Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Brad Knowles wrote: Yeah, but rate-limiting is nothing like having all your e-mail silently dropped on the floor. At least you're getting something through, and you usually know something about that fact. Obviously ... I just mentioned it to show AOL's general perspective towards people who participate in the feedback loop program. david -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/14/08, Ralf Hildebrandt wrote: Care to share a picture of how it looks? No retard aoluser was able to send me a screenshot. Yet. It differs depending on which version of which client you're running on which platform. Is there a specific version you're looking for? -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/14/08, David Gibbs wrote: Obviously ... I just mentioned it to show AOL's general perspective towards people who participate in the feedback loop program. Their attitude towards us is better than their attitude towards the rest of the effluent. At least we're floating on top. -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Brad Knowles wrote: On 8/14/08, David Gibbs wrote: Obviously ... I just mentioned it to show AOL's general perspective towards people who participate in the feedback loop program. Their attitude towards us is better than their attitude towards the rest of the effluent. At least we're floating on top. End original message. - Yes, but being on a shaky, leaky canoe ready to sink or capsize on top of a cesspool is still not a very nice place to be. ;-) Dragon ~~~ Venimus, Saltavimus, Bibimus (et naribus canium capti sumus) ~~~ -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/14/08, Dragon wrote: Yes, but being on a shaky, leaky canoe ready to sink or capsize on top of a cesspool is still not a very nice place to be. Who said you had the luxury of being in a canoe? You're swimming in it, buddy. They're squatting somewhere above you, and you just hope that you have enough time to swim away from the direction and area of impact when they decide to let loose again. Oh, and you want to be real careful when you try to breathe. -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/12/08, Mark Sapiro wrote: I think he was suggesting that Mailman could somehow put something like a rot13 encoded version of the recipient's address into a personalized list footer to sneak it past AOL's eliding of screen names. In the ARF reports, I don't think you're going to see copies of the footers. Not even copies of the message. Just the headers, of which all the useful information will be deleted by AOL. Moreover, even if you did get copies of the footers (as you have in the past, with the non-ARF reports), the people at AOL are smart enough to see that there is non-anonymized information in the footers and to fix that with the next update of the software. So, either way, we're screwed. AOL is determined to delete any and all data that would actually be useful to us in our jobs, and they are determined to file all these reports automatically. So do what I do -- file them automatically, in a folder that you never go look in. -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/13/08 1:07 AM, Brad Knowles at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, either way, we're screwed. AOL is determined to delete any and all data that would actually be useful to us in our jobs, and they are determined to file all these reports automatically. So do what I do -- file them automatically, in a folder that you never go look in. Why even receive them at that point? They're little more than spam themselves so maybe it's time to ban all mail from AOL as AOL will then be a known spammer. :-( -- Larry Stone [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.stonejongleux.com/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Hi there, Larry Stone: Why even receive them at that point? They're little more than spam themselves so maybe it's time to ban all mail from AOL as AOL will then be a known spammer. :-( Because you can always claim you treat their reports seriously. ;) Actually, when lists are personalized you can always use Message-ID to look up your nice AOL citizen. That't what I do as I use full personalization option. Yours, -- Zbigniew Szalbot www.LCWords.com -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Zbigniew Szalbot wrote: Actually, when lists are personalized you can always use Message-ID to look up your nice AOL citizen. That't what I do as I use full personalization option. I'm confused. How do you use the Message-ID for this? Even when messages are fully personalized, every recipient's message has the Message-ID of the original, incoming message. -- Mark Sapiro [EMAIL PROTECTED]The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On Wed, 13 Aug 2008, Mark Sapiro wrote: I'm confused. How do you use the Message-ID for this? Even when messages are fully personalized, every recipient's message has the Message-ID of the original, incoming message. It may depend on how your MTA is set up. On my lists, there is an internal Received: line where the mailman machine hands off the message to itself. That message ID allows me to lookup the recipient despite AOL's obfuscation. Here's an example from a test list, luckly someone just tested it: (Mycroft is the border mail machine, Friday is the web/mailman server) If I had a complaint I would look up message ID m7DF2jJX008532 on host Friday. Received: from friday.westnet.com (Friday.westnet.com [216.187.52.6]) by westnet.com (8.14.0/8.14.0) with ESMTP id m7DF301M001618 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Wed, 13 Aug 2008 11:03:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from friday.westnet.