Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Dan did, and he has a intermittent dead one already.  On a 60x, then 
only time I would replace all is if I rebuilt the engine or put on a new 
head.  On a 60x, if you take off the intake, then yes, change all, keep 
the good for spares.  Otherwise, change as needed.  You probably had at 
least one burned out before it got to 20 below.



Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
May 29, 2017 at 6:03 PM
Thats been my opinion for glow plugs since I spent a cold winters 
evening replacing two on the '83 240D. My indy had replaced only the 
failed one previously, at 20F the car wouldn't start with two dead 
ones. I vowed "never again"...

-Curt


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Thats been my opinion for glow plugs since I spent a cold winters evening 
replacing two on the '83 240D. My indy had replaced only the failed one 
previously, at 20F the car wouldn't start with two dead ones. I vowed "never 
again"...
-Curt

  From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Meade Dillon 
 Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2017 9:13 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question
   
#3 is in the process of going bad, and after you replace it the light will
behave as normal (until another plug also goes bad, thus the wisdom of
Kaleb).

At one of my last Navy duty stations, the building maintenance folks would
replace all the fluorescent bulbs in a room at once, on a schedule (mean
time between failure I think).  Labor hours are more expensive than bulbs,
less labor involved in sending two guys with a few boxes of bulbs to that
room once every couple of years.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Sun, May 28, 2017 at 9:06 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of
> them at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it
> tests good when cold but is actually bad?
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

I'm sorry Dave I am afraid I can't do that.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 29, 2017, at 8:48 AM, Floyd Thursby via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> It's a fault in the AE-35 unit.  You need to get it out and do a bench test 
> then replace it to see if it actually fails.
> 
> The glow plug light has never been known to have a fault, it is all human 
> error.
> 
> --FT
> 
> 
>> On 5/28/17 9:13 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes wrote:
>> #3 is in the process of going bad, and after you replace it the light will
>> behave as normal (until another plug also goes bad, thus the wisdom of
>> Kaleb).
>> 
>> At one of my last Navy duty stations, the building maintenance folks would
>> replace all the fluorescent bulbs in a room at once, on a schedule (mean
>> time between failure I think).  Labor hours are more expensive than bulbs,
>> less labor involved in sending two guys with a few boxes of bulbs to that
>> room once every couple of years.
>> 
>> -
>> Max
>> Charleston SC
>> 
>> On Sun, May 28, 2017 at 9:06 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of
>>> them at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it
>>> tests good when cold but is actually bad?
>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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>> 
> 
> -- 
> --FT
> Winston Churchill:
> “Never give in--never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large 
> or petty,
> never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense.
> Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the 
> enemy.”
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

It's a fault in the AE-35 unit.  You need to get it out and do a bench 
test then replace it to see if it actually fails.


The glow plug light has never been known to have a fault, it is all 
human error.


--FT


On 5/28/17 9:13 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes wrote:

#3 is in the process of going bad, and after you replace it the light will
behave as normal (until another plug also goes bad, thus the wisdom of
Kaleb).

At one of my last Navy duty stations, the building maintenance folks would
replace all the fluorescent bulbs in a room at once, on a schedule (mean
time between failure I think).  Labor hours are more expensive than bulbs,
less labor involved in sending two guys with a few boxes of bulbs to that
room once every couple of years.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Sun, May 28, 2017 at 9:06 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:


Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of
them at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it
tests good when cold but is actually bad?



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--
--FT
Winston Churchill:
“Never give in--never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or 
petty,
never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense.
Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the 
enemy.”


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

You already answered your question.  Change #3 GP.


Dan--- via Mercedes 
May 28, 2017 at 8:00 AM
So a while back I get a glow plug light while I'm driving down the 
road, after about a minute it goes out. As I understand the 
diagnostics of the GP relay, that probably means I have an open GP.


I test the GPs from the connector at the GP relay and find an open 
circuit on #3. OK, simple enough, my #3 GP has failed.


I order a GP from the dealer in a parts order and get it in the other day.

This morning I go out to test at the harness again to verify its #3 
before I start yanking things apart. All six GPs test the same at 0.7 
ohms. I retest and get the same results.


This morning on my grocery run I got the GP light for the minute or so 
after I was on the road.


What gives?

-D

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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

As far as I know the ones I replaced were all good.  As a consideration of 
“while you’re there you might as well do this” when I replaced the injectors I 
pulled the intake manifold and took advantage of the accessibility to ream out 
the holes and replace all of the glow plugs.

It’s more of a nuisance than anything else, as cold starts aren’t a big issue 
here, especially this time of the year.

They were Bosch glow plugs if it matters.  I ordered one from the dealer this 
time to see what brand it was, but there’s nothing on it as far as labeling 
other than a tristar.

-D


> On May 28, 2017, at 9:46 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Strange one I already failing. Did you have any good ones from when they were 
> all replaced? I would have just used one of those. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On May 28, 2017, at 8:41 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> They were all replaced less than a year ago when I did the injectors.
>> 
>> -D


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Strange one I already failing. Did you have any good ones from when they were 
all replaced? I would have just used one of those. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 28, 2017, at 8:41 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> They were all replaced less than a year ago when I did the injectors.
> 
> -D
> 
> 
>> On May 28, 2017, at 9:06 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of 
>> them at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it 
>> tests good when cold but is actually bad?
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

That’s what the FAA does.  They have a scheduled maintenance window for all of 
the lamps in a given facility, like a VOR, and they take it down, go in and 
replace everything, working or not.

That’s why we have the best navigational infrastructure in the world.  Those 
guys will lock out/tag out a piece of equipment if a $0.50 panel lamp is out.  
I’ve had it happen on equipment I was responsible for.

-D

 
> On May 28, 2017, at 9:13 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> #3 is in the process of going bad, and after you replace it the light will
> behave as normal (until another plug also goes bad, thus the wisdom of
> Kaleb).
> 
> At one of my last Navy duty stations, the building maintenance folks would
> replace all the fluorescent bulbs in a room at once, on a schedule (mean
> time between failure I think).  Labor hours are more expensive than bulbs,
> less labor involved in sending two guys with a few boxes of bulbs to that
> room once every couple of years.
> 
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
> 
> On Sun, May 28, 2017 at 9:06 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of
>> them at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it
>> tests good when cold but is actually bad?
>> 
>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

They were all replaced less than a year ago when I did the injectors.

-D


> On May 28, 2017, at 9:06 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of them 
> at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it tests 
> good when cold but is actually bad?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

#3 is in the process of going bad, and after you replace it the light will
behave as normal (until another plug also goes bad, thus the wisdom of
Kaleb).

At one of my last Navy duty stations, the building maintenance folks would
replace all the fluorescent bulbs in a room at once, on a schedule (mean
time between failure I think).  Labor hours are more expensive than bulbs,
less labor involved in sending two guys with a few boxes of bulbs to that
room once every couple of years.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Sun, May 28, 2017 at 9:06 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of
> them at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it
> tests good when cold but is actually bad?
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Unless it's not a car you are keeping you would generally replace all of them 
at the same time, then keep any good ones as spares. It could be it tests good 
when cold but is actually bad?

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 28, 2017, at 8:00 AM, Dan--- via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> So a while back I get a glow plug light while I'm driving down the road, 
> after about a minute it goes out. As I understand the diagnostics of the GP 
> relay, that probably means I have an open GP.
> 
> I test the GPs from the connector at the GP relay and find an open circuit on 
> #3.  OK, simple enough, my #3 GP has failed.
> 
> I order a GP from the dealer in a parts order and get it in the other day.
> 
> This morning I go out to test at the harness again to verify its #3 before I 
> start yanking things apart.  All six GPs test the same at 0.7 ohms.  I retest 
> and get the same results.
> 
> This morning on my grocery run I got the GP light for the minute or so after 
> I was on the road.
> 
> What gives?
> 
> -D
> 
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[MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

So a while back I get a glow plug light while I'm driving down the road, after 
about a minute it goes out. As I understand the diagnostics of the GP relay, 
that probably means I have an open GP.

