Re: reading battery level in sierra, and a few other things

[Chris Meredith]

Probably not the best idea in a meeting though, I expect.
> On Dec 31, 2016, at 12:00 AM, 'Peggy' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I have a Macbook Air. I didn't have a problem checking battery status until I 
> updated my mac a couple of weeks ago. I use siri to check the battery, very 
> easy to do.
> Peggy and Dixie Marie
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Dec 30, 2016, at 4:02 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> Hey everyone, going to cover a few different things in one message. First, as 
> the subject says, has anyone else had issues reading the time remaining or 
> percentage of a macbook battery in sierra? This happens on my 2010 macbook, 
> and my girl friend's 2015 macbook pro. While in the status menus, moving left 
> and right with the voiceover cursor allows you to get to the battery item, 
> but it just says battery or something similar, no time remaining or 
> percentage, this happens whether the option to show the percentage is checked 
> or not in the menu. The only way I know of to get around this is to check it 
> in the energy saver settings in system preferences. Interestingly, you can no 
> longer use the regular arrow keys to navigate the status menus, you must use 
> VO navigation. I don't mind this, actually it's more consistent this way 
> since before, the arrow keys only navigated built in items like wifi or the 
> battery, third party items such as dropbox always have required VO navigation 
> to access them.
> I can confirm that on the 2010 macbook, the same issue I had with my 2010 mac 
> mini does happen, when using Alex, speech disappears, sometimes for a few 
> seconds, sometimes completely, again, switching to a Nuance voice resolved it.
> I actually got a Christmas present for myself, a new mac mini, the issue does 
> not happen on the newer hardware. I am using a fit headless adapter connected 
> to the HDMI port, out of curiosity, I decided to disconnect it and see if 
> voiceover was as sluggish as it used to be, surprisingly, I didn't notice 
> much difference. I didn't run it this way for a long time, but I wonder if 
> Apple has finally fixed this issue for voiceover users. If not, the fit 
> headless adapter is definitely a good solution.
> 
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Re: caps lock as screen reader modifier on Windows VM?

[Chris Meredith]

FWIW, I have the same setup but use the right option key as the modifier—but 
that’s because the accent key, when shifted, means “home directory” in Unix.
> On Dec 2, 2016, at 10:31 AM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> Thanks guys. I've installed Sharp Keys, and am using the accent key as my 
> modifier. I'd prefer caps lock, but this works for now, and is supported by 
> Sierra.
> 
> --
> Alex Hall
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Nov 29, 2016, at 10:36, Andrew Lamanche > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hello,
>> 
>> I just want to add that Karabiner doesn't at present work under Sierra OS.  
>> An update is coming but we don't know when yet.  So whilst the method 
>> described in the article Rachel has kindly posted, it will not work in 
>> Sierra if you run VmWare fusion with Windows in this operating system.  It 
>> will however work in El Capitan.
>> 
>> Andrew
>>> On 29 Nov 2016, at 14:09, Rachel Feinberg >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Alex,
>>> 
>>> This article will walk you through all steps necessary to remap caps lock 
>>> to insert for use in Fusion.
>>> https://www.marcozehe.de/2015/06/07/how-to-map-your-macs-capslock-key-to-a-nvda-or-jaws-key-in-a-windows-virtual-machine/
>>>  
>>> 
>>> HTH,
>>> Rachel.
>>> 
>>> On Nov 28, 2016, at 6:29 PM, Alex Hall >> > wrote:
>>> 
 Hi all,
 I have Windows running on my MBP using Fusion. How do I get caps lock to 
 act as a modifier for NVDA? Even with VoiceOver completely off, Windows 
 doesn't seem to see the key correctly. Narrator speaks it when I press it, 
 so Windows knows about it, but NVDA just won't use it like it should. What 
 do people do to get around this problem, or is it specific to this new Pro 
 somehow? I'm using Windows 10, Fusion 8.5, and Sierra. Thanks!
 
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Re: A question about the Sonos

[Chris Meredith]

Unfortunately I’ve had zero success getting the Songs software to work on my 
Mac (haven’t tried it on my Windows VM) but, like everyone else who has 
commented so far, I do find it works splendidly on iOS—and, as it happe
> On Nov 13, 2016, at 10:34 AM, Kristeen Hughes  wrote:
> ns, Android, if that’s a thing you’re interested in at all.
> I have set it up just fine on my iPhone and all works beautifully. I 
> discovered how all settings can be accessed. My question is, can the Sonos 
> software on the Mac be accessed and used  with VO? It appears to me that it 
> can not. It all appears to be images and nothing like on the I devices. I 
> would very much like to use it from my Mac mini, but wondered if anyone has 
> done this successfully, and if so, how?
>> On Nov 13, 2016, at 3:41 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Kristine,
>> 
>> Firstly you need to setup a sonos system with your device and the sonos 
>> software on your device.
>> 
>> The software gives you two options,
>> A sonos system with bridge or a sonos system with or to your home wifi 
>> network.
>> 
>> 
>> It then takes you through a few steps which pair the player 5 with the 
>> system.
>> 
>> Have you managed to do this as yet?
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Kristeen Hughes
>> Sent: Sunday, 13 November 2016 3:10 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: A question about the Sonos
>> 
>> I just got a Sonos Player: 5. I have installed the Sonos software, but it 
>> seems very visual and I can do nothing with it. It appears to have added my 
>> music, but all I see are images and I’m wondering how to actually make it 
>> work. It is testing my stupidity levels right now and finding them high.
>> 
>> Kristeen
>> 
>> 
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Java Applications Accessibility Issue

[Chris Meredith]

Hey all.

Not sure if anyone can confirm this, but I seem to be hitting an issue with 
Java applications that use either the tree view (browser) or table controls.  
Since my company is standardizing on JMeter, which uses a browser control to 
display test plans and a table to show test results, this is a problem, as 
VoiceOver seems to render these controls with no content.  So far, the only 
solution I’ve found is to run pretty much any Java app that uses these controls 
under a Windows VM.  Anyone else ever hit this issue?

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Re: Looking for Slack feedback from voiceover users on OSX and IOS

[Chris Meredith]

One thing that I’ve found helps with Slack is to set the VO modifiers to allow 
caps lock as an option.  My guess is that some sort of keyDown event gets fired 
whenever any key that would register does so (I.e. Option, particularly since 
it can be used to type extended characters), and pops focus into the input 
field.  Caps lock is handled entirely by the OS (illustrated nicely by how many 
hoops we have to jump through to pass that key to VMware Fusion), and is thus 
not intercepted by Slack.
Find is your friend.  Search for “new messages since” to find the date of the 
last message, then search backward for that date to read what went on in your 
absence.  One thing I can’t seem to do is close the pop-up windows such as, for 
instance, the search box, short of closing and reopening the app.  If Slack are 
engaging in public discourse with their blind users, I’d love to chime in, 
since Slack seems to be part of my complete breakfast set of 
tools I need at my employer.
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 9:19 AM, michael babcock  
> wrote:
> 
> So hears how I’m using the desktop app:
> #1, try not to tap “Option” (that jumps focus back to edit box). I know kinda 
> hard when using voiceover…
> #2, use find for the text “esc” and that will take you to the end of the 
> conversation (channel) your in.
> #3, use command+option+left or right to jump between conversations you’ve 
> opened since that instance of the app has been running.
> Let me know if I can help any more :( and I hope they make it more 
> accessible. Love the concept of it, and am actively using it with a VA out of 
> India, so would love to have it working.
> VOIP quality IMO is fairly good.
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 2:29 AM, Simon Fogarty > > wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks Michael,
>>  
>> I’ll go check this out , it might be worthwhile.
>>  
>> If only the desktop apps were more accessible, I’ll probanly have to use my 
>> iPhone.
>>  
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>  ] On Behalf Of michael babcock
>> Sent: Tuesday, 12 July 2016 5:05 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> Subject: Re: Looking for Slack feedback from voiceover users on OSX and IOS
>>  
>> Simon:
>> Thanks for your message.
>> Slack has created a #a11y organization, and they seem to be making things 
>> better. I’ll post one of the messages I got from the team a few hours ago:
>> "Hi Michael,
>> Thanks for coming back to me. Yes, there is an existing team that the 
>> accessibility community has created. This is a broad, public team on Slack 
>> with the goal of collaborating on accessibility solutions, technologies, 
>> etc. The current membership is already substantial and includes some of our 
>> engineers and folks from our accessibility team. Please feel free to share 
>> this with anyone who is interested.
>> 
>> Here's the link to request an invite: http://web-a11y.herokuapp.com 
>> .
>> 
>> “
>> And this was a follow-up to this message:
>> "Bel (Slack)
>> Jul 9, 9:32 PM PDT 
>> 
>> Hey there Michael,
>> 
>> Thanks for getting in touch! We would love to hear all your suggestions on 
>> how we might improve the user experience for blind users.
>> 
>> Accessibility is something we are working very hard to improve and our 
>> dedicated accessibility team are currently working on more features for our 
>> vision-impaired users. Please do let us know what your initial thoughts are 
>> on your experience and I will get our team involved from this side too.
>> 
>> Thanks for taking the time to offer your help and feedback on this Michael, 
>> your insights are really valuable to our development.
>> 
>> Warmly,
>> 
>> -Bel"
>> 
>> Hit up @slackhq
>> And type 
>> /feedback your feedback here
>> In any of the edit boxes on slack
>> Note: in desktop app on Mac, hitting the option key seems to jump focus back 
>> to the edit box, kinda makes things hard when using voiceover :)
>>  
>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 12:02 AM, Simon Fogarty > > wrote:
>>  
>> Hi Michael,
>>  
>> Thanks for this, I will definitely be looking into this.
>>  
>> We’ve just started using slack at work for our messaging system as it’s not 
>> hosted locally therefore if systems go down we can still communicate with 
>> our teams nationwide.
>>  
>> I have only been able to get it to work somewhat accessible on my iPhone but 
>> mac osx and windows desktop clients are pretty much crap accessibility 
>> So thanks this will be helpful.
>>  
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>  ] On Behalf Of Michael Babcock
>> Sent: Monday, 11 July 2016 2:08 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> Subject: Loo

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Chris Meredith]

Half a sec.  You lose points on the immigration scale for New Zealand if you’re 
blind?  The mind boggles just a bit.
> On Jul 16, 2016, at 5:32 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most 
> blind people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just 
> want to come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed 
> to match the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed 
> to prove I could live independently. It would have been been much easier had 
> I married a Kiwi.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> 
>> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters 
>> degree?
>> 
>> I can't believe that.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
>> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
>> tech world at only 22
>> 
>> Scott,
>> 
>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>> 
>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>> the C- GPA drag.
>> 
>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
>> which I graduated from when I was 27).
>> 
>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
>> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am 
>> blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding 
>> of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US 
>> is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and 
>> entered an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I 
>> graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate 
>> accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 
>> 40.
>> 
>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
>> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
>> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree 
>>> so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>>> 
>>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>>> through and do well in college.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
 
 I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
 into a college life, meet new people.
 Vaughn
 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> Hi Donna and Devin,
> 
> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
> other people from all walks of life.
> 
> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
> into a group living situation.
> 
> 
> 
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
> world at only 22
> 
> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
> 
> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like 
> to
> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting 
> point.
> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for

Re: Adobe Reader DC

[Chris Meredith]

