Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
Could also be had in the model 96 up until (I think) '64 or so. I'm sort of on the lookout for one. Either that or the v4. Jay Leno has a good video of his 92 on his website jaylenosgarage.com -Curt Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 21:14:17 -0500 From: "Wonko the Sane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels To: "Mercedes Discussion List" Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 That would be the engine -- three cylinders, two-cycle, 20 horsepower. But more fun than a man should have with his pants on. D. On 9/20/07, OK Don <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > IIRC, the flat rate time for a major overhaul of the Saab engine was 8 > hours. There was a time when the 3 cyl. Saab engine with a bit of > tuning was popular in a Lotus 11 chassis. > > On 9/20/07, Wonko the Sane <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > A two-stroke has a definite "cool" factor to it. > > > > I can still remember driving my first MIL's two-stroke Saab (93 I think, > > help me out here Chip) in the early 70s, and at the time it was a > well-used > > vehicle. > > > > Four on the column, shifted from 3rd to 4th at 30 mph going downhill. > > > > It just radiated (as my college-age step-daughter would say) uber cool. > > > > First wife loved telling me about going to the gas station and being > stopped > > by the "expert" running the station when she started to pour a can of > > Saab-approved 2-cycle oil into the fuel tank. > > -- > OK Don, KD5NRO > Norman, OK > "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." > -Benjamin Disraeli > '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ > For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > -- LT Don http://don.homelinux.net/~don/ Proudly marching to the beat of a different kettle of fish. - Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
Either way, they were way-fun lawn mower engines. I'd "kill" to have one now. D. On 9/20/07, OK Don <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I remember it as having around 36 HP - same as the 1200 VW engine. It > sounded like a Singer sewing machine at idle. > > On 9/20/07, Wonko the Sane <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > That would be the engine -- three cylinders, two-cycle, 20 horsepower. > > > > -- > OK Don, KD5NRO > Norman, OK > "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." > -Benjamin Disraeli > '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ > For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > -- LT Don http://don.homelinux.net/~don/ Proudly marching to the beat of a different kettle of fish. Make a small loan, Make a big difference - Kiva.org ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
I remember it as having around 36 HP - same as the 1200 VW engine. It sounded like a Singer sewing machine at idle. On 9/20/07, Wonko the Sane <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > That would be the engine -- three cylinders, two-cycle, 20 horsepower. > -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." -Benjamin Disraeli '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
That would be the engine -- three cylinders, two-cycle, 20 horsepower. But more fun than a man should have with his pants on. D. On 9/20/07, OK Don <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > IIRC, the flat rate time for a major overhaul of the Saab engine was 8 > hours. There was a time when the 3 cyl. Saab engine with a bit of > tuning was popular in a Lotus 11 chassis. > > On 9/20/07, Wonko the Sane <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > A two-stroke has a definite "cool" factor to it. > > > > I can still remember driving my first MIL's two-stroke Saab (93 I think, > > help me out here Chip) in the early 70s, and at the time it was a > well-used > > vehicle. > > > > Four on the column, shifted from 3rd to 4th at 30 mph going downhill. > > > > It just radiated (as my college-age step-daughter would say) uber cool. > > > > First wife loved telling me about going to the gas station and being > stopped > > by the "expert" running the station when she started to pour a can of > > Saab-approved 2-cycle oil into the fuel tank. > > -- > OK Don, KD5NRO > Norman, OK > "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." > -Benjamin Disraeli > '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ > For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > -- LT Don http://don.homelinux.net/~don/ Proudly marching to the beat of a different kettle of fish. Make a small loan, Make a big difference - Kiva.org ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
IIRC, the flat rate time for a major overhaul of the Saab engine was 8 hours. There was a time when the 3 cyl. Saab engine with a bit of tuning was popular in a Lotus 11 chassis. On 9/20/07, Wonko the Sane <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > A two-stroke has a definite "cool" factor to it. > > I can still remember driving my first MIL's two-stroke Saab (93 I think, > help me out here Chip) in the early 70s, and at the time it was a well-used > vehicle. > > Four on the column, shifted from 3rd to 4th at 30 mph going downhill. > > It just radiated (as my college-age step-daughter would say) uber cool. > > First wife loved telling me about going to the gas station and being stopped > by the "expert" running the station when she started to pour a can of > Saab-approved 2-cycle oil into the fuel tank. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." -Benjamin Disraeli '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
A two-stroke has a definite "cool" factor to it. I can still remember driving my first MIL's two-stroke Saab (93 I think, help me out here Chip) in the early 70s, and at the time it was a well-used vehicle. Four on the column, shifted from 3rd to 4th at 30 mph going downhill. It just radiated (as my college-age step-daughter would say) uber cool. First wife loved telling me about going to the gas station and being stopped by the "expert" running the station when she started to pour a can of Saab-approved 2-cycle oil into the fuel tank. -- LT Don http://don.homelinux.net/~don/ Proudly marching to the beat of a different kettle of fish. Make a small loan, Make a big difference - Kiva.org ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
