Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Sterling. Thank you for correcting me. I see the mistake I made was quoting a lecture by Hoover listed on the SPIE website as a presentation at this conference. It was not as you point out, given at this conference. The page I mistakenly quoted can be found here: http://spie.org/x17397.xml My suggestion for those interested to contact him directly, instead of paying any attention to the panspermia or any other website, still holds. Cheers -- Richard Kowalski Full Moon Photography IMCA #1081 __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Eric, Richard, List, The website panspermia.org is funded by a private organization, a one-man foundation. It has donated chiefly to Cardiff University in Wales and Chandra Wickramasinghe's research. The SPIE conference schedule is here: http://spie.org//app/program/index.cfm?fuseaction=conferencedetail&export_id=x13102&ID=x12769&redir=x12769.xml&conference_id=915535&event_id=894261&programtrack_id=915692 No paper with the title "Comets, Carbonaceous Meteorites, and the Origin of the Biosphere" is mentioned anywhere in the published Schedule for the Conference. Hoover delivered an invited paper, "Chiral biomarkers in meteorites" (no publication data and no abstract; it will be published in the Proceedings). Hoover essentially moderated the panel discussions, and he was a co-author on several other papers presented. One by Marina M. Astafieva, and Alexei Y. Rozanov "Comparative characteristic of methods of ancient rocks (AR-PR1) microfossils investigations," and another by the same and other authors, "Early Precambrian pillow lavas as habitat for microfossils." However, perhaps you mean this: Hoover, R. B. "Comets, Carbonaceous Meteorites and the Origin of the Biosphere" in Biosphere Origin and Evolution (N. Dobretsov, N. Kolchanov, A. Rozanov and G. Zavarzin, Eds.) Springer US, New York 55-68, (2008). http://www.springerlink.com/content/u17384273280174l/ The item on the panspermia.org website: http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm is only the most recent of such announcements from Hoover. There's these two from 2004: http://www.panspermia.org/hoover3.htm http://www.panspermia.org/hoover2.htm The plentiful references suggests these are not "made up." There are a lot of references there if anyone wants to chase them down. Hoover himself seems to cautiously add the term "biomorph" after every description, as in, "Well, they LOOK like living cells..." On a lighter note, there were several presentations at the Conference by Godfrey Louis and Chandra Wickramasinghe on the continuing ruptures of bat red blood cells in highly pressurized jars of super-heated oil, which they believe to be alien lifeforms that are multiplying --- the so-called "Red Rain" of Kerala. I love standup... Beyond the question of contamination of meteorites by contact or surface exposure, is the fact that micro-organisms can go ANYWHERE. There is nowhere on this planet (or any other planet, I imagine) that they cannot penetrate. They are found in situ and alive in solid rock samples from five miles down in the Earth's crust. They are found high in the atmosphere. If you are small enough, you can squeeze in anywhere. There will be no acceptance of, say, microbial life on Mars until we can go there and observe them directly at work and at play in their own environment. And even then, there will be cries of contamination. It would be much better if alien life would simply walk up and ask to be taken to our leader... ...if we had one. Sterling K. Webb ----- ----- Original Message - From: "Richard Kowalski" To: Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 7:54 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? Lars, The abstract of Richard Hoover's lecture at SPIE was entitled "Comets, Carbonaceous Meteorites, and the Origin of the Biosphere" In this abstract he states in part "Field Emission Scanning Electron Microscope (FESEM) studies carried out during the past several years on freshly fractured interior surfaces of the Orgueil CI meteorite has revealed in-situ the existence of the well-preserved mineralized remains of a complex suite of trichomic prokaryotes. Many of the forms found embedded in the mineral matrix are morphotypes of cyanobacteria and sulphur bacteria." He was the Chair for a number of the sessions at this astrobiology conference. I would suggest that anyone who takes this subject seriously and has questions about the topic, be suspicious about any sources other than his own. You can probably contact him directly more information and possibly a copy of his presentations. -- Richard Kowalski Full Moon Photography IMCA #1081 --- On Sat, 8/21/10, Lars Zielke wrote: From: Lars Zielke Subject: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Saturday, August 21, 2010, 2:55 PM Hi all My first post here on this excellent list. I think it's strange that the only place I can find anything about Hoovers presentation is on the panspermia web-site. From my fast google schearch it seems that Richard Hoover and the team is very respectable, so why only an article on what seems to be a very biased web-site? The agenda for the Astrobiology XIII session don't give me enough information. Can it be confirmed that the claims
