Re: [sage-devel] A suggestion for "make"

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2015-05-24 20:41, john_perry_usm wrote:

Does it seem reasonable to add a prompt at the beginning
of the Makefile that points this out, suggests './sage -b' if they just
want to fix some changes
I am very much against this. The normal way to rebuild is to use "make", 
while "./sage -b" should only be used if you know what you're doing.


I have seen several bug reports which were just people forgetting to run 
"make". So my impression is that we need to advertise "./sage -b" less, 
not more.


I agree with Simon that the docs are annoying. However, I usually run 
"make" in a different shell window. I can already run and test Sage 
while the documentation is still building.


Jeroen.

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Re: [sage-devel] A short description of what "Sage days" are on the wiki page

[William Stein]

On Mon, May 25, 2015 at 12:05 PM, Nathann Cohen  wrote:
> Hello everybody,
>
> I just noticed that the wiki page on "Sage Days" [2] can be reached
> quite easily from Sage's website [1]. Thus, we can expect many persons
> (ignorant of our customs and traditions) to read it.
>
> This page is actually quite clean and up-to-date, but it was lacking a
> short paragraph at the top of the page explaining to newcomers what
> exactly Sage days are.
>
> I added a short one, which everybody can freely [edit/change totally].
> It is my first time editing this page, and I thought it would be a
> good idea to write here to tell everybody "how public" that page is.

I changed it to the following: "Sage Days are gatherings of people
interested in SageMath development. Contributors, enthusiastic users,
and newcomers often attend. Sage Days are organized by a wide range of
people around the globe."

>
> Cheers,
>
> Nathann
>
> [1] "Home" menu, then "SageMath days" at http://www.sagemath.org/
> [2] http://wiki.sagemath.org/Workshops
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: sage binaries useless for development

[William Stein]

On Mon, May 25, 2015 at 12:44 PM, Dima Pasechnik  wrote:
>
>
> On Monday, 25 May 2015 20:17:49 UTC+1, William wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Just curious -- is this intentional?
>>
>> 1. Build sage.
>> 2. Type "./sage -bdist ..."
>> 3. Extract the resulting tarball elsewhere
>> 4. Type "make" inside the extracted directory.  BOOM!  Total disaster.
>
>
> Has it ever worked?

Yes,  because the first version of "sage -bdist" was a 1-liner that
just tar'd up the exact installation.  Then we kept removing things to
save disk space...

My unusual, but I think a very important, basic design principle with
sage binaries was that it was *super important* that one could do
development with them.  The idea is that a person would play with Sage
(as a user), then with minimal effort switch to doing some development
and contributing.  This has clearly been completely lost in the
current binaries.   It's also been lost in SageMathCloud -- but I hope
to get it back there (e.g., there could be a link the output of a
docstring or source code of a function in a worksheet, which would
setup a dev environment, and get you going editing that very
function...)

> IMHO nothing beyond 'sage -b' worked in this case...
>
>
>>
>> It starts by trying to download tarballs from the internet, etc...
>>
>
> this is certainly worse than it was.
>
>>
>>  -- William
>>
>> --
>> William (http://wstein.org)
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Web Interface

[William Stein]

On Mon, May 25, 2015 at 1:52 PM, mmarco  wrote:
> I am really impressed by the fact that a 10 year old can be fascinated by
> sage.

Find one and help them play with a worksheet, and you'll be surprised.
My 7 year old nephew gets pretty fascinated by Sage too.  It just
helps to work *with* them, since they probably don't know anything
about Python...

>
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[sage-devel] Re: documentation bug: git-trac instructions don't mention git commit

[Volker Braun]

The preceeding section explains how to make local edits and commit them 
(see 
http://doc.sagemath.org/html/en/developer/walk_through.html#commits-snapshots). 
The only thing that the "git-trac section" adds is how to exchange commits 
over the internet. This is why there is no special mention of how to 
commit, its exactly the same. Maybe the developer guide should just link 
back to the section on making commits?



On Tuesday, May 26, 2015 at 12:22:03 AM UTC+2, Ursula Whitcher wrote:
>
> I found a documentation "bug": literally following the instructions for 
> ticket creation and updates at 
> http://doc.sagemath.org/html/en/developer/git_trac.html results in the 
> publication of empty tickets, because there's no mention of *committing* 
> changes.  This is now ticket 18504:
>
> http://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/18504
>
> If I were to fix these instructions, I would add something along the lines 
> of, "Now, edit some files.  You can save the changes you have made by 
> typing 'git commit -a' and recording a commit message.  Your commit message 
> should be a short summary of what you have done, featuring an evocative 
> verb."  However, I am by no means a git expert.  Are there other important 
> commands we should recommend here?
>
> --Ursula.
>
>

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[sage-devel] documentation bug: git-trac instructions don't mention git commit

[Ursula Whitcher]

I found a documentation "bug": literally following the instructions for 
ticket creation and updates at 
http://doc.sagemath.org/html/en/developer/git_trac.html results in the 
publication of empty tickets, because there's no mention of *committing* 
changes.  This is now ticket 18504:

http://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/18504

If I were to fix these instructions, I would add something along the lines 
of, "Now, edit some files.  You can save the changes you have made by 
typing 'git commit -a' and recording a commit message.  Your commit message 
should be a short summary of what you have done, featuring an evocative 
verb."  However, I am by no means a git expert.  Are there other important 
commands we should recommend here?

