[NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Matija Šuklje]

Hullo,

I've been wondering ...does anyone know of any good (printed) book to learn 
ConTeXt?

Cheers,
Matija

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[NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Matija Šuklje]

Hullo,

I've been wondering ...does anyone know of any good (printed) book to learn 
ConTeXt?

Cheers,
Matija

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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Yue Wang]

On Feb 4, 2008 7:27 AM, Matija Šuklje <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hullo,
>
> I've been wondering ...does anyone know of any good (printed) book to learn
> ConTeXt?

cont-eni.pdf, the context manual from pragma ade, i think. but it is
quite outdated.
I think the context development team should update the manual whenever
a new feature is stable, but these people are working non-stop seeking
for new features and have no time to update the manuals:)
so maybe you can find more information on the wiki pages.

>
> Cheers,
> Matija
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Santy, Michael]

We would also be really interested in such a book (even if it was a bit pricey).

Cheers,
Mike



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Matija Suklje
Sent: Mon 2/4/2008 9:42 AM
To: mailing list for ConTeXt users
Subject: Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book
 
Dne ponedeljek 4. februarja 2008 je Yue Wang napisal(a):
> cont-eni.pdf, the context manual from pragma ade, i think. but it is
> quite outdated.
> I think the context development team should update the manual whenever
> a new feature is stable, but these people are working non-stop seeking
> for new features and have no time to update the manuals:)
> so maybe you can find more information on the wiki pages.

Thanks, but I thought about a physically present printed book that I could ask 
the central technical library to order it for their collection.

Cheers,
Matija

p.s. sorry about the double post ...there was a problem with the mail server.

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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Arthur Reutenauer]

> I've been wondering ...does anyone know of any good (printed) book to learn 
> ConTeXt?

  The ConTeXt book ... it has been a bit of a Holy Grail for quite a
while, and it looks like it will be some more time until it is found.

  The reason why there is no comprehensive book yet is not clear to me;
maybe Hans' documents were too intimidating in the first place and
nobody dared enhance them ;-)  But it's obvious that things can only
become worse over time, because on the other hand there is quite a lot
of sparse documentation about various aspects of ConTeXt, and it's not
straightforward to gather it all in a comprehensive and coherent way --
by the way, I wish to protest here against the oft-repeated lament
"There is not enough documentation about ConTeXt" (something you hear at
lot on this list): I think it's completely biased, there is a lot of
documentation concerning ConTeXt and it probably covers all the
subjects; the only problem is that it's scattered.  Even on the wiki,
it's not always straightforward to find answers to a particular question
(even if the answer to that exact question is there).

  Maybe this would be a way to start, organizing meta-information in the
wiki, starting, of course, from pages where such information has already
been gathered like http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Official_ConTeXt_Documentation
and http://wiki.contextgarden.net/FAQ -- and of course, this should also
be discussed at the ConTeXt meeting in Bohinj, where I trust all
interested parties should come ;-)

Arthur
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Matija Šuklje]

Dne ponedeljek 4. februarja 2008 je Yue Wang napisal(a):
> cont-eni.pdf, the context manual from pragma ade, i think. but it is
> quite outdated.
> I think the context development team should update the manual whenever
> a new feature is stable, but these people are working non-stop seeking
> for new features and have no time to update the manuals:)
> so maybe you can find more information on the wiki pages.

Thanks, but I thought about a physically present printed book that I could ask 
the central technical library to order it for their collection.

Cheers,
Matija

p.s. sorry about the double post ...there was a problem with the mail server.

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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Ernesto Schirmacher]

Dear ConTeXt experts, 

I recently switched over to ConTeXt and it has been great!

I have been learning a lot from the source files in texmf/tex/context/base/
but I find it hard to understand from the code for a given command what
options are available, which ones are defaults, and what are all the possible 
values
one might give a given option.

I presume all this information is contained in the sources but I am unsure 
as to what I should be looking for.  Are there specific things I should be
looking for?

Thanks in advance,

Ernesto
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Henning Hraban Ramm]

Am 2008-02-05 um 04:52 schrieb Ernesto Schirmacher:

> I presume all this information is contained in the sources but I am  
> unsure
> as to what I should be looking for.  Are there specific things I  
> should be
> looking for?

http://wiki.contextgarden.net
http://texshow.contextgarden.net


Greetlings from Lake Constance!
Hraban
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Jan Kraljič]

Hello,

i think it would be great to have some basic documentation published. My
idea is to create "Basic ConTeXt guide" with start documentation for new
user. This is what should be in:

1. Chapter: What is ConTeXt, what it included, which are basic modules, what
is needed to start with Context, maybe something about instalation

2. Chapter: first document step by step, second document (something like on
contexgarden, maybe little longer step by step)

3. Chapter: my first letter ( how to write little longer document "in
style")

4. Chapter: Formating - quick introduction in text aligment,, fonts (size
and format), tables, how to setup setups page design (mergins...)

