Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Zeev Suraski

I think their work is a good step that PHP needed for a while.  I also 
think it's an ongoing project, and not a one-time pass.

Looking at the patch, the vast majority of changes made don't actually fix 
bugs, but rather, implement the same code using 'defensive' 
techniques.  E.g., use strlcpy() instead of strcpy(), even when strcpy() is 
safe;  Or, use sizeof(foo) instead of a hardcoded number as an argument to 
snprintf(), in case the size of foo changes in the future.

The only comment I have (after this short glance) is that I'd rather see 
sizeof(foo) instead of 'sizeof foo' (we don't need yet another style in our 
code base :), but otherwise, I think most of the patches should make it 
into the main tree.

Zeev

At 14:22 14/03/2002, Andrew Sitnikov wrote:
Hello php-dev,

   What you think about this:
   http://phpaudit.42-networks.com/


   Big size of patch does not bring pleasure

Best regards,
  Andrew Sitnikov
  e-mail : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  GSM: (+372) 56491109


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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Yasuo Ohgaki

Zeev Suraski wrote:
 I think their work is a good step that PHP needed for a while.  I also 
 think it's an ongoing project, and not a one-time pass.
 
 Looking at the patch, the vast majority of changes made don't actually 
 fix bugs, but rather, implement the same code using 'defensive' 
 techniques.  E.g., use strlcpy() instead of strcpy(), even when strcpy() 
 is safe;  Or, use sizeof(foo) instead of a hardcoded number as an 
 argument to snprintf(), in case the size of foo changes in the future.
 
 The only comment I have (after this short glance) is that I'd rather see 
 sizeof(foo) instead of 'sizeof foo' (we don't need yet another style in 
 our code base :), but otherwise, I think most of the patches should make 
 it into the main tree.

That's what I thought, too.

I'm also suprised by the fact that there are so many magic numbers
in php source ;)

--
Yasuo Ohgaki


 
 Zeev
 
 At 14:22 14/03/2002, Andrew Sitnikov wrote:
 
 Hello php-dev,

   What you think about this:
   http://phpaudit.42-networks.com/


   Big size of patch does not bring pleasure

 Best regards,
  Andrew Sitnikov
  e-mail : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  GSM: (+372) 56491109


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[PHP-DEV] sizeof foo vs sizeof (foo) (Was Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit)

2002-03-14 Thread Wez Furlong

On 14/03/02, Zeev Suraski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 The only comment I have (after this short glance) is that I'd rather see 
 sizeof(foo) instead of 'sizeof foo' (we don't need yet another style in our 
 code base :),

I know of a compiler for the Amiga that doesn't grok 'sizeof struct foo';
the solution is to always use 'sizeof(struct foo)'.

As for the audit project itself; it does sound like a good idea.

--Wez.


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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Jedi/Sector One

The only comment I have (after this short glance) is that I'd rather see 
sizeof(foo) instead of 'sizeof foo'

  No problem Zeev. All sizeof x (including those we didn't introduce) have
just been replaced by sizeof(x) .

  We are now working on a CVS tree. If you want access to review or change
things, just ask.

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Re: [PHP-DEV] sizeof foo vs sizeof (foo) (Was Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit)

2002-03-14 Thread Jedi/Sector One

On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:19:32PM +, Wez Furlong wrote:
 I know of a compiler for the Amiga that doesn't grok 'sizeof struct foo';
 the solution is to always use 'sizeof(struct foo)'.

  sizeof type is incorrect.
  
  The correct sizeof semantics are
  
  sizeof value  
  or:  
  sizeof( type )
  
  So sizeof (value) means to evaluate '(value)' whoose result is
'value', then compute 'sizeof value' .

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RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread James Cox




   We are now working on a CVS tree. If you want access to review or change
 things, just ask.


What's stopping you committing it to cvs.php.net ?

James Cox
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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Jedi/Sector One

On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:34:06PM -, James Cox wrote:
 What's stopping you committing it to cvs.php.net ?

