Re: Graphics

[Shari]

The price we pay for easier management by Apple is more space taken 
up on our disks.. though there are programs that eliminate extra 
languages automatically.


Shari, I wouldn't worry too much about your file size - I personally 
think it's just fine, and probably smaller than many (like the game 
we mentioned).


Cheers,
Karl


So the bigger our hard drives get, the bigger the programs get to fill them...

I had noticed that programs seemed to come with a lot of extraneous 
languages, but I hadn't dug much into the why's and wherefore's.  On 
systems before OSX, I'd be deleting unnecessaries in a heartbeat, but 
I'm not as comfortable with the guts of OSX and tend to be cautious 
about deleting anything.


First thing I used to do with a new OS is go into the Control Panels 
and Extensions and delete anything I wouldn't use.  OSX has all these 
different places where things are, and I don't know what they all 
mean.

So I leave them be.

Shari
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Re: Graphics

[Karl Becker]

On May 26, 2005, at 1:26 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:


Shari wrote:


Geez!  And I thought my game was bloated!



Whenever I start to feel bad about bloat-creep I just do a Get Info  
on any Apple app.


The theory with shared frameworks is that by putting the 80% of an  
application that's generic into a common shared library, an app can  
be made more efficient.


So what does this mean in real-world terms?

In OS 9 the Calculator app was 8k.
In OS X it's 3MB.

In OS 9 the DVD Player was 468k.
In OS X it's 13.8MB

In OS 9 iTunes was 3.9MB
In OS X it's 29.8MB


I know it's in fun, but do take a look at removing the extra  
languages if you haven't already.  I'm guessing that will trim the  
file size down some.
The language files exist for almost every language Apple supports -  
it makes it easier for them to distribute one app that supports every  
language than having a bunch of distributions and keeping track of  
them all.


The price we pay for easier management by Apple is more space taken  
up on our disks.. though there are programs that eliminate extra  
languages automatically.


Shari, I wouldn't worry too much about your file size - I personally  
think it's just fine, and probably smaller than many (like the game  
we mentioned).


Cheers,
Karl
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Re: Graphics

[xbury . cs]

On 26.05.2005 08:26:09 metacard-bounces wrote:
>Shari wrote:
>> Geez!  And I thought my game was bloated!
>
>Whenever I start to feel bad about bloat-creep I just do a Get Info on
>any Apple app.
>
>The theory with shared frameworks is that by putting the 80% of an
>application that's generic into a common shared library, an app can be
>made more efficient.
>
>So what does this mean in real-world terms?
>
>In OS 9 the Calculator app was 8k.
>In OS X it's 3MB.
>
>In OS 9 the DVD Player was 468k.
>In OS X it's 13.8MB
>
>In OS 9 iTunes was 3.9MB
>In OS X it's 29.8MB

I have another view Richard,


NT4: 96KBs
W2K3 calculator: 113KB

The finder + system in MacOS1.0 = 160KBs
Windows 2003 Server install (Winnt alone) 1.8GBs ;0

By using a framework library, your applications are 90% smaller, 
and require 90% less support or development time but it does require
a larger framework library and about twice the time to work out the
library than it would for individual program features. On the other 
hand, by the time you re-use a feature, you've multiplied your efficiency
times 2!!! It's the Art of OOP ;)

cheers
Xavier



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Re: Graphics

[Richard Gaskin]

Shari wrote:

Geez!  And I thought my game was bloated!


Whenever I start to feel bad about bloat-creep I just do a Get Info on 
any Apple app.


The theory with shared frameworks is that by putting the 80% of an 
application that's generic into a common shared library, an app can be 
made more efficient.


So what does this mean in real-world terms?

In OS 9 the Calculator app was 8k.
In OS X it's 3MB.

In OS 9 the DVD Player was 468k.
In OS X it's 13.8MB

In OS 9 iTunes was 3.9MB
In OS X it's 29.8MB

:)

--
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RE: Graphics

[Shari]

But how do you explain a 200MB demo of GTR being so popular then?

http://www.bhmotorsports.com/GTR/downloads/2972

Advertising wise they haven't done much at all...

cheers
Xavier


They appear to be featured on some major sites.  Gamers Hell and 3D 
Gamers and Electronic Arts got them a lot of downloads, looks like. 
Ach, we're in the wrong game biz!  LOL!


I did create the 1000 btns, and the overhead was .1 MB without the 
graphics.  Opening the Control Browser is a bugger, though.  Am 
working on the graphics now...


Shari
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Re: Graphics

[Shari]

Also, can animated gifs be used as icons on buttons, or just static images?

Cheers,
Karl


YES!  I just discovered this one recently.  Set the icon to an 
animated GIF, and it will play the GIF automatically.  You can also 
start/stop it, though I haven't played much with that.  So others 
would have to chime in if you need details :-)  The latest edition of 
my game has an animated GIF in it.  Bit of work to create but well 
worth the effort :-)


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Re: Graphics

[Shari]

Tell that to iPoker... it's a 36.2MB download, stuffed!



I can't figure that one!  The voices are computer voices, so there 
shouldn't be any sound files.  There are a few graphics and small 
Quicktime movies, but nothing that would come close to 36 MB.  I 
wonder where the overhead came from?


Let's see, dissecting the folder

The game itself is 1.7 MB.  The games folder (with the 100+ variants 
of poker) is 2 MB.  The options (graphics) are 17.2 MB.  He did a 
terrible job with compression and size issues!  My graphics file with 
hundreds of graphics is about 2 MB.


The player folder is 39.3 MB, which is a huge list of Quicktime 
movies.  I know he could have done better...


Geez!  And I thought my game was bloated!


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RE: Graphics

[MisterX]

 
> > I did a bit of research not long ago at various download sites.  
> > Comparing my download rates with some of the competition.  
> Even though 
> > my game had better screenshots, a better description, equal 
> or better 
> > options, and an equal rating, it got less downloads.  The only 
> > explanation was size.

But how do you explain a 200MB demo of GTR being so popular then?

http://www.bhmotorsports.com/GTR/downloads/2972

Advertising wise they haven't done much at all...

cheers
Xavier

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Re: Graphics

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, Karl Becker  wrote:

> can animated gifs be used as icons on buttons...?

Definitely.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
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Re: Graphics

[Karl Becker]

It's crucial to keep it from getting any bigger, because people  
will download the smaller competitors first.  And only if they are  
unhappy will they finally download mine.  Most C-based games of  
this type are less than 1 MB stuffed.


Many shareware games are bigger than 1 MB stuffed nowadays, though,  
especially if it's something that's costing a decent amount of money.


I did a bit of research not long ago at various download sites.  
Comparing my download rates with some of the competition.  Even  
though my game had better screenshots, a better description, equal  
or better options, and an equal rating, it got less downloads.  The  
only explanation was size.


That's ignoring play, word of mouth, advertising, etc.  A company  
like Freeverse will have a lot more pull from the get-go because  
people know them and are at their website for other reasons/games  
already.  With a smaller number of games offered (and a smaller  
advertising budget), the playing field is not quite level.


I tried my darndest to get the whole kaboodle to be less than 1 MB  
stuffed, but even with compressing all the graphics and whittling  
away at various things, it's 3.5 MB stuffed.


It's really impossible to get it smaller than 1MB.  My KTA Tennis app  
zipped with Mac OS X 10.4 only shrinks to 1.1MB ... and that's not  
including most of the artwork / sound assets.


I had hoped for a solution that didn't involve thousands of  
additional objects :-(


I would like to know if this speeds up game execution a lot, so let  
us know if you try to implement it.


Also, can animated gifs be used as icons on buttons, or just static  
images?


Cheers,
Karl
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Re: Graphics

[Ken Ray]

On 5/25/05 2:43 PM, "Shari" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> That's actually what I normally do for graphics, I'm good at that.
> But to have thousands of additional btn objects would surely create
> significant overhead?  Anything more than a few K is bad.

Well, the button objects themselves won't add much. But if you want, you
could make graphics of 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5 chips and then reduce the number of
overall buttons needed to represent a "stack".

> It's crucial to keep it from getting any bigger, because people will
> download the smaller competitors first.  And only if they are unhappy
> will they finally download mine.  Most C-based games of this type are
> less than 1 MB stuffed.

Tell that to iPoker... it's a 36.2MB download, stuffed!
 
> I did a bit of research not long ago at various download sites.
> Comparing my download rates with some of the competition.  Even
> though my game had better screenshots, a better description, equal or
> better options, and an equal rating, it got less downloads.  The only
> explanation was size.

Perhaps the target audience is still mostly on dial-up? Is that what you're
finding?


Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Web site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Graphics

[Shari]

What is so unique about the chips?  If they're separate then yes, you would
use a separate object for each chip.  If your question is how to manage them
efficiently, you could create your chips as buttons and set their icon
properties to the appropriate source chip image stored in your stack.  This
way you can have a thousand chips (buttons) with virtually no additional
overhead since all the chips are only pointers original chip art.

Regards,

Scott Rossi


Scott,

That's actually what I normally do for graphics, I'm good at that. 
But to have thousands of additional btn objects would surely create 
significant overhead?  Anything more than a few K is bad.


It's crucial to keep it from getting any bigger, because people will 
download the smaller competitors first.  And only if they are unhappy 
will they finally download mine.  Most C-based games of this type are 
less than 1 MB stuffed.


I did a bit of research not long ago at various download sites. 
Comparing my download rates with some of the competition.  Even 
though my game had better screenshots, a better description, equal or 
better options, and an equal rating, it got less downloads.  The only 
explanation was size.


I tried my darndest to get the whole kaboodle to be less than 1 MB 
stuffed, but even with compressing all the graphics and whittling 
away at various things, it's 3.5 MB stuffed.


I had hoped for a solution that didn't involve thousands of 
additional objects :-(


Shari
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Re: Graphics

[Klaus Major]

Hi Scott,


Recently, Shari  wrote:

Has anyone here every played iPoker?
I love the way they handle the player's chips and have been pondering
how to do it in Metacard.  If each chip were an object, you'd have a
helluva lot of objects.
I'm not familiar enough with other ways of handling graphics to do it
without objects.

What is so unique about the chips?  If they're separate then yes,  
you would
use a separate object for each chip.  If your question is how to  
manage them

efficiently, you could create your chips as buttons and set their icon
properties to the appropriate source chip image stored in your  
stack.  This
way you can have a thousand chips (buttons) with virtually no  
additional

overhead since all the chips are only pointers original chip art.


Try to tell THAT the casino boss :-D


Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-
E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com


Best

Klaus Major
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.major-k.de

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Re: Graphics

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, Shari  wrote:

> Has anyone here every played iPoker?
> 
> I love the way they handle the player's chips and have been pondering
> how to do it in Metacard.  If each chip were an object, you'd have a
> helluva lot of objects.
> 
> I'm not familiar enough with other ways of handling graphics to do it
> without objects.

What is so unique about the chips?  If they're separate then yes, you would
use a separate object for each chip.  If your question is how to manage them
efficiently, you could create your chips as buttons and set their icon
properties to the appropriate source chip image stored in your stack.  This
way you can have a thousand chips (buttons) with virtually no additional
overhead since all the chips are only pointers original chip art.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-
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Graphics

[Shari]

Has anyone here every played iPoker?

I love the way they handle the player's chips and have been pondering 
how to do it in Metacard.  If each chip were an object, you'd have a 
helluva lot of objects.


I'm not familiar enough with other ways of handling graphics to do it 
without objects.


Shari
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3d graphics in RR/MC

[Alejandro Tejada]

Hi Developers,
 
Download the stack Rotater Manipulator from:



This is an adaptation of the HC stack of Alexander
Thomas that you could download from his website:
 


I've added 3D matrix math to make the transformations
still more faster and included the "Live" option
suggested by Jim Hurley (use this option with
models of a few lines like the cube and some simple
shapes like the Fighter and the Tank).

Read the Help card (second card)
of this stack for useful information.

I've invited to Alexander Thomas to test RunRev 
by himself and to visit us in the mail list.

Enjoy! :-))

al

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Re: Inline Graphics

[Ray Horsley]

Thanks Ray and Scott!

Very cool thing!  It may be old to a lot of guys, but I've been working with
Metacard for over a year, and I never knew you could do that.

Thanks again,


Ray Horsley
Developer, LinkIt! Software



on 8/21/03 2:27 PM, Ray G. Miller at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> From: Ray Horsley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> 
>> Greetings,
>> 
>> 
>> I'm wanting to display things like the degree sign (the superscript zero)
>> and fractions (stacked vertically), but of course I want them to flow with
>> text in a field as it gets displayed on different systems with different
>> fonts.  Anybody know of anyway to put a graphic "in" a field so it does
>> this?
> 
> 
> Ray,
> Have you tried:
> 
> 
> set the imageSource of char y of line x of field showFldName to imageID
> 
> Ray G. Miller
> __
> Turtlelips Productions
> 4009 Everett Ave.
> Oakland, CA 94602
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Re: Inline Graphics

[Ray G. Miller]

From: Ray Horsley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


Greetings,

I'm wanting to display things like the degree sign (the superscript zero)
and fractions (stacked vertically), but of course I want them to flow with
text in a field as it gets displayed on different systems with different
fonts.  Anybody know of anyway to put a graphic "in" a field so it does
this?


Ray,
Have you tried:
set the imageSource of char y of line x of field showFldName to imageID

Ray G. Miller
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Re: Inline Graphics

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, Ray Horsley wrote:

> I'm wanting to display things like the degree sign (the superscript zero)
> and fractions (stacked vertically), but of course I want them to flow with
> text in a field as it gets displayed on different systems with different
> fonts.  Anybody know of anyway to put a graphic "in" a field so it does
> this?

Have you tried the imageSource property?

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director

Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.tactilemedia.com

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Inline Graphics

[Ray Horsley]

Greetings,


I'm wanting to display things like the degree sign (the superscript zero)
and fractions (stacked vertically), but of course I want them to flow with
text in a field as it gets displayed on different systems with different
fonts.  Anybody know of anyway to put a graphic "in" a field so it does
this?

Thanks!


Ray Horsley
Developer, LinkIt! Software

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blendLevel for graphics/EPS?

[Karl Becker]

Are there any plans to implement the blendLevel property for graphics 
and EPS objects?

This would be a huge solution to some features I need for projects I'm 
working on right now.

Thanks,
Karl
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[ANN] graphics transformations 01

[Alejandro Tejada]

Download the stack: graphics transformations 01
from:

http://ffc.virtualave.net/graphics_transformations_01.zip

This stack shows the use of matrices to scale,
rotate and skew polygon graphics. The included flip
transformation does not use matrices.

Feel free to add your own enhancements and post them
back to the list or send them directly to me for
including in a next version.

Planned enhancements:
1- Transform multiple graphics (currently only one)
2- Convert the scripts and stack to work as palette.
3- Better Interface.

Alejandro

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Converting Regular Graphics to Polygons Graphics

[Alejandro Tejada]

Hi fellow list members,

I was working in the code to convert regular
graphics in polygon graphics.
You can see the results in the following file:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/metacard/files/export_regular_polygons.zip

You need to have a Yahoo account to download
from this group, so a Temporal File area will be
a nice addition to this list, too.

When you open the file you will notice that
there is a big regular graphics in the center
of the stack. A smaller graphic is at the left.

You change the number of sides
using the blue popUp button at the right.
The slider lets you change the angle of the
graphic. Additionally, when you change the angle,
a mouseUp msg is sent to the center regular graphic
and an outlined black line polygon graphic is draw
around this graphic.
As the outline of both graphics are not the same
colors, you will notice the slightest differences
between both.
Although, is almost exact for some angles and some
sides, you'll notice when not.

But the real problem is the small regular graphic.
This graphic was scaled so the polygon that draws
around it has to rescale itself and this is were the
problems begun.

A regular graphic is draw inside a circle, so his rect
includes the circle that surround it.

When I set the rect of the Polygon graphic to the
rect of the regular graphic, the result is a
graphic identically proportional but always bigger.

The question is:

How can I rescale the polygon graphic to fit exactly
over the NON proportional scaled regular graphic?

In a first attempt, I made a code to fit the
Polygon over a regular graphic of 6 sides.
It works well for some angles, but not for others.
I have not included this code in this file,
but if you want to give it a try, I'll
send you or post in the list.

In my limited math knowledge, a code that works
in every situation (all angles for all number of
sides) must require to know "exactly" where the
vertex fall in the area of the regular graphic.
Only in certain angles the vertex of some graphics
touch the edges of the rectangle. This is the ideal
situation.

Any help in this area is welcome,

Thanks in advance.

Alejandro







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Graphics and visual effects

[Shari]

I often run into the problem where showing a graphic with a visual 
effect produces a white area.  Where part of the graphic shows up 
white and the rest is okay.  Or part of it shows up as diagonal lines 
and the rest is okay.  Or sometimes the whole graphic shows up as 
nothing but diagonal lines during the effect.

It will work sometimes and not others.

I am assuming this is memory related.  As it seems to happen more 
when the program has been running awhile, and I've been in and out of 
several stacks (all with the destroy properties set to true).

I believe that folks with less memory available to them experience 
this as well.

Is there any way to address it?

