrote: Is it just me, or is there not something ironic about a serious minded 21st century LUTE-list member finding a great 20th century musical icon (think of him what one will otherwise) outdated? Not at all. Implicit in the whole early music movement is the assumption that the mainstream classical approach to early music was outdated, including icons like Karajan, Stokowski, and yes, Segovia. Their approach was an early-to-mid-twentieth-century approach that became outdated when we learned better. Sure, but we're not talking about Segovia's early music interpretations. To get on or off this list see list information at [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:dwinh...@lmi.net 2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Question on String Tension
Great advice! I had never thought about this myself, but , yes, of course it should be possible to increase the twist and get more flexible gut strings! There is a type of gut string called Venice which is manufactured with a much higher twist and is much more flexible. It behaves differently, and is especially loved for a certain repertoire of bowed strings. Its tone is differente as well. I am sorry for not being able to give more detail due to my limited knowledge, if someone is interested I can direct e-mails to musicians who buy these Venice strings and who may be more able to answer questions. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 18.12.2013, às 08:11, alexander voka...@verizon.net escreveu: David, there is a possibility of improving your situation. First you have to make sure you know which way the string is twisted (clockwise or counter). A strong magnifying glass might be of help. Next you need to get one end of the string free, either the bridge end or the peg end. Firmly holding the string, give it one or two turns in the direction of the twist. Twist as much as possible without a distortion to the shape of the string. Do not let the string to bulk on itself. Fix the end of the string back where it belongs and raise the pitch. Of course make sure the string does not untwist, and keep it somewhat taut while holding. This simple technique might be enough to increase the string's elasticity and make it more agreeable to finger pressure. There is no difficulty to this, just some amount of common sense, and never turn against the string's twist, as if the string is not glued well together, it could be damaged. You could practice on a piece of fret gut, to get a feel to it. Some strings can take quite a bit of twist and actually be improved by this. alexander r. On Tue, 17 Dec 2013 17:59:52 -0800 David Smith d...@dolcesfogato.com wrote: I have an 11 course lute where the 11^th course seems to be very sensitive and difficult to get in tune. It is gut. No, I do not want to use copper or silver wrapped strings. Does this make sense to anyone or is it just noise? I am looking to see if changing the string will have an effect on tunability and whether it indicates a low or high tension change would be good. Thanks for listening to the ramblings and any guidance you can provide. These are expensive strings (Gut) so just experimenting is a bit spendy. Regards David -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed we got so far away from the [LUTE]-forum
The Segovia film is nice in its own way, it was probably interesting for at least a part of the audience at the time it was recorded, sounds completely outdated and boring for most people today, and may be rediscovered in the future for some reason we would never even think of. Is it somehow related to the lute? Bream played something thought to be a lute in his own time, so he may be discussed here? Had Segovia anything to do with the lute besides the repertoire? And if it is the repertoire, may we include Andre Rieu here? He also plays some of the most extended lute repertoire... I think Jimi Hendrix also has a lot to do with the lute - his characteristic rythmic flamboyance is directly associated to the liberties taken in lute performance, were musicians are free from dogmas imposed by some phonographic industry product player. Or thus I understand it, in my very personal interpretation of the lute. And the arab / turkish / syrian lutes in use nowadays? And so it goes... Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 18.12.2013, às 14:00, Jarosław Lipski jaroslawlip...@wp.pl escreveu: Segovia could have been polite and gentle providing that a student followed his remarks, fingerings etc. This is nothing extraordinary in music, and there are similar reported cases from the past centuries . Some big Maestros were known for bullying un-subjugated pupils. (Bach was known for bullying kids from his choir). This is not a good excuse obviously, especially in our modern world, however it gives me a thought how both performance practice and teaching evolved. BTW for those of you who doubt Segovia's competence as a guitarist there is a short, live video from 50's (Torroba's Sonatina in particular). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjRLpE_TzdA Enjoy Jaroslaw Wiadomość napisana przez gary w dniu 18 gru 2013, o godz. 04:08: How does one go about preventing the tastes of one person from shaping the tastes of an art? Van Gogh couldn't sell a painting to save his life during his own time because of the prevailing taste of his era. Popularity is a factor in determining an era's tastes in art. It seems unfair to fault Segovia for accepting his popularity and using it to further his own taste. I'm sure from Segovia's point of view in promoting his own tastes he was protecting the integrity of the guitar and the music. Gary On 2013-12-17 13:13, Braig, Eugene wrote: . . . Not to mention a huge body of dedicated baroque- and romantic-era repertoire for guitar that was forgotten for generations because Segovia didn't like it and instead opted to create a body of repertoire through transcription. I don't think Segovia can be blamed for his tremendous popularity, but there is a danger in allowing the tastes of one person shape the state of an art. Respectfully, Eugene -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed
