RE: on urban violence (fwd)
On Tue, 15 Feb 1994, Doug Henwood wrote: Jipson Art asked for more info on my assertion that NYC has a lower crime rate than suburbs gone wild like Dallas and Atlanta, and that there is no relation between pop density and crime. Here are the details. Doug, The problem with your table is (to be a sociologist for a minute), I don't trust the validity of crime statistics between different cities. Murder rates are relatively reliable, although even that can be problematic at times. Do police departments treat homicide, manslaughter and "accidents" in the exact same way? What crimes are pursued or even reported vary based on the racial breakdown of the cops and the communities served. Another issue is how crime effects most in the community. DC is known for having a high murder rate, but most of the murders are concentrated in the drug trade against other criminals, which is different from some other cities where murder effects the rest of the population more directly. The bottom line is whether higher crime rates in Atlanta or Dallas reflect more crimes or a higher willingness to report crimes to the police? The city of Berkeley where I live has the highest rate of felonies per capita in the state. It is a rather dangerous city but this may also reflect the rather abnormal (but generally non-lethal) outbreaks of riots on Telegraph Avenue. I would say that it is a fair statement that the majority of crimes are not reported to the police, especially crimes that are between gangs or others involved in criminal activity. (The low crime rate in LA is awfully suspicious on this point). Given this, while statistics are always useful, crime stats have to be taken with a bit of skepticism. Crime, even murder, is not a homogeneous category and the left needs to challenge the numerical game of measuring crime. Crime is an intangible in people's lives that harms their sense of security, or freedom, and hope for the future (not to different or unrelated to the effects of capitalism as a whole). It is also part of a social process that simplistic solutions like "three strikes and you're out" focused on those numbers will inevitable miss. I caught Jerry Brown on C-SPAN (where they were filming his new radio show). He did an amazingly good job of challenging the idiocy of the current hysteria over "three strikes" while focusing on jobs, opportunity and hope. He even had on a woman involved in the East Bay Conservation Corps to embody his alternative, all without sounding "soft." One of the best lines he gave was noting that when he was governor, he beat his breast as much as anyone over crime and increased sentences and so on, prison populations soared, yet crime increased. Jerry does a great "sinner redeemed" routine in his populist attacks. It may be worth catching his show. --Nathan Newman
RE: on urban violence (fwd)
One reason why the crime rate is so low in Los Angeles is that what the L.A.P.D. does is generally considered to be legal. (not to mention the Sheriff's Department.) in pen-l solidarity, Jim Devine BITNET: jndf@lmuacadINTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Econ. Dept., Loyola Marymount Univ., Los Angeles, CA 90045-2699 USA 310/338-2948 (off); 310/202-6546 (hm); FAX: 310/338-1950
Re: on urban violence (fwd)
The US is one of the least densely populated countries in the world, yet it's one of the most violent. NYC is our most densely populated city but its violent crime rate is lower than the overgrown suburbs called Dallas and Atlanta. Can't be density, can it? Doug Doug Henwood [[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Left Business Observer 212-874-4020 (voice) 212-874-3137 (fax) On Fri, 11 Feb 1994, Jim Devine wrote: There might be a better spin on the "hyperactive monkeys" analogy about urban youth (though I hate any animal analogies about people especially about minorities). Awhile back they did experiments on normally calm rats (and also monkeys, I believe). Crowding them together led to a dramatic rise in anti-social behavior. So one might conclude that the problem is not the rats or the monkeys but their environment. Unfortunately, the political intellectual establishments, including Mr. Bill, don't follow that interpretation. But it's a point against them. in pen-l solidarity, Jim Devine BITNET: jndf@lmuacad. INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Econ. Dept., Loyola Marymount Univ., Los Angeles, CA 90045-2699 USA 310/338-2948 (off); 310/202-6546 (hm); FAX: 310/338-1950
RE: on urban violence (fwd)
Jipson Art asked for more info on my assertion that NYC has a lower crime rate than suburbs gone wild like Dallas and Atlanta, and that there is no relation between pop density and crime. Here are the details. For more, see the forthcoming LBO #62 as well as my social atlas, The State of the United States, forthcoming from Simon Schuster this fall. Apologies for the self-promotion, but such are the pressures of commerce. Apologies too for any formatting oddities. Doug Doug Henwood [[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Left Business Observer 250 W 85 St NY NY 10024 212-874-4020 (voice) 212-874-3137 (fax) CRIME: PERCEPTION, REALITY, AND POPULATION DENSITY % seeing violent crimes per population rankings city as 100,000 population - land --- unsafe, -- per sq areaun- violent homi- pop 1990 all homicide mile 1,000s (sq mi) safe crime cide density Atlanta 39%4,041.1 50.9 2,989 394 131.8 9 2 3 2 Boston29%2,066.4 19.712,451 57446.110 81113 Chicago 65%32.912,2542,784 227.2 5 712 Dallas26%2,568.3 48.6 2,9441,008 342.412 4 4 1 Detroit 68%2,727.3 59.3 7,4121,028 138.7 4 3 2 7 Houston 25%1,599.9 36.5 3,0211,631 539.913 10 5 3 Los Angeles 64%2,525.8 28.9 7,4263,485 469.3 6 5 9 8 Miami 76%4,252.0 36.410,084 35935.6 2 1 610 Minneapolis 11%1,577.5 17.1 6,703 36854.915 1112 6 New York 85%2,318.2 29.323,6997,323 309.0 1 7 815 Philadelphia 40%1,408.0 27.611,7391,586 135.1 8 121011 San Diego 28%1,219.9 14.7 3,4291,111 324.011 1413 4 San Francisco 43%1,645.4 12.915,503 72446.7 7 91414 Seattle 16%1,356.3 8.1 6,150 51683.914 1315 5 Washington DC 71%2,452.3 80.6 9,886 60761.4 3 6 1 9 correl with pop dens -0.05 -0.16-0.62 0.03 0.26 sourcescrime: U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics, Sourcebook of Criminal Justice Statistics 1992 (Washington, DC, BJS, 1993), tables 2.27 and 3.128 population land area: Statistical Abstract of the US, 1993
Re: on urban violence (fwd)
There might be a better spin on the "hyperactive monkeys" analogy about urban youth (though I hate any animal analogies about people especially about minorities). Awhile back they did experiments on normally calm rats (and also monkeys, I believe). Crowding them together led to a dramatic rise in anti-social behavior. So one might conclude that the problem is not the rats or the monkeys but their environment. Unfortunately, the political intellectual establishments, including Mr. Bill, don't follow that interpretation. But it's a point against them. in pen-l solidarity, Jim Devine BITNET: jndf@lmuacad. INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Econ. Dept., Loyola Marymount Univ., Los Angeles, CA 90045-2699 USA 310/338-2948 (off); 310/202-6546 (hm); FAX: 310/338-1950
