Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
George, I knew you were the first to read it. I actually accomplished what I wanted which was to bring attention to CAPS and thank you in a joking way. Suitcase home 34,147 came with early B 546 and without your article I would not have been able to date it. Steve Steve, I'm gratified to hear that you continue to enjoy the article on the 1896-1901 "Home." (Not only did I read it, but I wrote it!) Your kind remarks on that article as well as The Sound Box are much appreciated. Anyone wishing to subscribe to The Sound Box may do so my logging onto the website Steve provided: www.ca-phono.org. ...and pay online with Paypal. Otherwise, send a check to the address given on the website. All back issues are still available as well. George P. ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
HELLO ALL on another interesting note i have seen some mandrels on both a banner home and a banner standard that have an indented ring on the left side both are nickel plated did edison try a new design for a brief period just curious zono In a message dated 5/17/2010 3:13:06 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, harveykrav...@yahoo.com writes: Hi Al, Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an Edison suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original owner or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it back to original. Thanks, Harvey Kravitz From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Greetings Harvey: The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in brass costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For the rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve well. The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial numbers are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the mandrel shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. And further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only guarantee the above to be 50% correct... Al ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Steve Thank you for your help it is well appreciated. Ed Sieckert - Original Message - From: "Steven Medved" To: "Phono-l" Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 5:41 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hi Ed, I assume you are referring to Edison Cylinder Phonographs, and most unfortunately the best and most complete book is now out of print and costs around $200.00 to purchase. http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0960646612/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1274142870&sr=8-1&condition=used http://tinyurl.com/2eg9ewh CAPS California Antique Phonograph Society can be joined by contacting Jeff Olliphant at jl...@aol.com I believe the back issues can still be purchased. The magazine is produced four times a year and is well worth the price. I believe it costs $25 a year. Here is the website. I live in Florida so I cannot attend the meetings but the magazine is wonderful. http://www.ca-phono.org/ Steve From: e...@sieckert.com To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 16:28:11 -0700 Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hello Steve I am new to the site and wondered if you could help. I am interested in learning about the Edison phonographs circa 1900 to 1910. Are there any good books written on the subject. The Sound Box. Do you know who publishes this magazine and any phone number to call so that I can subscribe? Thank you. ED Sieckert Lodi, CA _- - Original Message - From: "Steven Medved" To: "Phono-l" Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 4:19 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > Hi Harvey, > > George must have read the The Edison "Home" Phonograph, 1896 - 1901 in > the > Sept 2006 CAPS The Sound Box. This was a wonderful article well worth > the > price of the annual subscription. I still refer to this article for > the > most valuable information it provides. > > I cannot say enough about how enjoyable The Sound Box is to read. > > Steve > >> Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 16:01:02 -0700 >> From: harveykrav...@yahoo.com >> To: phono-l@oldcrank.org >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... >> >> Hi George, >> Thanks for the help. I really appreciate it. >> All the best. >> Harvey >> >> >> >> >> >> ____ >> From: "gpaul2...@aol.com" >> To: phono-l@oldcrank.org >> Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 2:00:14 PM >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... >> >> >> Harvey, >> >> An Edison "Home" numbered in the 3400 range would date from February >> 1898. As I noted yesterday on the ATM board, "Homes" began appearing >> with nickel-plated mandrels in October/November 1898. Hope this >> helps - - >> >> George P. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: harvey kravitz >> To: Antique Phonograph List >> Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 3:09 pm >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... >> >> >> Hi Al, >> Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an >> Edison >> suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a >> brass >> mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the >> original >> owner >> or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it >> back to >> original. >> Thanks, >> Harvey Kravitz >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" >> To: phono-l@oldcrank.org >> Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... >> >> >> Greetings Harvey: >> >> The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. >> They >> were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid >> brass >> of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after >> 1896. >> As >> the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass >> mandrel >> became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick >> wall >> brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was >> indented >> to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the >> nickel >> plated thin walled drawn bra
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Steve, I'm gratified to hear that you continue to enjoy the article on the 1896-1901 "Home." (Not only did I read it, but I wrote it!) Your kind remarks on that article as well as The Sound Box are much appreciated. Anyone wishing to subscribe to The Sound Box may do so my logging onto the website Steve provided: www.ca-phono.org. ...and pay online with Paypal. Otherwise, send a check to the address given on the website. All back issues are still available as well. George P. -Original Message- From: Steven Medved To: Phono-l Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 7:19 pm Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hi Harvey, George must have read the The Edison "Home" Phonograph, 1896 - 1901 in the Sept 2006 CAPS The Sound Box. This was a wonderful article well worth the price of the annual subscription. I still refer to this article for the most valuable information it provides. I cannot say enough about how enjoyable The Sound Box is to read. Steve > Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 16:01:02 -0700 > From: harveykrav...@yahoo.com > To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > Hi George, > Thanks for the help. I really appreciate it. > All the best. > Harvey > > > > > > > From: "gpaul2...@aol.com" > To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 2:00:14 PM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > > Harvey, > > An Edison "Home" numbered in the 3400 range would date from February 1898. > As I noted yesterday on the ATM board, "Homes" began appearing with nickel-plated mandrels in October/November 1898. Hope this helps - - > > George P. > > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > From: harvey kravitz > To: Antique Phonograph List > Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 3:09 pm > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > > Hi Al, > Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an Edison > suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass > mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original > owner > or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it back > to > original. > Thanks, > Harvey Kravitz > > > > > > > From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" > To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > > Greetings Harvey: > > The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They > were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass > of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As > the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel > became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall > brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented > to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel > plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in brass > costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end > continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For the > rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve > well. > > The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end > pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial > numbers > are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home > had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was > reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was > introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the > mandrel > shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. > > SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin > walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than > they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial > number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. And > further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel > for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! > > I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only > guarantee the a
