RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Right. My bad for going iron. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 04:21:18 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I should amend to say the gas cloud feeds on hemoglobin... - Original Message - From: "Keith Johnson" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, December 6, 2009 2:24:27 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... Those were the days. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the directo
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
That last did widen my eyes, Keith. Again, maybe it's just me and my oddness. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 04:44:30 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I love Obsession, from the way the gas cloud creature was able to leave normal space--being there, but not there--due to its use of gravity, to the final explosion, when Kirk and Garavick beam up in the aftermath of that antimatter blast. Probably improbable, but still great stuff, especially McCoy in the transporter room muttering "Crazy way to travel, scattering a man's atoms halfway across the galaxy", and Scotty's "Got 'em--or a piece of 'em anyway", followed by Spock's cool, "Cross-circuiting to Across-circuting to B". Good stuff! And as a kid, I remember going "Wowww!", when they said there was a cubic inch of antimatter in that bomb, but it was more powerful than ten thousand cobalt bombs. Boggles the mind... - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Sunday, December 6, 2009 3:51:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Thanks for the memory jogs, Keith! As for "Obsession", it just didn't seem to jog right with me. Something about the timing or the acting... I don't know. And I gave it every opportunity, whenever it aired. Maybe it's just me being picky. Old age does that. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2009 07:24:27 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. - Original Message ----- From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Found
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
No idea, Mr Worf. My best notion is that they wanted some technology in view, and an android Second Officer just wasn't enough. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: hellomahog...@gmail.com Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2009 22:28:02 -0800 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 My question about ST is why didn't they make Jordy some new eyes? On Sun, Dec 6, 2009 at 8:47 PM, Keith Johnson wrote: No, I get that, I'm just saying even an inner eyelid wouldn't protect Spock's eyes from light that was calibrated to be at the intensity encountered near their son. It'd blind him, and i doubt even his optic nerves and retinas could heal. - Original Message - From: "Mr. Worf" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, December 6, 2009 5:30:49 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 It kind of fits with the mythology of the creation of Vulcan. Their sun changed stages and burned away most of the planet's vegetation. If the same thing happened here we would probably have evolved with different kinds of eyes as well. Humans evolved differently to adapt to certain conditions to suit their environment, but I don't think that we would have developed a 2nd eyelid like an alligator. (Eskimos developed sunglasses to block out the sun's rays.) On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Keith Johnson wrote: The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
My question about ST is why didn't they make Jordy some new eyes? On Sun, Dec 6, 2009 at 8:47 PM, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > No, I get that, I'm just saying even an inner eyelid wouldn't protect > Spock's eyes from light that was calibrated to be at the intensity > encountered near their son. It'd blind him, and i doubt even his optic > nerves and retinas could heal. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Mr. Worf" > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Sunday, December 6, 2009 5:30:49 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul > Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > > > > It kind of fits with the mythology of the creation of Vulcan. Their sun > changed stages and burned away most of the planet's vegetation. If the same > thing happened here we would probably have evolved with different kinds of > eyes as well. Humans evolved differently to adapt to certain conditions to > suit their environment, but I don't think that we would have developed a 2nd > eyelid like an alligator. (Eskimos developed sunglasses to block out the > sun's rays.) > > On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Keith Johnson > wrote: > >> >> >> The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that >> feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL >> travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and >> "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached >> themselves to people. >> >> Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they >> couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and >> radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. >> WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? >> And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no >> sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect >> agains the brightness they were using. >> >> >> >> >> >> - Original Message - >> From: "Martin Baxter" >> To: "SciFiNoir2" >> Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >> Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul >> Greengrass quits Bourne 4 >> >> >> >> As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two >> whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos >> creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the >> one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked >> people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. >> >> As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but >> epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at >> times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he >> openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading >> any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. >> >> >> "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in >> bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant >> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik >> >> >> >> >> -- >> To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >> From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net >> Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + >> Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul >> Greengrass quits Bourne 4 >> >> >> >> Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? >> I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's >> Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? >> I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but >> couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. >> And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, >> any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. >> >> >> - Original Message - >> From: "Martin Baxter" >> To: "SciFiNoir2" >> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >> Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: P
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
That would explain the stabbing pains in my head whenever I get on this line of discussion... "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 17:50:12 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 See you get the need to change things for a broader audience, but most fans do not. So, many aneurisms result. I’m not putting down the decision to make the changes, but saying that I empathize with the fans of the book From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:28 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 It's coming back now, Tracey... the protagonist of the book was a physicist who worked at CERN, dealing with the events. Another thing tha tthey had to change, because who would've gotten a physicist as the hero of a drama? Fine for "The Big Bang Theory", but not when gunfire is involved. Closest thing to a physicist as a hero has come via the works of Travis S Taylor, and his representations are boring at best and overtly comical at worst. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 15:42:53 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There is no way you could have liked the movie. However, Wikipedia has pretty much the synopsis of the FlashForward’s book version described and it has more focus on the science and the scifi than being a police procedural. I do not think cops are even a major feature of the book. I do not think I would like the series if I had read the book From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 3:17 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Again, Tracey, true. But I can't help but wonder what gave the producers the notion that "Jumper" could be made into escapist fare. The book itself was grim, almost from cover to cover. Davey starting out as an abused child using his ability to escape his father and relocate to Noo Yawk City, finding his mother only see her killed by a terrorist on the national news, vowing revenge on the terrorist (can't remember if he got it or not -- need to reread it) -- all makes for some dark reading. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 13:47:06 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
No, I get that, I'm just saying even an inner eyelid wouldn't protect Spock's eyes from light that was calibrated to be at the intensity encountered near their son. It'd blind him, and i doubt even his optic nerves and retinas could heal. - Original Message - From: "Mr. Worf" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, December 6, 2009 5:30:49 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 It kind of fits with the mythology of the creation of Vulcan. Their sun changed stages and burned away most of the planet's vegetation. If the same thing happened here we would probably have evolved with different kinds of eyes as well. Humans evolved differently to adapt to certain conditions to suit their environment, but I don't think that we would have developed a 2nd eyelid like an alligator. (Eskimos developed sunglasses to block out the sun's rays.) On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Keith Johnson < keithbjohn...@comcast.net > wrote: The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" < truthseeker...@hotmail.com > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. ----- Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" < truthseeker...@hotmail.com > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I love Obsession, from the way the gas cloud creature was able to leave normal space--being there, but not there--due to its use of gravity, to the final explosion, when Kirk and Garavick beam up in the aftermath of that antimatter blast. Probably improbable, but still great stuff, especially McCoy in the transporter room muttering "Crazy way to travel, scattering a man's atoms halfway across the galaxy", and Scotty's "Got 'em--or a piece of 'em anyway", followed by Spock's cool, "Cross-circuiting to Across-circuting to B". Good stuff! And as a kid, I remember going "Wowww!", when they said there was a cubic inch of antimatter in that bomb, but it was more powerful than ten thousand cobalt bombs. Boggles the mind... - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Sunday, December 6, 2009 3:51:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Thanks for the memory jogs, Keith! As for "Obsession", it just didn't seem to jog right with me. Something about the timing or the acting... I don't know. And I gave it every opportunity, whenever it aired. Maybe it's just me being picky. Old age does that. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2009 07:24:27 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. ----- Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I should amend to say the gas cloud feeds on hemoglobin... - Original Message - From: "Keith Johnson" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, December 6, 2009 2:24:27 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... Those were the days. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 04:39:13 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Yeah, it was heaven! From about the time I was eight, until around the age of 18 or so, I pretty much read nothing but science fiction: starting with
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
It kind of fits with the mythology of the creation of Vulcan. Their sun changed stages and burned away most of the planet's vegetation. If the same thing happened here we would probably have evolved with different kinds of eyes as well. Humans evolved differently to adapt to certain conditions to suit their environment, but I don't think that we would have developed a 2nd eyelid like an alligator. (Eskimos developed sunglasses to block out the sun's rays.) On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds > on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel > ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: > Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to > people. > > Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they > couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and > radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. > WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? > And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no > sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect > agains the brightness they were using. > > > > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" > Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul > Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > > > > As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose > titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature > that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I > dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's > nervous systems by latching onto their spines. > > As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, > the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a > bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals > with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of > Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. > > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in > bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > -- > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net > Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + > Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul > Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > > > > Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I > can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's > Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? > I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but > couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. > And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, > any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" > Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul > Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > > > Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a > couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his > artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek > began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to > start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave > one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the > class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty > office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth > for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on > things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the > library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' > "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began > reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... &g