I test the GPs from the connector at the GP relay and find an open circuit on 
#3.  OK, simple enough, my #3 GP has failed.

I order a GP from the dealer in a parts order and get it in the other day.

This morning I go out to test at the harness again to verify its #3 before I 
start yanking things apart.  All six GPs test the same at 0.7 ohms.  I retest 
and get the same results.

This morning on my grocery run I got the GP light for the minute or so after I 
was on the road.

What gives?

-D

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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

I'm sure the issue will resurface.  I'll snag a new glow plug on my next order 
from an aftermarket supplier. That way I'll have one handy when I feel the need 
for some serious car repair self abuse.

-D

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 22, 2017, at 8:31 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> The diagnostic circuit is not perfect, so it doesn't always tell you that
> there is a problem.  The glow plug is still bad.
> 
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
> 
> On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 6:28 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> Worked normally this morning. Ambient around 60F, took 25-30 seconds to
>> glow, no glow lights on the 25 minute drive to work.
>> 
>> Hmmm.
>> 
>> -D
>> 
>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

The diagnostic circuit is not perfect, so it doesn't always tell you that
there is a problem.  The glow plug is still bad.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 6:28 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Worked normally this morning. Ambient around 60F, took 25-30 seconds to
> glow, no glow lights on the 25 minute drive to work.
>
> Hmmm.
>
> -D
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Worked normally this morning. Ambient around 60F, took 25-30 seconds to glow, 
no glow lights on the 25 minute drive to work.

Hmmm.

-D

> On Mar 22, 2017, at 5:23 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I did not and it does not have a fuse for the GP relay, only a strip fuse for 
> the ACC blower.
> 
> Based on the initial diagnostics it sounds like the #3 glow plug has failed.  
> The symptoms are pretty much what the manual describes - little or no glow 
> plug light on startup, glow plug light coming on for approximately a minute 
> while engine running.
> 
> -D
> 
> 
>> On Mar 21, 2017, at 10:39 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Did you swap out/in the GP relay and/or fuse (if it has them)?
>> 
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

I did not and it does not have a fuse for the GP relay, only a strip fuse for 
the ACC blower.

Based on the initial diagnostics it sounds like the #3 glow plug has failed.  
The symptoms are pretty much what the manual describes - little or no glow plug 
light on startup, glow plug light coming on for approximately a minute while 
engine running.

-D


> On Mar 21, 2017, at 10:39 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Did you swap out/in the GP relay and/or fuse (if it has them)?
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Did you swap out/in the GP relay and/or fuse (if it has them)?

On Tue, Mar 21, 2017 at 10:32 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Yeah, I bought  one or 2 sets of Beru, but normally just use the Bosch.  I
> generally replace only one at a time because the MTBF is not a narrow
> band.  Some last 20 years, some last 1.  The exception in on an OM603 if I
> am going to take off the manifold and there are at least 2 bad on a car I
> just bought.  Then I may replace all, but I save the good ones to replace
> somewhere when one goes out.
>
> Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
>> March 21, 2017 at 7:28 PM
>> Interesting about the Beru GPs, too. They’re tough to find and about 3x
>> the cost of the Bosch. That’s what I’ll replace it with. The Bosch is about
>> a year old, I replaced them last May.
>>
>> -D
>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Yeah, I bought  one or 2 sets of Beru, but normally just use the Bosch.  
I generally replace only one at a time because the MTBF is not a narrow 
band.  Some last 20 years, some last 1.  The exception in on an OM603 if 
I am going to take off the manifold and there are at least 2 bad on a 
car I just bought.  Then I may replace all, but I save the good ones to 
replace somewhere when one goes out.



Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
March 21, 2017 at 7:28 PM
Interesting about the Beru GPs, too. They’re tough to find and about 
3x the cost of the Bosch. That’s what I’ll replace it with. The Bosch 
is about a year old, I replaced them last May.


-D





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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

On the OM603 and earlier engines, I think Bosch are the best choice, that's
what I just put in my '87 wagon.  Beru is preferred for the OM606 engines
because they seem to be made of sturdier stuff (they publish a maximum
torque that can be applied when removing the plugs, haven't found that for
Bosch) and they were OE.

Oh yeah, Marshall said we had to use Bosch, you don't want to go down that
path

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Tue, Mar 21, 2017 at 8:28 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Interesting about the Beru GPs, too.  They’re tough to find and about 3x
> the cost of the Bosch.  That’s what I’ll replace it with. The Bosch is
> about a year old, I replaced them last May.
>
> -D
>
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Didn't think the compressor was running with the high vent temperatures, so
not KLIMA if you have compressor engaging.

Did some of your refrigerant leak out?

Maybe the car just wants some attention?

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Tue, Mar 21, 2017 at 7:29 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I wondered about the KLIMA, but since I’m getting compressor operation,
> what else would it be affecting?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -D
>
> > On Mar 21, 2017, at 6:41 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Not related.  HVAC sounds like KLIMA relay or push button unit.  If your
> tachometer also died, then the OVP relay would be suspect.
> > --
> > Max Dillon
> > Charleston SC
> > '87 300TD
> > '95 E300
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Interesting about the Beru GPs, too.  They’re tough to find and about 3x the 
cost of the Bosch.  That’s what I’ll replace it with. The Bosch is about a year 
old, I replaced them last May.

-D


> On Mar 21, 2017, at 8:22 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> #3 is not the worst.  1 and 6 are easiest.
> 
>> Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
>> March 21, 2017 at 7:04 PM
>> Did a quick resistance check:
>> 
>> 1 - 0.7 Ω
>> 2 - 0.7 Ω
>> 3 - 25 Ω
>> 4 - 0.7 Ω
>> 5 - 0.7 Ω
>> 6 - 0.7 Ω
>> 
>> So based on this I assume I have a bad #3 glow plug. Of course, as it’s 
>> probably the most difficult one to get to…
>> 
>> I may decide to live with this for a while, since cold weather starting 
>> isn’t an issue here. That is, if it doesn’t drive me nuts first.
>> 
>> -D
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

#3 is not the worst.  1 and 6 are easiest.


Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
March 21, 2017 at 7:04 PM
Did a quick resistance check:

1 - 0.7 Ω
2 - 0.7 Ω
3 - 25 Ω
4 - 0.7 Ω
5 - 0.7 Ω
6 - 0.7 Ω

So based on this I assume I have a bad #3 glow plug. Of course, as 
it’s probably the most difficult one to get to…


I may decide to live with this for a while, since cold weather 
starting isn’t an issue here. That is, if it doesn’t drive me nuts first.


-D




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Curley McLain 
March 21, 2017 at 5:24 PM
the GP light is an indication that you have GPs.  They are not related 
to mileage.  Beru have the reputation to last longer, but that is no 
guarantee.



Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
March 21, 2017 at 4:55 PM
The 350SDL started acting weird this morning….

No glow plug light when I went to start it up, or if it did come on it 
was only for a few seconds and I missed it. Ambient was maybe 50F, 
possibly a little warmer. About 5-10 minutes later as I’m driving down 
the street, the glow plug light comes on and stays on for a short 
time, then goes off.


Weird.

At lunch I went out and the light lit for maybe 5-10 seconds and went 
out. Again, it came on while I was driving a few minutes later for a 
short time and then went out.


Same thing on the drive home today.

As I look at the service manual, it says that one of the fault 
indicators is no preglow lamp at startup, then the light can light up 
for approximately one minute while driving. Fault: One or more glow 
plugs defective.


So I’m wondering if I’ve got a bad glow plug. I just swapped them all 
out less than 10k ago, probably even less than that.