5. Chapter: How to create simple presentation

6. Tips and Tricks (maybe some FAQ explained)

Appedix A: Table of math symbols with examples (like sum, matrix...)

Appedix B: Article From Latex to Context
..

Now my question: are we able to create some book like this? And would be
users interested to buy/use it?

Jan


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[PChot]

On Feb 6, 2008 10:37 AM, Taco Hoekwater <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>
>
> Jan Kraljič wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > i think it would be great to have some basic documentation published.
>
> http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/ms-cb-en.pdf (screen )
> http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf (paper )
>
> Is not what you had in mind?


Pretty much something like that. (Paper version)

I believe that no one would print this on printer. So I wonder if there
would be interest for published book?

Regards, Jan


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Taco Hoekwater]

Jan Kraljič wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> i think it would be great to have some basic documentation published. 

http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/ms-cb-en.pdf (screen )
http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf (paper )

Is not what you had in mind?

Best wishes,
Taco
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Gour]

> "PChot" == PChot  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

PChot> I believe that no one would print this on printer. So I wonder if
PChot> there would be interest for published book?

I'd buy a book for sure, but in the meantime printed the above stuff in
local copy-shop and put in spiral binding ;)

Sincerely,
Gour

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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Otared Kavian]

Hi all,

Indeed the documents mentioned by Taco are great, but some time ago  
there was a discussion on the list about an update of those manuals  
(dating from 1999, according to the colofon) and about how we users  
can contribute to the job by finding the possible bugs, errors,  
misprints, etc. But us far as I know we, at least I, didn't do anything…


Now in my opinion the idea of having a book is a good one: for  
instance many of my students when writing reports and theses ask me  
about a book on TeX or LaTeX, even though there are many electronic  
documents about them freely available. Our library has the books by  
Donald Knuth, Leslie Lamport and Raymond Séroul among others, and if  
there were a book about ConTeXt I would certainly order at least two  
for our library and one for myself. For making ConTeXt more popular  
among mathematicians (or other academic users) I think it is good to  
have books about it in libraries, since at first students look for  
books before sticking to one of TeX flavors.


Best regards: OK


On 6 févr. 08, at 10:50, PChot wrote:


On Feb 6, 2008 10:37 AM, Taco Hoekwater <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


Jan Kraljič wrote:
> Hello,
>
> i think it would be great to have some basic documentation  
published.


http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/ms-cb-en.pdf (screen )
http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf (paper )

Is not what you had in mind?

Pretty much something like that. (Paper version)

I believe that no one would print this on printer. So I wonder if  
there would be interest for published book?


Regards, Jan


--
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Linux is for those who want to know why their computer works.
DOS is for those who want to know why their computer doesn't work.
Windows is for those who don't want to know why their computer  
doesn't work.  
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Aditya Mahajan]

On Wed, 6 Feb 2008, Otared Kavian wrote:

> Now in my opinion the idea of having a book is a good one: for instance many

How about distributing the ConTeXt manuals from Lulu or someother self 
publishing website. I think that the eplain manual is distributed this 
way.

Aditya
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Arthur Reutenauer]

> So first step, What is not correct written in pdf (
> http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf)? All suggestion
> welcomed!! And all suggestion what should be, is missing?

  I suppose you should start with
  
http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Revision_and_translations_of_%E2%80%9CConTeXt%2C_an_excursion%E2%80%9D
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Jan Kraljič]

OK, I see there is interest in users for book. What is Hans saying on this
idea?

I belive printing and selling wont be such a problem. I think about 1000
copies can be sold.

Firstly we must prepare the book. If there is interest, i'll push this idea
forward.

So first step, What is not correct written in pdf (
http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf)? All suggestion
welcomed!! And all suggestion what should be, is missing?

Regards, Jan


-- 
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt book

[Andrea Valle]

So first step, What is not correct written in pdf (http:// 
www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf)? All suggestion  
welcomed!! And all suggestion what should be, is missing?