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Thanks for the memory jogs, Keith! As for "Obsession", it just didn't seem to jog right with me. Something about the timing or the acting... I don't know. And I gave it every opportunity, whenever it aired. Maybe it's just me being picky. Old age does that. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2009 07:24:27 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... Those were the days. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
The eps you're thinking of are "Obsession" about the gas cloud that feeds on iron, can change its molecular structure, and uses gravity for FTL travel ( a show I love actually, what do you dislike about it?), and "Operation: Annihilate" about the braincell creatures that attached themselves to people. Now that show, i get your disdain. Even as a kid I didn't get how they couldn't kill the creatures. McCoy says he and Spock tried "heat, light, and radiation" to kill their test subject. The answer? Ultraviolet radiation. WTF? You mean they skipped an important compenent of the spectrum?? How ?? And that foolishness about Spock's inner eyelid protecting his eye made no sense: he still went blind, and I doubt even a second lid could protect agains the brightness they were using. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2009 3:50:52 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. ----- Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... Those were the days. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 04:39:13 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Yeah, it was heaven! From about the time I was eight, until around the age of 18 or so, I pretty much read nothing but science fiction: starting with Andre Norton (some fantasy there of course), Heinlein, Clarke, all the standards. The discovery of adult-oriented scifi was the first wondrous time for me. I discovered fantasy after seeing one of the Covenant books--The Illearth War--in a grocery store, and being intrigued. I then went home and read my brother's copy The H
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
As for the Trek eps, you got them all in one swoop. Also, there's two whose titles won't come to my over-concussed brain, one about the gaseuos creature that killed people by feeding on the iron in people's blood and the one I dub "The Fried-Egg Monster Ep", with the creatures that attacked people's nervous systems by latching onto their spines. As for what you haven't read, the Foundation series is, IMO, slow but epic, the kind of trip you don't regret having taken. Moorcock can, at times, be a bit too weird for your sensibilities, I suspect. At times, he openly deals with incest and other themes unabashedly. As for not reading any of Octavia's work... you may want to *duck*. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 06:23:39 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... Those were the days. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 04:39:13 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Yeah, it was heaven! From about the time I was eight, until around the age of 18 or so, I pretty much read nothing but science fiction: starting with Andre Norton (some fantasy there of course), Heinlein, Clarke, all the standards. The discovery of adult-oriented scifi was the first wondrous time for me. I discovered fantasy after seeing one of the Covenant books--The Illearth War--in a grocery store, and being intrigued. I then went home and read my brother's copy The Hobbit, was entertained, and decided to explore fantasy. Went back to find the Covenant trilogy, was hooked, then embarked on that six year journey. Eyes glazed indeed. It got to the point where if a book had the stamp of "Del Rey Fantasy", I'd buy it. Or, if the cover art was by a guy named Darrell K. Sweet (did the Covenant covers, among others), I'd buy it. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 8:21:50 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 WHOA... I took in all of those, too, but over a span of thirty-odd years. The entirely of that, in so short a span... you ended up in a corner, glazed look in your eyes for weeks afterward, right? "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@com
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Wow, great story. What were the "childish" Trek eps that you didn't like? I can imagine some possibilities: "And the Children Shall Lead", "Spock's Brain", "The Way to Eden", "The Mark of Gideon", "The Alternative Factor"? I haven't read the Helliconia books. I tried when i was younger, but couldn't get into them. Never read any Moorcock either. And have to admit, i haven't read the Foundation series, the Dune novels, any of Octavia Butler's books, or anything from Stephen King. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 5:22:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... Those were the days. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 04:39:13 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Yeah, it was heaven! From about the time I was eight, until around the age of 18 or so, I pretty much read nothing but science fiction: starting with Andre Norton (some fantasy there of course), Heinlein, Clarke, all the standards. The discovery of adult-oriented scifi was the first wondrous time for me. I discovered fantasy after seeing one of the Covenant books--The Illearth War--in a grocery store, and being intrigued. I then went home and read my brother's copy The Hobbit, was entertained, and decided to explore fantasy. Went back to find the Covenant trilogy, was hooked, then embarked on that six year journey. Eyes glazed indeed. It got to the point where if a book had the stamp of "Del Rey Fantasy", I'd buy it. Or, if the cover art was by a guy named Darrell K. Sweet (did the Covenant covers, among others), I'd buy it. ----- Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 8:21:50 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 WHOA... I took in all of those, too, but over a span of thirty-odd years. The entirely of that, in so short a span... you ended up in a corner, glazed look in your eyes for weeks afterward, right? "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:13:06 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 An *awesome* moment! May spoke of the energy crackling and coruscating all around Remillard's ceremetal containment unit. Her power was off the chart! Remember how it took that huge concerted effort of psi's to tackle her, focusing all the power in a wedge with Aiken Drum at the tip, and her torturer as the "fuse"? Good stuff. What a heady time it was for me when I read May's work. In about a five or six year period, I discovered the following works: the Pliocene Exile series, Kurtz's Deryni series, Barbara Hambly's Time of the Dark series, the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever, the Xanth and Phaze novels by Piers Anthony, Zelazny's Amber novels, the Shannara books, the Belgariad, the Dragon Riders of Pern, Varley's Titan, Wizard, and Demon, the Ringworld books, and the Silmarillion. Can you imagine coming new to all that in five years?? I was *never* without something exciting to read, and was always breathless fo
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
You are right on. I had conversations today with several friends of mine all in their mid-20's. All grew up loving Star Wars. To a man, they said the movie was amazing, the best Trek ever. They had quibbles with the plotting, such as the illogic of Nero blaming Spock for Romulus' destruction. But they didn't really get why I said the spirit of Trek wasn't preserved. They had questions about Spock's overt affection for Uhura, but again, they took the explanation that since he's young it makes sense. Pity... - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 3:32:03 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 It did so well that whatever concerns they may have had about angering StarTrek fans (if any), likely no longer exist, because the box office has shown them that it does not really matter what we think. They went out and recruited Star Wars fans. Too bad. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 12:01 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 interesting. Either way, it did enough money so that another film in this alternate reality is a certainty, more's the pity. Hell, if they wanna do alternate reality Trek, then give me Mirror Universe eps. At least then I'd get to see Spock with the cool beard! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:53:15 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think they were more forgiving of the breakaway from the original than many fans were. But it is hard to say. Those of us who did like it are not as vocal as those who did not or those who refuse to see it From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 10:15 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I was referring to fans too, just started referencing critics. You make an interesting point: you think critics liked Star Trek more than fans? - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 12:27:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There are definitively two views. But I was not referring to critics, but instead devoted fans. I do not think fans are a flexible as critics. That is probably why critics like the new Star Trek more than many of the fans. Based on what I have read, Jumper and FlashForward are pretty much two completely new animals. Another example of taking big leaps away from the source material are the Hollywoodization of Philip K. Dick short stories. While I like some of the movies, they barely resemble the original story. However, in many cases, I would say staying true to the source material probably would not sell to the masses. The Avatar is an example where I will be resistant. Perhaps the retooling to include a few more Asians will change that for me. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 5:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think there's two views. Most critics I've read say they don't expect a movie to be slavishly devoted to the source material. They're actually okay with some latitude taken by the filmmakers, as they feel that a book isn't usually written with an eye toward a film anyway, so some change is acceptable, even necessary. Dropping minor plot lines or characters, combining a couple of minor characters together, eliminating some background story, updating the era or location in which the story takes place are examples. As Tracey mentioned, LOTR is a good example of that: lots of changes from the book, but the overall theme and spirit are true, so it's a great piece of film making. Indeed, some critics point to the first two Harry Potter movies--which follow the books very closely--as being boring because they're so much an exact treatment. (never read the books, so don't know). The problem is when the lattitude is too far, such as changing gender, race, country (especially, moving stuff from another country to the States)
