[RBW] Re: All-Rounder Deal - Anyone dig 26 here?
Good discussion all! Almost makes me think I should have bid higher on that AR...Maybe it's not too late for Riv to consider a 559/59+cm version of the new Atlantis? (I'll take a 62 please) I recall an earlier Reader that had a nice article about cycle aesthetics, and I pretty much agreed with all of the points GP made in it. (Now where was that...) When I built up the Trek 850 (559/61cm) and took a long look at the thing from every angle, I was surprised that with fenders and the right size tires, a tall-frame 26er actually looked quite balanced. Not so much with typical MTB tires, but it came together once it was set up in AR mode. Here's a link to those pics for those that had not seen it before. http://tinyurl.com/ygerbmv Marty -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: All-Rounder Deal - Anyone dig 26 here?
On Mon, 2010-01-04 at 19:12 -0800, Justin August wrote: Well, Matthew Grimm recently pushed the 650b version of the Kogswell P/ R to Anthony @ Longleaf so MG could focus on a 26 wheeled version for the foreseeable future. Yes, as I recall what he said, he's concentrating on a market that has junk MTBs laying around with recyclable wheels, aiming to sell them on a frame that's more suited to practical tasks than the MTB frames those wheels came on. That's almost an operational definition of bottom feeder, isn't it? And it's hardly a narrative to inspire. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Anyone dig 26 here?
My Ram (52cm) came with 26 wheels so that the frame geometry would be better than with 700s, per GP's notes when the bike was still for sale on the RBW site. Since then, I purchased a second set of 26 wheels which can carry bigger tires than the stock Arrayas or go on another bike. Just for fun, and using the long reach Tektro calipers, I put the 26 wheels on a 53 CM frame that came originally with 700 wheels. The brakes ju had enough reach to make it work. The handling was a bit too twitchy with the severe change in trail, but I did like both the look and the ride. So yes, I dig 26. Wish that there were more road centered tire choices in the 28mm ish range. (Running Conti Ultra Gatorskin 28s now) Tailwinds From: Marty mgie...@mac.com To: RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, January 5, 2010 6:02:43 AM Subject: [RBW] Re: All-Rounder Deal - Anyone dig 26 here? Good discussion all! Almost makes me think I should have bid higher on that AR...Maybe it's not too late for Riv to consider a 559/59+cm version of the new Atlantis? (I'll take a 62 please) I recall an earlier Reader that had a nice article about cycle aesthetics, and I pretty much agreed with all of the points GP made in it. (Now where was that...) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
That is a really nice looking sam, probably one of the nicer builds I have seen! Just when I thought I was over getting a sam! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
What front derailleur are you using? I have a similar setup, but have issues with the tire clearance. thx. On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(with all stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester tandem, which I loved), but wasn't quite ready to build up a frame myself, and also thought it too precious/expensive. The Bianchi was stolen in 2003 or so, and in 2006 I replaced it with a used Independent Fabrications Planet Cross (http://tinyurl.com/yduufyx) that could do double duty as a fast road bike and an off-roader (though the rear can't quite fit 42 mm knobbies). My Sphinx meanwhile wore fenders and got me to school and back. I even went so far as to buy a silly aero wheelset for the Indy Fab so I could switch it back and forth from road to off road quickly, and was thinking of replacing the dowdy Sugino triple with something sexier and lighter-weight (I hadn't yet reallized that there isn't anything sexier than a Sugino). But then it started bugging me that the Indy Fab couldn't take fenders or racks (no braze-ons) and slowly the things that initially turned me off a bit about Rivendell (why do the MUSA pants have to be two-tone? Flat pedals? Without toe-straps, even? Mud flaps? In California? What's up with the ridiculously high stems? [I still don't understand why Riv doesn't promote Periscopa type stems more, I think they would look much better than a Technomic raised to the max]), well, those things didn't bug me so much anymore. I still didn't want to/couldn't spend $2000 on a frame, the Atlantis seemed
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
It's an IRD compact I had lying around. I am actually not that happy with it. It requires severe overshifting to go from granny to the middle ring (ramped, brand-new Sugino rings) regardless of which gear I am in in the back. Anyone know if I can tweak the setup to improve it? Pretty much followed Sheldon's installation instructions... What tire clearance issues do you have? Interference with the front derailer? Cheers, Gernot On Jan 5, 9:48 pm, doc gspi...@aol.com wrote: What front derailleur are you using? I have a similar setup, but have issues with the tire clearance. thx. On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(withall stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester tandem, which I loved), but wasn't quite ready to build up a frame myself, and also thought it too precious/expensive. The Bianchi was stolen in 2003 or so, and in 2006 I replaced it with a used Independent Fabrications Planet Cross (http://tinyurl.com/yduufyx) that could do double duty as a fast road bike and an off-roader (though the rear can't quite fit 42 mm knobbies). My Sphinx meanwhile wore fenders and got me to school and back. I even went so far as to buy a silly aero wheelset for the Indy Fab so I could switch it back and forth from road to off road quickly, and was thinking of replacing the dowdy Sugino triple with something sexier and lighter-weight (I hadn't yet reallized that there isn't anything sexier than a Sugino). But then it started bugging me that the Indy Fab
[RBW] OT But Fun - How Riv Customers are Made
Was on Spectrum looking for pictures of my bike. None there, but did find this: http://www.spectrumpowderworks.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4t=101 What is not to love? Lugs, double crown plate, King headset, can't make out the front hub, but it looks like the real deal. Kid is definitely going to have a thang for Rivs someday. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
Earl: What ring sizes are you using? dougP On Jan 5, 7:39 am, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: It's an IRD compact I had lying around. I am actually not that happy with it. It requires severe overshifting to go from granny to the middle ring (ramped, brand-new Sugino rings) regardless of which gear I am in in the back. Anyone know if I can tweak the setup to improve it? Pretty much followed Sheldon's installation instructions... What tire clearance issues do you have? Interference with the front derailer? Cheers, Gernot On Jan 5, 9:48 pm, doc gspi...@aol.com wrote: What front derailleur are you using? I have a similar setup, but have issues with the tire clearance. thx. On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(withall stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester tandem, which I loved), but wasn't quite ready to build up a frame myself, and also thought it too precious/expensive. The Bianchi was stolen in 2003 or so, and in 2006 I replaced it with a used Independent Fabrications Planet Cross (http://tinyurl.com/yduufyx) that could do double duty as a fast road bike and an off-roader (though the rear can't quite fit 42 mm knobbies). My Sphinx meanwhile wore fenders and got me to school and back. I even went so far as to buy a silly aero wheelset for the Indy Fab so I could switch it back and forth from road to off road quickly, and was thinking of replacing the dowdy Sugino
Re: [RBW] OT But Fun - How Riv Customers are Made
Oh my. Ohmy. I was just thinking about the logistics of learning to make bike frames so I could keep my kids in bikes throughout their lives. Seeing this makes me so envious. What power. What intensity. What talent. Oh my. OT or not, thank you for posting, Joel. Happy New Year! -- Jon ³Papa² Grant Illustration + Information Graphics Austin, Texas jgr...@papagrant.com 512-284-9599 From: JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com Reply-To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 08:03:09 -0800 (PST) To: RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: [RBW] OT But Fun - How Riv Customers are Made Was on Spectrum looking for pictures of my bike. None there, but did find this: http://www.spectrumpowderworks.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4t=101 What is not to love? Lugs, double crown plate, King headset, can't make out the front hub, but it looks like the real deal. Kid is definitely going to have a thang for Rivs someday. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
On Jan 4, 9:50 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote: I meant this: is standing on steep climbs, or, IOW, standing and doing low cadence, high torque pedalling, bad for you knees? Is it any different from stair stepping? I don't see how stair stepping is comparable unless you're taking a few steps at a time, which would also be putting unnecessary stress on the knees. the way I understand it (based on text books and conversations with physical therapists), the knee is essentially a bearing. in a healthy knee, the back of the kneecap runs smoothly over the bones that make up the knee joint because there is a nice layer of lubrication there. when you forcefully extend your leg - e.g. push down on a step or pedal - there is some contact pressure between the kneecap and knee joint but the lubrication keeps everything working nicely. when you put really big loads on the knee, it creates excessive contact pressure and can actually displace the lubrication. bearings - and joints - fail overtime when they're not properly lubricated. in any event, i'm not a doctor. and you specifically asked for a non- speculative answer. so, I apologize for this (although i don't think it's pure speculation): I don't think anyone would endorse a day-in/ day-out, very low cadence, grind-your-way-uphill riding style if you are concerned with the long term health of your knees. and making a relative comparison to another activity which also stresses the knee might not be best way to assess whether it's bad for your knees. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Anyone dig 26 here?