But - there’s more…

The AC started acting up. Hot air, literally HOT air coming out of the 
vents. I checked the monovalve, it’s good. Checked the AC system, 
everything is good there as far as pressures and charge, but the low 
pressure line is not cold. High pressure is.


I put a clamp on the coolant line to the cabin to isolate the heater 
and drove the car. I can get duct temps down to about 70F and that’s 
it. Pressures are correct for the ambient temperature and humidity.


It’s almost like I was getting heat during cooling, but I’m not 
getting decent output from the system to begin with.


Both of these issues started at the same time. I can’t see how they’re 
related.


???

-D


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Did a quick resistance check:

1 - 0.7 Ω
2 - 0.7 Ω
3 - 25 Ω
4 - 0.7 Ω
5 - 0.7 Ω
6 - 0.7 Ω

So based on this I assume I have a bad #3 glow plug. Of course, as it’s 
probably the most difficult one to get to…

I may decide to live with this for a while, since cold weather starting isn’t 
an issue here.  That is, if it doesn’t drive me nuts first.

-D

 
> On Mar 21, 2017, at 6:24 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> the GP light is an indication that you have GPs.  They are not related to 
> mileage.  Beru have the reputation to last longer, but that is no guarantee.


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

And the tach is working.

-D

> On Mar 21, 2017, at 7:29 PM, Dan Penoff  wrote:
> 
> I wondered about the KLIMA, but since I’m getting compressor operation, what 
> else would it be affecting?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> -D
> 
>> On Mar 21, 2017, at 6:41 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Not related.  HVAC sounds like KLIMA relay or push button unit.  If your 
>> tachometer also died, then the OVP relay would be suspect.
>> -- 
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> '87 300TD
>> '95 E300
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

I put a set of Bosch GPs in it.  Can I check resistances from the GP relay like 
you can on OM617s?

Thanks,

-D

> On Mar 21, 2017, at 6:24 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> the GP light is an indication that you have GPs.  They are not related to 
> mileage.  Beru have the reputation to last longer, but that is no guarantee.
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

I wondered about the KLIMA, but since I’m getting compressor operation, what 
else would it be affecting?

Thanks,

-D

> On Mar 21, 2017, at 6:41 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> Not related.  HVAC sounds like KLIMA relay or push button unit.  If your 
> tachometer also died, then the OVP relay would be suspect.
> -- 
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> '87 300TD
> '95 E300


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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Not related.  HVAC sounds like KLIMA relay or push button unit.  If your 
tachometer also died, then the OVP relay would be suspect.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On March 21, 2017 5:55:29 PM EDT, Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
 wrote:
>The 350SDL started acting weird this morning….
>
>No glow plug light when I went to start it up, or if it did come on it
>was only for a few seconds and I missed it.  Ambient was maybe 50F,
>possibly a little warmer.  About 5-10 minutes later as I’m driving down
>the street, the glow plug light comes on and stays on for a short time,
>then goes off.
>
>Weird.
>
>At lunch I went out and the light lit for maybe 5-10 seconds and went
>out.  Again, it came on while I was driving a few minutes later for a
>short time and then went out.
>
>Same thing on the drive home today.
>
>As I look at the service manual, it says that one of the fault
>indicators is no preglow lamp at startup, then the light can light up
>for approximately one minute while driving.  Fault: One or more glow
>plugs defective.
>
>So I’m wondering if I’ve got a bad glow plug.  I just swapped them all
>out less than 10k ago, probably even less than that.
>
>But - there’s more…
>
>The AC started acting up.  Hot air, literally HOT air coming out of the
>vents.  I checked the monovalve, it’s good.  Checked the AC system,
>everything is good there as far as pressures and charge, but the low
>pressure line is not cold.  High pressure is.
>
>I put a clamp on the coolant line to the cabin to isolate the heater
>and drove the car.  I can get duct temps down to about 70F and that’s
>it.  Pressures are correct for the ambient temperature and humidity.
>
>It’s almost like I was getting heat during cooling, but I’m not getting
>decent output from the system to begin with.
>
>Both of these issues started at the same time.  I can’t see how they’re
>related.
>
>???
>
>-D
>
>
>___
>http://www.okiebenz.com
>
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>
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

the GP light is an indication that you have GPs.  They are not related 
to mileage.  Beru have the reputation to last longer, but that is no 
guarantee.



Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
March 21, 2017 at 4:55 PM
The 350SDL started acting weird this morning….

No glow plug light when I went to start it up, or if it did come on it 
was only for a few seconds and I missed it. Ambient was maybe 50F, 
possibly a little warmer. About 5-10 minutes later as I’m driving down 
the street, the glow plug light comes on and stays on for a short 
time, then goes off.


Weird.

At lunch I went out and the light lit for maybe 5-10 seconds and went 
out. Again, it came on while I was driving a few minutes later for a 
short time and then went out.


Same thing on the drive home today.

As I look at the service manual, it says that one of the fault 
indicators is no preglow lamp at startup, then the light can light up 
for approximately one minute while driving. Fault: One or more glow 
plugs defective.


So I’m wondering if I’ve got a bad glow plug. I just swapped them all 
out less than 10k ago, probably even less than that.


But - there’s more…

The AC started acting up. Hot air, literally HOT air coming out of the 
vents. I checked the monovalve, it’s good. Checked the AC system, 
everything is good there as far as pressures and charge, but the low 
pressure line is not cold. High pressure is.


I put a clamp on the coolant line to the cabin to isolate the heater 
and drove the car. I can get duct temps down to about 70F and that’s 
it. Pressures are correct for the ambient temperature and humidity.


It’s almost like I was getting heat during cooling, but I’m not 
getting decent output from the system to begin with.


Both of these issues started at the same time. I can’t see how they’re 
related.


???

-D



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[MBZ] Glow Plug Question / Weirdness

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

The 350SDL started acting weird this morning….

No glow plug light when I went to start it up, or if it did come on it was only 
for a few seconds and I missed it.  Ambient was maybe 50F, possibly a little 
warmer.  About 5-10 minutes later as I’m driving down the street, the glow plug 
light comes on and stays on for a short time, then goes off.

Weird.

At lunch I went out and the light lit for maybe 5-10 seconds and went out.  
Again, it came on while I was driving a few minutes later for a short time and 
then went out.

Same thing on the drive home today.

As I look at the service manual, it says that one of the fault indicators is no 
preglow lamp at startup, then the light can light up for approximately one 
minute while driving.  Fault: One or more glow plugs defective.

So I’m wondering if I’ve got a bad glow plug.  I just swapped them all out less 
than 10k ago, probably even less than that.

But - there’s more…

The AC started acting up.  Hot air, literally HOT air coming out of the vents.  
I checked the monovalve, it’s good.  Checked the AC system, everything is good 
there as far as pressures and charge, but the low pressure line is not cold.  
High pressure is.

I put a clamp on the coolant line to the cabin to isolate the heater and drove 
the car.  I can get duct temps down to about 70F and that’s it.  Pressures are 
correct for the ambient temperature and humidity.

It’s almost like I was getting heat during cooling, but I’m not getting decent 
output from the system to begin with.

Both of these issues started at the same time.  I can’t see how they’re related.

???

-D


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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[OK Don]

Plus, you are measuring the resistance of all the connections in the path,
including the meter to ground side. I had an ammeter for testing glow
plugs, till I permanently wired it into the circuit in the '92 to chase
down an intermittant current drian when off. Still don't know where the
drain is, but starting and immediately killing the engine makes it go away,
so the meter is not wasted.

Back to Hans's problem, my usual approach is to measure the wires from the
relay to the plug, and if good, replace all the glow plugs at once. Like
you said, they're usually all the same age, so when one dies, they all get
replaced.


