[RBW] Re: The Rivendell Ride

[lconley]

Have you verified that was what got built? My Custom is thankfully 
different from the plan in some aspects. The plan shows Roadini style 
baseball bat tapered seat and and top tubes which I find ugly. Nobilette 
apparently just went with the big end size (31.8) for all of the main 
triangle tubes which is how I ended up with a 29.0 seatpost. It calls for a 
ball socket seat lug which I guess they don't have in 31.8 x 31.8 so I 
ended up with regular fluted seat stay caps. I haven't verified the angles 
yet, but the plan says mine has 72 deg seat tube angle and 71.5 head tube 
angle with a little more trail (62.9) than yours. I don't have any tube 
thickness info on my plans. It is a beautiful bike.

Laing

On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 7:36:55 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Oh right, I have numbers for why my Rivendell rides the way it does. I 
> forgot! 
>
> 71.5 seattube, 69.5 headtube. I wanted a pavement-biased frame for 
> non-touring-level loads and this is how it turned out. [image: 
> Screenshot_20221117_163140.jpg]
> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 4:02:08 PM UTC-8 John Hawrylak wrote:
>
>> Joe
>>
>> What is the Seat Tube Angle of your custom??
>>
>> John Hawrylak
>> Woodstown NJ
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 5:41:41 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> This is an edited version of an email I recently sent Grant, I wanted to 
>>> post here cuz I think the magical Riv ride he designs into these frames is 
>>> slightly under discussed..like we all know it and love it, then talk about 
>>> other stuff like paint and parts. My comments are specifically about my 
>>> custom but I've owned a bunch of Rivs and they all ride like this (Clem 
>>> maybe not so light-feeling, but still zippy). Add your thoughts about your 
>>> bikes! :
>>>
>>> The handling is amazing. It feels light and zippy, yet absorbs shock 
>>> (there's a lot of shock on these roads) and is very stable. When you put it 
>>> in a turn it goes where you point it and holds the line until you change 
>>> it. It does this when getting bumped offline, too..the darn thing pops 
>>> right back to where it was going! I've ridden a bazillion bikes and nothing 
>>> rides like a Rivendell 🙌
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard 
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[DavidP]

Eric - You mentioned 26lbs of gear, I'm curious how much of that weight you 
had up front in the Chest and if there was any noticeable impact on 
handling?

Thanks,
-Dave

On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 11:47:57 PM UTC-5 Philip Williamson wrote:

> Such a well crafted ride report! Thanks for the pictures, they're great. 
>
> Philip 
> Sonoma County, Calif
>
> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 5:22:44 PM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter
>>
>> 14-15 November 2022
>> 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 
>>
>> [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]
>>
>> This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips 
>> by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a 
>> primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
>> loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
>> night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
>> to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
>> out. 
>>
>> Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
>> well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow 
>> were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad 
>> weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
>> would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
>> late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
>> check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
>> shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the 
>> wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
>> way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 
>>
>> [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]
>>
>> The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with 
>> cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges 
>> of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained 
>> gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful 
>> farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a 
>> way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy 
>> fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. 
>>
>> Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
>> rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
>> stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
>> had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
>> a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with 
>> a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk 
>> candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
>> full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
>> favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were 
>> fantastically good. 
>>
>> [image: 03 Road SM.jpg]
>>
>> We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long 
>> climb that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles 
>> without interruption. 
>>
>> The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road that is at times 
>> quite rocky but easily passible by bike… if your legs are up for it. You 
>> would need a serious 4x4 vehicle with clearance to make it up these roads 
>> and the few campers and people out fishing were in one-ton trucks. There 
>> are a few steep, rocky, loose descents on the way up, short reprieves from 
>> long and steady climbing. According to my GPS we climbed for three hours. 
>> We took one snack break early on and had a few quick stops but for the most 
>> part we were grinding away. Paul longed for a bag of potato chips, craving 
>> salt and tired of all the chewing required of his nutty trail mix. 
>>
>> I don’t have many pictures from this section as I was very focussed on 
>> trying to make it to the cabin before dark. The early sunset and our vital 
>> camp chores were top of mind. Once we arrived we needed to gather firewood 
>> and water. Without electricity or plumbing we were reliant on the woodstove 
>> for heat and the spring for hydration. Stumbling around in steep and 
>> unfamiliar terrain searching for wood and water was something I hoped to 
>> avoid. 
>>
>> As we were passing a gate with signs that announced bicycles were 
>> prohibited we encountered a traveller on a flat bar mountain bike with 
>> disks. We had a short chat about where he was headed and I gave him the 
>> best directions I could. When I asked how much further we had to the top he 
>> said it was “a few miles.” Later on I realized he was tempering our 
>> distance and trying to be encouraging. The spinning continued. 
>>
>> Once we were within five miles of the top Paul said som

[RBW] Re: Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[larson....@gmail.com]

Great ride report and some beautiful country! These challenges and 
hardships make for memorable trips and a sense of adventure. Great work!
Randy in Wisconsin

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 6:56:09 AM UTC-6 DavidP wrote:

> Eric - You mentioned 26lbs of gear, I'm curious how much of that weight 
> you had up front in the Chest and if there was any noticeable impact on 
> handling?
>
> Thanks,
> -Dave
>
> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 11:47:57 PM UTC-5 Philip Williamson 
> wrote:
>
>> Such a well crafted ride report! Thanks for the pictures, they're great. 
>>
>> Philip 
>> Sonoma County, Calif
>>
>> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 5:22:44 PM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter
>>>
>>> 14-15 November 2022
>>> 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 
>>>
>>> [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]
>>>
>>> This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips 
>>> by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a 
>>> primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
>>> loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
>>> night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
>>> to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
>>> out. 
>>>
>>> Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
>>> well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow 
>>> were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad 
>>> weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
>>> would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
>>> late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
>>> check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
>>> shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the 
>>> wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
>>> way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 
>>>
>>> [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]
>>>
>>> The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with 
>>> cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges 
>>> of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained 
>>> gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful 
>>> farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a 
>>> way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy 
>>> fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. 
>>>
>>> Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
>>> rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
>>> stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
>>> had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
>>> a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with 
>>> a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk 
>>> candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
>>> full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
>>> favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were 
>>> fantastically good. 
>>>
>>> [image: 03 Road SM.jpg]
>>>
>>> We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long 
>>> climb that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles 
>>> without interruption. 
>>>
>>> The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road that is at times 
>>> quite rocky but easily passible by bike… if your legs are up for it. You 
>>> would need a serious 4x4 vehicle with clearance to make it up these roads 
>>> and the few campers and people out fishing were in one-ton trucks. There 
>>> are a few steep, rocky, loose descents on the way up, short reprieves from 
>>> long and steady climbing. According to my GPS we climbed for three hours. 
>>> We took one snack break early on and had a few quick stops but for the most 
>>> part we were grinding away. Paul longed for a bag of potato chips, craving 
>>> salt and tired of all the chewing required of his nutty trail mix. 
>>>
>>> I don’t have many pictures from this section as I was very focussed on 
>>> trying to make it to the cabin before dark. The early sunset and our vital 
>>> camp chores were top of mind. Once we arrived we needed to gather firewood 
>>> and water. Without electricity or plumbing we were reliant on the woodstove 
>>> for heat and the spring for hydration. Stumbling around in steep and 
>>> unfamiliar terrain searching for wood and water was something I hoped to 
>>> avoid. 
>>>
>>> As we were passing a gate with signs that announced bicycles were 
>>> prohibited we encountered a traveller on a flat bar mountain bike with 
>>> disks. We had a short chat a

Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

[DavidP]

An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my frame 
was fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the 
hanger threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the 
cups threaded in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been 
chasing the threads on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get 
them cleaned out and accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing 
taps so I've always just used a steel screw, working it in and out until 
the threads are clear. I've seen thread clearing tools made using a 
sacrificial screw with a slot cut along the length of the threads to allow 
material to clear while threading it, which probably would've made it go 
faster.

Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant 
to turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it 
to tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the 
bolt it snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of 
the bolt out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I 
was unable to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I 
replaced the bolt with a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, 
non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue loctite on the bolt). Now everything 
tightens up (and loosens again) as expected.

-Dave

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

> I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that 
> have two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right 
> side lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I 
> don't know if a non-integrated right lever exists.
>
> The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
> repositioning the pivot pin.
>
> Laing
>
> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
>> I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
>> I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into 
>> that before.
>>
>> I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? 
>> implies “and how are you going to build it up?”
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] The Rivendell Ride

[RichS]

Paul asked about another bike that rides like a Rivendell. I have a Mercian 
Audax that was built to my specs with 725 tubing and 650b wheels. The bike 
rides and handles as well as any Rivendell I've owned. This is completely 
subjective of course and YMMV.

Best,
Rich in ATL

On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 7:45:42 PM UTC-5 Paul Clifton wrote:

> Chris,
> I've heard this too, about the trade secret numbers. 
>
> It made me wonder, has anyone ridden another bike that rides like a 
> Rivendell?
>
> To me, more-or-less like Joe said, it's nimble handling that also feels 
> extremely stable. It's easy to change lines around a curve, but it's also 
> easy to just let the bike hold it's line (straight or in corners).
>
> I've ridden plenty of miles on two Rosco Bubbes (MTBubbe and Rosco Bebe), 
> a Gus, and a tandem. I've ridden a few miles on a too small Clem L and a 
> Sam. They all handle similarly. The thing that changes is position and how 
> much bike is out front and how much bike is out back. The Bebe bike, with a 
> lot of length out front really leads itself through the curves. The Gus 
> kind of trails behind. But both are absurdly stable. I'd put the MTBubbe 
> and the Sam as kind of neutral in that respect. I can choose to place the 
> front or back wheel as a way to pick my line.
>
> The only other bike I've ridden that comes close was my Surly Long Haul 
> Trucker. It was not the same as a Riv, but it was stable, but not nimble 
> (which may or may not have made me like it more or less). I finally 
> realized that it was also a size too big, which I suspect has a tendency to 
> make a bike less nimble - think about how nimble a BMX bike is for a full 
> grown person ... I traded it for a 1984 Trek 720, which I don't consider 
> either stable or nimble compared to the LHT or my Rivs. But it's still an 
> alright bike.
>
> But it's gotta be something about the trail and the ratio of rider weight 
> over the front and back ends. So as rake increases, the rear end might also 
> increase. I dunno, I'd love to make an spreadsheet.
>
> Paul in AR
>
> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 6:32:53 AM UTC-6 Chris L wrote:
>
>> I remember reading where Grant, or one of his long-term employees but I 
>> think Grant, said on front end geometry handling there are a few numbers 
>> they hold to but they don't discuss them outside the shop.  Trail would be 
>> an obvious one, but I've always thought it would be interesting to hear the 
>> rest.  Jan Heine gets into what might be some of RBW's other unspoken 
>> factors in his book on performance bicycles.  
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 10:38:08 PM UTC-6 pi...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Grant's 1993 Bridgestone RB-1 had a 54mm trail with 25mm tires. The 2022 
>>> Roadini had a trail of around 58mm but with a 5mm lower BB. The Cheviot (I 
>>> can't find numbers for the Platypus) had a trail of 58mm with a 25mm tire 
>>> (but obviously few people would run 25mm tires on that bike), but even with 
>>> a 33mm tire it'll still be a 61mm trail, making the bike steer a little 
>>> slower but still agile. I had a custom bike built around the 1993 RB-1 
>>> geometry with a lower BB, and it rides similarly great. Now when it comes 
>>> to compliance, stiffness, etc., the tubing thickness etc matters more, but 
>>> in terms of handling I think Grant has it dialed down and you can see that 
>>> he pretty much keeps all his bikes in the same zone when it comes to trail. 
>>> The longer wheel base that he's been going for recently adds alot to 
>>> stability and high speed handling at the expense of packability into bike 
>>> boxes, which few care about. If you were to buy say, a Craig Calfee carbon 
>>> framed bike, it actually has a very similar geometry too the RB-1, and 
>>> rides similarly, but of course being made out of carbon and with a short 
>>> wheel base and relatively little tire clearance chances are that bike 
>>> wouldn't appeal to the same people who like Rivendell bicycles.
>>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 6:09:47 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Oh I haven't the first clue how Grant does it. There's something going 
 on with the numbers and tubes that makes them ride like a Harley Softail 
 on 
 the straights AND a Ducati Panigale in the turns. It's bonkers! 