A 26 wheeled Ram with two sets of wheels (light go fast/heavy trail use) sounds like an awesome bike! Rivendell has been so invested in 650B I forget they have 26 bikes also. On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 5:31 AM, Bruce fullylug...@yahoo.com wrote: My Ram (52cm) came with 26 wheels so that the frame geometry would be better than with 700s, per GP's notes when the bike was still for sale on the RBW site. Since then, I purchased a second set of 26 wheels which can carry bigger tires than the stock Arrayas or go on another bike. Just for fun, and using the long reach Tektro calipers, I put the 26 wheels on a 53 CM frame that came originally with 700 wheels. The brakes ju had enough reach to make it work. The handling was a bit too twitchy with the severe change in trail, but I did like both the look and the ride. So yes, I dig 26. Wish that there were more road centered tire choices in the 28mm ish range. (Running Conti Ultra Gatorskin 28s now) Tailwinds -- *From:* Marty mgie...@mac.com *To:* RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com *Sent:* Tue, January 5, 2010 6:02:43 AM *Subject:* [RBW] Re: All-Rounder Deal - Anyone dig 26 here? Good discussion all! Almost makes me think I should have bid higher on that AR...Maybe it's not too late for Riv to consider a 559/59+cm version of the new Atlantis? (I'll take a 62 please) I recall an earlier Reader that had a nice article about cycle aesthetics, and I pretty much agreed with all of the points GP made in it. (Now where was that...) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comrbw-owners-bunch%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- Cheers, David Redlands, CA Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym. ~Bill Nye, scientist guy -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Anyone dig 26 here?
cyclotourist wrote: A 26 wheeled Ram with two sets of wheels (light go fast/heavy trail use) sounds like an awesome bike! Rivendell has been so invested in 650B I forget they have 26 bikes also. --- I rode with an RBW listmember a couple of weeks ago, Sean O¹Bryan. He rode a smaller-framed, 26²-wheeled Rambouillet that looked perfectly proportioned, to my eye. He likes it pretty well, as I recall. Also, he had no problem wielding it to wax my ass on every uphill. He and his randonneuring buddy Jeff graciously waited for me at every crest, it seemed. Happy New Year! -- Jon ³Tandem-weight on a Single² Grant Illustration + Information Graphics Austin, Texas jgr...@papagrant.com 512-284-9599 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Rivendell Roadeo or Other
On Jan 4, 4:54 pm, sjauch sja...@gmail.com wrote: They have 2 55cm's built up and I'm a 52 or 53, so even though It's not my size I can hopefully still get an idea of how it rides. you might find that a 55 is exactly what rivendell recommends. have a look at riv's sizing/fit philosophy and be open minded about it if you're not already familiar with it. PBH (pubic bone height) is the crucial measurement for Rivendell. You can take this measurement yourself and figure out what size frame they'll most likely recommend. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Rivendell Roadeo or Other
There is always some risk in a custom bike because every custom is one- of-a-kind, and there are no prototypes, etc to work out the bugs before the customer pays the bill and takes the frame/bike. And if you don't like it, a custom can be tough to sell. Rivendell has the advantage of having designed/sold thousands of bikes, not including the even larger number of GP-designed Bridgestones. Unless you have some really strange bodily dimension to accommodate, or want some non- standard features on the frame, I'd suggest the stock Roadeo. (I have a custom bike and it's wonderful, but not every custom owner has the same positive experience...) On Jan 4, 3:54 pm, sjauch sja...@gmail.com wrote: I currently have a 2005 Specialized Allez Comp. It was my first road bike and it is about a size too big and only recently got comfortable riding it once I put an 80mm stem on it. Anyway I have been looking for a new road bike and want to go with a steel frame, preferably lugged. I have been eyeing the Rivendell Roadeo, as well as the De Rosa Corum (not lugged) and custom builders, Jeff Lyon and Circle A Cycles. I am very close to sending in a deposit to Jeff Lyon because of his experience with building the type of frames I'm interested in. However, I have resisted because I am drawn to the Rivendell Roadeo since it is similar to what I would like Jeff Lyon to build me. Also I am out in CA two or three times a year and stay pretty close to where Rivendell is located. So, I can visit them and test ride a similar frame to what I would be buying. They have 2 55cm's built up and I'm a 52 or 53, so even though It's not my size I can hopefully still get an idea of how it rides. I also really like the De Rosa, but none of the shops I called keep them in stock and if I am going to buy it locally I'd like to be able to take it out for a spin to see how things feel. If I'm dropping over 2k for that frame I might as well send my $ off to Lyon and let him build me something since I couldn't test ride that either and is probably more what I want. That brings me back to the Rivendell and Lyon dilemma. I want a lugged frame that is as light as practical and can fit fenders if I want to use them. I like the Lyon option because for about the same as the Rivendell I am getting something made just for me. However he is relying on the measurements and info I provide to make the correct frame. With the Riv bike I can visit them and let them take my measurements to determine which size Roadeo is the best fit. So I am really confused and am asking here to see which way some of you would go. Thanks! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Anyone dig 26 here?
On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 9:00 AM, Jon Grant jgr...@papagrant.com wrote: cyclotourist wrote: A 26 wheeled Ram with two sets of wheels (light go fast/heavy trail use) sounds like an awesome bike! Rivendell has been so invested in 650B I forget they have 26 bikes also. --- I rode with an RBW listmember a couple of weeks ago, Sean O’Bryan. He rode a smaller-framed, 26”-wheeled Rambouillet that looked perfectly proportioned, to my eye. He likes it pretty well, as I recall. Also, he had no problem wielding it to wax my ass on every uphill. He and his randonneuring buddy Jeff graciously waited for me at every crest, it seemed. *Happy New Year! **-- **Jon “Tandem-weight on a Single” Grant * I've noticed I tend to be the last one up the hill no matter what wheelset I'm using! Luckily I'm pretty quick at getting down the other side! -- Cheers, David Redlands, CA Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym. ~Bill Nye, scientist guy -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Anyone dig 26 here?
Yeah, something about the motor making more of a difference From: cyclotourist cyclotour...@gmail.com Also, he had no problem wielding it to wax my ass on every uphill. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] WTB:or Trade Saluki frame
Looking to trade or buy a 58cm Saluki frame.I currently ride a 56cm Saluki school bus yellow paint scheme and since purchasing a 58cm Rambouillet have found that the 56cm is to small for me.Anyone out there who has a similar dilema please contact me. Thanks james -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: All-Rounder Deal - Anyone dig 26 here?