Ah—I can pretty much guarantee that the file won’t be properly labelled.  I was 
actually using the form SS-5 as a “known case”, where I knew things should work 
as expected.  The form I need to fill out is something for my 401(k) plan, 
where the PDFs may not be adequately labeled.
If it makes a difference, I was running PDFPen as a demo, but I don’t THINK 
that should make a difference, since the only thing it claims is different 
about the demo is that export functionality is broken and it stamps a smile 
logo on the PDF if you save it.
> On Jun 26, 2016, at 2:54 PM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I use PDFPenPro to fill out forms quite a bit.  Try pressing tab to go 
> through the document and see how it goes.  Of course, it totally depends on 
> how good the creator of the fillable pdf did at labelling.  Most pdf making 
> people don't bother taking the time to label the fields and such, thus making 
> it not particularly useful to us screen reader users.  Not sure how proper 
> those forms from your Social Security people are, but you'd hope that a 
> government operation would do a better job.
> 
> Later...
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
> On Jun 26, 2016, at 12:36, Chris Meredith  wrote:
> 
> Half a sec.  Can you fill out forms with PDF Pen?  I tried downloading a form 
> from the Social Security Administration and PDF Pen failed to recognize the 
> fields.  Or, more correctly, VoiceOver failed to recognize that PDF Pen 
> recognized the fields.
>> On Jun 26, 2016, at 2:03 PM, christopher hallsworth 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> That’s not a showstopper for me. I simply select all the text in the PDF, 
>> copy, and paste into a blank Textedit document. Doesn’t work? Then it’s 
>> PDFPen to the rescue which, amongst other things, has the ability to OCR 
>> those dreaded scanned documents into readable text.
>>> On 26 Jun 2016, at 06:45, jaan ali  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, if you talking about the Mac then the same thing happened with me as 
>>> well
>>> I am very disappointed with the PDF with Mac so that's why I'm using 
>>> Windows only for this purpose
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> DISCLAIMER:
>>> "The information contained in this message is confidential and may be 
>>> protected by legal privilege. It is intended only for 
>>> the person(s) named as addressee. The dissemination, distribution,copying 
>>> or disclosure of this message, or its contents is 
>>> strictly prohibited unless authorized by the sender. If you have received 
>>> this message in error, please notify to the sender at the above address and 
>>> delete the email."
>>> 
>>> On Jun 26, 2016, at 12:35 AM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hey folks,
>>>> 
>>>> So I downloaded Adobe Reader DC, confident* in its ability to allow access 
>>>> to PDF files using VoiceOver.  Upon selecting a PDF, I was dropped into, 
>>>> astoundingly enough, an accessible view of the document.  Now, here’s the 
>>>> good bit—when I moved out of that accessible area, I was completely unable 
>>>> to get back to the document.  Did Acrobat actually design things such that 
>>>> you have only one chance at viewing your PDF document, or am I making some 
>>>> sort of newbie error?
>>>> 
>>>> * For suitably small values of “confident”.  Actually not confident at all.
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>>> Visionaries list.
>>>> 
>>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or 
>>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
>>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>>> 
>>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>>> 
>>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>>>> --- 
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>>>> Visit this group at https://gr

Re: Adobe Reader DC

[Chris Meredith]

Half a sec.  Can you fill out forms with PDF Pen?  I tried downloading a form 
from the Social Security Administration and PDF Pen failed to recognize the 
fields.  Or, more correctly, VoiceOver failed to recognize that PDF Pen 
recognized the fields.
> On Jun 26, 2016, at 2:03 PM, christopher hallsworth  
> wrote:
> 
> That’s not a showstopper for me. I simply select all the text in the PDF, 
> copy, and paste into a blank Textedit document. Doesn’t work? Then it’s 
> PDFPen to the rescue which, amongst other things, has the ability to OCR 
> those dreaded scanned documents into readable text.
>> On 26 Jun 2016, at 06:45, jaan ali  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, if you talking about the Mac then the same thing happened with me as well
>> I am very disappointed with the PDF with Mac so that's why I'm using Windows 
>> only for this purpose
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> DISCLAIMER:
>> "The information contained in this message is confidential and may be 
>> protected by legal privilege. It is intended only for 
>> the person(s) named as addressee. The dissemination, distribution,copying or 
>> disclosure of this message, or its contents is 
>> strictly prohibited unless authorized by the sender. If you have received 
>> this message in error, please notify to the sender at the above address and 
>> delete the email."
>> 
>> On Jun 26, 2016, at 12:35 AM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hey folks,
>>> 
>>> So I downloaded Adobe Reader DC, confident* in its ability to allow access 
>>> to PDF files using VoiceOver.  Upon selecting a PDF, I was dropped into, 
>>> astoundingly enough, an accessible view of the document.  Now, here’s the 
>>> good bit—when I moved out of that accessible area, I was completely unable 
>>> to get back to the document.  Did Acrobat actually design things such that 
>>> you have only one chance at viewing your PDF document, or am I making some 
>>> sort of newbie error?
>>> 
>>> * For suitably small values of “confident”.  Actually not confident at all.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>>> --- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact t

Re: Adobe Reader DC

[Chris Meredith]

Yes.  I even tried setting a hotspot on the PDF’s contents, which then 
registered as inactive if I moved the VoiceOver focus outside the PDF content.  
As someone who’s worked in software QA for years now, I can honestly say that 
Adobe should be full of shame for letting that problem get past QA.  Time to 
spin up a Windows VM, I guess.
> On Jun 26, 2016, at 1:45 AM, jaan ali  wrote:
> 
> Hi, if you talking about the Mac then the same thing happened with me as well
> I am very disappointed with the PDF with Mac so that's why I'm using Windows 
> only for this purpose
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> DISCLAIMER:
> "The information contained in this message is confidential and may be 
> protected by legal privilege. It is intended only for 
> the person(s) named as addressee. The dissemination, distribution,copying or 
> disclosure of this message, or its contents is 
> strictly prohibited unless authorized by the sender. If you have received 
> this message in error, please notify to the sender at the above address and 
> delete the email."
> 
> On Jun 26, 2016, at 12:35 AM, Chris Meredith  <mailto:talli...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
>> Hey folks,
>> 
>> So I downloaded Adobe Reader DC, confident* in its ability to allow access 
>> to PDF files using VoiceOver.  Upon selecting a PDF, I was dropped into, 
>> astoundingly enough, an accessible view of the document.  Now, here’s the 
>> good bit—when I moved out of that accessible area, I was completely unable 
>> to get back to the document.  Did Acrobat actually design things such that 
>> you have only one chance at viewing your PDF document, or am I making some 
>> sort of newbie error?
>> 
>> * For suitably small values of “confident”.  Actually not confident at all.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com 
>> <mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com>
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ 
>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/>
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
>> <mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>.
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>> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries 
>> <https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout 
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>.
> 
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
>  
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>  
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>  
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ 
> <http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/>
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
> <mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>.
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> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries 
> <https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout 
> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or con

Adobe Reader DC

[Chris Meredith]

Hey folks,

So I downloaded Adobe Reader DC, confident* in its ability to allow access to 
PDF files using VoiceOver.  Upon selecting a PDF, I was dropped into, 
astoundingly enough, an accessible view of the document.  Now, here’s the good 
bit—when I moved out of that accessible area, I was completely unable to get 
back to the document.  Did Acrobat actually design things such that you have 
only one chance at viewing your PDF document, or am I making some sort of 
newbie error?

* For suitably small values of “confident”.  Actually not confident at all.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara Quinn 
- you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?

[Chris Meredith]

Oh.  With FileVault, you first boot into the recovery partition.  Whilst 
Command+F5 gets you something that talks you through the prompts and calls 
itself VoiceOver, it’s likely a set of canned sound samples (remember, you’re 
only being prompted for your username and password, so you don’t necessarily 
need the ability to speak dynamic text here).  This to say, Siri, if it were in 
OS X 10.next, is likely not running on the recovery partition, and you’d likely 
need to find another way to Command+F5 your way into the more accessible login 
interface for FileVault users.
> On Jun 11, 2016, at 7:57 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland  
> wrote:
> 
> What do you mean?  I don't follow your logic, no pun intended.  Sorry bout 
> that.
> ---
> Christopher Gilland
> JAWS Certified, 2016.
> Training Instructor.
>  
> clgillan...@gmail.com <mailto:clgillan...@gmail.com>
> Phone: (704) 256-8010.
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: Chris Meredith <mailto:talli...@gmail.com>
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2016 4:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?
>> 
>> Although that wouldn’t solve the issue for those of us with FileVault 
>> enabled.
>>> On Jun 10, 2016, at 10:47 PM, Simon Fogarty >> <mailto:si...@blinky-net.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hey what about the rumour that the new apple notebooks are going to have 
>>> this touch bar but also siri which will allow you to turn voiceover on by 
>>> just saying hey siri!
>>> Wont that be great.
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>>  <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>] On Behalf Of Alex Hall
>>> Sent: Saturday, 11 June 2016 1:07 PM
>>> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries >> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>>
>>> Subject: Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?
>>> I've tried to stay away from all the speculative threads, but I wanted to 
>>> remind everyone that this isn't Apple's first rodeo. Plus, this is all over 
>>> rumors, backed up by a few images; we have no real idea what will happen in 
>>> the future. What if this is all false, and it doesn't happen? What if this 
>>> bar has taptic feedback, so that touching it simulates touching keys? What 
>>> if the keys are there, but each is a screen instead of plastic?
>>> But let's assume the worst: a smooth, glass surface that provides no 
>>> feedback when touched, unless VoiceOver is on. Why the automatic 
>>> assumptions that Apple will forget about VoiceOver? Remember the rumors 
>>> that flew when the Apple Watch was presented, and didn't use its internal 
>>> speaker on stage? People jumped to the conclusion that it lacked such a 
>>> speaker and thus would be totally inaccessible. The Watch on my wrist tells 
>>> me that was a false alarm. Or when, you know, Apple pretty much invented 
>>> screen-reading on a device with no buttons, in the iPod Touch and then 
>>> iPhone? Or when it included great VoiceOver features in the (smooth and 
>>> featureless) glass of the Apple TV 4 remote? Or when it made sure that 
>>> there was some form of audible feedback when booting into an encrypted 
>>> system, even though VoiceOver couldn't be used at the login prompts?
>>> But let's throw out history and assume Apple does the thing some people 
>>> think they will: they make this Mac, and don't include any way of toggling 
>>> VoiceOver on. No simple trackpad gesture, no holding the command key and 
>>> tapping twice anywhere on the bar, nothing whatsoever. In that incredibly 
>>> unlikely case, you simply don't buy the newest Mac until a software update 
>>> fixes the problem. I really don't understand the negativity here, is all 
>>> I'm saying.
>>>> On Jun 10, 2016, at 18:09, Daniel Miller >>> <mailto:miller...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>> If they replace the function keys with the touch sensitive bar,I  along 
>>>> with probably most of this list will lose a lot of respect for them as a 
>>>> company. I understand that they're supposed to integrate touch ID into 
>>>> this bar, but there are several other places on the machine itself or 
>>>> touch ID could be integrated without having to lose physical function 
>>>> keys. I have a feeling the Tim Cook le

Re: Hosting a website on a Mac Mini?