On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 1:00 AM, Fmiser  wrote:

> > Hans Neureiter wrote:
>
> > Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.
>
> Good. *smiles* Still doesn't mean a reading of 0.9 isn't
> actually 0.8 ohms.  If it's not a 4-lead milliohm meter, then
> it's risky to trust it for such measurements.
>
> > Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?
>
> Yes.  Both.  Most of the time they fail open.  Some times they
> fail shorted.  Occasionally I have seen other states of not good.
>
> > What resistance does a new good GP have?
>
> Based on ohms law, 20 A at 12 V = 0.6 ohm.  With the ammeter
> you can watch the current drop as it heats.  This is a good
> indication that the glow plug is actually glowing.
>
> --   Philip
>

-- 
OK Don
2001 ML320
1992 300D 2.5T
1990 300D 2.5T
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Hans Neureiter]

I should have said South East Teas.

On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 12:34 PM, WILTON  wrote:

> Oh, of course!  'Thought you meant WAY south.  Friend of mine, Lt Col
> (Ret) Joe Ornowski, lives in Katy, also.
>
> Wilton
>
> - Original Message - From: "Hans Neureiter" 
> To: "Mercedes Discussion List" 
> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 1:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question
>
>
> West of Houston (Katy)
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 9:31 AM, WILTON  wrote:
>>
>> Where in South Texas?  I lived in Harlingen for a year, 1960-61.
>>>
>>> Wilton
>>>
>>> - Original Message - From: "Hans Neureiter" 
>>> To: "Mercedes Discussion List" 
>>> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 12:25 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Question comes from some one's post some weeks ago.
>>>
>>>> He replaced all GP's and had readings from good to bad, like 0.9 to 90+
>>>> Ohm
>>>> I know I have to replace # UNO.(DOS, TRES, QUATRO, CHINCO,?)
>>>> A PITA to get to and a small lump of denero.
>>>> God bless South Texas. It hardly ever snows.
>>>> All you snowmobile salesman, you're welcome, but first learn to rope a
>>>> goat.
>>>> I would like a some sort of technicaln input. MB,as always leaves us in
>>>> the
>>>> dark.
>>>> Now I'm getting peturbed. $250K AMG vs. my 30+ year old jewel.
>>>> FYAFIFH. (FH like in fish head)
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Hans Neureiter 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.
>>>>
>>>>> Meter is good. And it is not the idiot reading it.
>>>>> Plugs have been there for the same time under the same conditons.
>>>>> Question to the ever knowing forum is:
>>>>> Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?
>>>>> I have nothing to compare, exept to adhere to Ohms Law and not knowing
>>>>> how
>>>>> the gizissicmos are made, I am confused.
>>>>> Looking at the "Glow Plug"" on my electric stove (heating element)
>>>>> it's a
>>>>> no brainer.
>>>>> Long skinny coiled wire imbedded in ceramic and clad with steel.
>>>>> Of course, my stove top does not encounter vulcanic activities such as
>>>>> extreme heat, shock and tremors. The GP does this 15 times/sec at idle.
>>>>>
>>>>> What resistance does a new good GP have?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 9:15 PM, OK Don  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Either you are correct, and the glow plugs are indeed bad (I've one or
>>>>>
>>>>>> two
>>>>>> that read higher resistance than they should have been) or your meter
>>>>>> needs
>>>>>> calibrating. What does the meter read when you short the two probes
>>>>>> together?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On the other hand, if you don't need all new glow plugs now, you will
>>>>>> at
>>>>>> some time in the future. Go ahead and get them, then decide whether to
>>>>>> replace all of them, or one at a time as they fail. You can also
>>>>>> verify
>>>>>> your meter against a new plug (assuming the new plug is good).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Hans Neureiter 
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> > I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O =
>>>>>> 0.095
>>>>>> > KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
>>>>>> > un-significant.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
>>>>>> > including Ohm’s law.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, >
>>>>>> Electric,
>>>>>> > etc., etc.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
>>>>>> > resistance.
>>>>>

Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[WILTON]

Oh, of course!  'Thought you meant WAY south.  Friend of mine, Lt Col (Ret) 
Joe Ornowski, lives in Katy, also.


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: "Hans Neureiter" 

To: "Mercedes Discussion List" 
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question



West of Houston (Katy)

On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 9:31 AM, WILTON  wrote:


Where in South Texas?  I lived in Harlingen for a year, 1960-61.

Wilton

- Original Message - From: "Hans Neureiter" 
To: "Mercedes Discussion List" 
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 12:25 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question



Question comes from some one's post some weeks ago.

He replaced all GP's and had readings from good to bad, like 0.9 to 90+
Ohm
I know I have to replace # UNO.(DOS, TRES, QUATRO, CHINCO,?)
A PITA to get to and a small lump of denero.
God bless South Texas. It hardly ever snows.
All you snowmobile salesman, you're welcome, but first learn to rope a
goat.
I would like a some sort of technicaln input. MB,as always leaves us in
the
dark.
Now I'm getting peturbed. $250K AMG vs. my 30+ year old jewel.
FYAFIFH. (FH like in fish head)

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Hans Neureiter 
wrote:

Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.

Meter is good. And it is not the idiot reading it.
Plugs have been there for the same time under the same conditons.
Question to the ever knowing forum is:
Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?
I have nothing to compare, exept to adhere to Ohms Law and not knowing
how
the gizissicmos are made, I am confused.
Looking at the "Glow Plug"" on my electric stove (heating element) it's 
a

no brainer.
Long skinny coiled wire imbedded in ceramic and clad with steel.
Of course, my stove top does not encounter vulcanic activities such as
extreme heat, shock and tremors. The GP does this 15 times/sec at idle.

What resistance does a new good GP have?

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 9:15 PM, OK Don  wrote:

Either you are correct, and the glow plugs are indeed bad (I've one or

two
that read higher resistance than they should have been) or your meter
needs
calibrating. What does the meter read when you short the two probes
together?

On the other hand, if you don't need all new glow plugs now, you will 
at

some time in the future. Go ahead and get them, then decide whether to
replace all of them, or one at a time as they fail. You can also 
verify

your meter against a new plug (assuming the new plug is good).

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Hans Neureiter 
wrote:

> I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O =
0.095
> KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.
>
> On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
> un-significant.
>
> I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
> including Ohm’s law.
>
> Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, 
> Electric,

> etc., etc.
>
> A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
> resistance.
>
> Current flowing through a conductor excites molecules/atoms and 
> causes

heat
> - it glows and eventually burns up if current is not limited.
>
> Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow plug
element,
> it stands to reason to assume that the electrical characteristics
> deteriorate, i.e. resistance increases. More resistance, less 
> current,

less
> glowing. Ohms Law is irrefutable, nor is the fact that things
deteriorate
> with age and use.
>
> Ohm’s law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics: Pressure (V) -
Head
> (Ω)
> - Flow (A).
>
> Only difference is that Head is influenced by Newton’s law (Static +
> dynamic). Electricity is weightless and thus exempt from 
> gravitational

> influences.
>
> I just can’t get past the fact that Ohm tells me the plugs dont even
> get
> warm.
>
> I am reading 95 Ohm instead of 0.9 Ohm. Kind of like 95 % dead.
>
> A Ohmmeter tells you just the same as an Ammeter knowing the 
> Voltage.