 On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 5:51:31 PM UTC-8 J J wrote:

> You hit it on the head, Joe. Thanks for the thread. With all of your 
> experience on a gazillion bikes, what do *you* think accounts for 
> “the magical Riv ride he designs into these frames”? What makes it happen?
>
> On Nov 16, 2022, at 5:41 PM, Joe Bernard  wrote:
>
> This is an edited version of an email I recently sent Grant, I wanted 
> to post here cuz I think the magical Riv ride he designs into these 
> frames 
> is slightly under discussed..like we all know it and love it, then talk 
> about other stuff like paint and parts. My comments 

Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[Eric Marth]

Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. 

Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything more 
than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but I got 
used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when I was 
trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda tipping 
over, no big deal. 

I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached a 
packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd also 
love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but couldn't 
get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a bootlegged Pec 
Deck for some time. 

Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a 
fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:
>
> Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter
>
>
>
> 14-15 November 2022
> 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 
>
> [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]
>
> This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips 
> by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a 
> primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
> loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
> night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
> to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
> out. 
>
> Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
> well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow 
> were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad 
> weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
> would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
> late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
> check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
> shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the 
> wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
> way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 
>
> [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]
>
> The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with 
> cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges 
> of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained 
> gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful 
> farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a 
> way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy 
> fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. 
>
> Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
> rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
> stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
> had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
> a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with 
> a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk 
> candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
> full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
> favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were 
> fantastically good. 
>
> [image: 03 Road SM.jpg]
>
> We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long climb 
> that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles without 
> interruption. 
>
> The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road that is at times 
> quite rocky but easily passible by bike… if your legs are up for it. You 
> would need a serious 4x4 vehicle with clearance to make it up these roads 
> and the few campers and people out fishing were in one-ton trucks. There 
> are a few steep, rocky, loose descents on the way up, short reprieves from 
> long and steady climbing. According to my GPS we climbed for three hours. 
> We took one snack break early on and had a few quick stops but for the most 
> part we were grinding away. Paul longed for a bag of potato chips, craving 
> salt and tired of all the chewing required of his nutty trail mix. 
>
> I don’t have many pictures from this section as I was very focussed on 
> trying to make it to the cabin before dark. The early sunset and our vital 
> camp chores were top of mind. Once we arrived we needed to gather firewood 
> and water. Without electricity or plumbing we were reliant on the woodstove 
> for heat and the spring for hydration. Stumbling around in steep and 
> unfamiliar terrain searching for wood and water

Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[Ryan Frahm]

Sounds like a great overnight trip, thank you for sharing! I have had the 
same issue sleeping on my last several trips and it makes the next days a 
bit tougher. Excessive stoke can be a real problem! 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 7:11:40 AM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. 
>
> Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything 
> more than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but 
> I got used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when 
> I was trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda 
> tipping over, no big deal. 
>
> I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached a 
> packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd also 
> love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but couldn't 
> get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a bootlegged Pec 
> Deck for some time. 
>
> Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a 
> fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:
>>
>> Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter
>>
>>
>>
>> 14-15 November 2022
>> 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 
>>
>> [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]
>>
>> This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips 
>> by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a 
>> primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
>> loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
>> night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
>> to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
>> out. 
>>
>> Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
>> well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow 
>> were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad 
>> weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
>> would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
>> late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
>> check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
>> shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the 
>> wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
>> way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 
>>
>> [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]
>>
>> The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with 
>> cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges 
>> of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained 
>> gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful 
>> farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a 
>> way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy 
>> fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. 
>>
>> Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
>> rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
>> stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
>> had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
>> a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with 
>> a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk 
>> candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
>> full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
>> favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were 
>> fantastically good. 
>>
>> [image: 03 Road SM.jpg]
>>
>> We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long 
>> climb that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles 
>> without interruption. 
>>
>> The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road that is at times 
>> quite rocky but easily passible by bike… if your legs are up for it. You 
>> would need a serious 4x4 vehicle with clearance to make it up these roads 
>> and the few campers and people out fishing were in one-ton trucks. There 
>> are a few steep, rocky, loose descents on the way up, short reprieves from 
>> long and steady climbing. According to my GPS we climbed for three hours. 
>> We took one snack break early on and had a few quick stops but for the most 
>> part we were grinding away. Paul longed for a bag of potato chips, craving 
>> salt and tired of all the chewing required of his nutty trail mix. 
>>
>> I don’t have many pictures from this section

Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[Keith Paugh]

What fun overnight adventure. Thanks for the engrossing write up!k.On Nov 18, 2022, at 7:11 AM, Eric Marth  wrote:Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything more than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but I got used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when I was trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda tipping over, no big deal. I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached a packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd also love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but couldn't get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a bootlegged Pec Deck for some time. Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.Sent from my iPhoneOn Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter14-15 November 202264 miles, 7,250 ft elevation This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night out. Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were fantastically good. We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long climb that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles without interruption. The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road that is at times quite rocky but easily passible by bike… if your legs are up for it. You would need a serious 4x4 vehicle with clearance to make it up these roads and the few campers and people out fishing were in one-ton trucks. There are a few steep, rocky, loose descents on the way up, short reprieves from long and steady climbing. According to my GPS we climbed for three hours. We took one snack break early on and had a few quick stops but for the most part we were grinding away. Paul longed for a bag of potato chips, craving salt and tired of all the chewing required of his nutty trail mix. I don’t have many pictures from this section as I was very focussed on trying to make it to the cabin before dark. The early sunset and our vital camp chores were top of mind. Once we arrived we needed to gather firewood and water. Without electricity or plumbing we were reliant on the woodstove for heat and the spring for hydration. Stumbling around in steep and unfamiliar terrain searching for wood and water was something I hoped to avoid. As we were passing a gate with signs that announced bicycles were prohibited we encountered a traveller on a flat bar mountain bike with disk

Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[Stephen]

Hey Eric,

Great ride report, really enjoyed reading it along with the previous day 
ride you posted! Love seeing reports of Appalachian overnighters. Having 
all that weight sure makes the ride harder, I got spanked last year taking 
my Joe on the Wilson's ramble in nc by naively planning my daily mileage 
based on how fast I ride unloaded.. ended up running low on food and 
shortening the route. Good for you getting out in the cold weather!

cheers,

Stephen

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. 
>
> Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything 
> more than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but 
> I got used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when 
> I was trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda 
> tipping over, no big deal. 
>
> I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached a 
> packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd also 
> love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but couldn't 
> get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a bootlegged Pec 
> Deck for some time. 
>
> Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a 
> fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:
>>
>> Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter
>>
>>
>>
>> 14-15 November 2022
>> 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 
>>
>> [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]
>>
>> This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips 
>> by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a 
>> primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
>> loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
>> night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
>> to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
>> out. 
>>
>> Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
>> well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow 
>> were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad 
>> weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
>> would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
>> late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
>> check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
>> shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the 
>> wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
>> way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 
>>
>> [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]
>>
>> The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with 
>> cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges 
>> of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained 
>> gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful 
>> farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a 
>> way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy 
>> fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. 
>>
>> Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
>> rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
>> stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
>> had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
>> a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with 
>> a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk 
>> candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
>> full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
>> favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were 
>> fantastically good. 
>>
>> [image: 03 Road SM.jpg]
>>
>> We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long 
>> climb that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles 
>> without interruption. 
>>
>> The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road that is at times 
>> quite rocky but easily passible by bike… if your legs are up for it. You 
>> would need a serious 4x4 vehicle with clearance to make it up these roads 
>> and the few campers and people out fishing were in one-ton trucks. There 
>> are a few steep, rocky, loose descents on the way up, short reprieves from 
>> long and steady climbing. According to my GPS we climbed for three hours. 
>> We took one sn

Re: [RBW] Hillborne / Hilsen: touring capable?

[Bob Warner]

PaulI have the same vintage Hillborne as you.  What from rack do you use and does it align with the stock braze ons??Nice looking ride there too!BobSent from my iPhoneOn Nov 16, 2022, at 5:50 PM, 'Bikie#4646' via RBW Owners Bunch  wrote:In my estimation, my 2015 Sam Hillborne is pretty nearly the perfect touring bike for overnighters or multi-day rail trail trips. I have a Hilsen which is a bit more lively and a really nice mixed-surface riding bike. (Yes, I am spoiled.)I realize this topic has likely come up before:Every once in a while, I wonder if the Hilsen would work for touring, but I tried a sport tourer for loaded trips once. It was too whippy, especially in the mountains. It's a rhetorical question for now, but at 76, I will eventually have to thin the herd. I'm happy with a dedicated bike for each purpose.My Hillborne on the Greenbrier River Trail, WVa. in Oct.https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/52435098025/in/album-72177720302972379/https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/52435097390/in/album-72177720302972379/The Hilsen:https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/51845027385/in/album-72177720296237851/Paul GermainMidlothian, VA



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[RBW] Re: FS: Platypus 60cm - Choose Your Own Adventure

[Ian Wilder]

Platypus is 
*SOLD!*
On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 3:33:53 PM UTC-6 Ian Wilder wrote:

> *FS: Platypus 60cm - Choose Your Own Adventure*
>
> This frame is a quick catch and release from another list member in 
> efforts to thin the stable. This one just wasn’t for me!
>
> Selling this as rolling chassis, frame/fork or complete with some options. 
> In excellent condition, one small ding in paint on top tube (pictured).
>
> *Photos Here: *https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjAf9x1
>
> *Parts List*
>
>- Platypus 60cm Frame in Mermaid
>- Wheels - Rear Hub: White Industries T11, Front Hub: Son Deluxe, 
>Rims: Velocity A23
>- Tires - Rene Herse Barlow Pass Standard (set up tubeless)
>- Headset - Chris King Grip Nut (Can swap and keep this if you want to 
>save $150)
>- Cranks - Rene Herse 48/32
>- Brakes - Paul Mini Motos (I have a pair of Motolites if you want 
>more clearance)
>- Saddle - Berthoud Aspin - Broken in but still kickin’.
>- Pedals - MKS Always
>
> *Choose Your Build*
>
> Albatross
>
>- Suntour Barends
>- Nitto Stem (normal quill length)
>- Shimano levers
>- Vintage Campy (record?) front derailleur
>- SRAM Force 22 rear derailleur 
>- SRAM Force 22 11-28 11 speed cassette
>- Rear Derailleur and Cassette can be switched to 9 speed at no cost!
>
> Drop Bar (for iconoclasts with long torsos such as myself)
>
>- SRAM Force 22 Right shift lever w/ Force 1 left brake lever
>- Soma Highway One Bar and Nitto Stem (long quill length)
>- Deep Custom Campy stem shifter w/ Vintage Campy Derailleur
>- Force 22 rear derailleur and cassette as above
>
>
> *Frame/Fork w/ CK Headset: $1500 + Shipping*
>
> *Frame/fork w/ FSA Duron Headset: $1350 + Shipping*
>
> *Rolling Chassis w/ CK Headeset: $1975 + Shipping*
>
> *Rolling Chassis w/ FSA Duron Headset: $1825 + Shipping*
>
>
> *Complete with Albatross - $2800 + Shipping*
>
> *Complete with Drop Bar - $3000 + Shipping*
>
> *“Upgrade” to a 9 or 10 speed friction drivetrain - FREE with complete 
> purchase!*
>
> Really flexible on sale/builds here. Let me know what you’re thinking and 
> I should be able to make it happen. Light and rear rack not included!
>
> *Important details for the discerning buyer: *
>
>- Steerer is cut for a CK Grip Nut headset. No room for spacers.
>- Rear hub is 130 spaced. QR is keeping dropouts sprung set. (low 
>miles in this config)
>- Drive side spokes are black and non-drive are silver due to sourcing 
>issues. Same spokes though!
>
> Ian in STL
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: Brooks Flyer aged tan

[bill la via]

Yep, that’s it. I ended up with a B67 like that for one bike and then a
black B67 for the platypus. Ended up being more comfortable for me then the
Flyer with the upright position. We will see which one outlasts the other.
Since I got the platypus, it’s getting most of my miles so good that the
longer wearing saddle is on it.

