Re: [PD] pd-extended on debian squeeze?

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

I added a Debian/squeeze chroot to the nightly builds, so if things go  
alright, we should have squeeze builds tomorrow.


.hc

On Feb 12, 2010, at 3:11 PM, Josh Lawrence wrote:


Hi!

I'm trying to install pd-extended on debian squeeze, but cannot due to
to an unresolved dependency on libmagick++10.  I've done a little
googling, and the solution that I found was to compile everything from
svn, which I'm afraid might be beyond my abilities.  Is that still the
case?  If not, what is the work-around?

Thanks!

Josh

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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

On Feb 12, 2010, at 4:21 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote:


On Fri, 2010-02-12 at 09:40 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote:

On Thu, 2010-02-11 at 18:39 -0800, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:

Hi Andrew,

Thanks, but that doesn't help so much with with the max to pd  
conversion. If I made it an external, I would be able to use it to

replace the internal, right?


I _think_ that this is not possible with Pd <= current versions.


To correct myself: Since 0.42 or so there is way for externals to
override internals.
Personally I find it was wrong to implement this 'feature' without
providing a mechanism for a patch to protect it from using externals
that override internals. This really can make debugging hard and  
writing

portable patches impossible.

IIRC, there is even a documented case on the list, where someone  
posted

a patch, that was working only on some computers because a slight
difference between Pd's [wrap] and zexy's [wrap] and only on *some*
machines zexy was installed and did override Pd's internal [wrap].


FYI: I agree with Roman.  I already removed the 0.42 aliasing feature  
from Pd-extended 0.42.5


.hc





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Re: [PD] Reinstall of latest Pd still crashes

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

How about Pd-extended 0.42.5?  Its got a much newer version of  
portaudio.  Are you using an external audio interface?


.hc

On Feb 12, 2010, at 8:35 PM, ryan legge wrote:



I reinstalled the latest build of Pd vanilla, and it still seems to  
crash after turning off 'compute audio'



Process: pd [274]
Path:/Applications/Pd-0.42-5.app/Contents/Resources/ 
Scripts/../bin/pd

Identifier:  pd
Version: ??? (???)
Code Type:   X86 (Native)
Parent Process:  Pd [271]

Interval Since Last Report:  10654 sec
Crashes Since Last Report:   3
Per-App Interval Since Last Report:  0 sec
Per-App Crashes Since Last Report:   3

Date/Time:   2010-02-12 17:32:32.608 -0800
OS Version:  Mac OS X 10.5.8 (9L30)
Report Version:  6
Anonymous UUID:  D0E8E53D-538F-484D-A5E5-BC31B96E6A3D

Exception Type:  EXC_BAD_ACCESS (SIGBUS)
Exception Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE at 0x01d8
Crashed Thread:  2

Thread 0:
0   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936cf3a6 mach_wait_until + 10
1   libSystem.B.dylib 0x937463ad nanosleep + 314
2   libSystem.B.dylib 0x9374626d usleep + 61
3   pd0x00075f68 Pa_Sleep + 40  
(pa_unix_util.c:119)
4   pd0x00079f34  
BlockWhileAudioUnitIsRunning + 99 (pa_mac_core.c:2128)
5   pd0x00079fc3 StopStream + 128  
(pa_mac_core.c:2167)
6   pd0x0006f9d5 CloseAudioStream +  
53 (s_audio_pablio.c:339)
7   pd0x0006f13d pa_close_audio + 46  
(s_audio_pa.c:279)
8   pd0x00048a11 sys_close_audio +  
145 (s_audio.c:340)
9   pd0x00039a93 pd_typedmess + 781  
(m_class.c:681)
10  pd0x0003d15b binbuf_eval + 1075  
(m_binbuf.c:722)
11  pd0x0004478e socketreceiver_read  
+ 1016 (s_inter.c:546)
12  pd0x00043821 sys_domicrosleep +  
385 (s_inter.c:184)
13  pd0x00043886 sys_microsleep + 19  
(s_inter.c:207)
14  pd0x00041527 m_mainloop + 468  
(m_sched.c:511)
15  pd0x00043622 sys_main + 1642  
(s_main.c:313)

16  pd0x19f6 _start + 216
17  pd0x191d start + 41

Thread 1:
0   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936cf286 mach_msg_trap + 10
1   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936d6a7c mach_msg + 72
2   com.apple.CoreFoundation  0x90216e7e  
CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 1790
3   com.apple.CoreFoundation  0x90217aa8 CFRunLoopRunInMode  
+ 88
4   com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x94b0c5f8  
HALRunLoop::OwnThread(void*) + 160
5   com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x94b0c480  
CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96

6   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700155 _pthread_start + 321
7   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700012 thread_start + 34

Thread 2 Crashed:
0   pd0x00078c12 AudioIOProc + 2015  
(pa_mac_core.c:1889)


