Re: [mailop] AOL Postmasters - Syntax replacement for http://postmaster.aol.com/faq/mailerfaq.html#syntax

[Ángel]

On 2017-10-24 at 11:33 -0400, Kevin A. McGrail wrote:
> So apparently they do not follow the syntax any more.  Struggling to 
> find out the new syntax.
> 
> Regards,
> KAM


Hello Kevin

Doing a few tests at https://i.aol.com/reg/signup shows:

Username cannot…

a) "Be shorter than 3"
 This is being enforced: «Please make sure that the username field is at
least 3 characters long»

b) or longer than 16 characters.
The userName field has a maxlength of 32
(intriguingly, there's also a hidden usernameEmail of up to 97
characters)

c) Begin with numbers.
This is being enforced «Your username must begin with a letter.»

d) Contain punctuation of any kind (such as periods, underscores, or
dashes).
Both periods and underscores are accepted (they are even offered in the
dropbox), dashes are not.
«Your username may not contain characters such as @, !, * or $.»

Periods and underscores may not begin or end the username, or be
consecutive (not between themselves), ie. these two characters may only
appear when surrounded by alphanumeric ones.

(this condition for periods actually comes from rfc5321, assuming you
want to avoid quoting the local part)


Basically, it seems they added . and _ to the allowed characters, and
doubled the username size.


The error messages at
https://sns-static.aolcdn.com/1.19/reg/resources/js/webreg_validate5-built.js 
also provide relevant information for gathering the rules:

"Please make sure that the username field is at least 3 characters
long."
"Please make sure that the username field is at least 3 characters
long."
"Your username may not exceed "+regPageData.snMax+" characters."
"Your username must begin with a letter."
"Your username may not contain characters such as @, !, * or $.",
"Your username may not contain characters such as @, !, * or $." (funnily, this 
is shown if you enter a space)
"Your username may not contain characters such as @, !, * or $." (this is if it 
is deemed "not alphanumeric")
"Usernames cannot end with a dot (.) or underscore (_)."
"Usernames cannot have consecutive dots (..) or underscores (__)."

"Please make sure that the email address is at least 3 characters long."
"Your email address may not exceed 97 characters."



Best regards


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Re: [mailop] SENDERSCORE

[Benjamin BILLON via mailop]

You might want to register on https://www.senderscore.org/ to get more
information about the score of your IP


-- 

Benjamin

2017-10-25 3:34 GMT+08:00 Justin Frechette :

> Tim,
>
> From my understanding, the nslookup reverseIP.score.senderscore.com will
> result in showing the Return Path Sender Score for that IP. Here's some
> info I quickly found: http://www.dattaproffs.se/2017/02/22/check-your-ips-
> senderscore-from-the-commandline/
>
> If that's what you're doing, and you're seeing your Sender Score, you'll
> actually not want to see it get to 0 - you'll want to see it get to as
> close to 100 as possible!
>
> If you have an IP in the 50s/60s, you can probably expect to see mail
> delivery issues.
>
> Hope that helps clear things up on Sender Score.
>
> Justin
>
> On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 11:23 AM,  wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>>
>> Has anyone else had experience with SenderScore RBL?
>>
>>
>>
>> I find one of our domains on their blacklist and have addressed the issue
>> that presumably got us there, but having difficulty getting any “real”
>> estimates as to how long it will take for our IP reputation to recover.
>>
>>
>>
>> My understanding is that an NSlookup against a particular zone shows if
>> the IP is listed and the last digit indicates the current spam reputation
>> for the blacklisted entry
>>
>>
>>
>> nslookup zzz.yyy.xxx.vvv.score.senderscore.com   (where vvv.xxx.yyy.zzz
>> is the IP you wish to lookup)
>>
>>
>>
>> (our is currently 58, it was 69 last night)
>>
>>
>>
>> Based on that rate of roughly 9 points in 15 hours, it’s going to be a
>> long week if we need to get to “0”.   Does anyone know if that speeds up
>> (“snowballs”) as the reputation improves and/or what threshold it takes to
>> move from “poor” to “neutral” ?
>>
>>
>>
>> I understand that the whole system is automated and can’t be “nudged
>> along”, but SenderScore’s estimate of “a few hours to just over a week” is
>> a bit too vague to be of value.
>>
>>
>>
>> They also couldn’t provide any specifics on the message(s) that triggered
>> the block aside from “approximate time of last spam message” – which makes
>> it hard to correlate which messages triggered the event.
>>
>>
>>
>> We are not on any other blacklists but this one is negatively affecting
>> some of our larger customers.  Murphy’ s Law…
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Tim
>>
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>
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Re: [mailop] SENDERSCORE

[Justin Frechette]

Tim,

>From my understanding, the nslookup reverseIP.score.senderscore.com will
result in showing the Return Path Sender Score for that IP. Here's some
info I quickly found:
http://www.dattaproffs.se/2017/02/22/check-your-ips-senderscore-from-the-commandline/

If that's what you're doing, and you're seeing your Sender Score, you'll
actually not want to see it get to 0 - you'll want to see it get to as
close to 100 as possible!