>
> Makes sense of my experience. No pre glow fault indication, but the
motor
> was hard to start below 40 F.
>
> Well, #1 finally kicked the bucket and told me something is wrong.
>
> Just wondering if I am on the right track or way out in left field?
>
> --
> Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
> '82 300SD
> '01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
> __**_
>



--
OK Don
2001 ML320
1992 300D 2.5T
1990 300D 2.5T
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Hans Neureiter]

West of Houston (Katy)

On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 9:31 AM, WILTON  wrote:

> Where in South Texas?  I lived in Harlingen for a year, 1960-61.
>
> Wilton
>
> - Original Message - From: "Hans Neureiter" 
> To: "Mercedes Discussion List" 
> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 12:25 AM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question
>
>
>
> Question comes from some one's post some weeks ago.
>> He replaced all GP's and had readings from good to bad, like 0.9 to 90+
>> Ohm
>> I know I have to replace # UNO.(DOS, TRES, QUATRO, CHINCO,?)
>> A PITA to get to and a small lump of denero.
>> God bless South Texas. It hardly ever snows.
>> All you snowmobile salesman, you're welcome, but first learn to rope a
>> goat.
>> I would like a some sort of technicaln input. MB,as always leaves us in
>> the
>> dark.
>> Now I'm getting peturbed. $250K AMG vs. my 30+ year old jewel.
>> FYAFIFH. (FH like in fish head)
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Hans Neureiter 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.
>>> Meter is good. And it is not the idiot reading it.
>>> Plugs have been there for the same time under the same conditons.
>>> Question to the ever knowing forum is:
>>> Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?
>>> I have nothing to compare, exept to adhere to Ohms Law and not knowing
>>> how
>>> the gizissicmos are made, I am confused.
>>> Looking at the "Glow Plug"" on my electric stove (heating element) it's a
>>> no brainer.
>>> Long skinny coiled wire imbedded in ceramic and clad with steel.
>>> Of course, my stove top does not encounter vulcanic activities such as
>>> extreme heat, shock and tremors. The GP does this 15 times/sec at idle.
>>>
>>> What resistance does a new good GP have?
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 9:15 PM, OK Don  wrote:
>>>
>>> Either you are correct, and the glow plugs are indeed bad (I've one or
>>>> two
>>>> that read higher resistance than they should have been) or your meter
>>>> needs
>>>> calibrating. What does the meter read when you short the two probes
>>>> together?
>>>>
>>>> On the other hand, if you don't need all new glow plugs now, you will at
>>>> some time in the future. Go ahead and get them, then decide whether to
>>>> replace all of them, or one at a time as they fail. You can also verify
>>>> your meter against a new plug (assuming the new plug is good).
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Hans Neureiter 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O =
>>>> 0.095
>>>> > KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.
>>>> >
>>>> > On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
>>>> > un-significant.
>>>> >
>>>> > I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
>>>> > including Ohm’s law.
>>>> >
>>>> > Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, Electric,
>>>> > etc., etc.
>>>> >
>>>> > A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
>>>> > resistance.
>>>> >
>>>> > Current flowing through a conductor excites molecules/atoms and causes
>>>> heat
>>>> > - it glows and eventually burns up if current is not limited.
>>>> >
>>>> > Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow plug
>>>> element,
>>>> > it stands to reason to assume that the electrical characteristics
>>>> > deteriorate, i.e. resistance increases. More resistance, less current,
>>>> less
>>>> > glowing. Ohms Law is irrefutable, nor is the fact that things
>>>> deteriorate
>>>> > with age and use.
>>>> >
>>>> > Ohm’s law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics: Pressure (V) -
>>>> Head
>>>> > (Ω)
>>>> > - Flow (A).
>>>> >
>>>> > Only difference is that Head is influenced by Newton’s law (Static +
>>>> > dynamic). Electricity is weightless and thus exempt from gravitational
>>>> > influences.
>>>> >
>>>> > I just can’t get past the fact that Ohm tells me the plugs dont even
>

Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[WILTON]

Where in South Texas?  I lived in Harlingen for a year, 1960-61.

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: "Hans Neureiter" 

To: "Mercedes Discussion List" 
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 12:25 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question



Question comes from some one's post some weeks ago.
He replaced all GP's and had readings from good to bad, like 0.9 to 90+ 
Ohm

I know I have to replace # UNO.(DOS, TRES, QUATRO, CHINCO,?)
A PITA to get to and a small lump of denero.
God bless South Texas. It hardly ever snows.
All you snowmobile salesman, you're welcome, but first learn to rope a 
goat.
I would like a some sort of technicaln input. MB,as always leaves us in 
the

dark.
Now I'm getting peturbed. $250K AMG vs. my 30+ year old jewel.
FYAFIFH. (FH like in fish head)

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Hans Neureiter  
wrote:



Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.
Meter is good. And it is not the idiot reading it.
Plugs have been there for the same time under the same conditons.
Question to the ever knowing forum is:
Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?
I have nothing to compare, exept to adhere to Ohms Law and not knowing 
how

the gizissicmos are made, I am confused.
Looking at the "Glow Plug"" on my electric stove (heating element) it's a
no brainer.
Long skinny coiled wire imbedded in ceramic and clad with steel.
Of course, my stove top does not encounter vulcanic activities such as
extreme heat, shock and tremors. The GP does this 15 times/sec at idle.

What resistance does a new good GP have?

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 9:15 PM, OK Don  wrote:

Either you are correct, and the glow plugs are indeed bad (I've one or 
two

that read higher resistance than they should have been) or your meter
needs
calibrating. What does the meter read when you short the two probes
together?

On the other hand, if you don't need all new glow plugs now, you will at
some time in the future. Go ahead and get them, then decide whether to
replace all of them, or one at a time as they fail. You can also verify
your meter against a new plug (assuming the new plug is good).

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Hans Neureiter 
wrote:

> I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O =
0.095
> KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.
>
> On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
> un-significant.
>
> I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
> including Ohm’s law.
>
> Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, Electric,
> etc., etc.
>
> A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
> resistance.
>
> Current flowing through a conductor excites molecules/atoms and causes
heat
> - it glows and eventually burns up if current is not limited.
>
> Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow plug
element,
> it stands to reason to assume that the electrical characteristics
> deteriorate, i.e. resistance increases. More resistance, less current,
less
> glowing. Ohms Law is irrefutable, nor is the fact that things
deteriorate
> with age and use.
>
> Ohm’s law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics: Pressure (V) -
Head
> (Ω)
> - Flow (A).
>
> Only difference is that Head is influenced by Newton’s law (Static +
> dynamic). Electricity is weightless and thus exempt from gravitational
> influences.
>
> I just can’t get past the fact that Ohm tells me the plugs dont even 
> get

> warm.
>
> I am reading 95 Ohm instead of 0.9 Ohm. Kind of like 95 % dead.
>
> A Ohmmeter tells you just the same as an Ammeter knowing the Voltage.
>
> Makes sense of my experience. No pre glow fault indication, but the
motor
> was hard to start below 40 F.
>
> Well, #1 finally kicked the bucket and told me something is wrong.
>
> Just wondering if I am on the right track or way out in left field?
>
> --
> Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
> '82 300SD
> '01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
> ___
>



--
OK Don
2001 ML320
1992 300D 2.5T
1990 300D 2.5T
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
 ___
http://www.okiebenz.com
For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

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http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com





--
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI





--
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
___
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For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Fmiser]

> Hans Neureiter wrote:

> Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.

Good. *smiles* Still doesn't mean a reading of 0.9 isn't
actually 0.8 ohms.  If it's not a 4-lead milliohm meter, then
it's risky to trust it for such measurements. 

> Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?

Yes.  Both.  Most of the time they fail open.  Some times they
fail shorted.  Occasionally I have seen other states of not good.

> What resistance does a new good GP have?

Based on ohms law, 20 A at 12 V = 0.6 ohm.  With the ammeter
you can watch the current drop as it heats.  This is a good
indication that the glow plug is actually glowing.

--   Philip

___
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Fmiser]

> Hans Neureiter wrote:

> On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
> un-significant.

Correct.  We do want to know the resistance, and by measuring
amps or ohms can get us there.  But _I_ prefer knowing the
resistance of the glow plug when is glowing - like it would
when I'm using it.

> A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a
> designated resistance.

> Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow
> plug element, it stands to reason to assume that the
> electrical characteristics deteriorate, i.e. resistance
> increases. 