On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 9:10 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> I'll add a shoutout for this style for anyone who's curious. These have
> been variously labeled Aged and Softened over the years - I think there was
> a Pre-Softened at one point, too - and I have the B17 version. It's great!
> It comes in kind of a non-color like the (discontinued) Select series,
> which wears into a nice honey over time. You don't treat the top, just hop
> on and ride..mine only took about a hundred miles to feel comfortable. Will
> it last a couple decades like the super hard ones? Probably not, but it
> won't take you 6 months to break it in either. A good saddle!
>
> *mine pictured
>
> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 1:33:53 PM UTC-8 schralp wrote:
>
>> Like new condition purchased in August 2022 as I sorted out which seat
>> worked best for me on my new Platypus. I ended up preferring the B67 so
>> looking to part ways with this one. $110.
>
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> .
>
-- 
-Bill

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Re: [RBW] Betty Foy Sizing & Search

['zoomie z' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Oh wow! So cool 💗
We’re  selling a Betty Foy 62 cm in excellent shape with albatross handlebars! 
I’ve tried to post here without any luck!

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 28, 2022, at 6:09 PM, 'John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch 
>  wrote:
> 
> The price looks very good if the 2 racks are included.   A 55 may be too big 
> for Matt's wife
> 
> John Hawrylak
> Woodstown NJ
> 
>> On Friday, October 28, 2022 at 8:20:51 PM UTC-4 Matthew Williams wrote:
>> Here’s a 55cm Betty Foy in Santa Barbara...
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Rivendell Betty Foy mixte - bicycles - by owner - bike sale
>> santabarbara.craigslist.org
> 
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Re: [RBW] The do-it-all Rivendell of choice

[Patrick Moore]

Since I opened the thread I get to set the (ironclad) conditions of the
thought experiment. The conditions allow you to have several wheelsets for
the "one-and-only." So -- how fat a tire can a QB contain? Perhaps with 42
mm knobbies and a bigger cog or fw you might be able to do at least "light"
mountain biking.

On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 6:04 PM Eric Daume  wrote:

> My riding is 75% around town on a fixed gear, with the rest made up of
> mountain biking and some geared road rides.
>
> I would probably end up forgoing my mountain biking and get a Quickbeam as
> my Riv one and only bike.
>
> Eric
>

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Re: [RBW] The Rivendell Ride

[Patrick Moore]

IMO, the "signature" ride of at least all the Rivendells I've ridden is the
reason that Grant's designs remain my handling benchmark after almost 30
years and the reason that the 1999 Joe Starck custom is my favorite bike of
all time.

Some of the 5 Rivs I've owned have handled better (to my taste) than
others, but all have exhibited a unique (IME -- I stress this, tho' I've
owned scores of bikes) combination of straight-line stability and unerring
or seamless transition into turns: no "dartiness" on straights or dartiness
*or* hesitation in turns.

One might be slower to turn-in than I liked, another might turn-in too
fast, but none were either "nervous" or "sluggish."

I've sold on all but 1 of the 5: the first-gen Sam Hill  felt too sedate in
handling for a road bike and didn't take tires fat enough for a (sandy
soil) all rounder; also the steering flopped too much on steep, slow
uphills when seated far back and torquing hard at slow cadences -- the way
I like to climb; especially with a large rear load. But again, seamless in
flatland cruising or downhill transition from straight to corner. The Ram
also felt less nimble in turns than I liked -- I like the nimble feel of
light "twenty six inch" (24" to 25 6/10") wheels. OTOH, the first (1994
order, 1995 delivery) custom was slightly too nervous, tho' even this was
stable and predictable compared to other bikes, at least when I was riding
32 mm tires instead of the 22 mm gofast tires of the time. And the 2003
custom had tubing that was too stiff. But all very noticeably had that
Grantian quality.

I compare all 5 with my current Matthews #1 with its 622X 60 Big One,s and
it illustrates by contraries this signature Riv handling. Once you get up
to speed -- 15 mph? -- the Matthews is steady and corners well: it is
stable on the straights and predictable in the turns, tho' neither so
stable straight or so "transparent" in turns as the Rivs. But at slower
speeds it's by comparison noticeably more nervous in a straight line, yet
hesitant then darty in corners. Note that this may be due in large or small
part to the fat, soft 60--62 mm tires at 18-21 psi; if I shod it with 48s
at 27-30 psi it might handle more like the Rivs. But I expect that, with
all the virtues that make it a keeper, it still would not show that
signature Riv handling.

(Matthews #2 is a near-geometrical clone of the 2003 Riv custom and thus
also exhibits Riv-like handling both with 29s and with 42s.)

On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 3:41 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> This is an edited version of an email I recently sent Grant, I wanted to
> post here cuz I think the magical Riv ride he designs into these frames is
> slightly under discussed..like we all know it and love it, then talk about
> other stuff like paint and parts. My comments are specifically about my
> custom but I've owned a bunch of Rivs and they all ride like this (Clem
> maybe not so light-feeling, but still zippy). Add your thoughts about your
> bikes! :
>
> The handling is amazing. It feels light and zippy, yet absorbs shock
> (there's a lot of shock on these roads) and is very stable. When you put it
> in a turn it goes where you point it and holds the line until you change
> it. It does this when getting bumped offline, too..the darn thing pops
> right back to where it was going! I've ridden a bazillion bikes and nothing
> rides like a Rivendell 🙌
>
> Joe Bernard
>
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> 
> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] The do-it-all Rivendell of choice

[Eric Daume]

I had an Orange QB, and it was a bit tighter clearance than I expected (my
Surly Cross Check had better clearance). Maybe a 42 would fit, but that's
not enough to let me ride briskly with my friends on their 29ers. Which is
why I currently have a handful of mountain bikes in addition to a pair of
fixed gears. And a couple of folders.

I'm a ways from the "one bike" level.

Eric

On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 12:07 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> Since I opened the thread I get to set the (ironclad) conditions of the
> thought experiment. The conditions allow you to have several wheelsets for
> the "one-and-only." So -- how fat a tire can a QB contain? Perhaps with 42
> mm knobbies and a bigger cog or fw you might be able to do at least "light"
> mountain biking.
>
> On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 6:04 PM Eric Daume  wrote:
>
>> My riding is 75% around town on a fixed gear, with the rest made up of
>> mountain biking and some geared road rides.
>>
>> I would probably end up forgoing my mountain biking and get a Quickbeam
>> as my Riv one and only bike.
>>
>> Eric
>>
> --
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [RBW] Betty Foy Sizing & Search

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 Contact info and pics?

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:32:11 AM MST, 'zoomie z' via RBW Owners 
Bunch  wrote:  
 
 Oh wow! So cool 💗We’re  selling a Betty Foy 62 cm in excellent shape with 
albatross handlebars! I’ve tried to post here without any luck!

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 28, 2022, at 6:09 PM, 'John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch 
 wrote:



The price looks very good if the 2 racks are included.   A 55 may be too big 
for Matt's wife
John HawrylakWoodstown NJ

On Friday, October 28, 2022 at 8:20:51 PM UTC-4 Matthew Williams wrote:

Here’s a 55cm Betty Foy in Santa Barbara...


|  |
| 
| Rivendell Betty Foy mixte - bicycles - by owner - bike 
salesantabarbara.craigslist.org |

 |




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Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[Eric Marth]

Thank you Stephen, Ryan and Keith. 

It's my first trip, lots to learn and even un-learn! I'm glad we stuck it 
out for the weather. Will be all the better earlier in the season. But here 
in Virginia we could get some 70 degree days in December... 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 11:19:41 AM UTC-5 Stephen wrote:

> Hey Eric,
>
> Great ride report, really enjoyed reading it along with the previous day 
> ride you posted! Love seeing reports of Appalachian overnighters. Having 
> all that weight sure makes the ride harder, I got spanked last year taking 
> my Joe on the Wilson's ramble in nc by naively planning my daily mileage 
> based on how fast I ride unloaded.. ended up running low on food and 
> shortening the route. Good for you getting out in the cold weather!
>
> cheers,
>
> Stephen
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. 
>>
>> Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything 
>> more than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but 
>> I got used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when 
>> I was trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda 
>> tipping over, no big deal. 
>>
>> I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached 
>> a packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd 
>> also love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but 
>> couldn't get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a 
>> bootlegged Pec Deck for some time. 
>>
>> Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a 
>> fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! 
>>
>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:
>>>
>>> Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 14-15 November 2022
>>> 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 
>>>
>>> [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]
>>>
>>> This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips 
>>> by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a 
>>> primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
>>> loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
>>> night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
>>> to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
>>> out. 
>>>
>>> Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
>>> well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow 
>>> were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad 
>>> weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
>>> would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
>>> late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
>>> check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
>>> shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the 
>>> wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
>>> way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 
>>>
>>> [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]
>>>
>>> The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with 
>>> cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges 
>>> of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained 
>>> gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful 
>>> farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a 
>>> way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy 
>>> fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. 
>>>
>>> Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
>>> rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
>>> stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
>>> had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
>>> a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with 
>>> a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk 
>>> candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
>>> full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
>>> favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were 
>>> fantastically good. 
>>>
>>> [image: 03 Road SM.jpg]
>>>
>>> We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long 
>>> climb that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles 
>>> without interruption. 
>>>
>>> The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road t

Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[brizbarn]

It's always easy to overpack, or at least feel like you did when you're 
pedaling up a hill.  I wouldn't say your pack list is overly excessive tho, 
it looks like everything fit in your bags just fine, which is a plus.  I'm 
tend to overflow my bags which are slightly smaller than yours on 
overnighters, but I'm usually glad I have everything that I packed.  On a 
recent overnighter I took a thicker, better R-value sleeping pad and that 
helped me sleep much better.  I also tried not to over-hydrate, which in 
the past I think I did often, especially later in the day.  This time 
paying attention to when I was actually thirsty, not just drinking a lot to 
"stay hydrated".  This NPR Life Kit 
busts some water drinking myths 
and was helpful for me.   A "sport top" on your Kleen Kanteen may be 
helpful for sipping while riding, and maybe a bottom downtube bottle cage 
to get some water weight lower down.  I ride with a front rando bag on my 
bike most of the time, which maybe acclimates me to having some weight up 
front on trips.  Being soaked in sweat on a cold day is never fun either, 
maybe too much wool while climbing?  Glad you were able to get comfy with 
the fire tho.  I might need to check out that camp pillow before next 
season.  Makes me want to try a cold weather trip! 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:57:09 AM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Thank you Stephen, Ryan and Keith. 
>
> It's my first trip, lots to learn and even un-learn! I'm glad we stuck it 
> out for the weather. Will be all the better earlier in the season. But here 
> in Virginia we could get some 70 degree days in December... 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 11:19:41 AM UTC-5 Stephen wrote:
>
>> Hey Eric,
>>
>> Great ride report, really enjoyed reading it along with the previous day 
>> ride you posted! Love seeing reports of Appalachian overnighters. Having 
>> all that weight sure makes the ride harder, I got spanked last year taking 
>> my Joe on the Wilson's ramble in nc by naively planning my daily mileage 
>> based on how fast I ride unloaded.. ended up running low on food and 
>> shortening the route. Good for you getting out in the cold weather!
>>
>> cheers,
>>
>> Stephen
>>
>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. 
>>>
>>> Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything 
>>> more than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but 
>>> I got used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when 
>>> I was trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda 
>>> tipping over, no big deal. 
>>>
>>> I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached 
>>> a packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd 
>>> also love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but 
>>> couldn't get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a 
>>> bootlegged Pec Deck for some time. 
>>>
>>> Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a 
>>> fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! 
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:

 Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter



 14-15 November 2022
 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 

 [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]

 This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight 
 trips by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I 
 booked 
 a primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
 loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
 night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
 to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
 out. 

 Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
 well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and 
 snow 
 were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With 
 bad 
 weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
 would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
 late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
 check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
 shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed 
 the 
 wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
 way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 

 [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]

 The f

Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 Dave:
The nylock nut bonding to the bolt sounds like an unlikely phenomenon to me. I 
just got an Atlantis F/F with same binder bolt set-up and mine turned normally. 
I wonder if yours was cross threaded because the nut got set cock-eyed in its 
binder seat when married to bolt. I can't see how nylon would bond to a bolt 
shaft as to not be removable as you tried. Blue locktite on a standard not is 
an option, but I wouldn't be opposed to trying a nylock nut again.
Also, chasing threads can be assisted by using a little lubrication of some 
sort: anti seeze/thread lube compound, Sea Foam, WD-40, most any lube. Even 
motor oil, not that I would given other options.
Another nifty trick is to start chasing from the opposite side you would 
typically introduce the bolt. For example on drop out eyelets start from the 
inboard wheel side. That way if something binds or goes a little wrong you 
could have second attempt by trying from the outboard wheel side. There have 
been times when I've had threads start to bugger/bind for one reason or another 
and it's a simple way to clean things back up by running a bolt through from 
other side. A second shot at same task, if you will. Assuming it's possible, 
for example one wouldn't be able to do this on a bottom bracket type scenario 
since there isn't access from the opposite side.
I'm probably sharing what you already know all well. Just sharing my 
experiences that have helped me out of a pickle. Tips from friends are always 
welcome. Even If I already know them...

Scott

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 06:31:17 AM MST, DavidP 
 wrote:  
 
 An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my frame 
was fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the hanger 
threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the cups threaded 
in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been chasing the threads 
on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get them cleaned out and 
accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing taps so I've always just 
used a steel screw, working it in and out until the threads are clear. I've 
seen thread clearing tools made using a sacrificial screw with a slot cut along 
the length of the threads to allow material to clear while threading it, which 
probably would've made it go faster.
Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant to 
turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it to 
tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the bolt it 
snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of the bolt 
out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I was unable 
to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I replaced the bolt with 
a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue 
loctite on the bolt). Now everything tightens up (and loosens again) as 
expected.
-Dave

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that have 
two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right side 
lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I don't know 
if a non-integrated right lever exists.
The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
repositioning the pivot pin.

Laing

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:

Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into that 
before.

I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? implies 
“and how are you going to build it up?”





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Re: [RBW] The Rivendell Ride

['John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Rich

Can you share the STA, OD and wall thickness of the main tubes and the 
trail for the Mercian??   Curious as to how they compare to your Rivendells.

I looked at the Mercian 15 years ago and they are very nice frames/forks.  
 The price was good even at the exchange rate then.  Might be better with 
the better exchange rate now

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:32:54 AM UTC-5 RichS wrote:

> Paul asked about another bike that rides like a Rivendell. I have a 
> Mercian Audax that was built to my specs with 725 tubing and 650b wheels. 
> The bike rides and handles as well as any Rivendell I've owned. This is 
> completely subjective of course and YMMV.
>
> Best,
> Rich in ATL
>
> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 7:45:42 PM UTC-5 Paul Clifton wrote:
>
>> Chris,
>> I've heard this too, about the trade secret numbers. 
>>
>> It made me wonder, has anyone ridden another bike that rides like a 
>> Rivendell?
>>
>> To me, more-or-less like Joe said, it's nimble handling that also feels 
>> extremely stable. It's easy to change lines around a curve, but it's also 
>> easy to just let the bike hold it's line (straight or in corners).
>>
>> I've ridden plenty of miles on two Rosco Bubbes (MTBubbe and Rosco Bebe), 
>> a Gus, and a tandem. I've ridden a few miles on a too small Clem L and a 
>> Sam. They all handle similarly. The thing that changes is position and how 
>> much bike is out front and how much bike is out back. The Bebe bike, with a 
>> lot of length out front really leads itself through the curves. The Gus 
>> kind of trails behind. But both are absurdly stable. I'd put the MTBubbe 
>> and the Sam as kind of neutral in that respect. I can choose to place the 
>> front or back wheel as a way to pick my line.
>>
>> The only other bike I've ridden that comes close was my Surly Long Haul 
>> Trucker. It was not the same as a Riv, but it was stable, but not nimble 
>> (which may or may not have made me like it more or less). I finally 
>> realized that it was also a size too big, which I suspect has a tendency to 
>> make a bike less nimble - think about how nimble a BMX bike is for a full 
>> grown person ... I traded it for a 1984 Trek 720, which I don't consider 
>> either stable or nimble compared to the LHT or my Rivs. But it's still an 
>> alright bike.
>>
>> But it's gotta be something about the trail and the ratio of rider weight 
>> over the front and back ends. So as rake increases, the rear end might also 
>> increase. I dunno, I'd love to make an spreadsheet.
>>
>> Paul in AR
>>
>> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 6:32:53 AM UTC-6 Chris L wrote:
>>
>>> I remember reading where Grant, or one of his long-term employees but I 
>>> think Grant, said on front end geometry handling there are a few numbers 
>>> they hold to but they don't discuss them outside the shop.  Trail would be 
>>> an obvious one, but I've always thought it would be interesting to hear the 
>>> rest.  Jan Heine gets into what might be some of RBW's other unspoken 
>>> factors in his book on performance bicycles.  
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 10:38:08 PM UTC-6 pi...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Grant's 1993 Bridgestone RB-1 had a 54mm trail with 25mm tires. The 
 2022 Roadini had a trail of around 58mm but with a 5mm lower BB. The 
 Cheviot (I can't find numbers for the Platypus) had a trail of 58mm with a 
 25mm tire (but obviously few people would run 25mm tires on that bike), 
 but 
 even with a 33mm tire it'll still be a 61mm trail, making the bike steer a 
 little slower but still agile. I had a custom bike built around the 1993 
 RB-1 geometry with a lower BB, and it rides similarly great. Now when it 
 comes to compliance, stiffness, etc., the tubing thickness etc matters 
 more, but in terms of handling I think Grant has it dialed down and you 
 can 
 see that he pretty much keeps all his bikes in the same zone when it comes 
 to trail. The longer wheel base that he's been going for recently adds 
 alot 
 to stability and high speed handling at the expense of packability into 
 bike boxes, which few care about. If you were to buy say, a Craig Calfee 
 carbon framed bike, it actually has a very similar geometry too the RB-1, 
 and rides similarly, but of course being made out of carbon and with a 
 short wheel base and relatively little tire clearance chances are that 
 bike 
 wouldn't appeal to the same people who like Rivendell bicycles.
 On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 6:09:47 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Oh I haven't the first clue how Grant does it. There's something going 
> on with the numbers and tubes that makes them ride like a Harley Softail 
> on 
> the straights AND a Ducati Panigale in the turns. It's bonkers! 
>
> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 5:51:31 PM UTC-8 J J wrote:
>
>> You hit it on the head, Joe. Thanks for the thread. 

Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

['Slacky Mac' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Eric,

That was a great read - I felt the cold!  Also have been really enjoying 
your YT channel.



On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 12:57:09 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Thank you Stephen, Ryan and Keith. 
>
> It's my first trip, lots to learn and even un-learn! I'm glad we stuck it 
> out for the weather. Will be all the better earlier in the season. But here 
> in Virginia we could get some 70 degree days in December... 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 11:19:41 AM UTC-5 Stephen wrote:
>
>> Hey Eric,
>>
>> Great ride report, really enjoyed reading it along with the previous day 
>> ride you posted! Love seeing reports of Appalachian overnighters. Having 
>> all that weight sure makes the ride harder, I got spanked last year taking 
>> my Joe on the Wilson's ramble in nc by naively planning my daily mileage 
>> based on how fast I ride unloaded.. ended up running low on food and 
>> shortening the route. Good for you getting out in the cold weather!
>>
>> cheers,
>>
>> Stephen
>>
>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. 
>>>
>>> Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything 
>>> more than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but 
>>> I got used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when 
>>> I was trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda 
>>> tipping over, no big deal. 
>>>
>>> I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached 
>>> a packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd 
>>> also love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but 
>>> couldn't get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a 
>>> bootlegged Pec Deck for some time. 
>>>
>>> Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a 
>>> fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! 
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:

 Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter



 14-15 November 2022
 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 

 [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]

 This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight 
 trips by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I 
 booked 
 a primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
 loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
 night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
 to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
 out. 

 Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
 well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and 
 snow 
 were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With 
 bad 
 weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
 would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
 late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
 check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
 shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed 
 the 
 wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
 way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 

 [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]

 The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside 
 with cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown 
 vestiges of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and 
 well-maintained gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of 
 small beautiful farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road 
 continued on in a way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, 
 over corn and soy fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for 
 hay. 

 Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
 rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
 stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
 had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
 a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store 
 with 
 a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. 
 Bulk 
 candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
 full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
 favorite, the Black Twig and we got four

[RBW] Re: The Rivendell Ride

[Joe Bernard]

Laing, 

To my eye the frame is pretty much what was in the plan. The only 
difference I can pick out is I ended up with the seattube reamed for 27.2 
instead of 26.8. 

