Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
well the issues have been resolved, ( learnt a lot about how different servers handle bounces !!): I was using qmail only for outgoing emails and had a rcpthosts file lying in my /var/qmail/control i hpe you can guess the rest, the bounces from domains aol, schwab were being refused. On fixing the above, the bounces were again getting bounced, and i couldn't send emails from an aol account to an account on my qmail server. The reverse lookup for the external ip address i had wasn't working, fixing that things are running smoothly now! thanks, Ketan - Original Message - From: Ketan Bajaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Ketan Bajaj [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Greg White [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, April 23, 2001 2:32 PM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted probably this is what is going wrong: this time i used qmail-remote directly : /var/qmail/bin/qmail-remote schwab.com sender-envelope [EMAIL PROTECTED] qmail-remote exits with the report rK: * rRecipient report: acceptance. KMessage report: success. host has taken responsibility for delivering the message to each acceptable recipient. * Now if sender-envelope address is at my qmail-server, the bounce never comes back. If i change the sender-envelope address to some another address as [EMAIL PROTECTED], a bounce is received at that address!! which may mean either the remote hosts like aol.com and schwab.com are either not able to send the bounce message to the sender-envelope address at my qmail server, which i have been using. (they don't like my server name/ip, but i checked that reverse lookup are fine !) or they are sending the bounce to the envelope, but qmail is not accepting them due to some reasons.. -ketan - Original Message - From: Ketan Bajaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Greg White [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, April 23, 2001 12:26 PM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted i tried something more : sent messages to bad_user_names @yahoo.com, hotmail.com. My qmail logs show that they bounce back immediately, with a error code 554 and 550 respectively. which is the correct and expected behaviour. No i try again to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED], i get a 250_ok (remote accepted message) !!! (they should have bounced back). is it that schwab.com, aol.com are delaying the bounce back and sending the bounce back after sending the accept message .. and my qmail logs when it gets the 250_ok message, doesn't write any other error info into logs for the same message id / delivery id. or maybe qmail-remote closes connection with the remote server after seeing a 250_ok message and thus doesn't get the delayed bounce ??? ( i'm sending the email using mailto address, and putting a subject with no message body) as you've mentioned : you see the accept message and followed by a bounce. what i could be possibly missing? is it some sort of qmail-remote configuration?? thanks, Ketan - Original Message - From: Greg White [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2001 1:43 AM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted On Sat, Apr 21, 2001 at 01:52:54PM -0700, Ketan Bajaj wrote: i think i haven't been clear enough in explaining the problem... again, A (local smtp server)B (remote smtp server) B is at domain schwab.com, about which i do not know anything, whether it has qmail, sendmail, exchange or anything else. 1. when A is setup as qmail, and remote address is incorrect@B there is no bounce from B and the message is accepted at B. I see this at the qmail logs on A. In sending them a test message, I too see the remote host accept the message, but it promptly bounces it with '550 User Unknown'. Your qmail server is likely configured incorrectly -- you should be seeing the bounces. Please send a message, _headers and all_, that you sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] from your qmail server... GW
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
i tried something more : sent messages to bad_user_names @yahoo.com, hotmail.com. My qmail logs show that they bounce back immediately, with a error code 554 and 550 respectively. which is the correct and expected behaviour. No i try again to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED], i get a 250_ok (remote accepted message) !!! (they should have bounced back). is it that schwab.com, aol.com are delaying the bounce back and sending the bounce back after sending the accept message .. and my qmail logs when it gets the 250_ok message, doesn't write any other error info into logs for the same message id / delivery id. or maybe qmail-remote closes connection with the remote server after seeing a 250_ok message and thus doesn't get the delayed bounce ??? ( i'm sending the email using mailto address, and putting a subject with no message body) as you've mentioned : you see the accept message and followed by a bounce. what i could be possibly missing? is it some sort of qmail-remote configuration?? thanks, Ketan - Original Message - From: Greg White [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2001 1:43 AM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted On Sat, Apr 21, 2001 at 01:52:54PM -0700, Ketan Bajaj wrote: i think i haven't been clear enough in explaining the problem... again, A (local smtp server)B (remote smtp server) B is at domain schwab.com, about which i do not know anything, whether it has qmail, sendmail, exchange or anything else. 1. when A is setup as qmail, and remote address is incorrect@B there is no bounce from B and the message is accepted at B. I see this at the qmail logs on A. In sending them a test message, I too see the remote host accept the message, but it promptly bounces it with '550 User Unknown'. Your qmail server is likely configured incorrectly -- you should be seeing the bounces. Please send a message, _headers and all_, that you sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] from your qmail server... GW
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