Why would the deterioration not cause a _decrease_ in
resistance?  Either way, we want to identify what is good and
what is not.

> Ohm's law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics

Correct.

> A Ohmmeter tells you just the same as an Ammeter knowing the
> Voltage.

Almost.  Based solely on ohm's law - yes.

But an ohm meter can "lie" because the test environment is
different than the operation environment.

The wire, connections, and the glow plug can - and do - act
different with 20 amps running throught them than they do with
0.2 milliamp.

Add to that the margin of error when using an standard ohm
meter for measurements <1 ohm.  0.6 ohms increasing to 0.9 ohms.

All this to say.  If you have an ohm meter - use it.  A
milliohm meter is better.  But realize the test results may
not be especially accurate.  95 ohm is clearly a failed plug.
And you might be able to spot a shorted plug.  But the ohm
meter is not much help for anything more subtle.

Thus my opening statement that the ammeter is the "preferred
way to test" - not the only way.  However, it is the only way
I bother to test now.  My test meter is just as easy to get as
the ohm meter, and it's at least as easy to use, and the test
results are more meaningful and dependable.

--  Philip

___
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For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Hans Neureiter]

Question comes from some one's post some weeks ago.
He replaced all GP's and had readings from good to bad, like 0.9 to 90+ Ohm
I know I have to replace # UNO.(DOS, TRES, QUATRO, CHINCO,?)
A PITA to get to and a small lump of denero.
God bless South Texas. It hardly ever snows.
All you snowmobile salesman, you're welcome, but first learn to rope a goat.
I would like a some sort of technicaln input. MB,as always leaves us in the
dark.
Now I'm getting peturbed. $250K AMG vs. my 30+ year old jewel.
FYAFIFH. (FH like in fish head)

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Hans Neureiter  wrote:

> Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.
> Meter is good. And it is not the idiot reading it.
> Plugs have been there for the same time under the same conditons.
> Question to the ever knowing forum is:
> Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?
> I have nothing to compare, exept to adhere to Ohms Law and not knowing how
> the gizissicmos are made, I am confused.
> Looking at the "Glow Plug"" on my electric stove (heating element) it's a
> no brainer.
> Long skinny coiled wire imbedded in ceramic and clad with steel.
> Of course, my stove top does not encounter vulcanic activities such as
> extreme heat, shock and tremors. The GP does this 15 times/sec at idle.
>
> What resistance does a new good GP have?
>
> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 9:15 PM, OK Don  wrote:
>
>> Either you are correct, and the glow plugs are indeed bad (I've one or two
>> that read higher resistance than they should have been) or your meter
>> needs
>> calibrating. What does the meter read when you short the two probes
>> together?
>>
>> On the other hand, if you don't need all new glow plugs now, you will at
>> some time in the future. Go ahead and get them, then decide whether to
>> replace all of them, or one at a time as they fail. You can also verify
>> your meter against a new plug (assuming the new plug is good).
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Hans Neureiter 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O =
>> 0.095
>> > KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.
>> >
>> > On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
>> > un-significant.
>> >
>> > I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
>> > including Ohm’s law.
>> >
>> > Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, Electric,
>> > etc., etc.
>> >
>> > A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
>> > resistance.
>> >
>> > Current flowing through a conductor excites molecules/atoms and causes
>> heat
>> > - it glows and eventually burns up if current is not limited.
>> >
>> > Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow plug
>> element,
>> > it stands to reason to assume that the electrical characteristics
>> > deteriorate, i.e. resistance increases. More resistance, less current,
>> less
>> > glowing. Ohms Law is irrefutable, nor is the fact that things
>> deteriorate
>> > with age and use.
>> >
>> > Ohm’s law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics: Pressure (V) -
>> Head
>> > (Ω)
>> > - Flow (A).
>> >
>> > Only difference is that Head is influenced by Newton’s law (Static +
>> > dynamic). Electricity is weightless and thus exempt from gravitational
>> > influences.
>> >
>> > I just can’t get past the fact that Ohm tells me the plugs dont even get
>> > warm.
>> >
>> > I am reading 95 Ohm instead of 0.9 Ohm. Kind of like 95 % dead.
>> >
>> > A Ohmmeter tells you just the same as an Ammeter knowing the Voltage.
>> >
>> > Makes sense of my experience. No pre glow fault indication, but the
>> motor
>> > was hard to start below 40 F.
>> >
>> > Well, #1 finally kicked the bucket and told me something is wrong.
>> >
>> > Just wondering if I am on the right track or way out in left field?
>> >
>> > --
>> > Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
>> > '82 300SD
>> > '01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
>> > ___
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> OK Don
>> 2001 ML320
>> 1992 300D 2.5T
>> 1990 300D 2.5T
>> 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
>>  ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
> '82 300SD
> '01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
>



-- 
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
___
http://www.okiebenz.com
For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Hans Neureiter]

Touching the leads together reads 0.00 Ohms.
Meter is good. And it is not the idiot reading it.
Plugs have been there for the same time under the same conditons.
Question to the ever knowing forum is:
Do Glow Plugs  deteriotate or just go on/off like a light bulb?
I have nothing to compare, exept to adhere to Ohms Law and not knowing how
the gizissicmos are made, I am confused.
Looking at the "Glow Plug"" on my electric stove (heating element) it's a
no brainer.
Long skinny coiled wire imbedded in ceramic and clad with steel.
Of course, my stove top does not encounter vulcanic activities such as
extreme heat, shock and tremors. The GP does this 15 times/sec at idle.

What resistance does a new good GP have?

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 9:15 PM, OK Don  wrote:

> Either you are correct, and the glow plugs are indeed bad (I've one or two
> that read higher resistance than they should have been) or your meter needs
> calibrating. What does the meter read when you short the two probes
> together?
>
> On the other hand, if you don't need all new glow plugs now, you will at
> some time in the future. Go ahead and get them, then decide whether to
> replace all of them, or one at a time as they fail. You can also verify
> your meter against a new plug (assuming the new plug is good).
>
> On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Hans Neureiter  wrote:
>
> > I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O = 0.095
> > KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.
> >
> > On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
> > un-significant.
> >
> > I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
> > including Ohm’s law.
> >
> > Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, Electric,
> > etc., etc.
> >
> > A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
> > resistance.
> >
> > Current flowing through a conductor excites molecules/atoms and causes
> heat
> > - it glows and eventually burns up if current is not limited.
> >
> > Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow plug
> element,
> > it stands to reason to assume that the electrical characteristics
> > deteriorate, i.e. resistance increases. More resistance, less current,
> less
> > glowing. Ohms Law is irrefutable, nor is the fact that things deteriorate
> > with age and use.
> >
> > Ohm’s law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics: Pressure (V) - Head
> > (Ω)
> > - Flow (A).
> >
> > Only difference is that Head is influenced by Newton’s law (Static +
> > dynamic). Electricity is weightless and thus exempt from gravitational
> > influences.
> >
> > I just can’t get past the fact that Ohm tells me the plugs dont even get
> > warm.
> >
> > I am reading 95 Ohm instead of 0.9 Ohm. Kind of like 95 % dead.
> >
> > A Ohmmeter tells you just the same as an Ammeter knowing the Voltage.
> >
> > Makes sense of my experience. No pre glow fault indication, but the motor
> > was hard to start below 40 F.
> >
> > Well, #1 finally kicked the bucket and told me something is wrong.
> >
> > Just wondering if I am on the right track or way out in left field?
> >
> > --
> > Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
> > '82 300SD
> > '01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
> > ___
> >
>
>
>
> --
> OK Don
> 2001 ML320
> 1992 300D 2.5T
> 1990 300D 2.5T
> 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
>  ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>



-- 
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
___
http://www.okiebenz.com
For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[OK Don]

Either you are correct, and the glow plugs are indeed bad (I've one or two
that read higher resistance than they should have been) or your meter needs
calibrating. What does the meter read when you short the two probes
together?