May I endorse Bruno and state academic research is a fantastic knowledge work. Making interesting music is another thing. Violinist and writer Judy Tarling has been twice in Brazil and showed us how academic research can be included into making lively, interesting music. She writes and plays upon the highest excellence standards. I am sure Hopkinson has spent his share of time learning about the musical knowledge generated by research besides being an extraordinary musician. The lute-work Bruno does here is as important to us. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 12.12.2013, às 00:26, Bruno Correia bruno.l...@gmail.com escreveu: 2013/12/11 Mayes, Joseph [1]ma...@rowan.edu Well, browse the recordings since mid seventies. Well, I was sort of fearing some push-back from the tap-dancing barefoot crowd. I don't know how you can speak for most of the lutenists out there. I certainly only meant to speak for me. No it doesn't. Lamentable only for those who didn't have the trouble to learn how to do it. Ask Hoppy, O'Dette, North, Herringman, Lislevand, Ferre, Barto (the list is too big...) and many others how to do it. It's not that difficult and the result is pure joy. Sweetness requires nails. The sound - sort of a thub, thub one achieves without them is so unsatisfying as to be lamentable. Fungus? That's pure speculation. About Sor, check his method, no research needed it's there. Tarrega played with nails until he lost them due to fungus - He convinced his late-in-life student Pujol that flesh was the way to go. Sor hated nails? I'd like to see that research. Rubish, Dolmetsch didn't study enough lute praxis and Bream wasn't a lutenist in the first place (actually he never assumed he was - this is documented in an interview). The stars do not agree entirely with themselves, but the important points remain the same. As for asking Hoppy, I think that illustrates part of the problem with the HIP folks. Because the stars do it one way - that's the right way. Bear in mind that Dolmetch and Bream, et al thought they had it right, too. I thought this list was supposedly a place to discuss lute performance practice and not each ones taste. Some people may prefer to play with nails on carbon single strings and with amplification. What does it have to do with HIP? But, as I say, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. Play any way you want to, just leave the dogma on the porch. Joseph Mayes From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Bruno Correia [[4]bruno.l...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 8:29 PM To: List LUTELIST Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed It may sound good to you, but not for most of the lutenists out there. Ask Hoppy about this issue? Ok, you don't need to ask him, after all you don't ride a horse to the gig... Hey, I'd like to do that, the traffic has been so bad nowadays. The most frequent word to describe the lute's sound is sweetness! How can you have achieve it with nails? Double strings also require that both strings be pressed at once and not one after the other. The lute is after all a sweet instrument (specially with gut). Even in classical guitar tutors (19th-20th century) the issue of nails was still rolling on. Sor hated it and only tolerated Aguado because of his great skill. That's why Tarrega and Pujol also avoided it (even if it was a requirement due to the high tension of the Torres guitar). Going back: The sources were just saying that many people were careless about their sound production. In order to avoid it, what about cutting your nails once and a while, washing your hands (daily if you can)? 2013/12/10 Mayes, Joseph [1][5]ma...@rowan.edu I play the lute, archlute and vihuela with nails for the same reason that I play the classical guitar with nails: because it sounds better! Of course, by that I mean it sounds better to me. Nails give the attack a precision that flesh does not. It also comes closer, IMHO to the sound usually described in historical sources as desirable on lute - silvery, tinkling, etc. Many sources tell us not to use nails - which they wouldn't have bothered to do if people were not doing it that way. I don't play with flesh, I don't ride my horse to the gig, and I don't attend any bear-bating. My $.02 Joseph mayes -- References 1. mailto:[6]ma...@rowan.edu To get on or off this list see list information at [7]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Bruno Figueiredo Pesquisador autonomo da pratica e interpretac,ao historicamente informada no
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed ukuleles