If you have an IP in the 50s/60s, you can probably expect to see mail
delivery issues.

Hope that helps clear things up on Sender Score.

Justin

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 11:23 AM,  wrote:

> Hello,
>
>
>
> Has anyone else had experience with SenderScore RBL?
>
>
>
> I find one of our domains on their blacklist and have addressed the issue
> that presumably got us there, but having difficulty getting any “real”
> estimates as to how long it will take for our IP reputation to recover.
>
>
>
> My understanding is that an NSlookup against a particular zone shows if
> the IP is listed and the last digit indicates the current spam reputation
> for the blacklisted entry
>
>
>
> nslookup zzz.yyy.xxx.vvv.score.senderscore.com   (where vvv.xxx.yyy.zzz
> is the IP you wish to lookup)
>
>
>
> (our is currently 58, it was 69 last night)
>
>
>
> Based on that rate of roughly 9 points in 15 hours, it’s going to be a
> long week if we need to get to “0”.   Does anyone know if that speeds up
> (“snowballs”) as the reputation improves and/or what threshold it takes to
> move from “poor” to “neutral” ?
>
>
>
> I understand that the whole system is automated and can’t be “nudged
> along”, but SenderScore’s estimate of “a few hours to just over a week” is
> a bit too vague to be of value.
>
>
>
> They also couldn’t provide any specifics on the message(s) that triggered
> the block aside from “approximate time of last spam message” – which makes
> it hard to correlate which messages triggered the event.
>
>
>
> We are not on any other blacklists but this one is negatively affecting
> some of our larger customers.  Murphy’ s Law…
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tim
>
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> mailop@mailop.org
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>
>
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Re: [mailop] list-unsubscribe how do you handle the requests

[Mathieu Bourdin]

Hi Simon,

We deal with these as a regular unsub, as in many cases (except Gmail which is 
why Benjamin was making a special case there I guess)users still have a choice 
between hitting list-unsub and reporting the mail as spam.
The fact is that in the rare cases where we’ve seen a higher ration of unsub 
through the link-unsub link on gmail where also always cases where other 
indicators showed there was an issue on the program in general (low opens, 
complaints on other domains etc…).

Mathieu.

De : Bressier Simon [mailto:bressie...@gmail.com]
Envoyé : mardi 24 octobre 2017 17:29
À : Benjamin BILLON 
Cc : mailop 
Objet : Re: [mailop] list-unsubscribe how do you handle the requests

Well, the definition is going to say that yes, it's an unsub, but what in 
practice... Maybe not to be handled exactly as a spam complaint, but close, in 
my opinion.

2017-10-24 17:24 GMT+02:00 Benjamin BILLON 
>:
Unsub request (that's what it is, right?),  but still differentiated from other 
reasons of unsub.
We're thinking of making a special case for List-unsubs coming from Gmail, too 
(although that's not much of a priority)


--


Benjamin

2017-10-24 23:09 GMT+08:00 Bressier Simon 
>:
Hey all,

Just a brief question about list-unsubscribe, and the way you're using the 
"unsub" requests on sender side.

On your side, are you handling that as an unsub request or more like a spam 
report ?

Thank you in advance !

Simon

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Re: [mailop] AOL Postmasters - Syntax replacement for http://postmaster.aol.com/faq/mailerfaq.html#syntax

[Kevin A. McGrail]

On 10/24/2017 11:27 AM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:

On Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:56:19 -0400, "Kevin A. McGrail" said:


Recently we were alerted to a valid address that did not meet the syntax.

Are you able to tell us in what way it didn't meet the syntax, and how you
confirmed it's valid anyhow?


The syntax used to be:

#What is the correct syntax for AOL e-mail addresses?
#The "user name" is the part of the address that appears before the @ 
symbol: usern...@aol.com.

#Valid AOL e-mail addresses can not:
#Be shorter than 3 or longer than 16 characters.
#Begin with numbers.
#Contain punctuation of any kind (such as periods, underscores, or dashes).

The email contains an underscore.

AOL postmaster responded:


"The email address is xxx_...@aol.com is valid and active at our end. "


So apparently they do not follow the syntax any more.  Struggling to 
find out the new syntax.


Regards,
KAM

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Re: [mailop] list-unsubscribe how do you handle the requests

[Bressier Simon]

Well, the definition is going to say that yes, it's an unsub, but what in
practice... Maybe not to be handled exactly as a spam complaint, but close,
in my opinion.

