Photographers not terrorists
Section 44 of the Terrorism Act has been used in recent years to stop search people, including photographers, illegally. Today the government announced that it is bringing the legislation into line with the ruling of the European court. This means that the police can no longer use Section 44 in the way they were using it before, and can only stop search people now under Section 43, which requires a *reasonable suspicion* that the person is a terrorist - taking photographs is normally unlikely to be a reasonable suspicion. This is good news for human rights in the UK, including us specifically as photographers, and a triumph for the people who originally brought the case in front of the courts. http://photographernotaterrorist.org/ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/10555430.stm It's still illegal under Section 72 to elicit information about a police officer. They use this to try and stop people photographing cops. Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
w00t! There is still hope. Thanks for sharing Ecke 2010/7/8 Bob W p...@web-options.com: Section 44 of the Terrorism Act has been used in recent years to stop search people, including photographers, illegally. Today the government announced that it is bringing the legislation into line with the ruling of the European court. This means that the police can no longer use Section 44 in the way they were using it before, and can only stop search people now under Section 43, which requires a *reasonable suspicion* that the person is a terrorist - taking photographs is normally unlikely to be a reasonable suspicion. This is good news for human rights in the UK, including us specifically as photographers, and a triumph for the people who originally brought the case in front of the courts. http://photographernotaterrorist.org/ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/10555430.stm It's still illegal under Section 72 to elicit information about a police officer. They use this to try and stop people photographing cops. Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
-- From: Bob W p...@web-options.com Sent: Thursday, July 08, 2010 8:29 AM To: 'Pentax-Discuss Mail List' pdml@pdml.net Subject: Photographers not terrorists Section 44 of the Terrorism Act has been used in recent years to stop search people, including photographers, illegally. Today the government announced that it is bringing the legislation into line with the ruling of the European court. This means that the police can no longer use Section 44 in the way they were using it before, and can only stop search people now under Section 43, which requires a *reasonable suspicion* that the person is a terrorist - taking photographs is normally unlikely to be a reasonable suspicion. This is good news for human rights in the UK, including us specifically as photographers, and a triumph for the people who originally brought the case in front of the courts. http://photographernotaterrorist.org/ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/10555430.stm It's still illegal under Section 72 to elicit information about a police officer. They use this to try and stop people photographing cops. Bob Do you think it will do some good, or will it be ignored on the streets and end up being same old. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: Photographers not terrorists
This is good news for human rights in the UK, including us specifically as photographers, and a triumph for the people who originally brought the case in front of the courts. http://photographernotaterrorist.org/ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/10555430.stm It's still illegal under Section 72 to elicit information about a police officer. They use this to try and stop people photographing cops. Bob Do you think it will do some good, or will it be ignored on the streets and end up being same old. William Robb ever since people started protesting about it the number of stops has reduced dramatically, and last year the police were instructed to stop being so enthusiastic, so I do expect it to stop. If it doesn't they'll find themselves in court again. It won't stop officious security guards and similar from trying to stop us, but they have no powers of arrest or search. Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
On 8/7/10, William Robb, discombobulated, unleashed: Do you think it will do some good, or will it be ignored on the streets and end up being same old. That one. -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche -- http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
On 7/8/2010 8:22 PM, Cotty wrote: On 8/7/10, William Robb, discombobulated, unleashed: Do you think it will do some good, or will it be ignored on the streets and end up being same old. That one. That's what I thought too... There is a certain distance between the well dressed man presiding in some well guarded room of some well known building and an actual representative of all of the above on the street. Boris -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
2010/7/8 Bob W p...@web-options.com: It won't stop officious security guards and similar from trying to stop us, but they have no powers of arrest or search. don't forget citizen's arrest, pepper spray and the dangerous delusions that go along with them - I was witness of the state in an assault and battery trial against four tram ticket inspectors in Cologne a couple years ago. two of the ticket people had cornered an African tourist who spoke only French and admittedly had no ticket. buddy was like 170 cm tall and skinny and the guards were three guys of 190+ and a roid bumped female Chuck Norris. They had him backed up against a pole on the streetcar and were trying to get some ID from him and he kept saying in French he didn't have any on him. Main defendant started pushing him and he was visibly scared and raised his hands to chest level in a clear give up gesture. This was enough of an excuse I guess as the guy banged the back of his head into the pole a couple times, lifted him by the throat, carried him off the train that had just stopped, slammed him into one of those plexiglass stalls, all still by the throat and then down onto a bench where he choked him some more. All the time there was no resistance. This is when I finally got physically close enough to do something. Another guy and I stepped in, stopped them and called the police. The ticket guys not only refused to give ID which, them being public servants, was against the law but also produced little scraps of paper which had §127 paragraph 4 of the Criminal Procedure Code printed on them, i.e. the law governing citizen's arrest and actually tried to make us believe 127 justified their behaviour. They did identify themselves to police and charges were pressed by the public attorney meaning this was not considered a minor offense. The sentences were pretty high given they were all first offenders, three were fined 3 monthly salaries each and the main defendant got four plus 3 months on parole. He also appealed the sentence so I had to come again and the judge told him outright to withdraw his appeal or he would get a higher sentence yet. He complied. But all the while before and after the court sessions all four kept pestering us in the hallway that they had done nothing wrong and so on and bla bla and I think they actually believed it, too. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
On 8/7/10, eckinator, discombobulated, unleashed: But all the while before and after the court sessions all four kept pestering us in the hallway that they had done nothing wrong and so on and bla bla and I think they actually believed it, too. This in itself is a criminal offense in the UK. Do they not have CCTV at the courts? -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche -- http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
