Re: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Pictures?


Max Dillon via Mercedes 
November 11, 2018 at 9:36 AM
Aye! Going to put in my Service Dress Blue uniform for a concert at 
church this afternoon.


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Re: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

And another +1!

-D


> On Nov 11, 2018, at 7:13 PM, Greg Fiorentino via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> +1!!
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Curley 
> McLain via Mercedes
> Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2018 6:49 AM
> To: Mercedes Discussion List
> Cc: Curley McLain
> Subject: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!
> 
> To all the veterans on the list (and elsewhere)   THANK YOU!
> 
> 
> 
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> 


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Re: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[Greg Fiorentino via Mercedes]

+1!!

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Curley 
McLain via Mercedes
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2018 6:49 AM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Cc: Curley McLain
Subject: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

To all the veterans on the list (and elsewhere)   THANK YOU!



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Re: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[Michael Esh via Mercedes]

Amen!

Michael E. Esh


> On Nov 11, 2018, at 8:55 AM, Dimitri via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[M. Mitchell Marmel via Mercedes]

What Curley said.  Thank you all.

On Sun, Nov 11, 2018 at 9:37 AM Max Dillon via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Aye!  Going to put in my Service Dress Blue uniform for a concert at
> church this afternoon.
> --
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> '87 300TD
> '95 E300
>
> On November 11, 2018 9:49:05 AM EST, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >To all the veterans on the list (and elsewhere)   THANK YOU!
> >
> >
> >
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Aye!  Going to put in my Service Dress Blue uniform for a concert at church 
this afternoon.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On November 11, 2018 9:49:05 AM EST, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
 wrote:
>To all the veterans on the list (and elsewhere)   THANK YOU!
>
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Aye!
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On November 11, 2018 8:55:58 AM EST, Dimitri via Mercedes 
 wrote:
>
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[MBZ] OT: Happy Veterans Day!

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

To all the veterans on the list (and elsewhere)   THANK YOU!



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Re: [MBZ] No MB: Veterans for Hillary

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Duffleblog is satire.

Curt

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sat, Oct 29, 2016 at 12:32 PM, rogerhga--- via 
Mercedes wrote:   Mitch, 
I hope you were joking with this story about 25000 WWI vets voting for Hillary. 
I did a search and got the following. Of course if you were referring to how 
the "dearly departed" seem to still vote, then I understand. 

How many WWI vets are still around ( alive )? 


    * From Yahoo Answers 


I read an article on or about Veterans Day, stating that they thought between 
30 and 40 were still alive (US), and the article asked folks to inform a 
website if they knew of a living WWI vet. Think about it, none would be less 
than 105 years old. Wish I'd saved the article. 
answers.yahoo.com 

Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] No MB: Veterans for Hillary

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Yep, it's satire. 
Imagine a 15 year old sneaking into the service in 1918.
He'd only be 113 today. 
In other words, there are no WWI vets, haven't been for five years now. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Buckles

If you read the original spoof on Duffleblog, you'll see that the name Andrew
Spieles is a link to this article:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/he-fought-in-world-war-ii-he-died-in-2014-and-he-just-registered-to-vote-in-va/2016/09/29/5e0bffee-8670-11e6-ac72-a29979381495_story.html

http://www.duffelblog.com/2016/10/early-voting-data-shows-world-war-veterans-overwhelming-support-hillary-clinton/

> On October 29, 2016 at 12:32 PM rogerhga--- via Mercedes
>  wrote:
> Of course if you were referring to how the "dearly departed" seem to still
> vote, then I understand.

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[MBZ] No MB: Veterans for Hillary

[rogerhga--- via Mercedes]

Mitch, 
I hope you were joking with this story about 25000 WWI vets voting for Hillary. 
I did a search and got the following. Of course if you were referring to how 
the "dearly departed" seem to still vote, then I understand. 

How many WWI vets are still around ( alive )? 


* From Yahoo Answers 


I read an article on or about Veterans Day, stating that they thought between 
30 and 40 were still alive (US), and the article asked folks to inform a 
website if they knew of a living WWI vet. Think about it, none would be less 
than 105 years old. Wish I'd saved the article. 
answers.yahoo.com 

Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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[MBZ] To the veterans

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

Wilton, Scott, Meade, Lt Don and everyone else not mentioned:  Thank 
you for your service, and remembering you on Veterans day.


