Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[kcrisman]

On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-4, Samuel Lelievre wrote:
>
> Let me try to make the case for making JupyterLab a standard package.
>
> (1)
>
> According to a recent post on the Jupyter blog [0],
>
> - JupyterLab is ready for daily use.
> - JupyterLab will eventually replace the classic Jupyter Notebook.
>

"JupyterLab 1.0 will eventually replace the classic Jupyter Notebook. 
Throughout this transition, the same notebook document format will be 
supported by both the classic Notebook and JupyterLab." 

So do we have to yet *again* reimplement notebook interactivity?  How 
different are they?  How does that affect people wanting to upgrade their 
notebooks - let alone from sagenb?  What about the CoCalc .sagews format? 
 And the CoCalc Jupyter notebooks?  I feel like there are some interesting 
unanswered questions here.

Certainly optional package is fine, though, as long as it works properly on 
all supported platforms.

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2018-03-13 23:26, Samuel Lelièvre wrote:

My view is that since it's pip-installable, it's as though it were
already an optional package.


I have a very different view of that. "optional" implies a level of 
official support in SageMath. In particular, it should actually build 
and work properly on all supported systems.


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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2018-03-14 02:08, John H Palmieri wrote:

I feel like we need another class of package: "pending" (or perhaps some
other name) = those which we propose to make standard soon.


I agree with Vincent: the build system doesn't need to know that.

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2018-03-13 23:26, Samuel Lelièvre wrote:

What would it mean to make it an optional package?


Exactly the same as making it a standard package, except that the type 
is "optional" instead of "standard".


Once you do that, it will be trivial to make it a standard package by 
just changing the type.


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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Vincent Delecroix]

I am not sure there is a need for such distinction. As a user, you
mostly don't care. As a developer, you know the "real" status.

Vincent

On 14/03/2018 02:08, John H Palmieri wrote:

I feel like we need another class of package: "pending" (or perhaps some
other name) = those which we propose to make standard soon. Most optional
packages are not intended to be converted to standard, as far as I can
tell, so "optional" isn't the appropriate tag in this case.

   John


On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 4:29:06 PM UTC-7, Dima Pasechnik wrote:




On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 10:26:55 PM UTC, Samuel Lelievre wrote:


2018-03-13 20:01 GMT+01:00 Jeroen Demeyer :


On 2018-03-13 18:33, Samuel Lelievre wrote:


Let me try to make the case for making JupyterLab a standard package.


What is your case for *NOT* making it an optional package first?


My view is that since it's pip-installable, it's as though it were
already an optional package.

What would it mean to make it an optional package? Maybe
I just don't understand that.



basically, make up a slot in build/pkgs/ with some mostly meta-data.

And we need a vote. Yes, I vote for make it optional, or better.

  





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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[John H Palmieri]

I feel like we need another class of package: "pending" (or perhaps some 
other name) = those which we propose to make standard soon. Most optional 
packages are not intended to be converted to standard, as far as I can 
tell, so "optional" isn't the appropriate tag in this case.

  John


On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 4:29:06 PM UTC-7, Dima Pasechnik wrote:
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 10:26:55 PM UTC, Samuel Lelievre wrote:
>>
>> 2018-03-13 20:01 GMT+01:00 Jeroen Demeyer :
>> >
>> > On 2018-03-13 18:33, Samuel Lelievre wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Let me try to make the case for making JupyterLab a standard package.
>> >
>> > What is your case for *NOT* making it an optional package first?
>>
>> My view is that since it's pip-installable, it's as though it were
>> already an optional package.
>>
>> What would it mean to make it an optional package? Maybe
>> I just don't understand that.
>>
>
> basically, make up a slot in build/pkgs/ with some mostly meta-data.
>
> And we need a vote. Yes, I vote for make it optional, or better.
>
>  
>

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Dima Pasechnik]

On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 10:26:55 PM UTC, Samuel Lelievre wrote:
>
> 2018-03-13 20:01 GMT+01:00 Jeroen Demeyer  >:
> >
> > On 2018-03-13 18:33, Samuel Lelievre wrote:
> >>
> >> Let me try to make the case for making JupyterLab a standard package.
> >
> > What is your case for *NOT* making it an optional package first?
>
> My view is that since it's pip-installable, it's as though it were
> already an optional package.
>
> What would it mean to make it an optional package? Maybe
> I just don't understand that.
>

basically, make up a slot in build/pkgs/ with some mostly meta-data.

And we need a vote. Yes, I vote for make it optional, or better.