 I kinda wish there was a production version of this frame so everybody 
could ride one, it's amazing! 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 4:53:22 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:

> Have you verified that was what got built? My Custom is thankfully 
> different from the plan in some aspects. The plan shows Roadini style 
> baseball bat tapered seat and and top tubes which I find ugly. Nobilette 
> apparently just went with the big end size (31.8) for all of the main 
> triangle tubes which is how I ended up with a 29.0 seatpost. It calls for a 
> ball socket seat lug which I guess they don't have in 31.8 x 31.8 so I 
> ended up with regular fluted seat stay caps. I haven't verified the angles 
> yet, but the plan says mine has 72 deg seat tube angle and 71.5 head tube 
> angle with a little more trail (62.9) than yours. I don't have any tube 
> thickness info on my plans. It is a beautiful bike.
>
> Laing
>
> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 7:36:55 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Oh right, I have numbers for why my Rivendell rides the way it does. I 
>> forgot! 
>>
>> 71.5 seattube, 69.5 headtube. I wanted a pavement-biased frame for 
>> non-touring-level loads and this is how it turned out. [image: 
>> Screenshot_20221117_163140.jpg]
>> On Thursday, November 17, 2022 at 4:02:08 PM UTC-8 John Hawrylak wrote:
>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>> What is the Seat Tube Angle of your custom??
>>>
>>> John Hawrylak
>>> Woodstown NJ
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 5:41:41 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 This is an edited version of an email I recently sent Grant, I wanted 
 to post here cuz I think the magical Riv ride he designs into these frames 
 is slightly under discussed..like we all know it and love it, then talk 
 about other stuff like paint and parts. My comments are specifically about 
 my custom but I've owned a bunch of Rivs and they all ride like this (Clem 
 maybe not so light-feeling, but still zippy). Add your thoughts about your 
 bikes! :

 The handling is amazing. It feels light and zippy, yet absorbs shock 
 (there's a lot of shock on these roads) and is very stable. When you put 
 it 
 in a turn it goes where you point it and holds the line until you change 
 it. It does this when getting bumped offline, too..the darn thing pops 
 right back to where it was going! I've ridden a bazillion bikes and 
 nothing 
 rides like a Rivendell 🙌

 Joe Bernard 

>>>

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Re: [RBW] Betty Foy Sizing & Search

[Joe Bernard]

It might be this one. 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/225234493429?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=5U1MCFkqQfe&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=mIm2WqOOS_O&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:39:39 AM UTC-8 Scott wrote:

> Contact info and pics?
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:32:11 AM MST, 'zoomie z' via RBW Owners 
> Bunch  wrote: 
>
>
> Oh wow! So cool 💗
> We’re  selling a Betty Foy 62 cm in excellent shape with albatross 
> handlebars! I’ve tried to post here without any luck!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 28, 2022, at 6:09 PM, 'John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> The price looks very good if the 2 racks are included.   A 55 may be too 
> big for Matt's wife
>
> John Hawrylak
> Woodstown NJ
>
> On Friday, October 28, 2022 at 8:20:51 PM UTC-4 Matthew Williams wrote:
>
> Here’s a 55cm Betty Foy in Santa Barbara...
>
>
> [image: 00N0N_24mfIhCIO8Bz_0pO0jm_600x450.jpg]
>
> Rivendell Betty Foy mixte - bicycles - by owner - bike sale 
> 
> santabarbara.craigslist.org 
> 
>
> 
>
> -- 
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>  
> 
> .
>
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>  
> 
> .
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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

[Mark C]

Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The 
seatpost bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a 
week through a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I 
was turning onto my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The 
bolt still seemed to be tight, but I finally marked it and could see that 
it wasn't turning in the nut even though the bolt turned with difficulty. 
Then, as I was suspecting and sort of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found 
the nut so don't know what was up there, but it sure seemed like the 
threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know how else the post would 
suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It was such a freak thing 
I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:

> An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my 
> frame was fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the 
> hanger threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the 
> cups threaded in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been 
> chasing the threads on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get 
> them cleaned out and accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing 
> taps so I've always just used a steel screw, working it in and out until 
> the threads are clear. I've seen thread clearing tools made using a 
> sacrificial screw with a slot cut along the length of the threads to allow 
> material to clear while threading it, which probably would've made it go 
> faster.
>
> Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant 
> to turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it 
> to tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the 
> bolt it snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of 
> the bolt out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I 
> was unable to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I 
> replaced the bolt with a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, 
> non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue loctite on the bolt). Now everything 
> tightens up (and loosens again) as expected.
>
> -Dave
>
> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:
>
>> I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White 
>> that have two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The 
>> right side lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano 
>> hub. I don't know if a non-integrated right lever exists.
>>
>> The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
>> repositioning the pivot pin.
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
>>> I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
>>> I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into 
>>> that before.
>>>
>>> I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? 
>>> implies “and how are you going to build it up?”
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 Good idea marking the bolt end. That's clever!

I bet the bolt was shearing when it turned with difficulty despite no change on 
the end.
I'm always very vigilant and pay critical attention to ensuring threads are 
engaging before giving it the onion. At times it can be hard to tell given a 
certain scenario when it's hard to get a good tactile feel.
If I were to install a new bolt and nut, I'd make sure I use tip of my index 
finger to ensure nut is seat completely and flush with mounting surface. One 
should be able to feel through a hex wrench the bolt threads passively engaging 
nut a few rotations before some resistance when the bolt encounters the nylon 
segment. Sometimes it's helpful to, while lightly applying pressure  to one 
another (bolt and nut), to rotated the bolt counter clockwise until one feels a 
very light click. At that point the threads would be very close to engaging and 
then I would return to a very light clockwise rotation and use the tactile 
thing to ensure threads are engaging passively.
Blabber, blabber

Again, just my friendly input...
Scott 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 03:13:03 PM MST, Mark C 
 wrote:  
 
 
Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The seatpost 
bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a week through 
a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I was turning onto 
my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The bolt still seemed to be 
tight, but I finally marked it and could see that it wasn't turning in the nut 
even though the bolt turned with difficulty. Then, as I was suspecting and sort 
of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found the nut so don't know what was up 
there, but it sure seemed like the threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know 
how else the post would suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It 
was such a freak thing I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:

An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my frame was 
fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the hanger 
threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the cups threaded 
in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been chasing the threads 
on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get them cleaned out and 
accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing taps so I've always just 
used a steel screw, working it in and out until the threads are clear. I've 
seen thread clearing tools made using a sacrificial screw with a slot cut along 
the length of the threads to allow material to clear while threading it, which 
probably would've made it go faster.
Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant to 
turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it to 
tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the bolt it 
snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of the bolt 
out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I was unable 
to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I replaced the bolt with 
a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue 
loctite on the bolt). Now everything tightens up (and loosens again) as 
expected.
-Dave

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that have 
two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right side 
lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I don't know 
if a non-integrated right lever exists.
The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
repositioning the pivot pin.

Laing

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:

Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into that 
before.

I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? implies 
“and how are you going to build it up?”






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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

[lconley]

The problem could be that the nut and bolt are both stainless steel. 
Stainless on stainless can "gall", basically cold welding themselves to 
each other. Lubricant / anti-seize on the threads can help prevent this.

Laing

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:12:58 PM UTC-5 Mark C wrote:

>
> Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The 
> seatpost bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a 
> week through a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I 
> was turning onto my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The 
> bolt still seemed to be tight, but I finally marked it and could see that 
> it wasn't turning in the nut even though the bolt turned with difficulty. 
> Then, as I was suspecting and sort of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found 
> the nut so don't know what was up there, but it sure seemed like the 
> threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know how else the post would 
> suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It was such a freak thing 
> I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:
>
>> An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my 
>> frame was fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the 
>> hanger threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the 
>> cups threaded in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been 
>> chasing the threads on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get 
>> them cleaned out and accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing 
>> taps so I've always just used a steel screw, working it in and out until 
>> the threads are clear. I've seen thread clearing tools made using a 
>> sacrificial screw with a slot cut along the length of the threads to allow 
>> material to clear while threading it, which probably would've made it go 
>> faster.
>>
>> Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant 
>> to turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it 
>> to tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the 
>> bolt it snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of 
>> the bolt out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I 
>> was unable to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I 
>> replaced the bolt with a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, 
>> non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue loctite on the bolt). Now everything 
>> tightens up (and loosens again) as expected.
>>
>> -Dave
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:
>>
>>> I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White 
>>> that have two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The 
>>> right side lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano 
>>> hub. I don't know if a non-integrated right lever exists.
>>>
>>> The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
>>> repositioning the pivot pin.
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:
>>>
 Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
 I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers 
 yet.
 I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into 
 that before.

 I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? 
 implies “and how are you going to build it up?”



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Re: [RBW] Betty Foy Sizing & Search

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 Thanks, Joe

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 02:46:17 PM MST, Joe Bernard 
 wrote:  
 
 It might be this one. 
https://www.ebay.com/itm/225234493429?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=5U1MCFkqQfe&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=mIm2WqOOS_O&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:39:39 AM UTC-8 Scott wrote:

 Contact info and pics?

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:32:11 AM MST, 'zoomie z' via RBW Owners 
Bunch  wrote:  
 
 Oh wow! So cool 💗We’re  selling a Betty Foy 62 cm in excellent shape with 
albatross handlebars! I’ve tried to post here without any luck!

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 28, 2022, at 6:09 PM, 'John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch 
 wrote:



The price looks very good if the 2 racks are included.   A 55 may be too big 
for Matt's wife
John HawrylakWoodstown NJ

On Friday, October 28, 2022 at 8:20:51 PM UTC-4 Matthew Williams wrote:

Here’s a 55cm Betty Foy in Santa Barbara...


|  |
| 
| Rivendell Betty Foy mixte - bicycles - by owner - bike 
salesantabarbara.craigslist.org |

 |




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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 You get the "Knowledge" badge, Laing. Thanks for sharing. I didn't even know 
such a phenomenon existed.
I'll add that to my experience tool box.
Much appreciated!
Scott

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 03:33:52 PM MST, lconley  
wrote:  
 
 The problem could be that the nut and bolt are both stainless steel. Stainless 
on stainless can "gall", basically cold welding themselves to each other. 
Lubricant / anti-seize on the threads can help prevent this.
Laing

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:12:58 PM UTC-5 Mark C wrote:


Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The seatpost 
bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a week through 
a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I was turning onto 
my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The bolt still seemed to be 
tight, but I finally marked it and could see that it wasn't turning in the nut 
even though the bolt turned with difficulty. Then, as I was suspecting and sort 
of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found the nut so don't know what was up 
there, but it sure seemed like the threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know 
how else the post would suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It 
was such a freak thing I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:

An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my frame was 
fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the hanger 
threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the cups threaded 
in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been chasing the threads 
on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get them cleaned out and 
accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing taps so I've always just 
used a steel screw, working it in and out until the threads are clear. I've 
seen thread clearing tools made using a sacrificial screw with a slot cut along 
the length of the threads to allow material to clear while threading it, which 
probably would've made it go faster.
Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant to 
turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it to 
tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the bolt it 
snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of the bolt 
out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I was unable 
to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I replaced the bolt with 
a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue 
loctite on the bolt). Now everything tightens up (and loosens again) as 
expected.
-Dave

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that have 
two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right side 
lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I don't know 
if a non-integrated right lever exists.
The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
repositioning the pivot pin.

Laing

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:

Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into that 
before.

I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? implies 
“and how are you going to build it up?”







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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 Ima take mine apart and add some anti seeze. Hope it's not galled like the 
others experienced. Simple fix though...
Scott

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 03:33:52 PM MST, lconley  
wrote:  
 
 The problem could be that the nut and bolt are both stainless steel. Stainless 
on stainless can "gall", basically cold welding themselves to each other. 
Lubricant / anti-seize on the threads can help prevent this.
Laing

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:12:58 PM UTC-5 Mark C wrote:


Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The seatpost 
bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a week through 
a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I was turning onto 
my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The bolt still seemed to be 
tight, but I finally marked it and could see that it wasn't turning in the nut 
even though the bolt turned with difficulty. Then, as I was suspecting and sort 
of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found the nut so don't know what was up 
there, but it sure seemed like the threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know 
how else the post would suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It 
was such a freak thing I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:

An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my frame was 
fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the hanger 
threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the cups threaded 
in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been chasing the threads 
on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get them cleaned out and 
accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing taps so I've always just 
used a steel screw, working it in and out until the threads are clear. I've 
seen thread clearing tools made using a sacrificial screw with a slot cut along 
the length of the threads to allow material to clear while threading it, which 
probably would've made it go faster.
Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant to 
turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it to 
tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the bolt it 
snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of the bolt 
out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I was unable 
to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I replaced the bolt with 
a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue 
loctite on the bolt). Now everything tightens up (and loosens again) as 
expected.
-Dave

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that have 
two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right side 
lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I don't know 
if a non-integrated right lever exists.
The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
repositioning the pivot pin.