(meant to post this early this morning)

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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[Rick Knoble via Mercedes]

+1 (me too) thank you guys. ‎
Rick 
Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.
  Original Message  
From: Curly McLain via Mercedes
Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 1:00 PM
To: G Mann; Mercedes Discussion List
Reply To: Curly McLain
Subject: [MBZ] To the veterans

Wilton, Scott, Meade, Lt Don and everyone else not mentioned:  Thank 
you for your service, and remembering you on Veterans day.

(meant to post this early this morning)



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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[WILTON via Mercedes]

Thank you; 'glad to have been of service and to have had the opportunity and 
the ability.

Let us not forget those who did not survive.

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Curly McLain via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
To: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com; Mercedes Discussion List 
mercedes@okiebenz.com

Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 1:48 PM
Subject: [MBZ] To the veterans


Wilton, Scott, Meade, Lt Don and everyone else not mentioned:  Thank you 
for your service, and remembering you on Veterans day.


(meant to post this early this morning)

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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 13:48:46 -0600 Rick Knoble via Mercedes
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 
 +1 (me too) thank you guys. ‎
 Rick 
 Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.
   Original Message  
 From: Curly McLain via Mercedes
 Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 1:00 PM
 To: G Mann; Mercedes Discussion List
 Reply To: Curly McLain
 Subject: [MBZ] To the veterans
 
 Wilton, Scott, Meade, Lt Don and everyone else not mentioned:  Thank 
 you for your service, and remembering you on Veterans day.
 
 (meant to post this early this morning)


Thank you, guys.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[Tim Crone via Mercedes]

Adding my ditto.  A very sincere thanks to all of you for your
willingness to serve for the rest of us.

Sincerely,
Tim


On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 3:28 PM, Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 13:48:46 -0600 Rick Knoble via Mercedes
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 
  +1 (me too) thank you guys.
  Rick
  Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.
Original Message
  From: Curly McLain via Mercedes
  Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 1:00 PM
  To: G Mann; Mercedes Discussion List
  Reply To: Curly McLain
  Subject: [MBZ] To the veterans
 
  Wilton, Scott, Meade, Lt Don and everyone else not mentioned:  Thank
  you for your service, and remembering you on Veterans day.
 
  (meant to post this early this morning)


 Thank you, guys.


 Craig

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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Me, too!  Thanks for your sacrifice in keeping us safe and free!

Dan


 On Nov 11, 2014, at 4:15 PM, Tim Crone via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Adding my ditto.  A very sincere thanks to all of you for your
 willingness to serve for the rest of us.
 
 Sincerely,
 Tim
 
 
 On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 3:28 PM, Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:
 
 On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 13:48:46 -0600 Rick Knoble via Mercedes
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 
 +1 (me too) thank you guys.
 Rick
 Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.
  Original Message
 From: Curly McLain via Mercedes
 Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 1:00 PM
 To: G Mann; Mercedes Discussion List
 Reply To: Curly McLain
 Subject: [MBZ] To the veterans
 
 Wilton, Scott, Meade, Lt Don and everyone else not mentioned:  Thank
 you for your service, and remembering you on Veterans day.
 
 (meant to post this early this morning)
 
 
 Thank you, guys.
 
 
 Craig
 
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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[archer75--- via Mercedes]

On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 13:28:41 -0700
Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 13:48:46 -0600 Rick Knoble via Mercedes
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
  +1 (me too) thank you guys. ‎
  Rick 

  Wilton, Scott, Meade, Lt Don and everyone else not mentioned:  Thank 
  you for your service, and remembering you on Veterans day.
  (meant to post this early this morning)
 
 Thank you, guys.
 Craig

I second that. We wouldn't have the good life we have in the U.S. today without 
them.
Gerry
PS: Is Lt. Don on the list?
 

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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[OK Don via Mercedes]

I think that Lt. Don left the list several years ago.

On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 4:02 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:



 PS: Is Lt. Don on the list?




-- 
OK Don

NSA: The only branch of government that actually listens to US citizens!

There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves.

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Whatever happened to LT Don?

On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 5:24 PM, OK Don via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:

 I think that Lt. Don left the list several years ago.