You may not be aware, but Aquila nylgut has conquered the ukulele world and is the standard stringing for any ukulele worth its money. Its sweet tone and characteristic decay is perfect for the ukulele sound and repertoire. It was originally developed for the lute! Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 09.12.2013, às 14:49, wayne cripps wst...@cs.dartmouth.edu escreveu: Is that the Yamaha Guitalele? Does that work as a beach/mountain instrument? Wayne Begin forwarded message: From: Dan Winheld dwinh...@lmi.net Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed Date: December 9, 2013 at 11:38:24 AM EST To: Geoff Gaherty ge...@gaherty.ca Cc: Lute Dmth lute@cs.dartmouth.edu lutekulele? Geoff- YOU WIN! On 12/9/2013 6:18 AM, Geoff Gaherty wrote: On 09/12/13 8:34 AM, William Brohinsky wrote: I own an electric guitar, and a small subset of the amazingly wide and varied tone-modifiers and other paraphernalia of electric-guitar use. And yet, I also own two acoustic 6-strings, two acoustic 12-strings, two classical guitars (admittedly, my wife brought one to the union) and a mandolin. Why ever for? I now own 10 different plucked instruments: medieval lute, renaissance lutes at a', g', and d', archlute, cittern, bandora, renaissance guitar, baroque guitar, and lutekulele. I play them all regularly, though mostly the g' renaissance and the baroque guitar (my newest toy). In my other hobby, astronomy, I own 12 telescopes. Fortunately my wife is a fabric artist, and owns half a dozen sewing machines, so she understands. Each instrument has its own function, strengths, and weaknesses. In each area we own a few high end devices, plus a variety of inexpensive experiments. In my case, the former includes custom-made telescopes and lutes, the latter includes mass-produced Chinese telescopes, Pakistani pluckies, and various homebrews. And yes, we both know that we are sick. Geoff To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed
Hi gong, I am too young to understand how important he was once upon a time, and his recordings do not fit into what I like to hear, say Hopkinson Smith and alumni. But then, we will all fade away over time... Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 06.12.2013, às 12:19, Allan Alexander guitarandl...@earthlink.net escreveu: Hi Gang, I just noticed that all the jackets of these CDs are mini reproductions of the original LP covers including the notes on the back. What an amazing collection and a truly amazing player. Allan To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed
This is a lute-talk, correct? I did not know Britten and Villa-Lobos composed for the lute, they are certainly not known for it. I know Bream played the lute, but his complete works collection is not too meaningfull for the lute today besides the historical (meaning the 1900-2000 period) rediscovery he helped forward. Generally speaking, we want to get more guitarists into the lute, not the other way around, isn't it? Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 06.12.2013, às 16:19, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com escreveu: On Dec 6, 2013, at 8:20 AM, erne...@aquila.mus.br wrote: his recordings do not fit into what I like to hear, say Hopkinson Smith and alumni. If you can direct me to Hopkinson Smith and Alumni play Britten and Villa-Lobos, I'd love to hear it. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed
This helps me understand your feelings and reactions... I feel the same about Leonhart, Hantai and Hopki. It is quite difficult for me to hear Landowska, Gould or Bream for the music itself. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 06.12.2013, às 16:06, Geoff Gaherty ge...@gaherty.ca escreveu: On 06/12/13 11:20 AM, erne...@aquila.mus.br wrote: I am too young to understand how important he was once upon a time, and his recordings do not fit into what I like to hear, say Hopkinson Smith and alumni. For a whole generation of lutenists, the first person we ever heard play the lute was Julian Bream, so he has a very special place in all our hearts. I've had several of the current generation of historically informed lutenists confess privately that they still love Bream's recordings. I feel the same way about Wanda Landowska and the harpsichord. Even if the Pleyel harpsichords she used were well on their way to evolving into the piano, her musicianship shines through. Even Glenn Gould has his place, though what he played was neither harpsichord nor piano. Geoff -- Geoff Gaherty Foxmead Observatory Coldwater, Ontario, Canada http://www.gaherty.ca http://starrynightskyevents.blogspot.com/ To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Contemporary lute music
The theorbo player with USP's small baroque orchester sent me this youtube link. It sounds interesting, but I am not specialized enough to comment. I hope you like it! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9i6dGL2DeU Tierkreis, for 12 music boxes or ensemble (1974-1975) I. Aquarius II. Pisces III. Aries IV. Taurus V. Gemini VI. Cancer VII. Leo VIII. Virgo IX. Libra X. Scorpio XI. Sagittarius XII. Capricorn Peter Söderberg Sven Åberg, lutes Karlheinz Stockhausen's Tierkreis (Zodiac) is excerpted from his 1975 work Musik im Bauch (Music in the Breast) for six percussionists and music boxes. Musik im Bauch is a musical fairy tale with stage action and minimal plot; its nostalgic naivete recalls the theater piece Herbstmusik (1974). In Tierkreis, the twelve signs of the zodiac are represented by melodies (or, more precisely, complex musical formulae expressed in several voices with specified tempos) on one of twelve music boxes. For the instrumental version of the work, Stockhausen made transcriptions of the music box melodies; a characteristic scoring includes clarinet, flute, trumpet, and piano, though any number of similar combinations is allowed. In the instrumental version(s) of the work, timbral effects, dynamics, and other parameters become part of the larger formula of each zodiac sign's music. The music itself is unexpectedly melodic, tonally centered, and even pretty in ways that are unexpected given the composer's earlier music. Stockhausen carefully considered the characteristics of each sign and each month of the year, as well as the personalities of people he knew were born under a particular sign, in composing this work. Tierkreis presages very directly the work with musical and character archetypes Stockhausen eventually undertook in his opera cycle Licht. Tierkreis is also the basis for the much more complex and extended Sirius (1977) for electronics and ensemble. [allmusic.com] Art by Milton Resnick Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 Em 21.10.2013, às 05:56, David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com escreveu: Suggest you get one of those very small camera tripods, Gorilla Pod. It's has felixible legs, so you can bend it around e.g. a music stand. David -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: general public Lute awareness