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Tracey, that's for the series only. In the novel, the cause was a pulse of neutrinos from the remnant of Supernova 1987A, which was further defined as a quark star and not a neutron star remnant, superdense matter which affected the LHC run at the time. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashforward_%28novel%29 "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 17:46:48 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 >From what I read, there are not cops involved, living forever or for hundreds of years is part of the plot and it is told from the point of view of the scientists who caused the Flash, I think it has something to do with the Dyson’s Sphere? From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:15 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 To the best of my knowledge, Keith, based on my spotty memory, the biggest difference is the time span of the FlashForward. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:17:54 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I haven't read either book/series, but the general consensus from what i've read is that the Jumper movie is a much poorer big version of its source material than the Flash Forward series is of its. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:40:18 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Oh, yes. Those were the days, falling across a Sweet cover. I bought a couple of books that weren't even bad enough to qualify as crap, but his artwork made it worth owning. My first exposure to SF was just after OS Trek began in reruns, and the childishness of some of the episodes drove me to start writing, first just for my closest friends. One of them, Beth, gave one of my stories to our English teacher who, after reading it, gave the class a pop quiz, exempting me and taking me across the hall to an empty office. There, he showed me the story, begged me not to be angry with Beth for showing it to him, and then telling me to begin writing in earnest, on things NOT Trek. He also told me where to find the SF/fantasy section of the library that the city had just built. My first SF novel was Aldiss' "Helliconia Winter". After that, Moorcock and Stapledon. Then I began reading the American authors, Heinlein, Asimov, Silverberg... Those were the days. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 04:39:13 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Yeah, it was heaven! From about the time I was eight, until around the age of 18 or so, I pretty much read nothing but science fiction: starting with Andre Norton (some fantasy there of course), Heinlein, Clarke, all the standards. The discovery of adult-oriented scifi was the first wondrous time for me. I discovered fantasy after seeing one of the Covenant books--The Illearth War--in a grocery store, and being intrigued. I then went home and read my brother's copy The Hobbit, was entertained, and decided to explore fantasy. Went back to find the Covenant trilogy, was hooked, then embarked on that six year journey. Eyes glazed indeed. It got to the point where if a book had the stamp of "Del Rey Fantasy", I'd buy it. Or, if the cover art was by a guy named Darrell K. Sweet (did the Covenant covers, among others), I'd buy it. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 8:21:50 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 WHOA... I took in all of those, too, but over a span of thirty-odd years. The entirely of that, in so short a span... you ended up in a corner, glazed look in your eyes for weeks afterward, right? "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:13:06 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 An *awesome* moment! May spoke of the energy crackling and coruscating all around Remillard's ceremetal containment unit. Her power was off the chart! Remember how it took that huge concerted effort of psi's to tackle her, focusing all the power in a wedge with Aiken Drum at the tip, and her torturer as the "fuse"? Good stuff. What a heady time it was for me when I read May's work. In about a five or six year period, I discovered the following works: the Pliocene Exile series, Kurtz's Deryni series, Barbara Hambly's Time of the Dark series, the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever, the Xanth and Phaze novels by Piers Anthony, Zelazny's Amber novels, the Shannara books, the Belgariad, the Dragon Riders of Pern, Varley's Titan, Wizard, and Demon, the Ringworld books, and the Silmarillion. Can you imagine coming new to all that in five years?? I was *never* without something exciting to read, and was always breathless for the next book--hell, the next chapter--to come. Don't think i can recall a more exciting time before or since in the fantasy world for me. The closest would be recently when someone in this very group (can't remember who) turned me on to the Riftwar Saga. I've been a fan of that world ever since. - Original Message - From: "B Smith" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:21:25 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I loved that series. I remember being blown away when Felice D-Jumped and nearly killed Marc Remillard. It was such surprising and scary moment. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > The result of years
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Okay. Thanks! "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 04:34:46 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 yeah, as recently as a year ago--the last time I read an X book--they mentioned that the students got two hours of combat training a day - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 8:16:41 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Keith, do they still do that in the X-titles? It's been forever since I picked one up. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:16:08 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Remember all those Danger Room sessions in the X-books? They were always throwing a fly into the ointment of one of the people working out, such as confronting a pure telepath with unliving, non-sentient robots with no minds that could be controlled. Or, putting Nightcrawler in a maze of small rooms so tightly packed that he dared not teleport. That's why all X-students get two hours mininum of combat training every day, for the moments when their powers are useless or neutralized in a fight. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:36:58 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 That's also true. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 04:02:52 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 True, that's why I put Xavier's powers on my list of some of the best. Although, one issue with telepathy would be range and accuracy. If you're infiltrating a facility, and there are security cameras, but the operator's in another part of the building, you might not be able to locate and wipe his mind in time, nor erase the recording. And then there's those pesky automated systems that you can't mind wipe--unless, like Jean Grey or Psylocke, you're blessed with TK as well as telepathy. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:35:34 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Tracey, Then I may be stewed and s*rewed, because I'm a dinosaur in a lot of ways. If I see a property that appeals to me right off the pages, I can't fathom the need to alter it. Again, maybe I'm expecting everyone to see the world as I do. Not wise, considering my record of instability... "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 22:06:21 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Martin: I’m actually siding with you. I do not read as much as I used too, but after years of being disappointed with film adaptations of books, I found a way to adapt….at least when it comes to scifi and only because of my scifi starvation. However, I’m saying if you cannot do that trick of the mind, there is no way you are going to like most adaptations. LOTR is the exception. Unfortunately most directors and producers of these adaptations are not big fans when they acquire the rights From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoog roups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:11 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I understand that, Tracey, and yet I don't. There are books out there which wouldn't translate well from page-to-screen, LOTR first on the list. But some, upon reading them, I can't see that differential. In "Jumper", I didn't read any thematic elements that couldn't translate to the big screen. Unless I'm being too smart for the average movie viewer, which I don't believe I am. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 16:25:47 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I agree, but it really is like star trek, if you love the original, the new one might be difficult to swallow. Just like with many book to film creations, this old school to new school translation created a who new animal. I liked and enjoyed the new one because I considered it a whole new animal.I never expect a movie to be like a book. I always take thatapproach so that I can enjoy it. Most book lovers cannot do that. So while I watch jumper more times than I care to admit in public, I can see why someone who read the dark and serious book could have an aneurism. The same could be said of fans of the book that FlashForward is based on From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 4:18 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:47:06 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. .
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
It did so well that whatever concerns they may have had about angering StarTrek fans (if any), likely no longer exist, because the box office has shown them that it does not really matter what we think. They went out and recruited Star Wars fans. Too bad. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 12:01 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 interesting. Either way, it did enough money so that another film in this alternate reality is a certainty, more's the pity. Hell, if they wanna do alternate reality Trek, then give me Mirror Universe eps. At least then I'd get to see Spock with the cool beard! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:53:15 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think they were more forgiving of the breakaway from the original than many fans were. But it is hard to say. Those of us who did like it are not as vocal as those who did not or those who refuse to see it From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 10:15 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I was referring to fans too, just started referencing critics. You make an interesting point: you think critics liked Star Trek more than fans? - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 12:27:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There are definitively two views. But I was not referring to critics, but instead devoted fans. I do not think fans are a flexible as critics. That is probably why critics like the new Star Trek more than many of the fans. Based on what I have read, Jumper and FlashForward are pretty much two completely new animals. Another example of taking big leaps away from the source material are the Hollywoodization of Philip K. Dick short stories. While I like some of the movies, they barely resemble the original story. However, in many cases, I would say staying true to the source material probably would not sell to the masses. The Avatar is an example where I will be resistant. Perhaps the retooling to include a few more Asians will change that for me. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 5:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think there's two views. Most critics I've read say they don't expect a movie to be slavishly devoted to the source material. They're actually okay with some latitude taken by the filmmakers, as they feel that a book isn't usually written with an eye toward a film anyway, so some change is acceptable, even necessary. Dropping minor plot lines or characters, combining a couple of minor characters together, eliminating some background story, updating the era or location in which the story takes place are examples. As Tracey mentioned, LOTR is a good example of that: lots of changes from the book, but the overall theme and spirit are true, so it's a great piece of film making. Indeed, some critics point to the first two Harry Potter movies--which follow the books very closely--as being boring because they're so much an exact treatment. (never read the books, so don't know). The problem is when the lattitude is too far, such as changing gender, race, country (especially, moving stuff from another country to the States), changing the endings (I hate the resolution of the Ring as written in The Return of the King) The other view is that the movie should follow the book as closely as possible. That view says the time period, plot line, location, etc., should be just like the book, or why bother? The problem, of course, is if the movie is shot so much like the book that it can be a bit boring. the imagination comes into play powerfully when reading a book, which makes a story more exciting for the reader. If the movie gives you visuals, but doesn't change the pacing of the story sometimes, it can be a dull thing. I hear "The DaVinci Code" is an example of that. I like an approach somewhere in the middle. As Martin seems to point out here, Jumper made a whole bunch of changes that fundamentally changed the spirit of the book. Knowing that mak
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
interesting. Either way, it did enough money so that another film in this alternate reality is a certainty, more's the pity. Hell, if they wanna do alternate reality Trek, then give me Mirror Universe eps. At least then I'd get to see Spock with the cool beard! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:53:15 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think they were more forgiving of the breakaway from the original than many fans were. But it is hard to say. Those of us who did like it are not as vocal as those who did not or those who refuse to see it From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 10:15 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I was referring to fans too, just started referencing critics. You make an interesting point: you think critics liked Star Trek more than fans? - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 12:27:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There are definitively two views. But I was not referring to critics, but instead devoted fans. I do not think fans are a flexible as critics. That is probably why critics like the new Star Trek more than many of the fans. Based on what I have read, Jumper and FlashForward are pretty much two completely new animals. Another example of taking big leaps away from the source material are the Hollywoodization of Philip K. Dick short stories. While I like some of the movies, they barely resemble the original story. However, in many cases, I would say staying true to the source material probably would not sell to the masses. The Avatar is an example where I will be resistant. Perhaps the retooling to include a few more Asians will change that for me. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 5:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think there's two views. Most critics I've read say they don't expect a movie to be slavishly devoted to the source material. They're actually okay with some latitude taken by the filmmakers, as they feel that a book isn't usually written with an eye toward a film anyway, so some change is acceptable, even necessary. Dropping minor plot lines or characters, combining a couple of minor characters together, eliminating some background story, updating the era or location in which the story takes place are examples. As Tracey mentioned, LOTR is a good example of that: lots of changes from the book, but the overall theme and spirit are true, so it's a great piece of film making. Indeed, some critics point to the first two Harry Potter movies--which follow the books very closely--as being boring because they're so much an exact treatment. (never read the books, so don't know). The problem is when the lattitude is too far, such as changing gender, race, country (especially, moving stuff from another country to the States), changing the endings (I hate the resolution of the Ring as written in The Return of the King) The other view is that the movie should follow the book as closely as possible. That view says the time period, plot line, location, etc., should be just like the book, or why bother? The problem, of course, is if the movie is shot so much like the book that it can be a bit boring. the imagination comes into play powerfully when reading a book, which makes a story more exciting for the reader. If the movie gives you visuals, but doesn't change the pacing of the story sometimes, it can be a dull thing. I hear "The DaVinci Code" is an example of that. I like an approach somewhere in the middle. As Martin seems to point out here, Jumper made a whole bunch of changes that fundamentally changed the spirit of the book. Knowing that makes me more unhappy. The plots he discussed would be way cooler. Some changes? I can see that, but not this many. - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:06:21 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Martin: I’m actually siding with you. I do not read as much as I used too, but after years of being di