[Chris Meredith]

Can I assume they give you full root and ssh access to your virtual server?
> On Jun 11, 2016, at 11:13 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
>  wrote:
> 
> Wonderful!  Glad you got set up.  Watch how quick they respond to your 
> ticket!  I think you'll be incredibly impressed.
> ---
> Christopher Gilland
> JAWS Certified, 2016.
> Training Instructor.
>  
> clgillan...@gmail.com 
> Phone: (704) 256-8010.
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: Alex Hall 
>> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
>> 
>> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2016 11:06 PM
>> Subject: Re: Hosting a website on a Mac Mini?
>> 
>> Thanks guys. I went ahead and signed up with them a couple hours ago, and I 
>> have to agree that it's been quite easy. The only problem was that my card 
>> wasn't accepted because they don't support that bank, but VO didn't detect 
>> the popup displaying the problem so I had to open a ticket with them. Other 
>> than that, things have worked well. My domain is hosted with GoDaddy, and 
>> the difference is incredible. Digital Ocean is easy to navigate and use, 
>> while GD is absolutely terrible. You can use it, but it's not intuitive, and 
>> it's often quite frustrating. There's a pun to be made about the shortcut I 
>> used for GoDaddy's name, but I'll leave that pun un-made. Fill it in in your 
>> own minds.
>>> On Jun 11, 2016, at 23:01, Christopher-Mark Gilland >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I use them all the freaking time, and swear, and I do mean, swear! by them!
>>>  
>>> Accessibility is steller on their web site.  So much so, that when I wrote 
>>> them to commend them, they told me flat out that they were 100% commited to 
>>> following W3C standard, and following all accessibility guidelines.  They 
>>> even went so far to say if anything breaks, tell them, and it'll be fixed 
>>> before a blink of an eye.
>>>  
>>> They have absolutely never done me wrong, and are absolutely a pleasure and 
>>> a half to work with.
>>>  
>>> I would strongly strongly recommend them!
>>>  
>>> Here's a link you can use to sign up, and get $10.00 of free credit when 
>>> doing so.
>>>  
>>> http://mandrillapp.com/track/click/30270081/cloud.digitalocean.com?p=eyJzIjoiOW15SHlHMHlQS0VPR2FFSGxsN2lqMVdDcHRVIiwidiI6MSwicCI6IntcInVcIjozMDI3MDA4MSxcInZcIjoxLFwidXJsXCI6XCJodHRwczpcXFwvXFxcL2Nsb3VkLmRpZ2l0YWxvY2Vhbi5jb21cXFwvYWNjZXB0P2NvZGU9ZDI2N2FhZmFjY2
>>>  
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Note, this link should work for anyone, but if it doesn't, then let me know.
>>> ---
>>> Christopher Gilland
>>> JAWS Certified, 2016.
>>> Training Instructor.
>>>  
>>> clgillan...@gmail.com 
>>> Phone: (704) 256-8010.
 - Original Message - 
 From: Alex Hall 
 To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
 
 Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2016 8:58 PM
 Subject: Re: Hosting a website on a Mac Mini?
 
 I didn't realize Digital Ocean was that cheap. If you, or anyone, has used 
 them before, do the web interface and other aspects work with VO/Safari? 
 Any accessibility things I need to know about? It's an ongoing cost, but 
 it's small, and I don't have to worry about firewalls, ports, or other 
 security setup and concerns.
> On Jun 11, 2016, at 13:47, Scott Granados  > wrote:
> 
> So I wouldn’t do this unless it’s a dedicated machine.  You can do things 
> to limit your exposure but the fact is if you have the server on the 
> public internet and your personal data is in it then it’s exposed.  You 
> really should keep them separate.  That being said if you want to do it, 
> there’s a few ways to go.
> You’ll need some sort of server OS.  Mac offers this but I might run a 
> linux variant in a virtual machine and map the external to internal IP as 
> you normally would.  This lets you run in an isolated image making it 
> more challenging (not impossible) for a hacker to get outside the VM.
> Personally, if I were going to do this project I’d go to 
> www.digitalocean.com 
> and rent a virtual server.  They start as low as $5 per month and if 
> things get really out of hand or compromised you just destroy the droplet 
> (virtual machine) and build a new one.  There’s lots of ways to do what 
> you want to do though.  Let me know if that helps or if you want more 
> specifics answered.
> Thanks
> From:  > on behalf of Alex Hall 
> mailto:mehg...@icloud.com>>

Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?

[Chris Meredith]

With all due respect, sir, there WAS a significant amount of negativity in this 
thread, which definitely took the tone of the age old song that blind people 
are always left out, and ZOMG this may happen again.  I’m pretty sure it was 
the present Apple CEO that pointed out that, when they consider accessibility 
of their products as pertains the blind, they “don’t care about the bloody 
ROI”.  I come from a staunch Windows background (I even worked on the Windows 
team at the folks in Redmond), pretty sure that you needed hooks that 
penetrated deep into the operating system to ever get accessibility right, 
because the designers of mainstream software didn’t, generally speaking, care 
one way or another.  It’s taken a year or seven, but I’m at least mostly 
convinced that Apple mostly gets it, although I do feel like more attention is 
paid to access on iOS than OS X (El Capitan is the first operating system build 
I’ve seen where a lot of the VoiceOver sluggishness has gone away, and it’s 
only been recent builds of Xcode’s Interface Builder that have worked with 
VoiceOver at all).  Whilst I feel like we have a way to go, and whilst I feel 
like a certain amount of accessibility parity may be prevented by other 
players’ tendency to “litigate, not innovate”, the state of accessibility of 
Apple products, at least in my limited view, has trended upwards in the last 
ten years, inasmuch as I can now do all of my work on my company’s Macs, 
although Slack still sometimes requires me to fail over to a Windows VM, and 
Chrome + ChromeVox + Macintosh is still a bit less than optimal where Google 
Apps are concerned (which may also be user error on my part).  Also, as far as 
tantrums, again from the limited amount of time I’ve lurked on this list, I 
would perhaps take a look at your own glass house before throwing stones.  
Perhaps my opinion is colored by the fact that I tend to agree with Mr. 
Granados’ assessment of the general tone taken by many in the Blind Community®, 
and his seeming jadedness with the “change is bad because it leaves us out in 
the cold” mentality, I seem to recall at least a few … less than civil … 
exchanges of which you’ve been a part, and definitely your statements 
purporting gloom and doom about this potential design change that may not even 
happen definitely outnumber any statements you’ve made allowing for the 
contrary.
> On Jun 11, 2016, at 12:09 AM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
>  wrote:
> 
> Scott,
> 
> With all due respect, I hope your little tantrom has made you feel better.
> 
> You're out of line!  We're not saying it's going to definitely be a problem. 
> Quit putting proverbial words in our mouths.  We're only stating it could! be 
> a problem.  Key word:  could! be a problem.  We never once said Apple 
> wouldn't come up with a work around.  If we did, then point me to the mail 
> that specifically said this, and then I'll profusely apologize.
> ---
> Christopher Gilland
> JAWS Certified, 2016.
> Training Instructor.
> 
> clgillan...@gmail.com
> Phone: (704) 256-8010.
> - Original Message - From: "Scott Granados" 
> To: 
> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 10:53 PM
> Subject: Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?
> 
> 
> Oh here we go, they haven’t released it yet and you’re all already bitchng 
> about it.
> 
> How many people did I hear piss and moan years ago when touch screens came 
> out.  Oh I must have a physical keyboard.  Phones will be inaccessible with 
> out physical keyboards, I need to have a screen reader to install in my phone 
> to use with my physical keyboard.  Then bam, Apple releases the iphone and 
> here we are all using touch screens.
> Then people bitched about the loss of the old multi pin connector in place of 
> the lightning and it hasn’t even happened yet but people cry about the loss 
> of the headphone jack and now this touch bar.  Stop it already.  Unless 
> you’ve used one you can’t comment with any degree of meaning on whether it’s 
> any good or not.  Let the product come out, let people review it first or 
> jump in like some of us do but try it before you bash it.  With the line of 
> thinking on this list sometimes we’d all still be using holes punched in 
> paper and an abacus trying to get jobs at Google.  An the first person who 
> says the abacus is better than a scientific calculator or beads are our 
> friends or what ever gets smacked about the head and shoulders with a trout 
> until they stop.:)
> 
> I’m tired of it.  IF you want to be luddites that’s fine and your choice but 
> come on, the same old tune is getting old.  Ihave a PDP-11 taking up space if 
> anyone wants it to get off the progress band wagon.
> 
> 
> On 6/10/16, 6:09 PM, "Daniel Miller"  behalf of miller...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> If they replace the function keys with the touch sensitive bar,I  along with 
>> probably most of this list will lose a lot of respect for them as a company. 
>> I understand that they're supposed to integ

Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?

[Chris Meredith]

Although that wouldn’t solve the issue for those of us with FileVault enabled.
> On Jun 10, 2016, at 10:47 PM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Hey what about the rumour that the new apple notebooks are going to have this 
> touch bar but also siri which will allow you to turn voiceover on by just 
> saying hey siri!
>  
> Wont that be great.
>  
>  
>  
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>  ] On Behalf Of Alex Hall
> Sent: Saturday, 11 June 2016 1:07 PM
> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries  >
> Subject: Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?
>  
> I've tried to stay away from all the speculative threads, but I wanted to 
> remind everyone that this isn't Apple's first rodeo. Plus, this is all over 
> rumors, backed up by a few images; we have no real idea what will happen in 
> the future. What if this is all false, and it doesn't happen? What if this 
> bar has taptic feedback, so that touching it simulates touching keys? What if 
> the keys are there, but each is a screen instead of plastic?
>  
> But let's assume the worst: a smooth, glass surface that provides no feedback 
> when touched, unless VoiceOver is on. Why the automatic assumptions that 
> Apple will forget about VoiceOver? Remember the rumors that flew when the 
> Apple Watch was presented, and didn't use its internal speaker on stage? 
> People jumped to the conclusion that it lacked such a speaker and thus would 
> be totally inaccessible. The Watch on my wrist tells me that was a false 
> alarm. Or when, you know, Apple pretty much invented screen-reading on a 
> device with no buttons, in the iPod Touch and then iPhone? Or when it 
> included great VoiceOver features in the (smooth and featureless) glass of 
> the Apple TV 4 remote? Or when it made sure that there was some form of 
> audible feedback when booting into an encrypted system, even though VoiceOver 
> couldn't be used at the login prompts?
>  
> But let's throw out history and assume Apple does the thing some people think 
> they will: they make this Mac, and don't include any way of toggling 
> VoiceOver on. No simple trackpad gesture, no holding the command key and 
> tapping twice anywhere on the bar, nothing whatsoever. In that incredibly 
> unlikely case, you simply don't buy the newest Mac until a software update 
> fixes the problem. I really don't understand the negativity here, is all I'm 
> saying.
> On Jun 10, 2016, at 18:09, Daniel Miller  > wrote:
>  
> If they replace the function keys with the touch sensitive bar,I  along with 
> probably most of this list will lose a lot of respect for them as a company. 
> I understand that they're supposed to integrate touch ID into this bar, but 
> there are several other places on the machine itself or touch ID could be 
> integrated without having to lose physical function keys. I have a feeling 
> the Tim Cook led Apple  is valuing form over function, which for people with 
> disabilities, isn't always the best idea. Lenovo attempted this no function 
> key idea with one of their machines, and guess what? It absolutely bombed, 
> even for people that did not have a disability.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6S Plus
> 
> 
> On Jun 10, 2016, at 6:00 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland  > wrote:
> 
> Honestly, totally agreed.
> ---
> Christopher Gilland
> JAWS Certified, 2016.
> Training Instructor.
> 
> clgillan...@gmail.com 
> Phone: (704) 256-8010.
> - Original Message - From: "Daniel Miller"  >
> To: mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>>
> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 5:57 PM
> Subject: Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?
> 
> 
> I think the touch bar is stupid, enough said.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6S Plus
> 
> 
> On Jun 10, 2016, at 5:01 PM, Ray Foret jr  > wrote:
> 
> Hi there,
> 
> Rumor has it that the soon forth coming Mac book pros will feature a touch 
> bar instead of function keys on the keyboard.  This raises an interesting 
> question.  Assuming that Voice Over is turned off on any one of the new Mac 
> book Pros that a blind user goes up to, how is a blind person supposed to 
> turn on Voice Over if there are no physical function keys but instead a touch 
> bar?  I think maybe I can guess.  If a blind person needs to turn on Voice 
> OVer, it should be possible by pressing VO+touch anyware on the bar and that 
> should do it.  Or else, triple tap the bar to turn Voice OVer on. I can 
> almost imagine the e-mails now.
> 
> 
> Sent from my Mac, The only computer with full accessibility for the blind 
> built-in
> 
> Sincerely, The Constantly Barefooted Ray
> Still a very happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone6+ and Apple TV user!
> 
> -- 
> The following information 

Re: bar instead of function keys on new Mac Book Pros?