 

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Samuel Lelièvre]

2018-03-13 20:01 GMT+01:00 Jeroen Demeyer :
>
> On 2018-03-13 18:33, Samuel Lelievre wrote:
>>
>> Let me try to make the case for making JupyterLab a standard package.
>
> What is your case for *NOT* making it an optional package first?

My view is that since it's pip-installable, it's as though it were
already an optional package.

What would it mean to make it an optional package? Maybe
I just don't understand that.

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2018-03-13 18:33, Samuel Lelievre wrote:

Let me try to make the case for making JupyterLab a standard package.


What is your case for *NOT* making it an optional package first?

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Samuel Lelievre]

Let me try to make the case for making JupyterLab a standard package.

(1)

According to a recent post on the Jupyter blog [0],

- JupyterLab is ready for daily use.
- JupyterLab will eventually replace the classic Jupyter Notebook.
- JupyterLab has been over three years in the making, with over 11,000 
commits
  and 2,000 releases of npm and Python packages. Over 100 contributors from
  the broader community have helped build JupyterLab in addition to our core
  JupyterLab developers.

See [1] for other posts tagged "jupyterlab" on the Jupyter blog.

(2)

ThebeLab [2] is a reimplementation of Thebe as a thin layer on top of
JupyterLab (making it more sustainable), and is needed for ongoing work [3]
to restore the possibility of making the Sage documentation live, which
we had with the legacy SageNB notebook.

(3)

I want everybody to be able to try it out by typing

sage -n jupyterlab

as was allowed by [4], without having to first run

sage -pip install jupyterlab

(4)

To address William's question, the dependency on Python3 is not an obstacle,
since (as Dima mentioned) Python3 has been a standard package in Sage for a
while now. Actually, a sage-devel discussion started on 2017-11-29 and
reactivated on 2018-03-13 (today), reports amazing progress on making Sage
work with Python3.

(References)

[0] [2018-02-20] JupyterLab is ready for users
https://blog.jupyter.org/jupyterlab-is-ready-for-users-5a6f039b8906

[1] posts tagged "jupyterlab" on the Jupyter blog
https://blog.jupyter.org/tagged/jupyterlab

[2] Thebelab -- turning static HTML pages into live documents
https://github.com/minrk/thebelab

[3] SageMath #24593: Upgrade from Thebe to ThebeLab for live documentation 
support
https://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/24593

[4] SageMath #22215: Allow "sage -n jupyterlab"
https://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/22215

[5] sage-devel discussion: A little Python 3 status update
https://groups.google.com/d/topic/sage-devel/Ty-OQN7Avfc/discussion

Kind regards,
Samuel

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[kcrisman]

On Tuesday, March 6, 2018 at 4:58:53 AM UTC-5, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:
>
> On 2018-03-06 00:29, Samuel Lelièvre wrote: 
> > I opened a ticket to make JupyterLab a standard package: 
> > 
> > https://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/24904 
> > 
> > Any opinions? 
>
> Shouldn't it be an optional package first? 
>
>
Ordinarily, yes. 

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2018-03-06 00:29, Samuel Lelièvre wrote:

I opened a ticket to make JupyterLab a standard package:

https://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/24904

Any opinions?


Shouldn't it be an optional package first?

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[Dima Pasechnik]

On Monday, March 5, 2018 at 11:33:57 PM UTC, William wrote:
>
> On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 3:29 PM, Samuel Lelièvre 
>  wrote: 
> > I opened a ticket to make JupyterLab a standard package: 
> > 
> > https://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/24904 
> > 
> > Any opinions? 
>
> There is a murky discussion about making JupyterLab Python3-only maybe 
> as part of the 1.0 release, with the argument partly being as a carrot 
> to force people switch to python3: 
>
> https://github.com/jupyterlab/jupyterlab/issues/2096# 
>
> If we always build and always include python3 with every sage these 
> days, then this isn't a problem.  Otherwise, it could be for a while. 
>
But Python3 is already a standard Sage package.
(sage-sh) $ python3
Python 3.6.1 (default, Feb 15 2018, 11:44:42) 
[GCC 7.2.0] on linux
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> 
 

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Re: [sage-devel] Make JupyterLab a standard package

[William Stein]

On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 3:29 PM, Samuel Lelièvre
 wrote:
> I opened a ticket to make JupyterLab a standard package:
>
> https://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/24904
>
> Any opinions?

There is a murky discussion about making JupyterLab Python3-only maybe
as part of the 1.0 release, with the argument partly being as a carrot
to force people switch to python3:

https://github.com/jupyterlab/jupyterlab/issues/2096#

If we always build and always include python3 with every sage these
days, then this isn't a problem.  Otherwise, it could be for a while.

 -- William

>
> Samuel
>
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-- 
William (http://wstein.org)

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