[nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
I'm developing a web application which aims to migrate at least two VB3 16-bit windows applications and a collection of other tools to a modern platform for the University of Technology Graz. Because I have a free pass to choose technologies and environments I aim to contribute to the technologies that I use and document that contribution and its implementation as part of my Master's Thesis in Software Development and Business Management. I would appreciate your input - ideas that you would like to see become reality for node.js and also in general. I will choose one more of the ideas that fit and aim to make the sources available. Thank you for your help. Igor Skoric -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
It will be a suite of tools for a geological lab. I plan to create a simple customer/project management suite and plug in a handful of applications for different processes. If you would like to recommend a different (but cutting edge) technology for this I would also be grateful. On Tuesday, June 12, 2012 2:59:24 PM UTC+2, Ben Noordhuis wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 2:27 PM, Igor Skoric sk.i...@gmail.com wrote: I'm developing a web application which aims to migrate at least two VB3 16-bit windows applications and a collection of other tools to a modern platform for the University of Technology Graz. Because I have a free pass to choose technologies and environments I aim to contribute to the technologies that I use and document that contribution and its implementation as part of my Master's Thesis in Software Development and Business Management. I would appreciate your input - ideas that you would like to see become reality for node.js and also in general. I will choose one more of the ideas that fit and aim to make the sources available. Thank you for your help. Igor Skoric Could you tell more about what you're trying to build / port? Node is not necessarily the best tool for every project. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
Ben, I am interested in what you consider to be poor holes for a node.js peg. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:14 PM, Paul Spaulding pjs67...@gmail.com wrote: Ben, I am interested in what you consider to be poor holes for a node.js peg. There are some things you cannot reasonably do in node.js no matter how hard you try, things like hard real-time, complex math, etc. They're fundamentally at odds with the language and the environment it runs in. Then there is the broad category of things you /can/ but not necessarily /should/ do. CRUD web apps come to mind: you /can/ write your new blog engine in node.js but it doesn't have a killer edge over other languages or frameworks (except for client/server code sharing, maybe.) -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:08 PM, Igor Skoric sk.i...@gmail.com wrote: It will be a suite of tools for a geological lab. I plan to create a simple customer/project management suite and plug in a handful of applications for different processes. If you would like to recommend a different (but cutting edge) technology for this I would also be grateful. Igor, see my previous email. node.js may or may not work for you. If you're already familiar with, say, flask or django, I'd go with that. The extra learning curve of a new language and framework will just get in the way of getting things done. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
things like hard real-time, complex math, etc. To elaborate on the math aspect: Because of the significant js/C barrier and the need for optimized code, node is a poor choice for significant computation. I would recommend python and numpy/scipy for this kinda stuff. One approach you may consider is to use node to manage basic web ui stuff, and then use the child_process module to shell out to workers written in more appropriate languages as necessary. For a scientific application this would probably even be a good fit. The extra learning curve of a new language and framework will just get in the way of getting things done. There's definitely a truth to this. When I did my masters, the biggest lesson was that your time is worth *way* more than both money and cool-factor. Flask might be boring but it's worth it if you're able to ship faster in the short term (and with the timescale of a masters you definitely want to be thinking short-term). Just something to think about. --Josh On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 12:20 PM, Ben Noordhuis i...@bnoordhuis.nl wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:08 PM, Igor Skoric sk.i...@gmail.com wrote: It will be a suite of tools for a geological lab. I plan to create a simple customer/project management suite and plug in a handful of applications for different processes. If you would like to recommend a different (but cutting edge) technology for this I would also be grateful. Igor, see my previous email. node.js may or may not work for you. If you're already familiar with, say, flask or django, I'd go with that. The extra learning curve of a new language and framework will just get in the way of getting things done. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en -- Joshua Holbrook Engineer Nodejitsu Inc. j...@nodejitsu.com -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
Python has a python/c barrier yes, but python's runtime is better equipped to handle crossing the boundary with low overhead because it was written with that use case in mind. v8, on the other hand, is optimized for running javascript code and so making the jump back and forth is considerably more effort for the vm. I'm sure someone with more experience with node C bindings (or python C bindings for that matter) could give a more technical explanation. I'm more of an end-user and not as much a developer when it comes to such bindings. To further elaborate: You *can* do basic math in javascript just fine, and at a reasonable rate. For heavy lifting though, ya gotta go lapack/atlas/etc. --Josh On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 2:18 PM, Matt hel...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:29 PM, Joshua Holbrook josh.holbr...@gmail.com wrote: To elaborate on the math aspect: Because of the significant js/C barrier and the need for optimized code, node is a poor choice for significant computation. I would recommend python and numpy/scipy for this kinda stuff. Python has the same barrier. What makes it different? i.e. why couldn't someone created a NumNode/SciNode? Matt. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en -- Joshua Holbrook Engineer Nodejitsu Inc. j...@nodejitsu.com -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