Umnh, no the 2 stroke Diesel concept is alive and well. http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/05/a_lightweight_v.html http://people.bath.ac.uk/ccsshb/12cyl/ http://www.aopa.org/pilot/features/future0008.html http://www.2si.com/2si_Industrial.htm http://www.mandiesel.com/ However in the medium segment they lost out to 4 stroke as they became more efficient and cleaner. Also 4 stroke is perceived to be more reliable and long term cost efficient. I am not sure whether the screaming Jimmies used a wet or dry sleeve. Peter Frederick wrote: > Very high emissions and very poor milage. > > 2-stroke diesel technology hit a dead end about 30 years ago, anything > still around is a left-over remnant. The combination of low > compression, inability to scavenge well, and reduced expansion > capability doomed the concept. The only advantage is low weight, and > once you get the huge supercharger in there to scavenge it will enough > to produce decent power, that advantage is gone as well. > > Peter > On Sep 20, 2007, at 7:22 AM, Peter Merle wrote: > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
> archer wrote: >> Germany built a three cylinder two cycle car, > > Who did that, DKW? NSU/Auto Union/Audi? > The Saab had an oil measuring cup in the gas cap, I think you were > supposed > to put regular 30W motor oil in it. > Mitch. ___ DKW, I'm pretty sure. Gerry DKW for sure, had a 3=6 DKW in Aden in the 60's Fred Moir Lynn MA Diesel Rules! - Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
No more two-strokes allowed in the US -- everything is gonna be four-stroke from now on out. Horrible emissions. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
Very high emissions and very poor milage. 2-stroke diesel technology hit a dead end about 30 years ago, anything still around is a left-over remnant. The combination of low compression, inability to scavenge well, and reduced expansion capability doomed the concept. The only advantage is low weight, and once you get the huge supercharger in there to scavenge it will enough to produce decent power, that advantage is gone as well. Peter On Sep 20, 2007, at 7:22 AM, Peter Merle wrote: > Why does the 2 stoke diesel not exist in passenger cars ? Are the > emmisions too high? > Peter > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ > For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
> archer wrote: >> Germany built a three cylinder two cycle car, > > Who did that, DKW? NSU/Auto Union/Audi? > The Saab had an oil measuring cup in the gas cap, I think you were > supposed > to put regular 30W motor oil in it. > Mitch. ___ DKW, I'm pretty sure. Gerry ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
Google "cerlist diesel" and you'll find a 3cyl 85hp 2 cycle diesel was used in the Jeep forward control series at one point in the late '50s and early '60s. Cerlist apparently claimed that each cylinder of their engine could make 25hp (I dunno why the 3 in the FC Jeep was 85hp). Supposedly they made or were going to make a 100hp v4 engine. If true and it was acceptable for automotive use just think of the possibilities. -Curt Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:22:22 +0200 From: "Peter Merle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels To: "Mercedes Discussion List" Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Why does the 2 stoke diesel not exist in passenger cars ? Are the emmisions too high? Peter - Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
-- Original message -- From: Mitch Haley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > archer wrote: > > Germany built a three cylinder two cycle car, > > Who did that, DKW? NSU/Auto Union/Audi? > The Saab had an oil measuring cup in the gas cap, I think you were supposed > to put regular 30W motor oil in it. > Mitch. > BTDT Put 1 qt of cheapest non-detergant you can find (I used Grants Special @ $.29/Qt) with 8 gallons of gas. Got to drive hard so as not to foul plugs. Left Rear fender will nevr rust, due to spilled oil! Pete ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
Two stroke in general never really took off in the car segment. The disadvantage of 2 stroke Diesels is that they need a supercharger to make em work. Why design a complicated 2 stroke engine when it is far easier to build a four stroke. Petrol two strokes don't need a supercharger and are relatively light, which makes them ideal for applications where horsepower is needed but a heavy engine isn't. Such as chainsaws, motorcycles (particularly off road ones) and a variety of other special things. Perhaps with the introduction of CDI technology we may see a two stroke Diesel in cars, or even small Diesel motors in general. Peter Merle wrote: > Why does the 2 stoke diesel not exist in passenger cars ? Are the > emmisions too high? > Peter > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ > For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
They were not diesel Peter -Original Message- From: archer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 20 September 2007 15:06 To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels - Original Message - From: "Peter Merle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Why does the 2 stoke diesel not exist in passenger cars ? Are the > emmisions too high? Peter -- Germany built a three cylinder two cycle car, a few of which were around after WW-2. Saab supposedly copied the engine and ran it in their early models. I drove the German version, which was also front wheel drive, on a trip since I was thinking about buying it from the owner. The steering was very clunky while driving/parking at low speeds, so no sale. IIRC it got fairly good gas mileage. One problem was the pistons tendency to stick in the cylinders, which is what eventually happened to the car I drove. This was before detergent oils, synthetic oils, etc. had been developed; so the cars weren't very practical back then. Gerry ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
archer wrote: > Germany built a three cylinder two cycle car, Who did that, DKW? NSU/Auto Union/Audi? The Saab had an oil measuring cup in the gas cap, I think you were supposed to put regular 30W motor oil in it. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels
2 strokes are not very efficient & the emissions are too high. Also, they tend to have a very narrow power band. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter Merle Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 7:22 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] Why no 2 stroke diesels Why does the 2 stoke diesel not exist in passenger cars ? Are the emmisions too high? Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