Thread 3:
0   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936cf286 mach_msg_trap + 10
1   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936d6a7c mach_msg + 72
2   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0021af0f  
XServerMachPort::ReceiveMessage(int&, void*, int&) + 101
3   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0020d477  
MIDIInPortThread::Run() + 111
4   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0021107d  
XThread::RunHelper(void*) + 17
5   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0021b9ee  
CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96

6   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700155 _pthread_start + 321
7   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700012 thread_start + 34

Thread 2 crashed with X86 Thread State (32-bit):
  eax: 0x7d70  ebx: 0x00078444  ecx: 0x  edx: 0x0080af6c
  edi: 0x  esi: 0xb01a41e0  ebp: 0xb01a44a8  esp: 0xb01a41c0
   ss: 0x001f  efl: 0x00010286  eip: 0x00078c12   cs: 0x0017
   ds: 0x001f   es: 0x001f   fs: 0x001f   gs: 0x0037
  cr2: 0x01d8

Binary Images:
0x1000 -0x8bfe3 +pd ??? (???) /Applications/Pd-0.42-5.app/ 
Contents/Resources/bin/pd
  0x209000 -   0x226ff7  com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 1.6.1 (42) / 
System/Library/Frameworks/CoreMIDI.framework/Versions/A/CoreMIDI
  0x23e000 -   0x25cfe3  libexpat.1.dylib ??? (???)  
 /usr/lib/libexpat.1.dylib
  0x276000 -   0x279fff  com.apple.audio.AudioIPCPlugIn 1.0.6  
(1.0.6) <51c811377017028f8904ad779e6a1344> /System/Library/ 
Extensions/AudioIPCDriver.kext/Contents/Resources/ 
AudioIPCPlugIn.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AudioIPCPlugIn
  0x27f000 -   0x285fff  com.apple.audio.AppleHDAHALPlugIn 1.7.1  
(1.7.1a2)  /System/Library/ 
Extensions/AppleHDA.kext/Contents/PlugIns/AppleHDAHALPlugIn.bundle/ 
Contents/MacOS/AppleHDAHALPlugIn
  0x28b000 -   0x2b0003  
+com.digidesign.digidesign.DigiCoreAudioPlugIn 7.4.2 (7.4.2f109)  
 /

[PD] Reinstall of latest Pd still crashes

[ryan legge]

I reinstalled the latest build of Pd vanilla, and it still seems to crash after 
turning off 'compute audio'


Process: pd [274]
Path:
/Applications/Pd-0.42-5.app/Contents/Resources/Scripts/../bin/pd
Identifier:  pd
Version: ??? (???)
Code Type:   X86 (Native)
Parent Process:  Pd [271]

Interval Since Last Report:  10654 sec
Crashes Since Last Report:   3
Per-App Interval Since Last Report:  0 sec
Per-App Crashes Since Last Report:   3

Date/Time:   2010-02-12 17:32:32.608 -0800
OS Version:  Mac OS X 10.5.8 (9L30)
Report Version:  6
Anonymous UUID:  D0E8E53D-538F-484D-A5E5-BC31B96E6A3D

Exception Type:  EXC_BAD_ACCESS (SIGBUS)
Exception Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE at 0x01d8
Crashed Thread:  2

Thread 0:
0   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936cf3a6 mach_wait_until + 10
1   libSystem.B.dylib 0x937463ad nanosleep + 314
2   libSystem.B.dylib 0x9374626d usleep + 61
3   pd0x00075f68 Pa_Sleep + 40 
(pa_unix_util.c:119)
4   pd0x00079f34 BlockWhileAudioUnitIsRunning + 
99 (pa_mac_core.c:2128)
5   pd0x00079fc3 StopStream + 128 
(pa_mac_core.c:2167)
6   pd0x0006f9d5 CloseAudioStream + 53 
(s_audio_pablio.c:339)
7   pd0x0006f13d pa_close_audio + 46 
(s_audio_pa.c:279)
8   pd0x00048a11 sys_close_audio + 145 
(s_audio.c:340)
9   pd0x00039a93 pd_typedmess + 781 
(m_class.c:681)
10  pd0x0003d15b binbuf_eval + 1075 
(m_binbuf.c:722)
11  pd0x0004478e socketreceiver_read + 1016 
(s_inter.c:546)
12  pd0x00043821 sys_domicrosleep + 385 
(s_inter.c:184)
13  pd0x00043886 sys_microsleep + 19 
(s_inter.c:207)
14  pd0x00041527 m_mainloop + 468 
(m_sched.c:511)
15  pd0x00043622 sys_main + 1642 (s_main.c:313)
16  pd0x19f6 _start + 216
17  pd0x191d start + 41

Thread 1:
0   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936cf286 mach_msg_trap + 10
1   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936d6a7c mach_msg + 72
2   com.apple.CoreFoundation  0x90216e7e CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 1790
3   com.apple.CoreFoundation  0x90217aa8 CFRunLoopRunInMode + 88
4   com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x94b0c5f8 HALRunLoop::OwnThread(void*) + 
160
5   com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x94b0c480 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 
96
6   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700155 _pthread_start + 321
7   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700012 thread_start + 34