--Ursula.

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[sage-devel] Re: Web Interface

[mmarco]

I am really impressed by the fact that a 10 year old can be fascinated by 
sage.

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[sage-devel] Re: sage binaries useless for development

[Dima Pasechnik]

On Monday, 25 May 2015 20:17:49 UTC+1, William wrote:
>
> Hi, 
>
> Just curious -- is this intentional? 
>
> 1. Build sage. 
> 2. Type "./sage -bdist ..." 
> 3. Extract the resulting tarball elsewhere 
> 4. Type "make" inside the extracted directory.  BOOM!  Total disaster. 
>

Has it ever worked?
IMHO nothing beyond 'sage -b' worked in this case...

 

> It starts by trying to download tarballs from the internet, etc... 
>
>
this is certainly worse than it was.
 

>  -- William 
>
> -- 
> William (http://wstein.org) 
>

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: SageManifolds 0.8

[Eric Gourgoulhon]

Le lundi 25 mai 2015 19:21:47 UTC+2, William a écrit :
>
> Hi, 
>
> SageManifolds 0.8 is now available by default in SageMathCloud. 
>
>
Thanks!

Eric.

PS: an example SMC worksheet is here 

.

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[sage-devel] sage binaries useless for development

[William Stein]

Hi,

Just curious -- is this intentional?

1. Build sage.
2. Type "./sage -bdist ..."
3. Extract the resulting tarball elsewhere
4. Type "make" inside the extracted directory.  BOOM!  Total disaster.
It starts by trying to download tarballs from the internet, etc...

 -- William

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[sage-devel] A short description of what "Sage days" are on the wiki page

[Nathann Cohen]

Hello everybody,

I just noticed that the wiki page on "Sage Days" [2] can be reached
quite easily from Sage's website [1]. Thus, we can expect many persons
(ignorant of our customs and traditions) to read it.

This page is actually quite clean and up-to-date, but it was lacking a
short paragraph at the top of the page explaining to newcomers what
exactly Sage days are.

I added a short one, which everybody can freely [edit/change totally].
It is my first time editing this page, and I thought it would be a
good idea to write here to tell everybody "how public" that page is.

Cheers,

Nathann

[1] "Home" menu, then "SageMath days" at http://www.sagemath.org/
[2] http://wiki.sagemath.org/Workshops

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[sage-devel] What kind of pictures to documentation?

[Jori Mäntysalo]

Nathann Cohen made it possible to add pictures to documentation. So, what now?

Let's start with concrete example: complements of an element on a  
lattice. It could be something like


.. PLOT::

L=LatticePoset({0:['A', 'x', 'B'], 'A': ['y'], 'x': ['y',  
'C'], 'B'$
g=L.plot(figsize=3, vertex_colors={'gray': [0,1,'x',  
'y'], '#ff$

sphinx_plot(g)

Plot-part of docs will be generated without dot2tex, so the result is  
not so beatyful. And the whole example might be bad. But a deeper  
question:


Is this kind of picture useful as a part of documentation? I.e. do we  
want pictures showing what is some mathematical thing, to some degree  
teaching mathematics to reader of documentation?


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Re: [sage-devel] Re: SageManifolds 0.8

[William Stein]

Hi,

SageManifolds 0.8 is now available by default in SageMathCloud.

William

On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 3:01 AM, Eric Gourgoulhon
 wrote:
> The base code for parallelization in SageManifolds 0.8 has been submitted as
> ticket #18100 (ready for review).
> Note that this regards only the parallelization of tensor operations on free
> modules. In SageManifolds 0.8, there are additional parallelization features
> (e.g. in computation of a Riemann tensor), but they pertain to the
> differential part (not submitted yet).
>
> Eric.
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Why \wedge works but \vee does not?

[Jori Mäntysalo]

On Mon, 25 May 2015, John H Palmieri wrote:


For me, it works using a raw string:

    title=r"$A \wedge B=1$ and $A \vee B=0$".


Thanks, it works! (Of course... I stupid.)

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[sage-devel] Re: Web Interface

[Simon King]

Hi John,

On 2015-05-25, John Foster  wrote:
> Is there any web based or even console based interface to all of Sage. 
> Just wondering if I missed it. I found this, it's not what I need just 
> an example:
>
> https://mathway.com/

As was pointed out by Dima, SageMathCloud provides a web interface to
SageMath.

> I'm looking for a way for "newbies", non-programmers or students, to use 
> Sage. This includes myself as I'm not a mathematician. However my 
> youngest grandson (10) is fascinated by Sage & I feel this would help 
> him maintain that interest and grow. I also would like a process for 
> using Sage more easily myself for working in the areas of physics that 
> I'm interested in. Any thoughts on at least a symbolic entry keyboard.