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by friday.westnet.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m7DF2jJX008532 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Wed, 13 Aug 2008 11:02:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Mycroft.westnet.com (Mycroft.westnet.com [216.187.52.7]) by friday.westnet.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m7DF1ddZ008518 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Wed, 13 Aug 2008 11:01:44 -0400 (EDT) == Chris Candreva -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- (914) 948-3162 WestNet Internet Services of Westchester http://www.westnet.com/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On Wed, 13 Aug 2008, Christopher X. Candreva wrote: On Wed, 13 Aug 2008, Mark Sapiro wrote: I'm confused. How do you use the Message-ID for this? Even when messages are fully personalized, every recipient's message has the Message-ID of the original, incoming message. It may depend on how your MTA is set up. On my lists, there is an internal Received: line where the mailman machine hands off the message to itself. That message ID allows me to lookup the recipient despite AOL's obfuscation. Here's an example from a test list, luckly someone just tested it: (Mycroft is the border mail machine, Friday is the web/mailman server) If I had a complaint I would look up message ID m7DF2jJX008532 on host Friday. Received: from friday.westnet.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by friday.westnet.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m7DF2jJX008532 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Wed, 13 Aug 2008 11:02:45 -0400 (EDT) That's not a Message ID, that's a queue ID. And yes, I do the same thing. -- Larry Stone [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On Wed, 13 Aug 2008, Larry Stone wrote: That's not a Message ID, that's a queue ID. And yes, I do the same thing. Ah yes, of course you are right. As you said though -- either way, it works. :-) == Chris Candreva -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- (914) 948-3162 WestNet Internet Services of Westchester http://www.westnet.com/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Brad Knowles wrote: So, either way, we're screwed. AOL is determined to delete any and all data that would actually be useful to us in our jobs, and they are determined to file all these reports automatically. And I'm *SURE* they will _never_ consider moving the Report to TOS button away from the Delete Message button ... or asking if the user is sure they want to report a message to TOS. sigh -- IBM i on Power - For when you can't afford to be out of business -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Mark Sapiro writes: Zbigniew Szalbot wrote: Actually, when lists are personalized you can always use Message-ID to look up your nice AOL citizen. That't what I do as I use full personalization option. I'm confused. How do you use the Message-ID for this? Even when messages are fully personalized, every recipient's message has the Message-ID of the original, incoming message. Well, we could provide a Resent-Message-ID. If it's not present in the AOL bounce and they won't provide it, we just say We log every outgoing message so we can fix these problems. Provide the corresponding Resent-Message-ID or it's not our problem, you're simply arbitrarily throwing away your customers' mail. But what it really comes down to is that they are arbitrarily throwing away their customers' mail, and their customers apparently like it that way. -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
But what it really comes down to is that they are arbitrarily throwing away their customers' mail, and their customers apparently like it that way. I would be MORE prone to believe that their customers have absolutely NO CLUE, Stephan and being aolers don't 'care' enough to complain (even IF they know how to) -:)-:)!! Ed -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/13/08, Larry Stone wrote: Why even receive them at that point? They're little more than spam themselves so maybe it's time to ban all mail from AOL as AOL will then be a known spammer. :-( If you set yourself up to receive them, it's a lot harder for AOL to automatically mark you as a spammer. Unless you actually are a spammer, you're not going to get enough Scomp reports to show up on their radar, and you can pretty much safely ignore them. At least, that's what we've been told by the AOL representative we have been working with. -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/13/08, Ed at JustBrits wrote: I would be MORE prone to believe that their customers have absolutely NO CLUE, Stephan and being aolers don't 'care' enough to complain (even IF they know how to) -:)-:)!! All their customers know is that they are doing everything they can to make the spam pain go away. So, they hit Report as spam for every single message, and boy does that make them feel good. Of course if they thought you were ever throwing away any of their e-mail (spam or not), they'd be really hopping mad. So, you make sure they never find out. -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