Thread 2 Crashed:
0   pd0x00078c12 AudioIOProc + 2015 
(pa_mac_core.c:1889)

Thread 3:
0   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936cf286 mach_msg_trap + 10
1   libSystem.B.dylib 0x936d6a7c mach_msg + 72
2   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0021af0f 
XServerMachPort::ReceiveMessage(int&, void*, int&) + 101
3   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0020d477 MIDIInPortThread::Run() + 111
4   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0021107d XThread::RunHelper(void*) + 17
5   com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0021b9ee CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 
96
6   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700155 _pthread_start + 321
7   libSystem.B.dylib 0x93700012 thread_start + 34

Thread 2 crashed with X86 Thread State (32-bit):
  eax: 0x7d70  ebx: 0x00078444  ecx: 0x  edx: 0x0080af6c
  edi: 0x  esi: 0xb01a41e0  ebp: 0xb01a44a8  esp: 0xb01a41c0
   ss: 0x001f  efl: 0x00010286  eip: 0x00078c12   cs: 0x0017
   ds: 0x001f   es: 0x001f   fs: 0x001f   gs: 0x0037
  cr2: 0x01d8

Binary Images:
0x1000 -0x8bfe3 +pd ??? (???) 
/Applications/Pd-0.42-5.app/Contents/Resources/bin/pd
  0x209000 -   0x226ff7  com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 1.6.1 (42) 
/System/Library/Frameworks/CoreMIDI.framework/Versions/A/CoreMIDI
  0x23e000 -   0x25cfe3  libexpat.1.dylib ??? (???) 
 /usr/lib/libexpat.1.dylib
  0x276000 -   0x279fff  com.apple.audio.AudioIPCPlugIn 1.0.6 (1.0.6) 
<51c811377017028f8904ad779e6a1344> 
/System/Library/Extensions/AudioIPCDriver.kext/Contents/Resources/AudioIPCPlugIn.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AudioIPCPlugIn
  0x27f000 -   0x285fff  com.apple.audio.AppleHDAHALPlugIn 1.7.1 (1.7.1a2) 
 
/System/Library/Extensions/AppleHDA.kext/Contents/PlugIns/AppleHDAHALPlugIn.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AppleHDAHALPlugIn
  0x28b000 -   0x2b0003 +com.digidesign.digidesign.DigiCoreAudioPlugIn 7.4.2 
(7.4.2f109)  
/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/Digidesign 
CoreAudio.plugin/Contents/MacOS/Digidesign CoreAudio
  0x578000 -   0x5e5fff +com.DivXInc.DivXDecoder 6.6.0 (6.6.0) 
/Library/QuickTime/DivX Decoder.component/Contents/MacOS/DivX Decoder

Re: [PD] arduino-test.pd crashes windows vista

[Alexandre Castonguay]

Hi Hans,

I'll have to wait a few days before I have access to that machine again 
but thanks for the lead (+ your work as always).


Alexandre

Hans-Christoph Steiner a écrit :


My guess is that the crash is coming from [moocow/any2string] since 
that is used in the arduino-test.pd patch but not in arduino.pd or 
arduino-help.pd.  Could you try that object on Vista?  I don't have 
access to a  Vista machine.


.hc

On Feb 12, 2010, at 1:46 PM, Alexandre Castonguay wrote:


Hi Hans,

I am helping someone with Pduino and opening arduino-test.pd crashes 
PD.  The [arduino] abstraction opens fine and so does 
arduino-help.pd.  The patch opens correctly from time to time (once 
every ~25 tries).  I can't get any usable information on the console 
before the crash.


He's using :

pduino-0.5beta6
arduino 0018
pd-extended 0.41.4

Thank you for your work, let me know if I can install anything to get 
a more useful report.


Alexandre




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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[cyrille henry]

Jonathan Wilkes a écrit :


--- On Fri, 2/12/10, Roman Haefeli  wrote:


From: Roman Haefeli 
Subject: Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction
To: "Jonathan Wilkes" 
Cc: pd-list@iem.at
Date: Friday, February 12, 2010, 10:21 AM
On Fri, 2010-02-12 at 09:40 +0100,
Roman Haefeli wrote:

On Thu, 2010-02-11 at 18:39 -0800, Jonathan Wilkes

wrote:

Hi Andrew,

Thanks, but that doesn't help so much with with

the max to pd conversion. If I made it an external, I would
be able to use it to 

replace the internal, right?

I _think_ that this is not possible with Pd <=

current versions.

To correct myself: Since 0.42 or so there is way for
externals to
override internals.
Personally I find it was wrong to implement this 'feature'
without
providing a mechanism for a patch to protect it from using
externals
that override internals. This really can make debugging
hard and writing
portable patches impossible.

IIRC, there is even a documented case on the list, where
someone posted
a patch, that was working only on some computers because a
slight
difference between Pd's [wrap] and zexy's [wrap] and only
on *some*
machines zexy was installed and did override Pd's internal
[wrap].