Re-refering to this thread, I just got news from the Basel Plucks - festival for lute guitar Good way to introduce more people to the lute, drawing in guitar audiences for something different (more refined, less sparky, more subtle - you name it - basically it is all about entertainement). https://www.facebook.com/baselplucks Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 On 14.08.2013, at 19:36, Mark Seifert seifertm...@att.net wrote: Dear Ron Andrico Finally got a chance to listen to your Sfumato CD while driving a couple of hundred miles through rural San Diego county and I am most impressed by what a fine piece of work it is. Best singing and fine luteplaying though newly acquired vocabulary from Master musician and recorder Dave Taylor momentarily intruded into consciousness so I imagined hearing plicky sounds without being fully aware of what that is precisely supposed to sound like. Your CDs are far better than anything I could ever produce or record. Everyone should own them. Could only appreciate it properly by sitting down in the car and taking the time to listen, though traffic was an occasional distraction. Distractions at home make such prolonged listening nearly impossible. Somehow the passing landscapes seemed good mimic backgrounds for Italy's 15-16th century! Included lots of vineyards and sunny fruit orchards with Latin names! Sorry that I never heard Millenium of Music but got excited enough by Dr. Duffin's Case-Western Univ. Micrologus broadcasts to audiotape it off the air on a number of 1980s-1990s occasions. It is impressive to hear of folks having hundreds of LPs and also comforting since I still have hundreds of audiotapes, some of which no longer play back properly. Nice to know I'm not the only collector. Made only one 1984 audiotape at my parents' home while unemployed after fleeing an LA divorce and waiting for an Ohio license. Could only dare to share it with someone as kind and good hearted as Ed Martin. Could never record video in future without the help of Dr. Taylor's instructions--what a technical as well as musical genius he is, like you! But when am I ever going to see a Savino video??? Do any other folks have hundreds of now obsolete audiotapes? Just try to find an audiotape player--dirty old ones which probably don't work can be found at Goodwill. They seem even more obsolete than the bulkier VHS tapes! Mark Seifert From: Ron Andrico praelu...@hotmail.com To: Nancy Carlin na...@nancycarlinassociates.com; William Samson willsam...@yahoo.co.uk Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Monday, August 12, 2013 12:11 PM Subject: [LUTE] Re: general public Lute awareness Please don't forget to mention Millennium of Music, the longest-running syndicated radio program featuring a broad and diverse selection of early music. The Harmonia program has a direct connection with that American early music organization, and you don't receive airplay on the program without special dispensation - no matter how much of a international radio presence you may already have. Say hello to the new face of Payola. RA Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2013 11:49:47 -0700 To: [1]willsam...@yahoo.co.uk CC: [2]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: [3]na...@nancycarlinassociates.com Subject: [LUTE] Re: general public Lute awareness There are a lot of good up and coming bands around. Take a listen to this week's Early Music Show on the BBC web site. They have a bit of music from a lot of the entries, only one of which has lute featured. The City Waites are still around and performing, especially at Christmas time in the UK. Taking a look at the groups that perform at the bigger early music series and festivals, Jordi Saval is featured a lot with various instrumental combinations. Le Poem Harmonique and Les Witches seem to be doing interesting things. What we don't have now is the record companies being the gate keepers for publicity. Back in the 70s and later this was a way to focus attention on the groups that were headed for some success and longevity. What we have now is YouTube and a bit of airplay on the radio shows we can hear on the internet (Early Music Show Harmonia). Nancy : Is it just me, or do there seem to be fewer small broken consorts around these days. Back in the 60s and 70s we had the Julian Bream Consort, The Early Music Consort of London, the Consort of Musicke, London Pro Musica, The Ely Consort, the Broadside Band, the City Waites, the Extempore String Ensemble. I am finding it hard to think of anything equivalent around today, certainly in the UK. I used to travel a long way to attend their gigs and was never disappointed - Lots of fresh music performed in ways I hadn't heard before. Always very entertaining and full of variety and played to packed houses. Have they had their day?
[LUTE] Re: Time to work on how we look?