  It might be better to work on a separate tree, and later let PHP developpers
merge what parts they want to.

  Or maybe we can work on cvs.php.net on a separate branch.
  
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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Stanislav Malyshev

JO   It might be better to work on a separate tree, and later let PHP
JO developpers merge what parts they want to.

Why? Your patches then would bit-rot constantly and you would have to 
update it even that nothing changes, and risk introducing new bugs in 
transition.

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Re: [PHP-DEV] sizeof foo vs sizeof (foo) (Was Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit)

2002-03-14 Thread Zeev Suraski

We know :)  And yet, we always use sizeof(), regardless of whether we feed 
it with a type or a value.

Zeev

At 15:34 14/03/2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:19:32PM +, Wez Furlong wrote:
  I know of a compiler for the Amiga that doesn't grok 'sizeof struct foo';
  the solution is to always use 'sizeof(struct foo)'.

   sizeof type is incorrect.

   The correct sizeof semantics are

   sizeof value
   or:
   sizeof( type )

   So sizeof (value) means to evaluate '(value)' whoose result is
'value', then compute 'sizeof value' .

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RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread James Cox


 On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:34:06PM -, James Cox wrote:
  What's stopping you committing it to cvs.php.net ?

   It might be better to work on a separate tree, and later let
 PHP developpers
 merge what parts they want to.

   Or maybe we can work on cvs.php.net on a separate branch.

Personally, i think it might be a good idea to cut a branch for it -- and
merge to head bit by bit.. but looking at the patch i think it looks pretty
good -- and is needed (imo).

apply (if you haven't already) at http://www.php.net/cvs-php.php

Thanks,

James


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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Markus Fischer

On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 02:30:43PM +0059, Jedi/Sector One wrote : 
 The only comment I have (after this short glance) is that I'd rather see 
 sizeof(foo) instead of 'sizeof foo'
 
   No problem Zeev. All sizeof x (including those we didn't introduce) have
 just been replaced by sizeof(x) .
 
   We are now working on a CVS tree. If you want access to review or change
 things, just ask.

Is there public access ? I'm interested in it too.

- Markus

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RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread James Cox

http://phpaudit.42-networks.com/

 -Original Message-
 From: Markus Fischer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2002 1:43 PM
 To: Jedi/Sector One
 Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit
 
 
 On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 02:30:43PM +0059, Jedi/Sector One wrote : 
  The only comment I have (after this short glance) is that I'd 
 rather see 
  sizeof(foo) instead of 'sizeof foo'
  
No problem Zeev. All sizeof x (including those we didn't 
 introduce) have
  just been replaced by sizeof(x) .
  
We are now working on a CVS tree. If you want access to 
 review or change
  things, just ask.
 
 Is there public access ? I'm interested in it too.
 
 - Markus
 
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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Zeev Suraski

At 15:37 14/03/2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:34:06PM -, James Cox wrote:
  What's stopping you committing it to cvs.php.net ?

   It might be better to work on a separate tree, and later let PHP 
 developpers
merge what parts they want to.

I think that most patches can be submitted to cvs.php.net directly.  If 
there's something that you think is not a clear-cut patch, then it's best 
if you raise it first on php-dev, but I think that most patches can go in 
without further discussion...  Andi's CVS police will usually catch things 
which are really really bad:)

Zeev


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RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Zeev Suraski

We decided not to use branches for development at all, only for 
releases...  I think we should stick to it.

Zeev

At 15:41 14/03/2002, James Cox wrote:
 
  On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:34:06PM -, James Cox wrote:
   What's stopping you committing it to cvs.php.net ?
 
It might be better to work on a separate tree, and later let
  PHP developpers
  merge what parts they want to.
 
Or maybe we can work on cvs.php.net on a separate branch.
 
