Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
I agree. But I have a friend who thinks an item is worthless unless he sees it sell for a lot on ebay then gets more interested in it, and will only bid on something unless it is extremely cheap or he knows there are <10 known. I keep arguing with him about this but it doesn't seem to matter. I thought Chuck said 2 more turned up recently, making 9, if he was already counting those then I guess there are 6. But those last 3 or 4 showed up in the last few showed up recently so there is hope. I guess it matters if I was going to try and restore a basket case machine. Unless it is rare it is not worth the bother. But there are things I have that maybe 3 or 4 exist and they are still not worth much or very interesting. -Barry On 4/17/2011 12:57 AM, Bruce Mercer wrote: As I said before, I collect these machines not because there are few known or the $ value. I collect them because they are wonderful machines. Just because I happen to have a relatively "rare" machine does not make me the type of collector that has to crow about it. I didn't bring up the subject of that thread and posted more as a joke. Apparently I didn't make that clear. I do remember saying that I hope many more C-1s are found. Everybody should be able to enjoy one. It only took me 50 years of constant looking to find one. If there are more than six both myself and Chuck would like to know about them and their serial numbers. Can you provide the serial numbers or names of the owners of those other four (or so) machines? I would be interested, and I know Chuck would be very surprised, meaning they would have had to have turned up in the last couple days. If that is the case he will have a BIG surprise in store. Idle speculation is just that. It's much the same in collecting reproducing pianos or rare radios like a Zenith Stratosphere or old cars like a Packard. The unconfirmed babble is often tainted with a little jealousy, envyor I'm not sure what. Sad. (just the facts ma'am) I do agree with Bill on one point, the C-2 upright is easier to load. On the other hand, the C-1 doesn't have that much wasted space in the cabinet. The top part is taken up by the turntable on the left and the radio tuner chassis on the right. Below are four generous record storage drawers on both sides of the grill cloth which has two oversized speakers stacked vertically in the back with a large power amp sitting on the floor. There is not much dead space. The C-2 has plenty of power but obviously can't match the power of the C-1. Having the turntable area lit helps quite a bit in sitting down the pickup but it's still a bit awkward and is really the only complaint I have with the design. I 'still' want to lift the lid. Bruce Mercer - Original Message - From: "bta...@realtick.com" To: "Antique Phonograph List" Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:10 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known I hope someday to own a C-2, I think it is just an amazingly cool machine. The rarity does not really even factor into it at all. The combination pickup for lateral & DD, the radio technology, the fact it is the end of an era. I actually like the C-2 better than the C-1 only in that the C-1 is just so big and looks like a phonograph was jammed in as an afterthought making record loading etc kind of awkward, although it certainly is a beautiful piece. Bill On 4/15/11 12:05 PM, "Barry Kasindorf" wrote: Like The Edison C-2, I thought it was so rare I would never hope to have one. I have had 3. And Chuck Azzalina had 7 in his basement last time I was there to fix. He started keeping count thinking the number surviving was in the 10's and stopped at 200 or so known. Same with C-1. There were 2 know for the longest time, then 2 more showed up then 1 more now I think there are about 10 or so out there. It isn't how many but how cool they are. C-1 and C-2 are very special machines and would be cool if there were 2000 left. I actually prefer if something I like is common, it means I can afford it :-). Collecting just so you can say you have 1 of only 2 known is what some people collect for but I am not one of them. -Barry On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 10:56 AM, Steven Medved wrote: Bruce, In the case of a machine like yours even if if there are twice as many existing as are currently known it is a very hard to find machine. Steve Steve, I agree completely and hope for collectors interested in these machines that at least a few more will be found. The thing that supports the 'few' is that they were made for only a year (more like 10 months), were very expensive and a good estimate of orginal production numbered about 200 machines. Frow wasn't much help. It seems that somebody at the National Monument could be a scource of desperately needed information regarding that machine and the number mfg.. I bought the machine from Charley H. and in
Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