 On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 4:02 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 
 
  PS: Is Lt. Don on the list?
 
 


 --
 OK Don

 NSA: The only branch of government that actually listens to US citizens!

 There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
 learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
 for themselves.

 WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
 2013 F150, 18 mpg
 2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
 1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

 On November 11, 2014 at 5:24 PM OK Don via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 wrote:


 I think that Lt. Don left the list several years ago.
 
He did, IIRC, over the Obama dislike shown on Banned and maybe on here in late
2008/early 2009.
 
I think he served an even 20 years in the USCG.
 
Mitch
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Re: [MBZ] To the veterans

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

He sold his Benz and bought a cheap truck or something, so really had no 
need to stay on a Benz list.  The political stuff was probably more of 
an irritant.


He was enlisted in the USCG then did the officer thing after some time, 
hence the Lt in LtDon.


I always found his views on things mildly entertaining, especially his 
stories about his charges at the home.  And the fatass he took for a 
ride somewhere in the Benz.


--R


On 11/11/14 6:06 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:

On November 11, 2014 at 5:24 PM OK Don via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
wrote:


I think that Lt. Don left the list several years ago.
  
He did, IIRC, over the Obama dislike shown on Banned and maybe on here in late

2008/early 2009.
  
I think he served an even 20 years in the USCG.
  
Mitch

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Mitch Haley]

WILTON wrote:

The tragedy of the Vietnam War is exceeded by only slavery and the Civil 
War as this nation's greatest tragedy. Not only were thousands of fine, 
young Americans sacrificed needlessly, sent into harm's way by a 
government with no commitment to a resolution to the conflict, but the 
conflict divided the country like nothing else since the Civil War.


When I was of draft age, I registered for Selective Service, but with the intent 
to refuse if they followed the example set in Korea and Vietnam of drafting with 
no declaration of war. I would have just told the draft board to give me a call 
when/if Congress ever declared war, as I felt that conscription was entirely 
unjustified outside of war.


I've changed my mind since then. I now feel that conscription is slavery of the 
worst kind, and the 13th Amendment outlaws human slavery.


If the country isn't facing a genuine threat to its survival, it's got no 
business sending citizens to their deaths against their will.
If the country is facing a genuine threat to its survival, it doesn't need 
conscription, it can fight the attackers with volunteers.
If the country is facing a genuine threat to its survival and its citizens don't 
want to fight to defend it, then that country's culture is so sick that it 
doesn't deserve to survive.


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Dan Penoff]

My oldest brother was approaching draft age as the Vietnam war was winding 
down, but my Dad, a hard core Nixon Republican, was adamant that none of us 
would be drafted for this war.  In anticipation of the approaching draft he was 
making arrangements to transfer to a division of GM that was based in Canada.  
His stated rationale was that if we were in Canada then he would refuse to 
allow us to register and we could stay there as conscientious objectors.

My sister took off with a draft dodger hippie guy in the early 70s who went to 
the area around Revelstoke, BC (Selkirk Mountains) and lived in a commune.  I 
went through the area back in the 90s and many of the people that bailed due to 
the war are still there.  It's a weird place, like going back in time.  
Beautiful country, though.

Dan

On Apr 27, 2013, at 8:50 AM, Mitch Haley wrote:

 When I was of draft age, I registered for Selective Service, but with the 
 intent to refuse if they followed the example set in Korea and Vietnam of 
 drafting with no declaration of war. I would have just told the draft board 
 to give me a call when/if Congress ever declared war, as I felt that 
 conscription was entirely unjustified outside of war.
 
 I've changed my mind since then. I now feel that conscription is slavery of 
 the worst kind, and the 13th Amendment outlaws human slavery.
 
 If the country isn't facing a genuine threat to its survival, it's got no 
 business sending citizens to their deaths against their will.
 If the country is facing a genuine threat to its survival, it doesn't need 
 conscription, it can fight the attackers with volunteers.
 If the country is facing a genuine threat to its survival and its citizens 
 don't want to fight to defend it, then that country's culture is so sick that 
 it doesn't deserve to survive.
 
 Mitch.
 
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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[WILTON]

As I said, I was upset, 'cause I KNEW it was gonna be a screwed up mess like 
Korea.  Also thought that we should not get involved without full, national 
knowledge and consent and a proper declaration of war as necessary.  After 
way too many years playing at it, we finally fought the war for 11 days.