Go Beth! You nailed it. Thank you for reminding me that when I bought my first mountain bike 18 years ago, I sold my Raleigh Team USA for $100 in order to make it happen. After years of fussing about this brake or that tire or what saddle works best for under $200, it's easy to forget what reality is like for most folks. My Atlantis frame cost around $1000 several years ago. That's about what an LHT sells for now as a complete bike, last time I looked. Even at that price, a good many of the folks for whom it would be an ideal bike consider it beyond their reach or even outrageously expensive. I keep building grocery bikes mostly out of parts I have lying around, because I'm not comfortable locking my nice bikes up at the supermarkets in my area. Inevitably, these grocery bikes end up with cool stuff on them and it becomes apparent that they are no less likely to be ripped off. Just easier to replace. That just seems hopelessly silly, but I can't help it. On Jan 4, 6:50 pm, beth h periwinkle...@yahoo.com wrote: Steve said: I suppose nobody cares that much about 559. Au contraire. The number of real-world bike shops (i.e., those that focus on mass- produced bicycles retailing for under $1,000) doing a roaring business in 650b is VERY low. 650b, while it offers a lovely ride and a great in-between wheel size that certainly fits a niche, is more likely to be found through custom builders, and from mail-order houses specializing in outfitting those custom frames. At our shop, we do carry 650b rims and tires. We probably get asked to build custom wheels in that size four or five times a year; and we've sold exactly ten 650b tires to customers in the last 6 months. We also carry 26/559 wheels, rims and tubes. We sell them by the hundreds. The largest number of bikes I've ever seen with 650b wheels -- about twelve of them -- were all in one room at the recent Oregon Manifest bike show. All of those gorgeous bikes were custom built. Some were available for sale and among those the cheapest one sold for around $4,000. The winning bike at the show is currently for sale, for a cool six grand. While these bikes represent some fantastic -- and even, in many cases, truly sensible -- ideas in bicycle design, I do not consider them to be real world bikes. I consider a real-world bike to be a mass-produced, LBS-quality bike that would retail for between $400 and $1000 complete. That is a bike that the majority of hourly-wage workers in this country can afford, even if they have to save up for it for several months (as a number of our customers have had to do). Based on that criteriae, there is not yet a real-world bike on the market that is built around 650b wheels. That's not to say it won't happen. I certainly could happen. But in order for it to happen, 650b proponents would have to be willing to accept a lower common standard in order to make the bike accessible to many more people. At present, 650b is still being sold on its performance, and in no small part its hip, French coolness. As an individual who loves hand-built bikes and beautiful components that perform beautifully, I GET cool, I actually DIG cool and in fact I am blessed enough to be able to RIDE cool to work every day. But as a bicycle salesperson it is very hard for me to sell that kind of cool to someone who rides daily for transportation, works in a dicey neighborhood and has to lock their bike to the gas meter in an apartment building basement every night. That level of cool is simply too expensive to buy, and to risk, at the present time. For my money, THE way to go for real-world bikes IS 26/559. The wheel size has been around for ages, offers zillions of tread choices and price ranges, and can be cobbled together with a used frame and parts to provide a VERY servicable, extremely rideable bike at a price that an hourly wage worker can handle. I love -- no, I ADORE -- the 26/559 wheel size and I am sure I'm not alone. That is why I worried when I heard that the Atlantis might go away. The Atlantis is an absolute wet dream of a 559-dedicated bike and it should live forever. I hope it will. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] WTB:or Trade Saluki frame
Hobie, How are you liking the Rambouillet? Tim On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 8:23 AM, hobie moho1...@yahoo.com wrote: Looking to trade or buy a 58cm Saluki frame.I currently ride a 56cm Saluki school bus yellow paint scheme and since purchasing a 58cm Rambouillet have found that the 56cm is to small for me.Anyone out there who has a similar dilema please contact me. Thanks james -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comrbw-owners-bunch%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
Congrats on the new bike. I have one question though. Isn't the Hillborne just as heavy as the Atlantis? I thought it was made out of the same gauge tubing and the which bike for what .pdf on the riv site says it's just as tourable. Just curious as to whether this is true or not. Thanks! On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(with all stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester tandem, which I loved), but wasn't quite ready to build up a frame myself, and also thought it too precious/expensive. The Bianchi was stolen in 2003 or so, and in 2006 I replaced it with a used Independent Fabrications Planet Cross (http://tinyurl.com/yduufyx) that could do double duty as a fast road bike and an off-roader (though the rear can't quite fit 42 mm knobbies). My Sphinx meanwhile wore fenders and got me to school and back. I even went so far as to buy a silly aero wheelset for the Indy Fab so I could switch it back and forth from road to off road quickly, and was thinking of replacing the dowdy Sugino triple with something sexier and lighter-weight (I hadn't yet reallized that there isn't anything sexier than a Sugino). But then it started bugging me that the Indy Fab couldn't take fenders or racks (no braze-ons) and slowly the things that initially turned me off a bit about Rivendell (why do the MUSA pants have to be two-tone? Flat pedals? Without toe-straps, even? Mud flaps? In California? What's up with the ridiculously high stems? [I still don't understand why Riv doesn't promote Periscopa type stems more, I think they would
[RBW] Re: All-Rounder Deal - Anyone dig 26 here?
Even at that price, a good many of the folks for whom it would be an ideal bike consider it beyond their reach or even outrageously expensive. Perhaps unfortunately so beyond the reach of some, but not outrageously. There is nothing outrageous about paying a fair price for quality built by people expert in their craft. On Jan 4, 9:08 pm, Swashbuckling Dandy swashbuckling.da...@gmail.com wrote: Go Beth! You nailed it. Thank you for reminding me that when I bought my first mountain bike 18 years ago, I sold my Raleigh Team USA for $100 in order to make it happen. After years of fussing about this brake or that tire or what saddle works best for under $200, it's easy to forget what reality is like for most folks. My Atlantis frame cost around $1000 several years ago. That's about what an LHT sells for now as a complete bike, last time I looked. Even at that price, a good many of the folks for whom it would be an ideal bike consider it beyond their reach or even outrageously expensive. I keep building grocery bikes mostly out of parts I have lying around, because I'm not comfortable locking my nice bikes up at the supermarkets in my area. Inevitably, these grocery bikes end up with cool stuff on them and it becomes apparent that they are no less likely to be ripped off. Just easier to replace. That just seems hopelessly silly, but I can't help it. On Jan 4, 6:50 pm, beth h periwinkle...@yahoo.com wrote: Steve said: I suppose nobody cares that much about 559. Au contraire. The number of real-world bike shops (i.e., those that focus on mass- produced bicycles retailing for under $1,000) doing a roaring business in 650b is VERY low. 650b, while it offers a lovely ride and a great in-between wheel size that certainly fits a niche, is more likely to be found through custom builders, and from mail-order houses specializing in outfitting those custom frames. At our shop, we do carry 650b rims and tires. We probably get asked to build custom wheels in that size four or five times a year; and we've sold exactly ten 650b tires to customers in the last 6 months. We also carry 26/559 wheels, rims and tubes. We sell them by the hundreds. The largest number of bikes I've ever seen with 650b wheels -- about twelve of them -- were all in one room at the recent Oregon Manifest bike show. All of those gorgeous bikes were custom built. Some were available for sale and among those the cheapest one sold for around $4,000. The winning bike at the show is currently for sale, for a cool six grand. While these bikes represent some fantastic -- and even, in many cases, truly sensible -- ideas in bicycle design, I do not consider them to be real world bikes. I consider a real-world bike to be a mass-produced, LBS-quality bike that would retail for between $400 and $1000 complete. That is a bike that the majority of hourly-wage workers in this country can afford, even if they have to save up for it for several months (as a number of our customers have had to do). Based on that criteriae, there is not yet a real-world bike on the market that is built around 650b wheels. That's not to say it won't happen. I certainly could happen. But in order for it to happen, 650b proponents would have to be willing to accept a lower common standard in order to make the bike accessible to many more people. At present, 650b is still being sold on its performance, and in no small part its hip, French coolness. As an individual who loves hand-built bikes and beautiful components that perform beautifully, I GET cool, I actually DIG cool and in fact I am blessed enough to be able to RIDE cool to work every day. But as a bicycle salesperson it is very hard for me to sell that kind of cool to someone who rides daily for transportation, works in a dicey neighborhood and has to lock their bike to the gas meter in an apartment building basement every night. That level of cool is simply too expensive to buy, and to risk, at the present time. For my money, THE way to go for real-world bikes IS 26/559. The wheel size has been around for ages, offers zillions of tread choices and price ranges, and can be cobbled together with a used frame and parts to provide a VERY servicable, extremely rideable bike at a price that an hourly wage worker can handle. I love -- no, I ADORE -- the 26/559 wheel size and I am sure I'm not alone. That is why I worried when I heard that the Atlantis might go away. The Atlantis is an absolute wet dream of a 559-dedicated bike and it should live forever. I hope it will.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit
[RBW] Re: Rivendell Roadeo or Other
Good points, Jim. I am 50/50 on customs. One worked great for me (until a blasted truck ran over it) the other not so well. I keep coming back, but I am in a position where maybe that is not so hard for me. A Riv is a pretty good candidate for someone's first good bike (or second, third, or fourth!) On Jan 5, 11:26 am, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: There is always some risk in a custom bike because every custom is one- of-a-kind, and there are no prototypes, etc to work out the bugs before the customer pays the bill and takes the frame/bike. And if you don't like it, a custom can be tough to sell. Rivendell has the advantage of having designed/sold thousands of bikes, not including the even larger number of GP-designed Bridgestones. Unless you have some really strange bodily dimension to accommodate, or want some non- standard features on the frame, I'd suggest the stock Roadeo. (I have a custom bike and it's wonderful, but not every custom owner has the same positive experience...) On Jan 4, 3:54 pm, sjauch sja...@gmail.com wrote: I currently have a 2005 Specialized Allez Comp. It was my first road bike and it is about a size too big and only recently got comfortable riding it once I put an 80mm stem on it. Anyway I have been looking for a new road bike and want to go with a steel frame, preferably lugged. I have been eyeing the Rivendell Roadeo, as well as the De Rosa Corum (not lugged) and custom builders, Jeff Lyon and Circle A Cycles. I am very close to sending in a deposit to Jeff Lyon because of his experience with building the type of frames I'm interested in. However, I have resisted because I am drawn to the Rivendell Roadeo since it is similar to what I would like Jeff Lyon to build me. Also I am out in CA two or three times a year and stay pretty close to where Rivendell is located. So, I can visit them and test ride a similar frame to what I would be buying. They have 2 55cm's built up and I'm a 52 or 53, so even though It's not my size I can hopefully still get an idea of how it rides. I also really like the De Rosa, but none of the shops I called keep them in stock and if I am going to buy it locally I'd like to be able to take it out for a spin to see how things feel. If I'm dropping over 2k for that frame I might as well send my $ off to Lyon and let him build me something since I couldn't test ride that either and is probably more what I want. That brings me back to the Rivendell and Lyon dilemma. I want a lugged frame that is as light as practical and can fit fenders if I want to use them. I like the Lyon option because for about the same as the Rivendell I am getting something made just for me. However he is relying on the measurements and info I provide to make the correct frame. With the Riv bike I can visit them and let them take my measurements to determine which size Roadeo is the best fit. So I am really confused and am asking here to see which way some of you would go. Thanks!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: All-Rounder Deal - Anyone dig 26 here?
