Mersenne: atomic clock

[Achim . Passauer]

> But on http://www.mersenne.org/primenet/ you can see a difference of about
> 6 minutes (yes I did reload the page!) between the time on that page and
> UTC. That happened months ago, came back to normal and now it´s there
> again
> 
> Current PrimeNet Atomic Clock UTC Time is Monday 26 March 2001, 06:11:40
> 
> Reload-Time 06:17:23 UTC!!
> 
> Regards
> Achim
> 
> -Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
> Von:  John R Pierce [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Gesendet am:  Montag, 26. März 2001 08:14
> An:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Cc:   Mersenne discussion list
> Betreff:  Re: Mersenne: atomic clock
> 
> > it may be a little bit off topic, but could someone please inform the
> guys
> > operating the server that the atomic clock is (again) about 5-6 minutes
> > behind UTC? I couldn´t find their mail address.
> 
> which atomic clock would that be?  The US Naval Observatory master clock?
> http://tycho.usno.navy.mil/time.html   probably has contact info.  my
> local
> server time is referenced to a time server that is a few stratums removed
> from USNO time, my time seems to stay within about 50mS of USNO at all
> times.
> 
> -jrp
> 
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Re: Mersenne: atomic clock

[John R Pierce]

> it may be a little bit off topic, but could someone please inform the guys
> operating the server that the atomic clock is (again) about 5-6 minutes
> behind UTC? I couldn´t find their mail address.

which atomic clock would that be?  The US Naval Observatory master clock?
http://tycho.usno.navy.mil/time.html   probably has contact info.  my local
server time is referenced to a time server that is a few stratums removed
from USNO time, my time seems to stay within about 50mS of USNO at all
times.

-jrp


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Mersenne: atomic clock

[Achim . Passauer]

Hi all,

it may be a little bit off topic, but could someone please inform the guys
operating the server that the atomic clock is (again) about 5-6 minutes
behind UTC? I couldn´t find their mail address.

Thanks.

Best regards 
Achim

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Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[John R Pierce]

> >even with prime95 running 24/7 on my Windows2000 system, it seems to come
up
> >with a FEW idle cycles.  I figure its when prime95 gets paged out or
> >something.  I rebooted a couple of hours ago after photoshop blew up and
> >left the system kinda crispy, in the past 2h 48m, I show 3 minutes of
idle
> >time has accumulated.  2:43 has gone to prime95.  the rest to everything
> >else i've done (hardly none to a number of edit windows, web browsers,
etc).
>
> I know that there's an idle process (#0), an init process (#1), and many
other
> processes in a computer. Idle time accrues to the idle process. What I
don't
> understand is how 2:43 of the idle time was accounted to prime95 and the
other
> seventeen seconds to other processes - it should all have been accounted
to the
> idle process.

my bad.  I meant, out of 2h 48m elapsed time, 3m was idle, 2h 43m was
prime95, and the rest to various other processes.


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Mersenne: small bug in Mlucas 2.7b error checking

[EWMAYER]

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 20:00 PST
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subj: small bug in Mlucas 2.7b error checking

In doing some testing of exponents very near the upper
limit of what Mlucas 2.7b allows for 640K FFT length,
I discovered a bug which in some case will allow per-
iteration roundoff checking to be turned off when the
run passes the iteration number (call it ITER_ECHECK_OFF)
set in the mlucas.cfg file, even when the code detects
a dangerous fractional error in the iterations leading
up to ITER_ECHECK_OFF. (In which case roundoff checking
is supposed to remain on for the rest of the LL test
irrespective of the value of ITER_ECHECK_OFF.)

To see whether you need to take any action, do a 'grep
err *stat' in your mersenne test directory. (And until v2.7c
comes out, repeat this whenever your current run has gotten
about a day into its latest exponent.)
If your current exponent has yielded no error warnings, you
need do nothing. If you see one or more error warnings, do
one of the following (your choice):

1) Kill and restart the run. On restart the program parses
the .stat file and if it finds one or more fractional error
warnings it sets the appropriate internal flag which makes
error checking stay on for the entire run.

2) Set the value of ITER_ECHECK_OFF on line 4 of the mlucas.cfg
file to some value >= your current exponent. After the exponent
finishes, you can set it back to the old value. (If there's not
a big speedup from turning error checking off on your system,
you may want to leave it at a large value.)