As I said before, I collect these machines not because there are few known or the $ value. I collect them because they are wonderful machines. Just because I happen to have a relatively "rare" machine does not make me the type of collector that has to crow about it. I didn't bring up the subject of that thread and posted more as a joke. Apparently I didn't make that clear. I do remember saying that I hope many more C-1s are found. Everybody should be able to enjoy one. It only took me 50 years of constant looking to find one. If there are more than six both myself and Chuck would like to know about them and their serial numbers. Can you provide the serial numbers or names of the owners of those other four (or so) machines? I would be interested, and I know Chuck would be very surprised, meaning they would have had to have turned up in the last couple days. If that is the case he will have a BIG surprise in store. Idle speculation is just that. It's much the same in collecting reproducing pianos or rare radios like a Zenith Stratosphere or old cars like a Packard. The unconfirmed babble is often tainted with a little jealousy, envyor I'm not sure what. Sad. (just the facts ma'am) I do agree with Bill on one point, the C-2 upright is easier to load. On the other hand, the C-1 doesn't have that much wasted space in the cabinet. The top part is taken up by the turntable on the left and the radio tuner chassis on the right. Below are four generous record storage drawers on both sides of the grill cloth which has two oversized speakers stacked vertically in the back with a large power amp sitting on the floor. There is not much dead space. The C-2 has plenty of power but obviously can't match the power of the C-1. Having the turntable area lit helps quite a bit in sitting down the pickup but it's still a bit awkward and is really the only complaint I have with the design. I 'still' want to lift the lid. Bruce Mercer - Original Message - From: "bta...@realtick.com" To: "Antique Phonograph List" Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:10 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known I hope someday to own a C-2, I think it is just an amazingly cool machine. The rarity does not really even factor into it at all. The combination pickup for lateral & DD, the radio technology, the fact it is the end of an era. I actually like the C-2 better than the C-1 only in that the C-1 is just so big and looks like a phonograph was jammed in as an afterthought making record loading etc kind of awkward, although it certainly is a beautiful piece. Bill On 4/15/11 12:05 PM, "Barry Kasindorf" wrote: Like The Edison C-2, I thought it was so rare I would never hope to have one. I have had 3. And Chuck Azzalina had 7 in his basement last time I was there to fix. He started keeping count thinking the number surviving was in the 10's and stopped at 200 or so known. Same with C-1. There were 2 know for the longest time, then 2 more showed up then 1 more now I think there are about 10 or so out there. It isn't how many but how cool they are. C-1 and C-2 are very special machines and would be cool if there were 2000 left. I actually prefer if something I like is common, it means I can afford it :-). Collecting just so you can say you have 1 of only 2 known is what some people collect for but I am not one of them. -Barry On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 10:56 AM, Steven Medved wrote: Bruce, In the case of a machine like yours even if if there are twice as many existing as are currently known it is a very hard to find machine. Steve Steve, I agree completely and hope for collectors interested in these machines that at least a few more will be found. The thing that supports the 'few' is that they were made for only a year (more like 10 months), were very expensive and a good estimate of orginal production numbered about 200 machines. Frow wasn't much help. It seems that somebody at the National Monument could be a scource of desperately needed information regarding that machine and the number mfg.. I bought the machine from Charley H. and in talking with him and at least one other rabid collector, those are the numbers that are known and a good guess as to the number built. Charley told me he had gotten the machine from the original owner in N.J., somebody that had worked for Edison. There were many old pictures, some autographed, all to do with Edison or the Company on the walls, when he got the machine. He thought it to be someone high up in the Company. As far as I'm concerned I hope 100 more turn up sooner than later. It wouldn't affect the value of mine in the least, not to me anyway. Spread the happiness. Very best, Bruce M. ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org -- -Barry ___
Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
I hope someday to own a C-2, I think it is just an amazingly cool machine. The rarity does not really even factor into it at all. The combination pickup for lateral & DD, the radio technology, the fact it is the end of an era. I actually like the C-2 better than the C-1 only in that the C-1 is just so big and looks like a phonograph was jammed in as an afterthought making record loading etc kind of awkward, although it certainly is a beautiful piece. Bill On 4/15/11 12:05 PM, "Barry Kasindorf" wrote: >Like The Edison C-2, I thought it was so rare I would never hope to >have one. I have had 3. And Chuck Azzalina had 7 in his basement last >time I was there to fix. He started keeping count thinking the number >surviving was in the 10's and stopped at 200 or so known. Same with >C-1. There were 2 know for the longest time, then 2 more showed up >then 1 more now I think there are about 10 or so out there. It isn't >how many but how cool they are. C-1 and C-2 are very special machines >and would be cool if there were 2000 left. I actually prefer if >something I like is common, it means I can afford it :-). Collecting >just so you can say you have 1 of only 2 known is what some people >collect for but I am not one of them. >-Barry > > >On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 10:56 AM, Steven Medved >wrote: >> >> Bruce, >> >> In the case of a machine like yours even if if there are twice as many >>existing as are currently known it is a very hard to find machine. >> >> Steve >>> Steve, I agree completely and hope for collectors interested in these >>> machines that at least a few more will be found. The thing that >>>supports the >>> 'few' is that they were made for only a year (more like 10 months), >>>were >>> very expensive and a good estimate of orginal