'Went into Iraq with the same type of BS.  Governments don't have memories 
and, therefore, never learn.
I knew we were in trouble in Iraq when I saw US Marines kicking down their 
doors and holding guns on their wives and children.  Then we stood by and 
watched as the people destroyed their own infrastructure by all-out, 
free-for-all looting.  Then the stage was firmly set when Mr. Governor 
(Whas'is name, Bremmer or Brenner?), with one stroke of a pen, did away with 
all of their government, all of their police and all of their military and 
sent all of those well-trained people home mad as hell, with no jobs and all 
of their guns and ammo.  Less than 24 hours later, they set off first 
roadside IED.


'Screwed up Afghanistan by trying to do it cheap, and let Taliban and 
Al-Qaida get away to sanctuary in Pakistan, then turned our backs on 
Afghanistan hoping Taliban and Al-Qaida would just go away.


There's more, but I'll try to calm down, now.  ;)

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 8:50 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial



WILTON wrote:

The tragedy of the Vietnam War is exceeded by only slavery and the Civil 
War as this nation's greatest tragedy. Not only were thousands of fine, 
young Americans sacrificed needlessly, sent into harm's way by a 
government with no commitment to a resolution to the conflict, but the 
conflict divided the country like nothing else since the Civil War.


When I was of draft age, I registered for Selective Service, but with the 
intent to refuse if they followed the example set in Korea and Vietnam of 
drafting with no declaration of war. I would have just told the draft 
board to give me a call when/if Congress ever declared war, as I felt that 
conscription was entirely unjustified outside of war.


I've changed my mind since then. I now feel that conscription is slavery 
of the worst kind, and the 13th Amendment outlaws human slavery.


If the country isn't facing a genuine threat to its survival, it's got no 
business sending citizens to their deaths against their will.
If the country is facing a genuine threat to its survival, it doesn't need 
conscription, it can fight the attackers with volunteers.
If the country is facing a genuine threat to its survival and its citizens 
don't want to fight to defend it, then that country's culture is so sick 
that it doesn't deserve to survive.


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Tim Crone]

My sister's are early high school, the coop is all over the map though.
Many (most?) of the kids have at least one army or ex-army parent (Fort
Bragg) so they might have a bit more appreciation.

On the other hand they are rabidly neocon overall so you would need to stay
away from current events... ;)

Best,
Tim

 On Apr 25, 2013 6:10 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:

 Maybe so.  What ages are the children; I was thinking high school, etc.
'You think younger would/could understand it OK?

 Wilton

 - Original Message - From: Tim Crone bb...@crone.us
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2013 11:23 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial


 On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:13 AM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:

 Thnks, glad to have the opportunity.
  Wilton


 My sister is involved in a big homeschool coop in Harnett County, would
you
 be interested in presenting to them?  They could probably make a day
trip
 out of it, not sure what all is in Goldsboro other than the AFB. (And of
 course I can't say for sure that she or the others would go for it, but
I
 didn't want to suggest it without asking you.)

 Also it would be worth checking with the high school history teachers,
they
 would probably love to have you come so they don't have to do a lesson
plan
 - I mean speak to their students. :)

 Best,
 Tim
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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[WILTON]

Well, as you can see, of course, the Vietnam presentation is about stuff 
that occurred 40 to 60 years ago.  ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Tim Crone bb...@crone.us

To: Mercedes List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial



My sister's are early high school, the coop is all over the map though.
Many (most?) of the kids have at least one army or ex-army parent (Fort
Bragg) so they might have a bit more appreciation.

On the other hand they are rabidly neocon overall so you would need to 
stay

away from current events... ;)

Best,
Tim


On Apr 25, 2013 6:10 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:


Maybe so.  What ages are the children; I was thinking high school, etc.

'You think younger would/could understand it OK?


Wilton

- Original Message - From: Tim Crone bb...@crone.us
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2013 11:23 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial



On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:13 AM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:


Thnks, glad to have the opportunity.
 Wilton



My sister is involved in a big homeschool coop in Harnett County, would

you

be interested in presenting to them?  They could probably make a day

trip
out of it, not sure what all is in Goldsboro other than the AFB. (And 
of

course I can't say for sure that she or the others would go for it, but

I

didn't want to suggest it without asking you.)