Cheers,
-Ernst


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Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[Pierre Abbat]

On Sun, 25 Mar 2001, Jeff Woods wrote:
>At 10:03 AM 3/25/01 -0500, you wrote:
>
>> >even with prime95 running 24/7 on my Windows2000 system, it seems to come up
>> >with a FEW idle cycles.  I figure its when prime95 gets paged out or
>>
>>How does idle time accrue *to a process*? Idle time is when the CPU is not
>>executing any process.
>
>On a Win32 system, the idle time is kept track of by the idle PROCESS (a 
>thread or task operating autonomously, for you *n*x types).   It is by 
>hooking into and pseudo-taking over this process that Prime95 does its work.

You're ignoring the context of my question. The context was:

>even with prime95 running 24/7 on my Windows2000 system, it seems to come up
>with a FEW idle cycles.  I figure its when prime95 gets paged out or
>something.  I rebooted a couple of hours ago after photoshop blew up and
>left the system kinda crispy, in the past 2h 48m, I show 3 minutes of idle
>time has accumulated.  2:43 has gone to prime95.  the rest to everything
>else i've done (hardly none to a number of edit windows, web browsers, etc).

I know that there's an idle process (#0), an init process (#1), and many other
processes in a computer. Idle time accrues to the idle process. What I don't
understand is how 2:43 of the idle time was accounted to prime95 and the other
seventeen seconds to other processes - it should all have been accounted to the
idle process.

phma
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Re: Mersenne: First illegal prime?

[Nathan Russell]

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On Mon, 26 Mar 2001 01:15:33 +0200, Shot wrote:

>On 25 Mar 2001, at 16:47, Nathan Russell wrote:
>
>> There was a mildly amusing article on Slashdot several weeks ago
>> about how, when the international space station was resupplied,
>> DVD movies were among the items the astronauts requested as part
>> of
>> their personal weight allowance.  
>> 
>> There was discussion about which region outer space was in, and
>> whether the astronauts would be breaking a law every several
>> minutes as they passed between regions :) 
>> 
>> (As it happens, there's one region for such 'special international
>> venues' as cruise ships, and that's how it's dealt with) 
>
>Stragne - I heard that Sony equipped the astronauts with a player 
>capable of playing any DVD (a player with disabled region-lock 
>check)...

I didn't know it was possible to disable the check; I'd thought it
was somehow integrated into the cryptosystem.  

If it is possible, that means the players are being deliberately
designed to check, which could place the manufacturers at a legal
disadvantage if they're ever accused of interfering with free trade
or any such - which I, as a perpetual optimist, devotely hope they
eventually will be.  

Nathan

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Re: Mersenne: First illegal prime?

[Shot]

On 25 Mar 2001, at 16:47, Nathan Russell wrote:

> There was a mildly amusing article on Slashdot several weeks ago
> about how, when the international space station was resupplied, DVD
> movies were among the items the astronauts requested as part of
> their personal weight allowance.  
> 
> There was discussion about which region outer space was in, and
> whether the astronauts would be breaking a law every several
> minutes as they passed between regions :) 
> 
> (As it happens, there's one region for such 'special international
> venues' as cruise ships, and that's how it's dealt with) 

Stragne - I heard that Sony equipped the astronauts with a player 
capable of playing any DVD (a player with disabled region-lock 
check)...

Cheers,
-- Shot
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Re: Mersenne: First illegal prime?

[Nathan Russell]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Wed, 21 Mar 2001 18:12:49 -, Brian J. Beesley wrote:

>On 20 Mar 2001, at 18:42, Nathan Russell wrote:

>> 
>> Slashdot takes a particular interest in this program because many
>> of their editors and members believe that CSS is an infringment of
>> civil rights - specifically, their right to play DVDs on the
>> operating system of their choice.  
>
>And I agree. Totally. I thought there was also a problem that DVD 
>movies are offered later and at higher prices in some markets, 
>therefore CSS is seen as an infringement of consumer's rights to buy
> a product in the cheapest market.

That's true as well.  In particular, some people have had problems
when they moved between regions and their movies could no longer be
played after the old player broke.  There was a mildly amusing
article on Slashdot several weeks ago about how, when the
international space station was resupplied, DVD movies were among the
items the astronauts requested as part of their personal weight
allowance.  

