[ozmidwifery] Twin births
Hi all, I'm just curious to hear what the proportion of vaginal births to CS is in other hospitals? I work in a tertiary, high risk Delivery Suite but vaginal birth is accepted as the default option for twins as long as the presenting twin is cephalic unless there is some problem that would indicate LSCS even in a singleton ( Placenta praevia etc). Also a comment I read, can't remember from whom, with in the last week or so about 38 weeks being the cut off date for twins- ours regularly go over 40 weeks in the absence of problems- and mostly, there aren't problems.Even our prem twins are born vaginally as the default option. I thought this was commonplace nowadays- no? Monica -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Twin births
Same here and we are level one. So long as presenting twin is cephalic everyone is happy to go for the vaginal option although they seem to be able to convince the mothers to agree to induction before term. Andrea Q On 07/07/2005, at 5:17 PM, mh wrote: Hi all, I'm just curious to hear what the proportion of vaginal births to CS is in other hospitals? I work in a tertiary, high risk Delivery Suite but vaginal birth is accepted as the default option for twins as long as the presenting twin is cephalic unless there is some problem that would indicate LSCS even in a singleton ( Placenta praevia etc). Also a comment I read, can't remember from whom, with in the last week or so about 38 weeks being the cut off date for twins- ours regularly go over 40 weeks in the absence of problems- and mostly, there aren't problems.Even our prem twins are born vaginally as the default option. I thought this was commonplace nowadays- no? Monica -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Homebirth of twins
Hi again Yvette and others, These babies weren't identical at all, although by ultrasound they were monochorionic diamniotic twins. My twins book says all monochorionic are identical so I am confused. My guidelines for twins at home have always been first baby head down, of even size and 37 weeks plus. This is the fourth set I have had prime care of - all have arrived head/head, after 37 weeks and pretty even in size. I am sure that setting clear guidelines to all involved makes a huge difference. Perhaps I sure try a time guideline as well!! This mum had an early u/sound, then chose to have another at 35 weeks to check for above criteria. (Totally her choice tho as I was quite clear of their position). The placenta, as attached, was very round - not obviously fused, but had a very thick fusion of membranes running down the centre. The cords were very different in size and length, and the placenta on baby#1 side was thick, and on baby#2 was thin and different coloured. I can't answer the question about the cervix - I only checked once and that was purely to stop my hair going greyer whilst I worried about position - I really didn't want a shoulder presentation... The assessment I did was about 5 hours after baby #1 and the cervix was nearly fully dilated. I guess I felt it was probably always at about that dilation. The contractions really didn't stop completely at any time, just weren't so strong for many hours, and definitely picked up in intensity whilst and after breastfeeding. The books say the intensity changes with the stretching and pressure of the presenting part coming into the vagina, so although she didn't exhibit transitional symptoms for all those hours, I think her cervix probably didn't alter much, but others may know more... As far as sharing the placenta goes, watching the mother's uterus reform around the second baby and placenta was pretty amazing and very obvious. It no doubt helped her uterine muscles to contract to the right size for the remaining one baby and large placenta. After baby # 2 was born, it then had less effort to contract again to expel the placenta whihc it did very efficiently, with minimal blood loss. I can imagine a very different scenario if baby # 2 was either forced through by oxytocin if her labour wasn't considered effective enough, or membranes broken and baby extracted by the end of the first hour ( or have we heard a much lesser time allowed between first and second babies?). This management would surely predispose a big bleed considering the enormous effort the uterus would have to make to contract quickly down around the now empty uterus always much to learn with every birth. Justine, you're amazing!! We'll look forward to your amazing story unfolding over the months. Just remember to really rest up and eat and drink well. Optimum health is a must for twins. Yvette, birth is a truly amazing journey each time. Birthing two can be a simple as one if you believe, prepare and have a solid team around you. Good luck and you are welcome to email me privately. I have attempted to post some pictures of the twins and their placenta, but it isn't working. I'll get my son onto it! Sue
RE: [ozmidwifery] Homebirth of twins
As I sit here with tears streaming, I just cant help but reply and thank you so much Sue for sharing this wonderful positive twin birth. I have in my 4 short years as a midwife, been involved with two women with twin pregnancies, and although both of them were fit, healthy, had great sized babies in good positions, were positive about birth, etc, the list goes on, unfortunately the outcomes for them were quite devastating, both with problems with twin#2. I have tried since then to remain positive and open minded about the possibility of twins being born vaginally, well and healthy, but my confidence in them being born at home has been completely shattered by these unfortunate experiences, by which Ive been deeply saddened. My colleague and I are now caring for a woman we have birthed with before who has twins this time, and I know that deep down in her heart she wants to birth at home, but neither of us can quite get the fear of our previous experiences out of the way in helping her to make the right decision for her. Your account of this birth has reinvigorated my quest to regain that faith and trust in birth. Thank you for that. Tania x From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Sue Cookson Sent: Thursday, 7 July 2005 5:55 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Homebirth of twins Hi again Yvette and others, These babies weren't identical at all, although