So, you make sure they never find out. LMAO, Brad ! Tnx, NEEDED that ! Ed -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Brad Knowles wrote: If you set yourself up to receive them, it's a lot harder for AOL to automatically mark you as a spammer. Actually, in my experience, AOL doesn't give a rats a-- that you are setup for the feedback loop (at least the old program) ... if they thought you might be a spammer they will still rate limit your delivery even if they send feedback to you. david -- IBM i on Power -- For when you can't afford to be out of business. -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/13/08, David Gibbs wrote: Actually, in my experience, AOL doesn't give a rats a-- that you are setup for the feedback loop (at least the old program) ... if they thought you might be a spammer they will still rate limit your delivery even if they send feedback to you. Yeah, but rate-limiting is nothing like having all your e-mail silently dropped on the floor. At least you're getting something through, and you usually know something about that fact. -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
* David Gibbs [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Brad Knowles wrote: So, either way, we're screwed. AOL is determined to delete any and all data that would actually be useful to us in our jobs, and they are determined to file all these reports automatically. And I'm *SURE* they will _never_ consider moving the Report to TOS button away from the Delete Message button ... or asking if the user is sure they want to report a message to TOS. Care to share a picture of how it looks? No retard aoluser was able to send me a screenshot. Yet. -- Ralf Hildebrandt (i.A. des IT-Zentrums) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Charite - Universitätsmedizin BerlinTel. +49 (0)30-450 570-155 Gemeinsame Einrichtung von FU- und HU-BerlinFax. +49 (0)30-450 570-962 IT-Zentrum Standort CBF send no mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
--On Saturday, August 09, 2008 12:16 PM -0500 Robert Braver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While the ARF format allows for the inclusion of the entire message that is the subject of the complaint, AOL will be redacting the message. Perhaps the customized part of the message could include the recipient in ROT13 or some other easily-reversible obfuscation to elude the redact? This would obviously require some code support in Mailman to do the obfuscation. -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On 8/12/08, Kenneth Porter wrote: Perhaps the customized part of the message could include the recipient in ROT13 or some other easily-reversible obfuscation to elude the redact? This would obviously require some code support in Mailman to do the obfuscation. If you're not AOL management, then there's no point in speculating what is technically possible for AOL to implement in their Scomp reports. -- Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED] LinkedIn Profile: http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Brad Knowles wrote: On 8/12/08, Kenneth Porter wrote: Perhaps the customized part of the message could include the recipient in ROT13 or some other easily-reversible obfuscation to elude the redact? This would obviously require some code support in Mailman to do the obfuscation. If you're not AOL management, then there's no point in speculating what is technically possible for AOL to implement in their Scomp reports. I think he was suggesting that Mailman could somehow put something like a rot13 encoded version of the recipient's address into a personalized list footer to sneak it past AOL's eliding of screen names. -- Mark Sapiro [EMAIL PROTECTED]The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
[Mailman-Users] changes at aol
debian Linux mnr.niof.net 2.6.24-1-686 #1 SMP Thu May 8 02:16:39 UTC 2008 i686 GNU/Linux mailman 2.2.11-2 exim4 4.69-6 Before sending out my last mailing (it's an announce list) I set mailman to do 'full personalization' so I could find out who was hitting the spam button. The TOS notifications I got back had this at the top: ALERT: Your feedback loop is not in ARF (Abuse Reporting Format). Beginning September 2, 2008, all feedback loops will be converted to ARF. To learn more about how this will impact you, please read more about how AOL uses ARF at http://postmaster.aol.com/fbl/arfinfo.html. Also read the announcement of our plan to convert all feedback loops to ARF on our blog at http://journals.aol.com/pmtjournal/blog/entries/2008/06/27/aol-converting-all-fbls-to-arf-on-9208/2977. Please make any necessary preparations to accept ARF feedback loops before the September 2, 2008 conversion. To change your existing non-ARF loops to ARF, fill out our online support form at http://postmaster.aol.com/waters/fbl_change_form.html. What exactly is this telling me? Does mailman or exim need to be changed or do I need to do something? -- First ask yourself: What is the worst that can happen? Then prepare to accept it. Then proceed to improve on the worst. -- Dale Carnegie Rick Pasotto[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.niof.net -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On Saturday, August 9, 2008, 11:24:42 AM, Rick Pasotto wrote: RP What exactly is this telling me? Does mailman or exim need to be changed RP or do I need to do something? Follow the links for more information that are provided. It's pretty clear. You don't really have to do anything. The spam reports are moving to the standardized ARF format, and we will no longer have the choice to continue receiving AOL FBL reports in the format you (and I) are receiving them in now. While the ARF format allows for the inclusion of the entire message that is the subject