There was discussion about which region outer space was in, and
whether the astronauts would be breaking a law every several minutes
as they passed between regions :)

(As it happens, there's one region for such 'special international
venues' as cruise ships, and that's how it's dealt with)

>> Of course, (in theory) that could be seen as a disproof of all
>> copyright - there's nothing that does not already exist.  Of
>> course, thinking of the number of possible English phrases - never
>> mind books, or images - is a fairly easy way to come up with
>> numbers that dwarf the Mersennes.  
>
>Nevertheless I have demonstrated a (for the time being, impractical
>-  but roll on quantum computing) _purely mechanical_ way of
>generating  all that content; this nullifies the whole idea of
>"intellectual 
>property", and the legal concept of copyright that goes with it.

A mixed blessing to be sure - without "intellectual property", the
various free software groups would no longer have assurance that
their programs would be distributed according to the license
requirements.  

>> Unfortunately for them, that 40-bit encryption is now hard-coded
>> into every DVD player; they can no more easily change it than they
>> can suddenly start selling videotapes for the Betamax VCR.  
>
>Tough. That's _their_ problem, not ours. The fact is that (for
>better  or for worse) the DeCSS cat is well and truly out of the
>bag, and I  don't see how lawyers are going to be able to persuade
>it to get back  in.

My conclusion, to date, is that they've managed to dig themselves in
deeper by encouraging the entire Internet community to go out of
their way to spread copies of DeCSS (and, more importantly, the
included tables, which IIRC are not part of the original 'illegal
prime').  

If I have a free week or so this summer, I might start hunting for an
illegal prime corresponding to a patch to add those tables...

>Regards
>Brian Beesley

Nathan

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Re: Mersenne: First illegal prime?

[Nathan Russell]

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On Wed, 21 Mar 2001 22:10:06 -, Brian J. Beesley wrote (re gray
bits):


>This is an example of the sort of "copy protection" I find 
>acceptable, because I can make as many perfect copies as I like for 
>my own use; nonetheless the copies can be identified as such, for
>the  purposes of prosecuting anyone who happens to be trading them
>in 
>place of genuine original pressings.

The same, of course, is true of the various shareware programs - if
someone's trading a program with a registration key purchased with my
credit card, it's reasonable for the author to conclude that I had a
role in distributing it.  

Nathan

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Re: Mersenne: Re: Getting new GIMPSers

[Nathan Russell]

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On Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:09:02 +0200, Steiner wrote:

>On Sun, Mar 25, 2001 at 10:03:01AM -0500, Pierre Abbat wrote:
>>How does idle time accrue *to a process*? Idle time is when the CPU
>>is not executing any process.
>
>Just like the brain, your computer can not `do nothing'. `Idle' time
>would most likely be spent in some sort of loop, possibly a HLT
>loop, keeping your CPU cool :-)

Very true, AFAIK.   This can be especially important with portable
computers, which can be improperly cooled.  

As Brian said, Windows gives a small share of CPU time to every
process (this can be observed by running a game or other program that
uses 100% CPU; when you look back, Prime95 will have been running at
ten percent or less of normal speed (I've seen timings go from 76 ms
to 2 seconds), but it will not have stopped completely.  

IIRC, this is part of the reason some other operating systems are
slightly better - they allow a program to sleep and wait for an
event, such as a mouse click, and begin running only when it needs to
deal with said event.  

Nathan

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Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[John R Pierce]

> How does idle time accrue *to a process*? Idle time is when the CPU is not
> executing any process.

in virtually every multitasking OS, there is a special "IDLE" process.  This
is usually something as simple as...

idleloop:
HLT
JMP idleloop

and this process is always 'ready' to run, and always at the LOWEST system
priority [many OS's have a special 'Idle' priority used only for this
process].  That way the task dispatcher *always* has somewhere to go if no
other process is ready.  The "HLT" instruction will be awoken at the very
next interrupt, and since anything that can cause a process to wake up
neccessarily involves a interrupt, this means no time is wasted.  HLT also
causes most CPUs to enter a reduced power state, running many degrees cooler
(when I exit prime95, my P3-933 goes from ~118F to ~80F in a very short
time).