Isn't this is a problem with the way libraries have loaded by 
default in Pd-ext (I think there's been a long thread about that but 
I haven't followed it)?  I don't know much about zexy's [wrap], but this 
seems a documentation issue rather than a bug-- whether it's at load 
time or in the docs, at some point zexy needs to say, "Greetings, 
gentleman.  All your [wrap] are belong to us."  Or maybe Pd needs to 
say "All my [wrap] are belong to zexy."

well, that is curently almost what happend.
pd say somthing like :

warning: class 'wrap' overwritten\; old one renamed 'wrap_aliased'

but i suspect that very few peoples care about what pd say at startup

Cyrille


If I have a bunch of objects in folder "maxwise-abs," and I tell Pd 
to add that folder to the path, it is extremely likely (99%) that I want 
the abstraction to take precedence over the internal.  (Granted I 
currently only have one object in that folder but I just started...)


-Jonathan


Roman




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Re: [PD] arduino-test.pd crashes windows vista

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

My guess is that the crash is coming from [moocow/any2string] since  
that is used in the arduino-test.pd patch but not in arduino.pd or  
arduino-help.pd.  Could you try that object on Vista?  I don't have  
access to a  Vista machine.


.hc

On Feb 12, 2010, at 1:46 PM, Alexandre Castonguay wrote:


Hi Hans,

I am helping someone with Pduino and opening arduino-test.pd crashes  
PD.  The [arduino] abstraction opens fine and so does arduino- 
help.pd.  The patch opens correctly from time to time (once every  
~25 tries).  I can't get any usable information on the console  
before the crash.


He's using :

pduino-0.5beta6
arduino 0018
pd-extended 0.41.4

Thank you for your work, let me know if I can install anything to  
get a more useful report.


Alexandre




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Re: [PD] Sound FX for Games

[George Ker]

Thnx Jeffrey for your link.
Just posted in my frienfeed:
http://friendfeed.com/georgeker/d5716ab1/video-game-audio-articles-by-leonard-j-paul-via



-
http://tinyurl.com/georgeker
-


2010/2/12 Jeffrey Concepcion 

> http://www.sfu.ca/~leonardp/VideoGameAudio/main.htm#patches



>
> On Thu, Feb 11, 2010 at 6:03 AM, Alvar Lahoz  wrote:
>
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> It's my first message to list.
>>
>> Recently I'm interested to entry to world of games, i worked in a post
>> production studio and i was making sound for films. I have concepts of Pure
>> Data, but i don't know how i can work it with games. Someone can give me a
>> tutorial for noobs?
>>
>> Thanks.
>> Àlvar
>>
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Re: [PD] relative paths with [folder_list]

[András Murányi]

On Fri, Feb 12, 2010 at 8:38 PM, Jonathan Wilkes  wrote:

> Dear Hans,
> I'm using [folder_list] on windows, and on 0.43.0-devel-20100126 when
> I create it, it prints the default path to the console, which is the
> path of the patch I'm working with (which is exactly what I want).
>
> However, I'd like to use a relative path (../something/*) to access a
> folder from the parent, but when I try to use that relative path, it turns
> out that it's not relative to the working directory-- instead, it's
> relative
> to the path to Pd.
>
> Any advice on getting [folder_list] to access that folder from the parent?
> I'd rather not use an absolute path (especially since there are so many
> spaces in windows paths).
>
> Thanks,
> Jonathan
>
>
Hello Jonathan,

I'm not sure if it is the solution to your problem - i use [relativepath]
and [absolutepath] by Antoine Rousseau.
Andras
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[PD] pd-extended on debian squeeze?

[Josh Lawrence]

Hi!

I'm trying to install pd-extended on debian squeeze, but cannot due to
to an unresolved dependency on libmagick++10.  I've done a little
googling, and the solution that I found was to compile everything from
svn, which I'm afraid might be beyond my abilities.  Is that still the
case?  If not, what is the work-around?

Thanks!

Josh

-- 
Josh Lawrence
http://www.hardbop200.com

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[PD] relative paths with [folder_list]

[Jonathan Wilkes]

Dear Hans,
 I'm using [folder_list] on windows, and on 0.43.0-devel-20100126 when 
I create it, it prints the default path to the console, which is the 
path of the patch I'm working with (which is exactly what I want).

However, I'd like to use a relative path (../something/*) to access a 
folder from the parent, but when I try to use that relative path, it turns 
out that it's not relative to the working directory-- instead, it's relative 
to the path to Pd.

Any advice on getting [folder_list] to access that folder from the parent?  
I'd rather not use an absolute path (especially since there are so many 
spaces in windows paths).

Thanks,
Jonathan


  


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[PD] arduino-test.pd crashes windows vista

[Alexandre Castonguay]

Hi Hans,

I am helping someone with Pduino and opening arduino-test.pd crashes PD.  The 
[arduino] abstraction opens fine and so does arduino-help.pd.  The patch opens 
correctly from time to time (once every ~25 tries).  I can't get any usable 
information on the console before the crash.

He's using :

pduino-0.5beta6
arduino 0018
pd-extended 0.41.4

Thank you for your work, let me know if I can install anything to get a more 
useful report.