On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 12:08 PM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote: Even at that price, a good many of the folks for whom it would be an ideal bike consider it beyond their reach or even outrageously expensive. Perhaps unfortunately so beyond the reach of some, but not outrageously. There is nothing outrageous about paying a fair price for quality built by people expert in their craft. One option, of course, is to spend double (at least!) on each of your bikes what you spend on your car. (I do realize that, for some, a car is not a plaything or a status symbol of some very weird sort, but a necessity.) I have seen many people poor enough to be hard pressed to pay their monthly insurance premiums making payments on cars far, far more expensive than what I drive; not to mention fast food bills and fancy cell phones and iPods and what have you; my ex, a pediatrician, saw many Medicaid patients carrying Vuitton and so on. I'm not ranting about welfare queens, but our country is so rich that even many of the poor can afford decent bikes if they really wanted them. I've seen poverty in India and Pakistan, where a bike means, or used to mean, practically middle class status. -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Rivendell Roadeo or Other
Thanks all for the for the input, keep it coming. I am leaning towards the Roadeo (digging the white blue) and will see what the Riv crew says when I pay them a visit. I've visited them before and appreciate their honesty. Jim: Grant's knowledge and experience is another comforting factor as well as buying from an established business. On Jan 5, 12:26 pm, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: There is always some risk in a custom bike because every custom is one- of-a-kind, and there are no prototypes, etc to work out the bugs before the customer pays the bill and takes the frame/bike. And if you don't like it, a custom can be tough to sell. Rivendell has the advantage of having designed/sold thousands of bikes, not including the even larger number of GP-designed Bridgestones. Unless you have some really strange bodily dimension to accommodate, or want some non- standard features on the frame, I'd suggest the stock Roadeo. (I have a custom bike and it's wonderful, but not every custom owner has the same positive experience...) On Jan 4, 3:54 pm, sjauch sja...@gmail.com wrote: I currently have a 2005 Specialized Allez Comp. It was my first road bike and it is about a size too big and only recently got comfortable riding it once I put an 80mm stem on it. Anyway I have been looking for a new road bike and want to go with a steel frame, preferably lugged. I have been eyeing the Rivendell Roadeo, as well as the De Rosa Corum (not lugged) and custom builders, Jeff Lyon and Circle A Cycles. I am very close to sending in a deposit to Jeff Lyon because of his experience with building the type of frames I'm interested in. However, I have resisted because I am drawn to the Rivendell Roadeo since it is similar to what I would like Jeff Lyon to build me. Also I am out in CA two or three times a year and stay pretty close to where Rivendell is located. So, I can visit them and test ride a similar frame to what I would be buying. They have 2 55cm's built up and I'm a 52 or 53, so even though It's not my size I can hopefully still get an idea of how it rides. I also really like the De Rosa, but none of the shops I called keep them in stock and if I am going to buy it locally I'd like to be able to take it out for a spin to see how things feel. If I'm dropping over 2k for that frame I might as well send my $ off to Lyon and let him build me something since I couldn't test ride that either and is probably more what I want. That brings me back to the Rivendell and Lyon dilemma. I want a lugged frame that is as light as practical and can fit fenders if I want to use them. I like the Lyon option because for about the same as the Rivendell I am getting something made just for me. However he is relying on the measurements and info I provide to make the correct frame. With the Riv bike I can visit them and let them take my measurements to determine which size Roadeo is the best fit. So I am really confused and am asking here to see which way some of you would go. Thanks!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: January Calendar
Thanks Eric - very cool pic of the QB by the way thanks for sharing On Jan 4, 1:30 pm, Eric Norris campyonly...@me.com wrote: Here it is: https://rcpt.yousendit.com/798181952/ac2521f0bae5b412eab7c1e305d4cbb8 On Jan 4, 2010, at 1:27 PM, RoadieRyan rya...@hotmail.com wrote: https://rcpt.yousendit.com/798181952/ac2521f0bae5b412eab7c1e305d4cbb8- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
on 1/5/10 11:05 AM, JGS at jonat...@jonfipro.com wrote: Congrats on the new bike. I have one question though. Isn't the Hillborne just as heavy as the Atlantis? I thought it was made out of the same gauge tubing and the which bike for what .pdf on the riv site says it's just as tourable. Just curious as to whether this is true or not. Thanks! My understanding was that the Hillborne tubeset was a bit lighter _in_ _places_ when compared to the Atlantis - that it was designed to be between the Hilsen and Atlantis, functionally. One tube thicker here, one tube thinner there, it may weigh the same, but the tubing choices were different. - J -- Jim Edgar cyclofi...@earthlink.net ³Velvet pillows, safari parks, sunglasses: people have become woolly mice. They still have bodies that can walk for five days and four nights through a desert of snow, without food, but they accept praise for having taken a one-hour bicycle ride.² - Tim Krabbe, The Rider Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries - http://www.cyclofiend.com Current Classics - Cross Bikes Singlespeed - Working Bikes Send In Your Photos! - Here's how: http://www.cyclofiend.com/guidelines -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
Thanks, Patrick; I do appreciate your reply. I should have been more clear about what I meant by stair stepping: I have in mind those machines that people use in gyms, and the real thrust of my question was that, although sitting and shoving a pedal over in too high a gear is by all accounts, and by my own experience, bad for your knees, is standing to push over a similar gear necessarily a bad thing in the long run? I've been riding fixed since at least 1997 in a somewhat hilly and certainly windy environment, and my knees are fine (they will celebrate, as twins, their 55th in March) and I was fishing for comments about the relative ease on the knees of standing compared to sitting and pushing. Perhaps I am wrong, but I am still curious. Are there any PTs or MDs and so on out there who will comment? Patrick anyone named 'Patrick' can't be all bad Moore On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 9:29 AM, Patrick in VT psh...@drm.com wrote: On Jan 4, 9:50 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote: I meant this: is standing on steep climbs, or, IOW, standing and doing low cadence, high torque pedalling, bad for you knees? Is it any different from stair stepping? I don't see how stair stepping is comparable unless you're taking a few steps at a time, which would also be putting unnecessary stress on the knees. the way I understand it (based on text books and conversations with physical therapists), the knee is essentially a bearing. in a healthy knee, the back of the kneecap runs smoothly over the bones that make up the knee joint because there is a nice layer of lubrication there. when you forcefully extend your leg - e.g. push down on a step or pedal - there is some contact pressure between the kneecap and knee joint but the lubrication keeps everything working nicely. when you put really big loads on the knee, it creates excessive contact pressure and can actually displace the lubrication. bearings - and joints - fail overtime when they're not properly lubricated. in any event, i'm not a doctor. and you specifically asked for a non- speculative answer. so, I apologize for this (although i don't think it's pure speculation): I don't think anyone would endorse a day-in/ day-out, very low cadence, grind-your-way-uphill riding style if you are concerned with the long term health of your knees. and making a relative comparison to another activity which also stresses the knee might not be best way to assess whether it's bad for your knees. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comrbw-owners-bunch%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] FW: It's here
The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
Not as far as I can tell. Haven't weighed the two bikes (and that would be meaningless due to totally different builds). But my Hillborne definitely feels lighter. Not only in picking it up but also while riding. And, in theory if not actual fact, my Hillborne should be a touch heavier. They are both the same size frame (56). However, the Hillborne is designed for larger riders than the 56 Atlantis. Eric Platt St. Paul, MN On Jan 5, 1:05 pm, JGS jonat...@jonfipro.com wrote: Congrats on the new bike. I have one question though. Isn't the Hillborne just as heavy as the Atlantis? I thought it was made out of the same gauge tubing and the which bike for what .pdf on the riv site says it's just as tourable. Just curious as to whether this is true or not. Thanks! On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(withall stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester tandem, which I loved), but wasn't quite ready to build up a frame myself, and also thought it too precious/expensive. The Bianchi was stolen in 2003 or so, and in 2006 I replaced it with a used Independent Fabrications Planet Cross (http://tinyurl.com/yduufyx) that could do double duty as a fast road bike and an off-roader (though the rear can't quite fit 42 mm knobbies). My Sphinx meanwhile wore fenders and got me to school and back. I even went so far as to buy a silly aero wheelset for the Indy Fab so I could switch it back and forth from road to off road quickly, and was thinking of replacing the
Re: [RBW] Re: Goals for 2010
The CO is flat, straight and not very interesting riding. (And when we did it in 2006, it was in rough shape in some stretches. The GAP offers varied terrain, beautiful scenery, and nice places to stop along the way. If you have the time, I'd recommend riding from Pittsburgh to DC in 4 or 5 days. Cheers, Sean --- On Sat, 1/2/10, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote: From: Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net Subject: [RBW] Re: Goals for 2010 To: RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Date: Saturday, January 2, 2010, 3:54 AM Steve, I had considered riding the GAP and the CO. Why do you save GAP is safer? Thanks for the great photos! Angus On Jan 1, 9:25 pm, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Fri, 2010-01-01 at 19:18 -0800, Angus wrote: 1. Fix my back (leg pain)...again. 2. Ride either the Katy Trail or CO Canal self supported. Have you considered the GAP? I'd recommend it over the CO - much safer and much more comfortable. My GAP photos:http://www.flickr.com/photos/97916...@n00/sets/72157622381493111/show/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: FW: It's here