-jrp


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Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[Jeff Woods]

At 10:03 AM 3/25/01 -0500, you wrote:

> >even with prime95 running 24/7 on my Windows2000 system, it seems to come up
> >with a FEW idle cycles.  I figure its when prime95 gets paged out or
>
>How does idle time accrue *to a process*? Idle time is when the CPU is not
>executing any process.

On a Win32 system, the idle time is kept track of by the idle PROCESS (a 
thread or task operating autonomously, for you *n*x types).   It is by 
hooking into and pseudo-taking over this process that Prime95 does its work.

Win32 tracks ALL processes by (I think) 32 different "priority" levels, 
broken into two different tiers (with only five basic priority levels from 
low, midium low, etc, to high).The Idle Process is but one more process 
running next to the Kernel, GDI, and other messaging and system processes 
as well as user applications.

It *will* get the occasional cycle, lest it never be accessed at all, even 
when Prime95 is running.
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Mersenne: Re: Getting new GIMPSers

[Steinar H. Gunderson]

On Sun, Mar 25, 2001 at 10:03:01AM -0500, Pierre Abbat wrote:
>How does idle time accrue *to a process*? Idle time is when the CPU is not
>executing any process.

Just like the brain, your computer can not `do nothing'. `Idle' time would
most likely be spent in some sort of loop, possibly a HLT loop, keeping
your CPU cool :-)

/* Steinar */
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Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[Pierre Abbat]

On Sun, 25 Mar 2001, John R Pierce wrote:
>> Hmm ... my comp has NO idle time anymore (8
>
>even with prime95 running 24/7 on my Windows2000 system, it seems to come up
>with a FEW idle cycles.  I figure its when prime95 gets paged out or
>something.  I rebooted a couple of hours ago after photoshop blew up and
>left the system kinda crispy, in the past 2h 48m, I show 3 minutes of idle
>time has accumulated.  2:43 has gone to prime95.  the rest to everything
>else i've done (hardly none to a number of edit windows, web browsers, etc).

How does idle time accrue *to a process*? Idle time is when the CPU is not
executing any process.

phma
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Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[Brian J. Beesley]

On 25 Mar 2001, at 2:08, John R Pierce wrote:

> > Hmm ... my comp has NO idle time anymore (8
> 
> even with prime95 running 24/7 on my Windows2000 system, it seems to
> come up with a FEW idle cycles.

Yes, to enable low-priority tasks to respond to events (mouse clicks 
etc) the scheduler makes sure every process - even the null process - 
gets a few cycles every so often. If you have a "normal" number of 
processes running you will probably have only about 99% of the actual 
processor cycles available to _all_ user processes. What is "normal?" 
Well, the task manager on my Win2K system shows 28 processes when all 
applications are shut.

Eè­Û
®&§ç¬
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Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[John R Pierce]

> Hmm ... my comp has NO idle time anymore (8

even with prime95 running 24/7 on my Windows2000 system, it seems to come up
with a FEW idle cycles.  I figure its when prime95 gets paged out or
something.  I rebooted a couple of hours ago after photoshop blew up and
left the system kinda crispy, in the past 2h 48m, I show 3 minutes of idle
time has accumulated.  2:43 has gone to prime95.  the rest to everything
else i've done (hardly none to a number of edit windows, web browsers, etc).

-jrp


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Mersenne Digest V1 #832

[Mersenne Digest]

Mersenne Digest Sunday, March 25 2001 Volume 01 : Number 832




--

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 18:42:17 -0500
From: Nathan Russell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mersenne: First illegal prime?

- -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Tue, 20 Mar 2001 22:22:11 -, Brian Beesley wrote:

>On 20 Mar 2001, at 13:35, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
(Phil Carmody's 'illegal prime')
>I take it "illegal" means that the particular number contains a 
>representation in some form of language for a computer program that 
>does something which transgresses the law. In this case, cracks 
>DeCSS.

 The embedded program is a version of DeCSS, a program for
cracking the CSS encryption scheme. 

Slashdot takes a particular interest in this program because many of
their editors and members believe that CSS is an infringment of civil
rights - specifically, their right to play DVDs on the operating
system of their choice.  