On Tuesday, June 12, 2012 9:29:10 PM UTC+2, jesusabdullah wrote: things like hard real-time, complex math, etc. To elaborate on the math aspect: Because of the significant js/C barrier and the need for optimized code, node is a poor choice for significant computation. I would recommend python and numpy/scipy for this kinda stuff. The computations are not very complex. Computing performance is not important and the computation time is insignificant. But I still find your recommendations for that case (should i have it come up) interesting. The extra learning curve of a new language and framework will just get in the way of getting things done. There's definitely a truth to this. When I did my masters, the biggest lesson was that your time is worth *way* more than both money and cool-factor. Flask might be boring but it's worth it if you're able to ship faster in the short term (and with the timescale of a masters you definitely want to be thinking short-term). Just something to think about. Right now I'm more concerned about the right topic for my thesis. I have not worked with django or flask before. I have coded some pure php/js and i don't like PHP very much. The planned scope is about 6-12 months. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
On Tuesday, June 12, 2012 9:20:40 PM UTC+2, Ben Noordhuis wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:08 PM, Igor Skoric sk.i...@gmail.com wrote: It will be a suite of tools for a geological lab. I plan to create a simple customer/project management suite and plug in a handful of applications for different processes. If you would like to recommend a different (but cutting edge) technology for this I would also be grateful. Igor, see my previous email. node.js may or may not work for you. If you're already familiar with, say, flask or django, I'd go with that. The extra learning curve of a new language and framework will just get in the way of getting things done. Unfortunately I'm not familiar with either. It's going to be a learning experience either way. :) -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
Well for one, scipy numpy already exist. If you want to do something like linear regression, you'll have to build all kinds of base math libraries into node before you can start working on anything. It's great if you want to create an equivalent scipy for node, but probably not in the scope of a master's thesis. On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 2:18 PM, Matt hel...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:29 PM, Joshua Holbrook josh.holbr...@gmail.comwrote: To elaborate on the math aspect: Because of the significant js/C barrier and the need for optimized code, node is a poor choice for significant computation. I would recommend python and numpy/scipy for this kinda stuff. Python has the same barrier. What makes it different? i.e. why couldn't someone created a NumNode/SciNode? Matt. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
If you currently do your math using matlab, I would suggest numpy. There's some documents on the scipy site that will help you transition your matlab knowledge into numpy python syntax. There's no good reason for you to do it in nodejs unless you want to make a significant math library contribution. On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 2:43 PM, Igor Skoric sk.i...@gmail.com wrote: On Tuesday, June 12, 2012 9:20:40 PM UTC+2, Ben Noordhuis wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:08 PM, Igor Skoric sk.i...@gmail.com wrote: It will be a suite of tools for a geological lab. I plan to create a simple customer/project management suite and plug in a handful of applications for different processes. If you would like to recommend a different (but cutting edge) technology for this I would also be grateful. Igor, see my previous email. node.js may or may not work for you. If you're already familiar with, say, flask or django, I'd go with that. The extra learning curve of a new language and framework will just get in the way of getting things done. Unfortunately I'm not familiar with either. It's going to be a learning experience either way. :) -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Joshua Holbrook josh.holbr...@gmail.comwrote: Python has a python/c barrier yes, but python's runtime is better equipped to handle crossing the boundary with low overhead because it was written with that use case in mind. v8, on the other hand, is optimized for running javascript code and so making the jump back and forth is considerably more effort for the vm. I'm sure someone with more experience with node C bindings (or python C bindings for that matter) could give a more technical explanation. I'm more of an end-user and not as much a developer when it comes to such bindings. I'm familiar with Node's C++ bindings and I'm very familiar with Perl's C interface (XS) and the overheads of passing objects back and forth there. And Perl was designed very similarly to Python in that sense. The answer is there's not that much difference between Node and Perl in that respect, and I haven't seen any reason the equivalent to NumPy (or PDL which is the Perl equivalent) couldn't be built in Node from my knowledge of the internals. Not that this exists now, or is even in the scope of a masters thesis, but I'm just saying it's not something that can't be done, it just hasn't been done yet, IMHO. Matt. -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 6:09 PM, Joshua Holbrook josh.holbr...@gmail.comwrote: it's not something that can't be done, it just hasn't been done yet, IMHO. Right. It's doable, it's just not actually that great of an idea. Hah, well people said that at first about numerical calculations in Python before NumPy existed, and Perl before PDL existed - after all that's what Mathematica and FORTRAN were for ;-) -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