Congratulations! The QB is a great and versatile bike. Mine is about to metamorphose into its 3rd incarnation. jim mather walnut creek ca On Jan 5, 11:52 am, Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu wrote: The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: FW: It's here
Mine's about to complete its transition from stock to shiftable 2-speed to shiftable 3-speed (current) to shiftable 15-speed with derailleurs front and rear and bar-end shifters. I'll post photos if all goes well. (I'm still waiting for the wheel.) For all intents and purposes it might be close to a canti-Hilsen when it's done. -Jim W. p.s. I love the way it rides, but I really need some gears for the hill I live on. -Original Message- From: Jim M. mather...@gmail.com Sent: Jan 5, 2010 4:29 PM To: RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: [RBW] Re: FW: It's here Congratulations! The QB is a great and versatile bike. Mine is about to metamorphose into its 3rd incarnation. jim mather walnut creek ca On Jan 5, 11:52 am, Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu wrote: The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: FW: It's here
Love the sidepulls! I am secretly hoping the SimpleOne will have that setup later this year... On Jan 5, 2:52 pm, Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu wrote: The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: FW: It's here
Love the sidepulls! I am secretly hoping the SimpleOne will have that setup later this year... On Jan 5, 2:52 pm, Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu wrote: The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
On Jan 5, 2:47 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks, Patrick; I do appreciate your reply. well, I hope some one can give you a more definitive answer. and i certainly don't want to be discouraging - I also ride fixed gear, and often push a bigger gear than I probably should. but knees ain't as easy to replace cartridge bearings, you know? so i try to be careful and moderate. anyway, if you don't mind, I'll continue to speculate . ... . I should have been more clear about what I meant by stair stepping: I have in mind those machines that people use in gyms i don't think this is a comparable exercise. a normal step, even on one of those machines, would probably be around 6-8 inches. when pedaling, you're forcefully extending your leg and putting your knee under load for roughly double that range of motion. in any event, this video may help to visualize things - http://www.youtube.com/user/Linearc although sitting and shoving a pedal over in too high a gear is by all accounts, and by my own experience, bad for your knees, is standing to push over a similar gear necessarily a bad thing in the long run? i guess that's my point: whether sitting or standing, you're putting an excessive load on your knees when geared to high. and it's the load that matters when it comes wear and tear on joints. no time for research, but google spit these sheldon articles out quickly http://www.sheldonbrown.com/standing.html http://www.sheldonbrown.com/fixed-knees.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Goals for 2010
On Tue, 2010-01-05 at 13:22 -0800, Sean Whelan wrote: The CO is flat, straight and not very interesting riding. (And when we did it in 2006, it was in rough shape in some stretches. The GAP offers varied terrain, beautiful scenery, and nice places to stop along the way. If you have the time, I'd recommend riding from Pittsburgh to DC in 4 or 5 days. My group started in McKeesport. I don't believe the section between there and Pittsburg is really finished yet. You have the choice of riding west to east, where the first 120 miles or so are all uphill, but very gentle, followed by what feels like a screaming 25 mile steep downhill between the Eastern Continental Divide and Cumberland; or a tough 25 mile climb followed by an almost imperceptible downhill for the remaining 120 or so. I liked the GAP a lot, and will be happy to do it again in 2010. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Goals for 2010
Sorry, I live in Pittsburgh, and the tendency here is to refer to any city within 25 miles of Pittsburgh as Pittsburgh. We started at Little Boston. Did overnight stays in Confluence, PA Cumberland, MD Hancock, MD Harper's Ferry, WV That route gives you 60 - 70 miles per day. Would do it again for sure. Cheers! Sean --- On Tue, 1/5/10, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: From: Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Goals for 2010 To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Date: Tuesday, January 5, 2010, 5:08 PM On Tue, 2010-01-05 at 13:22 -0800, Sean Whelan wrote: The CO is flat, straight and not very interesting riding. (And when we did it in 2006, it was in rough shape in some stretches. The GAP offers varied terrain, beautiful scenery, and nice places to stop along the way. If you have the time, I'd recommend riding from Pittsburgh to DC in 4 or 5 days. My group started in McKeesport. I don't believe the section between there and Pittsburg is really finished yet. You have the choice of riding west to east, where the first 120 miles or so are all uphill, but very gentle, followed by what feels like a screaming 25 mile steep downhill between the Eastern Continental Divide and Cumberland; or a tough 25 mile climb followed by an almost imperceptible downhill for the remaining 120 or so. I liked the GAP a lot, and will be happy to do it again in 2010. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Goals for 2010
On Tue, 2010-01-05 at 14:11 -0800, Sean Whelan wrote: Sorry, I live in Pittsburgh, and the tendency here is to refer to any city within 25 miles of Pittsburgh as Pittsburgh... We started at Little Boston. Did overnight stays in Confluence, PA Cumberland, MD Hancock, MD Harper's Ferry, WV That route gives you 60 - 70 miles per day. Far more ambitious than our group. We stayed at West Newton (the first day was very short because it took so long to get to McKeesport - 3 hrs just to go from McKeesport to the Pittsburg Airport to turn in the rental van, then taxi back to McKeesport), Ohiopyle and Myersdale. My trip ended in Cumberland, but the rest of the group went on to do the Canal. I'm not sure where they stayed. My maximun day was around 45 miles. Of course, a day and a half of that was in pouring down rain, which definitely makes the distance seem a lot longer. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] FW: It's here
If I didn't have a brand new QB I'd be jealous. ;-) [Admittedly 52cm is way too small for me so I don't have any designs on yours.] That's a sweet bike. I think you'll find it's a great riding bike. Enjoy! Aloha. Bob On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 9:52 AM, Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.eduwrote: The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comrbw-owners-bunch%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- Robert Harrison rfharri...@gmail.com statrixblog.statrix.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] It's here
Updated pics added--pretty much set with the exception of bar tape, fenders and a nicer saddle bag. I want to take it for a test spin to check the brake lever position and such before I tape it up. http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248795965/sizes/l/ The point of the seat tube lug got bent somewhere on the way but I tapped it back into line with my trusty rubber mallet. That cracked the paint a little of course but I'll put a couple of coats of wax or some clear enamel over it and it'll be okay for a decade or so... Thanks for the kind words--I've sort of intermittently wanted a QB for a long time and the sidepulls and 650b wheels pushed me over the edge! Steve -Original Message- From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com on behalf of Frederick, Steve Sent: Tue 1/5/2010 2:52 PM To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: [RBW] FW: It's here The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. winmail.dat
RE: [RBW] It's here
Beautiful bike. It almost looks perfect with bare bars. -Original Message- From: Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu Sent: Jan 5, 2010 6:43 PM To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: RE: [RBW] It's here Updated pics added--pretty much set with the exception of bar tape, fenders and a nicer saddle bag. I want to take it for a test spin to check the brake lever position and such before I tape it up. http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248795965/sizes/l/ The point of the seat tube lug got bent somewhere on the way but I tapped it back into line with my trusty rubber mallet. That cracked the paint a little of course but I'll put a couple of coats of wax or some clear enamel over it and it'll be okay for a decade or so... Thanks for the kind words--I've sort of intermittently wanted a QB for a long time and the sidepulls and 650b wheels pushed me over the edge! Steve -Original Message- From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com on behalf of Frederick, Steve Sent: Tue 1/5/2010 2:52 PM To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: [RBW] FW: It's here The last of the 52cm, 650b Quickbeams is mine, all mine! The color really suits the name: http://www.flickr.com/photos/40738...@n08/4248168665/sizes/l/ (don't worry, that's not where my seat will be when I ride it) Steve woohoo! Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Pickups for SF Folks?
I like to go to Riv now and then, but it's an expensive BART ticket from SF and quite a bit of time if I'm just getting an odd part or two. On the other hand, I don't want to pay shipping for a cheap part nor do I like the idea of packaging and trucking a part that I can carry in my pocket home. Propposed solution: I order my parts, they wait at Riv for a couple days, and then on the weekend we take turns doing a mass pick up for SF folks. Informally, one pickup gets you one free shipment. The courier can meet the rest of us back in the city at a central location (coffee shop), where there will be much rejoicing, perhaps a quick ride, etc. Anyone interested? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Pickups for SF Folks?