by ultrasound they were monochorionic diamniotic twins. My twins book says all monochorionic are identical so I am confused. My guidelines for twins at home have always been first baby head down, of even size and 37 weeks plus. This is the fourth set I have had prime care of - all have arrived head/head, after 37 weeks and pretty even in size. I am sure that setting clear guidelines to all involved makes a huge difference. Perhaps I sure try a time guideline as well!! This mum had an early u/sound, then chose to have another at 35 weeks to check for above criteria. (Totally her choice tho as I was quite clear of their position). The placenta, as attached, was very round - not obviously fused, but had a very thick fusion of membranes running down the centre. The cords were very different in size and length, and the placenta on baby#1 side was thick, and on baby#2 was thin and different coloured. I can't answer the question about the cervix - I only checked once and that was purely to stop my hair going greyer whilst I worried about position - I really didn't want a shoulder presentation... The assessment I did was about 5 hours after baby #1 and the cervix was nearly fully dilated. I guess I felt it was probably always at about that dilation. The contractions really didn't stop completely at any time, just weren't so strong for many hours, and definitely picked up in intensity whilst and after breastfeeding. The books say the intensity changes with the stretching and pressure of the presenting part coming into the vagina, so although she didn't exhibit transitional symptoms for all those hours, I think her cervix probably didn't alter much, but others may know more... As far as sharing the placenta goes, watching the mother's uterus reform around the second baby and placenta was pretty amazing and very obvious. It no doubt helped her uterine muscles to contract to the right size for the remaining one baby and large placenta. After baby # 2 was born, it then had less effort to contract again to expel the placenta whihc it did very efficiently, with minimal blood loss. I can imagine a very different scenario if baby # 2 was either forced through by oxytocin if her labour wasn't considered effective enough, or membranes broken and baby extracted by the end of the first hour ( or have we heard a much lesser time allowed between first and second babies?). This management would surely predispose a big bleed considering the enormous effort the uterus would have to make to contract quickly down around the now empty uterus always much to learn with every birth. Justine, you're amazing!! We'll look forward to your amazing story unfolding over the months. Just remember to really rest up and eat and drink well. Optimum health is a must for twins. Yvette, birth is a truly amazing journey each time. Birthing two can be a simple as one if you believe, prepare and have a solid team around you. Good luck and you are welcome to email me privately. I have attempted to post some pictures of the twins and their placenta, but it isn't working. I'll get my son onto it! Sue
[ozmidwifery] London
I sincerely hope that the people from this list who are from London or have loved ones there are safe and not directly effected by these awful attacks on London. My heart goes out to all. Jo -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.10/43 - Release Date: 7/6/2005
RE: [ozmidwifery] Homebirth of twins
The last twin birth that I had the misfortune to be involved with was a few years ago. I had caught the first babe and the woman had been talked into all the interventions that you all know about. Then the OB (fairly obviously playing up to the crowd!) did an ARM with the second twin nowhere near the cx, could not bring a pole down, CTC plummeted and we had an emergency CS on our hands. Poor dad was left holding twin 1 as we raced away to OR. Baby was ok but I know in my heart that all that drama was not necessary. I tried to debrief them a little but the OB had 'saved' the baby. Cheers Judy --- Mary Murphy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: M limited observations of twins born in hospitals is that the drs try to manipulate the 2nd twin and cause problems in that way. I have only assisted at 3 sets of twins. one set born at home and two in low level hospitals. They were all born fine without manipulation by me, the drs outside the door of the labour room. Two at 38 weeks and one set at 401weeks. Leave them alone, they birth fine without intervention. MM From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tania Smallwood Sent: Thursday, 7 July 2005 5:58 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Homebirth of twins As I sit here with tears streaming, I just can't help but reply and thank you so much Sue for sharing this wonderful positive twin birth. I have in my 4 short years as a midwife, been involved with two women with twin pregnancies, and although both of them were fit, healthy, had great sized babies in good positions, were positive about birth, etc, the list goes on, unfortunately the outcomes for them were quite devastating, both with problems with twin#2. I have tried since then to remain positive and open minded about the possibility of twins being born vaginally, well and healthy, but my confidence in them being born at home has been completely shattered by these unfortunate experiences, by which I've been deeply saddened. My colleague and I are now caring for a woman we have birthed with before who has twins this time, and I know that deep down in her heart she wants to birth at home, but neither of us can quite get the fear of our previous experiences out of the way in helping her to make the right decision for her. Your account of this birth has reinvigorated my quest to regain that faith and trust in birth. Thank you for that. Tania x _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sue Cookson Sent: Thursday, 7 July 2005 5:55 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Homebirth of twins Hi again Yvette and others, These babies weren't identical at all, although by ultrasound they were monochorionic diamniotic twins. My twins book says all monochorionic are identical so I am confused. My guidelines for twins at home have always been first baby head down, of even size and 37 weeks plus. This is the fourth set I have had prime care of - all have arrived