Also it would be worth checking with the high school history teachers,

they

would probably love to have you come so they don't have to do a lesson

plan

- I mean speak to their students. :)

Best,
Tim
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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Mitch Haley]

Dan Penoff wrote:

My oldest brother was approaching draft age as the Vietnam war was winding 
down, but my Dad, a hard core Nixon Republican, was adamant that none of us 
would be drafted for this war.  In anticipation of the approaching draft he was 
making arrangements to transfer to a division of GM that was based in Canada.  
His stated rationale was that if we were in Canada then he would refuse to 
allow us to register and we could stay there as conscientious objectors.


That's one way around it.


My sister took off with a draft dodger hippie guy in the early 70s who went to 
the area around Revelstoke, BC (Selkirk Mountains) and lived in a commune.  I 
went through the area back in the 90s and many of the people that bailed due to 
the war are still there.  It's a weird place, like going back in time.  
Beautiful country, though.


I must say I've got more respect for Cassius Clay This police action is wrong, 
I'd rather go to jail than participate than I have for the illegal aliens in 
Canada. (I don't have a lot of respect for the illegal aliens here either.)


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Scott Ritchey]

In my view, there is nothing admirable in a man that lets other men and
their children fight for him, but cheats his way out of doing his own part.
I don't mean real COs who have the courage to face the consequences.

As Wilton pointed out. The strategy in SEA (and also Iraq) was a cluster
from the start.  The fix is political: communicate with your elected
representatives and, if they don't change course, get rid of them at the
next opportunity.  There is also passive resistance:  public demonstrations,
public speech, and now the Internet.  I also respect such demonstrators,
whether I agree with them or not.  I wouldn't say that about the armchair
generals who can bloviate all day long but do never do anything.  




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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[WILTON]

Thnks, glad to have the opportunity.
 
Wilton


- Original Message - 
From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2013 12:08 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial



ATTABOY, Wilton.


Mitch.


Thanks for posting that Wilton, and thanks again for your service. 
What you wrote is a sobering dose of reality.


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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Tim Crone]

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:13 AM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:

 Thnks, glad to have the opportunity.
  Wilton


My sister is involved in a big homeschool coop in Harnett County, would you
be interested in presenting to them?  They could probably make a day trip
out of it, not sure what all is in Goldsboro other than the AFB. (And of
course I can't say for sure that she or the others would go for it, but I
didn't want to suggest it without asking you.)

Also it would be worth checking with the high school history teachers, they
would probably love to have you come so they don't have to do a lesson plan
- I mean speak to their students. :)

Best,
Tim
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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[WILTON]

Maybe so.  What ages are the children; I was thinking high school, etc. 
'You think younger would/could understand it OK?


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Tim Crone bb...@crone.us

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2013 11:23 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial



On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:13 AM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:


Thnks, glad to have the opportunity.
 Wilton



My sister is involved in a big homeschool coop in Harnett County, would 
you

be interested in presenting to them?  They could probably make a day trip
out of it, not sure what all is in Goldsboro other than the AFB. (And of
course I can't say for sure that she or the others would go for it, but I
didn't want to suggest it without asking you.)

Also it would be worth checking with the high school history teachers, 
they
would probably love to have you come so they don't have to do a lesson 
plan

- I mean speak to their students. :)

Best,
Tim
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[MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[WILTON]

Well, here it is, anyway -- a proposed presentation that I composed for 
possible presentation to local school and civic groups in support of the 
Traveling Vietnam Veterans Memorial here in Goldsboro last week.  The 
presentation was not made, however, for reasons unknown to me - lack of 
interest by coordinators or school officials, maybe - I don't know.  It is a 
combination of history lesson and memorial.  It briefly recounts some of the 
events that led us into the war and some of the ridiculous policies that 
prolonged it and led to having the names of more then 58000 brave, young 
Americans etched into that hallowed wall in DC.


THE WALL
By Wilton Strickland

The tragedy of the Vietnam War is exceeded by only slavery and the Civil War 
as this nation's greatest tragedy. Not only were thousands of fine, young 
Americans sacrificed needlessly, sent into harm's way by a government with 
no commitment to a resolution to the conflict, but the conflict divided the 
country like nothing else since the Civil War.