On the other hand, if you don't need all new glow plugs now, you will at
some time in the future. Go ahead and get them, then decide whether to
replace all of them, or one at a time as they fail. You can also verify
your meter against a new plug (assuming the new plug is good).

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Hans Neureiter  wrote:

> I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O = 0.095
> KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.
>
> On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
> un-significant.
>
> I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
> including Ohm’s law.
>
> Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, Electric,
> etc., etc.
>
> A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
> resistance.
>
> Current flowing through a conductor excites molecules/atoms and causes heat
> - it glows and eventually burns up if current is not limited.
>
> Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow plug element,
> it stands to reason to assume that the electrical characteristics
> deteriorate, i.e. resistance increases. More resistance, less current, less
> glowing. Ohms Law is irrefutable, nor is the fact that things deteriorate
> with age and use.
>
> Ohm’s law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics: Pressure (V) - Head
> (Ω)
> - Flow (A).
>
> Only difference is that Head is influenced by Newton’s law (Static +
> dynamic). Electricity is weightless and thus exempt from gravitational
> influences.
>
> I just can’t get past the fact that Ohm tells me the plugs dont even get
> warm.
>
> I am reading 95 Ohm instead of 0.9 Ohm. Kind of like 95 % dead.
>
> A Ohmmeter tells you just the same as an Ammeter knowing the Voltage.
>
> Makes sense of my experience. No pre glow fault indication, but the motor
> was hard to start below 40 F.
>
> Well, #1 finally kicked the bucket and told me something is wrong.
>
> Just wondering if I am on the right track or way out in left field?
>
> --
> Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
> '82 300SD
> '01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
> ___
>



-- 
OK Don
2001 ML320
1992 300D 2.5T
1990 300D 2.5T
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
___
http://www.okiebenz.com
For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Hans Neureiter]

I use a Fluke MM. Setting it on auto or scale, same results. 95 O = 0.095
KO, and it reads 0.01 Ohm.

On second thought, the measurement of resistance may not be so
un-significant.

I am pretty much aware of the laws of physics that rule our world,
including Ohm’s law.

Cast in “Stone” they are; Gravity, Kinetic, Dynamic, Static, Electric,
etc., etc.

A glow plug is a resistor, a electrical conductor with a designated
resistance.

Current flowing through a conductor excites molecules/atoms and causes heat
- it glows and eventually burns up if current is not limited.

Not knowing the metallurgical/chemical composition of a glow plug element,
it stands to reason to assume that the electrical characteristics
deteriorate, i.e. resistance increases. More resistance, less current, less
glowing. Ohms Law is irrefutable, nor is the fact that things deteriorate
with age and use.

Ohm’s law is similar to the principals of Hydraulics: Pressure (V) - Head (Ω)
- Flow (A).

Only difference is that Head is influenced by Newton’s law (Static +
dynamic). Electricity is weightless and thus exempt from gravitational
influences.

I just can’t get past the fact that Ohm tells me the plugs dont even get
warm.

I am reading 95 Ohm instead of 0.9 Ohm. Kind of like 95 % dead.

A Ohmmeter tells you just the same as an Ammeter knowing the Voltage.

Makes sense of my experience. No pre glow fault indication, but the motor
was hard to start below 40 F.

Well, #1 finally kicked the bucket and told me something is wrong.

Just wondering if I am on the right track or way out in left field?

On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 5:56 PM, Dieselhead <126die...@gmail.com> wrote:

> You can compensate for resistance error on a meter by measuring  new or
> known good GPs.  If it can detect a difference of half an ohm, you are good.
>
> I have a 25 yr old radio junk analog meter that will read about 1.5 ohms
> on a good one, but it is sensitive enough to pick up a half ohm. So when it
> reads 0 or over 2, I know I have a bad plug.
>
>
>
> Typo. Thanks for the smiles.
>> What I gather, checking for resisstance is meaningless other than
>> continuity or open circuit.
>> Thanks all.
>>
>> Apr 1, 2012 at 3:45 PM, Fmiser  wrote:
>>
>>  > Hans Neureiter wrote:
>>>
>>>  > On my OM 517 engine
>>>
>>>  A _5_17?  I'm not familiar with that one, but on a OM617...
>>>  *smiles*
>>>
>>>  > I tested the glow plugs. No preglow
>>>  > indicater light. The Manual calls for 8 - 15 A per plug.
>>>
>>>  So here I go again...
>>>
>>>  My preferred way to test the glow plug system is with an 30 A
>>>  ammeter.  I put 12AWG wire leads on it.
>>>
>>>  To use it, I pop the top off of the glow relay and unplug the
>>>  connector for the glow plugs. There is a contact for each glow
>>>  plug in this connector, so I clip on meter lead to the fused
>>>  side of the big, screw-in fuse and then touch each contact,
>>>  one at a time. The socket has pin numbers molded into it, and
>>>  these numbers correspond to the cylinder number.
>>>
>>>  This method tests the supply 12V, the wire, and the plug. When
>>>  cold, a good plug draws about 20A (Well, on my meter it point
>>>  to the mark for 20 amps. I have not calibrated or tested the
>>>  accuracy of that meter...) It will drop back to about 15A
>>>  after 8-10 seconds.
>>>
>>>  Once the one wire is connected to the fuse, DO NOT LET THE
>>>  OTHER WIRE TOUCH CHASSIS GROUND!!!  Or the big fuse will blow
>>>  and possibly so will your ammeter. :)
>>>
>>>  --   Philip
>>>
>>>  __**_
>>>  http://www.okiebenz.com
>>>  For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
>>>  To search list archives 
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/
>>>
>>>  To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>>  
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
>> '82 300SD
>> '01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
>> __**_
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
>> To search list archives 
>> http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/
>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com
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'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Max]

Hans, resistance test is a fair test if you have a meter capable of measuring 
values if less than one ohm.  Phillip's current measurement test is the best.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'95 E300, '87 300TD
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Dieselhead]

You can compensate for resistance error on a meter by measuring  new 
or known good GPs.  If it can detect a difference of half an ohm, you 
are good.


I have a 25 yr old radio junk analog meter that will read about 1.5 
ohms on a good one, but it is sensitive enough to pick up a half ohm. 
So when it reads 0 or over 2, I know I have a bad plug.





Typo. Thanks for the smiles.
What I gather, checking for resisstance is meaningless other than
continuity or open circuit.
Thanks all.

Apr 1, 2012 at 3:45 PM, Fmiser  wrote:


 > Hans Neureiter wrote:

 > On my OM 517 engine

 A _5_17?  I'm not familiar with that one, but on a OM617...
 *smiles*

 > I tested the glow plugs. No preglow
 > indicater light. The Manual calls for 8 - 15 A per plug.

 So here I go again...

 My preferred way to test the glow plug system is with an 30 A
 ammeter.  I put 12AWG wire leads on it.

 To use it, I pop the top off of the glow relay and unplug the
 connector for the glow plugs. There is a contact for each glow
 plug in this connector, so I clip on meter lead to the fused
 side of the big, screw-in fuse and then touch each contact,
 one at a time. The socket has pin numbers molded into it, and
 these numbers correspond to the cylinder number.

 This method tests the supply 12V, the wire, and the plug. When
 cold, a good plug draws about 20A (Well, on my meter it point
 to the mark for 20 amps. I have not calibrated or tested the
 accuracy of that meter...) It will drop back to about 15A
 after 8-10 seconds.

 Once the one wire is connected to the fuse, DO NOT LET THE
 OTHER WIRE TOUCH CHASSIS GROUND!!!  Or the big fuse will blow
 and possibly so will your ammeter. :)

 --   Philip

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--
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Hans Neureiter]

Typo. Thanks for the smiles.
What I gather, checking for resisstance is meaningless other than
continuity or open circuit.
Thanks all.