Laing

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:

Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into that 
before.

I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? implies 
“and how are you going to build it up?”







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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

[lconley]

I have busted multiple stainless steel nuts and bolts. The old chrome ones 
from Cinelli and Campagnolo, etc. never froze and broke, nor did the 
galvanized ones on lesser bikes. Then I 'upgraded' to Stainless Steel, and 
started having problems.

Google this: Pepto Bismol works as anti-seize if you don't have anything 
else around.

Laing

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:44:36 PM UTC-5 Scott wrote:

> You get the "Knowledge" badge, Laing. Thanks for sharing. I didn't even 
> know such a phenomenon existed.
>
> I'll add that to my experience tool box.
>
> Much appreciated!
>
> Scott
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 03:33:52 PM MST, lconley  
> wrote: 
>
>
> The problem could be that the nut and bolt are both stainless steel. 
> Stainless on stainless can "gall", basically cold welding themselves to 
> each other. Lubricant / anti-seize on the threads can help prevent this.
>
> Laing
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:12:58 PM UTC-5 Mark C wrote:
>
>
> Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The 
> seatpost bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a 
> week through a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I 
> was turning onto my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The 
> bolt still seemed to be tight, but I finally marked it and could see that 
> it wasn't turning in the nut even though the bolt turned with difficulty. 
> Then, as I was suspecting and sort of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found 
> the nut so don't know what was up there, but it sure seemed like the 
> threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know how else the post would 
> suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It was such a freak thing 
> I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:
>
> An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my 
> frame was fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the 
> hanger threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the 
> cups threaded in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been 
> chasing the threads on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get 
> them cleaned out and accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing 
> taps so I've always just used a steel screw, working it in and out until 
> the threads are clear. I've seen thread clearing tools made using a 
> sacrificial screw with a slot cut along the length of the threads to allow 
> material to clear while threading it, which probably would've made it go 
> faster.
>
> Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant 
> to turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it 
> to tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the 
> bolt it snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of 
> the bolt out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I 
> was unable to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I 
> replaced the bolt with a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, 
> non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue loctite on the bolt). Now everything 
> tightens up (and loosens again) as expected.
>
> -Dave
>
> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:
>
> I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that 
> have two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right 
> side lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I 
> don't know if a non-integrated right lever exists.
>
> The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
> repositioning the pivot pin.
>
> Laing
>
> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:
>
> Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
> I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
> I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into 
> that before.
>
> I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? 
> implies “and how are you going to build it up?”
>
> -- 
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/9a7cb4df-a1dd-4e82-8037-335e9cf1c032n%40googlegroups.com
>  
> 
> .
>

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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 I always have a tube of anti-sieze laying around. I love the stuff not just 
for anti-seize properties but also for thread lubrication to get things to seat 
nicely, especially if I've got the torque wrench in play.
Pepto is multi purpose...how about that?! Didn't know that either!
Thanks again, Laing
Scott

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 04:03:08 PM MST, lconley  
wrote:  
 
 I have busted multiple stainless steel nuts and bolts. The old chrome ones 
from Cinelli and Campagnolo, etc. never froze and broke, nor did the galvanized 
ones on lesser bikes. Then I 'upgraded' to Stainless Steel, and started having 
problems.
Google this: Pepto Bismol works as anti-seize if you don't have anything else 
around.
Laing

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:44:36 PM UTC-5 Scott wrote:

 You get the "Knowledge" badge, Laing. Thanks for sharing. I didn't even know 
such a phenomenon existed.
I'll add that to my experience tool box.
Much appreciated!
Scott

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 03:33:52 PM MST, lconley  
wrote:  
 
 The problem could be that the nut and bolt are both stainless steel. Stainless 
on stainless can "gall", basically cold welding themselves to each other. 
Lubricant / anti-seize on the threads can help prevent this.
Laing

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:12:58 PM UTC-5 Mark C wrote:


Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The seatpost 
bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a week through 
a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I was turning onto 
my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The bolt still seemed to be 
tight, but I finally marked it and could see that it wasn't turning in the nut 
even though the bolt turned with difficulty. Then, as I was suspecting and sort 
of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found the nut so don't know what was up 
there, but it sure seemed like the threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know 
how else the post would suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It 
was such a freak thing I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:

An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my frame was 
fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the hanger 
threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the cups threaded 
in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been chasing the threads 
on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get them cleaned out and 
accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing taps so I've always just 
used a steel screw, working it in and out until the threads are clear. I've 
seen thread clearing tools made using a sacrificial screw with a slot cut along 
the length of the threads to allow material to clear while threading it, which 
probably would've made it go faster.
Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant to 
turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it to 
tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the bolt it 
snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of the bolt 
out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I was unable 
to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I replaced the bolt with 
a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue 
loctite on the bolt). Now everything tightens up (and loosens again) as 
expected.
-Dave

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that have 
two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right side 
lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I don't know 
if a non-integrated right lever exists.
The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
repositioning the pivot pin.

Laing

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:

Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into that 
before.

I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? implies 
“and how are you going to build it up?”







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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

['Scott Luly' via RBW Owners Bunch]

 Laing, I've heard the term "galling" before, but I always thought it meant 
threads were somehow corroded, filled with debris, or buggered from cross 
threading.
I've also heard the term used to describe my personality...hehe...but that's a 
thread for elsewhere.
It's Friday afternoon. Can you tell? Yee-haw!!!
Scott

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 03:33:52 PM MST, lconley  
wrote:  
 
 The problem could be that the nut and bolt are both stainless steel. Stainless 
on stainless can "gall", basically cold welding themselves to each other. 
Lubricant / anti-seize on the threads can help prevent this.
Laing

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:12:58 PM UTC-5 Mark C wrote:


Oddly enough, I had the same experience with my Rosco Platypus. The seatpost 
bolt was very tight to turn, but worked sort of okay for almost a week through 
a few adjustments due to trying different saddles. Then as I was turning onto 
my street after a ride, the seatpost slammed down. The bolt still seemed to be 
tight, but I finally marked it and could see that it wasn't turning in the nut 
even though the bolt turned with difficulty. Then, as I was suspecting and sort 
of hoping, the bolt broke. I never found the nut so don't know what was up 
there, but it sure seemed like the threads slipped enough to jam. I don't know 
how else the post would suddenly slip and the bolt still feel very tight. It 
was such a freak thing I didn't mention it, but now I hear of another case.
On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:31:11 AM UTC-5 DavidP wrote:

An update on my build experience so far - the derailleur hanger on my frame was 
fine, no adjustment to alignment needed. No chasing needed on the hanger 
threads either. The bottom bracket threads were also fine and the cups threaded 
in smoothly. The most time consuming part so far has been chasing the threads 
on the fork crown braze-ons - it took a while to get them cleaned out and 
accept a screw smoothly. I've never acquired chasing taps so I've always just 
used a steel screw, working it in and out until the threads are clear. I've 
seen thread clearing tools made using a sacrificial screw with a slot cut along 
the length of the threads to allow material to clear while threading it, which 
probably would've made it go faster.
Out of the box, I noticed the seat collar binder bolt was oddly resistant to 
turn in either direction; it took an unusual amount of force to get it to 
tighten and the post still had play. Then while trying to loosen the bolt it 
snapped in the middle of the shaft. After taking the two halves of the bolt 
out, I found the nylock nut was bound to the end of the bolt and I was unable 
to turn it loose using vice grips and a socket wrench. I replaced the bolt with 
a new stainless M6 x 20mm and a standard, non-locking, M6 nut (with some blue 
loctite on the bolt). Now everything tightens up (and loosens again) as 
expected.
-Dave

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 4:20:47 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

I got some Shimano levers for my internal gear bikes from Peter White that have 
two position cable attachments for normal or linear brakes. The right side 
lever has an integrated thumb shifter for the 8 speed Shimano hub. I don't know 
if a non-integrated right lever exists.
The Paul Cross-Lever can also be used with either style of brake by 
repositioning the pivot pin.

Laing

On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 2:45:05 PM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:

Thanks, Scott.  That helps a lot.
I’m going for Tektro linear pull V-brakes, but no decision on levers yet.
I like the adjustable pull on those levers, though.  I hadn’t run into that 
before.

I’m not trying to hijack this thread, but “Who is getting a Platypus”? implies 
“and how are you going to build it up?”







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[RBW] Granola-Moose Bar?

[George Schick]

I got an email from VO today introducing a new product - the "Granola-Moose 
Bar."  Now, VO has always seemed to me to keep in semi-lock step with Riv 
and in this case I'd call it a variant of the Nitto Choco-Moose bar that 
they (used to?) sell.  The three differences I notice (maybe 3 1/2) are: 
the VO offering is in 1 1/8" threadless instead of a welded-in quill stem, 
it has a "cross bar" between the two curved handles with a slightly 
flattened section to allow for the mounting of lights, etc., it's available 
in both black and chrome, oh and it's about 2/3 the price that the 
Riv/Nitto version is/was.

Laying all of that aside for the moment, what opinion do any of you all 
have about the Nitto bar that Riv offered if you have one?  I'm thinking of 
buying one of the VO versions to replace the "cow horn" bar that I 
currently have installed on my Surly 1x1 because 1) it has a threadless 
steerer and the Nitto won't/wouldn't work and 2) it comes in a black 
version and everything else on my headset, current threadless stem, and 
bars is black and I'd like to keep it that way.  BUT, and this is an item 
that I'd really like some feedback about, both of these bars, i.e. from 
either company, have a fixed, unadjustable angle because they're welded to 
the stem (or threadless clamp).  Has that lack of adjustment bar angle 
capability been a problem for any of the Choco-Moose users out there?

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[RBW] Re: Granola-Moose Bar?

[Joe Bernard]

This is extremely subjective and it matters a lot what the headtube angle 
is on the frame the bar is going on, but I had a ChocoMoose for a while 
(Cheviot? I think it was on a Cheviot) and the angle seemed fine to me. 

If it matters at all to you the Granola-Moose has a lot more 
flare/splaying-out than Choco. 

Joe Bernard 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 3:34:44 PM UTC-8 George Schick wrote:

> I got an email from VO today introducing a new product - the 
> "Granola-Moose Bar."  Now, VO has always seemed to me to keep in semi-lock 
> step with Riv and in this case I'd call it a variant of the Nitto 
> Choco-Moose bar that they (used to?) sell.  The three differences I notice 
> (maybe 3 1/2) are: the VO offering is in 1 1/8" threadless instead of a 
> welded-in quill stem, it has a "cross bar" between the two curved handles 
> with a slightly flattened section to allow for the mounting of lights, 
> etc., it's available in both black and chrome, oh and it's about 2/3 the 
> price that the Riv/Nitto version is/was.
>
> Laying all of that aside for the moment, what opinion do any of you all 
> have about the Nitto bar that Riv offered if you have one?  I'm thinking of 
> buying one of the VO versions to replace the "cow horn" bar that I 
> currently have installed on my Surly 1x1 because 1) it has a threadless 
> steerer and the Nitto won't/wouldn't work and 2) it comes in a black 
> version and everything else on my headset, current threadless stem, and 
> bars is black and I'd like to keep it that way.  BUT, and this is an item 
> that I'd really like some feedback about, both of these bars, i.e. from 
> either company, have a fixed, unadjustable angle because they're welded to 
> the stem (or threadless clamp).  Has that lack of adjustment bar angle 
> capability been a problem for any of the Choco-Moose users out there?
>
>

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[RBW] FS: 58cm SimpleOne

[Jared Wilson]

Hey group,

Repurchased my old SimpleOne earlier this year and just don't find myself 
riding it enough, I thought that might change the second time around, 
alas

58cm Rivendell SimpleOne Frame/Fork

*Used with paint chips and a micro-dent on the top tube. I don't buy bikes 
with dented tubes but this one is so small I couldn't find the energy to 
care, you should do the same!*

Tange Headset

Nitto 85mm 31.8 FacePlater stem

Nitto/Riv 31.8 BullBar

Origin8 brake levers

Ergon GP1 BioKork grips

Shimano Deore BR-T610 V-brakes, rear will be swapped to black before sale

Nitto S65 seatpost

WTB Pure V saddle

IRD 165mm 144bcd cranks with 42T 3/32" Wabi chainring

Shimano UN300 BB

OEM Quickbeam wheels, Suzue hubs to Mavic rims

18T White Industries Eno Trials Freewheel

20T White Industries Eno Freewheel

Rene Herse Snoqualmie Pass Endurance Tires (700x44)

Surly Tuggnut chain tensioner

Pedals not included

SimpleOne Photos 


*$1500 + buyer pays shipping*

Can deliver to SF Bay Area November 30th or down to LA around Christmas 
time.