The tragedy is best illustrated by the Vietnam Veterans Memorial, the black 
granite wall in Washington, DC, which has etched into it more than 58 
thousand names of the real heroes of the war.  Members of their families are 
also heroes who still suffer from the perpetual absence of their loved ones 
who have never returned.  Thousands of children have grown up never knowing 
their fathers and grandfathers, and thousands of children and grandchildren 
of the victims have never been born and never will be.  Many families have 
waited 45 years and more not knowing the fates of their lost loved-ones, and 
many will never know.  The suffering continues.


To get a proper feel for this tragedy and to help us better understand and 
to remember, every American should visit the Memorial, study those names 
etched into it and think very seriously about how they got there.


Let me quickly review some of the events and policies that put them there, 
starting with the French, who have had a strong influence and presence in 
the areas of Cambodia, Laos and Vietnam since the mid 1800's.  For many 
years, the area was even known as French Indochina.  During WWII, the area 
was captured and occupied by the Japanese.  After WWII, the French tried to 
reassert control, but meanwhile, a Communist insurgency led by Ho Chi Minh 
had gained strong influence, and a civil war erupted.  The United States 
began to provide military aid to the French in Vietnam in 1950, but the 
Communist forces defeated the French at Dien Bien Phu in 1954, and Viet Nam 
was divided into North and South Vietnam along a demilitarized zone just 
south of the 17th parallel with a Communist government in the North and a 
government friendly to the United States in the South.  South Vietnam 
immediately began to ask the United States for support against Communist 
influence and insurgency from the North - the first being given in 1955. 
The insurgency in the South was originally conducted by local forces 
friendly to the North and were known as Viet Cong.  Later, many North 
Vietnamese troops were also directly involved.


As the insurgency increased, the United States gradually increased aid to 
South Vietnam, including military supplies, equipment and military advisors 
working closely with the South Vietnamese Army and Air Force.


By late 1962, I was living in Georgia as an Air Force lieutenant on a B-52 
combat crew.  There I spent about a third of my time on alert with B-52's 
loaded with nuclear weapons ready to launch at a moment's notice and strike 
targets in the Soviet Union.  By 1963 and '64, I began to see articles in 
the Atlanta Constitution newspaper about American military advisors being 
killed in Vietnam.  This was very disturbing to me.  I could so easily 
remember the stalemate that drug on for years in Korea without a resolution 
only 10  to 12 years or so before.  I was afraid that the conflict in 
Vietnam would get bogged down into the same type of indecisiveness.  I felt, 
that, because of the way that it was going to be conducted, i. e., piecemeal 
and haphazardly, we should not get involved in Vietnam, but if we were going 
to be involved, we should be quick and decisive about it.


We were easing into a war that most Americans didn't even know about.  Those 
who did know about it didn't seem to care as long as it was somebody else's 
son, brother, husband, cousin or friend who was getting killed, hurt or 
taken prisoner.


Then in Aug of '64 there were two incidents that led to much greater 
American involvement - American war ships in international waters in the 
Gulf  of Tonkin off of N. Vietnam were confronted and fired upon by several 
N. Vietnamese torpedo boats.  The American ships returned fire and sank one 
of the boats.  Two days later, nervous and antsy RADAR operators on the 
American ships in the same area saw what they thought were the N. Vietnamese 
boats again and the Americans fired wildly on 

Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[OK Don]

well said, Wilton. My experience at the Wall was similar. Thanks for taking
the time to write this.

ATTABOY!


On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 9:53 AM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:

 Well, here it is, anyway -- a proposed presentation that I composed for
 possible presentation to local school and civic groups in support of the
 Traveling Vietnam Veterans Memorial here in Goldsboro last week.  The
 presentation was not made, however, for reasons unknown to me - lack of
 interest by coordinators or school officials, maybe - I don't know.  It is
 a combination of history lesson and memorial.  It briefly recounts some of
 the events that led us into the war and some of the ridiculous policies
 that prolonged it and led to having the names of more then 58000 brave,
 young Americans etched into that hallowed wall in DC.