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I think they were more forgiving of the breakaway from the original than many fans were. But it is hard to say. Those of us who did like it are not as vocal as those who did not or those who refuse to see it From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 10:15 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I was referring to fans too, just started referencing critics. You make an interesting point: you think critics liked Star Trek more than fans? - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 12:27:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There are definitively two views. But I was not referring to critics, but instead devoted fans. I do not think fans are a flexible as critics. That is probably why critics like the new Star Trek more than many of the fans. Based on what I have read, Jumper and FlashForward are pretty much two completely new animals. Another example of taking big leaps away from the source material are the Hollywoodization of Philip K. Dick short stories. While I like some of the movies, they barely resemble the original story. However, in many cases, I would say staying true to the source material probably would not sell to the masses. The Avatar is an example where I will be resistant. Perhaps the retooling to include a few more Asians will change that for me. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 5:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think there's two views. Most critics I've read say they don't expect a movie to be slavishly devoted to the source material. They're actually okay with some latitude taken by the filmmakers, as they feel that a book isn't usually written with an eye toward a film anyway, so some change is acceptable, even necessary. Dropping minor plot lines or characters, combining a couple of minor characters together, eliminating some background story, updating the era or location in which the story takes place are examples. As Tracey mentioned, LOTR is a good example of that: lots of changes from the book, but the overall theme and spirit are true, so it's a great piece of film making. Indeed, some critics point to the first two Harry Potter movies--which follow the books very closely--as being boring because they're so much an exact treatment. (never read the books, so don't know). The problem is when the lattitude is too far, such as changing gender, race, country (especially, moving stuff from another country to the States), changing the endings (I hate the resolution of the Ring as written in The Return of the King) The other view is that the movie should follow the book as closely as possible. That view says the time period, plot line, location, etc., should be just like the book, or why bother? The problem, of course, is if the movie is shot so much like the book that it can be a bit boring. the imagination comes into play powerfully when reading a book, which makes a story more exciting for the reader. If the movie gives you visuals, but doesn't change the pacing of the story sometimes, it can be a dull thing. I hear "The DaVinci Code" is an example of that. I like an approach somewhere in the middle. As Martin seems to point out here, Jumper made a whole bunch of changes that fundamentally changed the spirit of the book. Knowing that makes me more unhappy. The plots he discussed would be way cooler. Some changes? I can see that, but not this many. - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:06:21 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Martin: I’m actually siding with you. I do not read as much as I used too, but after years of being disappointed with film adaptations of books, I found a way to adapt….at least when it comes to scifi and only because of my scifi starvation. However, I’m saying if you cannot do that trick of the mind, there is no way you are going to like most adaptations. LOTR is the exception. Unfortunately most directors and producers of these adaptations are not big fans when they acquire the rights From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoog roups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:11 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I was referring to fans too, just started referencing critics. You make an interesting point: you think critics liked Star Trek more than fans? - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 12:27:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There are definitively two views. But I was not referring to critics, but instead devoted fans. I do not think fans are a flexible as critics. That is probably why critics like the new Star Trek more than many of the fans. Based on what I have read, Jumper and FlashForward are pretty much two completely new animals. Another example of taking big leaps away from the source material are the Hollywoodization of Philip K. Dick short stories. While I like some of the movies, they barely resemble the original story. However, in many cases, I would say staying true to the source material probably would not sell to the masses. The Avatar is an example where I will be resistant. Perhaps the retooling to include a few more Asians will change that for me. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 5:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think there's two views. Most critics I've read say they don't expect a movie to be slavishly devoted to the source material. They're actually okay with some latitude taken by the filmmakers, as they feel that a book isn't usually written with an eye toward a film anyway, so some change is acceptable, even necessary. Dropping minor plot lines or characters, combining a couple of minor characters together, eliminating some background story, updating the era or location in which the story takes place are examples. As Tracey mentioned, LOTR is a good example of that: lots of changes from the book, but the overall theme and spirit are true, so it's a great piece of film making. Indeed, some critics point to the first two Harry Potter movies--which follow the books very closely--as being boring because they're so much an exact treatment. (never read the books, so don't know). The problem is when the lattitude is too far, such as changing gender, race, country (especially, moving stuff from another country to the States), changing the endings (I hate the resolution of the Ring as written in The Return of the King) The other view is that the movie should follow the book as closely as possible. That view says the time period, plot line, location, etc., should be just like the book, or why bother? The problem, of course, is if the movie is shot so much like the book that it can be a bit boring. the imagination comes into play powerfully when reading a book, which makes a story more exciting for the reader. If the movie gives you visuals, but doesn't change the pacing of the story sometimes, it can be a dull thing. I hear "The DaVinci Code" is an example of that. I like an approach somewhere in the middle. As Martin seems to point out here, Jumper made a whole bunch of changes that fundamentally changed the spirit of the book. Knowing that makes me more unhappy. The plots he discussed would be way cooler. Some changes? I can see that, but not this many. - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:06:21 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Martin: I’m actually siding with you. I do not read as much as I used too, but after years of being disappointed with film adaptations of books, I found a way to adapt….at least when it comes to scifi and only because of my scifi starvation. However, I’m saying if you cannot do that trick of the mind, there is no way you are going to like most adaptations. LOTR is the exception. Unfortunately most directors and producers of these adaptations are not big fans when they acquire the rights From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoog roups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:11 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I understand that, Tracey, and yet I don't. There are books out there which wouldn't translate well from page-to-screen, LOTR first on the list. But some, upon reading them, I can't see that differential. In "Jumper", I didn't read any thematic elements that couldn't translate to the big screen. Unless I'm being too smart for the ave
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
There are definitively two views. But I was not referring to critics, but instead devoted fans. I do not think fans are a flexible as critics. That is probably why critics like the new Star Trek more than many of the fans. Based on what I have read, Jumper and FlashForward are pretty much two completely new animals. Another example of taking big leaps away from the source material are the Hollywoodization of Philip K. Dick short stories. While I like some of the movies, they barely resemble the original story. However, in many cases, I would say staying true to the source material probably would not sell to the masses. The Avatar is an example where I will be resistant. Perhaps the retooling to include a few more Asians will change that for me. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 5:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think there's two views. Most critics I've read say they don't expect a movie to be slavishly devoted to the source material. They're actually okay with some latitude taken by the filmmakers, as they feel that a book isn't usually written with an eye toward a film anyway, so some change is acceptable, even necessary. Dropping minor plot lines or characters, combining a couple of minor characters together, eliminating some background story, updating the era or location in which the story takes place are examples. As Tracey mentioned, LOTR is a good example of that: lots of changes from the book, but the overall theme and spirit are true, so it's a great piece of film making. Indeed, some critics point to the first two Harry Potter movies--which follow the books very closely--as being boring because they're so much an exact treatment. (never read the books, so don't know). The problem is when the lattitude is too far, such as changing gender, race, country (especially, moving stuff from another country to the States), changing the endings (I hate the resolution of the Ring as written in The Return of the King) The other view is that the movie should follow the book as closely as possible. That view says the time period, plot line, location, etc., should be just like the book, or why bother? The problem, of course, is if the movie is shot so much like the book that it can be a bit boring. the imagination comes into play powerfully when reading a book, which makes a story more exciting for the reader. If the movie gives you visuals, but doesn't change the pacing of the story sometimes, it can be a dull thing. I hear "The DaVinci Code" is an example of that. I like an approach somewhere in the middle. As Martin seems to point out here, Jumper made a whole bunch of changes that fundamentally changed the spirit of the book. Knowing that makes me more unhappy. The plots he discussed would be way cooler. Some changes? I can see that, but not this many. - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:06:21 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Martin: I’m actually siding with you. I do not read as much as I used too, but after years of being disappointed with film adaptations of books, I found a way to adapt….at least when it comes to scifi and only because of my scifi starvation. However, I’m saying if you cannot do that trick of the mind, there is no way you are going to like most adaptations. LOTR is the exception. Unfortunately most directors and producers of these adaptations are not big fans when they acquire the rights From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoog roups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:11 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I understand that, Tracey, and yet I don't. There are books out there which wouldn't translate well from page-to-screen, LOTR first on the list. But some, upon reading them, I can't see that differential. In "Jumper", I didn't read any thematic elements that couldn't translate to the big screen. Unless I'm being too smart for the average movie viewer, which I don't believe I am. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _____ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 16:25:47 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I think there's two views. Most critics I've read say they don't expect a movie to be slavishly devoted to the source material. They're actually okay with some latitude taken by the filmmakers, as they feel that a book isn't usually written with an eye toward a film anyway, so some change is acceptable, even necessary. Dropping minor plot lines or characters, combining a couple of minor characters together, eliminating some background story, updating the era or location in which the story takes place are examples. As Tracey mentioned, LOTR is a good example of that: lots of changes from the book, but the overall theme and spirit are true, so it's a great piece of film making. Indeed, some critics point to the first two Harry Potter movies--which follow the books very closely--as being boring because they're so much an exact treatment. (never read the books, so don't know). The problem is when the lattitude is too far, such as changing gender, race, country (especially, moving stuff from another country to the States), changing the endings (I hate the resolution of the Ring as written in The Return of the King) The other view is that the movie should follow the book as closely as possible. That view says the time period, plot line, location, etc., should be just like the book, or why bother? The problem, of course, is if the movie is shot so much like the book that it can be a bit boring. the imagination comes into play powerfully when reading a book, which makes a story more exciting for the reader. If the movie gives you visuals, but doesn't change the pacing of the story sometimes, it can be a dull thing. I hear "The DaVinci Code" is an example of that. I like an approach somewhere in the middle. As Martin seems to point out here, Jumper made a whole bunch of changes that fundamentally changed the spirit of the book. Knowing that makes me more unhappy. The plots he discussed would be way cooler. Some changes? I can see that, but not this many. - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 4, 2009 1:06:21 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Martin: I’m actually siding with you. I do not read as much as I used too, but after years of being disappointed with film adaptations of books, I found a way to adapt….at least when it comes to scifi and only because of my scifi starvation. However, I’m saying if you cannot do that trick of the mind, there is no way you are going to like most adaptations. LOTR is the exception. Unfortunately most directors and producers of these adaptations are not big fans when they acquire the rights From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoog roups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:11 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I understand that, Tracey, and yet I don't. There are books out there which wouldn't translate well from page-to-screen, LOTR first on the list. But some, upon reading them, I can't see that differential. In "Jumper", I didn't read any thematic elements that couldn't translate to the big screen. Unless I'm being too smart for the average movie viewer, which I don't believe I am. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 16:25:47 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I agree, but it really is like star trek, if you love the original, the new one might be difficult to swallow. Just like with many book to film creations, this old school to new school translation created a who new animal. I liked and enjoyed the new one because I considered it a whole new animal. I never expect a movie to be like a book. I always take thatapproach so that I can enjoy it. Most book lovers cannot do that. So while I watch jumper more times than I care to admit in public, I can see why someone who read the dark and serious book could have an aneurism. The same could be said of fans of the book that FlashForward is based on From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 4:18 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella&quo
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Martin: Im actually siding with you. I do not read as much as I used too, but after years of being disappointed with film adaptations of books, I found a way to adapt .at least when it comes to scifi and only because of my scifi starvation. However, Im saying if you cannot do that trick of the mind, there is no way you are going to like most adaptations. LOTR is the exception. Unfortunately most directors and producers of these adaptations are not big fans when they acquire the rights From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoog roups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:11 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I understand that, Tracey, and yet I don't. There are books out there which wouldn't translate well from page-to-screen, LOTR first on the list. But some, upon reading them, I can't see that differential. In "Jumper", I didn't read any thematic elements that couldn't translate to the big screen. Unless I'm being too smart for the average movie viewer, which I don't believe I am. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 16:25:47 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I agree, but it really is like star trek, if you love the original, the new one might be difficult to swallow. Just like with many book to film creations, this old school to new school translation created a who new animal. I liked and enjoyed the new one because I considered it a whole new animal.I never expect a movie to be like a book. I always take thatapproach so that I can enjoy it. Most book lovers cannot do that. So while I watch jumper more times than I care to admit in public, I can see why someone who read the dark and serious book could have an aneurism. The same could be said of fans of the book that FlashForward is based on From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 4:18 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:47:06 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _____ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But dont feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one c
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
yeah, as recently as a year ago--the last time I read an X book--they mentioned that the students got two hours of combat training a day - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 8:16:41 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Keith, do they still do that in the X-titles? It's been forever since I picked one up. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:16:08 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Remember all those Danger Room sessions in the X-books? They were always throwing a fly into the ointment of one of the people working out, such as confronting a pure telepath with unliving, non-sentient robots with no minds that could be controlled. Or, putting Nightcrawler in a maze of small rooms so tightly packed that he dared not teleport. That's why all X-students get two hours mininum of combat training every day, for the moments when their powers are useless or neutralized in a fight. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:36:58 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 That's also true. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 04:02:52 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 True, that's why I put Xavier's powers on my list of some of the best. Although, one issue with telepathy would be range and accuracy. If you're infiltrating a facility, and there are security cameras, but the operator's in another part of the building, you might not be able to locate and wipe his mind in time, nor erase the recording. And then there's those pesky automated systems that you can't mind wipe--unless, like Jean Grey or Psylocke, you're blessed with TK as well as telepathy. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:35:34 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely w
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Yeah, it was heaven! From about the time I was eight, until around the age of 18 or so, I pretty much read nothing but science fiction: starting with Andre Norton (some fantasy there of course), Heinlein, Clarke, all the standards. The discovery of adult-oriented scifi was the first wondrous time for me. I discovered fantasy after seeing one of the Covenant books--The Illearth War--in a grocery store, and being intrigued. I then went home and read my brother's copy The Hobbit, was entertained, and decided to explore fantasy. Went back to find the Covenant trilogy, was hooked, then embarked on that six year journey. Eyes glazed indeed. It got to the point where if a book had the stamp of "Del Rey Fantasy", I'd buy it. Or, if the cover art was by a guy named Darrell K. Sweet (did the Covenant covers, among others), I'd buy it. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 8:21:50 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 WHOA... I took in all of those, too, but over a span of thirty-odd years. The entirely of that, in so short a span... you ended up in a corner, glazed look in your eyes for weeks afterward, right? "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:13:06 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 An *awesome* moment! May spoke of the energy crackling and coruscating all around Remillard's ceremetal containment unit. Her power was off the chart! Remember how it took that huge concerted effort of psi's to tackle her, focusing all the power in a wedge with Aiken Drum at the tip, and her torturer as the "fuse"? Good stuff. What a heady time it was for me when I read May's work. In about a five or six year period, I discovered the following works: the Pliocene Exile series, Kurtz's Deryni series, Barbara Hambly's Time of the Dark series, the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever, the Xanth and Phaze novels by Piers Anthony, Zelazny's Amber novels, the Shannara books, the Belgariad, the Dragon Riders of Pern, Varley's Titan, Wizard, and Demon, the Ringworld books, and the Silmarillion. Can you imagine coming new to all that in five years?? I was *never* without something exciting to read, and was always breathless for the next book--hell, the next chapter--to come. Don't think i can recall a more exciting time before or since in the fantasy world for me. The closest would be recently when someone in this very group (can't remember who) turned me on to the Riftwar Saga. I've been a fan of that world ever since. - Original Message - From: "B Smith" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:21:25 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I loved that series. I remember being blown away when Felice D-Jumped and nearly killed Marc Remillard. It was such surprising and scary moment. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > The result of years of reading Marvel's Handbook (with all the power levels > and comparisons listed). Also, stuff such as Julian May's Pliocene exile > series, where powers are broken down into Farsensing (telepathy/remote > sensing), Pyschokinesis, Coercion (mind control), Redaction (mind > reading/altering), and Creativity (matter/energy manipulation). > > > > I tend to think a lot about powers and how they'd be of benefit. I tend to > break them down into offensive (e.g., Cyclops' optic beams, Wolvie's claws), > defensive (Juggernaut's invulnerability, Blob's mass of blubber, Storm's > winds applied at a foe), information gathering/stealth (telepathy, > invisibility, intangibility), and special powers (Forge's knack with > machines, mind control of Xavier, etc). > > > > So, when thinking of a superpower I'd like to have, I try to think of one or > two that cover the gamut and would give one as many tools as possible. > Magneto, Storm, Graviton, and Xavier--all of which could be called > "elementals"--are tops in the list for covering all bases. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Kelwyn" > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:10:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: [scif
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
See you get the need to change things for a broader audience, but most fans do not. So, many aneurisms result. Im not putting down the decision to make the changes, but saying that I empathize with the fans of the book From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:28 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 It's coming back now, Tracey... the protagonist of the book was a physicist who worked at CERN, dealing with the events. Another thing tha tthey had to change, because who would've gotten a physicist as the hero of a drama? Fine for "The Big Bang Theory", but not when gunfire is involved. Closest thing to a physicist as a hero has come via the works of Travis S Taylor, and his representations are boring at best and overtly comical at worst. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 15:42:53 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There is no way you could have liked the movie. However, Wikipedia has pretty much the synopsis of the FlashForwards book version described and it has more focus on the science and the scifi than being a police procedural. I do not think cops are even a major feature of the book. I do not think I would like the series if I had read the book From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 3:17 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Again, Tracey, true. But I can't help but wonder what gave the producers the notion that "Jumper" could be made into escapist fare. The book itself was grim, almost from cover to cover. Davey starting out as an abused child using his ability to escape his father and relocate to Noo Yawk City, finding his mother only see her killed by a terrorist on the national news, vowing revenge on the terrorist (can't remember if he got it or not -- need to reread it) -- all makes for some dark reading. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 13:47:06 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _____ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But dont feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the si
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
