Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
on 2012-10-11 6:58 Ann Sanfedele wrote "Efficient urban density" sounds chillingly Orwellian to me. it's just a straight ahead term, whereas in practice the more romantic term "landmark district" could represent a more Orwellian outcome cities are half machine/half organism; your neighborhood probably already has efficient urban density, and i bet no one there really needs a car but here the thriving local business district (which gives my home a walk score of 98) mostly depends on customers from away, who mostly arrive by car (though bikes are popular too); this also means the types of businesses don't really match the needs and desires of the neighborhood; this is inefficient; one could also phrase it more organically — "out of balance", "unhealthy" -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
On Oct 11, 2012, at 8:58 AM, Ann Sanfedele wrote: > > > Ditto what Frank wrote about Toronto, btw - I'm watching how fast the > high rise is going up at Astor Place as I pretty much pass there everyday. A couple of nights ago Letterman was talking about how your mayor has said that NYC doesn't have enough skyscrapers; Letterman's comment was that NYC definitely needs more buildings with Trump written on them. And he and Paul agreed that anyone's first impression of NYC must be "hmm, not enough tall buildings." stan -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
Of course, there's another side to it. Around here the buildings that really should have been preserved were demolished in the 50s & 60s. The only significant building that has been demolished recently was only significant because it was such a horrendously BUTT UGLY eye-sore! They did rescue a neighborhood of beautiful Victorian Gingerbread houses and there's a "historic district" to protect them and the plantation house of the father-in-law of the guy who sold the state of North Carolina the land for the original plan of Raleigh. They moved a log kitchen building where Andrew Johnson was born to the site & have rescued some other tiny historic buildings. The downside is that my house is on the fringe of the Historic District and every few years I have to have an argument with some asshole who doesn't like the "non-conforming modifications" that were made to the house 20 years before anyone even thought of having a historic preservation district(about 10 - 15 years before I bought it). From: "knarftheriault I agree. In this town we are fast losing our older.buildings (many of which have so much character) to the wrecking ball so ugly fifty floor condos can go up. These new buildings are so cheaply built that a local study estimates that the average life expectancy for these atrocities is 25-40 years. That means some condo owners will have their building fall down before they're done paying their mortgage. One building has been shedding its plate glass windows during windstorms causing the closure of a major downtown street and a multi-million dollar refit. Luckily no pedestrians or passing motorists were injured by the falling glass. But I digress; this is about historic designations. I'm in favour but the counterpoint is that once your building is so designated its value plummets. One is restricted in what renovations are permitted and because any renovations must be in keeping with the original architecture/design permitted renos are very expensive. Unfortunately these buildings end up being white elephants. Everyone loves them, no one wants to buy them. Cheers, frank -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
On 10/11/2012 01:58, steve harley wrote: on 2012-10-10 15:11 Ann Sanfedele wrote so for me personally it is much more than simply keeping the whole neighborhood from being overrun with luxury highrises and college dorms and well keep my building from going co-op or being demolished. i understand your perspective, and suspected you had an interest in the non-preservation side-effects; would you feel as strongly if you didn't have rent control? steve, I'd stay here by choice if I won the lottery... I'd never want to live anywhere else and hope I'll never be asked to for any reason. I've lived here since 1968 - it's home and I feel as strongly about it as if it were a house I'd built. The neighborhood is Cheers without the booze. But yes, very close (2 blocks away) another high-rise is going up across from Cooper Union... and then there is the NYU expansion. Ditto what Frank wrote about Toronto, btw - I'm watching how fast the high rise is going up at Astor Place as I pretty much pass there everyday. here, landmarking of several hundred mostly single-family homes has has done nothing to stop (and i would argue has partly caused) gentrification, sharply rising rents, and a trend toward undesirable development immediately adjacent to the landmark district; it will also make it harder for this neighborhood to reach efficient urban density "Efficient urban density" sounds chillingly Orwellian to me. ann -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
On Oct 11, 2012, at 4:55 AM, Ann Sanfedele wrote: > the on topic aspect is that I took all the photos in my Back In the Day > Calendar with my old Pentax Kx'en. Except for one taken in 1971 with a > RICOH(!) > > This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) > I'm right in the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) > breathing a sigh of relief > > http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission-approves-east-village-historic-district/ What a great idea. Reminds me of the historic Victorian district in Oamaru (or, if you believe iOS 6 maps, Oamuru). http://www.historicoamaru.co.nz/ Make sure you preserve as much as you can. They're tearing it down left & right here, just when I was starting to appreciate it. http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/christchurch-earthquake-2011/7781487/New-bids-to-save-Cranmer-Courts I think the Italians are a being bit more sensible... http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/7750474/Chch-can-learn-from-quake-hit-Italian-city Cheers, Dave -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