(I like the idea of a book.)
IMHO one should start from scratch, i.e. from defining a new document  
structure. Then the manual contents can evidently be cannibalized  
while writing.
But such a project need "official coordinators". Otherwise it risks  
to be a printed wiki (which is good, but it's not  a book)


Best

-a-







Regards, Jan


--
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Linux is for those who want to know why their computer works.
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--> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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. noise [salt] is boring
. F(blah) [food without salt] can be boring
. F(noise, blah) can be really tasty
"
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[NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

Dear gang,

As some of you may know, I'm working on a professional introductory book  
for learning ConTeXt. Part of the philosophy of this book is to be as  
self-contained as possible, so we'll be using a preferred editor.


Not one editor/ide out there is ideal for ConTeXt (including bidi editing  
and other user-friendly configurability). The best balance I could find is  
Notepad++ (Npp), and that's what I'm going with. I have done a lot of work  
to contextify it, and I have added some new features, such as a  
context-menu where one can right-click and get a list of ConTeXt  
typography and description options, experimental support for tooltips  
(giving options for commands etc), no more manual braces (so far less run  
errors) etc.


To take this to the next level I need help: Is there anyone on the list  
who knows how to write and compile lexers for scintilla-based editors?  
Also, how to compile C++ for M$-Windows based applications such as Npp?


Npp has a rich user-defined dialog, and I have been able to do a lot with  
it, but it has some serious limitations. So I'd like to port my  
user-definitions to a lexer. We can probably start with the code for the  
included TeX lexer, de-latexify it, and add the needed functions for  
ConTeXt, including a few other features.


If anyone is interested, please contact me!

Best wishes
Idris
--
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International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[amca01]

Sent from my android device.

-Original Message-
From: "Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس   سماوي حامد" 
To: ntg-context@ntg.nl, "dev-cont...@ntg.nl" 
Sent: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 6:23 AM
Subject: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

Dear gang,

As some of you may know, I'm working on a professional introductory book  
for learning ConTeXt. Part of the philosophy of this book is to be as  
self-contained as possible, so we'll be using a preferred editor.

Not one editor/ide out there is ideal for ConTeXt (including bidi editing  
and other user-friendly configurability). The best balance I could find is  
Notepad++ (Npp), and that's what I'm going with. I have done a lot of work  
to contextify it, and I have added some new features, such as a  
context-menu where one can right-click and get a list of ConTeXt  
typography and description options, experimental support for tooltips  
(giving options for commands etc), no more manual braces (so far less run  
errors) etc.

To take this to the next level I need help: Is there anyone on the list  
who knows how to write and compile lexers for scintilla-based editors?  
Also, how to compile C++ for M$-Windows based applications such as Npp?

Npp has a rich user-defined dialog, and I have been able to do a lot with  
it, but it has some serious limitations. So I'd like to port my  
user-definitions to a lexer. We can probably start with the code for the  
included TeX lexer, de-latexify it, and add the needed functions for  
ConTeXt, including a few other features.

If anyone is interested, please contact me!

Best wishes
Idris
-- 
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Sun, 2011-08-14 at 14:23 -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي
حامد wrote:
> Dear gang,
> 
> As some of you may know, I'm working on a professional introductory book  
> for learning ConTeXt. Part of the philosophy of this book is to be as  
> self-contained as possible, so we'll be using a preferred editor.

Hey Idris. I think writing a book is a great idea and much needed. I
don't believe that tying it to a specific editor though is neither
necessary nor a good idea.

> Not one editor/ide out there is ideal for ConTeXt (including bidi editing  
> and other user-friendly configurability). The best balance I could find is  
> Notepad++ (Npp), and that's what I'm going with. 

The problem with Npp is that the tens of millions of users out there
running operating systems like Ubuntu will not be able to use Notepad++
since it is written only for Windows. It might be better to decouple the
editor from the information on ConTeXt itself and perhaps offer editor
specific integration information in an appendix. You'll find that Gedit,
for instance, is very easy to write syntax highlighting for.

Take care,

-- 
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

Hi Kip,

On Sun, 14 Aug 2011 15:16:58 -0600, Kip Warner  wrote:


As some of you may know, I'm working on a professional introductory book
for learning ConTeXt. Part of the philosophy of this book is to be as
self-contained as possible, so we'll be using a preferred editor.



Hey Idris. I think writing a book is a great idea and much needed. I
don't believe that tying it to a specific editor though is neither
necessary nor a good idea.


The Book will not be "tied" to an editor. However, one goal of the book is  
to be accessible to absolute newbies for whom the TeX-vs-editor  
distinction will be a turn-off. A complete newbie system should include an  
editor/environment. The book will be arranged in a way that the two are  
not coupled, and those with some TeX or other technical background can  
easily ignore Npp.


