[OGD] Stuff and Worker Bird
Loved the Worker Bird. I think that sometimes we all get too caught up in the "politically correct" and forget that there are sentiments that are worth expressing. Susan Taylor ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] "... Jesus himself often quoted from the Old Testament, therefore I believe it is safe to assume that he believed it, literally!"
For days I struggled to say out of (Theistic or No) Evolution/Creation (Creationism) but +7 oz of wine makes for great profundity, verbosity of style and a presumption that the orchid - this world's most complete of all plants - is one damn fine expression of creation reality and yes, Faith (not religion). If anyone wants to discuss the difference between Faith (Caps) and religion (lowercase) please feel free to go off OGD. Be warned/informed - Credentials seem very important with some in this group so: I attended 17 years of Catholic schools to include taking (except 6 hours in 'Sacramental Practicum' - or how we used to say - "How to do 'the Magic.'") all the required ordination courses at a Seminary. Formal Catholic training by Nuns, Brothers and Priests would be a couple years more but Dad was stationed in Germany following W.W.II and my tutor was more interested in 'bartering' cigarettes with my mother than offering wisdom in Catholicism ... or math for that matter. Added comment: Don't know why - but it seemed very important to a 'Village Priest in the middle of Indiana' who didn't find it necessary for me to attend Pre-Marriage Instruction - I was 'privately' confirmed by the Cardinal of Vienna. Hopefully everyone is impressed --- or as President Bush says, "In shock and awe." Sharon, Don't mean to 'pick on' you. Your comment just offered the springboard for what has been building. I invite anyone who does not accept my belief in some form of a Supreme Force to go off-line. I have no illusion that either of us will change our beliefs but I will gain from you comments. As to the rest and I do mean 'THE REST' ... isn't it really 'just religion' rather than Faith? I often quote from 'Through the Looking Glass' by Lewis Carroll but I don't literally believe everything that is in it. 'The time has come,' the Walrus said, 'To talk of many things: Of shoes - and ships - and sealing-wax - Of cabbages - and kings - And why the sea is boiling hot - And whether pigs have wings.' Why is it "safe to assume that he (Jesus) believed it (the OT), literally" simply because He quoted from it? A logical(?) extension, "There were many things in the OT that Jesus did not literally believe because he did not quote them." 'Assume' - possibly the most dangerous of words and also a most fun --- 'What do you call it when you break it down into its parts?' Creation Evolution??? (Note that I do not say Creationism which I consider to be a religious term which may or may not be valid but some find of great value.) Creation Evolution??? Creation IS so that evolution MAY BE. Consider: An intelligent Being/Force imaged a physical universe and it formed - was - came to be. The Being (I think it much, much to limiting to say He or She and especially It) posses(ed)(es) - all at the same time - perfect/whole/complete Knowledge. The Being gifted this created but formless universe with a set of rules. Some choose to call them the Natural Law but I like to think of them as The Master 'Do-It-Yourself/Put-It-Together' Manual. An assembly manual so complete; but, at the same time imaginative and flexible, that the universe was, in time and over time, free to form all sorts of things/creatures. Things and creatures that we (The Arrogant Human) can only guess about. I find this concept TRULY awesome and APPROPRIATELY respectful of the sublime limitlessness of The Being. The whole idea is exciting! Talk about WISDOM. Please don't see this as in anyway limiting the significance of God directly acting in forming The Man, Adam. It is so much more. God KNEW!! Knew what was to be and billions of years ago set Knowledge into motion. A 'System --- The PLAN' that would one day allow for the gradual forming of the human AND ALLOWED FOR THE GRADUAL FORMING OF WHAT IS TO COME AT SOME FUTURE TIME. I think to say otherwise simply expresses human pride and insults the Being because in our arrogance we presume to place limits on Limitless Imagination. Scary and exciting and sort of fun -- all at the same time. What is to be??? One of the creatures that 'formed - evolved' from this imaged original plan is uniquely gifted. Unique in that it is the only one (so far known in all others) that has this gift/skill. The gift is the ability to choose to say "Yes" to the Creator's gratuitous (we did not earn it) offer of relationship. Sadly, some humans reject the gift and say "No" to this sublime invitation of relationship. Some religions (including the one to which I am a member) choose to label this 'Sin' but I see it more as waste - something that is the antithesis of the plan of the Creating Being --- something not in 'appropriate' balance with The Plan. Each creature was/is/to be from the Mind-Will-Love of the Creator. As the result of this gift the human is more complex BUT does not have greater value than any