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Lars, The abstract of Richard Hoover's lecture at SPIE was entitled "Comets, Carbonaceous Meteorites, and the Origin of the Biosphere" In this abstract he states in part "Field Emission Scanning Electron Microscope (FESEM) studies carried out during the past several years on freshly fractured interior surfaces of the Orgueil CI meteorite has revealed in-situ the existence of the well-preserved mineralized remains of a complex suite of trichomic prokaryotes. Many of the forms found embedded in the mineral matrix are morphotypes of cyanobacteria and sulphur bacteria." He was the Chair for a number of the sessions at this astrobiology conference. I would suggest that anyone who takes this subject seriously and has questions about the topic, be suspicious about any sources other than his own. You can probably contact him directly more information and possibly a copy of his presentations. -- Richard Kowalski Full Moon Photography IMCA #1081 --- On Sat, 8/21/10, Lars Zielke wrote: > From: Lars Zielke > Subject: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? > To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, August 21, 2010, 2:55 PM > Hi all > > My first post here on this excellent list. > > I think it's strange that the only place I can find > anything about Hoovers > presentation is on the panspermia web-site. From my fast > google schearch it > seems that Richard Hoover and the team is very respectable, > so why only an > article on what seems to be a very biased web-site? > > The agenda for the Astrobiology XIII session don't give me > enough > information. > > Can it be confirmed that the claims was actually put > forward by Richard > Hoover at the conference, and do we know if there will be > any official paper > about it? > > In short, can the source of this story be trusted? > > > Regards > Lars > > -Oprindelig meddelelse- > Fra: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] > På vegne af Meteorites > USA > Sendt: 20. august 2010 23:48 > Til: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > Emne: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? > > Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about > possible > fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it > because it's on > "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? > > Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? > > Eric > > > __ > Visit the Archives at > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Hi all My first post here on this excellent list. I think it's strange that the only place I can find anything about Hoovers presentation is on the panspermia web-site. From my fast google schearch it seems that Richard Hoover and the team is very respectable, so why only an article on what seems to be a very biased web-site? The agenda for the Astrobiology XIII session don't give me enough information. Can it be confirmed that the claims was actually put forward by Richard Hoover at the conference, and do we know if there will be any official paper about it? In short, can the source of this story be trusted? Regards Lars -Oprindelig meddelelse- Fra: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] På vegne af Meteorites USA Sendt: 20. august 2010 23:48 Til: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Emne: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? Eric __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Dear Darren and Eric - having worked on ALH 84001 years ago and having been involved in research/management of the NASA -AMES Exobiology Program, I am a skeptic of fossil life in 84001 or any other Martian meteorite recovered to date. However, the finding of water on Mars and the recent discovery of methane does give promise. We know that Mars had water "oceans" at one time, although we do not know how long the water reservoirs were available to promote simple life. It took 100s of millions of years to accomplish that feat on Earth in the form of cyanobacteria, about 3.5 billion years ago. The main problem with "fossil life" in carbonaceous chondrites is contamination. With respect to Orgueil and contamination, Paul Pellas told me a long time ago that most of the museum's Orgueil collection had been stored haphazardly in boxes in the same drawer with various French coal samples - not good. Even though Murchison is a fall, there may have been sufficient time for the transfer of cyanobacteria or other simple organisms in the soil to nutrient-rich, water-bearing Murchison specimens. The best sample for fossil life study could be Tagish Lake - those samples that were immediately collected and carefully treated to avoid most forms of contaminates. My bottom line is that meteorites are a poor harborer of life in any case. Ted On 8/21/10 2:02 PM, "Darren Garrison" wrote: > On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 12:25:30 -0700, you wrote: >> >> I'm curious how many of us "meteorite addicts" are actually believers in >> extraterrestrial life, or at the very least are open to the possibility. > > Anyone who is not "open to the possibility of exterrestrial life"-- meaning > anyone who is convinced that the only POSSIBLE life in the entire universe is > that on Earth-- is an effing nitwit. > > Having said that, I'm agnostic on fossils in Martian meteorites and am not > even > close to beginning to swallow fossils in carbonaceous chondrites. > __ > Visit the Archives at > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 13:26:31 -0700, you wrote: >Ok, I'll go with that first part... But why do you doubt fossilized >microbes in carbonaceous meteorites? One, because the "report" so far utterly lacks the extreme degree of scientific rigor needed for such an extreme story and two, because it flies in the face of "common sense" plausibility for complex life (and yes, bacteria are complex life) could have evolved on a carbonaceous chondrite parent body before it went cold and dry. I'm going to need much, much, much more evidence than an article at a wingnut "panspermia" site. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Ok, I'll go with that first part... But why do you doubt fossilized microbes in carbonaceous meteorites? Eric On 8/21/2010 2:02 PM, Darren Garrison wrote: On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 12:25:30 -0700, you wrote: I'm curious how many of us "meteorite addicts" are actually believers in extraterrestrial life, or at the very least are open to the possibility. Anyone who is not "open to the possibility of exterrestrial life"-- meaning anyone who is convinced that the only POSSIBLE life in the entire universe is that on Earth-- is an effing nitwit. Having said that, I'm agnostic on fossils in Martian meteorites and am not even close to beginning to swallow fossils in carbonaceous chondrites. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 12:25:30 -0700, you wrote: > >I'm curious how many of us "meteorite addicts" are actually believers in >extraterrestrial life, or at the very least are open to the possibility. Anyone who is not "open to the possibility of exterrestrial life"-- meaning anyone who is convinced that the only POSSIBLE life in the entire universe is that on Earth-- is an effing nitwit. Having said that, I'm agnostic on fossils in Martian meteorites and am not even close to beginning to swallow fossils in carbonaceous chondrites. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
I wholeheartedly agree Mike! Resembling something like fossilized bacteria is completely different than being proof of life. I'm curious how many of us "meteorite addicts" are actually believers in extraterrestrial life, or at the very least are open to the possibility. Regards, Eric On 8/20/2010 4:12 PM, Galactic Stone & Ironworks wrote: Hi Folks, I think some of the reluctance to accept results like these is that they are largely based on visual comparison. A scientist thinks the structures seen in the meteorite closely resemble the structures of bacteria. There is no definitive proof that the structures are indeed fossilized bacteria. There is little question that the structures do resemble bacteria, but resembling something and being something are two very different things. Best regards, MikeG On 8/20/10, Meteorites USA wrote: Hi Kirk, I agree such a discovery, if true, is monumental. Perhaps even larger than one person could ever conceive or comprehend. As huge as news of this is, not one person responded with comment to even refute this lastest link or argue against it, or propose another opinion at all. It simply got ignored. I'm seriously curious about this apparent double standard on the burden of proof. Sure, there's questions to be asked, but my point is no ones asking... Even the NASA's announcement of 3 Martian meteorites having "possible" evidence of life in the form of microbial fossils was practically ignored from most list members a few months back. Barely any discussion on it at all. It seems people would rather whine about what meteorite is paired with what, complain about pricing than talk about what really matters. Aliens! It's like no one wants to talk about the possibility of aliens or something! ;) Is there really some alien stigma out there? Are people afraid of being accused of being crazy tinfoil hat wearing alien mind probe freaks? Regards, Eric On 8/20/2010 3:52 PM, Becky and Kirk wrote: Hi Eric and All, A very significant discovery indeed---and---the evidence to back it up! A huge story! The Murchison data is pretty compelling. Kirk.:-) - Original Message - From: "Meteorites USA" To: Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 4:48 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? Eric On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Hi Eric, I looked briefly at the article and then at the webpage. I know that I have to go back and look at things a little more to see if it's actual scientific evidence or if it's more of a "face on mars" kind of webpage... Since I