Personally, i think it might be a good idea to cut a branch for it -- and
merge to head bit by bit.. but looking at the patch i think it looks pretty
good -- and is needed (imo).

apply (if you haven't already) at http://www.php.net/cvs-php.php

Thanks,

James


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RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread James Cox

fair enough. :)

 -Original Message-
 From: Zeev Suraski [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2002 1:45 PM
 To: James Cox
 Cc: Jedi/Sector One; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit


 We decided not to use branches for development at all, only for
 releases...  I think we should stick to it.

 Zeev

 At 15:41 14/03/2002, James Cox wrote:
  
   On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:34:06PM -, James Cox wrote:
What's stopping you committing it to cvs.php.net ?
  
 It might be better to work on a separate tree, and later let
   PHP developpers
   merge what parts they want to.
  
 Or maybe we can work on cvs.php.net on a separate branch.
  
 Personally, i think it might be a good idea to cut a branch for it -- and
 merge to head bit by bit.. but looking at the patch i think it
 looks pretty
 good -- and is needed (imo).
 
 apply (if you haven't already) at http://www.php.net/cvs-php.php
 
 Thanks,
 
 James
 
 
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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Markus Fischer

On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 01:44:44PM -, James Cox wrote : 
 http://phpaudit.42-networks.com/

I thought he was refering to CVS access to the current state
of their patch. The websites doesn't list any such resource.

- Markus
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Markus Fischer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
  Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2002 1:43 PM
  To: Jedi/Sector One
  Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit
  
  
  On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 02:30:43PM +0059, Jedi/Sector One wrote : 
   The only comment I have (after this short glance) is that I'd 
  rather see 
   sizeof(foo) instead of 'sizeof foo'
   
 No problem Zeev. All sizeof x (including those we didn't 
  introduce) have
   just been replaced by sizeof(x) .
   
 We are now working on a CVS tree. If you want access to 
  review or change
   things, just ask.
  
  Is there public access ? I'm interested in it too.
  
  - Markus
  
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Re: [PHP-DEV] sizeof foo vs sizeof (foo) (Was Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit)

2002-03-14 Thread Wez Furlong

On 14/03/02, Zeev Suraski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 We know :)  And yet, we always use sizeof(), regardless of whether we feed 
 it with a type or a value.

I meant to say that :)
 
 At 15:34 14/03/2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
The correct sizeof semantics are
sizeof value
or:
sizeof( type )

I didn't know that! (and how long have I been coding in C??).
It's interesting that most compilers that I have used _can_
handle 'sizeof type'.

--Wez.



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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Jedi/Sector One

On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 02:53:27PM +0100, Markus Fischer wrote:
 I thought he was refering to CVS access to the current state
 of their patch. The websites doesn't list any such resource.

  The CVS was just installeda few minutes ago. There's no anonymous access
yet.

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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread derick

On Thu, 14 Mar 2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:

 On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 02:53:27PM +0100, Markus Fischer wrote:
  I thought he was refering to CVS access to the current state
  of their patch. The websites doesn't list any such resource.
 
   The CVS was just installeda few minutes ago. There's no anonymous access
 yet.


I'd reather see you work on the HEAD branch... that way it's tested much 
faster, and your patches are always up to date.

Derick

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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Andi Gutmans

At 15:06 14/03/2002 +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Thu, 14 Mar 2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:

  On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 02:53:27PM +0100, Markus Fischer wrote:
   I thought he was refering to CVS access to the current state
   of their patch. The websites doesn't list any such resource.
 
The CVS was just installeda few minutes ago. There's no anonymous access
  yet.


I'd reather see you work on the HEAD branch... that way it's tested much
faster, and your patches are always up to date.

Me too. I don't see much reason not to commit directly to PHP, at least the 
obvious patches. If there are any conceptual changes we should discuss them 
first.

Andi


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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Jedi/Sector One

On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 05:10:38PM +0200, Andi Gutmans wrote:
 Me too. I don't see much reason not to commit directly to PHP, at least the 
 obvious patches. If there are any conceptual changes we should discuss them 
 first.