Sage has an extensive documentation (see http://doc.sagemath.org/). 
However, one must not forget that SageMath is a computer algebra system
and thus some mathematical background is very useful (hopefully your 10
year old grandson will not soon be frustrated). Also, basic programming
(conditional clauses, loops etc) could be useful, too.

>From my point of view, one strength of SageMath is the fact that it relies
on Python (a mainstream programming language), whereas many other
computer algebra systems invented a custom programming language. So,
with SageMath, one learns something that is useful also outside of
computer algebra.

Best regards,
Simon

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[sage-devel] Re: Why \wedge works but \vee does not?

[John H Palmieri]

For me, it works using a raw string: 

title=r"$A \wedge B=1$ and $A \vee B=0$". 

Have you tried that? (I don't know if it's a bug: I think it's always safer 
to use raw strings when the strings contain backslashes.)

  John


On Monday, May 25, 2015 at 1:48:30 AM UTC-7, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:
>
> Strange: 
>
> L=LatticePoset({0:['A', 'x', 'B'], 'A': ['y'], 'x': ['y', 'C'], 'B': 
> ['C'], 'y': [1], 'C': [1]}) 
> L.show(figsize=3, vertex_colors={'gray': [0,1,'x', 'y'], '#ff': ['A'], 
> '#00ff00': ['B', 'C']}, title="$A \wedge B=1$ and $A \vee B=0$.") 
>
> It seems that \wedge works, but \vee does not. Already documented bug? 
>
> -- 
> Jori Mäntysalo 
>

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[sage-devel] Re: Web Interface

[Dima Pasechnik]

On Monday, 25 May 2015 15:04:32 UTC+1, John Foster wrote:
>
> Is there any web based or even console based interface to all of Sage. 


cloud.sagemath.com
 

>
> Just wondering if I missed it. I found this, it's not what I need just 
> an example: 
>
> https://mathway.com/ 
>
> I'm looking for a way for "newbies", non-programmers or students, to use 
> Sage. This includes myself as I'm not a mathematician. However my 
> youngest grandson (10) is fascinated by Sage & I feel this would help 
> him maintain that interest and grow. I also would like a process for 
> using Sage more easily myself for working in the areas of physics that 
> I'm interested in. Any thoughts on at least a symbolic entry keyboard. 
> Thanks 
>
> -- 
> John Foster 
> JW Foster & Associates 
>
>

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[sage-devel] Web Interface

[John Foster]

Is there any web based or even console based interface to all of Sage. 
Just wondering if I missed it. I found this, it's not what I need just 
an example:


https://mathway.com/

I'm looking for a way for "newbies", non-programmers or students, to use 
Sage. This includes myself as I'm not a mathematician. However my 
youngest grandson (10) is fascinated by Sage & I feel this would help 
him maintain that interest and grow. I also would like a process for 
using Sage more easily myself for working in the areas of physics that 
I'm interested in. Any thoughts on at least a symbolic entry keyboard.

Thanks

--
John Foster
JW Foster & Associates

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Why \wedge works but \vee does not?

[Jori Mäntysalo]

On Mon, 25 May 2015, Volker Braun wrote:


Looks like a bug in matplotlib's internal TeX processor. It does understand
e.g. \curlyvee which, one would have thought, is more obscure. 


OK. Somebody wants to open ticket for them?

At least this works with newest version available for Fedora 21, so it not 
just missing font (or has been corrected):


import numpy as np
from matplotlib.pyplot import figure, show
fig = figure()
ax = fig.add_subplot(111, axisbg='y')
ax.set_title(r'$A \wedge B \vee C$')
show()

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[sage-devel] Re: Why \wedge works but \vee does not?

[Volker Braun]

Looks like a bug in matplotlib's internal TeX processor. It does understand 
e.g. \curlyvee which, one would have thought, is more obscure.
 

On Monday, May 25, 2015 at 10:48:30 AM UTC+2, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:
>
> Strange: 
>
> L=LatticePoset({0:['A', 'x', 'B'], 'A': ['y'], 'x': ['y', 'C'], 'B': 
> ['C'], 'y': [1], 'C': [1]}) 
> L.show(figsize=3, vertex_colors={'gray': [0,1,'x', 'y'], '#ff': ['A'], 
> '#00ff00': ['B', 'C']}, title="$A \wedge B=1$ and $A \vee B=0$.") 
>
> It seems that \wedge works, but \vee does not. Already documented bug? 
>
> -- 
> Jori Mäntysalo 
>

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[sage-devel] Why \wedge works but \vee does not?

[Jori Mäntysalo]

Strange:

L=LatticePoset({0:['A', 'x', 'B'], 'A': ['y'], 'x': ['y', 'C'], 'B': ['C'], 
'y': [1], 'C': [1]})
L.show(figsize=3, vertex_colors={'gray': [0,1,'x', 'y'], '#ff': ['A'], '#00ff00': 
['B', 'C']}, title="$A \wedge B=1$ and $A \vee B=0$.")

It seems that \wedge works, but \vee does not. Already documented bug?

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