haven't seen any mention of it in any other news media I'm a little skeptical at this point. Yeah, okay, "Panspermia" isn't exactly a name I would want associated with a scientific discovery if I were to make one... Makes me wonder what exactly the ".org" stand for... Original Message: - From: Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2010 14:48:09 -0700 To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? Eric On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: > http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm > > __ > Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list mail2web.com Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on Microsoft® Exchange - http://link.mail2web.com/Personal/EnhancedEmail __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Hi George, Good question... It means "Do you believe in Aliens?" ;) Anywhere... I'd ask if you think there is life ANYWHERE in the universe other than on Earth. (that does not actually originate from Earth) ;) If people believe aliens have visited us, then that's cool too. Eric On 8/20/2010 5:10 PM, geo...@aol.com wrote: A POLL - Do you Believe in Aliens?>> Does the question mean, do you believe in aliens that have found it's way to earth, or do you believe that life exists somewhere else in the universe? GeoZay __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
>>A POLL - Do you Believe in Aliens?>> Does the question mean, do you believe in aliens that have found it's way to earth, or do you believe that life exists somewhere else in the universe? GeoZay __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
The thought process to say "up against" is defeatist. Not that I'm offended by it, I'm not, I'm just saying perhaps it should be "work together" instead. Here's something FUN! I'm curious how many listees are actually open to it and "believe". ;) A POLL - Do you Believe in Aliens? http://www.mhcmagazine.com/aliens/ Regards, Eric On 8/20/2010 4:42 PM, Michael Fowler wrote: Eric, Kirk& Listees, Most people post to the list (hopefully) when they think they have something useful and positive to contribute. Perhaps the lack of posts simply reflects the fact that there may be many people on the list knowledgeable about meteorites, but few, if any, who are knowledgeable enough about the fields cyanobacteria, exbiology, or interpretation of microfossils in ancient rocks. To know what you are up against read the following: Cradle of Life: The Discovery of Earth's Earliest Fossils [Paperback] J. William Schopf http://www.amazon.com/Cradle-Life-Discovery-Earliest-Fossils/dp/0691088640/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1282347539&sr=1-1 or: http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/12/science/oldest-bacteria-fossils-or-are-they-merely-tiny-rock-flaws.html Sincerely, Mike Fowler Chicago Hi Kirk, I agree such a discovery, if true, is monumental. Perhaps even larger than one person could ever conceive or comprehend. As huge as news of this is, not one person responded with comment to even refute this lastest link or argue against it, or propose another opinion at all. It simply got ignored. I'm seriously curious about this apparent double standard on the burden of proof. Sure, there's questions to be asked, but my point is no ones asking... Even the NASA's announcement of 3 Martian meteorites having "possible" evidence of life in the form of microbial fossils was practically ignored from most list members a few months back. Barely any discussion on it at all. It seems people would rather whine about what meteorite is paired with what, complain about pricing than talk about what really matters. Aliens! It's like no one wants to talk about the possibility of aliens or something! ;) Is there really some alien stigma out there? Are people afraid of being accused of being crazy tinfoil hat wearing alien mind probe freaks? Regards, Eric __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Eric, Kirk & Listees, Most people post to the list (hopefully) when they think they have something useful and positive to contribute. Perhaps the lack of posts simply reflects the fact that there may be many people on the list knowledgeable about meteorites, but few, if any, who are knowledgeable enough about the fields cyanobacteria, exbiology, or interpretation of microfossils in ancient rocks. To know what you are up against read the following: Cradle of Life: The Discovery of Earth's Earliest Fossils [Paperback] J. William Schopf http://www.amazon.com/Cradle-Life-Discovery-Earliest-Fossils/dp/0691088640/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1282347539&sr=1-1 or: http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/12/science/oldest-bacteria-fossils-or-are-they-merely-tiny-rock-flaws.html Sincerely, Mike Fowler Chicago > Hi Kirk, I agree such a discovery, if true, is monumental. Perhaps even > larger than one person could ever conceive or comprehend. As huge as > news of this is, not one person responded with comment to even refute > this lastest link or argue against it, or propose another opinion at > all. It simply got ignored. > > I'm seriously curious about this apparent double standard on the burden > of proof. Sure, there's questions to be asked, but my point is no ones > asking... Even the NASA's announcement of 3 Martian meteorites having > "possible" evidence of life in the form of microbial fossils was > practically ignored from most list members a few months back. Barely any > discussion on it at all. It seems people would rather whine about what > meteorite is paired with what, complain about pricing than talk about > what really matters. > > Aliens! > > It's like no one wants to talk about the possibility of aliens or > something! ;) Is there really some alien stigma out there? > > Are people afraid of being accused of being crazy tinfoil hat wearing > alien mind probe freaks? > > Regards, > Eric __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Hi Eric, I have been following that site for years, and there are many thought provoking articles posted there. As far as the claims of fossilized bacteria, they seem plausible to me, but the researcher who has been doing this work for many years has yet to convince any of his skeptical scientific peers. Time will tell... Mike Fowler Chicago > Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible > fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's on > "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? > > Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? > > Eric > > >> On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: >> > > http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm > __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
That's a good point, Mike. Anyone know what criteria is used here on Earth when one finds a fossil to determine if it is the fossil of some kind of bacteria? keith Original Message: - From: Galactic Stone & Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2010 19:12:37 -0400 To: e...@meteoritesusa.com, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? Hi Folks, I think some of the reluctance to accept results like these is that they are largely based on visual comparison. A scientist thinks the structures seen in the meteorite closely resemble the structures of bacteria. There is no definitive proof that the structures are indeed fossilized bacteria. There is little question that the structures do resemble bacteria, but resembling something and being something are two very different things. Best regards, MikeG On 8/20/10, Meteorites USA wrote: > Hi Kirk, I agree such a discovery, if true, is monumental. Perhaps even > larger than one person could ever conceive or comprehend. As huge as > news of this is, not one person responded with comment to even refute > this lastest link or argue against it, or propose another opinion at > all. It simply got ignored. > > I'm seriously curious about this apparent double standard on the burden > of proof. Sure, there's questions to be asked, but my point is no ones > asking... Even the NASA's announcement of 3 Martian meteorites having > "possible" evidence of life in the form of microbial fossils was > practically ignored from most list members a few months back. Barely any > discussion on it at all. It seems people would rather whine about what > meteorite is paired with what, complain about pricing than talk about > what really matters. > > Aliens! > > It's like no one wants to talk about the possibility of aliens or > something! ;) Is there really some alien stigma out there? > > Are people afraid of being accused of being crazy tinfoil hat wearing > alien mind probe freaks? > > Regards, > Eric > > > > On 8/20/2010 3:52 PM, Becky and Kirk wrote: >> Hi Eric and All, >> A very significant discovery indeed---and---the evidence to back it up! >> A huge story! The Murchison data is pretty compelling. >> >> Kirk.:-) >> >> - Original Message - From: "Meteorites USA" >> >> To: >> Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 4:48 PM >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? >> >> >>> Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible >>> fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's >>> on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? >>> >>> Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? >>> >>> Eric >>> >>> >>> On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: >>>> http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm >>>> >>>> __ >>>> Visit the Archives at >>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html >>>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>>> >>>> >>> __ >>> Visit the Archives at >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > __ > Visit the Archives at > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone & Ironworks Meteorites http://www.galactic-stone.com http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list mail2web.com What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you? http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Hi Folks, I think some of the reluctance to accept results like these is that they are largely based on