Many times I close a stack, with all the destroy properties set to 
true, but somehow Metacard still has the stack in memory.  Because 
when I open it again, I get the purge dialog.  I suspect there's a 
relationship, things being stored in memory that I didn't want there, 
and memory running out.

I guess I don't expect an answer, but who knows?  Maybe somebody out 
there found a fix :-)  Or maybe there's a piece of code I need to add 
to better purge the memory during operation.

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RE: disappearing movies and graphics

[Chipp Walters]

> I have a folder with my graphics in it (jpegs and gifs) and one with my
> Quicktime movies and use relative paths in the program. I built a
> standalone
> on a Mac, and when I run it on another Mac the movies do not show
> up but the
> players do and some graphics show up, other graphics show up when I go to
> the next card and then go back, and some don't show up at all.

>When I save the same
> program on
> a PC and run the standalone on the PC, everything shows up! Any help would
> be greatly appreciated!

My guess it has something to do with how the PC and Mac transform the
pathnames. I'd suggest you set the paths programatically each time you
startup. On startup, get the folder your in and then set the filename of
each image programatically and see if it doesn't work. I built a 'skinnable'
presentation program that way and it worked well.

-Chipp


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Re: disappearing movies and graphics

[Ken Ray]

I honestly don't know of the top of my head... does anyone else have an
idea?

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 2:33 PM
Subject: RE: disappearing movies and graphics


> Ken,
>
> I haven't had time to really work with that project until this
> morning. Buffering
> the images worked well, but it seems that the only image type I can
> get
> to display right are gifs. Although, I have a buffered gif that just
> doesn't want
> to show up. It is positioned under a button if that makes any
> difference.
> Also, I found that when I buffered the players the movies would
> flash very
> quickly in the player while playing. Do you have any idea why the
> movies are
> doing this?
>
> Thanks so much for your assitance.
> Kristen Billings
> VA Healthcare System Pittsburgh
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
> > Just curious... did you set the "alwaysBuffer" of the players/images to
> > true? If not, it probably would be a good idea (unless you feel the
target
> > audience has significant memory constraints), as it helps a lot with
> > redraw
> > issues. Then try it again and report back if it didn't work out...
> >
> > Ken Ray
> > Sons of Thunder Software
> > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> >
> >
> > ___
> > metacard mailing list
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RE: disappearing movies and graphics

[Kristen . Billings]

Ken,

I haven't had time to really work with that project until this
morning. Buffering
the images worked well, but it seems that the only image type I can
get
to display right are gifs. Although, I have a buffered gif that just
doesn't want
to show up. It is positioned under a button if that makes any
difference. 
Also, I found that when I buffered the players the movies would
flash very
quickly in the player while playing. Do you have any idea why the
movies are 
doing this?

Thanks so much for your assitance.
Kristen Billings
VA Healthcare System Pittsburgh
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



> Just curious... did you set the "alwaysBuffer" of the players/images to
> true? If not, it probably would be a good idea (unless you feel the target
> audience has significant memory constraints), as it helps a lot with
> redraw
> issues. Then try it again and report back if it didn't work out...
> 
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> 
> 
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disappearing movies and graphics

[Kristen . Billings]

Hi all. I have a (hopefully) easy question about my standalone program.
 
I have a folder with my graphics in it (jpegs and gifs) and one with my
Quicktime movies and use relative paths in the program. I built a standalone
on a Mac, and when I run it on another Mac the movies do not show up but the
players do and some graphics show up, other graphics show up when I go to
the next card and then go back, and some don't show up at all. Am I missing
an important concept about graphics and movies in Metacard? (I am very new
to the program and programming in general.) When I save the same program on
a PC and run the standalone on the PC, everything shows up! Any help would
be greatly appreciated!

Thanks in advance,
Kristen Billings
VA Healthcare System
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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moving icon graphics from HC to MC

[erik hansen]

i have several dozen 32x32 icons in HC that i use
for Mexican folklorico dancers. they can be
copied from the icon editor and pasted to a HC
card, and a shot of the card can be exported. the
programs that will open the "document" file do
not let you "save as" a jpeg or gif file.
photoshop does not register the files existence.

i checked the faq, readme, and index with no
result. there is a lot in the archives which is a
step or two beyond me. any ideas for a simple
icon transfer from HC > MC?


=
[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org

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Re: html graphics problem

[Dave Cragg]

At 2:38 pm -0800 11/12/01, Kevin Wilson wrote:

>everything works fine. If I try -
>
>put "  " into variable1
>put "" into variable2
>put variable1 & line 1 of fld "Master" and variable2 into fld "Dimension"
>
>("11430" being the id of the image that I am using), the ability to
>highlight lines in the text field becomes completely arbitrary, some
>lines working and others not.

This seems to be either a bug or a limitation of embedded graphics.

You can set the the imageSource of a single character in a field to 
the id of an image. So if you have the following in a field:

x  Smoked Eel

and do the following:

set the imageSource of char 1 of field 1 to 11430

it works fine. In this case the "x" is still present in the field 
text, it's just not displayed. (You can look in the "contents" filed 
in the property dialog to see that it's still there.) But the 
htmlText for the field returns:

  Smoked Eel

The first character is missing from the htmlText. So setting the 
field to this htmlText doesn't produce what we started with. I guess 
this accounts for the weirdness of selecting in list fields.

The only way round this I think is to use a "dummy" character in the 
html and set the imageSource of that char after setting the htmlText. 
Something like"

set the htmlText of field 1 to "x Smoked Eel
set the imageSource of char 1 of field 1 to 11430

Not so elegant. :(

Cheers
Dave Cragg





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html graphics problem

[Kevin Wilson]

Hello list. I having a problem with embedding html 
graphics in a text field, and I'm not sure that I understand why. I am working 
with a text field with list behavior, and I am trying to embed an image at the 
beginning of each line.
I have tried a number of different methods. if I 
try - 
 
put "" into variable1
put "" into variable2
put variable1 & line 1 of fld "Master" and 
variable2 into fld "Dimension"
 
everything works fine. If I try - 

 
put "  " into variable1
put "" into variable2
put variable1 & line 1 of fld "Master" and 
variable2 into fld "Dimension"
 
("11430" being the id of the image that I am using), the ability to 
highlight lines in the text field becomes completely arbitrary, some lines 
working and others not. 
I have also tried it without quotes, like this - 
 

put "
put "" into variable2
put variable1 & line 1 of fld "Master" and 
variable2 into fld "Dimension"
 
which produces the same arbitrary results, and also like this - 
 
put "

put "" into variable2
put variable1 & line 1 of fld "Master" and 
variable2 into fld "Dimension"
 
which also produces the same results, some lines working and others not. 
Each time that I try it, the lines which work and the ones which do not are 
different. While I have not included all of the code that is involved, I have 
made a small stack and recreated the problem in it, and I would be happy to send 
it to anyone who thinks that they might have a suggestion as to what the problem 
might be. Thanks for the help.

BEGIN:VCARD
VERSION:2.1
N:;Kevin
FN:Kevin
ORG:Etraffic Solutions, Inc.
TITLE:programmer
NOTE;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:**=0D=0AEtraffic=
 Solutions Inc. is a 2001 funding recipient of the=0D=0ACANARIE eLearning fu=
nding. World-recognized CANARIE is Canada's =0D=0AAdvanced Internet Developm=
ent Organization. Etraffic Solutions Inc. =0D=0Ais the project lead of a maj=
or new high technology application =0D=0Athat will transform the way second =
languages are taught online.=0D=0A=0D=0AVisit http://www.etrafficsolutions.c=
om/ for more information!=0D=0A*=
**
TEL;WORK;VOICE:1-866-658-8238
TEL;WORK;FAX:1-250-658-5936
ADR;WORK:;;2955 Jutland Suite 102;Victoria;British Columbia;V8T 5J9;Canada
LABEL;WORK;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:2955 Jutland Suite 102=0D=0AVictoria, British Columbia V8T 5J9=0D=0ACanada
URL;WORK:http://www.etrafficsolutions.com
EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
REV:20011211T223801Z
END:VCARD

Re: Inquiry for graphics external

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote/ schreef:

> MC currently doesn't support painting on an alphamask..so it strips the
> alphamask with any image editing operation (ie.flips and rotation). You
> can however save the alphadata away before rotating it..rotate the
> alphadata by script, and apply it afterwards using the alphadata
> property.
> If this is too slow you can still take advantage of the
> alphadata/imagedata/maskdata properties by having an external do the
> heavy bit fiddling (external api now supports manipulating binary data)
> [snip]
Or what you can do is use MC built-in functions to manipulate the image when
the user is rotating, flipping etc., and do the manipulation on idle (when
the user's done) by exporting the mask and alphadata. Also you dan save the
original image, so it only get minimally distorted.