on 2012-10-10 15:11 Ann Sanfedele wrote so for me personally it is much more than simply keeping the whole neighborhood from being overrun with luxury highrises and college dorms and well keep my building from going co-op or being demolished. i understand your perspective, and suspected you had an interest in the non-preservation side-effects; would you feel as strongly if you didn't have rent control? here, landmarking of several hundred mostly single-family homes has has done nothing to stop (and i would argue has partly caused) gentrification, sharply rising rents, and a trend toward undesirable development immediately adjacent to the landmark district; it will also make it harder for this neighborhood to reach efficient urban density -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
Stan - if you find toe coordinates I'd be happy to - it could even be some place I already have photos of. But if it is "Just a block off Broadway" it's not near the UN. UN - east side, Broadway at the same "latitude" is on the west side. roughly a mile away. How neat that you live in an old house ann On 10/10/2012 22:24, Stan Halpin wrote: On Oct 10, 2012, at 3:13 PM, steve harley wrote: on 2012-10-10 9:55 Ann Sanfedele wrote This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) I'm right in the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) breathing a sigh of relief http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission-approves-east-village-historic-district/ hmmm … owning a house in a landmark district in Denver, and having a sense for architecture, i have a very mixed opinion of enforced historic preservation; it has been very messy in my neighborhood, and i live in fear, should i ever have the money to do major work on my house, of the edicts of Landmark Preservation Commission; meanwhile many of my neighbors find ways to skirt the regulations (mostly by failing to pull permits) and cause obvious harm to the historic fabric i think strict historic preservation should be used very selectively, but i also wish people in general had more consciousness of architecture and urban design Steve, the house we lived in in Kansas City is 175 years old this year. Young by European standards but historic in this context. Two log cabins provide the base for the Federal-style farm house it appears today.The oldest or 2nd oldest house in the county. I could easily have gotten a National Historic Landmark designation but the downside would have been the possibility of renovation restrictions. Ann, Meg's step-mother's grandmother owned a small apartment building "just a block off Broadway" back in the 1910's-1920's. Sometime when you feel like an excuse for a photowalk, we'll dig out the address and ask you for a few images of what it is like today. Ofhand I am not sure of the cross street but did a Google search on it a few years ago and the U.N. appeared to be nearby. stan -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
I agree. In this town we are fast losing our older.buildings (many of which have so much character) to the wrecking ball so ugly fifty floor condos can go up. These new buildings are so cheaply built that a local study estimates that the average life expectancy for these atrocities is 25-40 years. That means some condo owners will have their building fall down before they're done paying their mortgage. One building has been shedding its plate glass windows during windstorms causing the closure of a major downtown street and a multi-million dollar refit. Luckily no pedestrians or passing motorists were injured by the falling glass. But I digress; this is about historic designations. I'm in favour but the counterpoint is that once your building is so designated its value plummets. One is restricted in what renovations are permitted and because any renovations must be in keeping with the original architecture/design permitted renos are very expensive. Unfortunately these buildings end up being white elephants. Everyone loves them, no one wants to buy them. Cheers, frank "What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." -- Christopher Hitchens --- Original Message --- From: Bob W Sent: October 10, 2012 10/10/12 To: "'Pentax-Discuss Mail List'" Subject: RE: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC > From: PDML [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of Ann Sanfedele > > the on topic aspect is that I took all the photos in my Back In the Day > Calendar with my old Pentax Kx'en. Except for one taken in 1971 with a > RICOH(!) > > This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) I'm right in > the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) breathing a > sigh of relief > > http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission- > approves-east-village-historic-district/ > that's great - it's nice living in a historic place, and knowing it will be more or less properly looked after. Maybe they'll turn it into a World Heritage site. B -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