Not one editor/ide out there is ideal for ConTeXt (including bidi  
editing
and other user-friendly configurability). The best balance I could find  
is

Notepad++ (Npp), and that's what I'm going with.



The problem with Npp is that the tens of millions of users out there


Wow, that would be great if we got tens of millions of users to buy the  
Book :D :D :D



running operating systems like Ubuntu will not be able to use Notepad++
since it is written only for Windows.


Well, most people using Linux have some technical facility, so they can  
configure their own editors.



It might be better to decouple the
editor from the information on ConTeXt itself and perhaps offer editor
specific integration information in an appendix.


That is actually one option I'm considering. In any case.


You'll find that Gedit,


I did look at gedit, but for the current vision I have for introducing  
ConTeXt to non-technical folks it does not work.


Actually, I spent months checking for a better candidate than Npp,  
experimenting with just about everything I could get my hands on. On  
balance Npp got the best score on all the benchmarks I set. That's not to  
say I wouldn't prefer something better, but that decision is done, only to  
be revisited if something really AMAZING happens in the next few months.


WinEdt would really have been be my ideal choice -- but the lack of  
unicode, bidi is just a non-starter. TeXWorks has a long way to go, and  
although I'm a fan of Qt its open-type implementation is buggy; so some  
Arabic-monospaced fonts don't show up correctly.




for instance, is very easy to write syntax highlighting for.


Syntax highlighting is only a small part of what we're doing with Npp.  
Otherwise, just the user-defined dialog of Npp would be sufficient.  
Click-and-tag, tooltips ... these make for real user-friendliness.


Thanks for the criticism and

Best wishes
Idris
--
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Alasdair McAndrew]

Maybe I'm missing the point, but what about Emacs?  There are versions for
most operating systems, and emacs+auctex is surely the editing system of
choice for any TeX-based system.

-Alasdair

2011/8/15 Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد 

> Hi Kip,
>
>
> On Sun, 14 Aug 2011 15:16:58 -0600, Kip Warner  wrote:
>
>  As some of you may know, I'm working on a professional introductory book
>>> for learning ConTeXt. Part of the philosophy of this book is to be as
>>> self-contained as possible, so we'll be using a preferred editor.
>>>
>>
>  Hey Idris. I think writing a book is a great idea and much needed. I
>> don't believe that tying it to a specific editor though is neither
>> necessary nor a good idea.
>>
>
> The Book will not be "tied" to an editor. However, one goal of the book is
> to be accessible to absolute newbies for whom the TeX-vs-editor distinction
> will be a turn-off. A complete newbie system should include an
> editor/environment. The book will be arranged in a way that the two are not
> coupled, and those with some TeX or other technical background can easily
> ignore Npp.
>
>
>  Not one editor/ide out there is ideal for ConTeXt (including bidi editing
>>> and other user-friendly configurability). The best balance I could find
>>> is
>>> Notepad++ (Npp), and that's what I'm going with.
>>>
>>
>  The problem with Npp is that the tens of millions of users out there
>>
>
> Wow, that would be great if we got tens of millions of users to buy the
> Book :D :D :D
>
>
>  running operating systems like Ubuntu will not be able to use Notepad++
>> since it is written only for Windows.
>>
>
> Well, most people using Linux have some technical facility, so they can
> configure their own editors.
>
>
>  It might be better to decouple the
>> editor from the information on ConTeXt itself and perhaps offer editor
>> specific integration information in an appendix.
>>
>
> That is actually one option I'm considering. In any case.
>
>
>  You'll find that Gedit,
>>
>
> I did look at gedit, but for the current vision I have for introducing
> ConTeXt to non-technical folks it does not work.
>
> Actually, I spent months checking for a better candidate than Npp,
> experimenting with just about everything I could get my hands on. On balance
> Npp got the best score on all the benchmarks I set. That's not to say I
> wouldn't prefer something better, but that decision is done, only to be
> revisited if something really AMAZING happens in the next few months.
>
> WinEdt would really have been be my ideal choice -- but the lack of
> unicode, bidi is just a non-starter. TeXWorks has a long way to go, and
> although I'm a fan of Qt its open-type implementation is buggy; so some
> Arabic-monospaced fonts don't show up correctly.
>
>
>
>  for instance, is very easy to write syntax highlighting for.
>>
>
> Syntax highlighting is only a small part of what we're doing with Npp.
> Otherwise, just the user-defined dialog of Npp would be sufficient.
> Click-and-tag, tooltips ... these make for real user-friendliness.
>
> Thanks for the criticism and
>
>
> Best wishes
> Idris
> --
> Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
> International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
> Department of Philosophy
> Colorado State University
> Fort Collins, CO 80523
> __**__**
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-- 
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Web:  http://bit.ly/Alasdair
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Mon, 2011-08-15 at 14:45 +1000, Alasdair McAndrew wrote:
> Maybe I'm missing the point, but what about Emacs?  There are versions for
> most operating systems, and emacs+auctex is surely the editing system of
> choice for any TeX-based system.
> 
> -Alasdair