On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 8:12 PM, William Henderson william.c.hender...@gmail.com wrote: I like to go to Riv now and then, but it's an expensive BART ticket from SF and quite a bit of time if I'm just getting an odd part or two. On the other hand, I don't want to pay shipping for a cheap part nor do I like the idea of packaging and trucking a part that I can carry in my pocket home. Propposed solution: I order my parts, they wait at Riv for a couple days, and then on the weekend we take turns doing a mass pick up for SF folks. Informally, one pickup gets you one free shipment. The courier can meet the rest of us back in the city at a central location (coffee shop), where there will be much rejoicing, perhaps a quick ride, etc. Anyone interested? Does SF have a zipcars program? That might be an affordable option. -sv -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
24-36-48 stock Sugino rings on an XD2R crankset. Brand new. SRAM 9 speed chain, also brand new. Gernot On Jan 5, 11:10 pm, doug peterson dougpn...@cox.net wrote: Earl: What ring sizes are you using? dougP On Jan 5, 7:39 am, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: It's an IRD compact I had lying around. I am actually not that happy with it. It requires severe overshifting to go from granny to the middle ring (ramped, brand-new Sugino rings) regardless of which gear I am in in the back. Anyone know if I can tweak the setup to improve it? Pretty much followed Sheldon's installation instructions... What tire clearance issues do you have? Interference with the front derailer? Cheers, Gernot On Jan 5, 9:48 pm, doc gspi...@aol.com wrote: What front derailleur are you using? I have a similar setup, but have issues with the tire clearance. thx. On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(withall stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester tandem, which I loved), but wasn't quite ready to build up a frame myself, and also thought it too precious/expensive. The Bianchi was stolen in 2003 or so, and in 2006 I replaced it with a used Independent Fabrications Planet Cross (http://tinyurl.com/yduufyx) that could do double duty as a fast road bike and an off-roader (though the rear can't quite fit 42 mm knobbies). My Sphinx meanwhile
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
I think the Hillborne is lighter, but to a degree that is insignificant (it has a lower weight-limit if you follow the chart). Though I do think it may be more sprightly in its handling. I am not saying that my reasons for not getting an Atlantis were all reasonable. :) In the end it came down to price (and color!): what I can afford, what I feel justified in spending on a bike, and what I can lock up on the street without worrying too much about it... :) Gernot On Jan 6, 2:05 am, JGS jonat...@jonfipro.com wrote: Congrats on the new bike. I have one question though. Isn't the Hillborne just as heavy as the Atlantis? I thought it was made out of the same gauge tubing and the which bike for what .pdf on the riv site says it's just as tourable. Just curious as to whether this is true or not. Thanks! On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(withall stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester tandem, which I loved), but wasn't quite ready to build up a frame myself, and also thought it too precious/expensive. The Bianchi was stolen in 2003 or so, and in 2006 I replaced it with a used Independent Fabrications Planet Cross (http://tinyurl.com/yduufyx) that could do double duty as a fast road bike and an off-roader (though the rear can't quite fit 42 mm knobbies). My Sphinx meanwhile wore fenders and got me to school and back. I even went so far as to buy a silly aero wheelset for the Indy Fab so I could switch it back and forth from road to off road quickly, and
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
From the Hillborne description at rivbike: The Sam Hillborne is [...] a cross between the Atlantis, our cantilever-braked touring bike, and the A. Homer HIlsen, our roadish country bike. It's a cross... means it has tubing halfway in between the two (in wall thickness...); has the canti-brakes (or V-brakes) of the Atlantis, and the 40mm max tire clearance of the A.Homer Hilsen. Both thinner tubes and less tire clearance should reduce the weight marginally... On Jan 6, 10:09 am, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: I think the Hillborne is lighter, but to a degree that is insignificant (it has a lower weight-limit if you follow the chart). Though I do think it may be more sprightly in its handling. I am not saying that my reasons for not getting an Atlantis were all reasonable. :) In the end it came down to price (and color!): what I can afford, what I feel justified in spending on a bike, and what I can lock up on the street without worrying too much about it... :) Gernot On Jan 6, 2:05 am, JGS jonat...@jonfipro.com wrote: Congrats on the new bike. I have one question though. Isn't the Hillborne just as heavy as the Atlantis? I thought it was made out of the same gauge tubing and the which bike for what .pdf on the riv site says it's just as tourable. Just curious as to whether this is true or not. Thanks! On Jan 4, 11:22 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I bought a Hillborne a couple of months ago, built it up for commuting and mixed road/off-road riding, and have been loving it. I feel like I have found my perfect bike, even though as recently as a year ago I never seriously thought of buying a Rivendell. Here it is:http://tinyurl.com/y8ay6gg The following is the history that led me to buy a Sam, and I thought it might be of interest to some of you (I sent a version to Grant as well). The funny thing is that the Hillborne is almost exactly the bike I have wanted for the past 20 years, although at times I didn't quite know it. And the bike I have been riding for the last 19 years is a lot like a Sam Hillborne, only not nearly as nice a bike. So here is the back story: Back in 1991 when I bought my first real bike, I looked at Bridgestones, but wanted neither a road nor a mountain bike, and the RB-T was still too much of a road bike for me. I also had a Shimano bias (since cured), which made at least some Bridgestones less attractive. I wanted a bike that could do anything, and in my college student's $600 price range, the Fisher Sphinx (basically a rigid 29er with drop bars, or a proto monster cross) was almost exactly it. I still consider the Fisher Sphinx a ground-breaking bike, but it never gets mentioned in discussions of the origins of all-arounders or whatever you want to call them, and I've only ever been able to find ONE photo of it on the web: http://tinyurl.com/yhlo7jy(withall stock parts excecpt the tires: it came with 38mm semi-knobbies; note the it's so hideous it's almost good 'sharkbite' paint job). I'll put photos of mine up on cyclofiend at some point. I did admire the Bridgestones though, still have the 1992-94 catalogues, and even bought a long sleeve wool jersey with tagua nut buttons from Bridgestone. I particularly liked the XO-1, and if it had had a triple crank and 700C wheels, I might have bought one and sold the Fisher. In the late 90s I tried buying an MB-1 off a friend who wasn't riding it, but he wasn't selling, either. :) The Fisher is still my main ride (well, was, until the Sam arrived), but it bugs me that it has a 1 1/4 headset and 88mm bottom bracket shell, which mean it's going to be a pain in the butt to maintain long term. The frame is also not of terribly high quality, with a chainstay bridge that runs diagonal, and some subpar welds. Even though I vaguely knew about Rivendell from early on, I somewhat strangely did not think of buying a Rivendell until fairly recently. I still remember my first conscious Riv sighting, at a critical mass in San Francisco around 2000. I was very intrigued, but also mystified. I talked to the owner for a while, admired the burnt orange paint job ( a lot like the orange Sam) and the SON dynohub, but thought it was trying a bit too hard to look retro. Another part of not thinking about buying one was the high price, not wanting to own a bike that precious and unusual, and partly, since I already had a very sensible bike, I wanted something a bit racier for fast club rides. In '96, I had bought a NOS 1995 Bianchi Veloce, the last lugged steel bike with steel fork they made, I think. At the time I remembered being a bit sad that the Veloce didn't come with a carbon fork, but over the years I became glad it was all steel. I also considered buying an Ibis Hakkalügi cyclocross at one point (I already had an Ibis Uncle Fester
[RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
Hi All! I’m joining this one late, again… and once again, this will likely be lengthy… IT Band trouble is rarely a primary cause of knee pain, or an independently occurring malady. Unfortunately, there are no very good studies of IT band syndrome. For instance, some researchers have found that running across inclines causes IT band symptoms to occur in the uphill leg, while others have found that the symptoms occur in the downhill leg. Some researchers have found that slow running relieves IT band symptoms in runners while others have found that faster running relieves the symptoms… what the studies do not control for is proximal (hip) and/or distal (lower leg) variables. Instead, most researchers have only looked at “IT band tightness”, though some have looked at the relationship between IT band symptoms and lower leg external rotation (in ballet dancers). The upshot is that there is no good research which implicates the IT band as a primary or independent problem. It is also important to note that the iliotibial band cannot be stretched—you can apply tension through it, but there is no evidence that a plastic change in its length can be made. We can stretch the muscle (the tensor fascia latae) to which the IT band blends at the pelvis, but even that will not produce an IT band length change. The muscle itself (which, incidentally is only approximately 3-4 long), when stretched will have minimal, if any effect on IT band syndrome. The IT band becomes symptomatic when it is exposed to excessive friction as the lateral femoral epicondyle moves under the IT band during knee flexion