[OGD] Re: Artificial lighting period
-- Message: 4 Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 19:30:23 -0500 From: "MaryLou Porlick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [OGD] Lengh of growing days To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Dear friends, Those of you who mostly have to grow under artificial lights may be missing the realities of real day length. When our sun starts to 'come up' it is way over on the south eastern horizen and does not intensify for quite a while so the plants cannot get the full effect of photosynthesis early in the day. The sun does not come on as when you click a light switch. Your plant lights do. Then at sunset the light drops gradually, sometimes hastened by clouds and rain squalls preventing light from reaching plant leaves. Commercial greenhouses align their growing areas to take full advantage of day length but some of us have to make do with our small city lots. In winter, as of now, the sun is coming almost from the horizen of the south at a sharp angle. This is when C. trianae blooms in Miami, usually Dec. C. skinneri and aurantiaca come later in late Feb. or March again depending somewhat on clouds, rain etc changing the light as well as the slightly lengthening day and the sun starting to raise a little over that southern horizen. All this happens very gradually then BOOM suddenly the sun is directly overhead and it is summer! And we have days that last until 8PM. All those summer blooming Catts. suddenly throw blooms from their fresh green sheaths, while the skinneris will develop dried brown sheath from their new growths and wait until the next spring. It kind of works like clockwork but with slight variations each year. The plants are reacting to very slight changes in their environment which include the angle of the sun, the intensity as well as the hours per day of light and the temperature. I do hope our drops to in the 40's this week don't hurt my 'chids. Can't protect them, they are on their own. It does seem that a lot of people have lights on the Catts. for too long in number of hours but maybe not strong enough light when it is on. There are complaints that Catts are hard to bloom and I believe that slight changes would help them. Right now Bob figured out we get 10 hours 57 minutes of daylight counting sunrise to sunset, but the workable sun hours are somewhat less and the sun in Miami is very intense even in winter during the middle of the day. Good blooming and a cosy warm winter to all, Mary Lou/Miami Hello to all, I live in Oklahoma City, U.S.A. All of my orchids are grown in octagon shaped Cedar baskets. In the summer time they reside outside in trees in my yard where they get morning and late evening sun and are shaded from the scorching mid day sun. In the winter they come inside under banks of 6500K florescent lights in a room in my house. These lights are triggered from what I call a reverse photo cell, it turns on the lights when the sun is about one hour above the horizon and off about one hour before the sun sets. My collection is small, mainly species and I have no problem blooming them. Some bloom in the summer and some in the winter. A moderate amount of light comes from windows with the lighting being supplemental. The temperature is allowed to go as low as 60F at night if it will, and up to 80F in the daytime. Before putting the lights on the photocell and instead using fixed timers the plants were not "happy" and would often refuse to flower. The photo periodical lighting has definitely helped my orchids. I enjoy this forum and have for many years, despite the sometimes ranting of a few members. While hoping not to ignite a "flame", I would like to say ... "Merry Christmas to all, and to all a good night". Richard Scanned by Norton anti-Virus 2005 ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] Thank you, Oliver
Oliver wrote, Happy Holiday - but what of all the unemployed, for whom this is just another day of capitalist tyranny? Thanks for remembering us, Oliver. I can choose to have a happy holiday in spite of capitalist greed. Even some orchid vendors seem to believe that unemployed orchid growers can buy their goods. Think again. Harv Seattle ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] Paphiopedilum pollination
I found this site: http://www.orchideenvermehrung.at/cgi-local/framebreaker/reload.pl? english/seed%20germination/getting%20seeds.htm click on "Paphiopedilum". The key is placing the pollen on the 'X' part (stigma) which lies under the shield (the thick fleshy part that is centered in the middle of the flower- look at the picture, you'll see what I am trying to say). Will ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] Evolution / creation of orchid names...
