Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread Bulent Celasun
Are you aware that you can only compare the results of similar
(MP-wise) camera body-lens pairs?
If you do so (and, compare K5 with D700 etc), the results are not much
different.

Remember, they are also the ones who scored the K5 body higher than
much more expensive C/N bodies.

Bulent
-
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bc_the_path/
http://photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=2226822
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artists/bulentcelasun


2012/11/21 Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com:
 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 Jack

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread Jack Davis
That's completely contrary to my impression of test results for both Canon and 
Nikon.

Jack 

- Original Message -
From: Larry Colen l...@red4est.com
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 9:32 PM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests


On Nov 20, 2012, at 2:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

I looked at a few Pentax lenses, then went and looked at some nikkor glass, and 
it wasn't doing much better in the scores.


--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread Jack Davis
In my initial post I thought I acknowledged awareness of those factors, Bulent.
Review each brand individually and give me your impression of the comparative 
results.

 
Jack
- Original Message -
From: Bulent Celasun bulent.cela...@gmail.com
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 12:30 AM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

Are you aware that you can only compare the results of similar
(MP-wise) camera body-lens pairs?
If you do so (and, compare K5 with D700 etc), the results are not much
different.

Remember, they are also the ones who scored the K5 body higher than
much more expensive C/N bodies.

Bulent
-
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bc_the_path/
http://photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=2226822
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artists/bulentcelasun


2012/11/21 Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com:
 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 Jack

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread Bulent Celasun
Jack, I also had a very critical attitude (to say it politely) towards them.
I was also surprised to see even a top model Pentax lens-body combo
got unimpressive scores.
Then, I calmed down by accepting the limits of those analyses.

Let me tell you about my impression on a specific situation;
If we could put the DA 55mm f/1.4 lens on a 24MP (nonexistent) Pentax body,
that combo will likely get an appreciably higher score. Do you agree?

A body-independent lens test (if possible at all) might be more informative.
However, it will probably be of not much use as a body is needed
anyway to shoot with it...

I still believe, though, the presentation of their test results might
be modified for a better user experience.

Bulent
-
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bc_the_path/
http://photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=2226822
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artists/bulentcelasun


2012/11/21 Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com:
 In my initial post I thought I acknowledged awareness of those factors, 
 Bulent.
 Review each brand individually and give me your impression of the comparative 
 results.


 Jack
 - Original Message -
 From: Bulent Celasun bulent.cela...@gmail.com
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
 Cc:
 Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 12:30 AM
 Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

 Are you aware that you can only compare the results of similar
 (MP-wise) camera body-lens pairs?
 If you do so (and, compare K5 with D700 etc), the results are not much
 different.

 Remember, they are also the ones who scored the K5 body higher than
 much more expensive C/N bodies.

 Bulent
 -
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/bc_the_path/
 http://photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=2226822
 http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artists/bulentcelasun


 2012/11/21 Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com:
 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 Jack

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread Jack Davis
Yes, I agree that the lens/body combo has to be considered relevant. Why that 
isn't spoken to is somewhat of a mystery. 
When the tests included a K-5 body I'll admit to expecting an up-tick in the 
test scores.
I wonder if Kenny Boy is behind this...hm(?)
To be clear, my depression is really dismay.

Jack

- Original Message -
From: Bulent Celasun bulent.cela...@gmail.com
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 4:38 AM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

Jack, I also had a very critical attitude (to say it politely) towards them.
I was also surprised to see even a top model Pentax lens-body combo
got unimpressive scores.
Then, I calmed down by accepting the limits of those analyses.

Let me tell you about my impression on a specific situation;
If we could put the DA 55mm f/1.4 lens on a 24MP (nonexistent) Pentax body,
that combo will likely get an appreciably higher score. Do you agree?

A body-independent lens test (if possible at all) might be more informative.
However, it will probably be of not much use as a body is needed
anyway to shoot with it...

I still believe, though, the presentation of their test results might
be modified for a better user experience.

Bulent
-
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bc_the_path/
http://photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=2226822
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artists/bulentcelasun


2012/11/21 Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com:
 In my initial post I thought I acknowledged awareness of those factors, 
 Bulent.
 Review each brand individually and give me your impression of the comparative 
 results.


 Jack
 - Original Message -
 From: Bulent Celasun bulent.cela...@gmail.com
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
 Cc:
 Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 12:30 AM
 Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

 Are you aware that you can only compare the results of similar
 (MP-wise) camera body-lens pairs?
 If you do so (and, compare K5 with D700 etc), the results are not much
 different.

 Remember, they are also the ones who scored the K5 body higher than
 much more expensive C/N bodies.

