Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Fmiser]

> Mitch Haley wrote:

> If I put a 605 head and manifolds on the 602, along with a big
> bore 602 injection pump, should I call it a 605 or a 602
> engine?

603.5

--   Philip

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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Dieselhead]

Rolf wrote:
Fwiw I contacted the eBay seller and asked him to post up at STD. 
His 190sl will be 605 powered.


Now that's a rare engine around here.
Was the 605 ever sold in North America?

I've long thought about converting a 2.3-16v to a 2.5-20v.
Aside from the cylinder head it would be very similar to the 1987 
2.5 turbo, and I've got a 2.5 turbo parts car. If I put a 605 head 
and manifolds on the 602, along with a big bore 602 injection pump, 
should I call it a 605 or a 602 engine?


Mitch.


OM603.5  or maybe OM602/605 since OM603.5 might be confusticated with OM603.

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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Mitch Haley]

Rolf wrote:

Fwiw I contacted the eBay seller and asked him to post up at STD. His 190sl 
will be 605 powered.


Now that's a rare engine around here.
Was the 605 ever sold in North America?

I've long thought about converting a 2.3-16v to a 2.5-20v.
Aside from the cylinder head it would be very similar to the 1987 2.5 turbo, and 
I've got a 2.5 turbo parts car. If I put a 605 head and manifolds on the 602, 
along with a big bore 602 injection pump, should I call it a 605 or a 602 engine?


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Benz Hogs]

Oh, right, sorry I forgot that simple fact.

Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (159,xxx mi)

On 2/1/2013 11:42 PM, clay monroe wrote:

Sorry Luther, these cars are meant to run for at least a million miles, as 
stated endlessly in countless CL listings.  I would expect to be able to do 
that sort of engine life on any fuel I could find that would detonate on 
compression.  Why do you limit yourself to such low mileage?

clay

On Feb 1, 2013, at 8:54 PM, Benz Hogs wrote:


Out of an old Benz diesel?  If properly cared for, greater than 500kmi.

Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)

On 2/1/2013 8:11 PM, OK Don wrote:

Ah, but someone has to try it to get that long term data. How much long
term life do you need from a 20-40 year old car?

On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Benz Hogs  wrote:


There is no  scientific research that shows long-term WVO use not causing
life-ending damage to a diesel engine. This is a reason no car
manufacturers are exploring WVO/VO as a viable fuel source.



Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)



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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Rolf]

Fwiw I contacted the eBay seller and asked him to post up at STD. His 190sl 
will be 605 powered.

Sent from my Droid Charge on Verizon 4G LTE

Max Dillon  wrote:

>Don't remember, have that saved somewhere.  Let me know if you'd like me to 
>dig it up.
>
>-- 
>Max Dillon
>Charleston SC
>'95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20
>
>Jim Cathey  wrote:
>
>>> a small diesel engine was the test subject.
>>
>>Direct or indirect injection?  I thought one of the
>>main reasons that MB used IDI engines was to better
>>tolerate poor fuel.
>>
>>-- Jim
>>
>>
>>
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>
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Max Dillon]

Don't remember, have that saved somewhere.  Let me know if you'd like me to dig 
it up.

-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20

Jim Cathey  wrote:

>> a small diesel engine was the test subject.
>
>Direct or indirect injection?  I thought one of the
>main reasons that MB used IDI engines was to better
>tolerate poor fuel.
>
>-- Jim
>
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[clay monroe]

Sorry Luther, these cars are meant to run for at least a million miles, as 
stated endlessly in countless CL listings.  I would expect to be able to do 
that sort of engine life on any fuel I could find that would detonate on 
compression.  Why do you limit yourself to such low mileage?

clay

On Feb 1, 2013, at 8:54 PM, Benz Hogs wrote:

> Out of an old Benz diesel?  If properly cared for, greater than 500kmi.
> 
> Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
> '98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)
> 
> On 2/1/2013 8:11 PM, OK Don wrote:
>> Ah, but someone has to try it to get that long term data. How much long
>> term life do you need from a 20-40 year old car?
>> 
>> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Benz Hogs  wrote:
>> 
>>> There is no  scientific research that shows long-term WVO use not causing
>>> life-ending damage to a diesel engine. This is a reason no car
>>> manufacturers are exploring WVO/VO as a viable fuel source.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
>>> '98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[clay monroe]

>From what I find at PnP, you have it nailed down.  The VW will last almost 
>half as long as your MB, unless you crash the car.

clay


On Feb 1, 2013, at 7:20 PM, OK Don wrote:

> No study to quote, but comparing the results of studies based on "a small
> Diesel engine" and a VW Diesel engine to running the same fuel in a
> Mercedes Diesel engine like comparing apples to oranges.
> I'm only hoping that my VW Diesel will last half as long as an MB Diesel
> would.
> 
> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 9:12 PM, Max Dillon wrote:
> 
>> Years ago I found a university study, a small diesel engine was the test
>> subject.  First they took it apart and checked the tolerances, then ran it
>> a number of hours on virgin vegetable oil, then measured the tolerances
>> again.  They found significant wear.
>> 
>> I think Elsbett or some other after-market proponent of VO fuel worked
>> with VW to see what the best solution was they could build, and the wear
>> was not acceptable.
>> 
>> If someone knows of a study that says otherwise, please provide a link.
>> 
>> --
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> OK Don
> 2001 ML320
> 2012 Passat TDI DSG
> 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
> 1957 C182A
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Jim Cathey]

a small diesel engine was the test subject.