production numbered >>>about 200 >>> machines. Frow wasn't much help. It seems that somebody at the National >>> Monument could be a scource of desperately needed information >>>regarding that >>> machine and the number mfg.. I bought the machine from Charley H. and >>>in >>> talking with him and at least one other rabid collector, those are the >>> numbers that are known and a good guess as to the number built. >>>Charley told >>> me he had gotten the machine from the original owner in N.J., somebody >>>that >>> had worked for Edison. There were many old pictures, some autographed, >>>all >>> to do with Edison or the Company on the walls, when he got the >>>machine. He >>> thought it to be someone high up in the Company. >>> As far as I'm concerned I hope 100 more turn up sooner than later. It >>> wouldn't affect the value of mine in the least, not to me anyway. >>>Spread the >>> happiness. >>> >>> Very best, >>> Bruce M. >> >> ___ >> Phono-L mailing list >> http://phono-l.oldcrank.org >> > > > >-- >-Barry >___ >Phono-L mailing list >http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
Barry, With regards to machines like the Amberola 60 and 80 I have tried to research how many were made or left and so far I have not had much luck. I think it is great to see how many machines were made and how many survive. > Like The Edison C-2, I thought it was so rare I would never hope to > have one. I have had 3. And Chuck Azzalina had 7 in his basement last > time I was there to fix. He started keeping count thinking the number > surviving was in the 10's and stopped at 200 or so known. Same with > C-1. There were 2 know for the longest time, then 2 more showed up > then 1 more now I think there are about 10 or so out there. It isn't > how many but how cool they are. C-1 and C-2 are very special machines > and would be cool if there were 2000 left. I actually prefer if > something I like is common, it means I can afford it :-). Collecting > just so you can say you have 1 of only 2 known is what some people > collect for but I am not one of them. > -Barry ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
Like The Edison C-2, I thought it was so rare I would never hope to have one. I have had 3. And Chuck Azzalina had 7 in his basement last time I was there to fix. He started keeping count thinking the number surviving was in the 10's and stopped at 200 or so known. Same with C-1. There were 2 know for the longest time, then 2 more showed up then 1 more now I think there are about 10 or so out there. It isn't how many but how cool they are. C-1 and C-2 are very special machines and would be cool if there were 2000 left. I actually prefer if something I like is common, it means I can afford it :-). Collecting just so you can say you have 1 of only 2 known is what some people collect for but I am not one of them. -Barry On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 10:56 AM, Steven Medved wrote: > > Bruce, > > In the case of a machine like yours even if if there are twice as many > existing as are currently known it is a very hard to find machine. > > Steve >> Steve, I agree completely and hope for collectors interested in these >> machines that at least a few more will be found. The thing that supports the >> 'few' is that they were made for only a year (more like 10 months), were >> very expensive and a good estimate of orginal production numbered about 200 >> machines. Frow wasn't much help. It seems that somebody at the National >> Monument could be a scource of desperately needed information regarding that >> machine and the number mfg.. I bought the machine from Charley H. and in >> talking with him and at least one other rabid collector, those are the >> numbers that are known and a good guess as to the number built. Charley told >> me he had gotten the machine from the original owner in N.J., somebody that >> had worked for Edison. There were many old pictures, some autographed, all >> to do with Edison or the Company on the walls, when he got the machine. He >> thought it to be someone high up in the Company. >> As far as I'm concerned I hope 100 more turn up sooner than later. It >> wouldn't affect the value of mine in the least, not to me anyway. Spread the >> happiness. >> >> Very best, >> Bruce M. > > ___ > Phono-L mailing list > http://phono-l.oldcrank.org > -- -Barry ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
Bruce, In the case of a machine like yours even if if there are twice as many existing as are currently known it is a very hard to find machine. Steve > Steve, I agree completely and hope for collectors interested in these > machines that at least a few more will be found. The thing that supports the > 'few' is that they were made for only a year (more like 10 months), were > very expensive and a good estimate of orginal production numbered about 200 > machines. Frow wasn't much help. It seems that somebody at the National > Monument could be a scource of desperately needed information regarding that > machine and the number mfg.. I bought the machine from Charley H. and in > talking with him and at least one other rabid collector, those are the > numbers that are known and a good guess as to the number built. Charley told > me he had gotten the machine from the original owner in N.J., somebody that > had worked for Edison. There were many old pictures, some autographed, all > to do with Edison or the Company on the walls, when he got the machine. He > thought it to be someone high up in the Company. > As far as I'm concerned I hope 100 more turn up sooner than later. It > wouldn't affect the value of mine in the least, not to me anyway. Spread the > happiness. > > Very best, > Bruce M. ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