Ketan Bajaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: sent messages to bad_user_names @yahoo.com, hotmail.com. My qmail logs show that they bounce back immediately, with a error code 554 and 550 respectively. which is the correct and expected behaviour. It's correct, but why is it expected? It's only possible if the process which accepts the message from the net at large has knowledge of the final delivery target. This is the case sometimes, and other times not. No i try again to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED], i get a 250_ok (remote accepted message) !!! (they should have bounced back). qmail-smtpd doesn't have any knowledge of local users. It therefore cannot reject the message during the initial SMTP conversation. It then bounces the message if the local user turns out not to exist. This is all allowed by the SMTP spec. as you've mentioned : you see the accept message and followed by a bounce. what i could be possibly missing? is it some sort of qmail-remote configuration?? No, it's not a configuration issue. You simply don't understand that this is also correct and allowed behaviour, and for obvious reasons, it has to be. There are many network and software configurations which simply make it impossible to know during the inital SMTP conversation whether the local part of an address is valid. Charles -- --- Charles Cazabon[EMAIL PROTECTED] GPL'ed software available at: http://www.qcc.sk.ca/~charlesc/software/ Any opinions expressed are just that -- my opinions. ---
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
probably this is what is going wrong: this time i used qmail-remote directly : /var/qmail/bin/qmail-remote schwab.com sender-envelope [EMAIL PROTECTED] qmail-remote exits with the report rK: * rRecipient report: acceptance. KMessage report: success. host has taken responsibility for delivering the message to each acceptable recipient. * Now if sender-envelope address is at my qmail-server, the bounce never comes back. If i change the sender-envelope address to some another address as [EMAIL PROTECTED], a bounce is received at that address!! which may mean either the remote hosts like aol.com and schwab.com are either not able to send the bounce message to the sender-envelope address at my qmail server, which i have been using. (they don't like my server name/ip, but i checked that reverse lookup are fine !) or they are sending the bounce to the envelope, but qmail is not accepting them due to some reasons.. -ketan - Original Message - From: Ketan Bajaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Greg White [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, April 23, 2001 12:26 PM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted i tried something more : sent messages to bad_user_names @yahoo.com, hotmail.com. My qmail logs show that they bounce back immediately, with a error code 554 and 550 respectively. which is the correct and expected behaviour. No i try again to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED], i get a 250_ok (remote accepted message) !!! (they should have bounced back). is it that schwab.com, aol.com are delaying the bounce back and sending the bounce back after sending the accept message .. and my qmail logs when it gets the 250_ok message, doesn't write any other error info into logs for the same message id / delivery id. or maybe qmail-remote closes connection with the remote server after seeing a 250_ok message and thus doesn't get the delayed bounce ??? ( i'm sending the email using mailto address, and putting a subject with no message body) as you've mentioned : you see the accept message and followed by a bounce. what i could be possibly missing? is it some sort of qmail-remote configuration?? thanks, Ketan - Original Message - From: Greg White [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2001 1:43 AM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted On Sat, Apr 21, 2001 at 01:52:54PM -0700, Ketan Bajaj wrote: i think i haven't been clear enough in explaining the problem... again, A (local smtp server)B (remote smtp server) B is at domain schwab.com, about which i do not know anything, whether it has qmail, sendmail, exchange or anything else. 1. when A is setup as qmail, and remote address is incorrect@B there is no bounce from B and the message is accepted at B. I see this at the qmail logs on A. In sending them a test message, I too see the remote host accept the message, but it promptly bounces it with '550 User Unknown'. Your qmail server is likely configured incorrectly -- you should be seeing the bounces. Please send a message, _headers and all_, that you sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] from your qmail server... GW
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
On Sat, Apr 21, 2001 at 01:52:54PM -0700, Ketan Bajaj wrote: i think i haven't been clear enough in explaining the problem... again, A (local smtp server)B (remote smtp server) B is at domain schwab.com, about which i do not know anything, whether it has qmail, sendmail, exchange or anything else. 1. when A is setup as qmail, and remote address is incorrect@B there is no bounce from B and the message is accepted at B. I see this at the qmail logs on A. In sending them a test message, I too see the remote host accept the message, but it promptly bounces it with '550 User Unknown'. Your qmail server is likely configured incorrectly -- you should be seeing the bounces. Please send a message, _headers and all_, that you sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] from your qmail server... GW
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
Does the exchange server you're sending through store mail for the schwab.com domain? if so, then this explains why. -jesse At 22:01 -0700 20/4/2001, Ketan Bajaj wrote: I have been seeing a problem: when i sent an email to an incorrect user at a correct domain, the qmail logs show that the message has been accepted. But if i send the same email, incorrect_user@correct_domain through outlook (microsoft exchange), the email bounces back immediately, with error message shown below: - Transcript of session follows - 550 [EMAIL PROTECTED] User unknown Any idea why email does not bounce when sent through qmail. thanks, Ketan -- Jesse Reynolds - Virtual Artists Pty Ltd - http://www.va.com.au jesse (at) va.com.au