Alexandre




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Re: [PD] Small bug with comment

[Jonathan Wilkes]

Or try:
O.4O

-Jonathan

--- On Fri, 2/12/10, Miller Puckette  wrote:

> From: Miller Puckette 
> Subject: Re: [PD] Small bug with comment
> To: "Steffen Juul" 
> Cc: "pd-list" , "cyrille henry" 
> Date: Friday, February 12, 2010, 5:02 PM
> It's unfortunate, but it's in fact a
> 'feature' - 1. is a number and all
> numbers are printed in their 'simplest' form :)
> 
> Also for instance "Pd version 0.40" types out as "Pd
> version 0.4" so all the
> help files I updated for 0.40 say "version 0.40.".
> 
> cheers
> M
> 
> On Fri, Feb 12, 2010 at 04:24:22PM +0100, Steffen Juul
> wrote:
> > 
> > On 09/02/2010, at 19.03, Max wrote:
> > 
> > >there is a bug in vanilla and even in the latest
> rewrite, that dots  
> > >followed by a space are disappearing after saving
> and reopening  
> > >patches.
> > >
> > >make the first line in this patch read
> > >"first 1. <- see there is no dot!"
> > >after reopening you'll see:
> > >"first 1 <- see there is no dot!"
> > 
> > reminds me of the bug with id 1984672, . Don't  
> > know if it's related.
> > 
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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[João Pais]

From: João Pais 
Subject: Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction
To: "Jonathan Wilkes" , pd-list@iem.at, "Andrew  
Faraday" 

Date: Friday, February 12, 2010, 1:35 PM
you're doing the conversion anyway
with patches saves in text format,right? you could do a search-replace  
to find for " t " and

replace it with" tt ". just make sure you don't replace more than you
want.


Thanks, that's probably the best workaround-- then once it's working,
change all the [tt]'s back to [t]'s and add msg boxes (if I want it to
work without my abstraction).


exactly. sometimes I prefer to edit pd files as text when there's too many  
parameters to change - like changing the send/receive names of 20 gui  
objects.


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Re: [PD] Install pd-extended on Ubuntu Jaunty 9.04 i686

[András Murányi]

[...]

>  >> When I tried adding adding to sources.list and installing via apt-get
>> >> I received the following error:
>> >> "Failed to fetch
>> >>
>> http://apt.puredata.info/releases/dists/jaunty/main/binary-amd64/Packages
>> >> 404 Not Found"
>> >>
>> >> Anyway, I ended up installing pd vanilla, gem, and zexy seperately and
>> >> adding the appropriate paths in the file > startup menu.  Everything
>> >> is working just fine now.
>> >>
>> >> -Ben
>> >
>> > Hello Ben,
>> >
>> > I am on amd64 too, and my best recommendation is that you use the i386
>> > version. At the moment it is just faster and more stable than 64-bit
>> builds.
>> > To set up an i386 package on your 64-bit Jaunty and satisfy all the
>> 32-bit
>> > dependecies you'll most likely want to use getlibs:
>> > http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=474790
>> >
>> > Andras
>> >
>> >
>>
>> Thanks Andras, that sounds like just what I need.
>> I'll give it a shot this weekend after I fix a botched dist-upgrade.
>>
>> -Ben
>>
>
> I just noticed there are more specifics at
> http://puredata.info/docs/developer/64BitLinux/ under "Method 2
>

BTW this page is under section "Developers"... it's not only developers who
want to install Pd, is it? Wouldn't it make sense to move or link to this
page from "download Pd"?
Andras
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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[Jonathan Wilkes]

--- On Fri, 2/12/10, João Pais  wrote:

> From: João Pais 
> Subject: Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction
> To: "Jonathan Wilkes" , pd-list@iem.at, "Andrew Faraday" 
> 
> Date: Friday, February 12, 2010, 1:35 PM
> you're doing the conversion anyway
> with patches saves in text format,  
> right? you could do a search-replace to find for " t " and
> replace it with  
> " tt ". just make sure you don't replace more than you
> want.

Thanks, that's probably the best workaround-- then once it's working, 
change all the [tt]'s back to [t]'s and add msg boxes (if I want it to 
work without my abstraction).

-Jonathan 


  


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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[Jonathan Wilkes]

--- On Fri, 2/12/10, Roman Haefeli  wrote:

> From: Roman Haefeli 
> Subject: Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction
> To: "Jonathan Wilkes" 
> Cc: pd-list@iem.at
> Date: Friday, February 12, 2010, 10:21 AM
> On Fri, 2010-02-12 at 09:40 +0100,
> Roman Haefeli wrote:
> > On Thu, 2010-02-11 at 18:39 -0800, Jonathan Wilkes
> wrote:
> > > Hi Andrew,
> > > 
> > > Thanks, but that doesn't help so much with with
> the max to pd conversion. If I made it an external, I would
> be able to use it to 
> > > replace the internal, right?
> > 
> > I _think_ that this is not possible with Pd <=
> current versions.
> 
> To correct myself: Since 0.42 or so there is way for
> externals to
> override internals.
> Personally I find it was wrong to implement this 'feature'
> without
> providing a mechanism for a patch to protect it from using
> externals
> that override internals. This really can make debugging
> hard and writing
> portable patches impossible.
> 
> IIRC, there is even a documented case on the list, where
> someone posted
> a patch, that was working only on some computers because a
> slight
> difference between Pd's [wrap] and zexy's [wrap] and only
> on *some*
> machines zexy was installed and did override Pd's internal
> [wrap].