On Jul 8, 2010, at 3:14 PM, eckinator wrote: 2010/7/8 Bob W p...@web-options.com: It won't stop officious security guards and similar from trying to stop us, but they have no powers of arrest or search. don't forget citizen's arrest, pepper spray and the dangerous delusions that go along with them - I was witness of the state in an assault and battery trial against four tram ticket inspectors in Cologne a couple years ago. two of the ticket people had cornered an African tourist who spoke only French and admittedly had no ticket. buddy was like 170 cm tall and skinny and the guards were three guys of 190+ and a roid bumped female Chuck Norris. They had him backed up against a pole on the streetcar and were trying to get some ID from him and he kept saying in French he didn't have any on him. Main defendant started pushing him and he was visibly scared and raised his hands to chest level in a clear give up gesture. This was enough of an excuse I guess as the guy banged the back of his head into the pole a couple times, lifted him by the throat, carried him off the train that had just stopped, slammed him into one of those plexiglass stalls, all still by the throat and then down onto a bench where he choked him some more. All the time there was no resistance. This is when I finally got physically close enough to do something. Another guy and I stepped in, stopped them and called the police. Good for you. It's not often that bystanders will stand up for the oppressed. Bravo! The ticket guys not only refused to give ID which, them being public servants, was against the law but also produced little scraps of paper which had §127 paragraph 4 of the Criminal Procedure Code printed on them, i.e. the law governing citizen's arrest and actually tried to make us believe 127 justified their behaviour. They did identify themselves to police and charges were pressed by the public attorney meaning this was not considered a minor offense. The sentences were pretty high given they were all first offenders, three were fined 3 monthly salaries each and the main defendant got four plus 3 months on parole. He also appealed the sentence so I had to come again and the judge told him outright to withdraw his appeal or he would get a higher sentence yet. He complied. But all the while before and after the court sessions all four kept pestering us in the hallway that they had done nothing wrong and so on and bla bla and I think they actually believed it, too. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
El 08/07/2010 22:20, P N Stenquist escribió: ce. Good for you. It's not often that bystanders will stand up for the oppressed. Bravo! Ditto, good for you Ecke. Carlos -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
2010/7/8 Cotty cotty...@mac.com: On 8/7/10, eckinator, discombobulated, unleashed: But all the while before and after the court sessions all four kept pestering us in the hallway that they had done nothing wrong and so on and bla bla and I think they actually believed it, too. This in itself is a criminal offense in the UK. Do they not have CCTV at the courts? I can't say about now but in 1998 they did not. I guess it is an offense here, too but I wouldn't know, I generally know the law very poorly. Cheers, Ecke -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers not terrorists
2010/7/8 Carlos R carlos_r...@teleline.es: El 08/07/2010 22:20, P N Stenquist escribió: ce. Good for you. It's not often that bystanders will stand up for the oppressed. Bravo! Ditto, good for you Ecke. Thank you Paul and Carlos. To be honest, I was feeling pretty bad because I was one block of seats away when I heard them yell at him and had no way to get over there but it gave me the time to talk to the guy next to me to get him involved as well and we encouraged each other enough to step in. I was still pretty scared because despite having played some defense football, I've never been in a real fight in my life but I don't consider it necessarily a defect. Cheers Ecke -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Photographers are terrorists
I'm catching up on irregular webcomic, which I feel is on a par with XKCD http://xkcd.com for both humor and geekiness. Though David Morgan-Mar does a much better job of explaining the science and math in the postscripts. Most of the episodes are photos of legos, but this one is a photo of himself: http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/2375.html The postscript however describes how he was searched on grounds of suspicious activity, potentially related to terrorism. I'll forgive him for being a Canonite since he is an optics engineer for Canon in Australia. http://www.flickr.com/people/dmmaus/ -- The first step is learning to take great photos, the second step is learning to throw away ones that are merely good. Larry Colen l...@red4est.comhttp://www.red4est.com/lrc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: Photographers are terrorists
How ridiculous. I'm catching up on irregular webcomic, which I feel is on a par with XKCD http://xkcd.com for both humor and geekiness. Though David Morgan-Mar does a much better job of explaining the science and math in the postscripts. Most of the episodes are photos of legos, but this one is a photo of himself: http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/2375.html The postscript however describes how he was searched on grounds of suspicious activity, potentially related to terrorism. I'll forgive him for being a Canonite since he is an optics engineer for Canon in Australia. http://www.flickr.com/people/dmmaus/ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers are terrorists
On Aug 28, 2009, at 14:01, Larry Colen wrote: I'm catching up on irregular webcomic, which I feel is on a par with XKCD http://xkcd.com for both humor and geekiness. Though David Morgan-Mar does a much better job of explaining the science and math in the postscripts. Most of the episodes are photos of legos, but this one is a photo of himself: http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/2375.html The postscript however describes how he was searched on grounds of suspicious activity, potentially related to terrorism. I'll forgive him for being a Canonite since he is an optics engineer for Canon in Australia. http://www.flickr.com/people/dmmaus/ Actually, apparently some photographers are more likely to be terrorists than others: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McB9tsabPn0 Amusing and sad at the same time. -Charles -- Charles Robinson - charl...@visi.com Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Photographers are terrorists
Larry Colen wrote: I'm catching up on irregular webcomic, which I feel is on a par with XKCD http://xkcd.com for both humor and geekiness. Though David Morgan-Mar does a much better job of explaining the science and math in the postscripts. Most of the episodes are photos of legos, but this one is a photo of himself: http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/2375.html The postscript however describes how he was searched on grounds of suspicious activity, potentially related to terrorism. I'll forgive him for being a Canonite since he is an optics engineer for Canon in Australia. http://www.flickr.com/people/dmmaus/ Amusing postscript. CISRA have done well nurturing RD in Australia. Went for a job there once. D -- der...@iinet.net.au http://members.iinet.net.au/~derbyc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