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
No i don't think so ( why would the exchange server in my domain store another domain's email) -ketan - Original Message - From: "Jesse Reynolds" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "Ketan Bajaj" [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2001 12:05 AM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted Does the exchange server you're sending through store mail for the schwab.com domain? if so, then this explains why. -jesse At 22:01 -0700 20/4/2001, Ketan Bajaj wrote: I have been seeing a problem: when i sent an email to an incorrect user at a correct domain, the qmail logs show that the message has been accepted. But if i send the same email, incorrect_user@correct_domain through outlook (microsoft exchange), the email bounces back immediately, with error message shown below: - Transcript of session follows - 550 [EMAIL PROTECTED] User unknown Any idea why email does not bounce when sent through qmail. thanks, Ketan -- Jesse Reynolds - Virtual Artists Pty Ltd - http://www.va.com.au jesse (at) va.com.au
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
On Fri, Apr 20, 2001 at 10:01:45PM -0700, Ketan Bajaj wrote: I have been seeing a problem: when i sent an email to an incorrect user at a correct domain, the qmail logs show that the message has been accepted. But if i send the same email, incorrect_user@correct_domain through outlook (microsoft exchange), the email bounces back immediately, with error message shown below: - Transcript of session follows - 550 [EMAIL PROTECTED] User unknown Any idea why email does not bounce when sent through qmail. qmail-smtpd doesn't know anything about users or local addresses; it knows only what domains it should accept mail for. Once a message has been queued and processed, it'll be bounced if there is no such address. Are you questioning why qmail-smtpd doesn't reject the message right away, during the SMTP dialog, rather than accepting the message at first and then later bouncing it? Or are you saying that the message is never bounced? If the former, the answer is that that's how qmail works. If the latter, then you have a .qmail-default file that will catch any address rather than bounce mail sent to non-existent addresses. Chris
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
i think i haven't been clear enough in explaining the problem... again, A (local smtp server)B (remote smtp server) B is at domain schwab.com, about which i do not know anything, whether it has qmail, sendmail, exchange or anything else. 1. when A is setup as qmail, and remote address is incorrect@B there is no bounce from B and the message is accepted at B. I see this at the qmail logs on A. 2. when A is Microsoft exchange (with MUA as Outlook / outlook express), the email sent to incorrect@B bounces back immediately. so my rephrased question is why the behaviour of B is not consistent, whatever A is. I just checked this: sent an email from hotmail (which also uses qmail) to incorrect@B, and the email bounced back from B! so could it be that i have set up qmail at A incorrectly (case1 above), it don't think it should matter how the .qmail-default is set up at A. or maybe i should go back on Monday and check the qmail logs at A again, and see again if there's bounce message appearing now.! thanks, Ketan - Original Message - From: "Chris Johnson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "Ketan Bajaj" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2001 11:41 AM Subject: Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted On Fri, Apr 20, 2001 at 10:01:45PM -0700, Ketan Bajaj wrote: I have been seeing a problem: when i sent an email to an incorrect user at a correct domain, the qmail logs show that the message has been accepted. But if i send the same email, incorrect_user@correct_domain through outlook (microsoft exchange), the email bounces back immediately, with error message shown below: - Transcript of session follows - 550 [EMAIL PROTECTED] User unknown Any idea why email does not bounce when sent through qmail. qmail-smtpd doesn't know anything about users or local addresses; it knows only what domains it should accept mail for. Once a message has been queued and processed, it'll be bounced if there is no such address. Are you questioning why qmail-smtpd doesn't reject the message right away, during the SMTP dialog, rather than accepting the message at first and then later bouncing it? Or are you saying that the message is never bounced? If the former, the answer is that that's how qmail works. If the latter, then you have a .qmail-default file that will catch any address rather than bounce mail sent to non-existent addresses. Chris
Re: incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
On Sat, Apr 21, 2001 at 01:52:54PM -0700, Ketan Bajaj wrote: i think i haven't been clear enough in explaining the problem... again, A (local smtp server)B (remote smtp server) B is at domain schwab.com, about which i do not know anything, whether it has qmail, sendmail, exchange or anything else. 1. when A is setup as qmail, and remote address is incorrect@B there is no bounce from B and the message is accepted at B. I see this at the qmail logs on A. 2. when A is Microsoft exchange (with MUA as Outlook / outlook express), the email sent to incorrect@B bounces back immediately. I'd have to see this to believe it. Chris PGP signature
incorrect_user@correct_domain accepted
I have been seeing a problem: when i sent an email to an incorrect user at a correct domain, the qmail logs show that the message has been accepted. But if i send the same email, incorrect_user@correct_domain through outlook (microsoft exchange), the email bounces back immediately, with error message shown below: - Transcript of session follows - 550 [EMAIL PROTECTED] User unknown Any idea why email does not bounce when sent through qmail. thanks, Ketan