It is easy to talk about what is not liked, any piece of art has some small detail which can be despised. Tell us what you do like, which art satisfies your soul, and we will know a lot about your taste, ideas and background. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 On 20.08.2013, at 14:52, Edward Mast nedma...@aol.com wrote: Perhaps more difficult to listen to than to watch. Ned To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] strategies to acquire more general public Lute awareness
I agree to the out-reach being needed. Would someone organize the thread-suggested strategies? The thread has put forth: Playing in town outskirts to raise attendance for a central concert. Doing house concerts with CD sales. Using internet and e-mail tools such as fanbridge. Joining period-interested people and their activities (role-playing-, theater, food and other events). Calling concert series organizers and agents. Selling CDs, DVDs, (and why not t-shirts and books) whenever you play somewhere. All these are common tools and ways to make one's music heard, and are based on hard work and organic growth. Nothing new under the sun, then? Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 On 12.08.2013, at 22:30, t...@heartistrymusic.com wrote: The lute world needs to reach out to the non-traditional audience. Thanks Stephen. I agree. Tom [Stephen] There is an interesting book by Phyllis Tickle entitled The Great Emergence. It deals with modern Christianity and how it is evolving. I think her main theme applies to the lute world as well. The 'traditionalist' or 'fundamentalist' lute group will decline, and a rise of a 'hybrid' (Phyllis had another term for this, but I've forgotten what it was) lute group will occur. If not, the lute will slowly fade away. The lute world needs to reach out to the non-traditional audience. The SCA and the followers of Sting are a prime resource that should be cultivated and encouraged. For What It's Worth The Other Stephen Stubbs Champaign, IL USA Those who desire to give up freedom in order to gain security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one. Benjamin Franklin (American Statesman, Scientist, Philosopher, Printer, Writer, and Inventor. 1706-1790) -Original Message- [Tom] Are we trying creatively to increase general audience for lute music here, or are we practicing exclusivity? I'm looking at SCA and Ren Faires solely as a group of potential music buyers. Why not encourage the interest and point it in the right direction? Tom Draughon Heartistry Music http://www.heartistrymusic.com/artists/tom.html 714 9th Avenue West Ashland, WI 54806 715-682-9362 To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: general public Lute awareness
Talking to a friend recently arrived from The Hague I heard an interesting planned strategy put into use by a recorder duo: doing a lot of small gigs in a city (small local churches, libraries, museums, community gathering spots) for a very small or no fee to collect e-mail addresses from potential concert-goers and drawing all these people to a major concert in the city center. Makes sense, and is a organized and planned mirror of how a pro pop band gets to make it. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 On 06.08.2013, at 18:49, Nancy Carlin na...@nancycarlinassociates.com wrote: On 8/6/2013 2:07 PM, R. Mattes wrote: I never meant to say that the web page would get the gig for any musician, but it is the place where people go to look up an email address to offer the concert. Also the savy presenters will be looking there to check on what kind of promo materials will be available to them (pictures that can be down loaded or linked to, a well written bio for their publicity, etc.). Actually more of the bookings come from hammering away and name recognition and connections. Here is the US a lot of that is done at some very expensive conferences such as APAP - now called Arts Presenters. We do have a number of American groups running their own concert series and some of them invite others to play in their series. Mostly I see a lot of energy going into putting on 3-4 of their own group's concerts and very little back and forth concert opportunities. You are right about the concert presenter having many options to choose between. So how can we encourage them to hire more lutes and early music? They have to know it's out there and available (and many in the US do not). And they need to be reassured that they will get an audience and not loose money. Nancy Here I have to strongly object. I think that web-pages are totally over-rated (and I _do_ have some experience with the World Wide Web). Of all the musicians I know, only one, once, got a concert because of his web page. Maybe it's totally different in the states but the idea that a concert organizer googles for a Lute player (or any other kind of musician) is absurd. You get concerts because you _know_ people (and contact them at least twice a year!). You build up networks - invite other musicians to concert series you organize and hopefuly you get invited back (oh, and you need to have at least a small concert series :-) The problem of most organizers/comitees is not having to few groups to play (and hence having to find some) - it's more often having too many I have yet to see a paper out at a lute concert where the players is collecting emails for his own mailing list. Concert promoters have a hard time getting audiences out and need all the help they can get. Musicians who help them fill the seats get booked. - the lute world seems to be made up of players of all levels, but completely empty of people who are just fans. Yes, that's sadly a phenomen the lute world shares with the guitar world. Player-only-audiences. I think it correlates with the fact that guitar-/lute players often _only_ listen to Lute/Guitar music (have a look at your lute/guitar player friends CD shelves). I prefer to dwell in the early music world where ensembles do have fan audiences. Cheers, RalfD To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Nancy Carlin Administrator THE LUTE SOCIETY OF AMERICA http://LuteSocietyofAmerica.org PO Box 6499 Concord, CA 94524 USA 925 / 686-5800 www.groundsanddivisions.info www.nancycarlinassociates.com
[LUTE] Re: general public Lute awareness
I have done the same for a small baroque orchestra at the University of Sao Paulo, USP, with little gain as well. The group has a lute and a theorbo in it. Any hints are welcome. We have thought everything from flash-mobs to pairing music with food, theater, baroque dance, text, whatever... So far our biggest hits have been opera and baroque dance, costly events which we cannot do on a regular basis due to budget size. Ernesto Ett 11-99 242120 4 11-28376692 On 31.07.2013, at 22:46, Bruno Correia bruno.l...@gmail.com wrote: Dear members of the list, I have been at pains trying to raise interest in our beloved instrument down here in Brazil. I've given speeches, played solo and chamber concerts... but despite all efforts the general public and also the musicians (professionals or amateurs) simply don't get turned on. It is a sad fact that the lute and the early music performance practice did not reach the University here. So we don't exist academically speaking. Would anybody be willing to list some strategies that could be used to help disseminate the lute and its repertoire? -- Bruno Correia Pesquisador autonomo da pratica e interpretac,ao historicamente informada no alaude e teorba. Doutor em Praticas Interpretativas pela Universidade Federal do Estado do Rio de Janeiro. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Oud as Lute?