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Hi Ed, I assume you are referring to Edison Cylinder Phonographs, and most unfortunately the best and most complete book is now out of print and costs around $200.00 to purchase. http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0960646612/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1274142870&sr=8-1&condition=used http://tinyurl.com/2eg9ewh CAPS California Antique Phonograph Society can be joined by contacting Jeff Olliphant at jl...@aol.com I believe the back issues can still be purchased. The magazine is produced four times a year and is well worth the price. I believe it costs $25 a year. Here is the website. I live in Florida so I cannot attend the meetings but the magazine is wonderful. http://www.ca-phono.org/ Steve > From: e...@sieckert.com > To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 16:28:11 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > Hello Steve > > I am new to the site and wondered if you could help. I am interested > in learning about the Edison phonographs circa 1900 to 1910. Are there > any > good books written on the subject. > > The Sound Box. Do you know who publishes this magazine and any phone > number > to call so that I can subscribe? > > Thank you. > > ED Sieckert > Lodi, CA > _- > - Original Message - > From: "Steven Medved" > To: "Phono-l" > Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 4:19 PM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > > > > > Hi Harvey, > > > > George must have read the The Edison "Home" Phonograph, 1896 - 1901 in the > > Sept 2006 CAPS The Sound Box. This was a wonderful article well worth the > > price of the annual subscription. I still refer to this article for the > > most valuable information it provides. > > > > I cannot say enough about how enjoyable The Sound Box is to read. > > > > Steve > > > >> Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 16:01:02 -0700 > >> From: harveykrav...@yahoo.com > >> To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > >> > >> Hi George, > >> Thanks for the help. I really appreciate it. > >> All the best. > >> Harvey > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> From: "gpaul2...@aol.com" > >> To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > >> Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 2:00:14 PM > >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > >> > >> > >> Harvey, > >> > >> An Edison "Home" numbered in the 3400 range would date from February > >> 1898. As I noted yesterday on the ATM board, "Homes" began appearing > >> with nickel-plated mandrels in October/November 1898. Hope this > >> helps - - > >> > >> George P. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> -Original Message- > >> From: harvey kravitz > >> To: Antique Phonograph List > >> Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 3:09 pm > >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > >> > >> > >> Hi Al, > >> Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an > >> Edison > >> suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass > >> mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original > >> owner > >> or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it > >> back to > >> original. > >> Thanks, > >> Harvey Kravitz > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" > >> To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > >> Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM > >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > >> > >> > >> Greetings Harvey: > >> > >> The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. > >> They > >> were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid > >> brass > >> of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. > >> As > >> the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel > >> became a hollow cylinder with brass end
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Hello Steve I am new to the site and wondered if you could help. I am interested in learning about the Edison phonographs circa 1900 to 1910. Are there any good books written on the subject. The Sound Box. Do you know who publishes this magazine and any phone number to call so that I can subscribe? Thank you. ED Sieckert Lodi, CA _- - Original Message - From: "Steven Medved" To: "Phono-l" Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 4:19 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hi Harvey, George must have read the The Edison "Home" Phonograph, 1896 - 1901 in the Sept 2006 CAPS The Sound Box. This was a wonderful article well worth the price of the annual subscription. I still refer to this article for the most valuable information it provides. I cannot say enough about how enjoyable The Sound Box is to read. Steve Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 16:01:02 -0700 From: harveykrav...@yahoo.com To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hi George, Thanks for the help. I really appreciate it. All the best. Harvey From: "gpaul2...@aol.com" To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 2:00:14 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Harvey, An Edison "Home" numbered in the 3400 range would date from February 1898. As I noted yesterday on the ATM board, "Homes" began appearing with nickel-plated mandrels in October/November 1898. Hope this helps - - George P. -Original Message- From: harvey kravitz To: Antique Phonograph List Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 3:09 pm Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hi Al, Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an Edison suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original owner or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it back to original. Thanks, Harvey Kravitz From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Greetings Harvey: The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in brass costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For the rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve well. The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial numbers are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the mandrel shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. And further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only guarantee the above to be 50% correct... Al ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Hi Harvey, George must have read the The Edison "Home" Phonograph, 1896 - 1901 in the Sept 2006 CAPS The Sound Box. This was a wonderful article well worth the price of the annual subscription. I still refer to this article for the most valuable information it provides. I cannot say enough about how enjoyable The Sound Box is to read. Steve > Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 16:01:02 -0700 > From: harveykrav...@yahoo.com > To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > Hi George, > Thanks for the help. I really appreciate it. > All the best. > Harvey > > > > > > > From: "gpaul2...@aol.com" > To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 2:00:14 PM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > > Harvey, > > An Edison "Home" numbered in the 3400 range would date from February 1898. > As I noted yesterday on the ATM board, "Homes" began appearing with > nickel-plated mandrels in October/November 1898. Hope this helps - - > > George P. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message- > From: harvey kravitz > To: Antique Phonograph List > Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 3:09 pm > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > > Hi Al, > Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an Edison > suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass > mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original > owner > or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it back > to > original. > Thanks, > Harvey Kravitz > > > > > > > From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" > To: phono-l@oldcrank.org > Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... > > > Greetings Harvey: > > The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They > were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass > of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As > the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel > became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall > brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented > to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel > plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in > brass > costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end > continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For > the > rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve > well. > > The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end > pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial > numbers > are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home > had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was > reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was > introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the > mandrel > shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. > > SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin > walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than > they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial > number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. > And > further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel > for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! > > I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only > guarantee the above to be 50% correct... > > Al > > ___ > Phono-L mailing list > http://phono-l.oldcrank.org > > > > > ___ > Phono-L mailing list > http://phono-l.oldcrank.org > > > ___ > Phono-L mailing list > http://phono-l.oldcrank.org > > > > > ___ > Phono-L mailing list > http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Hi George, Thanks for the help. I really appreciate it. All the best. Harvey From: "gpaul2...@aol.com" To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 2:00:14 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Harvey, An Edison "Home" numbered in the 3400 range would date from February 1898. As I noted yesterday on the ATM board, "Homes" began appearing with nickel-plated mandrels in October/November 1898. Hope this helps - - George P. -Original Message- From: harvey kravitz To: Antique Phonograph List Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 3:09 pm Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hi Al, Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an Edison suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original owner or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it back to original. Thanks, Harvey Kravitz From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Greetings Harvey: The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in brass costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For the rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve well. The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial numbers are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the mandrel shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. And further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only guarantee the above to be 50% correct... Al ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Harvey, An Edison "Home" numbered in the 3400 range would date from February 1898. As I noted yesterday on the ATM board, "Homes" began appearing with nickel-plated mandrels in October/November 1898. Hope this helps - - George P. -Original Message- From: harvey kravitz To: Antique Phonograph List Sent: Mon, May 17, 2010 3:09 pm Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Hi Al, Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an Edison suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original owner or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it back to original. Thanks, Harvey Kravitz From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Greetings Harvey: The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in brass costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For the rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve well. The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial numbers are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the mandrel shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. And further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only guarantee the above to be 50% correct... Al ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Hi Al, Thank you for all your help.I really learned a lot from you. I have an Edison suit case Home with a 3400's serial number. Do you know if it had a brass mandrel? It was converted into a 2/4 min. machine either by the original owner or a collector. If this indeed had a brass mandrel, I'd love to get it back to original. Thanks, Harvey Kravitz From: "clockworkh...@aol.com" To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 4:04:46 AM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts... Greetings Harvey: The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in brass costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For the rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve well. The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial numbers are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the mandrel shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. And further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only guarantee the above to be 50% correct... Al ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
In a message dated 5/16/2010 7:05:11 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, clockworkh...@aol.com writes: The smaller diameter end was indented to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. - I assume the (original) purpose of the mandrel's "overhang" was to prevent the wax shavings from falling and jamming up the pivot point. Allen ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
Re: [Phono-L] Edison Brass Mandrels... some idle thoughts...
Greetings Harvey: The solid brass mandrels were on the early M and E electric machines. They were press fit onto the steel mandrel shaft. Even in those days solid brass of that diameter was expensive so few are found to be solid after 1896. As the M topworks was adapted for the Springmotor machines the brass mandrel became a hollow cylinder with brass ends pressed in. It was a thick wall brass which still carried some weight. The smaller diameter end was indented to allow for the needle bearing guard on the endgate. In 1901 the nickel plated thin walled drawn brass mandrel allowed for a drastic reduction in brass costs and reduced the number of machining operations. The indented end continued for the M and E but the new Triumph line did not require it. For the rest of the Triumph production the drawn brass mandrel continued to serve well. The Home phonograph had the thick walled hollow brass mandrel with end pieces almost from the earliest machines. Only the very lowest serial numbers are occasionally found with a solid mandrel and the indented end. The Home had that thick walled brass mandrel for a long time but wall thickness was reduced as nickel plating was added. The drawn thin brass mandrel was introduced before the 1901 new style cabinet change. The length of the mandrel shaft remained the same until the Model B was introduced. SADLY, there are sellers who swap out the brass mandrel for a later thin walled nickeled mandrel. They then charge more for the brass mandrel than they paid for the whole phonograph. So, you can find a Home with a serial number below 9000 with a shiny nickeled mandrel that should not be there. And further along there will be an eBay listing for the original brass mandrel for a higher price than the mutt machine. Gr ! ! ! I hope that helps. I am away from my research materials so I only guarantee the above to be 50% correct... Al ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
