Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
Martin Paljak wrote: On Sep 12, 2010, at 8:42 PM, Peter Koch wrote: I got two testcards from certgate in 2008. One was java-based and one contained a TCOS3-chip. They were planning to offer an ifd-handler for linux. Since OpenSC has TCOS3 support this microSD-card might work in combination with PCSClite and a vendor supplied ifd-handler. I think the most important piece that is missing is indeed the ifd-handler. If the microSD interface will be vendor specific, there will be a need for something like OpenCT, which will not be very nice. Something similar to what CCID is for USB is needed for microSD, so that support could exist without (binary only) vendor drivers. If there will be multiple vendors who provide such conformant microSD cards, the problem of the on-card OS or applet will be similar to what OpenSC currently faces. If there is no on-line provisioning support the scheme will fail anyway. Anders ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
Martin Paljak wrote: If the microSD interface will be vendor specific, I think it is, sorta. there will be a need for something like OpenCT, which will not be very nice. Yes. Something similar to what CCID is for USB is needed for microSD, so that support could exist without (binary only) vendor drivers. Two problems: 1. System SD access OS specific. I don't know if supported OpenSC systems other than Linux even has an SD API. In any case it's not compatible. 2. Card access over above SD access This is the protocol I think you refer to. SD seems more like PCMCIA than USB so I'd be quite surprised if there was any standardization effort for these microSD cards, even if they perform similar tasks. //Peter ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
Hi Andre! Have a look at: http://www.certgate.com/index.php?id=71 Certgate was the first company that offered smart cards built into microSD cards. I got two testcards from certgate in 2008. One was java-based and one contained a TCOS3-chip. They were planning to offer an ifd-handler for linux. Since OpenSC has TCOS3 support this microSD-card might work in combination with PCSClite and a vendor supplied ifd-handler. Giesecke Devrient no offers microSD smart cards as well but I have no idea what card operating system they use and wether they support linux or not. Peter ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
Hello Andre, Yes we can provide you with microSD cards that have our MyEID applet on them. Currently you also need a SDK to be able to integrate the card to your application. Currently there is no linux ifd-handler available. To be able to communicate with the card, you need a library that is only available in the card manufacturers SDK. The card supports common PKI standards, just like the standard MyEID card. While the demand for these kind of microSD cards is very limited, the purchase of a SDK and implementing the software you want is currently the only approach we can offer you. The SDK's library is supported on Windows, Windows Mobile, Android, Symbian and Linux. Best Regards, Toni -Original Message- From: Andre Zepezauer [mailto:andre.zepeza...@student.uni-halle.de] Sent: 1. syyskuuta 2010 21:51 To: Aventra development Cc: opensc-devel Subject: MyEID microSD Hello Toni, by visiting the webshop of Aventra I have noticed, that there is a smart card in microSD format in there portfolio. I have been looking for such a device for a while, but haven't found a supplier so far. Are you able to provide some more information on it. Most important to me is the existence of an ifd-handler for Linux. Kind Regards Andre ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 13:34 +0300, Aventra development wrote: Hello Andre, Yes we can provide you with microSD cards that have our MyEID applet on them. Currently you also need a SDK to be able to integrate the card to your application. Currently there is no linux ifd-handler available. To be able to communicate with the card, you need a library that is only available in the card manufacturers SDK. The card supports common PKI standards, just like the standard MyEID card. While the demand for these kind of microSD cards is very limited, the purchase of a SDK and implementing the software you want is currently the only approach we can offer you. The SDK's library is supported on Windows, Windows Mobile, Android, Symbian and Linux. Hello Toni, it's hard to imagine that the demand of these devices is still so limited, because they fit nicely into every laptop/netbook with SD card slot. A lot better than every usb key or smart card. With the availability of an ifd-handler and support form opensc it would be an easy to use plug and play solution. The whole host side software is already in place with the exception of the idf-handler. That's sad. I would really like to replace my usb key with a SD card. I keep waiting, until someone provides an easy to deploy solution. Development of custom applications (when got this right) isn't an option to me. Kind Regards Andre Best Regards, Toni -Original Message- From: Andre Zepezauer [mailto:andre.zepeza...@student.uni-halle.de] Sent: 1. syyskuuta 2010 21:51 To: Aventra development Cc: opensc-devel Subject: MyEID microSD Hello Toni, by visiting the webshop of Aventra I have noticed, that there is a smart card in microSD format in there portfolio. I have been looking for such a device for a while, but haven't found a supplier so far. Are you able to provide some more information on it. Most important to me is the existence of an ifd-handler for Linux. Kind Regards Andre ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
