Re: [RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Tony DeFilippo]

Gotcha, I misread your note about tire width to be rim width...  I'm a fan 
of the cliffhangers so far on my wife's clementine for sure.

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Re: [RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Deacon Patrick]

I’m fine with wider rims, Tony. My hunqapillar will have Cliffhanger rear and 
Atlas front, QB has NoBS rims. For the riding I do, I consider a hearty rim 
essential, and wider rims maximize tire suppleness. I shifted my QB from 719s 
to the NoBS without noticable change (but the big change then was to fixed, so 
changes may have been swallowed in that). 

With abandon,
Patrick

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Re: [RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Tony DeFilippo]

Deacon Patrick - Can you expand on your preference against wider rims?  At 
what width (or weight) are you seeing diminishing returns?  What rims are 
you running your Thunder Burts and Stielicooms?  I've weighed going wider 
on my Saluki rims, currently sitting with A23's but I've got a pair of 
cliffhanger rims hanging in the garage.

Regarding the OP question, I'm running cliffhangers with Schwable Big Ones 
tubeless on my wife's Clementine (52cm) and they max out the chainstay 
clearance... I'll post a picture and measurements later.  They are quite 
comfy though.

Tony

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Re: [RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Patrick Moore]

Regarding wide tires: I agree that adding significant weight on the
perimeter of the wheels is a good way to slow down both acceleration and
handling, but I have to say that compared to the 360 gram 50 mm F Freds, the
new-to-me Big Ones on the Matthews -- 440 grams!!! (well, I've seen them
range from 420 to 460) for true 60 mm!!! -- float over sand better, and
roll even faster on pavement, at least to judge this latter by the feel of
maintaining cadences in given conditions. Really wonderful tires! Besides,
they give the already somewhat industrial looking Matthews an even more
agressive, intimidating appearance, and that's what we all want, right?
(Before you get all indignant, consider whether this remark is earnest or
not.)

OTOH, I look forward to the day, perhaps, when I'll get a second wheelset
to run skinny Snoqualmie Pass tires tubeless, or perhaps even Barlow
Passes. But for local conditions, fatter is better, ceteris paribus.

On Sun, Feb 25, 2018 at 4:46 PM, David B  wrote:

> My thought was to get the widest possible tires to fulfill my desires for
> a plus bike. I've sort of resolved not too buy another bike for a long
> while and ride what I have. I also was pondering this idea in the middle of
> a big snowfall. All snow is gone now, however the river trail I ride floods
> regularly and leaves the trail very muddy at times and I prefer wider tires
> for that type of thick mud.
> However, it's all sort of moot now as it was warm enough for Clem to take
> back his typical duties, going for rides with my son on a rear set. I did
> pick up a set of Ardents that I might play around with next winter.
>
> On Sunday, February 25, 2018 at 3:42:30 PM UTC-6, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>> I’ve found that the weight of wider tires sucks more out of all terrain
>> rides than they benifit the few spots narrower tires stuffle on — and that
>> includes winter riding (granted we’ve has a wimpy winter in terms of snow
>> depth). My Hunqapillar handles better with liteskin 2.1” ThunderBurts than
>> with wider and heavier tires. On my QB now (the only bike I’ve ridden since
>> November), 38mm Steilacooms are brilliant. Where the line is for a given
>> bike/rider/terrain/riding surface is going to vary significantly, but there
>> is a point of diminishing returns. With good riding skill, the number of
>> places I think “I wish I had a wider tire” is near nothing vs. the distance
>> I ride in total, whereas with a wider tire all those miles feel clumbsy and
>> cumbersome and plodding.
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>
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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[David B]

My thought was to get the widest possible tires to fulfill my desires for a 
plus bike. I've sort of resolved not too buy another bike for a long while 
and ride what I have. I also was pondering this idea in the middle of a big 
snowfall. All snow is gone now, however the river trail I ride floods 
regularly and leaves the trail very muddy at times and I prefer wider tires 
for that type of thick mud. 
However, it's all sort of moot now as it was warm enough for Clem to take 
back his typical duties, going for rides with my son on a rear set. I did 
pick up a set of Ardents that I might play around with next winter.

On Sunday, February 25, 2018 at 3:42:30 PM UTC-6, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> I’ve found that the weight of wider tires sucks more out of all terrain 
> rides than they benifit the few spots narrower tires stuffle on — and that 
> includes winter riding (granted we’ve has a wimpy winter in terms of snow 
> depth). My Hunqapillar handles better with liteskin 2.1” ThunderBurts than 
> with wider and heavier tires. On my QB now (the only bike I’ve ridden since 
> November), 38mm Steilacooms are brilliant. Where the line is for a given 
> bike/rider/terrain/riding surface is going to vary significantly, but there 
> is a point of diminishing returns. With good riding skill, the number of 
> places I think “I wish I had a wider tire” is near nothing vs. the distance 
> I ride in total, whereas with a wider tire all those miles feel clumbsy and 
> cumbersome and plodding. 
>
> With abandon, 
> Patrick

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Dave Grossman]

The Russells BBQ stop!