Very sensible advice! On 01.11.2012, at 11:24, Bruno Fournier br...@estavel.org wrote: Hello A As an Oud player as well as a renaissance lute player, I would not recommend buying an Oud to play renaissance music.A It will sound awful even if you putA frets, andA you won't be able to tune it up to G ( OudsA first strings are ususally no higher than D or CA -- equivalent to second string Guitar 1st or 3rd fret)A A and you will not be able to play any of the tablature that involves anything more than single line melody. A Keep the Oud to play some medieval spanish music, Cantigas de Santa Maria, sounds great on that, or learn Arabic music.A A good approach for our western ears to Oud, is to play Sephardic jewsish music or Algerian and Moroccan Andalucian music ( no quarter tones in those styles). Anyway without frets and your western ear, you will find yourself constantly adjusting your fingers on the neck to be in pitch ( unless you are really used to hearing quarter tones...) A If you can't afford a lute, stick with a guitar tuned and a capo on third fret. will sound much better than on an Oud, we all went though this and its is well worth the wait to buy a real lute, than to play on instruments that have been modified to resemble a lute. A Bruno [1]www.estavel.org On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 8:13 AM, Christopher Wilke [2]chriswi...@yahoo.com wrote: A A Josh, A A A A You could re-sting an oud, put frets on it, and tune it as a A A pseudo-lute. I assume by lute you mean a six-course renaissance A A instrument, but there are some major drawbacks that would make it an A A impractical stand in for this. The neck is much shorter, which means A A that you won't be able to play the upper register of pieces that A A require this unless you fret a lot of (fretless) notes on the body. In A A Arabic music the oud is almost entirely used to play single line A A melodies, so the courses are closer together, which would make it A A difficult to play chords. Also, most ouds, being constructed to be A A played with a plectrum, are far more heavily built than lutes, which A A means that you won't get much benefit out of playing with period right A A hand technique. A A A A Certainly purchase the oud if you like it as an oud. It's a fun A A instrument all on it's own. Considering all the compromises needed to A A make an oud act like a lute, however, I would say a much better A A alternative is to just use a guitar if you can't afford a true lute. A A Chris A A Dr. Christopher Wilke D.M.A. A A Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer A A [3]www.christopherwilke.com A A A __ A A From: Joshua Horn [4]joshua-h...@att.net A A To: Lute Mailing List [5]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu A A Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2012 10:58 PM A A Subject: [LUTE] Oud as Lute? A A A A Hi ya'll, A A A I have an Oud that's come my way that I can afford to buy. Can an Oud A A A be made to play as a Lute?? Is there any major differences that would A A A make it impossible to play as a Lute? A A A Josh A A A + Joshua Edward Horn + A A A -- A A To get on or off this list see list information at A A [1][6]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html A A -- References A A 1. [7]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- A Bruno Cognyl-Fournier A [8]www.estavel.org A -- References 1. http://www.estavel.org/ 2. mailto:chriswi...@yahoo.com 3. http://www.christopherwilke.com/ 4. mailto:joshua-h...@att.net 5. mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu 6. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 7. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 8. http://www.estavel.org/
[LUTE] Re: Re: Le théorbe progressif de Helstroffer
if his music grows, he could be a theorbo-Hendrix (in a distant future, or more probably never)... On 24.09.2012, at 15:09, Arto Wikla wi...@cs.helsinki.fi wrote: Strange, crazy, weird, odd, freak, ..., but interesting! Thanks for the link, Bernd! :-) Arto On 24/09/12 19:51, Bernd Haegemann wrote: So, it seems that the theorbo is the Brahms of the instruments? http://sites.radiofrance.fr/francemusique/em/matin-musiciens_lundi/emission.php?e_id=6542 time to practice your latin - modern version though ;-) best regards Bernd To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Zingy strings
Why don't you give Aquila NGE a try? They are pure nylgut, long-lasting, very very budget-minded prices, and sound... my brazilian coleagues say ... almost like pure gut! I can send you some to try out if you'd like to. Write me off-list at erne...@aquila.mus.br . Em 23/05/2012, às 12:38, William Samson escreveu: Good question, David. They're very old Pyramids and although silvery in colour, it looks like silver plating on top of copper. I'd have thought that sweat and dirt might have calmed them down after all these years, but . . . :( Bill From: starb...@optonline.net starb...@optonline.net To: William Samson willsam...@yahoo.co.uk Sent: Wednesday, 23 May 2012, 16:23 Subject: Re: [BAROQUE-LUTE] Zingy strings Bill, Are you using silver or copper wound? I found that the copper wound are less zingy than the silver wound (at least on my lute). -David - Original Message - From: William Samson Date: Wednesday, May 23, 2012 10:32 am Subject: [BAROQUE-LUTE] Zingy strings To: baroque-lute mailing-list Hi, Just wondering if anybody had found a good way to take the worst of the boom and everlasting sustain out of overwound basses? Loaded gut is 'way beyond my budget, so anything that would make, say, Kuerschner or Pyramid basses a bit tamer would be helpful. I have heard about people who put a blob of Blu-tack on each string where it emerges from the bridge, but that sounds messy and unsightly. Hopefully there's a less cringe-making solution. Thanks! Bill -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- erne...@aquila.mus.br erne...@aquila.mus.br
[LUTE] Re: USA Aquila