Great news, Ann! Now you can be sure that your building won't become just a memory of what used to be -- replaced with million collar condos. Paul On Oct 10, 2012, at 11:55 AM, Ann Sanfedele wrote: > the on topic aspect is that I took all the photos in my Back In the Day > Calendar with my old Pentax Kx'en. Except for one taken in 1971 with a > RICOH(!) > > This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) > I'm right in the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) > breathing a sigh of relief > > http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission-approves-east-village-historic-district/ > > ann > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
On Oct 10, 2012, at 3:13 PM, steve harley wrote: > on 2012-10-10 9:55 Ann Sanfedele wrote >> This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) >> I'm right in the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) >> breathing a sigh of relief >> >> http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission-approves-east-village-historic-district/ > > hmmm … owning a house in a landmark district in Denver, and having a sense > for architecture, i have a very mixed opinion of enforced historic > preservation; it has been very messy in my neighborhood, and i live in fear, > should i ever have the money to do major work on my house, of the edicts of > Landmark Preservation Commission; meanwhile many of my neighbors find ways to > skirt the regulations (mostly by failing to pull permits) and cause obvious > harm to the historic fabric > > i think strict historic preservation should be used very selectively, but i > also wish people in general had more consciousness of architecture and urban > design > Steve, the house we lived in in Kansas City is 175 years old this year. Young by European standards but historic in this context. Two log cabins provide the base for the Federal-style farm house it appears today.The oldest or 2nd oldest house in the county. I could easily have gotten a National Historic Landmark designation but the downside would have been the possibility of renovation restrictions. Ann, Meg's step-mother's grandmother owned a small apartment building "just a block off Broadway" back in the 1910's-1920's. Sometime when you feel like an excuse for a photowalk, we'll dig out the address and ask you for a few images of what it is like today. Ofhand I am not sure of the cross street but did a Google search on it a few years ago and the U.N. appeared to be nearby. stan -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
Steve - I rent - and have lived here for 40 years. My rent has been fixed because of my age and the fact that when we moved in it was under rent control and as such, given my age, my rent will never go up. Good thing or I'd be in a homeless shelter or worse. For my landlord's sake, there are two of 11 aparmtents getting full market rent, and he is a prety good guy so I don't think this building would have gone, but you never know. so for me personally it is much more than simply keeping the whole neighborhood from being overrun with luxury highrises and college dorms and well keep my building from going co-op or being demolished. And a few of you know first hand how lucky I am :-) But, of course, anything can be messed up by committees. ann On 10/10/2012 15:13, steve harley wrote: on 2012-10-10 9:55 Ann Sanfedele wrote This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) I'm right in the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) breathing a sigh of relief http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission-approves-east-village-historic-district/ hmmm … owning a house in a landmark district in Denver, and having a sense for architecture, i have a very mixed opinion of enforced historic preservation; it has been very messy in my neighborhood, and i live in fear, should i ever have the money to do major work on my house, of the edicts of Landmark Preservation Commission; meanwhile many of my neighbors find ways to skirt the regulations (mostly by failing to pull permits) and cause obvious harm to the historic fabric i think strict historic preservation should be used very selectively, but i also wish people in general had more consciousness of architecture and urban design -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
on 2012-10-10 9:55 Ann Sanfedele wrote This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) I'm right in the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) breathing a sigh of relief http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission-approves-east-village-historic-district/ hmmm … owning a house in a landmark district in Denver, and having a sense for architecture, i have a very mixed opinion of enforced historic preservation; it has been very messy in my neighborhood, and i live in fear, should i ever have the money to do major work on my house, of the edicts of Landmark Preservation Commission; meanwhile many of my neighbors find ways to skirt the regulations (mostly by failing to pull permits) and cause obvious harm to the historic fabric i think strict historic preservation should be used very selectively, but i also wish people in general had more consciousness of architecture and urban design -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: OT and not OT - Landmark Preservation in NYC
> From: PDML [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of Ann Sanfedele > > the on topic aspect is that I took all the photos in my Back In the Day > Calendar with my old Pentax Kx'en. Except for one taken in 1971 with a > RICOH(!) > > This was in todays NY times (at least the online version) I'm right in > the middle of the area (7th st between 1st and 2nd ave) breathing a > sigh of relief > > http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/09/landmarks-commission- > approves-east-village-historic-district/ > that's great - it's nice living in a historic place, and knowing it will be more or less properly looked after. Maybe they'll turn it into a World Heritage site. B -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
