should have addressed it to Jan...
David H
On Fri, 24 Aug 2018 at 10:07, David Hofstee
wrote:
> Hi David C,
>
> I've had my dealings with these quote sites... It may apply to you. The
> actions you take seem to target email address validity, but Google cites
> complaints as the issue. None of your answers seem to target the problem of
> "do recipients want the email" effectively imho.
>
> My question would be: Why would the customer ask for an email address if
> the recipient only wants the quote?
> Answer: Because the customer doesn't want to "lose" the recipient.
>
> Question: Does the recipient want anything more than the quote?
> Answer: Likely (s)he does not.
>
> You can:
> - Test this by measuring how many temporary email addresses are in the
> list (e.g. @mailinator.com). If that percentage is relatively high,
> recipients do not trust and/or want to have a relationship with the sender.
> Otherwise they would provide their real email address.
> - Measure this by adding a "complaint" option in the unsubscribe form (so
> you can measure how many recipients didn't want the mails). Be sure to add
> a "free field" so people can explain why. Getting complaints and "the
> story" behind such issues is what deliverability is about... The
> unsubscribe form is by far the most useful tool to understand what
> recipients are thinking.
>
> Bottom line is that unless the recipient wants and expects every email,
> providing him/her with real value, the spam button will be hit... In this
> business case, getting data from the recipient to entice him/her into
> further contact is maybe seen as "aggressive" and people get to vote with
> the spam button.
>
> Yours,
>
>
> David H.
>
> On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 at 21:26, Jan Schapmans
> wrote:
>
>> Hi David,
>>
>>
>>
>> thank you very much for your answer.
>>
>>
>>
>> I think you are fully right stating that only changing the sending domain
>> and/or IP addresses won’t help.
>>
>> That’s just why we continue trying other things at the same time
>>
>>- only targeting recent engaged (open/click) users from the last 10
>>days
>>- making sure all clicks on unsubscribe link are processed as an
>>unsubscribe (without the users completely processing the unsubscribe flow)
>>- deduplicate all send outs (we’ve noticed some users are more than
>>once in the system because they’ve filed multiple requests)
>>
>>
>>
>> Only thing missing in their best practices, if we are not missing
>> anything, is that they don’t do double optin. To get them to implement
>> double optin, we are pushing to do this only for Gmail.
>>
>>
>>
>> We are:
>>
>>- using DMARC with reject policy
>>- all emails singed with DKIM
>>- Google postmaster ip reputation BAD, domain reputation BAD &
>>complaint rate ok and of course very low at the end because of no inbox
>>placement. In the feedback loop there is no mentioning of any identifier
>>you can see below we were in a happy place first, and slowly it got
>>worse & worse
>>- list is acquired by a webform where users request a valuation of
>>their car
>>- customer doesn’t want to do double optin, we are pushing to only
>>implement it for gmail & googlemail addresses.
>>(do you think gmail is also monitoring other domains? google apps?)
>>- spam message says (sorry for the Dutch)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> kr,
>>
>>
>>
>> Jan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* David Carriger
>> *Sent:* 22 August 2018 22:13
>> *To:* Jan Schapmans ; mailop@mailop.org
>> *Subject:* Re: Gmail - Anybody out there from Gmail, willing to assist
>> with strange reputation issue
>>
>>
>>
>> Changing the sending domain and the IP addresses won't help at all if you
>> haven't solved the underlying issue, you're just kicking the deliverability
>> can down the road. Is the domain using DMARC to prevent spoofing, and
>> what's the policy? Are all emails signed with DKIM? What does Google
>> Postmaster Tools show for IP reputation, domain reputation, and complaint
>> rates? How is the customer acquiring their list? Are they using double
>> opt-in? When an email goes to the spam folder, does Gmail show a banner
>> saying why it was sent to spam? If so, what's the banner say?
>>
>> Gmail is very good at spam filtering, so your best bet is to assume
>> there's a problem with the sender's practices and work backwards from there.
>> --
>>
>> *From:* mailop on behalf of Jan Schapmans <
>> jan.schapm...@selligent.com>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 22, 2018 8:25:46 AM
>> *To:* mailop@mailop.org
>> *Subject:* [mailop] Gmail - Anybody out there from Gmail, willing to
>> assist with strange reputation issue
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear Gmail,
>>
>>
>>
>> we are having for a UK customer an inboxing problem with Gmail and only
>> Gmail. Over a month ago we’ve changed their ip addresses, changed their
>> sending domains, started warming up again, all was good until a few week
>> ago: the reputation of ip’s &
