Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On Tue, Apr 10, 2012 at 1:53 AM, Mihai Popescu wrote: >> Andres Perera wrote: >> read very slowly >> if they don't use the following to boot: > >> * bootp (requires more than one system) >> * a cd (requires an optical drive) >> * a floppy (requires a floppy drive) > >> then they boot from hdd. it doesn't matter if it's usb, sata or what have you > > I think you are making a confusion between usb mass storage device and > usd attached hdd device. there's no distinction for the bios, which is the key part in booting a system. on x86 it looks for specific data which is common in "mass storage media" and hdd, *different* to cd boot and floppy boot > >> there are no official boot images for hdd. nick is aware of this, and >> so are the rest of the developers > > Yes, they do, since there is no such thing like "images for hdd". I > let you try to define one. hah, dd your raw hard drive device to a usb key. you have an hdd image. moreover, several projects either offer those, or an alternatively crafted iso which can be used for usb boot because it doesn't just have "el torito" boot you are wa over your head son, yet you keep insisting
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
> Andres Perera wrote: > read very slowly > if they don't use the following to boot: > * bootp (requires more than one system) > * a cd (requires an optical drive) > * a floppy (requires a floppy drive) > then they boot from hdd. it doesn't matter if it's usb, sata or what have you I think you are making a confusion between usb mass storage device and usd attached hdd device. > there are no official boot images for hdd. nick is aware of this, and > so are the rest of the developers Yes, they do, since there is no such thing like "images for hdd". I let you try to define one. >the faq requires that you boot with bsd.rd and use that environment to > install to usb media That is one particular case. The FAQ didn' t say all and it didn't say you cannot install on your kind of laptop. > you cannot do that with a single computer that can only boot from usb > hdd with the official media, so you need to install to qemu No. > you are obviously not talking about the same situation, and neither is > the other dude. more than that, you've never encountered this problem > or else you'd be familiar with the requirements Try again. > you are a humongous idiot Maybe I am, but that doesn't take away your pain. I wonder if you are able to call me that face to face. I let you have your personal quest of what OpenBSD cannot do. The search engines will redirect users to the middle of this thread where a solution was posted, no qemu involved. I'm out.
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
nope, not all bioses like that my hp mini's bios is only willing to do hdd emulation on usb sticks, so a dd'd iso or floppy image will not suffice (and hey, this inability isn't uncommon either) On Mon, Apr 9, 2012 at 6:38 PM, Ted Unangst wrote: > On Mon, Apr 09, 2012, Andres Perera wrote: >> if they don't use the following to boot: >> >> * bootp (requires more than one system) >> * a cd (requires an optical drive) >> * a floppy (requires a floppy drive) >> >> then they boot from hdd. it doesn't matter if it's usb, sata or what have you >> >> there are no official boot images for hdd. nick is aware of this, and >> so are the rest of the developers > > Copy the floppy (or cd, for that matter) image onto a USB stick. B Boot > from it. B Problem solved.
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On Mon, Apr 09, 2012, Andres Perera wrote: > if they don't use the following to boot: > > * bootp (requires more than one system) > * a cd (requires an optical drive) > * a floppy (requires a floppy drive) > > then they boot from hdd. it doesn't matter if it's usb, sata or what have you > > there are no official boot images for hdd. nick is aware of this, and > so are the rest of the developers Copy the floppy (or cd, for that matter) image onto a USB stick. Boot from it. Problem solved.
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On Mon, Apr 9, 2012 at 11:26 AM, Mihai Popescu wrote: >> B Andres Perera wote: >> B i don't understand why is such a simple problem turning into drama > > It is not. As for the understanding part, you need to identify what is > stopping you in the first place - is it that english is not your first > language and you don't have enough of it, or is it that you read > between lines, or any other thing. Once you will find it, you can > asjust it and come to an understanding. Eventually. > >> that's outside the conditions. i am talking about a real world >> situation where i had ONE COMPUTER and it did not have a cd drive > > Nick, the FAQ and a bunch of internet out there ARE TALKING about the > same thing. Didn't you really see this? > >> that's it. there's no other way to look at it > > Says who? Take a look at soekris.com stuff and believe this boards are > able to get OpenBSD installed on them and run it successfully. And > guess what? Only ONE COMPUTER is involved to prepare the OS. read very slowly if they don't use the following to boot: * bootp (requires more than one system) * a cd (requires an optical drive) * a floppy (requires a floppy drive) then they boot from hdd. it doesn't matter if it's usb, sata or what have you there are no official boot images for hdd. nick is aware of this, and so are the rest of the developers the faq requires that you boot with bsd.rd and use that environment to install to usb media you cannot do that with a single computer that can only boot from usb hdd with the official media, so you need to install to qemu you are obviously not talking about the same situation, and neither is the other dude. more than that, you've never encountered this problem or else you'd be familiar with the requirements you are a humongous idiot > > Excuse my intervention, please, but your answers keep remainding me of > someone I work with, who got a habit of telling people around him how > they CAN'T accomplish something. Pretty useless.