[Chris Meredith]

Could be that, could be a tactile marking above F5, could be any number of 
ways.  Unless you’re thinking that the bar won’t be divided up into segments 
that replace the function keys?
One question though—where are you hearing these rumors?
> On Jun 10, 2016, at 5:01 PM, Ray Foret jr  wrote:
> 
> Hi there,
> 
> Rumor has it that the soon forth coming Mac book pros will feature a touch 
> bar instead of function keys on the keyboard.  This raises an interesting 
> question.  Assuming that Voice Over is turned off on any one of the new Mac 
> book Pros that a blind user goes up to, how is a blind person supposed to 
> turn on Voice Over if there are no physical function keys but instead a touch 
> bar?  I think maybe I can guess.  If a blind person needs to turn on Voice 
> OVer, it should be possible by pressing VO+touch anyware on the bar and that 
> should do it.  Or else, triple tap the bar to turn Voice OVer on.  I can 
> almost imagine the e-mails now.
> 
> 
> Sent from my Mac, The only computer with full accessibility for the blind 
> built-in
> 
> Sincerely, The Constantly Barefooted Ray
> Still a very happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone6+ and Apple TV user!
> 
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Selecting text in Terminal

[Chris Meredith]

Hey gang.

Is this even possible?  There are times when I want to copy and paste various 
terminal outputs into either email or Slack chats (my company lives in Slack 
and spends most of its life in the Unix shell), and I can’t seem to find a way 
to bend VoiceOver to my will on this one.  So far my only workaround is to add 
“2>&1 | mate” to the command, piping its output to TextMate, which is a bit of 
a discomfort in the area immediately surrounding the digestive exit aperture, 
if you follow me.  Is there a better way?

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Re: VO says busy

[Chris Meredith]

I found that a lot of those issues seemed to disappear with the upgrade to
El Capitan.  If thats an option, I highly recommend it.

On Sat, Jan 30, 2016 at 11:52 AM, Sarai Bucciarelli <
sarai.bucciare...@gmail.com> wrote:

> VO keeps saying busy messages using Safari. any fix for this? I’m running
> Yosimidi on a MBP 2010.
> Sarai D. Bucciarelli www.linkedin.com/in/SaraiDBucciarelli
>
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Re: Keyboard shortcuts broken after VMware's remote support

[Chris Meredith]

A little late to the party on this one, but I can reproduce the issue of being 
stuck in the VMware chrome pretty much EVERY! TIME! on my Windows VM (my job 
uses Slack for team communications, and Slack on anything other than Windows 
apparently may cause pain, nausea or death).
On only a partially related note, how the deuce does anyone get their ORCA key 
to map to anything?  I use SharpKeys to emulate the caps lock key in Windows, 
but am curious what folks use for Orca under Linux.
> On Jan 18, 2016, at 4:30 PM, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Sabahattin:
> 
> You're correct, and I'll follow through on this. I know I did some
> mappings via the VMware settings menus. But I can no longer say whether
> that was all the mapping I did. In other words, I did have Karabiner
> installed, and it's very likely some mappings came via that app. It's
> temporarily off my Mac because it wasn't successfully auto updating.
> I'll put it back and see whether that helps.
> 
> My biggest problem with the apparent difference is that I can't reliably
> access the vm. It used to be that I could release the mouse with
> Option+Command and tab into the vm. I could even right arrow past Unity
> and end up in the vm. None of that is working.
> 
> So, back to the drawing board and the debug process of walking all the
> configuration steps. In truth I don't know whether VMware support broke
> things, or whether the upgrade broke them. All I really know is that it
> isn't behaving as before. 
> 
> Thanks again for the suggestion.
> 
> Janina
> 
> Sabahattin Gucukoglu writes:
>> Hi Janina,
>> 
>> How did you set up your keyboard shortcuts to start with.  System 
>> Preferences?  Have you tried looking in there again?
>> 
>> I actually can’t imagine any situation in which a remote support tool would 
>> reset the keyboard shortcuts you manually set, but I’m curious to know how 
>> you think they were set originally.  Unless your remote support person 
>> helpfully reset them all for you, which I imagine is entirely possible—in 
>> that case, of course, your mappings would be lost and you would need to 
>> reset them all to your preferences again.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Sabahattin
>> 
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> -- 
> 
> Janina Sajka, Phone:  +1.443.300.2200
>   sip:jan...@asterisk.rednote.net
>   Email:  jan...@rednote.net
> 
> Linux Foundation Fellow
> Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup: http://a11y.org
> 
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures  http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> 
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Re: Why do I want an Airport router?

[Chris Meredith]

Did Time Warner give you the router that supports 802.11AC?  If not, they 
should have.
For my part, and I run Macs, PCs, a Chromebook or two and at least one of each 
iDevice, I’ve gotten 802.11AC router that Time Warner provided and, because I 
live in an apartment in New York City where the wi-fi interference is vast, I 
have a Netgear router in the second bedroom (… and yet, I have a two bedroom 
apartment in New York City.) relaying the signal.  I get on average 200 Mbps 
Internet speed, though I don’t know what my throughput is to devices in the 
WLAN (like, for example, a NAS).
That said, I’m also curious if there would be any advantage to running an 
AirPort router—do I get AirPlay on the Extreme, or just the Express, for 
instance?
> On Jan 17, 2016, at 4:37 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> Hey all,
> I'm considering what to do for a new, modern router. We're running the cable 
> modem/router combo from Time Warner, but I hate it. Mostly, I want 
> network-based storage support, and better throughput. We all use Apple 
> products, and most of them can handle AC wifi. My question, though, is 
> whether I'd be better off with an Airport router of some kind, or a cheaper 
> router that has the same wifi features? Put another way, what's the advantage 
> to using Apple routers over cheaper alternatives? I'd like to save money if I 
> can, but are there features in the Airport line that make one of them 
> compelling? A Spider or a Nighthawk would do more than fine for non-Apple 
> options, but is there a good reason I would prefer an Airport? Thanks in 
> advance.
> 
> --
> Have a great day,
> Alex Hall
> mehg...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: wireless printers

[Chris Meredith]

Not sure what model HP printer you got from the Apple Store, but I ordered the 
HP 6100 Wireless ePrinter.  I say this because, if this is the same model you 
have, you can either connect to its own wi-fi network (a lot of printers set 
this up as a way to allow you to configure the printer through an embedded Web 
server), or connect via ethernet (I can’t remember if sighted help is needed to 
get the key for the printer’s built-in wi-fi network, but I have this eerie 
feeling that it might be, which is why I connected directly via ethernet).
In any case, no setup needed to be done on the printer itself, and, given the 
number of wireless networks beginning with “HPSetup” or other things that 
indicate an unconfigured wireless printer, I have a feeling that this stands a 
reasonable chance of being the case with yours.  Unfortunately, without the 
model number, this is all the information I can provide.
> On Jan 17, 2016, at 5:10 PM, Marie Lyons  wrote:
> 
> Those types of replies are less than helpful!
>> On Jan 17, 2016, at 3:49 AM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello. 
>> 
>> You should have got your printer from Amazon, no sighted help required. My 
>> printer is wireless and it was recommended to me on this list. I will find 
>> the printer model for you but it's too late for you now as you spent your 
>> hard earned cash at the aPple Store.
>> 
>> Kawal.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 17 Jan 2016, at 4:33 am, David Chittenden  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello,
>>> 
>>> Set up the wireless printer for wireless directly on the printer, not 
>>> through the Mac. It is necessary to have a sighted person do it because one 
>>> connects the printer to the wifi router through the printer. Once 
>>> connected, the iPhone will see it when on the same wireless network. I 
>>> print wirelessly at my partner's house by selecting print on my iPhone, 
>>> then selecting the wireless printer. I have never 'set up drivers for her 
>>> wireless printer.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 17 Jan 2016, at 17:00, Marie Lyons  wrote:
 
 I purchased my printer from the Apple store.  It’s an HP. So I finally 
 have someone who uses a mac work with me to set up the printer. We test 
 the printer and it works fine. We attempt to download the software and run 
 into difficulty.  Tonight I called Apple disability support about 
 accomplishing this. I am asking them about hooking up the wireless printer 
 and they tell me they don’t support wireless unless it goes through their 
 router.  So he wants me to connect the printer via usb to the computer and 
 then print that way.  I say what is the point of wireless if you have to 
 connect with a usb cable. I will be printing from my phone also and when 
 my sister visits she brings her laptop and needs access to the printer. 
 Does anyone know to hook up a wireless printer? I couldn’t find anything 
 in applications to help me. I don’t see why the Apple store would be 
 selling me something that I can’t use with their computers.
 
 Marie Lyons
 
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>>> To u

Toggling QuickNav in websites

[Chris Meredith]

Hey gang,

I can’t imagine this hasn’t come up before—but has anyone else noticed that  
toggling QuickNav on or off doesn’t reliably work if you’re on a Web page?  My 
workaround has been to enable Keyboard Comander and map the QuickNav toggle to 
Right Option+Q, but I wondered if I was just missing something.
Also, anyone else notice that, if you use the caps lock as the VO modifier, the 
VO modifier occasionally gets stuck?  It’s rather unpleasant.

Thanks,
Chris

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Re: Bull crap about I O S 9, and no, I'm not breaking NDA.

[Chris Meredith]

I can't confirm whether or not there is a limit on the number of cards you
can activate, but when I upgraded my phone to an iOS beta build, I did get
a ping from Capital One letting me know that my card was removed from Apple
Pay--so clearly there is some communication that happens there.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 4:17 PM, Brent Harding  wrote:

> The thing with the betas though, don't you have to wipe everything out to
> even install them? I will probably wait until July when the public beta is
> released, if I install the beta at all, but as far as I understood, when
> you load it through iTunes, it is also factory resetting your device. I
> kind of did wonder, as far as Apple Pay goes, if the bank knows when you
> deleted your card, to free up that device slot, if there is a limit on how
> many you can activate?
>
> - Original Message - From: "Christopher-Mark Gilland" <
> clgillan...@gmail.com>
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 2:04 PM
> Subject: Re: Bull crap about I O S 9, and no, I'm not breaking NDA.
>
>
>  Could be, but I still think it's a bit misleading.  Call me maybe a bit
>> picky on samantics, but, whatever.
>>
>> LOL!
>>
>> Chris.
>>
>> - Original Message - From: "christopher hallsworth" <
>> challswor...@icloud.com>
>> To: "macvisionaries" 
>> Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 2:49 PM
>> Subject: Re: Bull crap about I O S 9, and no, I'm not breaking NDA.
>>
>>
>> I think Apple is covering their backs so developers can't complain or
>> even sue Apple for bricking their devices.
>>
>>> On 13 Jun 2015, at 19:32, Christopher-Mark Gilland <
>>> clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Whatever George.
>>>
>>> Chris.
>>>
>>>  - Original Message -
 From: george b
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:24 AM
 Subject: RE: Bull crap about I O S 9, and no, I'm not breaking NDA.

 So why do you have to ust that language does it make you some kind of a
 man???

 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:
 macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Christopher-Mark Gilland
 Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 04:54
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Bull crap about I O S 9, and no, I'm not breaking NDA.

 Guys,

 I just wanted to clear up some miscommunication by Apple.  They say on
 the developer web site that once you upgrade to I O S 9, you cannot go back
 to a previous version, like 8.3.  That's utter bullshit from what so far I
 can see.  Now, I wanna make this very very clear.  I am saying this on the
 basis of! from what I so? far! can see!  Keep that in mind.

 I have an I O S device which I did update to I O S 9.  I've changed my
 mind, and now am deciding not to deploy it to I O S 9 after all.  OK, I
 have a device I will! be keeping on I O S 9, just not this particular one.
 Anyway, the point is, they are only partially right in what they're saying
 on their web site from what it seems.

 1.  If you try to downgrade while your device is normally booted up
 into I O S 9, then no.  It won't work.  That is factually accurate
 information which I have verified.

 2.  If, however Apple has not stopped digitally signing the previous
 version of I O S, which of corse, 8.3, they haven't, then you can get it
 back as long as before you restore the device, you first get the device
 into DFU mode, just as you did when you upgraded to I O S 9.  I tried this,
 and I O S 8.3 definitely now is downloading.  I'll keep you all posted, and
 let you all know if I'm able to flash it back, and restore from my backup.
 To the best of my knowledge though, this seems to so far be working.