>Could I point out that all computer programs and databases can be 
>represented as simply large integers, and that, if the
>representation  of this particular program were therefore illegal, I
>could claim 
>copyright of all existing and future software for all digitally 
>encoded systems since I can demonstrate a method of generating every
> possible program, video, music track, ... simply by counting? The 
>best defence to my copyright claim might be that the expansion of pi
> probably contains every possible finite length sequence of digits, 
>whatever rational base you care to use to make the expansion, and 
>that nobody "owns" pi.

Of course, (in theory) that could be seen as a disproof of all
copyright - there's nothing that does not already exist.  Of course,
thinking of the number of possible English phrases - never mind
books, or images - is a fairly easy way to come up with numbers that
dwarf the Mersennes.  

>Now I know the law's pretty darned silly, especially when it comes
>to  deep abstract concepts like this, but really I think that it's
>not 
>the integer itself which would be illegal, but its _deliberate_ use 
>as a mechanism to crack DeCSS. _If_ cracking DeCSS is indeed
>illegal.  

Here, at least, it is, due to a particularly idiotic law known as the
Digital Millenium Copyright Act, which essentially says that evading
copy-protection measures is itself a crime - regardless of whether
copyright is actually broken.  

I might note that it's impossible to encrypt something so it cannot
be copied exactly; even now, it is very common for pirate DVD
manufacturers to simply copy the original disc byte for byte, without
even needing to crack the encryption.  

>IMHO DeCSS is so badly broken that its proponents might as well give
> up now, but that's a different story.

Unfortunately for them, that 40-bit encryption is now hard-coded into
every DVD player; they can no more easily change it than they can
suddenly start selling videotapes for the Betamax VCR.  

>Regards
>Brian Beesley

Nathan Russell

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--

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 19:58:17 -0600
From: "David L. Nicol" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mersenne: First illegal prime?

Nathan Russell wrote:

> I might note that it's impossible to encrypt something so it cannot
> be copied exactly; even now, it is very common for pirate DVD
> manufacturers to simply copy the original disc byte for byte, without
> even needing to crack the encryption.

I guess "grey bits" never caught on.  "Grey bits" were a copy-protection
mechanism in which parts of the original media a program is distributed on
were encoded poorly, so that repeated reads of the grey sections would
produce different results. Before running, the program would try to read
the grey section until something came up different.

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--

Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 12:09:44 +0100
From: "Jean Flinois" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mersenne: First illegal prime?

> Nathan Russell wrote:
>
> > I might note that it's impossible to encrypt something so it cannot
> > be copied exactly; even now, it is very common for pirate DVD
> > manufacturers to simply copy the original disc byte for byte, without
> > even needing to crack the encryption.
>
> I guess "grey bits" never caught on.  "Grey bits" were a copy-protection
> mechanism 

Re: Mersenne: Getting new GIMPSers

[mohk]

Hmm ... my comp has NO idle time anymore (8

At 10:08 PM 3/11/2002, you wrote:
>see http://www.freechess.org/ for a way to attract GIMPS members.
>
>Freechess.org RC5 cracking team
>
>Is your computer doing all it can? Do you have idle CPU cycles laying
>around that aren't doing anything for you? Put those extra cycles to work!
>Join the Freechess.Org RC5 cracking team! Team Freechess.Org is currently
>participating in the RC5 cracking effort hosted by distributed.net. For
>more information on the key cracking effort you are invited to vist
>http://www.distributed.net. This site has all the information on the
>cracking effort as well as the client you will need to join the team.
>
>If team Freechess.Org wins,
>
>- $6,000 US will go to a charity selected by the vote of all participants
>("The Gutenberg Project" is currently leading here),
>- $2,000 US will go to distributed.net for hosting the effort,
>- $1,000 US will go to the single person who finds the correct key (This
>could be you!), and finally
>- $1,000 US will go to FICS to use as they see fit.
>
>If you would like to see how our team is currently doing, please visit
>http://rc5stats.distributed.net/rc5-64/tmsummary.php3?team=4264.
>Team Freechess.Org looks forward to your participation! If you have any
>further questions, please send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>_
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>Mersenne Prime FAQ  -- http://www.tasam.com/~lrwiman/FAQ-mers

_
Unsubscribe & list info -- http://www.scruz.net/~luke/signup.htm
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