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
> Andres Perera wote: > i don't understand why is such a simple problem turning into drama It is not. As for the understanding part, you need to identify what is stopping you in the first place - is it that english is not your first language and you don't have enough of it, or is it that you read between lines, or any other thing. Once you will find it, you can asjust it and come to an understanding. Eventually. > that's outside the conditions. i am talking about a real world > situation where i had ONE COMPUTER and it did not have a cd drive Nick, the FAQ and a bunch of internet out there ARE TALKING about the same thing. Didn't you really see this? > that's it. there's no other way to look at it Says who? Take a look at soekris.com stuff and believe this boards are able to get OpenBSD installed on them and run it successfully. And guess what? Only ONE COMPUTER is involved to prepare the OS. Excuse my intervention, please, but your answers keep remainding me of someone I work with, who got a habit of telling people around him how they CAN'T accomplish something. Pretty useless.
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
i don't understand why is such a simple problem turning into drama On Sat, Apr 7, 2012 at 2:10 PM, Nick Holland wrote: > On 04/06/12 07:35, Dan Shechter wrote: >> Hi, Sorry for the newbe question, but what is wrong with what he is doing? >> >> Best regards, >> Dan > > First of all, OpenBSD is completely free software. B we can not, nor do > we want to stop anyone from making their own "project" (or product) > based on OpenBSD. B That doesn't mean we always like it. > > The problem comes in when people create things that are no longer > OpenBSD, then the users come to our lists and developers expecting help. > B Or develop an opinion of OpenBSD based on these non-OpenBSD projects. > This is often due to lack of maintenance on the part of those "projects" > -- they put something together because they feel they need it, they > think, "this is pretty cool", set up a website, make a logo, and ta-da, > a project is born...and often, that's how it stays. > > We also don't like misinformation...for example, this from another part > of the thread: > >> can't install in the first place if your only bootable media can be >> usb sticks. the alternative to downloading premade images is making >> them in qemu, which is more work for little gain > > That's ONE alternative. B Roughly equivalent to turning right by turning > left three times (reverse for Drive-on-Left countries). B You can take > your USB stick and an OpenBSD CD to any same-platform computer in the > world that can boot from CD and has a USB port and build an install > device there using standard processes...and you know what you have and > how you got it. that's outside the conditions. i am talking about a real world situation where i had ONE COMPUTER and it did not have a cd drive that's it. there's no other way to look at it
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On 04/06/12 07:35, Dan Shechter wrote: > Hi, Sorry for the newbe question, but what is wrong with what he is doing? > > Best regards, > Dan First of all, OpenBSD is completely free software. we can not, nor do we want to stop anyone from making their own "project" (or product) based on OpenBSD. That doesn't mean we always like it. The problem comes in when people create things that are no longer OpenBSD, then the users come to our lists and developers expecting help. Or develop an opinion of OpenBSD based on these non-OpenBSD projects. This is often due to lack of maintenance on the part of those "projects" -- they put something together because they feel they need it, they think, "this is pretty cool", set up a website, make a logo, and ta-da, a project is born...and often, that's how it stays. We also don't like misinformation...for example, this from another part of the thread: > can't install in the first place if your only bootable media can be > usb sticks. the alternative to downloading premade images is making > them in qemu, which is more work for little gain That's ONE alternative. Roughly equivalent to turning right by turning left three times (reverse for Drive-on-Left countries). You can take your USB stick and an OpenBSD CD to any same-platform computer in the world that can boot from CD and has a USB port and build an install device there using standard processes...and you know what you have and how you got it. But other issues are solutions to non-problems, like flash-based re-distributions of OpenBSD. They are sold as "here's how to put OpenBSD on a flash device", but in reality, they make a difficult-to-maintain system that is actually NEEDED by a tiny minority of people utilizing flash media on an OpenBSD system, the rest are just taking perverse pleasure in doing simple things the hard way, because it is the sport of this industry. Worse, a lot of these "projects" are in the form of "just do this, and you get this" type things, rather than "here's how I did this, adapt as needed to your goals", so people can't see the assumptions they made and the overall strategy, so their ability to troubleshoot, upgrade, etc. the "solution" is minimal. We've also had users find "recipes" for mail servers on the 'net that only worked for obsolete versions of OpenBSD, and users who would rather follow the recipe on an obsolete version of OpenBSD than understand how it works and implement properly on supported versions of OpenBSD. There is a problem that many people on the 'net have -- they forget that any idiot can publish anything they wish on the 'net...the ability to render their thoughts into print or web does not mean it is accurate or of value...and google rankings There's also the issue of trust: "here's this file I put out on the 'net, please download it, install it, and run it. enjoy!" um... I have NO reason to believe Girish is deliberately doing anything to hurt the OpenBSD project, or its users. However, I have some gripes with this particular project: * The "Live CD" (which might be fascinating, though in 2012, now that everything boots off Flash now, I'm not sure how useful) isn't a live