 Chris.
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Re: JAWS and Dongles and Fusion, Oh My

[Chris Meredith]

Fantastic!  I was admittedly not looking forward to having my keys hanging off 
my Mac any time I wanted to run both operating systems.
Has this also been tested with altering the hard disk space, or backing up and 
restoring the virtual machine to/from external media?
Related to all of this, I can’t help but wonder why “Remove Authorization” 
doesn’t actually increment my available authorization count … which is actually 
probably another question for another thread on another list at another time.

-C-
> On Jun 13, 2015, at 11:48 PM, Jonathan Mosen  wrote:
> 
> Hi Chris, there were changes made to JAWS 16 that make it highly tolerant of 
> VM changes. You can very the RAM, the number of CPUs etc and not lose an 
> authorisation, so there's really no reason to avoid using ILM if you have it.
> Jonathan Mosen
> Mosen Consulting
> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
> http://Mosen.org <http://mosen.org/>
>> On 14/06/2015, at 5:04 pm, Chris Meredith > <mailto:talli...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Greetings.
>> 
>> I’m trying to get a VM spun up with Fusion and JAWS.  I’m loath to use an 
>> ILM authorization (I shall leave my editorial comments on what I make of 
>> their authorization scheme for another time), so I’m using a hardware dongle 
>> from a prior life wherein I worked on the team that developed a widely used 
>> operating system whose name is the same as  those panes of glass that some 
>> of you may look through from time to time.
>> Unfortunately, instructing Fusion to connect my SafeNet Pro dongle to the 
>> Windows VM results in several minutes of nothing, followed by a “driver 
>> error” from Fusion.  The Fusion KB seems to point me in the direction of an 
>> installed “SentinelSystemDrier.pkg” on the Mac side, except that this 
>> doesn’t exist.  Has anyone gotten this working?  I’d totally be cool with 
>> NVDA, except that there is some support lacking with NVDA and Visual Studio.
>> 
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JAWS and Dongles and Fusion, Oh My

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

I’m trying to get a VM spun up with Fusion and JAWS.  I’m loath to use an ILM 
authorization (I shall leave my editorial comments on what I make of their 
authorization scheme for another time), so I’m using a hardware dongle from a 
prior life wherein I worked on the team that developed a widely used operating 
system whose name is the same as  those panes of glass that some of you may 
look through from time to time.
Unfortunately, instructing Fusion to connect my SafeNet Pro dongle to the 
Windows VM results in several minutes of nothing, followed by a “driver error” 
from Fusion.  The Fusion KB seems to point me in the direction of an installed 
“SentinelSystemDrier.pkg” on the Mac side, except that this doesn’t exist.  Has 
anyone gotten this working?  I’d totally be cool with NVDA, except that there 
is some support lacking with NVDA and Visual Studio.

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Re: Evernote on iOS

[Chris Meredith]

Hmm. Wonder why I wasn’t seeing anything on my iPad—I’m totally willing to 
assume an acute case of neuroflatulence on my side.
> On Jun 8, 2015, at 5:06 AM, Shaf  wrote:
> 
> Yes, it's completely accessible.
> 
> On 6/8/2015 5:58 AM, Chris Meredith wrote:
>> Is the aforementioned even usable?Launching the app on iPad seems to yield 
>> no joy.
>> 
> 
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Evernote on iOS

[Chris Meredith]

Is the aforementioned even usable?Launching the app on iPad seems to yield no 
joy.  

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Favorites Bar in Mail

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

I don’t suppose Apple ever got around to fixing the issue(s) that make it 
impossible for us to add folders to the favorites bar, have they?Drag and drop 
appears not to work—am I perhaps missing something?

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Re: Menu extras and recovery partition

[Chris Meredith]

Oh--because I dont have the old machine that was causing problems with the
recover partition (although those were also fixed), as my new machine has
arrived, thus getting rid of the need to "upgrade" a recovery partition.
If a new machine doesn't have the latest OS, that's a different serious
problem.

On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 7:08 PM, Dan  wrote:

> Hello,
> Just curious. Why will this be moot?
>
>
>
>
> On Jun 1, 2015, at 6:42 PM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
>
> It does, actually. Do you know if it's possible to upgrade the recovery
> partition? Although this will be moot shortly, according to the order
> status notification I got yesterday.
>
> On Monday, June 1, 2015, Sabahattin Gucukoglu  wrote:
>
>> Just a follow-up to say that I verified that the recovery system of
>> Yosemite does in fact let you access the menu extras.  My iMac’s Internet
>> Recovery was for Lion, which definitely doesn’t support this, requiring
>> Ethernet to perform the install accessibly.
>>
>> Hope this helps someone.
>>
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Re: File Vault

[Chris Meredith]

It's been my experience that, if you fail to unlock FileVault and then
restart the machine, you'll fall into the recovery partition (or something
similar to this).  If that happens, a Command+F5 should get you into a
running copy of VoiceOver without a problem.


On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 10:14 AM, Shaf  wrote:

> So Apple Accessibility have been pretty useless at giving me a good
> resolution or response.
> I have File Vault enabled, and I have my iCloud account enabled to reset
> my password rather than using a recovery key.
> If I forget my password, is there an accessible way to sign into iCloud
> and have it reset my password? From what I know VoiceOver is not fully
> functional at the File Vault login prompt.
>
>
> -Shaf
>
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Re: Menu extras and recovery partition

[Chris Meredith]

It does, actually. Do you know if it's possible to upgrade the recovery
partition? Although this will be moot shortly, according to the order
status notification I got yesterday.

On Monday, June 1, 2015, Sabahattin Gucukoglu  wrote:

> Just a follow-up to say that I verified that the recovery system of
> Yosemite does in fact let you access the menu extras.  My iMac’s Internet
> Recovery was for Lion, which definitely doesn’t support this, requiring
> Ethernet to perform the install accessibly.
>
> Hope this helps someone.
>
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Re: Menu extras and recovery partition

[Chris Meredith]

Interesting.  My late 2011 unit beeps twice for username and three times
for password with FileVault active, and I have the latest updates installed.
Also, I'm still encountering the VoiceOver menu extras bug with the
recovery partition.  I assume theres not anything special I need to do in
order to update it?

On Sun, May 31, 2015 at 11:55 AM, Shaf  wrote:

>  I'm running 10.10.3 with all software updates installed.
> Here's another weird issue:
> I have multiple Macs with File Vault encryption. One of them self-voices
> when enabling VoiceOver on the lock screen, the other beeps for username
> and password. They are both fully updated to the latest software. Any idea
> what's happening there?
>
>
> On 5/31/2015 7:38 PM, Daniel Miller wrote:
>
> Hi. I don't have that bug. I'm able to access the Wi-Fi menu with in
> recovery partition just fine. I'm running the latest public beta of
> Yosemite 10.10.4, if that helps though. Although seeing as it's recovery
> partition, it should reinstall 10.10.3, and not 10.10.4 cents is not
> released publicly. Either way, I don't see the issue your referenced.v
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 31, 2015, at 1:06 PM, Shaf  wrote:
>
>   Actually
> There is a bug with VoiceOver where you cannot get into the menu extras
> with all software updates installed. VoiceOver restar
> ts itself and takes you out of the menu.
> On 5/31/2015 5:13 PM, Daniel Miller wrote:
>
> Hi Chris. No, that bug was fixed a couple of years ago. I can't remember
> and which version of OS X it was fixed with.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 31, 2015, at 2:49 AM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
>
>   Greetings.
>
>  So one bug I remember from years back was that, if you tried to access
> the menu extras (like, for example, connecting to WiFi to download the
> operating system), VoiceOver refused to acknowledge their existence.  Is
> this still a thing?  Will I need to procure an Ethernet adapter in the
> event I should need to download and install the OS from the recovery
> partition?
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Menu extras and recovery partition

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

So one bug I remember from years back was that, if you tried to access the
menu extras (like, for example, connecting to WiFi to download the
operating system), VoiceOver refused to acknowledge their existence.  Is
this still a thing?  Will I need to procure an Ethernet adapter in the
event I should need to download and install the OS from the recovery
partition?

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Re: Specs for MacBook Pro and VMware Fusion

[Chris Meredith]

See, this is what I was thinking--particularly as pertains the CPU.  Am I
right in assuming that OS X is generally lighter on resources than Windows?

On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 7:07 PM, Jeff Greene  wrote:

> Hi Chris,
> I always believe more memory is a good investiment. I have a 2012
> non-retina mbp that I upgraded to 16gb ram and a samsung ssd. It runs
> windows fine either via bootcamp or fusion 7. Also I use sharp keys from
> randyrants.com to remap tilde to insert. I also remap ] to an
> applications key. So to summ up don’t worry too much about the processor
> all modern quad-cores are up to what you want, but go for the 16gb ram! You
> won’t be disappointed.
> Jeff
>
> On May 29, 2015, at 9:57 PM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
>
> Greetings.
>
> I'm looking to finally upgrade my (ancient) late 2011 MacBook Pro.  Assume
> for a moment that the unit will need to occasionally run Windows under a
> VM, in order to support Visual Studio, Xamarin .NET development for iOS/Mac
> OS X, and the ability to connect back to a Mac for debugging.  Ideally, the
> Mac that the Windows VM connects to wants to be the Mac on which it runs.
> Would the preconfigured models have the specs to do what I"m asking, it
> would it be worth customizing (adding more RAM, etc.)?  What are folks
> running that are using Fusion to run Windows virtual machines?
> Also, how are folks getting around the fact that Windows screen readers
> pretty much all use Caps Lock as a modifier, which Fusion never gets from
> the operating system?
>
> Thanks,
> Chris
>
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Specs for MacBook Pro and VMware Fusion

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

I'm looking to finally upgrade my (ancient) late 2011 MacBook Pro.  Assume
for a moment that the unit will need to occasionally run Windows under a
VM, in order to support Visual Studio, Xamarin .NET development for iOS/Mac
OS X, and the ability to connect back to a Mac for debugging.  Ideally, the
Mac that the Windows VM connects to wants to be the Mac on which it runs.
Would the preconfigured models have the specs to do what I"m asking, it
would it be worth customizing (adding more RAM, etc.)?  What are folks
running that are using Fusion to run Windows virtual machines?
Also, how are folks getting around the fact that Windows screen readers
pretty much all use Caps Lock as a modifier, which Fusion never gets from
the operating system?

Thanks,
Chris

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Re: Newbie Calendar question

[Chris Meredith]

See, that's what I thought.  That said, I'm also using a beta Yosemite
build--which leads me to wonder if that's not part of the issue.
Specifically, pressing ENTER after entering the text, which is what I
thought should work, landed me ... right back in the calendar grid, with no
new appointment created.

On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 1:23 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:

> Cmd-n places you in a text field. Type a sentence like "lunch with Frank
> tomorrow at 3 pm" and listen to what VoiceOver says. You'll hear something
> like "lunch with Frank, tomorrow, March 16, from 3:00 PM to 4:00 PM".
> Adjust your sentence until everything sounds right. Alternatively, just
> type the title of the event and leave everything else blank. In either
> case, once you're done typing, hit enter and you'll be on a screen where
> you can fill out or modify any details you need to. Once you have things
> how you want, hit enter once more.
>
> On Mar 15, 2015, at 4:01 PM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
>
> Greetings.
>
> Clearly I am likely doing something wrong here—but, when trying to create
> a calendar event, the calendar seems to … fail to create a calendar event.
> Pressing Command+N brings up the popover, but nothing seems to intuitively
> indicate how to actually persist this appointment.  How am I totally
> stuffing up the process?
>
> Thanks,
> Chris
>
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> mehg...@icloud.com
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Newbie Calendar question

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

Clearly I am likely doing something wrong here—but, when trying to create a 
calendar event, the calendar seems to … fail to create a calendar event.  
Pressing Command+N brings up the popover, but nothing seems to intuitively 
indicate how to actually persist this appointment.  How am I totally stuffing 
up the process?