Aquila US is going well, and Curtis is as active as ever! I have these addresses to offer you: Curtis Daily aquilastri...@gmail.com and i...@aquilausa.com Regards, Ernesto (Aquila for South America) +55-11-28376692 or +55-11-92421204 Em 07/05/2012, às 18:33, Alain escreveu: Hi everyone, Does anyone know if Aquila USA is still in business in Portland and/or if they have a new e-mail address? I used to be in contact with Curtis, but perhaps this has changed. Thanks, Alain PS: Sorry if you already received this message - I seem to be having issues sending messages to the list To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html erne...@aquila.mus.br erne...@aquila.mus.br
[BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Jim Jarmusch and baroque lute
We say he who goes out in the rain is to get wet - here I go into the rain - hopefully only water, not bullets. Regarding the posted vimeo - nice music, sounds ok to 70's-psycodelica-trained ears but to me it seems the lute is not played like a lute, has nothing to do with a lute but for actually being a lute. Could have used a paraguaian harp to the same acoustical effect. But a lute looks so good! And who would deny we see music as much as we hear it? Why is everybody sharing vimeos and youtubes and not plain .wave or .mp3 archives? Nevertheless, why not play the lute like a guitar? If one in ten guitarists/bassists who take up the lute and play it like a guitar ends up falling in love with, say, Dowland, it will turn it into having been worthwhile! They do not have to mingle with the highly educated Castiglione-cortesanos of today's oude music who play the lute reclaiming long-gone ways to make and experience music. As says Gadamer, we cannot escape doing it within our own sweet horizon. So... Jim Jarmusch, Sting, great people. They are ok! (The kids are ok, too!) We have a saying here - Propaganda é a alma do negócio, roughly meaning that advertising is the soul of any business... But maybe this Jarmusch video should not have been posted here - I would not post the uses made of the lute in christmas shopping center decoration here, as it does not belong here. What do you think? unorthodox greetings from unorthodox Brasil - Ernesto Em 12/12/2011, às 19:34, theoj89...@aol.com escreveu: Poor balance. I think they should have turned the lute amp up a little :-) -Original Message- From: Stuart Walsh s.wa...@ntlworld.com To: Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net Cc: BAROQUE-LUTE baroque-lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Mon, Dec 12, 2011 10:03 am Subject: [BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Jim Jarmusch and baroque lute On 12/12/2011 13:44, Roman Turovsky wrote: http://vimeo.com/32220565 Enjoy, RT Did you enjoy it? Stuart To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- erne...@aquila.mus.br erne...@aquila.mus.br
[LUTE] Re: who is this guy?
We have a comedian in Brazil, Juca Chaves, who plays a guitar/lute almost like that, and I have sold a set of strings to a follower of his who built a lute body with an eight-string guitar arm. They have fun making music where they play and tell stories and jokes. It all looks a lot like an entertainment from long gone past times. Em 05/12/2011, às 03:10, Christopher Stetson escreveu: Please, gentlemen, let me encourage you to be kind to what appears to be a sincere effort. Mr. Tyson could well become a fellow lutelist member. Best to all, Chris. On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 11:59 PM, Bruno Fournier [1]br...@estavel.org wrote: Sounds like all of us had it wrong all along.to think I've been playing for 35 years, seen the evolution of the lute since the 70 and have to witness this on youtubemakes Sting look like an allrightA lutenist after all! A Bruno On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 9:58 PM, Andrew White [1][2]andywh...@optusnet.com.au wrote: Is that how a lute sounds? I must be doing something wrong. -Original Message- From: [2][3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:[3][4]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Bruno Fournier Sent: Monday, 5 December 2011 1:44 PM To: [4][5]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] who is this guy? A A A anyone ever met this guy? A A A [1][5][6]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug A A A A A -- A A A Bruno Cognyl-Fournier A A A [2][6][7]www.estavel.org A A A -- References A 1. [7][8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug A 2. [8][9]http://www.estavel.org/ To get on or off this list see list information at [9][10]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- A Bruno Cognyl-Fournier A [10][11]www.estavel.org A -- References 1. mailto:[12]andywh...@optusnet.com.au 2. mailto:[13]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 3. mailto:[14]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 4. mailto:[15]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu 5. [16]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug 6. [17]http://www.estavel.org/ 7. [18]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug 8. [19]http://www.estavel.org/ 9. [20]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 10. [21]http://www.estavel.org/ -- References 1. mailto:br...@estavel.org 2. mailto:andywh...@optusnet.com.au 3. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 4. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 5. mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu 6. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug 7. http://www.estavel.org/ 8. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug 9. http://www.estavel.org/ 10. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 11. http://www.estavel.org/ 12. mailto:andywh...@optusnet.com.au 13. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 14. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 15. mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu 16. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug 17. http://www.estavel.org/ 18. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qGxpT5rug 19. http://www.estavel.org/ 20. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 21. http://www.estavel.org/ erne...@aquila.mus.br erne...@aquila.mus.br
[LUTE] Re: Savarez KF dealer in USA?