>From what I read, there are not cops involved, living forever or for hundreds of years is part of the plot and it is told from the point of view of the scientists who caused the Flash, I think it has something to do with the Dysons Sphere? From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:15 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 To the best of my knowledge, Keith, based on my spotty memory, the biggest difference is the time span of the FlashForward. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:17:54 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I haven't read either book/series, but the general consensus from what i've read is that the Jumper movie is a much poorer big version of its source material than the Flash Forward series is of its. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:40:18 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But dont feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way better in comp
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
It's coming back now, Tracey... the protagonist of the book was a physicist who worked at CERN, dealing with the events. Another thing tha tthey had to change, because who would've gotten a physicist as the hero of a drama? Fine for "The Big Bang Theory", but not when gunfire is involved. Closest thing to a physicist as a hero has come via the works of Travis S Taylor, and his representations are boring at best and overtly comical at worst. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 15:42:53 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 There is no way you could have liked the movie. However, Wikipedia has pretty much the synopsis of the FlashForward’s book version described and it has more focus on the science and the scifi than being a police procedural. I do not think cops are even a major feature of the book. I do not think I would like the series if I had read the book From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 3:17 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Again, Tracey, true. But I can't help but wonder what gave the producers the notion that "Jumper" could be made into escapist fare. The book itself was grim, almost from cover to cover. Davey starting out as an abused child using his ability to escape his father and relocate to Noo Yawk City, finding his mother only see her killed by a terrorist on the national news, vowing revenge on the terrorist (can't remember if he got it or not -- need to reread it) -- all makes for some dark reading. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 13:47:06 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Agreed. and I freely acknowledge that, had I never seen or heard of Star Trek before, I'd have enjoyed this new movie more. - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 7:25:47 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I agree, but it really is like star trek, if you love the original, the new one might be difficult to swallow. Just like with many book to film creations, this old school to new school translation created a who new animal. I liked and enjoyed the new one because I considered it a whole new animal. I never expect a movie to be like a book. I always take thatapproach so that I can enjoy it. Most book lovers cannot do that. So while I watch jumper more times than I care to admit in public, I can see why someone who read the dark and serious book could have an aneurism. The same could be said of fans of the book that FlashForward is based on From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 4:18 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:47:06 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no re
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
WHOA... I took in all of those, too, but over a span of thirty-odd years. The entirely of that, in so short a span... you ended up in a corner, glazed look in your eyes for weeks afterward, right? "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:13:06 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 An *awesome* moment! May spoke of the energy crackling and coruscating all around Remillard's ceremetal containment unit. Her power was off the chart! Remember how it took that huge concerted effort of psi's to tackle her, focusing all the power in a wedge with Aiken Drum at the tip, and her torturer as the "fuse"? Good stuff. What a heady time it was for me when I read May's work. In about a five or six year period, I discovered the following works: the Pliocene Exile series, Kurtz's Deryni series, Barbara Hambly's Time of the Dark series, the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever, the Xanth and Phaze novels by Piers Anthony, Zelazny's Amber novels, the Shannara books, the Belgariad, the Dragon Riders of Pern, Varley's Titan, Wizard, and Demon, the Ringworld books, and the Silmarillion. Can you imagine coming new to all that in five years?? I was *never* without something exciting to read, and was always breathless for the next book--hell, the next chapter--to come. Don't think i can recall a more exciting time before or since in the fantasy world for me. The closest would be recently when someone in this very group (can't remember who) turned me on to the Riftwar Saga. I've been a fan of that world ever since. - Original Message - From: "B Smith" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:21:25 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I loved that series. I remember being blown away when Felice D-Jumped and nearly killed Marc Remillard. It was such surprising and scary moment. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > The result of years of reading Marvel's Handbook (with all the power levels > and comparisons listed). Also, stuff such as Julian May's Pliocene exile > series, where powers are broken down into Farsensing (telepathy/remote > sensing), Pyschokinesis, Coercion (mind control), Redaction (mind > reading/altering), and Creativity (matter/energy manipulation). > > > > I tend to think a lot about powers and how they'd be of benefit. I tend to > break them down into offensive (e.g., Cyclops' optic beams, Wolvie's claws), > defensive (Juggernaut's invulnerability, Blob's mass of blubber, Storm's > winds applied at a foe), information gathering/stealth (telepathy, > invisibility, intangibility), and special powers (Forge's knack with > machines, mind control of Xavier, etc). > > > > So, when thinking of a superpower I'd like to have, I try to think of one or > two that cover the gamut and would give one as many tools as possible. > Magneto, Storm, Graviton, and Xavier--all of which could be called > "elementals"--are tops in the list for covering all bases. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Kelwyn" > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:10:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Wow. I am just Pinky to your Brain! (I guess we can say you have thought > about this). > > ~rave! > > The Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? > Pinky: I think so, Brain, but if they called them "sad meals" no one would > buy them. > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > > > > > Yeah, teleportation is a good power, one of my favs too. Allows one to > > avoid danger, wreak all kinds of havoc(facing an army? No biggie: just > > 'port behind their lines, or 'port a bomb into their midst then skedaddle). > > I also like intangibility, as it's a great one for covert ops and > > resistance (avoidance) to injury. I like intagibility over invisibility > > because with the former you can get into and out of anything, while > > being invisible doesn't help if you can't pick the lock on a vault, or &
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Keith, do they still do that in the X-titles? It's been forever since I picked one up. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:16:08 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Remember all those Danger Room sessions in the X-books? They were always throwing a fly into the ointment of one of the people working out, such as confronting a pure telepath with unliving, non-sentient robots with no minds that could be controlled. Or, putting Nightcrawler in a maze of small rooms so tightly packed that he dared not teleport. That's why all X-students get two hours mininum of combat training every day, for the moments when their powers are useless or neutralized in a fight. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:36:58 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 That's also true. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 04:02:52 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 True, that's why I put Xavier's powers on my list of some of the best. Although, one issue with telepathy would be range and accuracy. If you're infiltrating a facility, and there are security cameras, but the operator's in another part of the building, you might not be able to locate and wipe his mind in time, nor erase the recording. And then there's those pesky automated systems that you can't mind wipe--unless, like Jean Grey or Psylocke, you're blessed with TK as well as telepathy. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:35:34 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director w
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
To the best of my knowledge, Keith, based on my spotty memory, the biggest difference is the time span of the FlashForward. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:17:54 +0000 Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I haven't read either book/series, but the general consensus from what i've read is that the Jumper movie is a much poorer big version of its source material than the Flash Forward series is of its. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:40:18 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget iss
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I understand that, Tracey, and yet I don't. There are books out there which wouldn't translate well from page-to-screen, LOTR first on the list. But some, upon reading them, I can't see that differential. In "Jumper", I didn't read any thematic elements that couldn't translate to the big screen. Unless I'm being too smart for the average movie viewer, which I don't believe I am. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 16:25:47 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I agree, but it really is like star trek, if you love the original, the new one might be difficult to swallow. Just like with many book to film creations, this old school to new school translation created a who new animal. I liked and enjoyed the new one because I considered it a whole new animal.I never expect a movie to be like a book. I always take thatapproach so that I can enjoy it. Most book lovers cannot do that. So while I watch jumper more times than I care to admit in public, I can see why someone who read the dark and serious book could have an aneurism. The same could be said of fans of the book that FlashForward is based on From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 4:18 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:47:06 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Gre
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Yes! And, if any of the producers had *read* the novel, they would've seen that it, as stood, would've made for a compelling story. No need for them to have engineered thre war against Jumpers that did come out to a degree, as I understand it, in the sequel. Though I don't know if terrorism would've gone down well with movie viewers post-9/11. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 00:27:27 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 that's *completely* different from the movie plot! - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 6:17:12 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Again, Tracey, true. But I can't help but wonder what gave the producers the notion that "Jumper" could be made into escapist fare. The book itself was grim, almost from cover to cover. Davey starting out as an abused child using his ability to escape his father and relocate to Noo Yawk City, finding his mother only see her killed by a terrorist on the national news, vowing revenge on the terrorist (can't remember if he got it or not -- need to reread it) -- all makes for some dark reading. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 13:47:06 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it com
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
that's *completely* different from the movie plot! - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 6:17:12 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Again, Tracey, true. But I can't help but wonder what gave the producers the notion that "Jumper" could be made into escapist fare. The book itself was grim, almost from cover to cover. Davey starting out as an abused child using his ability to escape his father and relocate to Noo Yawk City, finding his mother only see her killed by a terrorist on the national news, vowing revenge on the terrorist (can't remember if he got it or not -- need to reread it) -- all makes for some dark reading. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 13:47:06 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being s
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I pushed send before I was done. Sorry about that From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 4:18 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:47:06 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed s
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I agree, but it really is like star trek, if you love the original, the new one might be difficult to swallow. Just like with many book to film creations, this old school to new school translation created a who new animal. I liked and enjoyed the new one because I considered it a whole new animal.I never expect a movie to be like a book. I always take thatapproach so that I can enjoy it. Most book lovers cannot do that. So while I watch jumper more times than I care to admit in public, I can see why someone who read the dark and serious book could have an aneurism. The same could be said of fans of the book that FlashForward is based on From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 4:18 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:47:06 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I haven't read either book/series, but the general consensus from what i've read is that the Jumper movie is a much poorer big version of its source material than the Flash Forward series is of its. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:40:18 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >, cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., > cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts.