 Bulent
 -
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/bc_the_path/
 http://photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=2226822
 http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artists/bulentcelasun


 2012/11/21 Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com:
 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 Jack

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread P. J. Alling
Back in the antediluvian age of film, Modern Photography, or maybe it 
was Popular Photography after they absorbed Modern, adopted the 43mm 
limited as their reference lens because it was the best all around lens 
they had ever tested. That lens hasn't changed since then really, so 
testing criteria must have.


On 11/20/2012 5:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:

I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
I dare anyone to make me feel better?
  
Jack





--
Don't lose heart, they might want to cut it out, and they'll want to avoid a 
lengthly search.


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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread David J Brooks
On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 12:26 AM, Larry Colen l...@red4est.com wrote:

 On Nov 20, 2012, at 2:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 When they publish something like:

 Latest camera lense reviews

 How credible can they be, when they can't even spell lens?

They took my spelling classes, that counts, no.??

Dave



 --
 Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread Jack Davis
Pop Photo's long standing testing method is confined on the lens only. As I 
roughly understand it, the lenses are firmly affixed to a bench, a beam of 
light (laser?) shown through them and by some unknown method, the light 
dispersion (or?) is/are then measured. 
They have always referred to their published results as being subjective. 
Suppose they are referring to the converting of measured results to print sizes.

Jack
 
- Original Message -
From: P. J. Alling webstertwenty...@gmail.com
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 6:47 AM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

Back in the antediluvian age of film, Modern Photography, or maybe it was 
Popular Photography after they absorbed Modern, adopted the 43mm limited as 
their reference lens because it was the best all around lens they had ever 
tested. That lens hasn't changed since then really, so testing criteria must 
have.

On 11/20/2012 5:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:
 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.
  I dare anyone to make me feel better?
  Jack
 


-- Don't lose heart, they might want to cut it out, and they'll want to avoid a 
lengthly search.


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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-21 Thread Jack Davis
I didn't notice the misspelling. What spelling grade do I get?

Jack ;-) 

- Original Message -
From: David J Brooks pentko...@gmail.com
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 6:55 AM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 12:26 AM, Larry Colen l...@red4est.com wrote:

 On Nov 20, 2012, at 2:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 When they publish something like:

 Latest camera lense reviews

 How credible can they be, when they can't even spell lens?

They took my spelling classes, that counts, no.??

Dave



 --
 Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Charles Robinson
On Nov 20, 2012, at 16:04 , Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
 I dare anyone to make me feel better? 

I guess it all depends on what you're doing with your cameras.  Taking 
pictures, or trying to pass tests?

 -Charles

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Minneapolis, MN
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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread David J Brooks
On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 5:19 PM, Charles Robinson charl...@visi.com wrote:
 On Nov 20, 2012, at 16:04 , Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 I guess it all depends on what you're doing with your cameras.  Taking 
 pictures, or trying to pass tests?

MARK

  -Charles

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 Minneapolis, MN
 http://charles.robinsontwins.org
 http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson


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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread David Savage
On 21 November 2012 06:04, Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

http://500px.com/photo/18422461

:-P

DS

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Charles Robinson
On Nov 20, 2012, at 16:25 , David Savage ozsav...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 21 November 2012 06:04, Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
 I dare anyone to make me feel better?
 
 http://500px.com/photo/18422461
 

Me and my shared work-cube environment only got a glimpse at that before 
closing.

Warning, y'all.

(I will save the link for later)

 -Charles

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread David Savage
On 21 November 2012 07:23, Charles Robinson charl...@visi.com wrote:
 On Nov 20, 2012, at 16:25 , David Savage ozsav...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 21 November 2012 06:04, Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

 http://500px.com/photo/18422461


 Me and my shared work-cube environment only got a glimpse at that before 
 closing.

 Warning, y'all.

 (I will save the link for later)

:-D

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Paul Stenquist
It appears that only a very few Pentax lenses have been tested.

On Nov 20, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
 I dare anyone to make me feel better? 
  
 Jack
 
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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread P. J. Alling
Their test results seem to run counter to most other sites, so there's 
that.


On 11/20/2012 5:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:

I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
I dare anyone to make me feel better?
  
Jack





--
Don't lose heart, they might want to cut it out, and they'll want to avoid a 
lengthly search.


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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Igor Roshchin

Jack, 

Maybe experience-based (!) personal opinions of many people about various 
Pentax lenses would help you: http://stans-photography.info/ .
While, naturally, it might be skewed and not objective, what ultimately
matters is your own experience with the lenses.