Thanks,
Chris

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Re: iTunes Match and iOS

[Chris Meredith]

Hmmm. This is totally not what I'm seeing.  So either they are redoing how 
songs are managed on the iPhone, or they managed to break accessibility in the 
update (either of these are possible).  I suppose it's off to the forums where 
I can speak freely about such things then ...

-Chris-
On Jul 29, 2012, at 5:38 PM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:

> This is when you are in Songs view.  I don't believe that you'll have any 
> issues with the songs that are already uploaded to iCloud.
> 
> Later...
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
> On 2012-07-29, at 4:01 PM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
> 
>> In what view would I find this?  Songs?  Artist?  It's possible that this is 
>> broken in ... um ... builds of iOS that I'm not permitted to talk about, in 
>> which case this is a regression and I should file a bug.  The other 
>> possibility is that my phone is syncing everything in my music library 
>> despite iTunes Match being turned on, which is about to become disastrous as 
>> I import my entire CD collection to the cloud.
>> 
>> On Jul 29, 2012, at 8:07 AM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> In iOS, if the music is locally stored, there will be no indication whereas 
>>> if it is in iCloud, part of your iTunes Match collection and thus 
>>> downloadable, there will be an iCloud Download button after the given item.
>>> 
>>> To delete an item is a little tricky but I have had success doing this:
>>> 
>>> • Double-tap and hold on the item you wish to delete.
>>> • VO will make the blip sound.
>>> • Right away after the blip sound finishes, swipe left or right.
>>> • Wait a couple of seconds then swipe right.
>>> • VO should announce "Confirm Deletion".
>>> • Double-tap on that button and it's gone.
>>> 
>>> HTH.
>>> 
>>> Later...
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
>>> On 2012-07-29, at 1:48 AM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Greetings.
>>>> 
>>>> So I just turned on iTunes Match and am in the process of uploading my 
>>>> entire library.  One thing I'm noticing, though: It appears that VoiceOver 
>>>> doesn't actually see the cloud icon next to songs, artists or albums that 
>>>> indicate their status as "in the cloud" vs. locally downloaded.
>>>> Further, I'm not entirely sure I can see an option to remove synced music 
>>>> from my phone once downloaded.  Is there a workaround I'm missing due to 
>>>> my expectation that the way to do things that is listed in most 
>>>> walkthroughs actually works with VoiceOver?
>>>> 
>>>> -Chris-
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion

[Chris Meredith]

I'll admit I was a little astounded at what actually worked on the Mac side.  
I've a machine with both platforms, as 1) I work in Windows CE, which Xcode 
oddly enough fails to develop for, 2) there are still some things that tend to 
work better on Windows (Remote Desktop being one such), and 3) my colleagues 
use Office, and I don't trust documents to make a round trip from Office to 
Pages to Office again and keep all of their schmancy formatting intact.  
Oh--and 4) my networked three-tuner CableCard device doesn't let me watch 
encrypted TV (ie. HBO and such) on the Mac.  Having said that, I've seen some 
"Web 2.0" sites (God I hate that term) that actually seem to work better with 
Safari 6, Mountain Lion and VoiceOver than they do on Windows.
On Jul 31, 2012, at 7:43 AM, Alex Hall  wrote:

> I'd like to mention web browsing. I use chrome, not safari, but I find the 
> speed improvements in navigation amazing. In fact, it is as responsive now as 
> windows is on webpages, which I thought would never happen. I've been on 
> windows for years and had a horrible time getting used to the mac over the 
> last year, but now I literally turn on windows only for games. I never 
> thought I would do that, but the combination of ML, using Serena with vo, and 
> learning some really helpful commands has turned me into a shameless apple 
> fanboy.
> On Jul 31, 2012, at 10:38 AM, "Missy Hoppe"  wrote:
> 
>> Hi! I was trying to refrain from jumpint in on this topic, but I'm genuinely 
>> baffled by the original post and those who
>> supported it. The original post may have reflected my feelings about lion, 
>> and I remember being tempted to sell my mac last
>> year because I found lion to be so hateful, but I just made the best of it, 
>> knowing that updates would come along and fix the
>> problems sooner or later. Sure enough, patience paid off. If I'm ever going 
>> to enjoy using my mac on a more regular basis,
>> Mountain Lion will be the OS that makes that happen. So far as I can tell, 
>> almost everything I hated about lion has been
>> fixed, and for the 1 or 2 very minor issues that still exist, I have my 
>> external drive that runs snow leopard. Mountain lion
>> is significantly faster than Lion was, I haven't had any busies that I can 
>> recall, and best of all, VO always comes on at
>> start-up, something which almost never happened under lion for me. Folks are 
>> definitely entitled to their opinions, but this
>> almost seems like deliberate bashing just to cause drama. Maybe I'm the 
>> exception to the rule, but I simply can't imagine
>> anyone thinking that Lion was better than ML.
>> OK. I'm done now. I don't want to contribute too much to the drama, but I 
>> just had to speak up since for me, Mountain Lion is
>> like a night and day improvement over Lion, and I'm genuinely excited about 
>> using my mac now.
>> Missy
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Tanner
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2012 10:17 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion
>> 
>> I would definately agree, but if you remember, last year when Lion came out
>> we went through this same complaint cycle.   People want all the new stuff,
>> but they want it to all work the same and don't want to take the time and 
>> energy to learn the new stuff.  Some how it should
>> just jump into their minds how to do everything.
>> 
>> Perhaps, people should get the two new books from Bookshare about Mountain 
>> Lion and study those and learn before complaining.
>> 
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Kawal Gucukoglu" 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2012 3:42 AM
>> Subject: Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion
>> 
>> 
>> Hello All.
>> 
>> Now what I might say may be something that people may not like but I am one
>> for plain speaking and will not mince my words.  However, this is my
>> opinion.
>> 
>> People say that they may be disappointed with one thing or another and it is
>> their right to do so of course.
>> 
>> But when anything new is released, there is going to be bugs etc as I have
>> been a beta tester and know how hard people work to get a product into
>> shape.
>> 
>> So rather than people complaining as people seem to do, why not just send
>> your concerns to Apple Accessibility and rather than bashing a product work
>> with them to improve a producct?  It would be so positivve to do that and
>> sit and be passive about things as everyone would make a difference.  If
>> everything was plain sailing, life would be dull.  So chill and think to do
>> something positive.
>> 
>> Kawal.
>> 
>> On 31 Jul 2012, at 04:41 AM, James Mannion  wrote:
>> 
>>> And when the accessible web browsing experience on the mac at least
>>> matches windows, I'll buy it. busy busy busy, can't handel large
>>> amounts of text, ignores this and that on the page, the entire web
>>> thing 

Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion

[Chris Meredith]

But then, aren't we beginning to see some of this with Trackpad Commander in 
VoiceOver, and the touch modifications that are present in Narrator on Windows 
8?
On Jul 31, 2012, at 6:03 AM, Cheree Heppe  wrote:

> Cheree Heppe here:
> 
> Designing the architecture for a useable screen reader might be compared to a 
> science fiction writer designing a world or universe.  Wha if, though, the 
> original architecture of a world or a screen reader required radical changes 
> in order to keep pace with advancements unimagined in the original outlay?
> 
> Could we as users manage changes that re-mapped how keystrokes accessed 
> function?  Could a re-do of command structures be done without truly rocking 
> the world views of the users?  Could leaving a structural legacy intact, such 
> as maybe keystrokes using three and four keys at a time, a pattern that must 
> have sprung from the early beginnings of screen reader access, harm the 
> future flexibility or usability of a comman structure architecture?
> 
> What if the whole keystroke structure had to be re-done to make it more 
> streamlined and to allow for new access?  Could we tolerate that?  Or would 
> we be stuck in  some other mode?
> 
> If I could design an access model, it might allow screen gestures and tapping 
> the way an I-device such as an IPad or IPhone does, with the aded power of 
> the key commands and built-in features of a laptop design.
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Cheree Heppe
> 
> 
> Sent from my IPhone 4S
> 
> On 31/07/2012, at 5:51, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
>> You'll agree that it is a big learning curve when you get a Mac. One will 
>> only succeed if one puts effort in. We are our own enemies. Another thought 
>> crossed my mind, we want our technology, we pay with it for a few days, then 
>> when we get board or dissatified, we bash it. Human nature! This is what is 
>> happening here!
>> 
>> On 31 Jul 2012, at 01:40 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
>> 
>>> My response is simple.  If you are not going to report the issues as a bug 
>>> and are unhappy with the Mac.  Then simply don't buy one, or just take your 
>>> current one back if it is under the time limit of being able to get a full 
>>> refund.  Failing that, wipe it and stick Windows on the thing.
>>> 
>>> Bye bye 
>>> 
>>> Chris 
>>> On 31 Jul 2012, at 12:16, Ray Foret Jr  wrote:
>>> 
 And it ain't as if there's that much to complain about really.  Sure, 
 sometimes VO won't respond to pressing VO+space, and the time line issue; 
 but really, I think we're looking at an undercover Apple basher here.  You 
 know the type.  They get a Mac, give themselves perhaps a few  days with 
 it and expect it to be a windows machine.  So, when they find out it's 
 not, they not only take it back, they publicly condemn it to all their 
 windows friends.
 
 
 Sincerely,
 The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
 
 Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
 
 Skype name:
 barefootedray
 
 On Jul 31, 2012, at 5:15 AM, "Christopher-Mark gilland" 
  wrote:
 
> Hear ye, hear ye!
> 
> I couldn't agree more.  That mail had me constantly over and over again, 
> saying? Drama, drama, drama!
> 
> O, K, are there some bugs, yeah, granted I really haven't found any, but 
> that isn't to say I won't eventually.  The point is, give Apple a break 
> for God sake, and before you accuse any beta tester saying, it's too 
> buggy, why did you all let the bugs come through... OK, Mister or Misses 
> Smarty-Pants? why don't we give you the source code to OSX and see what 
> you! can do!  In other words, in less blunt terms, the beta testers also 
> are human.  Just because someone is on the dev beta team does not make 
> them infalible.  They, like you and myself are human.  So cut out the 
> bashing please.  I agree. It's ok to complain, but do so construtively.
> 
> Chris.
> 
> - Original Message - From: "Kawal Gucukoglu" 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2012 4:42 AM
> Subject: Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion
> 
> 
> Hello All.
> 
> Now what I might say may be something that people may not like but I am 
> one for plain speaking and will not mince my words.  However, this is my 
> opinion.
> 
> People say that they may be disappointed with one thing or another and it 
> is their right to do so of course.
> 
> But when anything new is released, there is going to be bugs etc as I 
> have been a beta tester and know how hard people work to get a product 
> into shape.
> 
> So rather than people complaining as people seem to do, why not just send 
> your concerns to Apple Accessibility and rather than bashing a product 
> work with them to improve a producct?  It would be so positivve to do 
> that and sit and be passive about things as everyone would make a 
> difference.  If 

Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion

[Chris Meredith]

I can confirm that Safari seems to handle larger web pages significantly better 
(I used blindcooltech.com as my test page, since it still continues to be a 
mass of text, links and headings that go on for miles).  I am noticing some 
oddities with some table navigation on one site in particular that made me head 
back to my Windows installation where it worked, however.
Specifically, if you go to www.kingdomofloathing.com, create a character, go to 
Seaside Town, Market Square, Mr. Store, and attempt to buy something, not all 
of the elements appear visible to VoiceOver.  I'll ... I'll file this on 
bugreport.

