Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
John took the time to answer: I dunno about brainiac, but I am young! The project is slowly coming along... we (group senior design project) have made progress, but not made progress. SWEET!! I'm sure your diligence and knowledge, combined with the fact you're actually doing something that will benifit you (and us as well), will pay off. Good Luck. Bob Rentfro '77 300D 142K Litchfield Park, AZ
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Gabriel S. wrote: any ideas on why they would design it that way? Does that apply for 124? YES and yes. Marshall -- Marshall Booth Ph.D. Ass't Prof. (ret.) Univ of Pittsburgh School of Medicine Department of Pharmacology 1300 BST Pittsburgh PA 15261 USA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Only cold air comes out the center vents before about 2000 -- the vents are shut off in heat mode. Peter
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
yea, you have the dreaded type 2 cc Bob Rentfro wrote: Peter typed: Only cold air comes out the center vents before about 2000 -- the vents are shut off in heat mode. I'm still...well, always, troubleshooting my HVAC and now there is a new twist. After driving for about 15 minutes with nothing on HVAC wise, I can start to feel a little wicked hot air at my feet and out of the center vents (thermometer in center vent reads 110 degrees) but it's just seeping out. I think it has lost it's mind. Any ideas? Thanks y'all. Bob Rentfro '77 300D 141K Litchfield Park, AZ ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Kaleb stated: yea, you have the dreaded type 2 cc I know...I hate it. Wasn't there some young, brainiac dude that was working on a viable replacement for this HVAC hell? I hope he is having sucess. Bob Rentfro 77 300D 141k Litchfield Park, AZ
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
On Fri, Oct 28, 2005 at 05:09:50PM -0700, Bob Rentfro wrote: Kaleb stated: yea, you have the dreaded type 2 cc I know...I hate it. Wasn't there some young, brainiac dude that was working on a viable replacement for this HVAC hell? I hope he is having sucess. There was, and there's also an electronic servo available for a mint from performance products IIRC. It's been a while since I read it, but slow response could be the foam tube for the in car sensor (by the right front speaker, IIRC), but it could also be everything :) K
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Bob Rentfro wrote: Kaleb stated: yea, you have the dreaded type 2 cc I know...I hate it. Wasn't there some young, brainiac dude that was working on a viable replacement for this HVAC hell? I hope he is having sucess. Yeah, but it costs as much as a new servo. Honestly, I feared the things at first. But how that I've become a bit more intimate with them, I understand them a bit better. Interesting bits of voodoo, they are... -- John L. Ervine 1981 240D 4-spd 268+kmi 1980 300TD 170+kmi 1980 300SD 277+kmi 1977 280S 4-spd 80+kmi
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
I have a line on a dude that will rebuild your servo for around $200 I believe if anybody is interested. John Ervine wrote: Bob Rentfro wrote: Kaleb stated: yea, you have the dreaded type 2 cc I know...I hate it. Wasn't there some young, brainiac dude that was working on a viable replacement for this HVAC hell? I hope he is having sucess. Yeah, but it costs as much as a new servo. Honestly, I feared the things at first. But how that I've become a bit more intimate with them, I understand them a bit better. Interesting bits of voodoo, they are... -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: I have a line on a dude that will rebuild your servo for around $200 I believe if anybody is interested. Next question: what internal bits are replaced as part of the rebuild? -- John L. Ervine 1981 240D 4-spd 268+kmi 1980 300TD 170+kmi 1980 300SD 277+kmi 1977 280S 4-spd 80+kmi
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
here is the email I got from the dude, no affiliation etc: Kaleb, I completely dismantle the units, clean, examine,evaluate and ultimately replace all worn components...I also effect specific modifications to the main bakelite housing which greatly reduce the potential for future leaks and cracks = longer operating life. Once all components are properly prepared I reassemble them using new hardware while properly setting the timing. Finally, with the unit rebuilt, I install it on a test bench and verify its proper function. I guarantee my rebuilds for 1 year ...including my paying the cost of shipping ( both ways) should you require service due to the malfunction of one of my rebuilt units. Kaleb, To rebuild servo with uncracked housings = US$220.00 + shipping To rebuild servo with a cracked housing add US$35.00 to above. For further info call Doug at 514-484-7546 after 7:00 PM John Ervine wrote: Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: I have a line on a dude that will rebuild your servo for around $200 I believe if anybody is interested. Next question: what internal bits are replaced as part of the rebuild? -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Holy crap, that sounds like a great deal! Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: here is the email I got from the dude, no affiliation etc: Kaleb, I completely dismantle the units, clean, examine,evaluate and ultimately replace all worn components...I also effect specific modifications to the main bakelite housing which greatly reduce the potential for future leaks and cracks = longer operating life. Once all components are properly prepared I reassemble them using new hardware while properly setting the timing. Finally, with the unit rebuilt, I install it on a test bench and verify its proper function. I guarantee my rebuilds for 1 year ...including my paying the cost of shipping ( both ways) should you require service due to the malfunction of one of my rebuilt units. Kaleb, To rebuild servo with uncracked housings = US$220.00 + shipping To rebuild servo with a cracked housing add US$35.00 to above. For further info call Doug at 514-484-7546 after 7:00 PM -- John L. Ervine 1981 240D 4-spd 268+kmi 1980 300TD 170+kmi 1980 300SD 277+kmi 1977 280S 4-spd 80+kmi
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
it could be, as I said though, no affiliation. Wonder if I can get a bulk rate, I got a pile of them sitting around. Maybe have him rebuild them then sell on ebay. Hmm. John Ervine wrote: Holy crap, that sounds like a great deal! Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: here is the email I got from the dude, no affiliation etc: Kaleb, I completely dismantle the units, clean, examine,evaluate and ultimately replace all worn components...I also effect specific modifications to the main bakelite housing which greatly reduce the potential for future leaks and cracks = longer operating life. Once all components are properly prepared I reassemble them using new hardware while properly setting the timing. Finally, with the unit rebuilt, I install it on a test bench and verify its proper function. I guarantee my rebuilds for 1 year ...including my paying the cost of shipping ( both ways) should you require service due to the malfunction of one of my rebuilt units. Kaleb, To rebuild servo with uncracked housings = US$220.00 + shipping To rebuild servo with a cracked housing add US$35.00 to above. For further info call Doug at 514-484-7546 after 7:00 PM -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
On Fri, Oct 28, 2005 at 07:54:26PM -0500, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: it could be, as I said though, no affiliation. Wonder if I can get a bulk rate, I got a pile of them sitting around. Maybe have him rebuild them then sell on ebay. Hmm. Yeah, how often do people ask you if you have a good servo? K
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
all the time Kevin wrote: On Fri, Oct 28, 2005 at 07:54:26PM -0500, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: it could be, as I said though, no affiliation. Wonder if I can get a bulk rate, I got a pile of them sitting around. Maybe have him rebuild them then sell on ebay. Hmm. Yeah, how often do people ask you if you have a good servo? K ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: I have a line on a dude that will rebuild your servo for around $200 I believe if anybody is interested. The problem with rebuilding the original plastic servos is that they may work perfectly right - up until they crack - AND they will crack - usually sooner rather than later. Nobody in their right mind will warrant a used plastic servo body for more than months or at most a year. Get one of the metal ones - some people will warrant them for as long as you own your car. Marshall -- Marshall Booth Ph.D. Ass't Prof. (ret.) Univ of Pittsburgh School of Medicine Department of Pharmacology 1300 BST Pittsburgh PA 15261 USA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Bob Rentfro wrote: I'm still...well, always, troubleshooting my HVAC and now there is a new twist. After driving for about 15 minutes with nothing on HVAC wise, I can start to feel a little wicked hot air at my feet and out of the center vents (thermometer in center vent reads 110 degrees) but it's just seeping out. I think it has lost it's mind. Any ideas? The way the wonderful Type II system is actually wired up the control system doesn't actually know if it is supposed to be on or off. The on/off of the system is a completely separate circuit, which is controlled by vacuum from the push button assembly. What that means is that