Have you tried the New Nylgut from Aquila? Lutenists here in Brazil love them! Em 09/11/2011, às 15:09, Bruno Fournier escreveu: I've always managed to order directly from Savarez.A In Canada there are no representatives for Savarez lute strings, just guitar, so they've always accepted to sell directly to me. A A Bruno On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 11:31 AM, Martin Shepherd [1]mar...@luteshop.co.uk wrote: The Savarez web site is rather vague about the density of these strings (the KF multi-coated strings from .95mm onwards) and even implies that the density is about the same as gut. A But my experience has been that they are more dense than gut, a good approximation being to use a diameter about 10% less than you would use with gut. A I have found they work quite well - on my 6c lute at the moment I have a 5th course of .95mm and a 6th of 1.25mm (both octaved). Martin On 09/11/2011 15:30, [2]theoj89...@aol.com wrote: Is there a Savarez dealer in the USA? I am looking to try the Alliance KF strings on a renaissance lute (unless members of this newsgroup warn me not to..) And how do I calculate thicknesses to order?Thanks, trj -- To get on or off this list see list information at [3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- A Bruno Cognyl-Fournier A [4]www.estavel.org A -- References 1. mailto:mar...@luteshop.co.uk 2. mailto:theoj89...@aol.com 3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 4. http://www.estavel.org/ erne...@aquila.mus.br erne...@aquila.mus.br
[LUTE] Re: tuners
Fantastic, the cleartune chromatic tuner - gives you a choice of temperaments with a chosen key, very precise and dependable, besides being handily availlable in the iphone... Em 05/08/2011, às 09:07, T.Kakinami escreveu: If you are iPhone or iPad user, Cleartune - Chromatic Tuner is available. This application allows you to set A = 392Hz. http://kakitoshilute.blogspot.com/2011/08/cleartune-chromatic-tuner.html http://www.bitcount.com/cleartune/features.html * Toshiaki Kakinami E-mail : tk...@orchid.plala.or.jp Blog : http://kakitoshilute.blogspot.com * -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Garry Warber Sent: Friday, August 05, 2011 7:16 PM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] tuners Anyone know of an electronic tuner that calibrates to a=392? My KORG does a=415, but only drops to 410... I have found a couple that allow you to calibrate some flats, which the vendor says would do the same thing, but one that calibrates to 392 would ease my suspicions. Garry -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: LuteLessons et al.
David, Thanks for posting this, fantastic! Which strings do you use? Ernesto Em 12/03/2011, às 13:55, David van Ooijen escreveu: I finally managed to upload five new Lute Lessons: www.youtube.com/lutelessons Last week, made some videos playing Hurel and De Vi'see on theorbo: www.youtube.com/luitluit And for those of you who are wondering what I do in my spare time, why, play early music, of course! Here's Landslide by Fleetwood Mac on a 19th century guitar: http://www.youtube.com/meesterdavidgitaar#p/a/u/2/WbOkltoar0s And while you're visiting, this one is kind of fun: http://www.youtube.com/meesterdavidgitaar#p/a/u/0/Gecw2Q_FJjc (wait for the surprise solo). End of shameless self-promotion. David -- *** David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com www.davidvanooijen.nl *** To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: New nylgut and KF basses
Thanks for the info, I will compare it with the values usually used by lutenists here in Brazil and let you know about the possible deviations I may find! How do you like the sound of new nylgut compared to the old nylgut ? And compared to other strings? Thanks, Ernesto Em 17/02/2011, às 17:02, Sauvage Valéry escreveu: -Message d'origine- Could you tell us your string length, string diameters tension, pitch standard? Thank you, Dan Here are the infos : Strings : NNG (new nylgut Aquila) KF (Savarez KF) Lute string length 60 cm, A 440 The references of the KF are from luthier Carlos Gonzales (Spain) and for the NNG, calcul made by luthier Wolfgang Früh, in Paris. 1: NNG 38 (too thin I think I'll try 40 next time) tension = 3.33kg 2: NNG 48 t = 2.98 kg 3: NNG 64 t = 2.97 kg 4: NNG 79 t = 2.85 5 : KF 84, NNG 52 t = 2.43 , 2.77 (I'll try to change the 84 KF by the NNG next time) 6: KF 116, NNG 70 t = 2.60, 2.82 7: KF 127, NNG 79 t = 2.47, 2.85 8: Kurchner copper KN 5185, NNG 94 t = 2.76, 2.86 (will try to change the KN by a Savarez KF, but I'm afraid it will be too big fot the bridge and peg holes ???) To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