-Chris-
On Jul 31, 2012, at 5:55 AM, Chris Moore  wrote:

> So you sold your Mac and gave up on it?  So what now qualifies you to know 
> how Mountain Lion and Safari 6 are performing?
> 
> I would say web surfing in ML is vastly improved.  I have not heard Safari 
> say busy yet, and the rotor is turbo speed in comparison to Lion.  Safari and 
> VO see more elements than before and you can easily select text now too.
> 
> Granted there are still a couple of minor bugs, but so is JAWS and Window 
> Eyes in that arena.
> 
> Sorry to be blunt, am just sick to death of people moaning.
> 
> Chris 
> On 31 Jul 2012, at 04:41, James Mannion  wrote:
> 
>> And when the accessible web browsing experience on the mac at least
>> matches windows, I'll buy it. busy busy busy, can't handel large
>> amounts of text, ignores this and that on the page, the entire web
>> thing was why I gave up on the mac thing and sold my mac mini. To do
>> the web on the mac you have to put on those rose colored glasses that
>> view everything from a pro Apple perspective and you can't require
>> that it gets the job done.
>> 
>> Jim
>> 
>> On 7/30/12, Brian Fischler  wrote:
>>> Been reading all these posts the last few days about how amazed
>>> everyone is with Mountain Lion, and not sure what all the amazement
>>> iss about.
>>> 
>>> It only took three days as I just had to use the Force Quit for
>>> Safari, and all it took was actually trying to login to my Yahoo
>>> Fantasy Baseball Page. I pulled it up and first the first time ever
>>> got a cookie message that said my safari cookie had expired, after I
>>> got out of that window safari did nothing but Busy Busy Busy for the
>>> better part of ten minutes before I went to force quit.
>>> 
>>> I already had been very unimpressed with Mountain Lion between the VO
>>> space bar not properly selecting items I clicked on to the features
>>> being very blah Seriously dictation is useless for anyone who knows
>>> how to type. The notification center is useless especially if you keep
>>> Night Owl open like I do to Tweet, and Imessage, I'm sorry but I fail
>>> to see the point as most of us have our Iphone sitting right next to
>>> us. I hate to be so negative, but considering how many people were
>>> bashing Lion which didn't have that many problems, I fail to see where
>>> the significant upgrade is.
>>> 
>>> --
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>>> 
>>> 
>> 
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Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion

[Chris Meredith]

Just some thoughts from someone who's actually in software development 
professionally.
Even if you're convinced that the beta testers have found a bug and that Apple 
is squashing it, report it anyway.  Occasionally, it helps set bug priority if 
developers know how many people are seeing the bug.  Something that is only 
occasionally reproduceable and has been reported only once or twice is not 
going to get the same priority as something that's easily reproduceable and 
affects thousands.
Bug reports do not need to contain effusive praise.  Yes, Apple has included a 
free screen reader in-box.  Odds are they already know this.  Not heaping 
praise upon them for what they have done will not, as I've heard some speculate 
(though not on this list) cause them to, let's face it, waste months and months 
of developer hours, break contracts with third party providers, and delay their 
next release just to remove VoiceOver and give those blind ingrates a spanking. 
 We're usually a thick-skinned bunch, and I can assure you that no bug I've 
encountered, even when reported by external customers, has contained a hymn of 
praise.
What we do like is steps you went through to reproduce the bug.  This includes 
"enable VoiceOver", possibly even including how to do so.  If nothing else, it 
may save the developer who has never used VoiceOver in their lives a bit of 
time by looking up the key sequence in whatever internal knowledge base Apple 
uses.  I've even gone so far when filing iOS bugs as to reproduce the bug on 
camera for them, attaching it as a QuickTime movie.  Even with the company I 
work for and the people that contract us, bug reports occasionally contain 
screenshots.  Again--if you can't provide screenshots or demos, detailed repro 
instructions will work just as well.  Soapbox mode off.  And no, I am not an 
Apple employee although, in the interest of full disclosure, I did previously 
work for the other guys over in Redmond.  And no, our bug reports also didn't 
include how much our external customers ostensibly hated our products and 
wanted us destroyed, either.

-Chris-
On Jul 31, 2012, at 5:49 AM, Chris Moore  wrote:

> I have found a number of bugs, and they are all fairly minor, no show 
> stoppers.  I am sure many of the bugs were identified by the beta testers, 
> but if Apple weighted for every single bug to be squashed then the thing 
> would never get out of the door.  instead of bitching, report the issues to 
> Apple.
> 
> Let's look at Blackberry for example, where is their Blackberry 10 operating 
> system? Oh right, yeah, they are waiting to release it once it is finally 
> feature rich and bug free.  See you in 2014 RIM or will it be RIP?
> 
> Let's remember that Apple will spend the next 12 months fixing any major 
> issues with Mountain Lion, is not just dumped in your lap to never be 
> updated.  So if you have concerns or issues, then let Apple know about it 
> directly.
> 
> Our energy would be best spent on making VoiceOver great, not tearing it 
> apart.
> 
> Narrator for Windows anyone?
> 
> Chris 
> 
> 
> On 31 Jul 2012, at 11:15, Christopher-Mark gilland  
> wrote:
> 
>> Hear ye, hear ye!
>> 
>> I couldn't agree more.  That mail had me constantly over and over again, 
>> saying? Drama, drama, drama!
>> 
>> O, K, are there some bugs, yeah, granted I really haven't found any, but 
>> that isn't to say I won't eventually.  The point is, give Apple a break for 
>> God sake, and before you accuse any beta tester saying, it's too buggy, why 
>> did you all let the bugs come through... OK, Mister or Misses Smarty-Pants? 
>> why don't we give you the source code to OSX and see what you! can do!  In 
>> other words, in less blunt terms, the beta testers also are human.  Just 
>> because someone is on the dev beta team does not make them infalible.  They, 
>> like you and myself are human.  So cut out the bashing please.  I agree. 
>> It's ok to complain, but do so construtively.
>> 
>> Chris.
>> 
>> - Original Message - From: "Kawal Gucukoglu" 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2012 4:42 AM
>> Subject: Re: Very Disappointed with Mountain Lion
>> 
>> 
>> Hello All.
>> 
>> Now what I might say may be something that people may not like but I am one 
>> for plain speaking and will not mince my words.  However, this is my opinion.
>> 
>> People say that they may be disappointed with one thing or another and it is 
>> their right to do so of course.
>> 
>> But when anything new is released, there is going to be bugs etc as I have 
>> been a beta tester and know how hard people work to get a product into shape.
>> 
>> So rather than people complaining as people seem to do, why not just send 
>> your concerns to Apple Accessibility and rather than bashing a product work 
>> with them to improve a producct?  It would be so positivve to do that and 
>> sit and be passive about things as everyone would make a difference.  If 
>> everything was plain sailing, life would be dull.  So 

Re: iTunes Match and iOS

[Chris Meredith]

In what view would I find this?  Songs?  Artist?  It's possible that this is 
broken in ... um ... builds of iOS that I'm not permitted to talk about, in 
which case this is a regression and I should file a bug.  The other possibility 
is that my phone is syncing everything in my music library despite iTunes Match 
being turned on, which is about to become disastrous as I import my entire CD 
collection to the cloud.

On Jul 29, 2012, at 8:07 AM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> In iOS, if the music is locally stored, there will be no indication whereas 
> if it is in iCloud, part of your iTunes Match collection and thus 
> downloadable, there will be an iCloud Download button after the given item.
> 
> To delete an item is a little tricky but I have had success doing this:
> 
> • Double-tap and hold on the item you wish to delete.
> • VO will make the blip sound.
> • Right away after the blip sound finishes, swipe left or right.
> • Wait a couple of seconds then swipe right.
> • VO should announce "Confirm Deletion".
> • Double-tap on that button and it's gone.
> 
> HTH.
> 
> Later...
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
> On 2012-07-29, at 1:48 AM, Chris Meredith  wrote:
> 
>> Greetings.
>> 
>> So I just turned on iTunes Match and am in the process of uploading my 
>> entire library.  One thing I'm noticing, though: It appears that VoiceOver 
>> doesn't actually see the cloud icon next to songs, artists or albums that 
>> indicate their status as "in the cloud" vs. locally downloaded.
>> Further, I'm not entirely sure I can see an option to remove synced music 
>> from my phone once downloaded.  Is there a workaround I'm missing due to my 
>> expectation that the way to do things that is listed in most walkthroughs 
>> actually works with VoiceOver?
>> 
>> -Chris-
>> 
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> 
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Re: why can't Textedit serve as a replacement for MS Word?

[Chris Meredith]

If I may play devil's advocate for a second, though--if you are working with 
people that are using Word, where is the line beyond which the solutions we 
have at our disposal that run natively on OS X are too incompatible for 
collaboration?
If I sent a document that was originally created in Word (say, a test 
specification template) off to someone after I'd edited it in Pages, and Pages 
totally botched the formatting during its round trip from Word to Pages to 
Word, this is going to make more work for the person approving the document 
(all test specifications at my company, for instance, start life as a template, 
then the tester writes the spec, then a peer reviews the spec for any missing 
elements).  Whilst one wouldn't need Office to be productive (I'll leave the 
philosophical discussions around the definition of "productive" for another 
time, as this is apparently a topic of some contention), are we still in a 
situation where we will need Office to be compatible?  Admittedly, as someone 
whose last experience with Pages was back in 2005, I would love to be told that 
the only things that don't tend to survive the round trip are some obscure 
formatting that really only is a factor if you edit documents in multiple 
languages and more than 30% of your doc is in Kanji.
On Jul 28, 2012, at 1:55 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:

> True. I have not tried Pages, but I hear it is mostly accessible, more than 
> MS can say about their solutions. I guess I'm just tired of everyone thinking 
> they need Office in order to be productive...
> On 28 Jul 2012, at 15:38, William Windels  wrote:
> 
>> Hello Alex,
>> in my opinion, we shouldn't accept that we can't work toghetter with oter 
>> sighted users because of the inaccessible or low featured editors.  
>> I think personally that Apple should build only apps that are fully 
>> accessible with their own accessibility rules in mind,(exepting bugs of 
>> course since we are all humans ;) ).
>> When you convert a doc(x) to a rtf, for shore you will lose lay-out 
>> functionality.
>> 
>> And Microsoft, they won't make accessible programs out of the box in the 
>> next years I think.
>> 
>> That's my opinion.
>> 
>> kind regards,
>> William Windels
>> Op 28-jul.-2012, om 16:01 heeft Alex Hall  het volgende 
>> geschreven:
>> 
>>> The way I see it, you have one other choice: only use Mac! If you have a 
>>> doc or docx file, will converting it to rtf, then saving it in that format, 
>>> solve the problem? I suppose this isn't a surprise, though, as no two 
>>> editors do things the same way, so compatibility in all aspects of 
>>> formatting is probably never going to happen. I'm okay with moving away 
>>> from a massively expensive and slow program like Office and using 
>>> lower-cost one like Pages, or free ones like Textedit. Maybe we can help 
>>> stop the monopoly Office has over anyone wanting to do wordprocessing...
>>> On 28 Jul 2012, at 09:42, William Windels  wrote:
>>> 
 Hello all,
 This is perhaps a late response but I found this a interesting  discussion 
 and I wasn't able to answer before because of holidays.
 
 What's most frustrating for me is that we can't edit office-documents of 
 others without distroying the made lay-out.
 The only option here should be to use ms office for mac but this isn't 
 accessible at all, right?
 Also with pages, it seems not compatible with some (basic) lay-out tasks 
 of ms office documents.
 
 So, to solve this, we should use windows or wate until???
 