Direct or indirect injection?  I thought one of the
main reasons that MB used IDI engines was to better
tolerate poor fuel.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Benz Hogs]

Out of an old Benz diesel?  If properly cared for, greater than 500kmi.

Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)

On 2/1/2013 8:11 PM, OK Don wrote:

Ah, but someone has to try it to get that long term data. How much long
term life do you need from a 20-40 year old car?

On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Benz Hogs  wrote:


There is no  scientific research that shows long-term WVO use not causing
life-ending damage to a diesel engine. This is a reason no car
manufacturers are exploring WVO/VO as a viable fuel source.



Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)








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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Dan Penoff]

I wouldn't know the difference. Just quoting their copy.

Sorry.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

On Feb 1, 2013, at 10:56 AM, Benz Hogs  wrote:

> BZ, that's a WVO car, not BioD.  BIG difference.  I quote from 
> the eBay add:
> "
> Own the first car to ever compete in an international road race using waste 
> cooking oil (WCO) or Biodiesel!!
> "
> WRONG!  WVO/WCO ≠ biodiesel.
> 
> Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
> '98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)
> 
> On 2/1/2013 7:29 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:
>> Check out BAT (Bring a Trailer) today for a crazy 1959 190D set up for 
>> racing and bio diesel.
>> 
>> Dan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
> 
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Max Dillon]

It is also true that some on this list and others that I know if have gotten 
40,000 miles or more using WVO as fuel in a 123.

-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20

OK Don  wrote:

>No study to quote, but comparing the results of studies based on "a
>small
>Diesel engine" and a VW Diesel engine to running the same fuel in a
>Mercedes Diesel engine like comparing apples to oranges.
>I'm only hoping that my VW Diesel will last half as long as an MB
>Diesel
>would.
>
>On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 9:12 PM, Max Dillon
>wrote:
>
>> Years ago I found a university study, a small diesel engine was the
>test
>> subject.  First they took it apart and checked the tolerances, then
>ran it
>> a number of hours on virgin vegetable oil, then measured the
>tolerances
>> again.  They found significant wear.
>>
>> I think Elsbett or some other after-market proponent of VO fuel
>worked
>> with VW to see what the best solution was they could build, and the
>wear
>> was not acceptable.
>>
>> If someone knows of a study that says otherwise, please provide a
>link.
>>
>> --
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20
>>
>>


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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[OK Don]

No study to quote, but comparing the results of studies based on "a small
Diesel engine" and a VW Diesel engine to running the same fuel in a
Mercedes Diesel engine like comparing apples to oranges.
I'm only hoping that my VW Diesel will last half as long as an MB Diesel
would.

On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 9:12 PM, Max Dillon wrote:

> Years ago I found a university study, a small diesel engine was the test
> subject.  First they took it apart and checked the tolerances, then ran it
> a number of hours on virgin vegetable oil, then measured the tolerances
> again.  They found significant wear.
>
> I think Elsbett or some other after-market proponent of VO fuel worked
> with VW to see what the best solution was they could build, and the wear
> was not acceptable.
>
> If someone knows of a study that says otherwise, please provide a link.
>
> --
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> '95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20
>
>


-- 
OK Don
2001 ML320
2012 Passat TDI DSG
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
1957 C182A
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Max Dillon]

Years ago I found a university study, a small diesel engine was the test 
subject.  First they took it apart and checked the tolerances, then ran it a 
number of hours on virgin vegetable oil, then measured the tolerances again.  
They found significant wear.  

I think Elsbett or some other after-market proponent of VO fuel worked with VW 
to see what the best solution was they could build, and the wear was not 
acceptable.   

If someone knows of a study that says otherwise, please provide a link.

-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'95 E300, '87 300TD, '73 Balboa 20

OK Don  wrote:

>Ah, but someone has to try it to get that long term data. How much long
>term life do you need from a 20-40 year old car?
>
>On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Benz Hogs 
>wrote:
>
>> There is no  scientific research that shows long-term WVO use not
>causing
>> life-ending damage to a diesel engine. This is a reason no car
>> manufacturers are exploring WVO/VO as a viable fuel source.
>>
>>
>>
>> Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
>> '98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)
>>
>>
>>


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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Michael Canfield]

Exactly.  Say you buy a car run on wvo  but with very good service history,
or you buy a car that has never seen wvo but has poor service history,
either way , it is a used car and it is up to you to check it out and make
sure it is a good car before you lay down your cash.  Maybe the previous
owner tells you it was never run on wvo but had straight waste grease
dumped in the tank and run that way with no conversion...

You are buying a 30+ year old car, check it over for defects that you want
to deal with.  If it has been run on wvo but you can find nothing wrong
with it then, like any other used car, why not buy it if the price is right?