> Tuviah
> http://members.aol.com/tuvsnyder/
Regards, / Groeten,
Sjoerd


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Re: Inquiry for graphics external

[diskot123]

>MetaCard's implementation introduces very noticeable
> distortions, especially with images that have alpha channels.
MC currently doesn't support painting on an alphamask..so it strips the
alphamask with any image editing operation (ie.flips and rotation). You
can however save the alphadata away before rotating it..rotate the
alphadata by script, and apply it afterwards using the alphadata
property. If this is too slow you can still take advantage of the
alphadata/imagedata/maskdata properties by having an external do the
heavy bit fiddling (external api now supports manipulating binary data)
..see the mossiac example in the new 2.4 external tutorial for an example
of a cross platform image manipulation external.

Tuviah
http://members.aol.com/tuvsnyder/

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Re: rotation property (was: Inquiry for graphics external)

[fuegox]

On Wednesday, November 14, 2001, at 01:13 AM, Sjoerd Op 't Land wrote:

> Tereza Snyder wrote/ schreef:
>
>> MetaCard's implementation introduces very noticeable
>> distortions, especially with images that have alpha channels.
> I think this is a quite important subject, because it is one of the 
> things
> that Macromedia Flash does better than MC/RR.
>
> Anyway I feel that this 'rotate' command that we have now is a step in 
> the
> right direction, but definitely not 'it'. I think a better solution 
> would be
> that every object (I mean every field, button, graphic etc,etc) had a
> 'rotation' property, which could be set to some value between 0 and 359
> degrees.
>
> This solution would involve storing the original 
> image(,field,button...) but
> would take care for not distorting the image.
>
> How do others think about this?
>
> Regards, / Groeten,
> Sjoerd

I think that this would be fabulous!

-Mark


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Re: Inquiry for graphics external

[Tereza Snyder]

>>> On Monday, November 12, 2001,I wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Does anyone have a Mac/Win external that I could use to manipulate
>>>> graphics
>>>> images - rotate, scale, crop - to supplement or replace MetaCard 2.4
>>>> built-in functions? MetaCard's implementation introduces very noticeable
>>>> distortions, especially with images that have alpha channels.
>>>> Unfortunately, my application encourages users
>>>> to crop, scale, rotate, and flip the  images  they import.
>> 

and Kevin James suggested:

> 
> Have you considered using java applets?  They are prone to all the
> problems of java ... slow, differing behaviors with platform-specific
> interpreters, etc. ... but could be a temporary fix ("need is
> immediate") to buy you some time.  They are also cross-platform by
> default, platform-specific issues notwithstanding.
> 
> My specific need is to use MC as a front end for a medical image
> archive of xrays, ct and mri data, etc.  Functions such as leveling,
> rotating, cropping etc. are essential for viewing these sorts of
> images.
> 
> In lieu of externals, my current approach is to use MC as front end
> for both uploading and viewing images  ... data such as patient name,
> etc. are written to a webserved database and the image is ftp'ed to
> the appropriate location.  To view the images, I have MC launch a
> browser with a URL that finds images based on the user's search
> criteria, such as name, medical record #, etc.  This results page is
> formatted in such a way that each image is represented by several
> hyperlinks corresponding to multiple ways to view the image.  You can
> view the image "as is" as a regular jpeg in your browser, use a
> simple java applet which basically allows you to zoom in and out, or
> use the feature-rich ImageJ, a public domain project of the National
> Institutes of Health which bills itself as "the world's fastest pure
> Java image processing program."
> 
> Check it out:
> 
> http://rsb.info.nih.gov/ij/applet2/
> 
[snip]

Wow! amazing stuff.

I can't imitate your approach in my application (where my users are
creating, combining, printing, and saving documents (stacks) containing
images and text and more) but I lust for the features I saw in my quick
exploration of ImageJ!

Thanks for the link


tereza





+ Tereza Snyder 
+ Senior Software Developer
+ Attainment Company, Inc.
+ 
+ 800.327.4269


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Re: Inquiry for graphics external

[Kevin James]

>
>on 11.12.01 05:01PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>>
>>  On Monday, November 12, 2001,I wrote:
>>
>>>  Does anyone have a Mac/Win external that I could use to manipulate
>>>  graphics
>>>  images - rotate, scale, crop - to supplement or replace MetaCard 2.4
>>>  built-in functions? MetaCard's implementation introduces very noticeable
>>>  distortions, especially with images that have alpha channels.
>>>  Unfortunately, my application encourages users
>>>  to crop, scale, rotate, and flip the  images  they import.
>
>to which Mark Talluto replied:
>
>>
>>  I am not a big fan of externals as there is always the potential of not
>>  having it for the platform you need.  Since MC has implemented most of
>>  these features, I would write into Scott and discuss what needs to be
>>  improved in a future version.  I will be using these new image features
>>  too in the next few weeks too.  If they are not working right as good as
>>  they could, maybe something could be done internally to improve them.
>>  This would be best for all I believe.
>
>I agree 100%.
>
>Sorry, I ought to have mentioned that I _have_ corresponded with Scott about
>the distortions in the image operations; and I'm confident that they'll
>improve eventually, but my need is immediate and it's not a high priority
>for Scott.
>

Have you considered using java applets?  They are prone to all the 
problems of java ... slow, differing behaviors with platform-specific 
interpreters, etc. ... but could be a temporary fix ("need is 
immediate") to buy you some time.  They are also cross-platform by 
default, platform-specific issues notwithstanding.

My specific need is to use MC as a front end for a medical image 
archive of xrays, ct and mri data, etc.  Functions such as leveling, 
rotating, cropping etc. are essential for viewing these sorts of 
images.

In lieu of externals, my current approach is to use MC as front end 
for both uploading and viewing images  ... data such as patient name, 
etc. are written to a webserved database and the image is ftp'ed to 
the appropriate location.  To view the images, I have MC launch a 
browser with a URL that finds images based on the user's search 
criteria, such as name, medical record #, etc.  This results page is 
formatted in such a way that each image is represented by several 
hyperlinks corresponding to multiple ways to view the image.  You can 
view the image "as is" as a regular jpeg in your browser, use a 
simple java applet which basically allows you to zoom in and out, or 
use the feature-rich ImageJ, a public domain project of the National 
Institutes of Health which bills itself as "the world's fastest pure 
Java image processing program."

Check it out:

http://rsb.info.nih.gov/ij/applet2/

Note I have sometimes had problems with it with MRJ 2.2.4 on classic Mac.

This was done in codewarrior and source code is freely available ... 
put your tax dollars to work!

Until MC has a feature set as robust as this, I see my approach as a 
clunky but acceptable workaround short of writing an external.  The 
applet approach has the added benefit of increasing utility via 
distribution ... clients don't need anything more than a browser to 
view images, although they'd need MC to upload and modify them.

Just a thought.


Kevin

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Re: rotation property (was: Inquiry for graphics external)

[Tereza Snyder]

on 11.14.01 03:13 AM, Sjoerd Op 't Land wrote:

> Anyway I feel that this 'rotate' command that we have now is a step in the
> right direction, but definitely not 'it'. I think a better solution would be
> that every object (I mean every field, button, graphic etc,etc) had a
> 'rotation' property, which could be set to some value between 0 and 359
> degrees.
> 
> This solution would involve storing the original image(,field,button...) but
> would take care for not distorting the image.
> 
> How do others think about this?

I imagine that the MetaCard engine would have to draw an object to an
offscreen buffer, rotate it, then composite it with the card image (though
there may be shortcuts). Therefore rotated objects would take longer to
display, and require more memory. But both memory and speed constraints fade
with time and I expect that in a few years an application that doesn't draw
controls this way (which can also allow drop shadows, anti-aliasing and
other fabulous effects) will seem stiff and coarse. The Quartz graphic
engine that underlies MacOS X provides facilities for rapid composition. I
wonder if Windows XP (which I haven't seen) has similar tools.

tereza



+ Tereza Snyder 
+ Senior Software Developer
+ Attainment Company, Inc.
+ 
+ 800.327.4269


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Re: rotation property (was: Inquiry for graphics external)

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, Sjoerd Op 't Land wrote:

> I think this is a quite important subject, because it is one of the things
> that Macromedia Flash does better than MC/RR.
> 
> Anyway I feel that this 'rotate' command that we have now is a step in the
> right direction, but definitely not 'it'. I think a better solution would be
> that every object (I mean every field, button, graphic etc,etc) had a
> 'rotation' property, which could be set to some value between 0 and 359
> degrees.
> 
> This solution would involve storing the original image(,field,button...) but
> would take care for not distorting the image.
> 
> How do others think about this?