  Because we are working on version 4.1.2 right now. We will switch to -HEAD
in 1-2 weeks.

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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread Andi Gutmans

At 16:16 14/03/2002 +0059, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
On Thu, Mar 14, 2002 at 05:10:38PM +0200, Andi Gutmans wrote:
  Me too. I don't see much reason not to commit directly to PHP, at least 
 the
  obvious patches. If there are any conceptual changes we should discuss 
 them
  first.

   Because we are working on version 4.1.2 right now. We will switch to -HEAD
in 1-2 weeks.

Oh, I must have missed that detail :)

Andi


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RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit

2002-03-14 Thread sesser

Hi,

due to the fact that I now have a cvs account at the phpaudit project
i am able to help on both sides. Of course we would like to have a
secure head and 4_2_0 branch but it is understandable that fixing
4.1.2 is the primary goal of the project. First things comes first.
Anyway during the next days i am going to look through the code of the
HEAD again and will fix all the bugs I find. Additionally I am going
to look through the phpaudit patch and commit all the stuff that is
not breaking anything.

Stefan

PS: The 4.1.2 hardening patch will also be a solution for the people
that encounter the crash bugs in the fileupload code.

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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-12 Thread Marcus Börger

In addition to Zeev,

Hey guys where is your problem if someone wants to infect php code with
functions that increases stability of code? The last days i spent much work
to get ext/exif working and many problems came from missuse of strxxx
functions. Changing to functions like strlcpy makes the code much more
stable and independent from exernal failures.

And here again you cannot rely on the fact that you have read any standard
about external stuff you are working on requirements/securisations of code
not from yourself. Everything that comes from outside to php can be wrong
and should be considered as such - this will also increase security against
some server-attack mechanisms. And we are a large group doing an eXtreme
developing - who knows exactly which function changes next day in which way?

marcus

At 14:31 11.03.2002, Zeev Suraski wrote:
Frank,

Don't be discouraged by the feedback here.  Your efforts are well 
appreciated!  You can choose to use whichever functions you deem best, as 
long as you're the one doing the work :)

Zeev

At 02:23 PM 3/11/2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
On Mon, Mar 11, 2002 at 01:21:02PM +0100, Stefan Esser wrote:
  strlcpy and strlcat are inventions of the OpenBSD project. Since they
  invented
  those they are trying to infect other projects.

   PHP is already infected.

   Try to grep for strlcpy and strlcat in the _vanilla_ PHP source code.

   But that's ok. If you don't want us to work on PHP, let our project stop.

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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread David Eriksson

On Mon, 11 Mar 2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:

   The goal is to help the PHP developpement, not to keep the patches
 separate, only for OpenBSD. There are some OpenBSD enhancements, but they
 are all surrounded with #ifdef __OpenBSD__ . We don't want to break
 portability, nor to release something only for OpenBSD. The patches are
 there to be shared by everyone. FYI, I'm working on them on my Linux laptop.

Are the strlcpy and strlcat functions (used in the patches) available on
Linux?

-\- David Eriksson -/-

I personally refuse to use inferior tools because of ideology.
- Linus Torvalds 


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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread derick

On Mon, 11 Mar 2002, David Eriksson wrote:

 On Mon, 11 Mar 2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
 
The goal is to help the PHP developpement, not to keep the patches
  separate, only for OpenBSD. There are some OpenBSD enhancements, but they
  are all surrounded with #ifdef __OpenBSD__ . We don't want to break
  portability, nor to release something only for OpenBSD. The patches are
  there to be shared by everyone. FYI, I'm working on them on my Linux laptop.
 
 Are the strlcpy and strlcat functions (used in the patches) available on
 Linux?