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
But silly fun! - Original Message - From: "Tracey de Morsella" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:47:06 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >, cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., > cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eas
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Remember all those Danger Room sessions in the X-books? They were always throwing a fly into the ointment of one of the people working out, such as confronting a pure telepath with unliving, non-sentient robots with no minds that could be controlled. Or, putting Nightcrawler in a maze of small rooms so tightly packed that he dared not teleport. That's why all X-students get two hours mininum of combat training every day, for the moments when their powers are useless or neutralized in a fight. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 3:36:58 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 That's also true. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 04:02:52 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 True, that's why I put Xavier's powers on my list of some of the best. Although, one issue with telepathy would be range and accuracy. If you're infiltrating a facility, and there are security cameras, but the operator's in another part of the building, you might not be able to locate and wipe his mind in time, nor erase the recording. And then there's those pesky automated systems that you can't mind wipe--unless, like Jean Grey or Psylocke, you're blessed with TK as well as telepathy. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:35:34 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >, cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., > cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > &g
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
An *awesome* moment! May spoke of the energy crackling and coruscating all around Remillard's ceremetal containment unit. Her power was off the chart! Remember how it took that huge concerted effort of psi's to tackle her, focusing all the power in a wedge with Aiken Drum at the tip, and her torturer as the "fuse"? Good stuff. What a heady time it was for me when I read May's work. In about a five or six year period, I discovered the following works: the Pliocene Exile series, Kurtz's Deryni series, Barbara Hambly's Time of the Dark series, the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever, the Xanth and Phaze novels by Piers Anthony, Zelazny's Amber novels, the Shannara books, the Belgariad, the Dragon Riders of Pern, Varley's Titan, Wizard, and Demon, the Ringworld books, and the Silmarillion. Can you imagine coming new to all that in five years?? I was *never* without something exciting to read, and was always breathless for the next book--hell, the next chapter--to come. Don't think i can recall a more exciting time before or since in the fantasy world for me. The closest would be recently when someone in this very group (can't remember who) turned me on to the Riftwar Saga. I've been a fan of that world ever since. - Original Message - From: "B Smith" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2009 4:21:25 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I loved that series. I remember being blown away when Felice D-Jumped and nearly killed Marc Remillard. It was such surprising and scary moment. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > The result of years of reading Marvel's Handbook (with all the power levels > and comparisons listed). Also, stuff such as Julian May's Pliocene exile > series, where powers are broken down into Farsensing (telepathy/remote > sensing), Pyschokinesis, Coercion (mind control), Redaction (mind > reading/altering), and Creativity (matter/energy manipulation). > > > > I tend to think a lot about powers and how they'd be of benefit. I tend to > break them down into offensive (e.g., Cyclops' optic beams, Wolvie's claws), > defensive (Juggernaut's invulnerability, Blob's mass of blubber, Storm's > winds applied at a foe), information gathering/stealth (telepathy, > invisibility, intangibility), and special powers (Forge's knack with > machines, mind control of Xavier, etc). > > > > So, when thinking of a superpower I'd like to have, I try to think of one or > two that cover the gamut and would give one as many tools as possible. > Magneto, Storm, Graviton, and Xavier--all of which could be called > "elementals"--are tops in the list for covering all bases. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Kelwyn" > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:10:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Wow. I am just Pinky to your Brain! (I guess we can say you have thought > about this). > > ~rave! > > The Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? > Pinky: I think so, Brain, but if they called them "sad meals" no one would > buy them. > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > > > > > Yeah, teleportation is a good power, one of my favs too. Allows one to > > avoid danger, wreak all kinds of havoc(facing an army? No biggie: just > > 'port behind their lines, or 'port a bomb into their midst then skedaddle). > > I also like intangibility, as it's a great one for covert ops and > > resistance (avoidance) to injury. I like intagibility over invisibility > > because with the former you can get into and out of anything, while > > being invisible doesn't help if you can't pick the lock on a vault, or > > can't figure a way to get around pressure plates or temperature sensors. > > > > > > > > I like the standards of strength, speed, and invulnerability too, but I > > tend to lean toward powers that are more diverse in usage. Thus, for me > > it'd be strong telekenesis (flight, lifting objects, forcefields), or maybe > > manipulation of gravity or magnetic fields a la Graviton and Magneto. Those > > powers allow one to control just about everything. Also like Storms weather > > manipulation, which can be devastating on a large or small scale. > > > > > > > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "Kelwyn" > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 9:52:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > > quits Bourne 4 > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it > > comes on. > > > > (but, then again, telepo
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
There is no way you could have liked the movie. However, Wikipedia has pretty much the synopsis of the FlashForwards book version described and it has more focus on the science and the scifi than being a police procedural. I do not think cops are even a major feature of the book. I do not think I would like the series if I had read the book From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 3:17 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Again, Tracey, true. But I can't help but wonder what gave the producers the notion that "Jumper" could be made into escapist fare. The book itself was grim, almost from cover to cover. Davey starting out as an abused child using his ability to escape his father and relocate to Noo Yawk City, finding his mother only see her killed by a terrorist on the national news, vowing revenge on the terrorist (can't remember if he got it or not -- need to reread it) -- all makes for some dark reading. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 13:47:06 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But dont feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, whic
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Again, Tracey, true. But I can't help but wonder what gave the producers the notion that "Jumper" could be made into escapist fare. The book itself was grim, almost from cover to cover. Davey starting out as an abused child using his ability to escape his father and relocate to Noo Yawk City, finding his mother only see her killed by a terrorist on the national news, vowing revenge on the terrorist (can't remember if he got it or not -- need to reread it) -- all makes for some dark reading. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 13:47:06 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed in storyt
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I think more thought was put into FlashForward ( the TV show)than in Jumper (The Movie). Jumper was pure escapism. From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 12:40 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But dont feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" , cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Tracey, I'm not as off-put by "FlashForward" the series as I am "Jumper" the movie. Admittedly, it's been years since I read the book (1999, when it came out), and I'm not remembering all of the details of it. I tried to get it before the series began, but it's been snatched up far and wide, even at the used bookstores I frequent. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 20:22:58 -0800 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But don’t feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" , cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com; cinque3...@...; ggs...@...; cdemorse...@... > From: tdli...@... > Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 10:48:29 -0800 > Subject: [scifinoir2] Paul Gre
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
That's also true. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 04:02:52 + Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 True, that's why I put Xavier's powers on my list of some of the best. Although, one issue with telepathy would be range and accuracy. If you're infiltrating a facility, and there are security cameras, but the operator's in another part of the building, you might not be able to locate and wipe his mind in time, nor erase the recording. And then there's those pesky automated systems that you can't mind wipe--unless, like Jean Grey or Psylocke, you're blessed with TK as well as telepathy. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:35:34 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" , cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., > cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody > hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com; cinque3...@...; ggs...@...; cdemorse...@... > From: tdli...@... > Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 10:48:29 -0800 > Subject: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits > Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > he slow development of the fourth Jason Bourne flick took another hit today > as director Paul Greengrass -
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
True, that's why I put Xavier's powers on my list of some of the best. Although, one issue with telepathy would be range and accuracy. If you're infiltrating a facility, and there are security cameras, but the operator's in another part of the building, you might not be able to locate and wipe his mind in time, nor erase the recording. And then there's those pesky automated systems that you can't mind wipe--unless, like Jean Grey or Psylocke, you're blessed with TK as well as telepathy. - Original Message - From: "Martin Baxter" To: "SciFiNoir2" Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:35:34 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >, cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., > cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody > hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com ; cinque3...@...; ggs...@...; cdemorse...@... > From: tdli...@... > Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 10:48:29 -0800 > Subject: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits > Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > he slow development of the fourth Jason Bourne flick took another hit today > as director Paul Greengrass - a man as intricately linked to the films as > star Matt Damon himself - walked out on the project in a row over the script. > > Details are still sketchy, but it would appear that Greengrass wasn't happy > when Universal brought in up-and-coming writer Josh Zetumer to work on a > 'parallel' screenplay for the film, rewriting the one already penned by > Ocean's 1
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
The difference is you read the book. From what I read about the book, I do not see how you could like it unless you looked at the movie as entirely separate from the book. . But dont feel bad, people who read the book that FlashForward is based on do not like the show. I was going to read the book , but after reading about the differences, I decided to wait so that it would not cause me to make comparisons From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:36 PM To: SciFiNoir2 Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik _ To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" , cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com; cinque3...@...; ggs...@...; cdemorse...@... > From: tdli...@... > Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 10:48:29 -0800 > Subject: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > he slow development of the fourth Jason Bourne flick took another hit today as director Paul Greengrass - a man as intricately linked to the films as star Matt Damon himself - walked out on the project in a row over the script. > > Details are still sketchy, but it would appear that Greengrass wasn't happy when Universal brought in up-and-coming writer Josh Zetumer to work on a 'parallel' screenplay for the film, rewriting the one already penned by Ocean's 12 's George Nolfi. > > Greengrass has already been under pressure from Universal over the way he's handled the budget on the forthcoming Green Zone , which has suffered reshoots and a $150 million pricetag. > http://mos.totalfilm.com/images/p/paul-greengrass-quits-bourne-4-00-420-75.j pg > &
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I loved Pink and the Brain too…. sigh From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Johnson Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 12:33 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Ha-ha, ah man you took me back! Loved Pinky and the Brain! And Tiny Toon Adventures, by the way. I loved when one of the characters would break into hysterics, and then a hand would appear handing them an Oscar. Their music video segment was great too. To this day, I find myself humming "Istanbul/Constantinople!" or Aretha Franklin's "Respect", with an eye to the Tiny Toon's visuals accompanying them. - Original Message - From: "Kelwyn" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:10:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow. I am just Pinky to your Brain! (I guess we can say you have thought about this). ~rave! The Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? Pinky: I think so, Brain, but if they called them "sad meals" no one would buy them. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > Yeah, teleportation is a good power, one of my favs too. Allows one to avoid > danger, wreak all kinds of havoc(facing an army? No biggie: just 'port behind > their lines, or 'port a bomb into their midst then skedaddle). I also like > intangibility, as it's a great one for covert ops and resistance (avoidance) > to injury. I like intagibility over invisibility because with the former you > can get into and out of anything, while being invisible doesn't help if you > can't pick the lock on a vault, or can't figure a way to get around pressure > plates or temperature sensors. > > > > I like the standards of strength, speed, and invulnerability too, but I tend > to lean toward powers that are more diverse in usage. Thus, for me it'd be > strong telekenesis (flight, lifting objects, forcefields), or maybe > manipulation of gravity or magnetic fields a la Graviton and Magneto. Those > powers allow one to control just about everything. Also like Storms weather > manipulation, which can be devastating on a large or small scale. > > > > > - Original Message - > From: "Kelwyn" > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 9:52:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it > comes on. > > (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). > > ~rave! > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> , > Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was > > a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday > > night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really > > explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. > > Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big > > problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key > > things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and > > curtailed in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can > > round off those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the > > first. > > > > > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, > > rewrites, and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "Martin Baxter" > > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> >, cinque3000@, ggszig@, > > cdemor
RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
I guess I'm alone in my loathing of "Jumper"... And, in terms of psi-powers, teleportation is keen, but judicious use of telepathy could have its uses. If one wants to infiltrate a facility, one could impose a "blind spot" on everyone inside, exactly the size and shape of the person wielding the power. If one is seen, one could wipe the mind of the person who's seen them, or dredge up a memory of extreme pleasure, pain or fear to distract. Getting vault combos would be a matter of reading minds. And one could convince the head of the facility to bring the desired item out of the facility. "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com From: ravena...@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:52:23 + Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" , cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., > cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody > hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com; cinque3...@...; ggs...@...; cdemorse...@... > From: tdli...@... > Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 10:48:29 -0800 > Subject: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits > Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > he slow development of the fourth Jason Bourne flick took another hit today > as director Paul Greengrass - a man as intricately linked to the films as > star Matt Damon himself - walked out on the project in a row over the script. > > Details are still sketchy, but it would appear that Greengrass wasn't happy > when Universal brought in up-and-coming writer Josh Zetumer to work on a > 'parallel' screenplay for the film, rewriting the one already penned by > Ocean's 12 's George Nolfi. > > Greengrass has already been under pressure from Universal over the way he's > handled the budget on the forthcoming Green Zone , which has suffered > reshoots and a $150 million pricetag. > http://mos.totalfilm.com/images/p/paul-greengrass-quits-bourne-4-00-420-75.jpg > > If Greengrass has left Bourne 4 for good (and it's early days yet - he could > be lured back), Damon could well decide to remain loyal to him and refuse to > shoot with anyone else. > Pure speculation, of course, but Greengrass has made the franchise his own > and it's hard to imagine anyone else swinging in to the rescue. > Unless, that is, Bourne Identity director Doug Liman fancies a break from > Jumper 2 and mourning his cancelled Knight Rider TV reboot... >  Without Greengrass, will Bourne be the same? Should Damon stick by his > side? Sound off below... > > > http://www.totalfilm.com/news/paul-greengrass-quits-bourne-4?cid=OTC-RSS&attr=news&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+totalfilm%2Fimdbnews+%28Total+Film+IMDb+aggregate%29 > > > > > Get gifts for them and cashback for you.