and extension. There is a bursa—a cushion of sorts— between the epicondyle and the IT band to minimize this friction. When considering IT band problems, it is important to think about the effect of the proximal attachment at the anterolateral aspect of the pelvis and the distal attachment at Gerdy’s tubercle on the anterolateral tibia a few centimeters distal to the jointline of the knee. Proximally there is very little motion relative to the underlying structures while distally there is greater motion relative to underlying structures. When the orientation of the lateral condyles of the tibia change relative to the epicondyles of the femur, the IT band may be exposed to greater friction forces and becomes susceptible to irritation, with pain following. The orientation of the condyles and epicondyles can be most adversely affected by either external rotation (“toes out”) of the lower leg without rotation of the femur or internal rotation of the femur (“knock-knees”) without rotation of the lower leg (that is, the lower leg remaing neutral with toes pointing straight ahead). The worst-case scenario is a combination of the two conditions. In either case (femoral internal rotation or tibial external rotation), the epicondyle of the femur is made more functionally prominent and abrades the underside of the IT band. There are several ways the orientation of the condyles/epicondyles may occur. To create tibial external rotation: excessively tight lateral hamstrings (biceps femoris) or excessively tight calf muscles (gastrocnemius) lateral head, excessively weak medial hamstrings (semitendinosis and semimembranosis) or medial gastrocnemius, articular surface defects (such as arthritis) which my alter the path of the tibia on the femur during knee extension/flexion. To create femoral internal rotation: weak hip abductors and/or external rotators, excessively tight hip adductors (inside thigh muscles) or hip internal rotators. Of course, in cycling, poorly positioned cleats can also create this problem. How to fix IT band syndrome? Well, first tease out the cause (weakness vs. tightness vs. a combination of the two). Then perform the relevant exercises (clamshells with elastic resistance bands around the knees and/or lateral stepping with elastic resistance bands around the ankles for strengthening and hamstrings, adductors, calf stretches for flexibility), ice and/or anti-inflammatories to control swelling and pain. In extreme cases, some manual therapy in the form of soft-tissue mobilization to reduce scar tissue may be required. Regarding Patrick in VT's (I hear you folks got a good dump of snow recently :) ) understanding that the effect of heavy resistance creating excessive contact pressure between the articular surfaces of the knee cap and the trochlear groove in which the knee cap glides, there is, again, no evidence to support this as being damaging to the knees. The exception to this is if one spends a substantial amount of time kneeling on a hard surface (tile setters, for instance experience this commonly). Prolonged heavy direct pressure can cause deformation of the articular cartilage of the knee cap which may lead to biomechanical pathology or simply pain. In exercises--even very heavy squatting--there is little risk of damage to the cartilage of the knee cap, presuming the rest of the kinetic chain is
Re: [RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
Cool, thanks for the info, Lyle. Xrays show I'm knock-kneed a bit. Also
have scoliosis curve which tilts my left shoulder down toward my left hip a
bit. Dr. suggested moving my heel in a bit and saddle down a bit, does that
sound like valid advice Others have suggested widening the crank Q as
per Andy Pruitt's advice. I haven't done that yet.
So far the stretches I have done don't seem to help too much, but I just
started them last week.
Cheers,
DE
On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 7:13 PM, LyleBogart{AT}gmail.com
lylebog...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi All!
I’m joining this one late, again… and once again, this will likely be
lengthy…
IT Band trouble is rarely a primary cause of knee pain, or an
independently occurring malady. Unfortunately, there are no very good
studies of IT band syndrome. For instance, some researchers have found
that running across inclines causes IT band symptoms to occur in the
uphill leg, while others have found that the symptoms occur in the
downhill leg. Some researchers have found that slow running relieves
IT band symptoms in runners while others have found that faster
running relieves the symptoms… what the studies do not control for is
proximal (hip) and/or distal (lower leg) variables. Instead, most
researchers have only looked at “IT band tightness”, though some have
looked at the relationship between IT band symptoms and lower leg
external rotation (in ballet dancers). The upshot is that there is no
good research which implicates the IT band as a primary or independent
problem.
It is also important to note that the iliotibial band cannot be
stretched—you can apply tension through it, but there is no evidence
that a plastic change in its length can be made. We can stretch the
muscle (the tensor fascia latae) to which the IT band blends at the
pelvis, but even that will not produce an IT band length change. The
muscle itself (which, incidentally is only approximately 3-4 long),
when stretched will have minimal, if any effect on IT band syndrome.
The IT band becomes symptomatic when it is exposed to excessive
friction as the lateral femoral epicondyle moves under the IT band
during knee flexion and extension. There is a bursa—a cushion of sorts—
between the epicondyle and the IT band to minimize this friction.
When considering IT band problems, it is important to think about the
effect of the proximal attachment at the anterolateral aspect of the
pelvis and the distal attachment at Gerdy’s tubercle on the
anterolateral tibia a few centimeters distal to the jointline of the
knee. Proximally there is very little motion relative to the
underlying structures while distally there is greater motion relative
to underlying structures. When the orientation of the lateral
condyles of the tibia change relative to the epicondyles of the femur,
the IT band may be exposed to greater friction forces and becomes
susceptible to irritation, with pain following.
The orientation of the condyles and epicondyles can be most adversely
affected by either external rotation (“toes out”) of the lower leg
without rotation of the femur or internal rotation of the femur
(“knock-knees”) without rotation of the lower leg (that is, the lower
leg remaing neutral with toes pointing straight ahead). The worst-case
scenario is a combination of the two conditions. In either case
(femoral internal rotation or tibial external rotation), the
epicondyle of the femur is made more functionally prominent and
abrades the underside of the IT band.
There are several ways the orientation of the condyles/epicondyles may
occur. To create tibial external rotation: excessively tight lateral
hamstrings (biceps femoris) or excessively tight calf muscles
(gastrocnemius) lateral head, excessively weak medial hamstrings
(semitendinosis and semimembranosis) or medial gastrocnemius,
articular surface defects (such as arthritis) which my alter the path
of the tibia on the femur during knee extension/flexion. To create
femoral internal rotation: weak hip abductors and/or external
rotators, excessively tight hip adductors (inside thigh muscles) or
hip internal rotators. Of course, in cycling, poorly positioned cleats
can also create this problem.
How to fix IT band syndrome? Well, first tease out the cause
(weakness vs. tightness vs. a combination of the two). Then perform
the relevant exercises (clamshells with elastic resistance bands
around the knees and/or lateral stepping with elastic resistance bands
around the ankles for strengthening and hamstrings, adductors, calf
stretches for flexibility), ice and/or anti-inflammatories to control
swelling and pain. In extreme cases, some manual therapy in the form
of soft-tissue mobilization to reduce scar tissue may be required.
Regarding Patrick in VT's (I hear you folks got a good dump of snow
recently :) ) understanding that the effect of heavy resistance
creating excessive contact pressure between the articular
[RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
David,
You've certainly got a number of variables at work here… do you have
pain in both knees? The scoliosis will likely affect the orientation
of your pelvis in the saddle, specifically I'd anticipate that your
pelvis would be somewhat rotated so the left hip/leg will be forward
of the right. This would have the effect of decreasing the internal
rotation of the thigh on the left, but increasing the amount of knee
flexion at the top of the pedal stroke on the left. Likewise, the
femoral internal rotation on the right will be somewhat increased…
There are several good reasons for the knock-knees: 1) tightness of
the hip adductors (muscles of the inner thigh), 2) tightness of the
hip internal rotators, 3) very weak hip abductors/external rotators,
4) congenital causes such as femoral torsion, femoral antervsion, or
tibiofemoral joint interface. Cause #4 we can't do anything about.
Causes 1-3 are correctable. For now, I would recommend continuing with
the stretching and strengthening of the hip muscles. When stretching,
make sure you stretch often throughout the day (more is better) and
maintain the stretched position for a few minutes at time. Too short a
stretch will yield an elastic change in the length of the tissues
being stretched; you likely need a plastic change. Also don't stretch
to the point of pain (discomfort, yes, but not pain). It may take a
couple of weeks before you notice much change in your flexibility if
you're significantly tight right now. Also remember that, even if
you're pretty strong in all the currently short muscles, you won't be
as strong in the newly acquired range of motion since you haven't been
strengthening in that range, so any strength deficits should be tended
to as well.
Changing the crank Q… widening the tread will have the effect of
decreasing somewhat the femoral internal rotation and may put the hip
external rotators into a more advantageous leverage position.