Emacs I'm sure is great, but it's really not suited for new folks
needing a modern GUI.

-- 
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Sun, 2011-08-14 at 16:39 -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي
حامد wrote:
> Wow, that would be great if we got tens of millions of users to buy the  
> Book :D :D :D

;)

> Well, most people using Linux have some technical facility, so they can  
> configure their own editors.

I don't know about that. That might have been the case in the early part
of the previous decade, but not so any more. Ubuntu changed all that,
with a large portion of its demographic being "regular users". Most of
them are not programmers.

> That is actually one option I'm considering. In any case.

e.g. an appendix for gedit, one for Npp, one for Scite, Gleany,
whatever.

> I did look at gedit, but for the current vision I have for introducing  
> ConTeXt to non-technical folks it does not work.

How so? I use it regularly for ConTeXt code. You just have to use the
LaTeX syntax highlighting, but writing a ConTeXt one should be
straightforward to someone familiar with ConTeXt. The LaTex syntax
highlighting that comes with gedit could be used as a fast starter.

> Actually, I spent months checking for a better candidate than Npp,  
> experimenting with just about everything I could get my hands on. On  
> balance Npp got the best score on all the benchmarks I set. That's not to  
> say I wouldn't prefer something better, but that decision is done, only to  
> be revisited if something really AMAZING happens in the next few months.

I'm not disagreeing with you that Npp might be great for beginnings, I'm
just saying that many beginners can't use it because it isn't available
for their operating system.

> WinEdt would really have been be my ideal choice -- but the lack of  
> unicode, bidi is just a non-starter. TeXWorks has a long way to go, and  
> although I'm a fan of Qt its open-type implementation is buggy; so some  
> Arabic-monospaced fonts don't show up correctly.

It's actually an even worse choice than Npp in the sense that, not only
is it available only for Windows, it's non-free.

> Syntax highlighting is only a small part of what we're doing with Npp.  
> Otherwise, just the user-defined dialog of Npp would be sufficient.  
> Click-and-tag, tooltips ... these make for real user-friendliness.

True enough. I agree that a GUI would be really great.

> Thanks for the criticism and
> 
> Best wishes
> Idris

Take care and good luck with the book! I'll probably get a copy myself.


-- 
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Martin Schröder]

2011/8/15 Kip Warner :
> On Sun, 2011-08-14 at 16:39 -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي
> حامد wrote:
>> unicode, bidi is just a non-starter. TeXWorks has a long way to go, and
>> although I'm a fan of Qt its open-type implementation is buggy; so some
>> Arabic-monospaced fonts don't show up correctly.
>
> It's actually an even worse choice than Npp in the sense that, not only
> is it available only for Windows, it's non-free.

Are we both talking about http://code.google.com/p/texworks/ ? Because
that's free (GPLv2) and runs on Windows, OSX and Linux.

Best
   Martin
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Herbert Voss]

Am 15.08.2011 08:42, schrieb Martin Schröder:

2011/8/15 Kip Warner:

On Sun, 2011-08-14 at 16:39 -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي
حامد wrote:

unicode, bidi is just a non-starter. TeXWorks has a long way to go, and
although I'm a fan of Qt its open-type implementation is buggy; so some
Arabic-monospaced fonts don't show up correctly.


It's actually an even worse choice than Npp in the sense that, not only
is it available only for Windows, it's non-free.


Are we both talking about http://code.google.com/p/texworks/ ? Because
that's free (GPLv2) and runs on Windows, OSX and Linux.


and comes with a ready made ConTeXt configuration ...

Herbert
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[luigi scarso]

2011/8/15 Kip Warner :
> I'm not disagreeing with you that Npp might be great for beginnings, I'm
> just saying that many beginners can't use it because it isn't available
> for their operating system.
Under linux Wine sometimes does a great job.