Isn't this is a problem with the way libraries have loaded by 
default in Pd-ext (I think there's been a long thread about that but 
I haven't followed it)?  I don't know much about zexy's [wrap], but this 
seems a documentation issue rather than a bug-- whether it's at load 
time or in the docs, at some point zexy needs to say, "Greetings, 
gentleman.  All your [wrap] are belong to us."  Or maybe Pd needs to 
say "All my [wrap] are belong to zexy."

If I have a bunch of objects in folder "maxwise-abs," and I tell Pd 
to add that folder to the path, it is extremely likely (99%) that I want 
the abstraction to take precedence over the internal.  (Granted I 
currently only have one object in that folder but I just started...)

-Jonathan

> 
> Roman
> 
> 
> 
>         
> ___
> 
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> 
> 


  


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Re: [PD] Install pd-extended on Ubuntu Jaunty 9.04 i686

[András Murányi]

2010/2/12 Ben Baker-Smith 

> 2010/2/11 András Murányi :
> > On Thu, Feb 11, 2010 at 3:21 AM, Ben Baker-Smith 
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> Thanks for getting back to me so quickly.
> >>
> >> Sorry, there was a typo in my initial message, it should say "there is
> >> no i686 package available".
> >>
> >> When I tried to install the Jaunty package I got a "wrong kernel type"
> >> error. All the packages seem to be for i386 and lpia, while my machine
> >> is running i686. The only mention of an i686 version that I have found
> >> is for Karmic in the 02-10-10 nightly build (and it seems rather small
> >> at 5.1M).
> >>
> >> When I tried adding adding to sources.list and installing via apt-get
> >> I received the following error:
> >> "Failed to fetch
> >>
> http://apt.puredata.info/releases/dists/jaunty/main/binary-amd64/Packages
> >> 404 Not Found"
> >>
> >> Anyway, I ended up installing pd vanilla, gem, and zexy seperately and
> >> adding the appropriate paths in the file > startup menu.  Everything
> >> is working just fine now.
> >>
> >> -Ben
> >
> > Hello Ben,
> >
> > I am on amd64 too, and my best recommendation is that you use the i386
> > version. At the moment it is just faster and more stable than 64-bit
> builds.
> > To set up an i386 package on your 64-bit Jaunty and satisfy all the
> 32-bit
> > dependecies you'll most likely want to use getlibs:
> > http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=474790
> >
> > Andras
> >
> >
>
> Thanks Andras, that sounds like just what I need.
> I'll give it a shot this weekend after I fix a botched dist-upgrade.
>
> -Ben
>

I just noticed there are more specifics at
http://puredata.info/docs/developer/64BitLinux/ under "Method 2"
(...you didn't mistakenly upgrade to Karmic did u? ;o) My girlfriend did
that on her laptop and err... not so good! Been told however that it is less
bad with the RT kernel -  a thing missing from Jaunty.)
Andras
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Re: [PD] Small bug with comment

[Miller Puckette]

It's unfortunate, but it's in fact a 'feature' - 1. is a number and all
numbers are printed in their 'simplest' form :)

Also for instance "Pd version 0.40" types out as "Pd version 0.4" so all the
help files I updated for 0.40 say "version 0.40.".

cheers
M

On Fri, Feb 12, 2010 at 04:24:22PM +0100, Steffen Juul wrote:
> 
> On 09/02/2010, at 19.03, Max wrote:
> 
> >there is a bug in vanilla and even in the latest rewrite, that dots  
> >followed by a space are disappearing after saving and reopening  
> >patches.
> >
> >make the first line in this patch read
> >"first 1. <- see there is no dot!"
> >after reopening you'll see:
> >"first 1 <- see there is no dot!"
> 
> reminds me of the bug with id 1984672, . Don't  
> know if it's related.
> 
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Re: [PD] Install pd-extended on Ubuntu Jaunty 9.04 i686

[Ben Baker-Smith]