Unfortunately, it may also have the effect of increasing the external
rotation of the tibia so it may exacerbate the problem. I also have a
bias against changing more than one variable at a time since doing so
may make unclear what the most effective strategy is…
Moving the heel in a bit and lowering the saddle… I would definitely
not recommend this combination for you. If you're already internally
rotated at the femurs, decreasing saddle height will not only increase
this problem, it will also place your hip abductors/external rotators
into a disadvantageous leverage position possibly further exacerbating
the femoral internal rotation. Not changing the saddle height, but
turning your heel in (which is the same as externally rotating your
tibia) may, again, worsen the problem. Remember, femoral internal
rotation = tibial external rotation at the knee joint. Both of these
conditions are usually implicated in IT band syndrome.
Hope this makes sense!
lyle
On Jan 5, 7:48 pm, cyclotourist cyclotour...@gmail.com wrote:
Cool, thanks for the info, Lyle. Xrays show I'm knock-kneed a bit. Also
have scoliosis curve which tilts my left shoulder down toward my left hip a
bit. Dr. suggested moving my heel in a bit and saddle down a bit, does that
sound like valid advice Others have suggested widening the crank Q as
per Andy Pruitt's advice. I haven't done that yet.
So far the stretches I have done don't seem to help too much, but I just
started them last week.
Cheers,
DE
On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 7:13 PM, LyleBogart{AT}gmail.com
lylebog...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi All!
I’m joining this one late, again… and once again, this will likely be
lengthy…
IT Band trouble is rarely a primary cause of knee pain, or an
independently occurring malady. Unfortunately, there are no very good
studies of IT band syndrome. For instance, some researchers have found
that running across inclines causes IT band symptoms to occur in the
uphill leg, while others have found that the symptoms occur in the
downhill leg. Some researchers have found that slow running relieves
IT band symptoms in runners while others have found that faster
running relieves the symptoms… what the studies do not control for is
proximal (hip) and/or distal (lower leg) variables. Instead, most
researchers have only looked at “IT band tightness”, though some have
looked at the relationship between IT band symptoms and lower leg
external rotation (in ballet dancers). The upshot is that there is no
good research which implicates the IT band as a primary or independent
problem.
It is also important to note that the iliotibial band cannot be
stretched—you can apply tension through it, but there is no evidence
that a plastic change in its length can be made. We can stretch the
muscle (the tensor fascia latae) to which the IT band blends at the
pelvis, but even that will not produce an IT band length change. The
muscle itself (which, incidentally is only approximately 3-4 long),
when stretched will
[RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
ooops! ... femoral antervsion,... that's femoral anteversion :)
On Jan 5, 8:28 pm, LyleBogart{AT}gmail.com lylebog...@gmail.com
wrote:
David,
You've certainly got a number of variables at work here… do you have
pain in both knees? The scoliosis will likely affect the orientation
of your pelvis in the saddle, specifically I'd anticipate that your
pelvis would be somewhat rotated so the left hip/leg will be forward
of the right. This would have the effect of decreasing the internal
rotation of the thigh on the left, but increasing the amount of knee
flexion at the top of the pedal stroke on the left. Likewise, the
femoral internal rotation on the right will be somewhat increased…
There are several good reasons for the knock-knees: 1) tightness of
the hip adductors (muscles of the inner thigh), 2) tightness of the
hip internal rotators, 3) very weak hip abductors/external rotators,
4) congenital causes such as femoral torsion, femoral antervsion, or
tibiofemoral joint interface. Cause #4 we can't do anything about.
Causes 1-3 are correctable. For now, I would recommend continuing with
the stretching and strengthening of the hip muscles. When stretching,
make sure you stretch often throughout the day (more is better) and
maintain the stretched position for a few minutes at time. Too short a
stretch will yield an elastic change in the length of the tissues
being stretched; you likely need a plastic change. Also don't stretch
to the point of pain (discomfort, yes, but not pain). It may take a
couple of weeks before you notice much change in your flexibility if
you're significantly tight right now. Also remember that, even if
you're pretty strong in all the currently short muscles, you won't be
as strong in the newly acquired range of motion since you haven't been
strengthening in that range, so any strength deficits should be tended
to as well.
Changing the crank Q… widening the tread will have the effect of
decreasing somewhat the femoral internal rotation and may put the hip
external rotators into a more advantageous leverage position.
Unfortunately, it may also have the effect of increasing the external
rotation of the tibia so it may exacerbate the problem. I also have a
bias against changing more than one variable at a time since doing so
may make unclear what the most effective strategy is…
Moving the heel in a bit and lowering the saddle… I would definitely
not recommend this combination for you. If you're already internally
rotated at the femurs, decreasing saddle height will not only increase
this problem, it will also place your hip abductors/external rotators
into a disadvantageous leverage position possibly further exacerbating
the femoral internal rotation. Not changing the saddle height, but
turning your heel in (which is the same as externally rotating your
tibia) may, again, worsen the problem. Remember, femoral internal
rotation = tibial external rotation at the knee joint. Both of these
conditions are usually implicated in IT band syndrome.
Hope this makes sense!
lyle
On Jan 5, 7:48 pm, cyclotourist cyclotour...@gmail.com wrote:
Cool, thanks for the info, Lyle. Xrays show I'm knock-kneed a bit. Also
have scoliosis curve which tilts my left shoulder down toward my left hip a
bit. Dr. suggested moving my heel in a bit and saddle down a bit, does that
sound like valid advice Others have suggested widening the crank Q as
per Andy Pruitt's advice. I haven't done that yet.
So far the stretches I have done don't seem to help too much, but I just
started them last week.
Cheers,
DE
On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 7:13 PM, LyleBogart{AT}gmail.com
lylebog...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi All!
I’m joining this one late, again… and once again, this will likely be
lengthy…
IT Band trouble is rarely a primary cause of knee pain, or an
independently occurring malady. Unfortunately, there are no very good
studies of IT band syndrome. For instance, some researchers have found
that running across inclines causes IT band symptoms to occur in the
uphill leg, while others have found that the symptoms occur in the
downhill leg. Some researchers have found that slow running relieves
IT band symptoms in runners while others have found that faster
running relieves the symptoms… what the studies do not control for is
proximal (hip) and/or distal (lower leg) variables. Instead, most
researchers have only looked at “IT band tightness”, though some have
looked at the relationship between IT band symptoms and lower leg
external rotation (in ballet dancers). The upshot is that there is no
good research which implicates the IT band as a primary or independent
problem.
It is also important to note that the iliotibial band cannot be
stretched—you can apply tension through it, but there is no evidence
that a plastic change in its length can be made. We can stretch the
muscle (the tensor
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
One tube thicker here, one tube thinner there, it may weigh the same, but the tubing choices were different. ok, so i'm curiousjust what does a fully built (regular setup, nothing extra heavy OR extra light) Sam Hillborne weigh? also, the AHH? no racks, with fenders. kim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: the long road to my first Rivendell
Isn't the IRD front derailleur designed to work with compact double cranksets? That may be the issue. You probably should get a front derailleur designed for a triple. I'm building my new Hillborne with a NOS Suntour XC pro front derailleur but I'm still awaiting my new Paul canti's so I haven't run cables yet. Speaking of tubing... I would assume the Hillborne has the slightly thicker tubesets because it a slightly lower grade non-heat treated tube. BTW... great story about how you got to Rivendell. Mike Socal -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Help open City of L.A. trails to bikes
Consider taking a few moments to submit support of opening dirt trails withing the city to cyclists: Comment period ends Jan 8. More info here: http://www.corbamtb.com/campaigns/la2.shtml The comment period ends Jan.8. Any and all support is appreciated!!! -- Cheers, David Redlands, CA Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym. ~Bill Nye, scientist guy -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Now: IT Band Was: Goals for 2010
On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 8:13 PM, LyleBogart{AT}gmail.com
lylebog...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi All!
Regarding [the] understanding that the effect of heavy resistance
creating excessive contact pressure between the articular surfaces of
the knee cap and the trochlear groove in which the knee cap glides,
there is, again, no evidence to support this as being damaging to the
knees. The exception to this is if one spends a substantial amount of
time kneeling on a hard surface (tile setters, for instance experience
this commonly). Prolonged heavy direct pressure can cause deformation
of the articular cartilage of the knee cap which may lead to
biomechanical pathology or simply pain. In exercises--even very heavy
squatting--there is little risk of damage to the cartilage of the knee
cap, presuming the rest of the kinetic chain is strong enough to
withstand the heavy exercise. In fact, compressive loading of
cartilage is actually essential to the health of the articular
surface. So…
Patrick Moore, unless you've already a knee problem, there's little
danger in unseated climbing on the fixed gear (and I'm happy that this
is so as I spend a great deal of time in that climbing mode, myself!)…
enjoy :)
I hope this helps!
Lyle: I take it DPT does not stand for don't know from physical therapy
and that you have some expertise in the matter, and I thank you for this
information. One more question: is *seated* high torque pedalling, the kind
that leaves my knees twinging slightly the day or so afterward, bad for the
knees?
Thanks again, very much,
Patrick spinning small gears makes me tired Moore
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