visual comparison. A scientist thinks the structures seen in the meteorite closely resemble the structures of bacteria. There is no definitive proof that the structures are indeed fossilized bacteria. There is little question that the structures do resemble bacteria, but resembling something and being something are two very different things. Best regards, MikeG On 8/20/10, Meteorites USA wrote: > Hi Kirk, I agree such a discovery, if true, is monumental. Perhaps even > larger than one person could ever conceive or comprehend. As huge as > news of this is, not one person responded with comment to even refute > this lastest link or argue against it, or propose another opinion at > all. It simply got ignored. > > I'm seriously curious about this apparent double standard on the burden > of proof. Sure, there's questions to be asked, but my point is no ones > asking... Even the NASA's announcement of 3 Martian meteorites having > "possible" evidence of life in the form of microbial fossils was > practically ignored from most list members a few months back. Barely any > discussion on it at all. It seems people would rather whine about what > meteorite is paired with what, complain about pricing than talk about > what really matters. > > Aliens! > > It's like no one wants to talk about the possibility of aliens or > something! ;) Is there really some alien stigma out there? > > Are people afraid of being accused of being crazy tinfoil hat wearing > alien mind probe freaks? > > Regards, > Eric > > > > On 8/20/2010 3:52 PM, Becky and Kirk wrote: >> Hi Eric and All, >> A very significant discovery indeed---and---the evidence to back it up! >> A huge story! The Murchison data is pretty compelling. >> >> Kirk.:-) >> >> - Original Message - From: "Meteorites USA" >> >> To: >> Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 4:48 PM >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? >> >> >>> Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible >>> fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's >>> on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? >>> >>> Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? >>> >>> Eric >>> >>> >>> On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: >>>> http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm >>>> >>>> __ >>>> Visit the Archives at >>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html >>>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>>> >>>> >>> __ >>> Visit the Archives at >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > __ > Visit the Archives at > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone & Ironworks Meteorites http://www.galactic-stone.com http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Hi Kirk, I agree such a discovery, if true, is monumental. Perhaps even larger than one person could ever conceive or comprehend. As huge as news of this is, not one person responded with comment to even refute this lastest link or argue against it, or propose another opinion at all. It simply got ignored. I'm seriously curious about this apparent double standard on the burden of proof. Sure, there's questions to be asked, but my point is no ones asking... Even the NASA's announcement of 3 Martian meteorites having "possible" evidence of life in the form of microbial fossils was practically ignored from most list members a few months back. Barely any discussion on it at all. It seems people would rather whine about what meteorite is paired with what, complain about pricing than talk about what really matters. Aliens! It's like no one wants to talk about the possibility of aliens or something! ;) Is there really some alien stigma out there? Are people afraid of being accused of being crazy tinfoil hat wearing alien mind probe freaks? Regards, Eric On 8/20/2010 3:52 PM, Becky and Kirk wrote: Hi Eric and All, A very significant discovery indeed---and---the evidence to back it up! A huge story! The Murchison data is pretty compelling. Kirk.:-) - Original Message - From: "Meteorites USA" To: Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 4:48 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? Eric On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Hi Eric and All, A very significant discovery indeed---and---the evidence to back it up! A huge story! The Murchison data is pretty compelling. Kirk.:-) - Original Message - From: "Meteorites USA" To: Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 4:48 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites? Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? Eric On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
Amazing there's No response on a meteorite list about possible fossilized bacteria and microbes in meteorites Is it because it's on "Panspermia.org" or that the word "Panspermia" is used? Why the silence on such a HUGE subject? Eric On 8/20/2010 5:35 AM, Charles O'Dale wrote: http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Cyanobacteria in meteorites?
http://www.panspermia.org/hoover4.htm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