Steve, I agree completely and hope for collectors interested in these machines that at least a few more will be found. The thing that supports the 'few' is that they were made for only a year (more like 10 months), were very expensive and a good estimate of orginal production numbered about 200 machines. Frow wasn't much help. It seems that somebody at the National Monument could be a scource of desperately needed information regarding that machine and the number mfg.. I bought the machine from Charley H. and in talking with him and at least one other rabid collector, those are the numbers that are known and a good guess as to the number built. Charley told me he had gotten the machine from the original owner in N.J., somebody that had worked for Edison. There were many old pictures, some autographed, all to do with Edison or the Company on the walls, when he got the machine. He thought it to be someone high up in the Company. As far as I'm concerned I hope 100 more turn up sooner than later. It wouldn't affect the value of mine in the least, not to me anyway. Spread the happiness. Very best, Bruce M. Memo to Bill Taney: Sorry Bill, too late. I had the case stripped, cut down those stubby feet and had the whole thing bleached almost white. Then I had gladiolas and other fauna and flora painted on...it REALLY stands out against that white. I've had people tell me they've never seen anything quite like it. ;-) - Original Message - From: "Steven Medved" To: "Phono-l" Sent: Monday, April 11, 2011 1:06 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known Hello Bruce and list, The amount of phonographs known depends largely on how well we as collectors are willing to communicate with each other and to the researcher. The Triumph G is a good example I believe there were about 6 of these known to exist and then a new one appeared on eBay in the Opera style case with the lid, bottom and columns missing, it was in poor shape. A mahogany one with its horn sold for $8777.00 on eBay years ago, I do not know if this was cataloged or not. Terry Baer has done research which is available on his website, but again he is dependent on collector input and what he sees. I do reproducer research and I am dependent on eBay and those generous collectors that share photos and serial numbers. There are two barriers to sharing, privacy and people not wanting to lowering the value. If you found a warehouse with 100 Victor VI in their packing crates and sold them all at once The 2 minute J in the Frow book, I spoke with the man that discovered it and it was the only one he knew of. I told him about the one I saw on eBay and since then a second one appeared so now I know of 3. I am still trying to find people with model O reproducers with the all brass nickel plated top, over the past 10 years I only found one with a serial number around 3500 but I lost the e-mail when my computer died. These days I get most of my research from eBay. So far I have 92 of the iron and brass O's in my list. At least 8,000 were made so around 1000 should have survived. This is actually the most commonly found O, but since it does not swell it is among the most desirable ones to have. In closing the amount known will give you an idea of the rarity, but as my old cranky friend has pointed out the amount known is a fraction of the ones that actually do exist. Perhaps one day we will learn more. Best regards, Steve UH-OH, have I been taken? I was told that my Edison C-1 is one of six known. According to the known serial numbers mine is the latest making it the last (accounted for) Diamond Disc machine. I sincerely hope that is not the case. Bruce ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] 3 Known
Hello Bruce and list, The amount of phonographs known depends largely on how well we as collectors are willing to communicate with each other and to the researcher. The Triumph G is a good example I believe there were about 6 of these known to exist and then a new one appeared on eBay in the Opera style case with the lid, bottom and columns missing, it was in poor shape. A mahogany one with its horn sold for $8777.00 on eBay years ago, I do not know if this was cataloged or not. Terry Baer has done research which is available on his website, but again he is dependent on collector input and what he sees. I do reproducer research and I am dependent on eBay and those generous collectors that share photos and serial numbers. There are two barriers to sharing, privacy and people not wanting to lowering the value. If you found a warehouse with 100 Victor VI in their packing crates and sold them all at once The 2 minute J in the Frow book, I spoke with the man that discovered it and it was the only one he knew of. I told him about the one I saw on eBay and since then a second one appeared so now I know of 3. I am still trying to find people with model O reproducers with the all brass nickel plated top, over the past 10 years I only found one with a serial number around 3500 but I lost the e-mail when my computer died. These days I get most of my research from eBay. So far I have 92 of the iron and brass O's in my list. At least 8,000 were made so around 1000 should have survived. This is actually the most commonly found O, but since it does not swell it is among the most desirable ones to have. In closing the amount known will give you an idea of the rarity, but as my old cranky friend has pointed out the amount known is a fraction of the ones that actually do exist. Perhaps one day we will learn more. Best regards, Steve > UH-OH, have I been taken? I was told that my Edison C-1 is one of six > known. According to the known serial numbers mine is the latest making it > the last (accounted for) Diamond Disc machine. I sincerely hope that is not > the case. > Bruce ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