people said that at first about numerical calculations in Python before NumPy existed I doubt it. Scientists *love* having a scripting language on top of their fortrans. It's a very old idea. --Josh On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Matt hel...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 6:09 PM, Joshua Holbrook josh.holbr...@gmail.com wrote: it's not something that can't be done, it just hasn't been done yet, IMHO. Right. It's doable, it's just not actually that great of an idea. Hah, well people said that at first about numerical calculations in Python before NumPy existed, and Perl before PDL existed - after all that's what Mathematica and FORTRAN were for ;-) -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en -- Joshua Holbrook Engineer Nodejitsu Inc. j...@nodejitsu.com -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
It's important to understand that the overhead of context switching in V8 is pretty painful when compared to Python. I'm doing a bit of work myself embedding v8 in a fairly intensive environment, and it's been a hell of a learning experience. There's a *metric s*** ton* of difference between the standard Python interpreter and v8 and how they are interpreted. A key thing to understand about v8 is that it JIT compiles your Javascript straight into machine language ( via the meta-lang pipeline: Crankshaft- Helium- Lithium ). This makes context switches far, far more costly, because v8 does not actually deal directly ( much ) with its abstractions. It does use them in formulation but then discards them when no longer needed. This means if you go a-fetching v8 has to do some searching and constructing before it can make your switch, unless you've asked v8 to 'hold onto' something ( which in turn, slows down the VM slightly via the GC and forces some parts of the VM to not optimize because your essentially telling the interpreter this is volatile ). This is part of the reason why v8 encourages you to use Local Handles whenever possible. The smackdown here isn't that hard - your looking at about 0.00032ms or so ( off the top of my head ) - but you take an array of say, a million elements, and there you go. Suddenly your looking at 1/3 seconds time just to iterate over a massive JS array in C++. Compare this to Python, or Ruby, or Perl, most interpreters of which keep their abstractions available ( in memory ) and deal with them directly. Context switches are not as painful because Python/Ruby/Perl do not have to do any building up on fetch or switch, they simply grab the abstraction's pointer and go. So its really best to limit those as much as possible. If you do proceed, some things to keep in mind: -As I mentioned, big arrays are painful if you need to access them in C. I would recommend following Node's lead and using buffer patterns where appropriate. In other words, try to make your switches as 'meaty' as possible. -It seems to be more painful to access JS from C++ ( via -Get() ) then it does to callback C++ from JS ( via FunctionTemplates ). -... but it doesn't seem that painful to call JS functions, or to create one-use JS Objects for your arguments in C++ ( via Function-Call() and v8::Object::New ). These are just my (not particularly scientific) observations. Best of luck! On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 6:29 PM, Joshua Holbrook josh.holbr...@gmail.comwrote: people said that at first about numerical calculations in Python before NumPy existed I doubt it. Scientists *love* having a scripting language on top of their fortrans. It's a very old idea. --Josh On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Matt hel...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 6:09 PM, Joshua Holbrook josh.holbr...@gmail.com wrote: it's not something that can't be done, it just hasn't been done yet, IMHO. Right. It's doable, it's just not actually that great of an idea. Hah, well people said that at first about numerical calculations in Python before NumPy existed, and Perl before PDL existed - after all that's what Mathematica and FORTRAN were for ;-) -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en -- Joshua Holbrook Engineer Nodejitsu Inc. j...@nodejitsu.com -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
Re: [nodejs] Ideas for contribution to node.js in the context of a Master's Thesis
On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 10:47 PM, Stewart Mckinney lordma...@gmail.comwrote: A key thing to understand about v8 is that it JIT compiles your Javascript straight into machine language ( via the meta-lang pipeline: Crankshaft- Helium- Lithium ). This makes context switches far, far more costly, because v8 does not actually deal directly ( much ) with its abstractions. It does use them in formulation but then discards them when no longer needed. This means if you go a-fetching v8 has to do some searching and constructing before it can make your switch, unless you've asked v8 to 'hold onto' something ( which in turn, slows down the VM slightly via the GC and forces some parts of the VM to not optimize because your essentially telling the interpreter this is volatile ). This is part of the reason why v8 encourages you to use Local Handles whenever possible. The smackdown here isn't that hard - your looking at about 0.00032ms or so ( off the top of my head ) - but you take an array of say, a million elements, and there you go. Suddenly your looking at 1/3 seconds time just to iterate over a massive JS array in C++. Sure, but IIRC neither NumPy nor PDL concepts of Arrays/Vectors/whatever are strictly language native. So it's basically the same as a Buffer. (sorry I guess this should be another thread). -- Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/ Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups nodejs group. To post to this group, send email to nodejs@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nodejs+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en?hl=en