The above is definitely a desired feature over here.  It would also be great
to see antialiasing added to the rendering of vector objects.  I know this
has already been suggested to MC Corp.

"Rotation" as a property could work.  Perhaps "angle" might be an
alternative.

Your idea of storing the original would appear to solve the problem of
continually degrading images.

All the above is useful and desired.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director

Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.tactilemedia.com


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Re: Inquiry for graphics external

[diskot123]

>Does anyone know of a dual-platform interface to QuickTime 2D Graphics
>functions? I've only ever compiled externals for the Mac, not Windows.
I'd
>welcome anything that would boost me over the learning curve.
Quicktime supports things like rotation, scaling, ect cross platform.

Tuviah
http://members.aol.com/tuvsnyder/

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rotation property (was: Inquiry for graphics external)

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

Tereza Snyder wrote/ schreef:

> MetaCard's implementation introduces very noticeable
> distortions, especially with images that have alpha channels.
I think this is a quite important subject, because it is one of the things
that Macromedia Flash does better than MC/RR.

Anyway I feel that this 'rotate' command that we have now is a step in the
right direction, but definitely not 'it'. I think a better solution would be
that every object (I mean every field, button, graphic etc,etc) had a
'rotation' property, which could be set to some value between 0 and 359
degrees.

This solution would involve storing the original image(,field,button...) but
would take care for not distorting the image.

How do others think about this?

Regards, / Groeten,
Sjoerd


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Re: Inquiry for graphics external

[Tereza Snyder]

on 11.12.01 05:01PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> 
> On Monday, November 12, 2001,I wrote:
> 
>> Does anyone have a Mac/Win external that I could use to manipulate
>> graphics
>> images - rotate, scale, crop - to supplement or replace MetaCard 2.4
>> built-in functions? MetaCard's implementation introduces very noticeable
>> distortions, especially with images that have alpha channels.
>> Unfortunately, my application encourages users
>> to crop, scale, rotate, and flip the  images  they import.

to which Mark Talluto replied:

> 
> I am not a big fan of externals as there is always the potential of not
> having it for the platform you need.  Since MC has implemented most of
> these features, I would write into Scott and discuss what needs to be
> improved in a future version.  I will be using these new image features
> too in the next few weeks too.  If they are not working right as good as
> they could, maybe something could be done internally to improve them.
> This would be best for all I believe.

I agree 100%.

Sorry, I ought to have mentioned that I _have_ corresponded with Scott about
the distortions in the image operations; and I'm confident that they'll
improve eventually, but my need is immediate and it's not a high priority
for Scott.

Does anyone know of a dual-platform interface to QuickTime 2D Graphics
functions? I've only ever compiled externals for the Mac, not Windows. I'd
welcome anything that would boost me over the learning curve.

tereza



+ Tereza Snyder 
+ Senior Software Developer
+ Attainment Company, Inc.
+ 
+ 800.327.4269


Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/metacard@lists.runrev.com/
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Please send bug reports to <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, not this list.

Inquiry for graphics external

[Tereza Snyder]

Does anyone have a Mac/Win external that I could use to manipulate graphics
images - rotate, scale, crop - to supplement or replace MetaCard 2.4
built-in functions? MetaCard's implementation introduces very noticeable
distortions, especially with images that have alpha channels. Unfortunately,
my application encourages users to crop, scale, rotate, and flip the images
they import. 

Is there any hope?


tereza



+ Tereza Snyder 
+ Senior Software Developer
+ Attainment Company, Inc.
+ 
+ 800.327.4269


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Graphics part II

[slord]

Wow cool, that graphics error only happens on stacks with the 
"palette" style applied.

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Re: how to make page turning graphics

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

Geoff Canyon wrote/ schreef:

> At 12:54 AM +0200 6/3/01, Sjoerd Op 't Land wrote:
>> But in the meanwhile, maybe this works: Clone your stack, open it offscreen
>> and make a snapshot of the page. Cost some memory, but if it works...
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion. I don't think this would work. As an experiment I
> tried moving my stack offscreen before taking the snapshot:
> 
> move offscreen
> go next card
> take snapshot
> go previous card
> bring back onscreen
> 
> The import snapshot command, being given a rect offscreen, defaults back to
> letting the user select an area to be captured. In other words, it didn't
> capture the offscreen area.
Well, if I execute this here:
  set the loc of stack "Test" to "-200,-200"
  go next
  import snapshot from rect "0,0,100,100" of window (the windowID of this
stack)

It seems to work (I don't get a select-capture-area-cross-cursor and no
error messages) here, but the captured image is completely distorted, so
this is definitely a bug.

> Regards,
> 
> Geoff
Regards,
Sjoerd


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Re: how to make page turning graphics

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

andu wrote/ schreef:

> On Sat, 02 Jun 2001, you wrote:
>> Geoff Canyon wrote/ schreef:
>> 
>>> I was hoping that
>>> 
>>> lock screen
>>> go next
>>> import snapshot from rect someRect
>>> 
>>> would get a picture of the next card. Instead, it gets a picture of the
>>> current card because that's what's showing because of the locked screen.
>> Mmm, I see this as a bug...
> 
> Why do you see it as a bug, isn't a snapshot supposed to take a
> picture of the current screen?
That's true, but if I want to do that, I would take the snapshot before I
lock the screen. But there is a point in what you say; maybe this is more
like a missing feature.

Regards,
Sjoerd


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Re: how to make page turning graphics

[Geoff Canyon]

At 7:19 PM -0400 6/2/01, andu wrote:
>> > would get a picture of the next card. Instead, it gets a picture of the
>> > current card because that's what's showing because of the locked screen.
>> Mmm, I see this as a bug...
>
>Why do you see it as a bug, isn't a snapshot supposed to take a
>picture of the current screen?

I don't think it's a bug, but it _would_ be very nice to be able to either composite 
an image while the screen was hidden, or to composite an image offscreen.

regards,

gc

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Re: how to make page turning graphics

[Geoff Canyon]

At 12:54 AM +0200 6/3/01, Sjoerd Op 't Land wrote:
>But in the meanwhile, maybe this works: Clone your stack, open it offscreen
>and make a snapshot of the page. Cost some memory, but if it works...

Thanks for the suggestion. I don't think this would work. As an experiment I tried 
moving my stack offscreen before taking the snapshot:

move offscreen
go next card
take snapshot
go previous card
bring back onscreen

The import snapshot command, being given a rect offscreen, defaults back to letting 
the user select an area to be captured. In other words, it didn't capture the 
offscreen area.

Regards,

Geoff

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Re: how to make page turning graphics

[andu]

On Sat, 02 Jun 2001, you wrote:
> Geoff Canyon wrote/ schreef:
> 
> > I was hoping that
> > 
> >   lock screen
> >   go next
> >   import snapshot from rect someRect
> > 
> > would get a picture of the next card. Instead, it gets a picture of the
> > current card because that's what's showing because of the locked screen.
> Mmm, I see this as a bug...

Why do you see it as a bug, isn't a snapshot supposed to take a
picture of the current screen?
 
> 
> But in the meanwhile, maybe this works: Clone your stack, open it offscreen
> and make a snapshot of the page. Cost some memory, but if it works...
> 
> Hope this helps,
> Sjoerd
> 
> 
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Andu

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Re: how to make page turning graphics

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

Geoff Canyon wrote/ schreef:

> I was hoping that
> 
>   lock screen
>   go next
>   import snapshot from rect someRect
> 
> would get a picture of the next card. Instead, it gets a picture of the
> current card because that's what's showing because of the locked screen.
Mmm, I see this as a bug...

But in the meanwhile, maybe this works: Clone your stack, open it offscreen
and make a snapshot of the page. Cost some memory, but if it works...

Hope this helps,
Sjoerd


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how to make page turning graphics

[Geoff Canyon]

Does anyone have any ideas about how I might get an image object to contain an image 
of a card that isn't currently showing, without displaying that card to the user?

More details are listed below.

Regards,

Geoff


Details:

I have a stack that looks like a book. When the user goes to the next page, I'd like 
to have a nice image of the page turning from one page to the next. The pages of the 
book can have different text and sometimes pictures on them.

The shrink and stretch visual effects would be perfect, except that they work from top 
to bottom (or vice versa) and I need something that works from right to left.

So my next thought was to use the import snapshot command to set some image objects to 
pictures of the current page and the next page, and use those to create the 
appropriate shrinking and growing images of the page turning.

But it seems that you can't get a snapshot of something that isn't showing. I know 
that's pretty self evident, but still, I was hoping that 

lock screen
go next
import snapshot from rect someRect

would get a picture of the next card. Instead, it gets a picture of the current card 
because that's what's showing because of the locked screen.