even when your system is off it is still trying to heat/cool your car (just with no blower). What it sounds like is the system determined there was a need for heat and was allowing hot water through the heater core even though the system is off. The assumption by MB is that when the blower is off there will be no airflow so it doesn't really matter if the system is left on, but in your case some airflow is occuring and causing the seep. Unfortunately, that is proper operation of the system from my understanding of it. If anything, you might want to check and make sure that the recirculation flap is properly closing as thats the only thing I know of that would cause airflow. FWIW it happens in my car as well... just never been bad enough to crawl around underneath the blower though! Best of luck with it, John '79 300SD
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Bob Rentfro wrote: I know...I hate it. Wasn't there some young, brainiac dude that was working on a viable replacement for this HVAC hell? I hope he is having sucess. I dunno about brainiac, but I am young! The project is slowly coming along... we (group senior design project) have made progress, but not made progress. http://www.ece.msstate.edu/courses/design/ece4532/2005_fall/climate_control/ Click on deliverables and thats what we've turned in so far. The Approach document is due on Tuesday and that contains about 99% of the project (and was only about 3% complete for the draft :(. I'll be spending all day tomorrow working on it... and all of the schematics, models, etc that need to go in it. If you'd like to see what is the most recent version of everything take a look at: http://starquake.ath.cx/svn/dacc/ Its a subversion repository and contains all of the Datasheets, our schematics, the different models that we have for how the new system will operate, and all the documents we're working on and have turned in. Its not looking to be super cheap, but if you order all the stuff yourself, solder it yourself (prolly going to be hard as all surface mount components) It will hopefully come in under $300. The vacuum valves add about $100 to the cost of the system... they're stupidly expensive!! When the approach doc is done you'll be able to read why it costs what it does, and what alternative options we had to choose from, etc. Hopefully tomorrow will be nice and productive, and I can dump out a schematic (and hopefully an approach doc) for all to see! Thanks for remembering :) John '79 300SD
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
On my 83' 300D, I've heard so many stories about the climate control not working that I have a hard time telling whether mine is working or not. This center vent thing kind of answers a potential question, though I'm not sure I ever got much out of them in the summer either... It *generally* seems to heat and cool automatically. Though periodically if I leave it on, when I start the car it decides to just turn the fan on full blast with a cold engine when it's supposed to be warming. Also on a couple occasions during the summer it was cooling nicely. Then at some point decided that since it was 90 degrees out and I asked for 72, that I must want maximum heat. But not paying attention to those oddities, The controls themselves and what the manual says seems odd. The defrost button is only ever max fan with max heat? I can only imagine that the theory is that the only time you need that is when you're really cold and frosted badly? and I *thought* the way I understood it looking at the buttons that all the buttons would blow most air to lower vents, but the one next to the defrost button would blow top and bottom. On my car, that one is the ONLY one that I've noticed air blowing at my legs. The others with arrows pointing down only blow out the upper vents. And as mentioned with the center vents, it generally all comes out of the defroster vents and/or side vents. The other thing I'm thinking of is that it seems like once it gets to about the right temp it starts blowing *slightly cool* air in the winter or *slightly warm* air in the summer. Not terribly badly, but enough where I frequently notice it and it seems like it should just shut itself off if it's going to be just gently blowing the wrong temperature air at me... I guess I was just curious if anyone has enough understanding of the system so that they could give me some insight as to whether this is either: -How they are supposed to function -How they normally function -Messed up Or -Some other combination of things. Thanks! Levi (: On 10/28/05, J.B. Hebert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The center vents are for A/C and non-heated fresh air venting. Not 100% sure why the system was designed this way, but MB stuck with it at least through the 124 chassis cars. J.B.