For the lenses that you already have, - don't read reviews, - if you
are happy with them, - just enjoy.
For the lenses that you don't have, - you can save money if you don't
buy them. Use the money to fund experiences (travel?) where you
can use your existing lenses.

;-)

Cheers,
Igor

PS You can also look at http://plg.komkon.org at links therein.
Those are somewhat dated, but contain a lot of interesting test results
if that's what you are interested in.

On Nov 20, 2012, at 16:04 , Jack Davis jdavisf8 at yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results.
 Even allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group
 they demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
 I dare anyone to make me feel better? 


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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Jack Davis
OK, that did it. Thanks, Dave! ;-))

Jack
 
- Original Message -
From: David Savage ozsav...@gmail.com
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 2:25 PM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

On 21 November 2012 06:04, Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?

http://500px.com/photo/18422461

:-P

DS

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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Jack Davis
Without going back to check, shudder I believe there were 3 ugly pages.

Jack
 
- Original Message -
From: Paul Stenquist pnstenqu...@comcast.net
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

It appears that only a very few Pentax lenses have been tested.

On Nov 20, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
 I dare anyone to make me feel better? 
  
 Jack
 
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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Jack Davis
Guess I unintentionally made my funk sound more serious than I intended.
My lengthy experience has been completely contrary to what one might assume 
from these nefarious test results.
Just thought there might be some founded negative history of these particular 
testers.

Comments appreciated, Igor.

Jack


- Original Message -
From: Igor Roshchin s...@komkon.org
To: PDML@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 5:46 PM
Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests


Jack, 

Maybe experience-based (!) personal opinions of many people about various 
Pentax lenses would help you: http://stans-photography.info/ .
While, naturally, it might be skewed and not objective, what ultimately
matters is your own experience with the lenses.


For the lenses that you already have, - don't read reviews, - if you
are happy with them, - just enjoy.
For the lenses that you don't have, - you can save money if you don't
buy them. Use the money to fund experiences (travel?) where you
can use your existing lenses.

;-)

Cheers,
Igor

PS You can also look at http://plg.komkon.org/ at links therein.
Those are somewhat dated, but contain a lot of interesting test results
if that's what you are interested in.

On Nov 20, 2012, at 16:04 , Jack Davis jdavisf8 at yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results.
 Even allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group
 they demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
 I dare anyone to make me feel better? 


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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Bob Sullivan
Jack,
I don't have a lot of new lenes.
The ones I have are really excellent.
The DA50-250/4 is truely special.
The DA55/1.4 is outstanding, wonderfully sharp portraits.
You know the 31, 43, and 77 limited are all extraordinary.
Stop worring about this.
Regards,  Bob S.


On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 8:16 PM, Jack Davis jdavi...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Guess I unintentionally made my funk sound more serious than I intended.
 My lengthy experience has been completely contrary to what one might assume 
 from these nefarious test results.
 Just thought there might be some founded negative history of these particular 
 testers.

 Comments appreciated, Igor.

 Jack


 - Original Message -
 From: Igor Roshchin s...@komkon.org
 To: PDML@pdml.net
 Cc:
 Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 5:46 PM
 Subject: Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests


 Jack,

 Maybe experience-based (!) personal opinions of many people about various
 Pentax lenses would help you: http://stans-photography.info/ .
 While, naturally, it might be skewed and not objective, what ultimately
 matters is your own experience with the lenses.


 For the lenses that you already have, - don't read reviews, - if you
 are happy with them, - just enjoy.
 For the lenses that you don't have, - you can save money if you don't
 buy them. Use the money to fund experiences (travel?) where you
 can use your existing lenses.

 ;-)

 Cheers,
 Igor

 PS You can also look at http://plg.komkon.org/ at links therein.
 Those are somewhat dated, but contain a lot of interesting test results
 if that's what you are interested in.

 On Nov 20, 2012, at 16:04 , Jack Davis jdavisf8 at yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results.
 Even allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group
 they demonstrate pitiful performance.

 I dare anyone to make me feel better?


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 PDML@pdml.net
 http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
 to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow 
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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Larry Colen

On Nov 20, 2012, at 2:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.
  
 I dare anyone to make me feel better? 

When they publish something like:

Latest camera lense reviews

How credible can they be, when they can't even spell lens?

 

--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: DXOMark Pentax Lens Tests

2012-11-20 Thread Larry Colen

On Nov 20, 2012, at 2:04 PM, Jack Davis wrote:

 I'm sort of in a funk after reading DXO's Pentax lens test results. Even 
 allowing for some older MP and camera technology, as a test group they 
 demonstrate pitiful performance.

I looked at a few Pentax lenses, then went and looked at some nikkor glass, and 
it wasn't doing much better in the scores.


--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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