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Revolution 1.0 and vector graphics

[jbv]

Perhaps is it not the right place to ask, but...

I spent a few minutes on the Revolution
website, and it says it imports vector
graphics (a feature that MC seems to lack)...

Where can I find more details about the
graphic formats it accepts ?

Thanks.

JB





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Re: Basic graphics questions

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

Gregory Lypny wrote/ schreef:

> Hi Everyone,
> 
> Can I set the icon of a button to a graphics object which I've
> created with MetaCard's draw tools?  That is, this is an object of type
> "graphic" and not of type "image".  I've noticed that the statement
> 
> Set the icon of button "X" to graphic "Y"
> 
> does nothing.
It is not possible to directly use a graphic as image icon, but there is a
work around.

For setting the icon to an image use:
  set the icon of button "MyButton" to "45"
  -- in which "45" is the ID of the image object containing the icon

For setting the icon to an graphic use:
  import snapshot from rect (the rect of graphic "MyGraphic") of window (the
windowID of this stack)
  -- a snapshot is taken from the graphic, which is imported as image
  -- so make sure that nothing overlaps the graphic

  -- assuming that there are no other images on this card
  -- (so that the number of the image will be "1"):
  set the icon of "MyButton" to the ID of image 1

> I'm a beginner (obviously) in the graphics-in-MetaCard arena.  I've
> imported a number of graphics created in Adobe Illustrator, but I'm not
> getting the quality I'd like to have.  For example, I've imported
> graphics as JPEG, which were created at a "high" quality setting and a
> resolution equal to the screen depth.  These appear in MetaCard as nice
> crisp images, but they are bounded by a white rectangle, which is a
> problem on non-white backgrounds.  If I use MetaCard's colour tools and
> set the image's ink to transparent, the white rectangle is largely
> removed but some annoying white pixels remain on the perimeter of the
> image.
> 
> Is there a best format for imported images?
Well, I always use GIF, because that supports transparency and is cross-
platform (unlike BMP or PICT). Also PNG is possible.

> Regards,
> 
> Greg
Hope this helps,
Sjoerd


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Re: Basic graphics questions

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, Gregory Lypny wrote:

> Can I set the icon of a button to a graphics object which I've
> created with MetaCard's draw tools?  That is, this is an object of type
> "graphic" and not of type "image".  I've noticed that the statement
> 
> Set the icon of button "X" to graphic "Y"
> 
> does nothing.

I believe this only works with images, not draw objects.


> I'm a beginner (obviously) in the graphics-in-MetaCard arena.  I've
> imported a number of graphics created in Adobe Illustrator, but I'm not
> getting the quality I'd like to have.  For example, I've imported
> graphics as JPEG, which were created at a "high" quality setting and a
> resolution equal to the screen depth.  These appear in MetaCard as nice
> crisp images, but they are bounded by a white rectangle, which is a
> problem on non-white backgrounds.  If I use MetaCard's colour tools and
> set the image's ink to transparent, the white rectangle is largely
> removed but some annoying white pixels remain on the perimeter of the
> image.
> 
> Is there a best format for imported images?

Best formats are JPEG and GIF, but MC will also support PICT on MacOS and I
believe BMP on Windows.  You probably need to clean up your images in
something like Photoshop or other bitmap editor before importing into MC.
The reason you're seeing white pixels after setting the ink to transparent
is probably because those pixels are not true white.

Regards,

Scott

_
Scott Rossi   Tactile Media - Multimedia & Design
Creative Director Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Web: www.tactilemedia.com


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Basic graphics questions

[Gregory Lypny]

Hi Everyone,

 Can I set the icon of a button to a graphics object which I've 
created with MetaCard's draw tools?  That is, this is an object of type 
"graphic" and not of type "image".  I've noticed that the statement

 Set the icon of button "X" to graphic "Y"

does nothing.

 I'm a beginner (obviously) in the graphics-in-MetaCard arena.  I've 
imported a number of graphics created in Adobe Illustrator, but I'm not 
getting the quality I'd like to have.  For example, I've imported 
graphics as JPEG, which were created at a "high" quality setting and a 
resolution equal to the screen depth.  These appear in MetaCard as nice 
crisp images, but they are bounded by a white rectangle, which is a 
problem on non-white backgrounds.  If I use MetaCard's colour tools and 
set the image's ink to transparent, the white rectangle is largely 
removed but some annoying white pixels remain on the perimeter of the 
image.

 Is there a best format for imported images?  

  Regards,

   Greg




_
Gregory Lypny
Associate Professor of Finance
Concordia University

_
"Take chances, make mistakes!"
   - Ms Frizzle, The Magic School Bus



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RE: Printing graphics

[Monte Goulding]

Hi

Thanks for the reply but my feeling is that this is an MC bug and as such i
have posted to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  I'm still waiting for a reply from Scott
but the basic problem I found was that MC couldn't handle a polygon graphic
that has heaps of points (I'm talking 30 mins of recorded mouse movements).
When the linesize of the graphic was set to 1 it displayed OK on the screen
but had inconsistent printing results. When I set the linesize to 2 I got an
odd filled shape. As you can see It's not something that I think anyone
other than Scott could do anything about. I found a workaround that suits my
purposes (making the line dashed) works well and prints well every time.

Thanks

Monte

> Monte Goulding wrote/ schreef:
>
> > Hi
> >
> > I have a fairly major problem with printing a polygon graphic.
> The graphic
> > is an unfilled line. When printing the screen it's sometimes
> not printed and
> > sometimes printed and sometimes parts are printed and sometimes
> parts are
> > printed filled. It is very odd behaviour. Is there any bug with
> black and
> > white printing that I should know about? It's weird that all
> other graphics
> > on the screen print perfectly fine but this one doesn't. It has heaps of
> > points and usually looks like a squigle all over the screen. I
> have markers
> > at certain points along this line that print OK too. It's just this one
> > line.
> >
> > Please someone help.
> Well, as a client of MC I don't know about it, but what I can do is try
> whether the stack prints odd here (HP550C), and maybe you can provide the
> MC-team some more info on your configuration.
>
> > Regards
> >
> > Monte
> Hope this helps,
> Sjoerd
>
>
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>


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Re: Printing graphics

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

Monte Goulding wrote/ schreef:

> Hi
> 
> I have a fairly major problem with printing a polygon graphic. The graphic
> is an unfilled line. When printing the screen it's sometimes not printed and
> sometimes printed and sometimes parts are printed and sometimes parts are
> printed filled. It is very odd behaviour. Is there any bug with black and
> white printing that I should know about? It's weird that all other graphics
> on the screen print perfectly fine but this one doesn't. It has heaps of
> points and usually looks like a squigle all over the screen. I have markers
> at certain points along this line that print OK too. It's just this one
> line.
> 
> Please someone help.
Well, as a client of MC I don't know about it, but what I can do is try
whether the stack prints odd here (HP550C), and maybe you can provide the
MC-team some more info on your configuration.

> Regards
> 
> Monte
Hope this helps,
Sjoerd


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Printing graphics

[Monte Goulding]

Hi

I have a fairly major problem with printing a polygon graphic. The graphic
is an unfilled line. When printing the screen it's sometimes not printed and
sometimes printed and sometimes parts are printed and sometimes parts are
printed filled. It is very odd behaviour. Is there any bug with black and
white printing that I should know about? It's weird that all other graphics
on the screen print perfectly fine but this one doesn't. It has heaps of
points and usually looks like a squigle all over the screen. I have markers
at certain points along this line that print OK too. It's just this one
line.

Please someone help.

Regards

Monte


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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Alan Beattie]

On 9/2/01 9:11 pm, Jacqueline Landman Gay at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I just had a similar experience which turns out to be a bug in MetaCard.
> If you have a button with a hiliteIcon set but no regular icon set, the
> hiliteIcon is not removed when you release the mouse. In other words,
> once you've clicked the button, it appears to be permanently in the
> "down" position until you change cards and go back again (opening the
> card clears the hiliteIcon.)
> 
> Until the bug is fixed, the solution is to assign either a non-existent
> icon number to the button as the regular icon (for example, assign it an
> ID of 3, which has no corresponding icon in MetaCard,) or assign a
> one-pixel transparent gif graphic as the icon. The danger with assigning
> a non-existent icon is that in the future those icon IDs may represent a
> real icon in MetaCard, and you will get an unexpected icon when running
> under those versions.