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
OK, that actually makes sense. Though generally I'm just looking for less heat out of the upper center vents as opposed to cold air when I have the heater on... Levi On 10/28/05, Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 28 Oct 2005 10:23:50 -0400 J.B. Hebert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The center vents are for A/C and non-heated fresh air venting. Not 100% sure why the system was designed this way, but MB stuck with it at least through the 124 chassis cars. And I think that system is great, particularly with a manual system like my '72 220D/8 had. When your feet are cold, you usually have a jacket on. Put the warm air out the foot vents and then regulate the temperature with the flow of cold air out the center vents. Good engineering ... Craig
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
My guess would be one or more of the following for your car: 1) Broken solder joints in your climate control computer (intermittent functionality) 2) Deteriorated/missing hose that connects the cabin air temp sensor to the air box (delayed temperature regulation) 3) Leaking vacuum pods and/or lines (improper air direction) 4) Faulty monovalve (max heat, or no heat, depending) It took me a while to sort out the issues on my '82 300CD climate control. I ended up fixing and/or replacing all of the above at one time or another. Good luck. J.B. At 11:01 AM 10/28/2005, you wrote: On my 83' 300D, I've heard so many stories about the climate control not working that I have a hard time telling whether mine is working or not. This center vent thing kind of answers a potential question, though I'm not sure I ever got much out of them in the summer either... It *generally* seems to heat and cool automatically. Though periodically if I leave it on, when I start the car it decides to just turn the fan on full blast with a cold engine when it's supposed to be warming. Also on a couple occasions during the summer it was cooling nicely. Then at some point decided that since it was 90 degrees out and I asked for 72, that I must want maximum heat. But not paying attention to those oddities, The controls themselves and what the manual says seems odd. The defrost button is only ever max fan with max heat? I can only imagine that the theory is that the only time you need that is when you're really cold and frosted badly? and I *thought* the way I understood it looking at the buttons that all the buttons would blow most air to lower vents, but the one next to the defrost button would blow top and bottom. On my car, that one is the ONLY one that I've noticed air blowing at my legs. The others with arrows pointing down only blow out the upper vents. And as mentioned with the center vents, it generally all comes out of the defroster vents and/or side vents. The other thing I'm thinking of is that it seems like once it gets to about the right temp it starts blowing *slightly cool* air in the winter or *slightly warm* air in the summer. Not terribly badly, but enough where I frequently notice it and it seems like it should just shut itself off if it's going to be just gently blowing the wrong temperature air at me... I guess I was just curious if anyone has enough understanding of the system so that they could give me some insight as to whether this is either: -How they are supposed to function -How they normally function -Messed up Or -Some other combination of things. Thanks! Levi (: On 10/28/05, J.B. Hebert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The center vents are for A/C and non-heated fresh air venting. Not 100% sure why the system was designed this way, but MB stuck with it at least through the 124 chassis cars. J.B. ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.12.5/150 - Release Date: 10/27/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.12.5/150 - Release Date: 10/27/2005
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
On Fri, 28 Oct 2005 11:05:56 -0400 Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 10/28/05, Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And I think that system is great, particularly with a manual system like my '72 220D/8 had. When your feet are cold, you usually have a jacket on. Put the warm air out the foot vents and then regulate the temperature with the flow of cold air out the center vents. Good engineering ... OK, that actually makes sense. Though generally I'm just looking for less heat out of the upper center vents as opposed to cold air when I have the heater on... Note the qualifier: a manual system. Your car may not have a manual system. Craig
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wondering why no heat comes out of my 2 center heater ports ? Any insight would be appreciated. That's a FEATURE - not a flaw. Only air at outside temps or cooled air are supposed to come out of the center dash vents! It was designed that way! Marshall -- Marshall Booth Ph.D. Ass't Prof. (ret.) Univ of Pittsburgh School of Medicine Department of Pharmacology 1300 BST Pittsburgh PA 15261 USA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
Levi Smith wrote: What is the point of them if they're designed not to be used? Or perhaps the question is what are the parameters for them to be activated? The center vents are designed to distribute cooled air or air at outside temperatures! That's their purpose. If you don't want cooled or outntemp air, you can turn them off. Marshall -- Marshall Booth Ph.D. Ass't Prof. (ret.) Univ of Pittsburgh School of Medicine Department of Pharmacology 1300 BST Pittsburgh PA 15261 USA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] center vents - no heat
any ideas on why they would design it that way? Does that apply for 124? On 10/28/05, Marshall Booth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wondering why no heat comes out of my 2 center heater ports ? Any insight would be appreciated. That's a FEATURE - not a flaw. Only air at outside temps or cooled air are supposed to come out of the center dash vents! It was designed that way! Marshall -- Marshall Booth Ph.D. Ass't Prof. (ret.) Univ of Pittsburgh School of Medicine Department of Pharmacology 1300 BST Pittsburgh PA 15261 USA [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Gabriel Soto Southern California 1987 300D 230K=-