of the complaint, AOL will be redacting the message. This means you will have to track down the individual message by the Message ID in order to identify the email address of the specific recipient. -- Best regards, Robert Braver [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 08/09/2008 12:16 PM, Robert Braver wrote: | On Saturday, August 9, 2008, 11:24:42 AM, Rick Pasotto wrote: | | RP What exactly is this telling me? Does mailman or exim need to be changed | RP or do I need to do something? | | Follow the links for more information that are provided. It's | pretty clear. | | You don't really have to do anything. The spam reports are moving | to the standardized ARF format, and we will no longer have the | choice to continue receiving AOL FBL reports in the format you (and | I) are receiving them in now. | | While the ARF format allows for the inclusion of the entire message | that is the subject of the complaint, AOL will be redacting the | message. | | This means you will have to track down the individual message by | the Message ID in order to identify the email address of the | specific recipient. | If you add personalization in the footer, AOL will not redact it. - -- ~ Steve -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEQEARECAAYFAkid5JMACgkQeERILVgMyvCOWQCYroTkzHWTA0IZlrLE4njDoPhZ RACXTDLbr8yel1dWsKHXcdpbQ/9p9A== =fyiH -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On Saturday, August 9, 2008, 1:40:19 PM, Steven Stern wrote: SS On 08/09/2008 12:16 PM, Robert Braver wrote: [...] SS | This means you will have to track down the individual message by SS | the Message ID in order to identify the email address of the SS | specific recipient. SS If you add personalization in the footer, AOL will not redact it. Today, yes, but not after the changes being made by AOL that is the subject of this thread. http://postmaster.info.aol.com/fbl/arfinfo.html What is the difference between the traditional AOL Feedback Loop format and ARF? The traditional format is a MIME multipart message with one empty text part and one message/rfc822 part with the original message being complained about. Parts of the header of the message being complained about are redacted out, where normally the AOL ScreenName recipient would be present. ARF is defined in a internet draft located at http://www.mipassoc.org/arf/ . ARF messages have three mime parts, one part for general information, one machine parsable and meta data part, and the last part as the original message being complained about. The original message is redacted to protect clear text occurrences of AOL screen names and email addresses. An example ARF report (with redacted message) is provided on the page referenced above. -- Best regards, Robert Braver [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
On Sat, Aug 09, 2008 at 01:49:50PM -0500, Robert Braver wrote: On Saturday, August 9, 2008, 1:40:19 PM, Steven Stern wrote: SS On 08/09/2008 12:16 PM, Robert Braver wrote: [...] SS | This means you will have to track down the individual message by SS | the Message ID in order to identify the email address of the SS | specific recipient. SS If you add personalization in the footer, AOL will not redact it. Today, yes, but not after the changes being made by AOL that is the subject of this thread. The messages I got back from AOL included a header line like: Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED] That 'username' tells me who the AOL member is. Are you saying that will be redacted with the new response format? -- Those words, 'temperate' 'moderate', are words either of political cowardice, or of cunning, or seduction... A thing moderately good is not so good as it ought to be. Moderation in temper is always a virtue, but moderation in principle is a species of vice. -- Thomas Paine Letter to Addressors Rick Pasotto[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.niof.net -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Re: [Mailman-Users] changes at aol
Rick Pasotto wrote: On Sat, Aug 09, 2008 at 01:49:50PM -0500, Robert Braver wrote: On Saturday, August 9, 2008, 1:40:19 PM, Steven Stern wrote: SS On 08/09/2008 12:16 PM, Robert Braver wrote: [...] SS | This means you will have to track down the individual message by SS | the Message ID in order to identify the email address of the SS | specific recipient. SS If you add personalization in the footer, AOL will not redact it. Today, yes, but not after the changes being made by AOL that is the subject of this thread. The messages I got back from AOL included a header line like: Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED] That 'username' tells me who the AOL member is. Are you saying that will be redacted with the new response format? You see that format in the Return-Path: header and maybe also in the Sender: and Errors-To: headers because the envelope sender is VERP'd. If your MTA is doing the VERP, its only in the Return-Path:. If Mailman is doing the VERP because VERP_PERSONALIZED_DELIVERIES is Yes and/or VERP_DELIVERY_INTERVAL = 1, then it's in the other headers too. I was going to suggest you try VERP before I saw this post, however, I don't know the answer to your question. I think you'll have to wait and see. Also, Message-ID was mentioned earlier in this thread. Unless you make changes to Mailman, you can't identify the recipient from the Message-ID because the post is sent to all recipients with the Message-ID of the original incoming message. -- Mark Sapiro [EMAIL PROTECTED]The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