-- 
luigi
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Taco Hoekwater]

On 08/15/2011 09:16 AM, luigi scarso wrote:

2011/8/15 Kip Warner:

I'm not disagreeing with you that Npp might be great for beginnings, I'm
just saying that many beginners can't use it because it isn't available
for their operating system.

Under linux Wine sometimes does a great job.

I, for one, am not willing to start wine to run something as basic as a 
text editor.

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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On 08/15/2011 09:16 AM, luigi scarso wrote:

Under linux Wine sometimes does a great job.


*If* the linux user happens to have 150 bucks and thinks it's a good 
idea to give that to Microsoft. No thanks. It's of course way too early 
to say anything about a project that I haven't seen a single line of, 
but tying it to an editor which is not cross-platform strikes me as a 
poor choice. And from what I see on this list, I'm not sure winblows 
users are the majority.


Thomas


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[luigi scarso]

On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 9:20 AM, Taco Hoekwater  wrote:
> On 08/15/2011 09:16 AM, luigi scarso wrote:
>>
>> 2011/8/15 Kip Warner:
>>>
>>> I'm not disagreeing with you that Npp might be great for beginnings, I'm
>>> just saying that many beginners can't use it because it isn't available
>>> for their operating system.
>>
>> Under linux Wine sometimes does a great job.
>>
> I, for one, am not willing to start wine to run something as basic as a text
> editor.
All this and much more, for ConTeXt.
-- 
luigi
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 09:20, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
>
> And
> from what I see on this list, I'm not sure winblows users are the majority.

According to statistics of distribution downloads (just counting
unique IPs, so not absolutely accurate), windows users amount to
17-20% downloads. Wiki gets 46% of windows users.

(I'm worried a bit about the high discrepancy in numbers, in
particular if you keep in mind that many might be using TeX Live under
Linux, bundled with their distribution, however ConTeXt doesn't even
work on MikTeX.)

Mojca
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Florian Wobbe]

> According to statistics of distribution downloads (just counting
> unique IPs, so not absolutely accurate), windows users amount to
> 17-20% downloads. Wiki gets 46% of windows users.

Have you ever googled for something context related? You end up mostly with 
false positives because "context" can appear just in any context. I wonder if 
all those windows hits are from people who searched for any other "context" and 
ended up on the wiki by mistake...

Florian

> (I'm worried a bit about the high discrepancy in numbers, in
> particular if you keep in mind that many might be using TeX Live under
> Linux, bundled with their distribution, however ConTeXt doesn't even
> work on MikTeX.)
> 
> Mojca

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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On 08/15/2011 09:46 AM, Florian Wobbe wrote:

Have you ever googled for something context related? You end up mostly with false positives because 
"context" can appear just in any context. I wonder if all those windows hits are from 
people who searched for any other "context" and ended up on the wiki by mistake...


And, being true windows users, take 30 minutes to figure out they're on 
the wrong page :-)


Thomas
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Hans Hagen]

On 15-8-2011 9:51, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:

On 08/15/2011 09:46 AM, Florian Wobbe wrote:

Have you ever googled for something context related? You end up mostly
with false positives because "context" can appear just in any context.
I wonder if all those windows hits are from people who searched for
any other "context" and ended up on the wiki by mistake...


And, being true windows users, take 30 minutes to figure out they're on
the wrong page :-)


that's because we cannot afford to pay for ending up at the top (try 
apple: no hit for the fruit on first google search)


Hans



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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Martin Schröder]

2011/8/15 Florian Wobbe :
> Have you ever googled for something context related? You end up mostly with 
> false positives because "context" can appear just in any context.

They even have their own conference: http://context-11.teco.edu :-)

Best
   Martin
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

Dear Knights,

A lot of the criticism seems to miss the point :-)

Part of the aim of the Book is to bring in new users, most of us here  
already know what we're doing. And M$-Windows dominates the marketplace  
for better or for worse.


I want to break out of the usual paradigm of presenting TeX and try  
something new and fresh. I want to give ConTeXt to my (or your) secretary,  
not just to geeks like most of us. I want to get them rolling as smoothly  
as possible. Telling a total newbie to go find one's own editor is not  
going to expand the ConTeXt ecosystem very efficiently.


As I said, the Book will not be "tied" to an editor. But I will use one as  
a way of easing the way for the maximum number of total non-geeks to get  
involved with ConTeXt. That's part of the vision I have.


To realize that vision, at this point I need some help writing and  
compiling lexer code, which I really don't want to have to learn to do  
myself; I simply don't have the time and would rather concentrate my  
skills more efficiently.