Hello, On Sep 2, 2010, at 4:44 PM, Andre Zepezauer wrote: it's hard to imagine that the demand of these devices is still so limited, because they fit nicely into every laptop/netbook with SD card slot. A lot better than every usb key or smart card. With the availability of an ifd-handler and support form opensc it would be an easy to use plug and play solution. The whole host side software is already in place with the exception of the idf-handler. That's sad. I believe the reason why smart cards exist is their common, agreed upon form factor and the existence of related infrastructure pieces. Like pinpad smart card readers. For permanent built-in crypto operations, the TPM chip should be the most hip thing currently (at least it was for a while, I don't know the exact status of TPM deployment on desktop machines). For pluggable devices, USB is still more relevant than SD. My laptop does not have a SD card slot but I don't know a laptop without USB. I think one of the main driving forces of (micro)SD based crypto tokens is the smartphone market [1]. Even though smartphones already contain a smart card (SIM) it is very hard/almost impossible to deploy SIM cards with crypto capabilities on larger scale because of the greedy ignorant bastard named mobile operator. [1] http://code.google.com/p/seek-for-android/ -- Martin Paljak @martinpaljak.net +3725156495 ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 17:05 +0300, Martin Paljak wrote: Hello, On Sep 2, 2010, at 4:44 PM, Andre Zepezauer wrote: it's hard to imagine that the demand of these devices is still so limited, because they fit nicely into every laptop/netbook with SD card slot. A lot better than every usb key or smart card. With the availability of an ifd-handler and support form opensc it would be an easy to use plug and play solution. The whole host side software is already in place with the exception of the idf-handler. That's sad. I believe the reason why smart cards exist is their common, agreed upon form factor and the existence of related infrastructure pieces. Like pinpad smart card readers. Pinpad readers (like all external readers) are good for desktop and office PCs. In the netbook market they will never become the equipment of choice. Furthermore there are so many people don't having a desktop PC but something portable. Even if there portables never leave there desk. For those people (including me) smarter solutions would be more appealing than the [age old] infrastructure pieces. For permanent built-in crypto operations, the TPM chip should be the most hip thing currently (at least it was for a while, I don't know the exact status of TPM deployment on desktop machines). That's exactly what I want: permanent built-in crypto. If not soldered on the board, then with good integration at least. For pluggable devices, USB is still more relevant than SD. My laptop does not have a SD card slot but I don't know a laptop without USB. I think one of the main driving forces of (micro)SD based crypto tokens is the smartphone market [1]. Even though smartphones already contain a smart card (SIM) it is very hard/almost impossible to deploy SIM cards with crypto capabilities on larger scale because of the greedy ignorant bastard named mobile operator. [1] http://code.google.com/p/seek-for-android/ ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
Helo, On Sep 2, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Andre Zepezauer wrote: On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 17:05 +0300, Martin Paljak wrote: I believe the reason why smart cards exist is their common, agreed upon form factor and the existence of related infrastructure pieces. Like pinpad smart card readers. Pinpad readers (like all external readers) are good for desktop and office PCs. In the netbook market they will never become the equipment of choice. Furthermore there are so many people don't having a desktop PC but something portable. Even if there portables never leave there desk. For those people (including me) smarter solutions would be more appealing than the [age old] infrastructure pieces. Some of those people (like me) have a pinpad reader on office dest and a pinpad reader at home for doing some operations with some cards (like changing the PIN when I feel like i have to). And a portable reader for the time on the road. But as you