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[David B]

Hi Dave,
Nice! I'm right near the start of the trail. My thought is to build up my 
Clem to ride during the winter on snowy trails. I'm not really sure how 
practical that is, but it will give me options for winter riding. 
I've got some use Maxxis Ardents coming that I'll try out, and thanks to 
Keith I know will fit my Clem, and it'll give me an idea of how much room I 
have to work with.
If it does seem to have more room, there are a few 29 x 2.6" tires 
available that I think might fit:
Maxxis Rekon
Maxxis Forekaster
Schwalbe Nobby Nic

Reviews show that all of these measure out around 60-65mm wide, which I 
know will fit the back, wondering about the fork. I won't be running 
fenders.

David
River Grove, IL

On Monday, February 12, 2018 at 3:08:50 PM UTC-6, Dave Grossman wrote:
>
> I ride the very same DPRT on my Jones with 2.3 Big Ones on Duallys.  
> Love it.  I also ride it on my Pug.

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Dave Grossman]

I ride the very same DPRT on my Jones with 2.3 Big Ones on Duallys.  
Love it.  I also ride it on my Pug.

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[tc]

Thanks Keith.  I ended up ordering a pair of 2.35 Vittoria Mezcal's, the 
"TNT" version (Tubes or No Tubes).  Great reviews re: bite, transition from 
center to edge transition on turns, rolling resistance, puncture 
resistance, and relative quiet on pavement.  Not too heavy, either.  Once I 
have the bike and have mounted and tested them I'll post a report...that 
may be a couple of weeks off though.

On Sunday, February 11, 2018 at 8:26:36 PM UTC-5, iamkeith wrote:
>
> Tom - regarding the 2x chainring wide/low configuration:  It's not a 
> problem at all - you just might need a longer bb spindle
>

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Jon BALER]

I enjoy my Surly Extraterrestrial 29 x 2.5 tires for mixed surface riding.  
They are heavy on the scale, but roll very well.  I use them on mixed 
surfaces with non-technical singletrack (e.g. MoCo trails here in 
Maryland).  Since they don't have tall knobs, they'll fit in most 29er 
frames.  I have ran them in Salsa Fargo Gen 1 and Velo Orange Piolet.

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[iamkeith]

Tom - regarding the 2x chainring wide/low configuration:  It's not a 
problem at all - you just might need a longer bb spindle.  That's what I 
have on mine, with a pant guard in the outer position.   Fender needed 
notching, but tire is fine.  One great thing about this setup, that I've 
never heard anyone else talk about, is how well this configuration actually 
works with these super-long chainstays.  I can freely use all 9 speeds in 
the rear, on either the small or the big ring, without the chainline ever 
being too crossed up, or rubbing on the derailleur or adjacent gears.  Best 
gearing ever! 

On Sunday, February 11, 2018 at 4:58:40 PM UTC-7, tc wrote:
>
> David,
> I'm curious about this too, as I have a 59 Clem H arriving this coming 
> Friday (though I don't need an aggressive knobby since fairly tame 
> singletrack will only be about 30% of my usage .. the other 60% being 
> divided by road and gravel).  Skinnier tires on a 59 Clem make it look a 
> bit malnourished to my eye...plus with all I've read about wide tires and 
> low pressure being as fast, why not, right?
>
> There was a thread a while back where a Clem owner voiced concern over the 
> wide/low double crank *possibly *not allowing the claimed 60cm / 2.5" 
> Clem max tire width without chain interference.  Never confirmed, though.  
> Do you think a 2.5 in back would cause interference?
>
> Tom
>
> PS.  FWIW, I've also read more than once on this forum that those who've 
> tried tires at or near the max width eventually downsized to the 2.25 to 
> 2.0 range because the bike felt to big and ponderous.  Though I don't 
> recall their usage.
>
>
>
> On Sunday, February 11, 2018 at 5:24:19 PM UTC-5, David B wrote:
>>
>> I was thinking of building up a plus frameset - that ended up falling 
>> through - so I came up with this idea of adding a second wheelset for my 
>> Clem and running the largest tires possible. When I first got my Clem I had 
>> it build up with 2.35" Schwalbe Big Ones which ran true to size and fit 
>> with SKS fenders. Tight spot was the front, but I'd think something 
>> slightly larger would fit without fenders up front, definitely would fit 
>> something larger in the back.
>>
>> So, wondering what tire recommendations the group has for tires in the 
>> 2.3 - 2.5 range in a 29er. 
>> Bonus points if you have measurements for width on specific rims.
>> If you have anything to sell, I'd be interested as well.
>> Thinking about Velocity Cliffhangers or Sun Rhyno Lite rims. Any other 
>> wider rim brake rims available in 29"?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> David
>> in deep snow in River Grove, IL thinking I could hit up the river trail 
>> with this potential build
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[iamkeith]

When I was first building up my 59cm Clem, I used 2.4 Maxis Ardents.  I can 
only find the few random photos below, though.   They fit the frame just 
fine but, as you note, the front would likely be too tight with a fender in 
use.  (Kind of a nitpick of mine actually - that something that is as 
easily adjusted as the length of the fork legs would end up being the 
limiting factor in the ability to use fenders.)  