2010/2/11 András Murányi :
> On Thu, Feb 11, 2010 at 3:21 AM, Ben Baker-Smith 
> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for getting back to me so quickly.
>>
>> Sorry, there was a typo in my initial message, it should say "there is
>> no i686 package available".
>>
>> When I tried to install the Jaunty package I got a "wrong kernel type"
>> error. All the packages seem to be for i386 and lpia, while my machine
>> is running i686. The only mention of an i686 version that I have found
>> is for Karmic in the 02-10-10 nightly build (and it seems rather small
>> at 5.1M).
>>
>> When I tried adding adding to sources.list and installing via apt-get
>> I received the following error:
>> "Failed to fetch
>> http://apt.puredata.info/releases/dists/jaunty/main/binary-amd64/Packages
>> 404 Not Found"
>>
>> Anyway, I ended up installing pd vanilla, gem, and zexy seperately and
>> adding the appropriate paths in the file > startup menu.  Everything
>> is working just fine now.
>>
>> -Ben
>
> Hello Ben,
>
> I am on amd64 too, and my best recommendation is that you use the i386
> version. At the moment it is just faster and more stable than 64-bit builds.
> To set up an i386 package on your 64-bit Jaunty and satisfy all the 32-bit
> dependecies you'll most likely want to use getlibs:
> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=474790
>
> Andras
>
>

Thanks Andras, that sounds like just what I need.
I'll give it a shot this weekend after I fix a botched dist-upgrade.

-Ben

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Re: [PD] Small bug with comment

[Steffen Juul]

On 09/02/2010, at 19.03, Max wrote:

there is a bug in vanilla and even in the latest rewrite, that dots  
followed by a space are disappearing after saving and reopening  
patches.


make the first line in this patch read
"first 1. <- see there is no dot!"
after reopening you'll see:
"first 1 <- see there is no dot!"


reminds me of the bug with id 1984672, . Don't  
know if it's related.


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Re: [PD] Sympathetic strings

[Derek Holzer]

Hi Pierre,

ah yes, Karplus-Strong, I forgot that keyword!

As for the analysis time of fiddle~, remember that computers aren't 
really real-time systems ;-) Besides that, you can change the analysis 
window size. Smaller windows equal faster analysis but less precision 
for lower frequencies. But yes, maybe new thread


Good luck!
Derek

Pierre Massat wrote:

Hi,
I have tried your patch called karplus-strong. This is just amazing! 
This solved two problems at once : getting a sitar-like sound plus a 
sympathetic strings simulation. Thank a lot!


Although i think i should open a new thread about this, i was a little 
shocked by the time fiddle~ takes to output a pitch (i used it to 
control a resonator with my guitar). I think it was way above 10 ms. I 
haven't tried sigmund~ yet, though. Do you know what latency i should 
expect? I think 5 ms should do.

Anyway, thanks again for introducing me to the Karplus-Strong model!

Pierre

2010/2/12 Pierre Massat mailto:pimas...@gmail.com>>

Thank you Derek! I'll give it a look.
Best,

Pierre

2010/2/11 Derek Holzer mailto:de...@umatic.nl>>

Hi Pierre,

I've found resonant comb filters to be the most useful in both
simulating string sounds, and in getting sympathetic resonances.
There's tons of stuff in the list archives on them, in
particular a patch (maybe I even posted it) on calculating the
correct delay length for produce a given pitch. Search for "comb
filter".

Best
Derek


Pierre Massat wrote:

Hello everyone,

I was wondering if anybody on this list would have an idea
of how one can simulate sympathetic strings in pd, using any
kind of audio input (especially NOT midi). I tried making a
patch with 12 resonating filters (moog~), each tuned to a
particular frequency belonging to the chromatic scale, but
the result wasn't too good (it sounded more like a weird
reverb).
My problem is basically that of isolating certain
frequencies in the input sound. I don't believe that objects
like fiddle~ or sigmund~ would be very helpful in that
matter, as they always start freaking out once you feed them
with chords.
I haven't found anything useful on the internet yet.
Any idea?

Pierre



-- 
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---Oblique Strategy # 130:
"Question the heroic"





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Re: [PD] Sympathetic strings

[Pierre Massat]

Hi,
I have tried your patch called karplus-strong. This is just amazing! This
solved two problems at once : getting a sitar-like sound plus a sympathetic
strings simulation. Thank a lot!

Although i think i should open a new thread about this, i was a little
shocked by the time fiddle~ takes to output a pitch (i used it to control a
resonator with my guitar). I think it was way above 10 ms. I haven't tried
sigmund~ yet, though. Do you know what latency i should expect? I think 5 ms
should do.
Anyway, thanks again for introducing me to the Karplus-Strong model!

Pierre

2010/2/12 Pierre Massat 

> Thank you Derek! I'll give it a look.
> Best,
>
> Pierre
>
> 2010/2/11 Derek Holzer 
>
> Hi Pierre,
>>
>> I've found resonant comb filters to be the most useful in both simulating
>> string sounds, and in getting sympathetic resonances. There's tons of stuff
>> in the list archives on them, in particular a patch (maybe I even posted it)
>> on calculating the correct delay length for produce a given pitch. Search
>> for "comb filter".
>>
>> Best
>> Derek
>>
>>
>> Pierre Massat wrote:
>>
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> I was wondering if anybody on this list would have an idea of how one can
>>> simulate sympathetic strings in pd, using any kind of audio input
>>> (especially NOT midi). I tried making a patch with 12 resonating filters
>>> (moog~), each tuned to a particular frequency belonging to the chromatic
>>> scale, but the result wasn't too good (it sounded more like a weird reverb).
>>> My problem is basically that of isolating certain frequencies in the
>>> input sound. I don't believe that objects like fiddle~ or sigmund~ would be
>>> very helpful in that matter, as they always start freaking out once you feed
>>> them with chords.
>>> I haven't found anything useful on the internet yet.
>>> Any idea?
>>>
>>> Pierre
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> ::: derek holzer ::: http://macumbista.net :::
>> ---Oblique Strategy # 130:
>> "Question the heroic"
>>
>
>
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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[João Pais]

you're doing the conversion anyway with patches saves in text format,  
right? you could do a search-replace to find for " t " and replace it with  
" tt ". just make sure you don't replace more than you want.