Mike
On Feb 1, 2013 9:11 PM, "OK Don"  wrote:

> Ah, but someone has to try it to get that long term data. How much long
> term life do you need from a 20-40 year old car?
>
> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Benz Hogs  wrote:
>
> > There is no  scientific research that shows long-term WVO use not causing
> > life-ending damage to a diesel engine. This is a reason no car
> > manufacturers are exploring WVO/VO as a viable fuel source.
> >
> >
> >
> > Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
> > '98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> OK Don
> 2001 ML320
> 2012 Passat TDI DSG
> 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
> 1957 C182A
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[OK Don]

Ah, but someone has to try it to get that long term data. How much long
term life do you need from a 20-40 year old car?

On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Benz Hogs  wrote:

> There is no  scientific research that shows long-term WVO use not causing
> life-ending damage to a diesel engine. This is a reason no car
> manufacturers are exploring WVO/VO as a viable fuel source.
>
>
>
> Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
> '98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)
>
>
>


-- 
OK Don
2001 ML320
2012 Passat TDI DSG
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
1957 C182A
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Benz Hogs]

There is no  scientific research that shows long-term WVO use not 
causing life-ending damage to a diesel engine. This is a reason no car 
manufacturers are exploring WVO/VO as a viable fuel source.



Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)

On 2/1/2013 10:28 AM, Michael Canfield wrote:

No Luther, not wrong!  Just because it has a setup for wvo does not mean
you cannot run dino or bio-diesel.

This, oh my god, it's a wvo car and is now useless for anything else type
of thinking is absurd.

Mike
On Feb 1, 2013 10:56 AM, "Benz Hogs"  wrote:


BZ, that's a WVO car, not BioD.  BIG difference.  I quote from
the eBay add:
"
Own the first car to ever compete in an international road race using
waste cooking oil (WCO) or Biodiesel!!
"
WRONG!  WVO/WCO ≠ biodiesel.

Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)

On 2/1/2013 7:29 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:


Check out BAT (Bring a Trailer) today for a crazy 1959 190D set up for
racing and bio diesel.

Dan

Sent from my iPad



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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[ernest breakfield]

if i hadn't seen so many badly botched up "conversions", i'd be more 
inclined to agree.
part of the problem is that it's hard to know what kind of crap 
people have run through a car just because its "converted".


doG knows i won't look at a converted car unless i know firsthand 
who did the work and (more importantly) how it was used.



cheers!
e

On 01/Feb/13 08:28, Michael Canfield wrote:

This, oh my god, it's a wvo car and is now useless for anything else type
of thinking is absurd.

Mike


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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Michael Canfield]

No Luther, not wrong!  Just because it has a setup for wvo does not mean
you cannot run dino or bio-diesel.

This, oh my god, it's a wvo car and is now useless for anything else type
of thinking is absurd.

Mike
On Feb 1, 2013 10:56 AM, "Benz Hogs"  wrote:

> BZ, that's a WVO car, not BioD.  BIG difference.  I quote from
> the eBay add:
> "
> Own the first car to ever compete in an international road race using
> waste cooking oil (WCO) or Biodiesel!!
> "
> WRONG!  WVO/WCO ≠ biodiesel.
>
> Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
> '98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)
>
> On 2/1/2013 7:29 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:
>
>> Check out BAT (Bring a Trailer) today for a crazy 1959 190D set up for
>> racing and bio diesel.
>>
>> Dan
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>
> __**_
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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[ernest breakfield]

yes, there's much misunderstanding about Biofuels, but to be fair, that 
statement could mean that he ran it on WVO some of the time and on 
BioDiesel some of the time.



cheers!
e


On 01/Feb/13 07:56, Benz Hogs wrote:
BZ, that's a WVO car, not BioD.  BIG difference.  I quote 
from the eBay add:

"
Own the first car to ever compete in an international road race using 
waste cooking oil (WCO) or Biodiesel!!

"
WRONG!  WVO/WCO ? biodiesel.

Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)

On 2/1/2013 7:29 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:
Check out BAT (Bring a Trailer) today for a crazy 1959 190D set up 
for racing and bio diesel.


Dan

Sent from my iPad


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Re: [MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Benz Hogs]

BZ, that's a WVO car, not BioD.  BIG difference.  I quote 
from the eBay add:

"
Own the first car to ever compete in an international road race using 
waste cooking oil (WCO) or Biodiesel!!

"
WRONG!  WVO/WCO ≠ biodiesel.

Luther   KB5QHUForest Park, IL
'98 ML320 "Max" (160,xxx mi)

On 2/1/2013 7:29 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:

Check out BAT (Bring a Trailer) today for a crazy 1959 190D set up for racing 
and bio diesel.

Dan

Sent from my iPad


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[MBZ] 1959 190D Bio Diesel

[Dan Penoff]

Check out BAT (Bring a Trailer) today for a crazy 1959 190D set up for racing 
and bio diesel.

Dan

Sent from my iPad
___
http://www.okiebenz.com
For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com