Please respond off list if interested, thanks :)

Jared in SLO County

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[RBW] Re: Granola-Moose Bar?

[Conway Bennett]

I like the idea of moose bars but I don't like it them in practice.  I like 
my wrists in a neutral position, and with a moose bar that is not a given.  
Plus, once you realize this, they are relatively expensive to ship to a new 
owner.

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:53:34 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:

> This is extremely subjective and it matters a lot what the headtube angle 
> is on the frame the bar is going on, but I had a ChocoMoose for a while 
> (Cheviot? I think it was on a Cheviot) and the angle seemed fine to me. 
>
> If it matters at all to you the Granola-Moose has a lot more 
> flare/splaying-out than Choco. 
>
> Joe Bernard 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 3:34:44 PM UTC-8 George Schick wrote:
>
>> I got an email from VO today introducing a new product - the 
>> "Granola-Moose Bar."  Now, VO has always seemed to me to keep in semi-lock 
>> step with Riv and in this case I'd call it a variant of the Nitto 
>> Choco-Moose bar that they (used to?) sell.  The three differences I notice 
>> (maybe 3 1/2) are: the VO offering is in 1 1/8" threadless instead of a 
>> welded-in quill stem, it has a "cross bar" between the two curved handles 
>> with a slightly flattened section to allow for the mounting of lights, 
>> etc., it's available in both black and chrome, oh and it's about 2/3 the 
>> price that the Riv/Nitto version is/was.
>>
>> Laying all of that aside for the moment, what opinion do any of you all 
>> have about the Nitto bar that Riv offered if you have one?  I'm thinking of 
>> buying one of the VO versions to replace the "cow horn" bar that I 
>> currently have installed on my Surly 1x1 because 1) it has a threadless 
>> steerer and the Nitto won't/wouldn't work and 2) it comes in a black 
>> version and everything else on my headset, current threadless stem, and 
>> bars is black and I'd like to keep it that way.  BUT, and this is an item 
>> that I'd really like some feedback about, both of these bars, i.e. from 
>> either company, have a fixed, unadjustable angle because they're welded to 
>> the stem (or threadless clamp).  Has that lack of adjustment bar angle 
>> capability been a problem for any of the Choco-Moose users out there?
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Granola-Moose Bar?

[Joe Bernard]

Definitely a money loser when you decide it's not your jam. I've shipped 
several versions of these things and...yeah. My Moose bar days are over. 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 4:11:35 PM UTC-8 captaincon...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> I like the idea of moose bars but I don't like it them in practice.  I 
> like my wrists in a neutral position, and with a moose bar that is not a 
> given.  Plus, once you realize this, they are relatively expensive to ship 
> to a new owner.
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:53:34 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> This is extremely subjective and it matters a lot what the headtube angle 
>> is on the frame the bar is going on, but I had a ChocoMoose for a while 
>> (Cheviot? I think it was on a Cheviot) and the angle seemed fine to me. 
>>
>> If it matters at all to you the Granola-Moose has a lot more 
>> flare/splaying-out than Choco. 
>>
>> Joe Bernard 
>>
>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 3:34:44 PM UTC-8 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> I got an email from VO today introducing a new product - the 
>>> "Granola-Moose Bar."  Now, VO has always seemed to me to keep in semi-lock 
>>> step with Riv and in this case I'd call it a variant of the Nitto 
>>> Choco-Moose bar that they (used to?) sell.  The three differences I notice 
>>> (maybe 3 1/2) are: the VO offering is in 1 1/8" threadless instead of a 
>>> welded-in quill stem, it has a "cross bar" between the two curved handles 
>>> with a slightly flattened section to allow for the mounting of lights, 
>>> etc., it's available in both black and chrome, oh and it's about 2/3 the 
>>> price that the Riv/Nitto version is/was.
>>>
>>> Laying all of that aside for the moment, what opinion do any of you all 
>>> have about the Nitto bar that Riv offered if you have one?  I'm thinking of 
>>> buying one of the VO versions to replace the "cow horn" bar that I 
>>> currently have installed on my Surly 1x1 because 1) it has a threadless 
>>> steerer and the Nitto won't/wouldn't work and 2) it comes in a black 
>>> version and everything else on my headset, current threadless stem, and 
>>> bars is black and I'd like to keep it that way.  BUT, and this is an item 
>>> that I'd really like some feedback about, both of these bars, i.e. from 
>>> either company, have a fixed, unadjustable angle because they're welded to 
>>> the stem (or threadless clamp).  Has that lack of adjustment bar angle 
>>> capability been a problem for any of the Choco-Moose users out there?
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Granola-Moose Bar?

[J Imler]

I’ve got the choco-moose on my Appaloosa.  The fit is as close to perfect 
at I think one could hope for, at least what I could hope for. I  just saw 
the restock of the Losco and considered a swap, but then I rethink it, and 
why?  

I also have the Bosco-moose in 58 sizing. Haven’t found the frame for those 
yet but I’m thinking one day I’ll be glad I held on to them.

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 3:34:44 PM UTC-8 George Schick wrote:

> I got an email from VO today introducing a new product - the 
> "Granola-Moose Bar."  Now, VO has always seemed to me to keep in semi-lock 
> step with Riv and in this case I'd call it a variant of the Nitto 
> Choco-Moose bar that they (used to?) sell.  The three differences I notice 
> (maybe 3 1/2) are: the VO offering is in 1 1/8" threadless instead of a 
> welded-in quill stem, it has a "cross bar" between the two curved handles 
> with a slightly flattened section to allow for the mounting of lights, 
> etc., it's available in both black and chrome, oh and it's about 2/3 the 
> price that the Riv/Nitto version is/was.
>
> Laying all of that aside for the moment, what opinion do any of you all 
> have about the Nitto bar that Riv offered if you have one?  I'm thinking of 
> buying one of the VO versions to replace the "cow horn" bar that I 
> currently have installed on my Surly 1x1 because 1) it has a threadless 
> steerer and the Nitto won't/wouldn't work and 2) it comes in a black 
> version and everything else on my headset, current threadless stem, and 
> bars is black and I'd like to keep it that way.  BUT, and this is an item 
> that I'd really like some feedback about, both of these bars, i.e. from 
> either company, have a fixed, unadjustable angle because they're welded to 
> the stem (or threadless clamp).  Has that lack of adjustment bar angle 
> capability been a problem for any of the Choco-Moose users out there?
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Granola-Moose Bar?

[Richard Rose]

My exact experience also. I really wanted to like my Boscomoose. But the fixed 
angle did not work for me. That VO bar is pretty though…

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 18, 2022, at 7:11 PM, Conway Bennett  
> wrote:
> 
> I like the idea of moose bars but I don't like it them in practice.  I like 
> my wrists in a neutral position, and with a moose bar that is not a given.  
> Plus, once you realize this, they are relatively expensive to ship to a new 
> owner.
> 
>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:53:34 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:
>> This is extremely subjective and it matters a lot what the headtube angle is 
>> on the frame the bar is going on, but I had a ChocoMoose for a while 
>> (Cheviot? I think it was on a Cheviot) and the angle seemed fine to me. 
>> 
>> If it matters at all to you the Granola-Moose has a lot more 
>> flare/splaying-out than Choco. 
>> 
>> Joe Bernard 
>> 
>>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 3:34:44 PM UTC-8 George Schick wrote:
>>> I got an email from VO today introducing a new product - the "Granola-Moose 
>>> Bar."  Now, VO has always seemed to me to keep in semi-lock step with Riv 
>>> and in this case I'd call it a variant of the Nitto Choco-Moose bar that 
>>> they (used to?) sell.  The three differences I notice (maybe 3 1/2) are: 
>>> the VO offering is in 1 1/8" threadless instead of a welded-in quill stem, 
>>> it has a "cross bar" between the two curved handles with a slightly 
>>> flattened section to allow for the mounting of lights, etc., it's available 
>>> in both black and chrome, oh and it's about 2/3 the price that the 
>>> Riv/Nitto version is/was.
>>> 
>>> Laying all of that aside for the moment, what opinion do any of you all 
>>> have about the Nitto bar that Riv offered if you have one?  I'm thinking of 
>>> buying one of the VO versions to replace the "cow horn" bar that I 
>>> currently have installed on my Surly 1x1 because 1) it has a threadless 
>>> steerer and the Nitto won't/wouldn't work and 2) it comes in a black 
>>> version and everything else on my headset, current threadless stem, and 
>>> bars is black and I'd like to keep it that way.  BUT, and this is an item 
>>> that I'd really like some feedback about, both of these bars, i.e. from 
>>> either company, have a fixed, unadjustable angle because they're welded to 
>>> the stem (or threadless clamp).  Has that lack of adjustment bar angle 
>>> capability been a problem for any of the Choco-Moose users out there?
>>> 
> 
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[RBW] Re: Granola-Moose Bar?

[Joe Bernard]

I should qualify my comment, I'm talking about shipping Moosey bars with a 
quill. I forgot we're talking about a clamp-on version, that's obviously 
easier to sell without taking as big a hit financially. Never mind! 😬

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 4:27:19 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Definitely a money loser when you decide it's not your jam. I've shipped 
> several versions of these things and...yeah. My Moose bar days are over. 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 4:11:35 PM UTC-8 captaincon...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I like the idea of moose bars but I don't like it them in practice.  I 
>> like my wrists in a neutral position, and with a moose bar that is not a 
>> given.  Plus, once you realize this, they are relatively expensive to ship 
>> to a new owner.
>>
>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 5:53:34 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> This is extremely subjective and it matters a lot what the headtube 
>>> angle is on the frame the bar is going on, but I had a ChocoMoose for a 
>>> while (Cheviot? I think it was on a Cheviot) and the angle seemed fine to 
>>> me. 
>>>
>>> If it matters at all to you the Granola-Moose has a lot more 
>>> flare/splaying-out than Choco. 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard 
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 3:34:44 PM UTC-8 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 I got an email from VO today introducing a new product - the 
 "Granola-Moose Bar."  Now, VO has always seemed to me to keep in semi-lock 
 step with Riv and in this case I'd call it a variant of the Nitto 
 Choco-Moose bar that they (used to?) sell.  The three differences I notice 
 (maybe 3 1/2) are: the VO offering is in 1 1/8" threadless instead of a 
 welded-in quill stem, it has a "cross bar" between the two curved handles 
 with a slightly flattened section to allow for the mounting of lights, 
 etc., it's available in both black and chrome, oh and it's about 2/3 the 
 price that the Riv/Nitto version is/was.