João


Hi Andrew,

Thanks, but that doesn't help so much with with the max to pd  
conversion. If I made it an external, I would be able to use it to

replace the internal, right?

-Jonathan

--- On Fri, 2/12/10, Andrew Faraday  wrote:


From: Andrew Faraday 
Subject: RE: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction
To: jancs...@yahoo.com, pd-list@iem.at
Date: Friday, February 12, 2010, 1:41 AM





This might be too much of an obvious answer, but try
calling it something else? tt.pd?

> Date: Thu, 11 Feb 2010 16:28:43 -0800
> From: jancs...@yahoo.com
> To: pd-list@iem.at
> Subject: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction
>
> Hello,
>  I'm not sure if I wrote that correctly--
I'd like to use an abstraction
> called t.pd in place of trigger.  So I put the
abstraction in my patch's
> folder but it won't alias [t] because I guess Pd
only searches for
> abstractions after it searches for internals.
>
> Basically I want to expirement with using a max-style
[t], one in
> which you can use actual float values as args.  But
more importantly, if I
> wanted to use such an abstraction as an aid in
converting a max patch to a
> pd patch, how could I force Pd to use the abstraction
in place of the
> internal?
>
> Thanks,
> Jonathan
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[Roman Haefeli]

On Fri, 2010-02-12 at 09:40 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote:
> On Thu, 2010-02-11 at 18:39 -0800, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:
> > Hi Andrew,
> > 
> > Thanks, but that doesn't help so much with with the max to pd conversion. 
> > If I made it an external, I would be able to use it to 
> > replace the internal, right?
> 
> I _think_ that this is not possible with Pd <= current versions.

To correct myself: Since 0.42 or so there is way for externals to
override internals.
Personally I find it was wrong to implement this 'feature' without
providing a mechanism for a patch to protect it from using externals
that override internals. This really can make debugging hard and writing
portable patches impossible.

IIRC, there is even a documented case on the list, where someone posted
a patch, that was working only on some computers because a slight
difference between Pd's [wrap] and zexy's [wrap] and only on *some*
machines zexy was installed and did override Pd's internal [wrap].

Roman




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Re: [PD] Alias an internal with an abstraction

[Roman Haefeli]

On Thu, 2010-02-11 at 18:39 -0800, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:
> Hi Andrew,
> 
> Thanks, but that doesn't help so much with with the max to pd conversion. If 
> I made it an external, I would be able to use it to 
> replace the internal, right?

I _think_ that this is not possible with Pd <= current versions. And if
it would be possible to override internals, I'd strongly fight this
ability for consistency reasons. It's already hard enough nowadays to
create a patch working on a fair amount of systems with different OS'
and different Pd flavours. The subset of internal object classes should
behave reliably the same on _every_ Pd installation.

BTW: there is a library dedicated to making Pd behaving more like
max/msp called cyclone. Just in case you didn't know it already (though
from what I know it doesn't address the difference of [t]).

Roman 






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Re: [PD] Sympathetic strings

[Pierre Massat]

Thank you Derek! I'll give it a look.
Best,

Pierre

2010/2/11 Derek Holzer 

> Hi Pierre,
>
> I've found resonant comb filters to be the most useful in both simulating
> string sounds, and in getting sympathetic resonances. There's tons of stuff
> in the list archives on them, in particular a patch (maybe I even posted it)
> on calculating the correct delay length for produce a given pitch. Search
> for "comb filter".
>
> Best
> Derek
>
>
> Pierre Massat wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> I was wondering if anybody on this list would have an idea of how one can
>> simulate sympathetic strings in pd, using any kind of audio input
>> (especially NOT midi). I tried making a patch with 12 resonating filters
>> (moog~), each tuned to a particular frequency belonging to the chromatic
>> scale, but the result wasn't too good (it sounded more like a weird reverb).
>> My problem is basically that of isolating certain frequencies in the input
>> sound. I don't believe that objects like fiddle~ or sigmund~ would be very
>> helpful in that matter, as they always start freaking out once you feed them
>> with chords.
>> I haven't found anything useful on the internet yet.
>> Any idea?
>>
>> Pierre
>>
>
>
> --
> ::: derek holzer ::: http://macumbista.net :::
> ---Oblique Strategy # 130:
> "Question the heroic"
>
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