2017-10-24 17:24 GMT+02:00 Benjamin BILLON :

> Unsub request (that's what it is, right?),  but still differentiated from
> other reasons of unsub.
> We're thinking of making a special case for List-unsubs coming from Gmail,
> too (although that's not much of a priority)
>
>
> --
> 
> Benjamin
>
> 2017-10-24 23:09 GMT+08:00 Bressier Simon :
>
>> Hey all,
>>
>> Just a brief question about list-unsubscribe, and the way you're using
>> the "unsub" requests on sender side.
>>
>> On your side, are you handling that as an unsub request or more like a
>> spam report ?
>>
>> Thank you in advance !
>>
>> Simon
>>
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>>
>>
>
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Re: [mailop] list-unsubscribe how do you handle the requests

[Benjamin BILLON via mailop]

Unsub request (that's what it is, right?),  but still differentiated from
other reasons of unsub.
We're thinking of making a special case for List-unsubs coming from Gmail,
too (although that's not much of a priority)


-- 

Benjamin

2017-10-24 23:09 GMT+08:00 Bressier Simon :

> Hey all,
>
> Just a brief question about list-unsubscribe, and the way you're using the
> "unsub" requests on sender side.
>
> On your side, are you handling that as an unsub request or more like a
> spam report ?
>
> Thank you in advance !
>
> Simon
>
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>
>
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Re: [mailop] AOL Postmasters - Syntax replacement for http://postmaster.aol.com/faq/mailerfaq.html#syntax

[valdis . kletnieks]

On Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:56:19 -0400, "Kevin A. McGrail" said:

> Recently we were alerted to a valid address that did not meet the syntax.

Are you able to tell us in what way it didn't meet the syntax, and how you
confirmed it's valid anyhow?


pgp8_pvw2dwEM.pgp
Description: PGP signature
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[mailop] SENDERSCORE

[timrutherford]

Hello,

 

Has anyone else had experience with SenderScore RBL?

 

I find one of our domains on their blacklist and have addressed the issue
that presumably got us there, but having difficulty getting any "real"
estimates as to how long it will take for our IP reputation to recover.   

 

My understanding is that an NSlookup against a particular zone shows if the
IP is listed and the last digit indicates the current spam reputation for
the blacklisted entry

 

nslookup zzz.yyy.xxx.vvv.score.senderscore.com   (where vvv.xxx.yyy.zzz is
the IP you wish to lookup)

 

(our is currently 58, it was 69 last night) 

 

Based on that rate of roughly 9 points in 15 hours, it's going to be a long
week if we need to get to "0".   Does anyone know if that speeds up
("snowballs") as the reputation improves and/or what threshold it takes to
move from "poor" to "neutral" ? 

 

I understand that the whole system is automated and can't be "nudged along",
but SenderScore's estimate of "a few hours to just over a week" is a bit too
vague to be of value.   

 

They also couldn't provide any specifics on the message(s) that triggered
the block aside from "approximate time of last spam message" - which makes
it hard to correlate which messages triggered the event. 

 

We are not on any other blacklists but this one is negatively affecting some
of our larger customers.  Murphy' s Law.

 

Thanks,

Tim

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[mailop] Hotmail, green SNDS and junk folder placement

[Benjamin BILLON via mailop]

Hello there,

Following Microsoft's folks recommendations (on this list and in ... a
Canadian city a few weeks ago), we're going through tickets as usual, but
we're for now circling around.
I just wonder if other senders witnessed the same as described below:

- SNDS says green
- given the open rates for Hotmail (vs. other ISPs), seed lists tests and
other metrics, much less than 90% of emails are delivered in inbox
- Forefront antispam says SFV:NSPM, SCL:1
- Microsoft antispam says BCL:8. That means "The message is from a bulk
sender that generates a high number of complaints"
- 7 complaints for this sender (from 6 different recipients) this month, as
provided by JMRP. 7. In 24 days.

It doesn't happen for many clients fortunately, but it's quite ...
disturbing.

Cheers,
-- 

Benjamin
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[mailop] list-unsubscribe how do you handle the requests

[Bressier Simon]

Hey all,

Just a brief question about list-unsubscribe, and the way you're using the
"unsub" requests on sender side.

On your side, are you handling that as an unsub request or more like a spam
report ?

Thank you in advance !

Simon
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Re: [mailop] Anyone from Optonline.net on here?

[Tony Rose]

Thank you Chris! I will use the resource below.

Best,
Tony

From: Chris Truitt [mailto:truitta...@outlook.com]
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 4:26 PM
To: Tony Rose ; mailop@mailop.org
Subject: Re: Anyone from Optonline.net on here?


Tony,



I've always communicated with them through their support portal. 
https://www.optimum.net/support/livepage/chat
They will likely ask you to provide the bounce code and to resend the bounce 
message to their support address. Also they reference Spamhaus, CBL (Composite 
Block list) and Cloudmark.