Apr 1, 2012 at 3:45 PM, Fmiser  wrote:

> > Hans Neureiter wrote:
>
> > On my OM 517 engine
>
> A _5_17?  I'm not familiar with that one, but on a OM617...
> *smiles*
>
> > I tested the glow plugs. No preglow
> > indicater light. The Manual calls for 8 - 15 A per plug.
>
> So here I go again...
>
> My preferred way to test the glow plug system is with an 30 A
> ammeter.  I put 12AWG wire leads on it.
>
> To use it, I pop the top off of the glow relay and unplug the
> connector for the glow plugs. There is a contact for each glow
> plug in this connector, so I clip on meter lead to the fused
> side of the big, screw-in fuse and then touch each contact,
> one at a time. The socket has pin numbers molded into it, and
> these numbers correspond to the cylinder number.
>
> This method tests the supply 12V, the wire, and the plug. When
> cold, a good plug draws about 20A (Well, on my meter it point
> to the mark for 20 amps. I have not calibrated or tested the
> accuracy of that meter...) It will drop back to about 15A
> after 8-10 seconds.
>
> Once the one wire is connected to the fuse, DO NOT LET THE
> OTHER WIRE TOUCH CHASSIS GROUND!!!  Or the big fuse will blow
> and possibly so will your ammeter. :)
>
> --   Philip
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>



-- 
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Fmiser]

> Hans Neureiter wrote:

> On my OM 517 engine

A _5_17?  I'm not familiar with that one, but on a OM617...
*smiles*

> I tested the glow plugs. No preglow
> indicater light. The Manual calls for 8 - 15 A per plug.

So here I go again...

My preferred way to test the glow plug system is with an 30 A
ammeter.  I put 12AWG wire leads on it.

To use it, I pop the top off of the glow relay and unplug the
connector for the glow plugs. There is a contact for each glow
plug in this connector, so I clip on meter lead to the fused
side of the big, screw-in fuse and then touch each contact,
one at a time. The socket has pin numbers molded into it, and
these numbers correspond to the cylinder number.

This method tests the supply 12V, the wire, and the plug. When
cold, a good plug draws about 20A (Well, on my meter it point
to the mark for 20 amps. I have not calibrated or tested the
accuracy of that meter...) It will drop back to about 15A
after 8-10 seconds.

Once the one wire is connected to the fuse, DO NOT LET THE
OTHER WIRE TOUCH CHASSIS GROUND!!!  Or the big fuse will blow
and possibly so will your ammeter. :)

--   Philip

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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Dieselhead]

Some problem with the accuracy of the meter.  You found out what you 
want to know.  #1 is bad.


the glow light will NOT come on when #1 is out.  The relay compares 
the current in #1 to the other 3 or 4 or 5 GPs.  When #1 is out, the 
glow light is out.


Replace #1 and be happy.



On my OM 517 engine I tested the glow plugs. No preglow indicater light.
The Manual calls for 8 - 15 A per plug.
I measured the resistance at the 6-pin connector:
#1 indicates open,
#2 - 5 measure 95 Ohm each
13V / 95 Ohm = 0.14 A (1/10th of spec)
What am I doing wrong?
--
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Allan Streib]

The resistance cold is not the same as the resistance hot.  But 95 Ohm
is too high for a cold plug, should be < 1 ohm IIRC, as they heat up the
resistance increases.  If you had an ammeter in line with the plug you'd
see an initial heavy current draw that drops off as the plug heats up.

Allan

Hans Neureiter  writes:

> On my OM 517 engine I tested the glow plugs. No preglow indicater light.
> The Manual calls for 8 - 15 A per plug.
> I measured the resistance at the 6-pin connector:
> #1 indicates open,
> #2 - 5 measure 95 Ohm each
> 13V / 95 Ohm = 0.14 A (1/10th of spec)
> What am I doing wrong?

-- 
1983 300D
1979 300SD

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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question

[Rick Knoble]

On Apr 1, 2012, at 10:01 AM, "Hans Neureiter"  wrote:

> I measured the resistance at the 6-pin connector:
> #1 indicates open,
> #2 - 5 measure 95 Ohm each
> 13V / 95 Ohm = 0.14 A (1/10th of spec)
> What am I doing wrong?


Your meter is not an autoranging meter and it is on the wrong scale?

Rick
Sent from my iPhone
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[MBZ] Glow plug question

[Hans Neureiter]

On my OM 517 engine I tested the glow plugs. No preglow indicater light.
The Manual calls for 8 - 15 A per plug.
I measured the resistance at the 6-pin connector:
#1 indicates open,
#2 - 5 measure 95 Ohm each
13V / 95 Ohm = 0.14 A (1/10th of spec)
What am I doing wrong?
-- 
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI
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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Jim Cathey]

If the plug is bad, the current will be less.


Or more!  I've seen that too.

It is very rare for the plug to ohm out right yet
not work right, due to the way it's constructed.
It's either open-circuit, or possibly partially
shorted inside so that the heat doesn't go all
the way out at the tip.  Those, though, will
usually draw different current than they ought
to.

It takes a pretty good meter to do reliable
sub-ohm measurements.  I'm extremely fond of
the Fluke 80 series.  They certainly work for
this.  The automotive ammeter is even better,
though.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Fmiser]

> Rick Knoble wrote:

> Is it possible for glow plugs to ohm out okay and still be bad?
> Perhaps shorted by carbon or something?

Yes. But a typical ohm meter is not very accurate at those
ranges.  Much better is to measure the current flow.

I use an old-fashioned automotive ammeter.  The ones that
display -30,0,+30. I put 12AWG wire leads on it.

To use it, I pop the top off of the glow relay and unplug the
connector for the glow plugs. There is a contact for each glow
plug in this connector, so I clip on meter lead to the fused
side of the big, screw-in fuse and then touch each contact,
one at a time. The socket has pin numbers molded into it, and
these numbers correspond to the cylinder number.

This method tests the supply 12V, the wire, and the plug. When
cold, a good plug draws about 20A (Well, on my meter it point
to the mark for 20 amps. I have not calibrated or tested the
accuracy of that meter...) It will drop back to about 15A
after 8-10 seconds.

If the plug is bad, the current will be less.

If the wire or connectors are in poor shape, the current will
be less.

If the supply voltage is low, the current will be less.

--  Philip, who feels like he's repeating himself

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Re: [MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Dieselhead]

Yes, (rare) and it is also possible they are not getting juice from 
the relay/bad fuse.




 Hi All,

Is it possible for glow plugs to ohm out okay and still be bad?
Perhaps shorted by carbon or something?

Rick



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[MBZ] Glow Plug Question

[Rick Knoble]

 Hi All,

Is it possible for glow plugs to ohm out okay and still be bad?
Perhaps shorted by carbon or something?

Rick
  
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Re: [MBZ] Glow plug question for the experts

[John Berryman]

On Thursday, February 9, 2006, at 08:27 PM, Loren Faeth wrote:

Bosch 0 250 201 001 is what fits in most of the diesels with  small 
pencil
type glow plugs.  It has a 5 digit application number of 80006.  Bosch 
0
250 201 039 also carries the 80006 designation.  Can anyone tell me 
what is

the difference, if any?

TIA

Loren



A good guess, one is for the system with afterglow. Just a guess.

Johnny B.
I Mac Therefore I am

[MBZ] Glow plug question for the experts

[Loren Faeth]

Bosch 0 250 201 001 is what fits in most of the diesels with  small pencil 
type glow plugs.  It has a 5 digit application number of 80006.  Bosch 0 
250 201 039 also carries the 80006 designation.  Can anyone tell me what is 
the difference, if any?


TIA

Loren
81 240D
86 and 87 SDLs
et al