Prior to the advent of plus-sized tires, Ardents were consistently the 
biggest tire you could find, as well as one of the best performers in terms 
of traction, weight and rolling speed.They are VERY tall, which is why 
I ended up switching them out and going with Super Motos - which are of 
course the predecessor to your Big Ones.  (I can barely straddle the frame 
as it is, and the extra height was just a little too much for comfort. 
However if/when I have a custom size of this bike made, I'll likely go back 
to these tires.)  So I would think that just about anything else would 
fit.  Whereas Ardents are true to size or possibly even a bit bigger than 
labeled, just about every other tire is smaller.

Sorry - I don't remember the mounted width on my Clem's rims, but it 
wouldn't be that useful anyway because they were too narrow (Velocity 
Dyads).  However, the same rear tire measured right around 63mm wide on 
Velocity Duallys, on my mountain bike.   Those rims are too wide for the 
Clem and don't have a brake track anyway, but you can likely find plenty of 
measurements cited for different rims by doing a web search on MTBR.  I'd 
use Velocity Cliffhangers if it were me, and if money weren't an object.  
Otherwise Rhyno Lites are a great choice.










On Sunday, February 11, 2018 at 3:24:19 PM UTC-7, David B wrote:
>
> I was thinking of building up a plus frameset - that ended up falling 
> through - so I came up with this idea of adding a second wheelset for my 
> Clem and running the largest tires possible. When I first got my Clem I had 
> it build up with 2.35" Schwalbe Big Ones which ran true to size and fit 
> with SKS fenders. Tight spot was the front, but I'd think something 
> slightly larger would fit without fenders up front, definitely would fit 
> something larger in the back.
>
> So, wondering what tire recommendations the group has for tires in the 2.3 
> - 2.5 range in a 29er. 
> Bonus points if you have measurements for width on specific rims.
> If you have anything to sell, I'd be interested as well.
> Thinking about Velocity Cliffhangers or Sun Rhyno Lite rims. Any other 
> wider rim brake rims available in 29"?
>
> Thanks,
> David
> in deep snow in River Grove, IL thinking I could hit up the river trail 
> with this potential build
>

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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[Jim A]

I have tires I've ridden and now consider selling:

Maxxis Ardent 29 x 2.4 skinwall pair
Aggresive knobs. Pretty light & supple sidewall, nice feeling tire, plus 
good looking.

Surly Extraterrestrial 29 x 2.5 pair
Heavy, but smooth-rolling tread for hardpack/street surface. Nice to feel 
bomb-proof.

I can take measurements mounted on Rhyno lites or certain other rims. Let 
me know if there's more info I can give, or PM for buying.


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[RBW] Re: 29 x 2.3-2.5 Knobby Tire & Rim Recommendations for Clem.

[tc]

David,
I'm curious about this too, as I have a 59 Clem H arriving this coming 
Friday (though I don't need an aggressive knobby since fairly tame 
singletrack will only be about 30% of my usage .. the other 60% being 
divided by road and gravel).  Skinnier tires on a 59 Clem make it look a 
bit malnourished to my eye...plus with all I've read about wide tires and 
low pressure being as fast, why not, right?

There was a thread a while back where a Clem owner voiced concern over the 
wide/low double crank *possibly *not allowing the claimed 60cm / 2.5" Clem 
max tire width without chain interference.  Never confirmed, though.  Do 
you think a 2.5 in back would cause interference?

Tom

PS.  FWIW, I've also read more than once on this forum that those who've 
tried tires at or near the max width eventually downsized to the 2.25 to 
2.0 range because the bike felt to big and ponderous.  Though I don't 
recall their usage.



On Sunday, February 11, 2018 at 5:24:19 PM UTC-5, David B wrote:
>
> I was thinking of building up a plus frameset - that ended up falling 
> through - so I came up with this idea of adding a second wheelset for my 
> Clem and running the largest tires possible. When I first got my Clem I had 
> it build up with 2.35" Schwalbe Big Ones which ran true to size and fit 
> with SKS fenders. Tight spot was the front, but I'd think something 
> slightly larger would fit without fenders up front, definitely would fit 
> something larger in the back.
>
> So, wondering what tire recommendations the group has for tires in the 2.3 
> - 2.5 range in a 29er. 
> Bonus points if you have measurements for width on specific rims.
> If you have anything to sell, I'd be interested as well.
> Thinking about Velocity Cliffhangers or Sun Rhyno Lite rims. Any other 
> wider rim brake rims available in 29"?
>
> Thanks,
> David
> in deep snow in River Grove, IL thinking I could hit up the river trail 
> with this potential build
>

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