 Kind regards,
 William Windels
 Op 24-jul.-2012, om 15:17 heeft Daniel McGee 
  het volgende geschreven:
 
> Hi Johnny, here is the direct homepage for Bean. 
> http://www.bean-osx.com/Bean.html
> 
> I will now try to describe how you download and install it. 
> Note two things. Once you understand how to install an app on the Mac, 
> then it will apply to most apps that you want to use. With the exception 
> of sometimes there being installers for some apps for the Mac but what 
> I'm about to try to describe to you will probably be the most common 
> situation. Another note. I am using OSX Lion so if it differs from 
> previous Mac OS versions then I apologise but I reckon it shouldn't be 
> all that much different. 
> 
> Ok lets use the website above as an example for you to install Bean and 
> try it out for yourself! By the way it is a free app as you may probably 
> notice. Once you go to the website, look for a link that called Download 
> Bean. Once you've found it, do a VO space bar on it to start the 
> download. Afther you've done this quickly press Command option L this 
> will open the download dialog box. Chances are that if this does;doesn't 
> happen i.e. the dialog box doesn't come up, it has been in my experience 
> that it has already downloaded. However, if you catch the dialog then 
> just wait f

iTunes Match and iOS

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

So I just turned on iTunes Match and am in the process of uploading my entire 
library.  One thing I'm noticing, though: It appears that VoiceOver doesn't 
actually see the cloud icon next to songs, artists or albums that indicate 
their status as "in the cloud" vs. locally downloaded.
Further, I'm not entirely sure I can see an option to remove synced music from 
my phone once downloaded.  Is there a workaround I'm missing due to my 
expectation that the way to do things that is listed in most walkthroughs 
actually works with VoiceOver?

-Chris-

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Re: Busy, busy everywhere

[Chris Meredith]

I tend to run into it primarily in Xcode, fact that I have a ate 2011 MacBook 
Pro with 8 GB of memory notwithstanding.
Thing is, if, as reported previously, the lag goes away when one removes 
VoiceOver from the equation and uses a working monitor, might the problem be 
with the way that VoiceOver is interacting with applications?
On Jul 27, 2012, at 3:01 PM, Daniel Miller  wrote:

> I don't get any busys at all, except every so often in iTunes when I go to
> the store. Then again, I am running a 2012 Macbook Air with 8GB of ram.
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Missy Hoppe
> Sent: Friday, July 27, 2012 4:59 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: Busy, busy everywhere
> 
> Same here. I don't think I've had any busys at all,  and startup is a lot
> faster. I'm very, very glad I got Mountain Lion!
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Lisette Wesseling
> Sent: Friday, July 27, 2012 5:38 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Busy, busy everywhere
> 
> Hi Alex
> I would actually say the opposite. There is less busy busy on my 2011
> MacBook pro with 4 gb ram than in Lion. Start up is definitely faster and I
> think VO is a bit snappier.
> Lisette
> 
> On 28/07/2012, at 4:17 AM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
>> Has anyone else noticed this? I went through enough of that constant 
>> busy stuff before I got a working monitor. If 10.8 causes those 
>> problems, I don't think I'll be upgrading until they're fixed.
>> 
>> On 7/27/12, Ricardo Walker  wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I suggest repairing permissions in disk utilities.
>>> 
>>> Ricardo Walker
>>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>>> www.appletothecore.info
>>> 
>>> On Jul 27, 2012, at 8:10 AM, Christine Grassman 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
 Since installing ML, I am noticing a huge increase in "busy"
 messages in Mail, Safari, Finder -- everywhere. Exceedingly 
 annoying. Sometimes, toggling VO off and on helps, but often not.
 Also, I've noticed that whenever I have to use VO space for 
 anything, it almost always requires a second or third press. Thoughts?
> Experiences?
 Work-arounds? TIA.
 Christine
 
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>>> 
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>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Have a great day,
>> Alex (msg sent from GMail website)
>> mehg...@gmail.com
>> 
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Re: VMWare Fusion questions

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

Actually what I did initially was get the machine running under Windows 7, as 
this is what Fusion knew what to cope with using automated install scripts.
Following this, I downloaded the Windows 8 ISO (there wasn't a key required, as 
this is still a preview), mounted it in the VM, then ran the installer within 
the Windows 7 VM.
At various points within the Windows 8 install process, I hit Windows-Enter (I 
think that translates to cmd+enter in the default layout?  It's been a while 
since I spun this up to play with it), and Narrator came up talking.
Tip: It looks like Microsoft has chosen to use caps lock as a modifier for 
Narrator, rather than Alt+Windows.  My suspicion is that this would make them 
look less like VoiceOver, but as I have no proof to substantiate my claim, 
parse it accordingly.  This makes SharpKeys an essential part of your complete 
breakfast if you're running Windows 8 under Fusion, as ou'll want to perhaps 
remap the right option key to the caps lock key in the virtual machine. ... 
Wait. I guess I should actually try this before I go throwing around 
recommendations. =)

Hope this helps,
Chris
On Jul 21, 2012, at 7:33 AM, Dannyboy wrote:

> Hello.  After telling vmware fusion where windows 8 was, did you have to type 
> a key?  Then, how did you get narator to talk?
> 
> On Monday, June 4, 2012 9:01:14 AM UTC-5, Chris Meredith wrote:
> Hi Maria,
> 
> I'm actually running Windows 8 on a MacBook Pro with 8 GB of RAM, which I 
> deliberately got kitted out so that I could run multiple virtual machines 
> without having to buy multiple computers.  I can't remember what the CPU is 
> on the Mini, but you should certainly have enough memory.
> For those of you that have gone the Bootcamp route, have any of you also used 
> the Windows Automated Installation Kit to create an unattended installation 
> file?  As someone that has reliable sighted help available approximately as 
> frequently as they have a six digit bank balance, I'm always on the lookout 
> for workarounds.
> On Jun 3, 2012, at 9:45 PM, Maria Chapman wrote:
> 
>> Hi.
>> 
>> I am also thinking about setting up a virtual machine.  Is there a 
>> recommended amount of resources the virtual machine needs to run properly 
>> but leaving enough for the mac? Will a virtual machine run ok on a mac mini 
>> with 8 gigs of ram? And, how do I run a screen reader with an apple 
>> bluetooth keyboard? Is there a way to make this work? Or would i be better 
>> plugging in a standard usb keyboard?
>> 
>> Is there anywhere i can go to read a tutorial or guide about setting up a 
>> virtual machine to run windows?
>> 
>> thanks
>> 
>> God Bless! Maria from australia
>>  Newbie mac user.
>> bubbygirl1...@gmail.com
>> will get you fb as well as email & iMessage.   
>> skype same as email,without the gmail part. twitter bubbygirl 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 04/06/2012, at 12:46 PM, Brent Harding wrote:
>> 
>>> Oh, cool! I have my mac already set up with boot camp. Would I likely have 
>>> activation issues with JFW going back and forth between these 2 methods? 
>>> Would I have to take up 2 keys, or is Fusion smart enough to deal with it?
>>> 
>>> - Original Message - From: "Matthew Campbell" 
>>> 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2012 4:44 PM
>>> Subject: Re: VMWare Fusion questions
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi.
>>> A couple of things to keep in mind.
>>> 1. If you do go the boot cam route, you will need sighted assistance to get 
>>> windows installed. Also, you'll be able to have Fusion treat the bootcamp 
>>> partition as a virtual machine. This has some advantages such as being able 
>>> to utilized all of the Mac's resources when you need to do something that 
>>> needs a lot of them but still able to boot in to windows quickly through 
>>> fusion when you don't need to do something system intensive.
>>> 2. The quick install option in fusion will have fusion install windows 
>>> without sighted assistance. The only thing you need do after installation 
>>> is install you're screen reader of choice.
>>> HTH,
>>> 
>>> On 2012-06-03, at 5:26 PM, Allison Mervis wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Thanks Matt. Right now I'm still unsure as to whether or not I'll set up a 
>>>> virtual machine or do a bootcamp install, but this info was very helpful.
>>>> Allison
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>

Re: VMWare Fusion questions

[Chris Meredith]

Hi Maria,

I'm actually running Windows 8 on a MacBook Pro with 8 GB of RAM, which I 
deliberately got kitted out so that I could run multiple virtual machines 
without having to buy multiple computers.  I can't remember what the CPU is on 
the Mini, but you should certainly have enough memory.
For those of you that have gone the Bootcamp route, have any of you also used 
the Windows Automated Installation Kit to create an unattended installation 
file?  As someone that has reliable sighted help available approximately as 
frequently as they have a six digit bank balance, I'm always on the lookout for 
workarounds.
On Jun 3, 2012, at 9:45 PM, Maria Chapman wrote:

> Hi.
> 
> I am also thinking about setting up a virtual machine.  Is there a 
> recommended amount of resources the virtual machine needs to run properly but 
> leaving enough for the mac? Will a virtual machine run ok on a mac mini with 
> 8 gigs of ram? And, how do I run a screen reader with an apple bluetooth 
> keyboard? Is there a way to make this work? Or would i be better plugging in 
> a standard usb keyboard?
> 
> Is there anywhere i can go to read a tutorial or guide about setting up a 
> virtual machine to run windows?
> 
> thanks
> 
> God Bless! Maria from australia
>  Newbie mac user.
> bubbygirl1...@gmail.com
> will get you fb as well as email & iMessage.   
> skype same as email,without the gmail part. twitter bubbygirl 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 04/06/2012, at 12:46 PM, Brent Harding wrote:
> 
>> Oh, cool! I have my mac already set up with boot camp. Would I likely have 
>> activation issues with JFW going back and forth between these 2 methods? 
>> Would I have to take up 2 keys, or is Fusion smart enough to deal with it?
>> 
>> - Original Message - From: "Matthew Campbell" 
>> 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2012 4:44 PM
>> Subject: Re: VMWare Fusion questions
>> 
>> 
>> Hi.
>> A couple of things to keep in mind.
>> 1. If you do go the boot cam route, you will need sighted assistance to get 
>> windows installed. Also, you'll be able to have Fusion treat the bootcamp 
>> partition as a virtual machine. This has some advantages such as being able 
>> to utilized all of the Mac's resources when you need to do something that 
>> needs a lot of them but still able to boot in to windows quickly through 
>> fusion when you don't need to do something system intensive.
>> 2. The quick install option in fusion will have fusion install windows 
>> without sighted assistance. The only thing you need do after installation is 
>> install you're screen reader of choice.
>> HTH,
>> 
>> On 2012-06-03, at 5:26 PM, Allison Mervis wrote:
>> 
>>> Thanks Matt. Right now I'm still unsure as to whether or not I'll set up a 
>>> virtual machine or do a bootcamp install, but this info was very helpful.
>>> Allison
>>> 
>>> --
>>> From: "Matthew Campbell" 
>>> Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2012 1:11 PM
>>> To: 
>>> Subject: Re: VMWare Fusion questions
>>> 
 Hi.
 Once you shut down the VM, you're Mac will indeed have all of it's 
 resources once again.
 HTH,
 
 On 2012-06-03, at 3:51 PM, Allison Mervis wrote:
 
> Hi everyone.
> I have a copy of Windows 7 floating around here, and I was thinking about 
> playing with VMWare fusion. I have a few questions before I get started 
> though. I understand that when you're setting up the virtual machine, you 
> allocate a certain portion of your system resources in order to run it. 
> Let's say, for example that I allocate four of my eight gigs of ram and 
> 250 of my 750 gigs of hard drive space for the virtual machine. When I 
> shut down the virtual machine, will those resources be returned to my 
> mac? That is to say, will I once again have all 8 gigs of ram and 750 
> gigs of hard drive space available for use on my mac? I apologize if this 
> sounds basic. Thanks.
> Allison
> 
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DVD Player Question

[Chris Meredith]

Greetings.

I could be completely misremembering (I'm returning to the world of Mac after a 
six year absence and everything), but I seem to remember that there was a way 
to accessibly use the DVD player (and by "use", I mean actually access chapter 
titles and things, even if this took a dependency on an Internet database being 
up to date or something).
Unfortunately, after popping in a disc of Law and Order: UK, I found that 
opening the "Go -> Title" menu yielded ... a list of numbers in sequence from 1 
to 19.  The Chapter menu was similarly useless.  I do, however, distinctly 
remember being able to access other DVDs.  As someone who takes objection to 
having appliances that only the sighted people in their household (all one of 
them) can use effectively, I'm curious if there's something I'm missing ... 
because trying to get a Mac Mini (DVD player) to interoperate with a Windows 
Media Center PC (cable box) is far less nauseating than having to have sighted 
help to watch movies not downloaded through iTunes (I suppose there's a third 
option, reencoding everything and copying to some sort of NAS, but that ... is 
time consuming).

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