I hope one of you out there will help me :-):-):-)

Best wishes
Idris
--
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Pontus Lurcock]

On Mon 15 Aug 2011, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:

> On 08/15/2011 09:16 AM, luigi scarso wrote:
>> Under linux Wine sometimes does a great job.
>
> *If* the linux user happens to have 150 bucks and thinks it's a good  
> idea to give that to Microsoft.

Huh? I've been using Wine for a while (though not for Notepad++) and
have not yet received a bill from Microsoft...

Pont
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Pablo Rodríguez]

On 08/15/2011 11:51 AM, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس   سماوي حامد wrote:
> Dear Knights,
> 
> A lot of the criticism seems to miss the point :-)
> 
> Part of the aim of the Book is to bring in new users, most of us here  
> already know what we're doing. And M$-Windows dominates the marketplace  
> for better or for worse.
> 
> I want to break out of the usual paradigm of presenting TeX and try  
> something new and fresh. I want to give ConTeXt to my (or your) secretary,  
> not just to geeks like most of us. I want to get them rolling as smoothly  
> as possible. Telling a total newbie to go find one's own editor is not  
> going to expand the ConTeXt ecosystem very efficiently.
> 
> As I said, the Book will not be "tied" to an editor. But I will use one as  
> a way of easing the way for the maximum number of total non-geeks to get  
> involved with ConTeXt. That's part of the vision I have.

Hi Idris,

I'm a ConTeXt newbie (although I have been using LaTeX for 10 years).

I'd use TeXworks as the editor, since it is available for Windows,
Macintosh and Linux. And it can be installed with TeXLive (and updated
with TLContrib). Remember: one install to rule them all ;-).

So you avoid having to implement lexer scripting.

BTW, I guess you plan to release the book under standard copyright
license, do you? (Just asking.)

Just in case it helps,


Pablo
-- 
http://www.ousia.tk
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

Hi Pablo,

On Mon, 15 Aug 2011 05:30:42 -0600, Pablo Rodríguez  wrote:


I'd use TeXworks as the editor


So would I, except that TeXWorks is not as rich in the features I'd like,
nor does it handle arabic-script as well as needed.

Believe me, I've looked at just about every option out there :-)

The functionality I can extract from Npp gives a pedagogical advantage
that's important for what I'm trying to achieve. For example, dbl-click a
word and get a context-menu that allows you to tag that word without
typing braces. I can even assign a shortcut so that I can tag a word and,
eg, emphasize it without typing. Or type a ConTeXt command and get a list
of options so you don't have to look at the manual.

As a a pedagogical tool for newcomers Npp has things like this. Techies
can of course choose what suits them. But I want to be able to tell my
classes: "All assignments must be done in ConTeXt" and make it easy for
them to do that. We're not at that point yet but that's the holy grail.

Best wishes
Idris

--
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

On Mon, 15 Aug 2011 06:38:42 -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس   سماوي حامد  
 wrote:



The functionality I can extract from Npp gives a pedagogical advantage
that's important for what I'm trying to achieve. For example, dbl-click a
word and get a context-menu that allows you to tag that word without
typing braces. I can even assign a shortcut so that I can tag a word and,
eg, emphasize it without typing. Or type a ConTeXt command and get a list
of options so you don't have to look at the manual.


Take a look at this:

http://tinypic.com/r/andfsn/7

In addition to the ConTeXt functionality note the new Arabic add-on to  
lm-mono, so for the first time we'll have an actually useful Arabic mono  
font where one can edit vowels etc. Unfortunately the opentype engine in,  
e.g., TeXWorks cannot handle the GSUB table properly.


Best wishes
Idris
--
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Martin Schröder]

2011/8/15 Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس   سماوي حامد :
> Believe me, I've looked at just about every option out there :-)

I believe you. And I think the editor is a typical bikeshed. :-)
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Parkinson%27s_Law_of_Triviality

I applaud your efforts.

What's the planned release date?
Will you include software?

Best
   Martin
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Arthur Reutenauer]

> Are we both talking about http://code.google.com/p/texworks/ ? Because
> that's free (GPLv2) and runs on Windows, OSX and Linux.

  I guess Kip meant WinEdt.

Arthur
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

Hi Martin,

On Mon, 15 Aug 2011 08:35:24 -0600, Martin Schröder   
wrote:



2011/8/15 Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس   سماوي حامد :

Believe me, I've looked at just about every option out there :-)


I believe you. And I think the editor is a typical bikeshed. :-)
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Parkinson%27s_Law_of_Triviality


LOL, I think you're right :-)


I applaud your efforts.