"In Singapore last week on a five-day visit for the Biology In Asia International Conference, Dr Goodall ... found time to ... have an orchid named after her (spathoglottis Jane Goodall, a yellow-and-purple bloom)" source : http://thestar.com.my/lifestyle/story.asp?file=/2004/12/14/features/9620782&sec=features *** Regards, Viateur ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] Re: Dennis/Evolution
Dear Dennis, Thank you for your message on the matter. I almost meant to write one myself, but yours comes across much clearer! What still surprises me is how people are using "religion" to further their own ends. I would greatly appreciate it if people who do lip service to their religions would deepen their knowledge through study and thinking. The Old Testament was never meant to be taken literally. It was a collection of myths, history, sanitary advice, and record of life of the wandering Jews in the Middle East. Christ gave the world the New Testament to replace the Old. He wanted to put emphasis on love, empathy, and forgiveness. The Old Testament is only meant for symbolic interpretation. This new round of fundamentalist thinking based on the fanatical and literal interpretation of the Old Testament is really frightening, as it is diametrically opposed to Christian beliefs. At the moment, we have an uncannily large population of people who think they are believers of their religions without knowing the basics of their religions at all. (This goes for more than just "Christians".) If Christ or Allah would know just how ignorant their current followers are... they would be frightened out of their wits. Darwin's theory on Evolution exists perfectly fine with the Christian God (and many other gods, too). This fresh attack against evolution in the name of Christ is a lot of igorance mobilized for political "capital". Thanks again for clearing up the issue. ;) Marianne PS - I think evolutionis absolutely relavent on an orchid forum: orchids are one of the best examples of the mechanics of evolution, and to refute evolution would be to throw into irrational chaos the entire family (it took long enough to sort them out!). ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] Re: Paph pollination photos
Hi Ron Like you, I have not managed to find any paph pollination photos on the web but there is a fair bit of written, video, and diagram info that you could maybe use. I think someone has mentioned this site recently, but here is the link again: http://www.cichlidrecipe.com/orchids/info_tutorials.asp It contains excellent on-line video tutorials including one on pollination of paphs. For good written info try Antec's site: http://ladyslipper.com/ftf.htm There are some really good photos here, although none of the actual pollenation process. You could also try Dr Tanaka's site which has diagrams of pollination and info on pollen storage: http://www.orchid.or.jp/orchid/research/tanaka/enseedling/ enseedling2.html I hope this is additional to the info you have already found, (or that it of interest to others in the group!) Cheers Kim AKL NZ, the other 'down under' Hi All. Is there a web site avaible that shows with photographs, how to pollinated Paphiopedilum orchids. Thanks in advance. Ron Boyd in sunny NSW Austrailia ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] A small request to de friends debating Evolution Vs Creationism
Please ...if you want to refer to the Supreme Creator of the scriptures written for the People of the Covenant use G-D do not write the full name: it is sacrilegious. TIA José ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] Re: Stuff
Please let's not have religious flame wars on an orchids channel. Next it will be whether mericlones are neoconservatives, or orchids are capitalist exploiters of trees. An equally off-topic point was made that: >A Pom is a slang term for someone of British decent. All British are by definition decent, but I think that the descent of the word was a ship-board abbreviation - Person of Means - to distinguish the individual from the rest of the human cargo, who were not. (Just like Port Out, Starboard Home, or 'posh', which bought you a cabin on the India ships that was in the shade on both legs of the journey.) Anyway, may I wish readers a Happy ... but what to say without insulting non-Christian readers.Um, then: how about Winter Solstice? No - think of the potential flames from touchy people in the Southern Hemisphere who are enduring their Summer solstice. So how about Happy Holiday - but what of all the unemployed, for whom this is just another day of capitalist tyranny? Well, please just read between the lines, and see here for a completely irrelevant but certifiably seculo-religious pan-global politically-sensitive card: www.chforum.org/xmas _ Oliver Sparrow Tel: UK (0)20 7736 9716 www.chforum.org www.treknepal.org www.datafreeze.com ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
[OGD] Connections between the Old and New Testaments....
I realize that this is off topic, but since its being discussed anywayFrom what I gather, what is regarded as the New Testament was compiled maybe 100 or so years after the death of Jesus, from the writings of the apostles ...apparently, there were many more gospels written than made it to the book...and most important, to me at least, from my Jewish perspective, are the differences from Jewish tradition...I believe, and I am no expert, but I have read a bit.that Paul (Saul of Tarsus) altered many Jewish traditions in order to expand the scope of Christ's teachings to the Gentiles. Originally, Christ's teachings were clearly and consistently within Jewish traditions. To make this a little more orchid-related...I am sure that Saul had some salep on his way to that road in DamascusTake care, Eric Muehlbauer celebrating the last night of Hanukkah on the coldest night of the winter so far... ___ the OrchidGuide Digest (OGD) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://orchidguide.com/mailman/listinfo/orchids_orchidguide.com