 Laying all of that aside for the moment, what opinion do any of you all 
 have about the Nitto bar that Riv offered if you have one?  I'm thinking 
 of 
 buying one of the VO versions to replace the "cow horn" bar that I 
 currently have installed on my Surly 1x1 because 1) it has a threadless 
 steerer and the Nitto won't/wouldn't work and 2) it comes in a black 
 version and everything else on my headset, current threadless stem, and 
 bars is black and I'd like to keep it that way.  BUT, and this is an item 
 that I'd really like some feedback about, both of these bars, i.e. from 
 either company, have a fixed, unadjustable angle because they're welded to 
 the stem (or threadless clamp).  Has that lack of adjustment bar angle 
 capability been a problem for any of the Choco-Moose users out there?



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[RBW] IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S vs. Paul Canti levers

[BobW]

I'm looking at the *IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S * 

 for 
a conversion from drops to swept back bars.  I originally was considering 
the Paul Canti levers, which get great reviews.  Does anyone have any 
insights on the IRD Canfam's in comparison to the Pauls??
I think they both have bearing pivots .  

thanks!!

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[RBW] Re: IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S vs. Paul Canti levers

[Mr. Ray]

I have Paul's Canti levers and was looking at the IRD Cafam levers last 
night (Soma is having 30% off sale).  To my eye, the Cafam look the same 
sans the Paul logo and Paul's groovy barrel adjusters.  Like the Paul 
levers, the Cafam have sealed bearings and are aluminum.  For the price 
(with discount) the IRD levers are an exceptional value.  If I didn't 
already have Paul levers, I would buy the IRD levers.

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:05:33 PM UTC-5 BobW wrote:

> I'm looking at the *IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S * 
> 
>  for 
> a conversion from drops to swept back bars.  I originally was considering 
> the Paul Canti levers, which get great reviews.  Does anyone have any 
> insights on the IRD Canfam's in comparison to the Pauls??
> I think they both have bearing pivots .  
>
> thanks!!
>

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[RBW] Re: IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S vs. Paul Canti levers

[Joe Bernard]

I guess there's only so many ways to make a brake lever but geez man, I 
hope IRD got some kinda sign from Paul that it was ok to do this. 

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 6:44:57 PM UTC-8 Mr. Ray wrote:

> I have Paul's Canti levers and was looking at the IRD Cafam levers last 
> night (Soma is having 30% off sale).  To my eye, the Cafam look the same 
> sans the Paul logo and Paul's groovy barrel adjusters.  Like the Paul 
> levers, the Cafam have sealed bearings and are aluminum.  For the price 
> (with discount) the IRD levers are an exceptional value.  If I didn't 
> already have Paul levers, I would buy the IRD levers.
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:05:33 PM UTC-5 BobW wrote:
>
>> I'm looking at the *IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S * 
>> 
>>  for 
>> a conversion from drops to swept back bars.  I originally was considering 
>> the Paul Canti levers, which get great reviews.  Does anyone have any 
>> insights on the IRD Canfam's in comparison to the Pauls??
>> I think they both have bearing pivots .  
>>
>> thanks!!
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Hillborne / Hilsen: touring capable?

['Paul Germain' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Bob, I have a Nitto Big Rack that Rivendell sells (sold?) on the rear. It came 
from a previous 2TT Hillborne I had and may have been purchased about 2011.
The front is outfitted with a small front Nitto Mark's Rack, double-strutted, 
and a HAR (Hub Area Rack) from Rivendell. Everything lined up OK on my 55cm 
frame. The front Mark's rack and the HAR are all attached at the mid-fork 
hourglass braze on at the front of the fork. It took a M5x30mm stainless bolt 
to penetrate the hourglass brake on fully once I added a small washer.
I don't know how these mid-fork fittings are moved around when the fame size 
changes, if they do. Here's an album of the bike with racks when I first 
purchased it (new) and built it up. If you are able to blow up the images it 
could help you. (At that time, I had single struts for the Mark's rack but 
later double-strutted it.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/albums/72157656598945451/with/19527279914/
If you have any of the other Nitto small front racks with a fixed strut 
placement, I'm not sure what to tell you. The nice thing about the Marks rack 
is its versatility in terms of strut / struts adjustability. I think Jan Heine 
at Rene Herse is making a similar one now - at a higher price. It has an 
adjustable strut but does not use the diving board though.
If you need additional images, I would do what I can. And thanks for the 
compliment on the bike. I'm very proud off it.
Paul GermainMidlothian, Va.


-Original Message-
From: Bob Warner 
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wed, Nov 16, 2022 6:27 pm
Subject: Re: [RBW] Hillborne / Hilsen: touring capable?

PaulI have the same vintage Hillborne as you.  What from rack do you use and 
does it align with the stock braze ons??Nice looking ride there too!Bob

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 16, 2022, at 5:50 PM, 'Bikie#4646' via RBW Owners Bunch 
 wrote:



In my estimation, my 2015 Sam Hillborne is pretty nearly the perfect touring 
bike for overnighters or multi-day rail trail trips. I have a Hilsen which is a 
bit more lively and a really nice mixed-surface riding bike. (Yes, I am 
spoiled.)I realize this topic has likely come up before:
Every once in a while, I wonder if the Hilsen would work for touring, but I 
tried a sport tourer for loaded trips once. It was too whippy, especially in 
the mountains. It's a rhetorical question for now, but at 76, I will eventually 
have to thin the herd. I'm happy with a dedicated bike for each purpose.My 
Hillborne on the Greenbrier River Trail, WVa. in 
Oct.https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/52435098025/in/album-72177720302972379/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/52435097390/in/album-72177720302972379/
The 
Hilsen:https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/51845027385/in/album-72177720296237851/
Paul GermainMidlothian, VA-- 
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[RBW] Re: IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S vs. Paul Canti levers

[Thomas Lawn]

I own the IRD version, and while they are nicer than pretty much every 
lever in the sub-$50 price range, they are still a far cry from the quality 
of machining you get from Paul. Most notable is the lever blades on the 
Paul levers have imperceptible play, if any, where the IRD levers can 
wiggle and rattle noticeably, even while properly adjusted. Given both of 
them are in the same class of "really expensive levers" I would just go for 
the Paul levers if there's any question between the two.

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 7:06:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I guess there's only so many ways to make a brake lever but geez man, I 
> hope IRD got some kinda sign from Paul that it was ok to do this. 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 6:44:57 PM UTC-8 Mr. Ray wrote:
>
>> I have Paul's Canti levers and was looking at the IRD Cafam levers last 
>> night (Soma is having 30% off sale).  To my eye, the Cafam look the same 
>> sans the Paul logo and Paul's groovy barrel adjusters.  Like the Paul 
>> levers, the Cafam have sealed bearings and are aluminum.  For the price 
>> (with discount) the IRD levers are an exceptional value.  If I didn't 
>> already have Paul levers, I would buy the IRD levers.
>>
>> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 8:05:33 PM UTC-5 BobW wrote:
>>
>>> I'm looking at the *IRD Brake Lever Set Cafam-S * 
>>> 
>>>  for 
>>> a conversion from drops to swept back bars.  I originally was considering 
>>> the Paul Canti levers, which get great reviews.  Does anyone have any 
>>> insights on the IRD Canfam's in comparison to the Pauls??
>>> I think they both have bearing pivots .  
>>>
>>> thanks!!
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope cabin overnighter

[Roberta]

Eric,

Thank you for all your stories, pictures, write ups and YouTube  videos. 
I’ve enjoyed them all. Everything so well done. 

Roberta

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Thank you all for the nice comments and for reading along. 
>
> Dave — That was the most weight I've had in the front bag for anything 
> more than a quick ride home from the co-op. It did effect the handling but 
> I got used to it pretty quickly. There were a few times while climbing when 
> I was trying to maneuver around a rock in the road and ended up kinda 
> tipping over, no big deal. 
>
> I'm eager to revise my packing to get the weight way down. I've attached a 
> packing list that's accurate to the best of my memory. It's a lot. I'd also 
> love to go rackless. I tried to mount the Chest from my saddle but couldn't 
> get it all worked out. I've had parts laying around for a bootlegged Pec 
> Deck for some time. 
>
> Randy — It was certainly different than my last trip out of town with a 
> fancy hotel stay for a wedding and paid for by my in-laws! 
>
> On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 9:05:11 AM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Intoxicating read! Now I have the “itch” real bad.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Nov 17, 2022, at 8:22 PM, Eric Marth  wrote:
>>
>> Ride Report: Hawksbill Slope Cabin Overnighter
>>
>>
>>
>> 14-15 November 2022
>> 64 miles, 7,250 ft elevation 
>>
>> [image: 05 Skyline 2 SM.jpg]
>>
>> This summer and early fall passed without any camping or overnight trips 
>> by bicycle. So a series of rides and ideas came together and I booked a 
>> primitive cabin for Monday night, earlier this week. I decided to make a 
>> loop of some fire roads I checked out in September with a stop for the 
>> night in the middle. Once I made the reservation I reached out to Paul R. 
>> to see if he’d like to join. To my surprise he was game for a Monday night 
>> out. 
>>
>> Temperatures Monday were predicted to peak in the high 40s and dip down 
>> well below freezing up on the mountain where we’d be staying. Rain and snow 
>> were in the cards for our return on Tuesday and warming up to 38º. With bad 
>> weather and short days in mind we met at the cracking hour of 11:00 AM. We 
>> would have preferred to start earlier but obligations sometimes call for a 
>> late start or no start at all. I unloaded my Appaloosa and did a final 
>> check of my luggage and gear. Paul arrived with his XL Susie Longbolts 
>> shoved in the back seat of his Honda. Even with the front wheel removed the 
>> wheelbase barely allowed the back doors to close. By 11:50 we were on our 
>> way, with temperatures comfortably in the high 40s. 
>>
>> [image: 02 Syria SM.jpg]
>>
>> The first eight miles took us through beautiful rolling countryside with 
>> cattle grazing, old brick houses on hills and the last rusty brown vestiges 
>> of crumbling foliage. We were on a mix of pavement and well-maintained 
>> gravel roads. The route took us through a neighborhood of small beautiful 
>> farms on a road that runs parallel to a stream. The road continued on in a 
>> way that felt like trespassing as we rode between barns, over corn and soy 
>> fields, past a tractor shed and through fields cut for hay. 
>>
>> Next we turned onto a painted highway with a posted speed of 45mph and 
>> rode along for about two miles. During our first day this was our only 
>> stretch of riding with paint on the road. We skirted around a mountain and 
>> had our first fun and short descent on a twisty paved road. We pulled into 
>> a neighborhood of old apple-packing warehouses and a convenience store with 
>> a deli, likely a good place to stop, according to Paul who ran inside. Bulk 
>> candy, camping goods, deli sandwiches and the rest. We surveyed a few bins 
>> full of local apples that were stationed out on the road. I found my local 
>> favorite, the Black Twig and we got four apples for $2. They were 
>> fantastically good. 
>>
>> [image: 03 Road SM.jpg]
>>
>> We enjoyed some more lovely country riding before starting on a long 
>> climb that took our elevation from 600 feet to 3,500 feet over 18 miles 
>> without interruption. 
>>
>> The way up is via a wooded fire and maintenance road that is at times 
>> quite rocky but easily passible by bike… if your legs are up for it. You 
>> would need a serious 4x4 vehicle with clearance to make it up these roads 
>> and the few campers and people out fishing were in one-ton trucks. There 
>> are a few steep, rocky, loose descents on the way up, short reprieves from 
>> long and steady climbing. According to my GPS we climbed for three hours. 
>> We took one snack break early on and had a few quick stops but for the most 
>> part we were grinding away. Paul longed for a bag of potato chips, craving 
>> salt and tired of all the chewing required of his nutty trail mix. 
>>
>> I don’t have many pictures from this section as I was very focussed on 
>> trying to make it to the cabin b