head/head, after 37 weeks and pretty even in size. I am sure that setting clear guidelines to all involved makes a huge difference. Perhaps I sure try a time guideline as well!! This mum had an early u/sound, then chose to have another at 35 weeks to check for above criteria. (Totally her choice tho as I was quite clear of their position). The placenta, as attached, was very round - not obviously fused, but had a very thick fusion of membranes running down the centre. The cords were very different in size and length, and the placenta on baby#1 side was thick, and on baby#2 was thin and different coloured. I can't answer the question about the cervix - I only checked once and that was purely to stop my hair going greyer whilst I worried about position - I really didn't want a shoulder presentation... The assessment I did was about 5 hours after baby #1 and the cervix was nearly fully dilated. I guess I felt it was probably always at about that dilation. The contractions really didn't stop completely at any time, just weren't so strong for many hours, and definitely picked up in intensity whilst and after breastfeeding. The books say the intensity changes with the stretching and pressure of the presenting part coming into the vagina, so although she didn't exhibit transitional symptoms for all those hours, I think her cervix probably didn't alter much, but others may know more... As far as sharing the placenta goes, watching the mother's uterus reform around the second baby and placenta was pretty amazing and very obvious. It no doubt helped her uterine muscles to contract to the right size for the remaining one baby and large placenta. After baby # 2 was born, it then had less effort to contract again to expel the placenta whihc it did very efficiently, with minimal blood loss. I can
RE: [ozmidwifery] Single Uterine Artery
Hi Everyone, I posted a few weeks back in regard to this as I had a SUA and was recommended my baby have an renal scan when a week old. Fortunately she did, as she did in fact have a urinary reflux. We actually saw a paediatric urologist last week as my bub (now 18 months) has had three UTI's despite being on antibiotics, and has kidney scarring due to the infections. He has recommended surgery and when I told him about the SUA he said babies who do have the reflux often have a SUA also. As I am right into the latest research about this condition I would be really interested if anyone knows of the latest info mentioned by Joy. cheers Kylie Carberry Freelance Journalist p: +61242970115 m: +612418220638 f: +61242970747From: "Joy Cocks" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auTo: "Ozmidwifery" ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: [ozmidwifery] Single Uterine ArteryDate: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 08:28:09 +1000Further to discussion a few weeks ago - according to a localobstetrician/ultrasonographer, previous information that SUA increases thelikelihood of renal anomalies has now been disproven and there is no needfor the baby to undergo renal ultrasound unless a problem presents. Sorry,I don't have any references, just word of mouth.JoyJoy Cocks RN (Div 1) RM CBE IBCLCBRIGHT Vic 3741email:[EMAIL PROTECTED]--This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] magnetic underlays babies
Dear Joanne, I have recently come into contact with someone who really believes in these magnets. I'm trying them out on my old knees as they got a bit wrecked a number of years ago with parvovirus and all the kneeling we do as a midwives is a bit tough on them . There is a store in Adelaide that sells them and on the brouchure a websit: www.bestfriendpainrelief.com.au the Email is: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For what its worth and as far as i can work out there would be no problem unless you used an electric blanket which would heat the magnets up too much for anyone really let alone a baby. Would love to know what u discover. cheers,marijke - Original Message - From: Mrs Joanne M Fisher To: Ozmidwifery Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 9:35 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] magnetic underlays babies Can anyone help me with this inquiry from a friend? Thanks. Cheers, Joanne "Do you know where I may find out whether magnetic underlays should be used where your baby may occasionally be fed in bed and sleep for a hour or two. I have searched the web but cant seem to find much" Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.1/28 - Release Date: 24/06/2005
Re: [ozmidwifery] just a thought - stickers for ICM
I think the sticker is a good idea, when i went to Oslo ICM there was an impromtu meeting of all midwives who did homebirths. We gathered together in one of the rooms and discussed where we were from and what our access for women having homebirth was. I met two Midwives from Holland and got a lift back to Amsterdam and saw there practice clinic. it was such a good connecting thing to do . maybe a meet the Ozmidders lunchcould be organised ? I am so looking forward to seeing everyone there lol Marijke - Original Message - From: Robyn Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 6:32 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] just a thought - stickers for ICM An OZMIDWIFERY STICKER attached to the Australian Akubara Hats would stand out in the crowd. Robyn -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andrea Robertson Sent: Friday, 1 July 2005 3:51 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] just a thought - stickers for ICM Hi Andrea Q, Yes, great idea! I'll get something organised - perhaps a star that could go on the name tags (you are all definitely gold star people) or something similar - come to the stand when you get there and I will make sure that you get a sticker. It will be fun to see how many of us are there...! Cheers Andrea R At 01:17 PM 1/07/2005, you wrote: Andrea R Any chance of some 'oz midwifery' stickers that list members could collect from you and put on our name tags at ICM so we can recognise and chat with each other Andrea Q -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. - Andrea Robertson Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.birthinternational.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.1/28 - Release Date: 24/06/2005 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