 THE WALL
 By Wilton Strickland

 The tragedy of the Vietnam War is exceeded by only slavery and the Civil
 War as this nation's greatest tragedy. Not only were thousands of fine,
 young Americans sacrificed needlessly, sent into harm's way by a government
 with no commitment to a resolution to the conflict, but the conflict
 divided the country like nothing else since the Civil War.

 The tragedy is best illustrated by the Vietnam Veterans Memorial, the
 black granite wall in Washington, DC, which has etched into it more than 58
 thousand names of the real heroes of the war.  Members of their families
 are also heroes who still suffer from the perpetual absence of their loved
 ones who have never returned.  Thousands of children have grown up never
 knowing their fathers and grandfathers, and thousands of children and
 grandchildren of the victims have never been born and never will be.  Many
 families have waited 45 years and more not knowing the fates of their lost
 loved-ones, and many will never know.  The suffering continues.

 To get a proper feel for this tragedy and to help us better understand and
 to remember, every American should visit the Memorial, study those names
 etched into it and think very seriously about how they got there.

 Let me quickly review some of the events and policies that put them there,
 starting with the French, who have had a strong influence and presence in
 the areas of Cambodia, Laos and Vietnam since the mid 1800's.  For many
 years, the area was even known as French Indochina.  During WWII, the area
 was captured and occupied by the Japanese.  After WWII, the French tried to
 reassert control, but meanwhile, a Communist insurgency led by Ho Chi Minh
 had gained strong influence, and a civil war erupted.  The United States
 began to provide military aid to the French in Vietnam in 1950, but the
 Communist forces defeated the French at Dien Bien Phu in 1954, and Viet Nam
 was divided into North and South Vietnam along a demilitarized zone just
 south of the 17th parallel with a Communist government in the North and a
 government friendly to the United States in the South.  South Vietnam
 immediately began to ask the United States for support against Communist
 influence and insurgency from the North - the first being given in 1955.
 The insurgency in the South was originally conducted by local forces
 friendly to the North and were known as Viet Cong.  Later, many North
 Vietnamese troops were also directly involved.

 As the insurgency increased, the United States gradually increased aid to
 South Vietnam, including military supplies, equipment and military advisors
 working closely with the South Vietnamese Army and Air Force.

 By late 1962, I was living in Georgia as an Air Force lieutenant on a B-52
 combat crew.  There I spent about a third of my time on alert with B-52's
 loaded with nuclear weapons ready to launch at a moment's notice and strike
 targets in the Soviet Union.  By 1963 and '64, I began to see articles in
 the Atlanta Constitution newspaper about American military advisors being
 killed in Vietnam.  This was very disturbing to me.  I could so easily
 remember the stalemate that drug on for years in Korea without a resolution
 only 10  to 12 years or so before.  I was afraid that the conflict in
 Vietnam would get bogged down into the same type of indecisiveness.  I
 felt, that, because of the way that it was going to be conducted, i. e.,
 piecemeal and haphazardly, we should not get involved in Vietnam, but if we
 were going to be involved, we should be quick and decisive about it.

 We were easing into a war that most Americans didn't even know about.
  Those who did know about it didn't seem to care as long as it was somebody
 else's son, brother, husband, cousin or friend who was getting killed, hurt
 or taken prisoner.

 Then in Aug of '64 there were two incidents that led to much greater
 American involvement - American war ships in international waters in the
 Gulf  of Tonkin off of N. Vietnam were confronted and fired upon by several
 N. Vietnamese torpedo boats.  The American ships returned fire and sank one
 of the boats.  Two 

Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Mitch Haley]

OK Don wrote:

well said, Wilton. My experience at the Wall was similar. Thanks for taking
the time to write this.


Any other top-posters quote Wilton's entire post and it'll make for one heck of 
a digest.


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Mitch Haley]

ATTABOY, Wilton.

Mitch.

WILTON wrote:
Well, here it is, anyway -- a proposed presentation that I composed for 
possible presentation to local school and civic groups in support of the 
Traveling Vietnam Veterans Memorial here in Goldsboro last week. 


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Re: [MBZ] OT - Vietnam Veterans Memorial

[Dieselhead]

ATTABOY, Wilton.

Mitch.


Thanks for posting that Wilton, and thanks again for your service. 
What you wrote is a sobering dose of reality.


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