[derick@kossu derick]$ man strlcpy
No manual entry for strlcpy
[derick@kossu derick]$ man strlcat
No manual entry for strlcat

Derick

 
 -\- David Eriksson -/-
 
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 - Linus Torvalds 
 
 
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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread Jedi/Sector One

On Mon, Mar 11, 2002 at 01:17:07PM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Are the strlcpy and strlcat functions (used in the patches) available on
  Linux?
 [derick@kossu derick]$ man strlcpy
 No manual entry for strlcpy
 [derick@kossu derick]$ man strlcat
 No manual entry for strlcat

  PHP defines them if they don't exist. It's in main/strlcpy.c and
main/strlcat.c 

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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread Jedi/Sector One

On Mon, Mar 11, 2002 at 01:21:02PM +0100, Stefan Esser wrote:
 strlcpy and strlcat are inventions of the OpenBSD project. Since they
 invented
 those they are trying to infect other projects.

  PHP is already infected.
  
  Try to grep for strlcpy and strlcat in the _vanilla_ PHP source code.

  But that's ok. If you don't want us to work on PHP, let our project stop.
  
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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread Stefan Esser

Hi,

   PHP is already infected.
Sorry, my fault. I have overseen that. I just wanted to clearify what
strlcat
and strlcpy are. I dislike OpenBSD because of several reasons but this list
is not the right place to discuss anything like this.

   But that's ok. If you don't want us to work on PHP, let our project
stop.
I don't have anything against you guys working on PHP. Four eyes do always
see more than two and in the end i think our both interest is a secure PHP.

Stefan


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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread Zeev Suraski

Frank,

Don't be discouraged by the feedback here.  Your efforts are well 
appreciated!  You can choose to use whichever functions you deem best, as 
long as you're the one doing the work :)

Zeev

At 02:23 PM 3/11/2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
On Mon, Mar 11, 2002 at 01:21:02PM +0100, Stefan Esser wrote:
  strlcpy and strlcat are inventions of the OpenBSD project. Since they
  invented
  those they are trying to infect other projects.

   PHP is already infected.

   Try to grep for strlcpy and strlcat in the _vanilla_ PHP source code.

   But that's ok. If you don't want us to work on PHP, let our project stop.

--
  __  /*-  Frank DENIS (Jedi/Sector One) [EMAIL PROTECTED] -*\  __
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   \/  a href=http://www.Jedi.Claranet.Fr/; Misc. free software /a  \/

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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread Andi Gutmans

At 13:21 11/03/2002 +0100, Stefan Esser wrote:
Hi,

strlcpy and strlcat are inventions of the OpenBSD project. Since they
invented
those they are trying to infect other projects.

I added them to PHP a long time ago and I have nothing to do with the 
OpenBSD project. They are extremely useful functions and should be used 
instead of strcat()/strcpy(). In Zend we only use memcpy()/memcmp() but for 
many uses strlcpy()/strlcat() are sufficient.

Andi


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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP audit project

2002-03-11 Thread Andi Gutmans

And as long as you don't use strncpy()

Just kidding :)

Andi

At 15:31 11/03/2002 +0200, Zeev Suraski wrote:
Frank,

Don't be discouraged by the feedback here.  Your efforts are well 
appreciated!  You can choose to use whichever functions you deem best, as 
long as you're the one doing the work :)

Zeev

At 02:23 PM 3/11/2002, Jedi/Sector One wrote:
On Mon, Mar 11, 2002 at 01:21:02PM +0100, Stefan Esser wrote:
  strlcpy and strlcat are inventions of the OpenBSD project. Since they
  invented
  those they are trying to infect other projects.

   PHP is already infected.

   Try to grep for strlcpy and strlcat in the _vanilla_ PHP source code.

   But that's ok. If you don't want us to work on PHP, let our project stop.

--
  __  /*-  Frank DENIS (Jedi/Sector One) [EMAIL PROTECTED] -*\  __
  \ '/a href=http://www.PureFTPd.Org/; Secure FTP Server /a\' /
   \/  a href=http://www.Jedi.Claranet.Fr/; Misc. free software /a  \/

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