I greatly appreciate that!


What's the planned release date?


Depends on the publisher, but there's no contract yet. If they pass on the  
chapters I send them, I'll self-publish it somehow.



Will you include software?


That's the plan, and the editor fits into that idea as well.

Best wishes
Idris
--
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Mon, 2011-08-15 at 08:42 +0200, Martin Schröder wrote:
> Are we both talking about http://code.google.com/p/texworks/ ? Because
> that's free (GPLv2) and runs on Windows, OSX and Linux.
> 
> Best
>Martin

Hey Martin. I meant WinEdt. Sorry for the ambiguity.

-- 
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Mon, 2011-08-15 at 09:20 +0200, Taco Hoekwater wrote:
> I, for one, am not willing to start wine to run something as basic as a 
> text editor.

My sentiments precisely.

-- 
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Mon, 2011-08-15 at 09:20 +0200, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
> *If* the linux user happens to have 150 bucks and thinks it's a good 
> idea to give that to Microsoft. No thanks. It's of course way too early 
> to say anything about a project that I haven't seen a single line of, 
> but tying it to an editor which is not cross-platform strikes me as a 
> poor choice. And from what I see on this list, I'm not sure winblows 
> users are the majority.
> 
> Thomas

Agreed.

-- 
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Mon, 2011-08-15 at 03:51 -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي
حامد wrote:
> And M$-Windows dominates the marketplace  
> for better or for worse.

Hey Idris. I think what the folks here are saying is that that's not
necessarily true - for ConTeXt.

-- 
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

Hi Kip,

On Mon, 15 Aug 2011 12:43:40 -0600, Kip Warner  wrote:


And M$-Windows dominates the marketplace
for better or for worse.



Hey Idris. I think what the folks here are saying is that that's not
necessarily true - for ConTeXt.


Yes!! That's _exactly_ the challenge! My vision is for ConTeXt to break  
out of the shell!


:-)

Best wishes
Idris
--
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Kip Warner]

On Mon, 2011-08-15 at 13:16 -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي
حامد wrote:
> 
> Yes!! That's _exactly_ the challenge! My vision is for ConTeXt to
> break  
> out of the shell! 

Best of luck to you. We all look forward to reading the book when done.
=)

-- 
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com


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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Russell Urquhart]

On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 01:16:55PM -0600, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس   سماوي حامد 
wrote:
> Yes!! That's _exactly_ the challenge! My vision is for ConTeXt to break  
> out of the shell!
>
> :-)
>
> Best wishes
> Idris
> -- 

Hi Idris,

As a tech writer for 27+ years, who is a recent Context newbie, I applaud your 
efforts and wish you the best. I just recently have been in the middle of a 
paradigm change myself, going from Xywrite on the PC to trying to learn and use 
Context and using vim/gvim as my editor. 

Back in 1988 or so, when i was employed at TI, we were tasked with trying to 
get people to use the then new Ventura Publisher for creating documents, etc. 
This was all pre- Windows. As a result of that i can understand your concern 
for having a complete system in place for your new users. Everything has to be 
in place.

I too look forward to your book. I also look forward to seeing some examples 
using an Arabic font. My wife is Persian so I've gained an appreciation for 
typography with regard to this language also. The fact that Context as well as 
Vim could handle these fonts well were factors in my trying to learn them.

Keep up the good work.


Russ
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt Book: Request for help!

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

On Tue, 16 Aug 2011 19:07:55 -0600, Russell Urquhart  
 wrote:



As a tech writer for 27+ years, who is a recent Context newbie, I  
applaud your efforts and wish you the best. I just recently have been in  
the middle of a paradigm change myself, going from Xywrite on the PC to  
trying to learn and use Context and using vim/gvim as my editor.


Back in 1988 or so, when i was employed at TI, we were tasked with  
trying to get people to use the then new Ventura Publisher for creating  
documents, etc. This was all pre- Windows. As a result of that i can  
understand your concern for having a complete system in place for your  
new users. Everything has to be in place.


I too look forward to your book. I also look forward to seeing some  
examples using an Arabic font. My wife is Persian so I've gained an  
appreciation for typography with regard to this language also. The fact  
that Context as well as Vim could handle these fonts well were factors  
in my trying to learn them.


Keep up the good work.


Thank you very kindly for the words of encouragement!!!

:-)

Best wishes
Idris

--
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shīʿī Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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