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Ha-ha, ah man you took me back! Loved Pinky and the Brain! And Tiny Toon Adventures, by the way. I loved when one of the characters would break into hysterics, and then a hand would appear handing them an Oscar. Their music video segment was great too. To this day, I find myself humming "Istanbul/Constantinople!" or Aretha Franklin's "Respect", with an eye to the Tiny Toon's visuals accompanying them. - Original Message - From: "Kelwyn" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:10:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow. I am just Pinky to your Brain! (I guess we can say you have thought about this). ~rave! The Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? Pinky: I think so, Brain, but if they called them "sad meals" no one would buy them. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > Yeah, teleportation is a good power, one of my favs too. Allows one to avoid > danger, wreak all kinds of havoc(facing an army? No biggie: just 'port behind > their lines, or 'port a bomb into their midst then skedaddle). I also like > intangibility, as it's a great one for covert ops and resistance (avoidance) > to injury. I like intagibility over invisibility because with the former you > can get into and out of anything, while being invisible doesn't help if you > can't pick the lock on a vault, or can't figure a way to get around pressure > plates or temperature sensors. > > > > I like the standards of strength, speed, and invulnerability too, but I tend > to lean toward powers that are more diverse in usage. Thus, for me it'd be > strong telekenesis (flight, lifting objects, forcefields), or maybe > manipulation of gravity or magnetic fields a la Graviton and Magneto. Those > powers allow one to control just about everything. Also like Storms weather > manipulation, which can be devastating on a large or small scale. > > > > > - Original Message - > From: "Kelwyn" > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 9:52:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it > comes on. > > (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). > > ~rave! > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was > > a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday > > night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really > > explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. > > Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big > > problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key > > things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and > > curtailed in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can > > round off those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the > > first. > > > > > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, > > rewrites, and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "Martin Baxter" > > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >, cinque3000@, ggszig@, > > cdemorsella@ > > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > > quits Bourne 4 > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in > > bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com ; cinque3000@; ggszig@; cdemorsella@ > > From: tdlists@ > > Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 10:48:29 -0800 > > Subject: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits > > Bourne 4 > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > he slow development of the fourth Jason Bourne flick took another hit today > > as director Paul Greengrass - a man as intricately linked to the films as > > star Matt Damon himself - walked out on
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
The result of years of reading Marvel's Handbook (with all the power levels and comparisons listed). Also, stuff such as Julian May's Pliocene exile series, where powers are broken down into Farsensing (telepathy/remote sensing), Pyschokinesis, Coercion (mind control), Redaction (mind reading/altering), and Creativity (matter/energy manipulation). I tend to think a lot about powers and how they'd be of benefit. I tend to break them down into offensive (e.g., Cyclops' optic beams, Wolvie's claws), defensive (Juggernaut's invulnerability, Blob's mass of blubber, Storm's winds applied at a foe), information gathering/stealth (telepathy, invisibility, intangibility), and special powers (Forge's knack with machines, mind control of Xavier, etc). So, when thinking of a superpower I'd like to have, I try to think of one or two that cover the gamut and would give one as many tools as possible. Magneto, Storm, Graviton, and Xavier--all of which could be called "elementals"--are tops in the list for covering all bases. - Original Message - From: "Kelwyn" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:10:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 Wow. I am just Pinky to your Brain! (I guess we can say you have thought about this). ~rave! The Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? Pinky: I think so, Brain, but if they called them "sad meals" no one would buy them. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > Yeah, teleportation is a good power, one of my favs too. Allows one to avoid > danger, wreak all kinds of havoc(facing an army? No biggie: just 'port behind > their lines, or 'port a bomb into their midst then skedaddle). I also like > intangibility, as it's a great one for covert ops and resistance (avoidance) > to injury. I like intagibility over invisibility because with the former you > can get into and out of anything, while being invisible doesn't help if you > can't pick the lock on a vault, or can't figure a way to get around pressure > plates or temperature sensors. > > > > I like the standards of strength, speed, and invulnerability too, but I tend > to lean toward powers that are more diverse in usage. Thus, for me it'd be > strong telekenesis (flight, lifting objects, forcefields), or maybe > manipulation of gravity or magnetic fields a la Graviton and Magneto. Those > powers allow one to control just about everything. Also like Storms weather > manipulation, which can be devastating on a large or small scale. > > > > > - Original Message - > From: "Kelwyn" > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 9:52:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it > comes on. > > (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). > > ~rave! > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was > > a lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday > > night, and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really > > explain why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. > > Hayden Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big > > problem. The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key > > things left unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and > > curtailed in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can > > round off those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the > > first. > > > > > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, > > rewrites, and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "Martin Baxter" > > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >, cinque3000@, ggszig@, > > cdemorsella@ > > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > > quits Bourne 4 > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > > > "If all the world's a stage and all th
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4
Yeah, teleportation is a good power, one of my favs too. Allows one to avoid danger, wreak all kinds of havoc(facing an army? No biggie: just 'port behind their lines, or 'port a bomb into their midst then skedaddle). I also like intangibility, as it's a great one for covert ops and resistance (avoidance) to injury. I like intagibility over invisibility because with the former you can get into and out of anything, while being invisible doesn't help if you can't pick the lock on a vault, or can't figure a way to get around pressure plates or temperature sensors. I like the standards of strength, speed, and invulnerability too, but I tend to lean toward powers that are more diverse in usage. Thus, for me it'd be strong telekenesis (flight, lifting objects, forcefields), or maybe manipulation of gravity or magnetic fields a la Graviton and Magneto. Those powers allow one to control just about everything. Also like Storms weather manipulation, which can be devastating on a large or small scale. - Original Message - From: "Kelwyn" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 9:52:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4 I second the emotion on "Jumper." My daughter and I watch it every time it comes on. (but, then again, teleportation IS my favorite super power). ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > You know what? I didn't hate "Jumper". It was weak, for sure, but there was a > lot to like about it. My wife and I saw it with a crowd on a Saturday night, > and had no regrets. Sure, Sam Jackson overacted, they didn't really explain > why his group felt Jumpers were an abomination in God's eyes. Hayden > Christenson is not exactly a scintillating actor, which was a big problem. > The script was a bit spare, the movie too short, and some key things left > unfulfilled. (ringing endorsement, eh?!) > > > > But all that being said, it was still an enjoyable time waster. The jumping > was good, and the possibilities only hinted at here are limitless. In some > ways it reminds me of the first X-Men movie, which, while defintely way > better in comparison, was also a bit rushed, light on plotting, and curtailed > in storytelling. I'm thinking that, like X2, maybe Jumper 2 can round off > those rough edges and show the promise I saw and enjoyed in the first. > > > > I have no evidence of this at all, but the first flick seemed to be one of > those put together after studio/director wrangling, budget issues, rewrites, > and a rushed shooting schedule. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Martin Baxter" > To: "SciFiNoir2" < scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >, cinque3...@..., ggs...@..., > cdemorse...@... > Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:53:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass > quits Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > Let's all channel these thoughts... > > "Mister Liman... 'Jumper 2' is CRAP... move back to 'Bourne'..." > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody > hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com ; cinque3...@...; ggs...@...; cdemorse...@... > From: tdli...@... > Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 10:48:29 -0800 > Subject: [scifinoir2] Paul Greengrass quits Bourne 4: Paul Greengrass quits > Bourne 4 > >  > > > > > he slow development of the fourth Jason Bourne flick took another hit today > as director Paul Greengrass - a man as intricately linked to the films as > star Matt Damon himself - walked out on the project in a row over the script. > > Details are still sketchy, but it would appear that Greengrass wasn't happy > when Universal brought in up-and-coming writer Josh Zetumer to work on a > 'parallel' screenplay for the film, rewriting the one already penned by > Ocean's 12 's George Nolfi. > > Greengrass has already been under pressure from Universal over the way he's > handled the budget on the forthcoming Green Zone , which has suffered > reshoots and a $150 million pricetag. > http://mos.totalfilm.com/images/p/paul-greengrass-quits-bourne-4-00-420-75.jpg > > > If Greengrass has left Bourne 4 for good (and it's early days yet - he could > be lured back), Damon could well decide to remain loyal to him and refuse to > shoot with anyone else. > Pure speculation, of course, but Greengrass has made the franchise his own > and it's hard to imagine anyone else swinging in to the rescue. > Unless, that is, Bourne Identity director Doug Liman fancies a break from > Jumper 2 and mourning his cancelled Knight Rider TV reboot... >  Without Greengrass, will Bourne be the same? Should Damon stick by his > side? Sound off below... > > > http://www.tot