say below, we probably need (and talk about) totally different things. Yes, there are other smarter solutions, both technology and business-wise. One of them was Mr. Jobs with the micro SIM move, who created a whole new niche market of micro SIM cutters and mini SIM micro SIM envelopes. Of course there remains the argument, that how often do you need to take a SIM out from the phone and put it somewhere else... But I could understand the grief of someone who broke his phone and would like to take some other phone as a replacement and use the same SIM card.. darn! For permanent built-in crypto operations, the TPM chip should be the most hip thing currently (at least it was for a while, I don't know the exact status of TPM deployment on desktop machines). That's exactly what I want: permanent built-in crypto. If not soldered on the board, then with good integration at least. Then buy your next portable with a TPM and check out http://trousers.sourceforge.net/ -- Martin Paljak @martinpaljak.net +3725156495 ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 18:20 +0300, Martin Paljak wrote: Helo, On Sep 2, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Andre Zepezauer wrote: On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 17:05 +0300, Martin Paljak wrote: I believe the reason why smart cards exist is their common, agreed upon form factor and the existence of related infrastructure pieces. Like pinpad smart card readers. Pinpad readers (like all external readers) are good for desktop and office PCs. In the netbook market they will never become the equipment of choice. Furthermore there are so many people don't having a desktop PC but something portable. Even if there portables never leave there desk. For those people (including me) smarter solutions would be more appealing than the [age old] infrastructure pieces. Some of those people (like me) have a pinpad reader on office dest and a pinpad reader at home for doing some operations with some cards (like changing the PIN when I feel like i have to). And a portable reader for the time on the road. But as you say below, we probably need (and talk about) totally different things. Yes, there are other smarter solutions, both technology and business-wise. One of them was Mr. Jobs with the micro SIM move, who created a whole new niche market of micro SIM cutters and mini SIM micro SIM envelopes. Of course there remains the argument, that how often do you need to take a SIM out from the phone and put it somewhere else... But I could understand the grief of someone who broke his phone and would like to take some other phone as a replacement and use the same SIM card.. darn! For permanent built-in crypto operations, the TPM chip should be the most hip thing currently (at least it was for a while, I don't know the exact status of TPM deployment on desktop machines). That's exactly what I want: permanent built-in crypto. If not soldered on the board, then with good integration at least. Then buy your next portable with a TPM and check out http://trousers.sourceforge.net/ And when this portable brakes, can I use the TPM (with keys on it) in a replacement part? ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
Re: [opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 15:44 +0200, Andre Zepezauer wrote: it's hard to imagine that the demand of these devices is still so limited, because they fit nicely into every laptop/netbook with SD card slot. A lot better than every usb key or smart card. The format of crypto devices, whether it be smartcard, USB token or SD card is secondary. IMHO, the relatively low demand for hardware encryption devices is the result of history: When smartcards were invented, patents did a lot of harm to the technology, driving cost up and technology down. During years, the market was only banks and large companies. In the past years, the ability to store keys pairs in so-called secure software stores, like Iceweasel or Internet Explorer, is offering a low-cost solution to the end-users. In marketing, the bad product kills the good one. The solution for selling encryption devices is not hardware, we already have very good hardware around. The solution is software and integration in the key management systems of OSes: Seahorse, Gnome-Keyring, Network Managers, Apple Keychain. We should make GUIs to manage smartcards and have better integration. -- Jean-Michel Pouré - Gooze - http://www.gooze.eu smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
[opensc-devel] MyEID microSD
Hello Toni, by visiting the webshop of Aventra I have noticed, that there is a smart card in microSD format in there portfolio. I have been looking for such a device for a while, but haven't found a supplier so far. Are you able to provide some more information on it. Most important to me is the existence of an ifd-handler for Linux. Kind Regards Andre ___ opensc-devel mailing list opensc-devel@lists.opensc-project.org http://www.opensc-project.org/mailman/listinfo/opensc-devel