As an alternative, you could insert the following (untested) script into the
frontScripts on preOpenStack:

local lTarget,lCondition

on mouseDown
  put the long id of the target into lTarget
  if word 1 of lTarget is not "button" then pass mouseDown
  put (the icon of lTarget is 0 and the hiliteIcon of lTarget is not 0) into
lCondition
  if lCondition then set the showIcon of lTarget to true
  pass mouseDown
end mouseDown
on mouseUp
  if word 1 of lTarget is not "button" then pass mouseUp
  if lCondition then set the showIcon of lTarget to false
  pass mouseUp
end mouseUp
on mouseRelease
  if word 1 of lTarget is not "button" then pass mouseRelease
  if lCondition then set the showIcon of lTarget to false
  pass mouseRelease
end mouseRelease

The above script would have the disadvantage that the display of the
hiliteIcon wouldn't track the mouse movement while the mouse is held down
and moved outwith the button (that could be added in if necessary). However,
you might find this a satisfactory temporary solution until the MC bug is
fixed. Then you could simply not insert these handlers. On the other hand if
you've just got a couple of buttons, one of the workarounds you suggested
would be better!

Cheers,

Alan

Alan Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Runtime Revolution Limited (Formerly Cross Worlds Computing)
Tel: +44 (0)131 672 2909.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.


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RE: Using graphics as buttons

[Monte Goulding]

Try setting the id of the image toi a larger number like 123456 and then use
that. There can be other images loaded into memory that have the same id.

> On 9/2/01 6:40 pm, Blair Moxon at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > Yes that is what I thought, however my current situation is
> this: I have a
> > pile of imported (screen snap) images that I am assigning to buttons. I
> > placed them on a separate card for storage. I originally set the button
> > properties/extras/icon ID to the ID that was assigned to the imported
> > images.  I had thought that every object in MC gets a unique ID
> and that it
> > is persistent.. if this is the case why are the icons
> disappearing? Do you
> > have to set both the "icon" ID and the "iconHilite" ID? (I
> don't care about
> > the hilite - I just want one icon to appear). Thanks,
> > Blair
>
> Blair, you just have to set the "icon" ID of the button and the
> icon will be
> displayed. Are you sure you have the stack containing the
> separate (storage)
> card in memory? When do the icons disappear?
>
> Alan
>
> Alan Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> Runtime Revolution Limited (Formerly Cross Worlds Computing)
> Tel: +44 (0)131 672 2909.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.
>
> >> System generated ID?  All IDs used by MC use its internal numbering
> >> system?
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Kevin
> >>
> >
> > Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/metacard@lists.runrev.com/
> > Info: http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/mailinglist.htm
> > Please send bug reports to <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, not this list.
>
>
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>


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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Jacqueline Landman Gay]

Blair Moxon wrote:
> 
> Yes that is what I thought, however my current situation is this: I have a
> pile of imported (screen snap) images that I am assigning to buttons. I
> placed them on a separate card for storage. I originally set the button
> properties/extras/icon ID to the ID that was assigned to the imported
> images.  I had thought that every object in MC gets a unique ID and that it
> is persistent.. if this is the case why are the icons disappearing? Do you
> have to set both the "icon" ID and the "iconHilite" ID? (I don't care about
> the hilite - I just want one icon to appear).

I just had a similar experience which turns out to be a bug in MetaCard.
If you have a button with a hiliteIcon set but no regular icon set, the
hiliteIcon is not removed when you release the mouse. In other words,
once you've clicked the button, it appears to be permanently in the
"down" position until you change cards and go back again (opening the
card clears the hiliteIcon.)

Until the bug is fixed, the solution is to assign either a non-existent
icon number to the button as the regular icon (for example, assign it an
ID of 3, which has no corresponding icon in MetaCard,) or assign a
one-pixel transparent gif graphic as the icon. The danger with assigning
a non-existent icon is that in the future those icon IDs may represent a
real icon in MetaCard, and you will get an unexpected icon when running
under those versions.

-- 
Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
HyperActive Software   | 612-724-1596
Custom hypermedia solutions| http://www.hyperactivesw.com

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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Alan Beattie]

On 9/2/01 6:40 pm, Blair Moxon at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Yes that is what I thought, however my current situation is this: I have a
> pile of imported (screen snap) images that I am assigning to buttons. I
> placed them on a separate card for storage. I originally set the button
> properties/extras/icon ID to the ID that was assigned to the imported
> images.  I had thought that every object in MC gets a unique ID and that it
> is persistent.. if this is the case why are the icons disappearing? Do you
> have to set both the "icon" ID and the "iconHilite" ID? (I don't care about
> the hilite - I just want one icon to appear). Thanks,
> Blair

Blair, you just have to set the "icon" ID of the button and the icon will be
displayed. Are you sure you have the stack containing the separate (storage)
card in memory? When do the icons disappear?

Alan

Alan Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Runtime Revolution Limited (Formerly Cross Worlds Computing)
Tel: +44 (0)131 672 2909.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.

>> System generated ID?  All IDs used by MC use its internal numbering
>> system?
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Kevin
>> 
> 
> Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/metacard@lists.runrev.com/
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RE: Using graphics as buttons

[Blair Moxon]

Yes that is what I thought, however my current situation is this: I have a
pile of imported (screen snap) images that I am assigning to buttons. I
placed them on a separate card for storage. I originally set the button
properties/extras/icon ID to the ID that was assigned to the imported
images.  I had thought that every object in MC gets a unique ID and that it
is persistent.. if this is the case why are the icons disappearing? Do you
have to set both the "icon" ID and the "iconHilite" ID? (I don't care about
the hilite - I just want one icon to appear). Thanks,
Blair



> System generated ID?  All IDs used by MC use its internal numbering
> system?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Kevin
> 

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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Gregory Lypny]

Hi Everyone,

 Thanks for the clarification on this as MetaCard's documentation was 
a little unclear to me, although I did start to experiment with inks and 
the like.  I think I'll continue the experimentation with the set 
hiliteIcon to dynamically swap the image displayed by a button.

 Greg






Gregory Lypny
Associate Professor
John Molson School of Business
Concordia University
Montreal, Canada


"I am just going outside and may be some time."
   - Captain Lawrence Oates, 17 March 1912, Scott Expedition



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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Kevin Miller]

On 8/2/01 2:26 pm, Blair Moxon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> One caveat: setting the button icon to the system generated ID can create
> massive headaches if you happen to delete an icon - it renumbers the icon ID's
> and all of your button icons suddenly disappear. A unique name is better;
> which means importing a graphic file. I tend to put all of these
> icons/graphics on a separate card and call them from there.
> 
> (Unless I am missing something here??)

System generated ID?  All IDs used by MC use its internal numbering system?

Regards,

Kevin

Kevin Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Limited (formerly Cross Worlds Computing).
Tel: +44 (0)131 672 2909.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.


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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Blair Moxon]

Re: Using graphics as buttons
>   One caveat: setting the button icon to the system generated ID can
> create massive headaches if you happen to delete an icon - it renumbers
> the icon ID's and all of your button icons suddenly disappear. A unique
> name is better; which means importing a graphic file. I tend to put all of
> these icons/graphics on a separate card and call them from there.
>   (Unless I am missing something here??)
rgds,
>   Blair

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RE: Using graphics as buttons

[Blair Moxon]

Title: RE: Using graphics as buttons





One caveat: setting the button icon to the system generated ID can create massive headaches if you happen to delete an icon - it renumbers the icon ID's and all of your button icons suddenly disappear. A unique name is better; which means importing a graphic file. I tend to put all of these icons/graphics on a separate card and call them from there.

(Unless I am missing something here??)
Blair

Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Alan Beattie]

On 8/2/01 8:39 am, Dave Cragg at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> At 7:27 PM -0500 7/2/01, Gregory Lypny wrote:
> 
>> Do you mean there's a button property that allows you to explicitly
>> hilite its icon if it exists?  If so, then that is what I want.
>> 
> 
> set the hiliteIcon of button x to the ID of image y

Hi, I think I understand the misunderstanding here :-)

Gregory, are you looking for a button property that actually alters the
appearance of the image used as the icon of the button when the button is
hilited? If so, this property does not exist.

Dave is referring to setting the hiliteIcon to a second image which you
would have to make yourself in an image editor.

So you would set the icon of the button to "image1" (your existing image).
You would then duplicate and *modify* the image in a paint editor (or MC of
course) to give it the hilited appearance you want. You would then set the
hiliteIcon of the button to this image, "image2".

Alternatively, if you would like to "dynamically" hilite the images using
the native features of MC, you could use inks instead. e.g. you could draw a
filled white rectangle graphic over the image, apply the "reverse" ink to it
and then show the rectangle graphic on mouseDown, hide it on mouseUp or
something to that effect.

Hope this helps,

Alan

Alan Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Runtime Revolution Limited (Formerly Cross Worlds Computing)
Tel: +44 (0)131 672 2909.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.