CD, it's a CD that makes a live USB drive. * He's perpetuating the "gotta use qemu to make a flash drive" thing. That's a funny shaped hammer to drive something that doesn't look like a nail. * Some language vagueness which is somewhat confusing (4GB...what? RAM? Flash drive? space free?) * Significant lag between OpenBSD release and project updates. * Recreating something that is trivial for any experienced OpenBSD user to create on their own. It may be of use for new OpenBSD users...but are they really using OpenBSD? While a USB flash drive may seem a good starting point for new users, due to performance, I'd much rather suggest a junk PC one could dedicate to the (I actually started out thinking I was going to be singing the praise of Girish's creation of a Live OpenBSD CDROM as a true "value add" to OpenBSD...but was rather disappointed to find out it was just an installer for a USB Flash install.) Nick. > > > > On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 8:56 AM, Jan Stary wrote: > >> On Apr 01 21:30:58, Girish Venkatachalam wrote: >> > After a long long time. Sigh. >> >> Please stop spreading this. All it does is give wrong >> instruction and diverts people who should instead read >> http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#flashmemLive
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
Hi, Sorry for the newbe question, but what is wrong with what he is doing? Best regards, Dan On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 8:56 AM, Jan Stary wrote: > On Apr 01 21:30:58, Girish Venkatachalam wrote: > > After a long long time. Sigh. > > Please stop spreading this. All it does is give wrong > instruction and diverts people who should instead read > http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#flashmemLive
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On Fri, Apr 6, 2012 at 2:17 AM, Mihai Popescu wrote: >> Andres Perera > >> if you cant install through network because you only got one machine > > So you can't install OpenBSD but you CAN download the pre-made OpenBSD images? need another machine for bootp > >>and feel that guerrilla overwriting your mbr after installing the locks >>within another os in >> order to do a hdd boot is too risky, you're left with this > > I've used OpenBSD in a multiboot and it was working perfectly fine, no > guerilla there. can't install in the first place if your only bootable media can be usb sticks. the alternative to downloading premade images is making them in qemu, which is more work for little gain > >> the page you linked does not provide that > > It does not, since the page is for a specific purpose. If you take > your time and go back to the root of FAQ you may find what you are > looking for. But I guess is nicer for you to spread crazy thing on the > list.
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On Apr 06 09:47:01, Mihai Popescu wrote: > > Andres Perera > > > if you cant install through network because you only got one machine > > So you can't install OpenBSD but you CAN download the pre-made OpenBSD images? > > >and feel that guerrilla overwriting your mbr after installing the locks > >within another os in > > order to do a hdd boot is too risky, you're left with this > > I've used OpenBSD in a multiboot and it was working perfectly fine, no > guerilla there. > > > the page you linked does not provide that > > It does not, since the page is for a specific purpose. If you take > your time and go back to the root of FAQ you may find what you are > looking for. But I guess is nicer for you to spread crazy thing on the > list. Please, don't feed this. This project brings nothing, and its page spreads disinformation. Just follow http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#flashmemLive
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
> Andres Perera > if you cant install through network because you only got one machine So you can't install OpenBSD but you CAN download the pre-made OpenBSD images? >and feel that guerrilla overwriting your mbr after installing the locks within >another os in > order to do a hdd boot is too risky, you're left with this I've used OpenBSD in a multiboot and it was working perfectly fine, no guerilla there. > the page you linked does not provide that It does not, since the page is for a specific purpose. If you take your time and go back to the root of FAQ you may find what you are looking for. But I guess is nicer for you to spread crazy thing on the list.
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 7:56 AM, Jan Stary wrote: > On Apr 01 21:30:58, Girish Venkatachalam wrote: >> After a long long time. Sigh. > > Please stop spreading this. All it does is give wrong > instruction and diverts people who should instead read > http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#flashmemLive http://www.undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20091208204922
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
? he is hosting *pre-made* bootable usb images if you cant install through network because you only got one machine, don't have a cd drive (e.g. netbook), and feel that guerrilla overwriting your mbr after installing the locks within another os in order to do a hdd boot is too risky, you're left with this the page you linked does not provide that On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Jan Stary wrote: > On Apr 01 21:30:58, Girish Venkatachalam wrote: >> After a long long time. Sigh. > > Please stop spreading this. All it does is give wrong > instruction and diverts people who should instead read > http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#flashmemLive
Re: LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
On Apr 01 21:30:58, Girish Venkatachalam wrote: > After a long long time. Sigh. Please stop spreading this. All it does is give wrong instruction and diverts people who should instead read http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#flashmemLive
LiveUSB OpenBSD and LiveCD-OpenBSD site updated
After a long long time. Sigh. http://liveusb-openbsd.sf.net http://livecd-openbsd.sf.net -Girish -- G3 Tech Networking appliance company web: http://g3tech.in mail: gir...@g3tech.in