Chris Truitt


From: mailop > on 
behalf of Tony Rose >
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 5:04:57 PM
To: mailop@mailop.org
Subject: [mailop] Anyone from Optonline.net on here?

Looking for a contact to send mitigation requests to for Optonline.

Thanks,
Tony

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[mailop] AOL Postmasters - Syntax replacement for http://postmaster.aol.com/faq/mailerfaq.html#syntax

[Kevin A. McGrail]

Hello,

AOL published for eons a valid syntax for usernames at 
http://postmaster.aol.com/faq/mailerfaq.html#syntax


http://web.archive.org/web/20081219125609/http://postmaster.aol.com:80/faq/mailerfaq.html

*What is the correct syntax for AOL e-mail addresses?*

   The "user name" is the part of the address that appears before the @
   symbol: usern...@aol.com.
   Valid AOL e-mail addresses can not:

 * Be shorter than 3 or longer than 16 characters.
 * Begin with numbers.
 * Contain punctuation of any kind (such as periods, underscores,
   or dashes).

Recently we were alerted to a valid address that did not meet the syntax.

I'm trying to find the current syntax and getting a runaround from level 
1 techs.


Regards,

KAM

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Re: [mailop] outlook.com and greylisting

[Mark Foster]

Good tips. I'm running postfix/postgrey.

The combination of rolling source IP's and long periods between retries 
seems to be the killer here. I also have quite a bit (but not all) of 
the email that passes through this server channeled via an antispam 
cloud service, this has probably shielded me from the collateral damage 
of my greylisting for a while.


Will look into what options exist for postgrey that'll do similar to 
what you're describing as a start, certainly subnetmatching to /24 or 
/64 and whitelisting for spf passes seem to be quite logical.


Thanks,
Mark.


On 24/10/2017 10:20 p.m., Benoit Panizzon wrote:

Hi Mark

Outlook is not the only one that re-sends and email from a different ip
with each attempt.

What tool do you use for greylisting?

I can recommend milter-greylist which has ways to react to such
situations:

subnetmatch /24
subnetmatch6 /64

will consider ip addresses within a /24 IPv4 and /64 IPv6 network to be
same.

racl whitelist spf pass

Will not greylist from sender which pass SPF checks, which is
reasonable as you want to block out all those botnet drones which
hopefully do not retry to send an email after the first attempt.

Real mailservers would retry and therefore it is helpfull to avoid
greylisting them anyway.

And another feature:

dnsrbl "DNSWL" list.dnswl.org 127.0.0.0/16
racl whitelist dnsrbl "DNSWL"

Will also whitelist ranges from dnswl.org

-Benoît Panizzon-



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Re: [mailop] outlook.com and greylisting

[Benoit Panizzon]

Hi Mark

Outlook is not the only one that re-sends and email from a different ip
with each attempt.

What tool do you use for greylisting?

I can recommend milter-greylist which has ways to react to such
situations:

subnetmatch /24
subnetmatch6 /64

will consider ip addresses within a /24 IPv4 and /64 IPv6 network to be
same.

racl whitelist spf pass

Will not greylist from sender which pass SPF checks, which is
reasonable as you want to block out all those botnet drones which
hopefully do not retry to send an email after the first attempt.

Real mailservers would retry and therefore it is helpfull to avoid
greylisting them anyway.

And another feature:

dnsrbl "DNSWL" list.dnswl.org 127.0.0.0/16
racl whitelist dnsrbl "DNSWL"

Will also whitelist ranges from dnswl.org

-Benoît Panizzon-
-- 
I m p r o W a r e   A G-Leiter Commerce Kunden
__

Zurlindenstrasse 29 Tel  +41 61 826 93 00
CH-4133 PrattelnFax  +41 61 826 93 01
Schweiz Web  http://www.imp.ch
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[mailop] outlook.com and greylisting

[Mark Foster]

Hi All,

I run a personal MTA but I host a few not-for-profits and such.
Recently one of my users reported substantial delays on inbound emails, 
so I had a quick look... it turns out email from outlook.com was being 
seriously hindered by Greylisting.
The retry rate on a 4xx error seems to be very slow (almost precisely an 
hour between retry attempts) and of course, the source IP address 
changes with each retry, so the Greylisting timers are always reset to 
zero... clearly I don't do enough mail volume to keep the timers up to a 
point where I know i'm getting 'clean' email.


The only way I can see to reliably resolve this is to try to whitelist 
the sending IP's (is this even practical?)  It'd be nice of messages 
from outlook.com were retried from the same source IP... this behavior 
seems to make greylisting on relatively low-volume mail servers 
something of a hassle, and across many years of running the MTA 
configured essentially this way, this is the first time i've had this 
sort of behavior reported.


Cheers,
Mark.


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