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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Dave Cragg]

At 7:27 PM -0500 7/2/01, Gregory Lypny wrote:

>  Do you mean there's a button property that allows you to explicitly
>hilite its icon if it exists?  If so, then that is what I want.
>

set the hiliteIcon of button x to the ID of image y

Cheers
Dave Cragg

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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Gregory Lypny]

OK Sjoerd Op 't Land,

 I think we're starting to converge, but I don't understand you when 
you write

 "...set the hilite icon to the graphic..."

 Do you mean there's a button property that allows you to explicitly 
hilite its icon if it exists?  If so, then that is what I want.
 
 Regards,

  Greg


On 8/2/2001 4:35 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 

>Gregory Lypny wrote/ schreef:
>
>> Hi Everyone,
>> 
>> I'd like to use some imported graphics as buttons.  I know I can set
>> a button's icon to a selected graphic or I can attached a script to the
>> graphic itself; but what I'd really like to do is give the graphic a
>> button-like autohilite behaviour when clicked.  Is there any way to do
>> that?
>I don't exactly understand you, but do you mean that the icon of the button
>changes when you click it? That's very easy: create a button, set the icon
>to the desired graphic, and set the hilite icon to the graphic you want to
>show when the button is clicked.





Gregory Lypny
Associate Professor
John Molson School of Business
Concordia University
Montreal, Canada


"I am just going outside and may be some time."
   - Captain Lawrence Oates, 17 March 1912, Scott Expedition



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Re: Using graphics as buttons

[Sjoerd Op 't Land]

Gregory Lypny wrote/ schreef:

> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I'd like to use some imported graphics as buttons.  I know I can set
> a button's icon to a selected graphic or I can attached a script to the
> graphic itself; but what I'd really like to do is give the graphic a
> button-like autohilite behaviour when clicked.  Is there any way to do
> that?
I don't exactly understand you, but do you mean that the icon of the button
changes when you click it? That's very easy: create a button, set the icon
to the desired graphic, and set the hilite icon to the graphic you want to
show when the button is clicked.

> Regards,
> 
> Greg
Hope this helps,
Sjoerd


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Using graphics as buttons

[Gregory Lypny]

Hi Everyone,

 I'd like to use some imported graphics as buttons.  I know I can set 
a button's icon to a selected graphic or I can attached a script to the 
graphic itself; but what I'd really like to do is give the graphic a 
button-like autohilite behaviour when clicked.  Is there any way to do 
that?

 Regards,

  Greg




_
Gregory Lypny
Associate Professor of Finance
Concordia University

_
"Take chances, make mistakes!"
   - Ms Frizzle, The Magic School Bus



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Re: Mac to Windows/Graphics

[Simon Lord]

I'm suprised at this thread.  I use gif's and jpg's for my cross platform
stacks and the images always look as good on the PC as they do on the Mac
and SGI.

My gif's are saved as adaptive and I always use Photoshop.  I found that
batching with Graphic Converter can create bad gif's, but anything from
Photoshop works just fine (except for progressive images, they get gummed up
in MC).

Hope that helps...

--

Cheers,
Simon

Graphic Development: http://www.amigo-3.com

--
"The great discoveries in science are not punctuated by 'Eureka! I've found
it!' but rather "Hmmm,that's funny" Isaac Asimov

> From: Mark Talluto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 10:14:28 -0800
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Mac to Windows/Graphics
> 
> 
> Look into the .png format.  It has the 24bit palette with the ability to use
> transparent backgrounds on it.
> 
> -Mark Talluto
> 
>> I have this problem (people complaining on PCs that some graphics look bad.)
>> Someone previously said just to not use any transparent GIF's. Unfortunately
>> that is the _very_ reason one would want to use a GIF, so that the image can
>> layer on top of a background or another image without have to be just an
>> ugly square box with white in it. . .
>> 
>> Some else said "stick with JPEG" for PC. . . but the above post indicates
>> that even JPEGS could have problems on PCs.
>> 
>> Does anyone have this area "wired tight" and can share more insights? Hoping
>> not to go back and reprocess a lot of graphics and end up at ground zero. Of
>> course, from all the posts, one has not control over the video card,
>> drivers, monitor etc. . .but maybe there is some "benchmark" image format
>> level for PCs that we can depend on? Especially for getting a
>> "transparency/clipping path" option that still looks good on a PC.
> 
> 
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> 


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Re: Mac to Windows/Graphics

[Mark Talluto]

Look into the .png format.  It has the 24bit palette with the ability to use
transparent backgrounds on it.

-Mark Talluto

> I have this problem (people complaining on PCs that some graphics look bad.)
> Someone previously said just to not use any transparent GIF's. Unfortunately
> that is the _very_ reason one would want to use a GIF, so that the image can
> layer on top of a background or another image without have to be just an
> ugly square box with white in it. . .
> 
> Some else said "stick with JPEG" for PC. . . but the above post indicates
> that even JPEGS could have problems on PCs.
> 
> Does anyone have this area "wired tight" and can share more insights? Hoping
> not to go back and reprocess a lot of graphics and end up at ground zero. Of
> course, from all the posts, one has not control over the video card,
> drivers, monitor etc. . .but maybe there is some "benchmark" image format
> level for PCs that we can depend on? Especially for getting a
> "transparency/clipping path" option that still looks good on a PC.


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Re: Mac to Windows/Graphics

[Sivakatirswami]

on 12/30/00 8:20 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] at
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> 3.  Sometimes Mac-created graphics (GIF or JPEG) look funny on Windows,
> depending on how they were created.  Depends how they were saved.

I have this problem (people complaining on PCs that some graphics look bad.)
Someone previously said just to not use any transparent GIF's. Unfortunately
that is the _very_ reason one would want to use a GIF, so that the image can
layer on top of a background or another image without have to be just an
ugly square box with white in it. . .

Some else said "stick with JPEG" for PC. . . but the above post indicates
that even JPEGS could have problems on PCs.

Does anyone have this area "wired tight" and can share more insights? Hoping
not to go back and reprocess a lot of graphics and end up at ground zero. Of
course, from all the posts, one has not control over the video card,
drivers, monitor etc. . .but maybe there is some "benchmark" image format
level for PCs that we can depend on? Especially for getting a
"transparency/clipping path" option that still looks good on a PC.

Thanks

Hinduism Today

Sivakatirswami
Editor's Assistant/Production Manager
www.HinduismToday.com
www.HimalayanAcademy.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: Graphics or images on option buttons

[Monte Goulding]

Thanks Kevin

Ok thats cool I can work that out, now all i need to do is set the icon on 
each button to the id of a graphic that is just one marker. Is this 
possible? If not would you suggest creating a snapshot of each graphic and 
using that as the icon or simply place eack graphic above a button.

PS If anyone thinks this would be a usefull tool then I could send them a 
copy when done.

Best regards to all

Monte

>From: Kevin Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: Re: Graphics or images on option buttons
>Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 19:41:42 +
>
>On 4/11/00 12:17 am, Monte Goulding <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Does anyone have experience creating stacks to be set as menu names for
> > option buttons. I'd like to create an option button with the same look 
>and
> > feel as a text option button that a user could use to select a graphic
> > marker. I'll offer it to the list when it's done if I work out how to do 
>it.
> > If anyone could offer guidance or a template for this it would be much
> > appreciated.
>
>A good place to start is to have a look at the ones in the MC dev UI.  
>E.g.:
>
>clone stack "MC selectedObject menu"
>
>Regards,
>
>Kevin
>
>Kevin Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <http://www.runrev.com/>
>Runtime Revolution Limited (formerly Cross Worlds Computing).
>Tel: +44 (0)131 672 2909.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.
>
>
>Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/metacard@lists.runrev.com/
>Info: http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/mailinglist.htm
>Please send bug reports to <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, not this list.
>

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Re: Graphics or images on option buttons

[Kevin Miller]

On 4/11/00 12:17 am, Monte Goulding <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Does anyone have experience creating stacks to be set as menu names for
> option buttons. I'd like to create an option button with the same look and
> feel as a text option button that a user could use to select a graphic
> marker. I'll offer it to the list when it's done if I work out how to do it.
> If anyone could offer guidance or a template for this it would be much
> appreciated.

A good place to start is to have a look at the ones in the MC dev UI.  E.g.:

clone stack "MC selectedObject menu"

Regards,

Kevin

Kevin Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Runtime Revolution Limited (formerly Cross Worlds Computing).
Tel: +44 (0)131 672 2909.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.


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Graphics or images on option buttons

[Monte Goulding]

Hi all

Does anyone have experience creating stacks to be set as menu names for 
option buttons. I'd like to create an option button with the same look and 
feel as a text option button that a user could use to select a graphic 
marker. I'll offer it to the list when it's done if I work out how to do it. 
If anyone could offer guidance or a template for this it would be much 
appreciated.

Best regards

Monte
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