Re: CS>Argyria cure
Hi Paul: You can view a summary of the information here: http://www.silvermedicine.org/argyria.html On this page, there are links to the actual forum discussions, in two seperate threads, that outline 3 different cases of argyria cured. http://www.silvermedicine.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=13 Mineral Supplement and water cure, also contains an individuals account of the laser cosmetic cure. http://www.silvermedicine.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=28 Silver Toxicity and Argyria Cured; case handled by Dr. Ziem ( retired ) at John Hopkins Center for Environmental Medicine. The most significant addition with the second case, is the addition of steam sauna therapy to an aggressive supplement and water protocol. Best Regards, Jason - Original Message - From: "Paul Holloway" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2005 8:31 AM Subject: CS>Argyria cure > Hi List, > > A man on another list I frequent has drinking CS made with > tapwater (yes, I know) and is now developing argyria. > I have explained to him what he has been drinking, but I know > there is a protocol for eliminating it. I am having trouble > finding it in the archives. Would someone be so kind as to > enlighten me? > > Thanks, > > Paul H > > > > -- > The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. > > Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org > > To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com > Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html > > Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com > OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html > > List maintainer: Mike Devour > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.6.10 - Release Date: 01/10/2005 > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.6.10 - Release Date: 01/10/2005
Re: CS>Argyria cure
Hi Paul, There must be more to argyria than just drinking CS made with tap water. I have been making and taking CS made with tap water, roof water, river water and well water and bottled around varous parts of South Africa for the past 10 or 12 years. No argyria here personally or with any of my family or friends. And no complaints as far as I know. I make and sell the ColSilGen cc which is a colloidal silver generator with constant current set at 1mA and using a single 9v battery. Two silver rods 2.5mm diameter and 75mm long and clamped at 10mm spacing. Basically the advice is two to three minutes per 250ml of water or 40 to 60 minutes per 250ml for distilled water. 1 teaspoon per day up to 3 tablespoons, three times per day, depending on circumstances. That is max of 135ml per day (about 1/2 a cup). 1/3 to 1/2 the dose to babies or children. Is it dose related? I have taken CS as drinking water for a few days, (2 to 3 litre per day on a desert hiking trip) with no remarkable effects. Is it related to the water treatment? I would really like to know. regards, Tony On 11 Jan 2005 at 16:31, Paul Holloway wrote: > Hi List, > > A man on another list I frequent has drinking CS made with > tapwater (yes, I know) and is now developing argyria. > I have explained to him what he has been drinking, but I know > there is a protocol for eliminating it. I am having trouble > finding it in the archives. Would someone be so kind as to > enlighten me? > > Thanks, > > Paul H > > > > -- > The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. > > Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org > > To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com > Silver List archive: > http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html > > Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com > OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html > > List maintainer: Mike Devour
Re: CS>Argyria cure
Re: CS>Argyria cure From: Tony Moody Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 10:49:28 http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m76893.html [...] > I make and sell the ColSilGen cc which is a colloidal silver > generator with constant current set at 1mA and using a single 9v > battery. Two silver rods 2.5mm diameter and 75mm long and clamped > at 10mm spacing. Basically the advice is two to three minutes per > 250ml of water or 40 to 60 minutes per 250ml for distilled water. > 1 teaspoon per day up to 3 tablespoons, three times per day, > depending on circumstances. That is max of 135ml per day (about > 1/2 a cup). 1/3 to 1/2 the dose to babies or children. > Is it dose related? I have taken CS as drinking water for a few > days, (2 to 3 litre per day on a desert hiking trip) with no > remarkable effects. Is it related to the water treatment? > I would really like to know. > regards, > Tony Hi Tony, Silver electrolysis should only be done with pure distilled water. For plain water, and assuming your constant current source goes into full limiting as soon as current is applied, a current of 1mA for 3 minutes in 250ml will liberate 1.609ppm of silver ions. (Calculations provided at the end.) This is an insignificant amount of silver, and most of the ions will probably combine with various contaminants in the water. If you are relying on this to protect you against water-borne disease, I'd recommend boiling, or any of the other proven methods for purifying water. It is not possible to calculate the amount of silver liberated in your distilled water example, since the voltage across the cell is too low. The initial resistance of the dw will allow only a small current to flow. The current will build up slowly, but it is doubtful the current limiter will go into full limiting during the brew cycle. Since we do not know the average current, we cannot calculate the amount of silver liberated. Best Regards, Mike Monett The following uses Roger Schafly's Mercury Solver, available at http://archives.math.utk.edu/software/msdos/calculus/mrcry209/.html Conversion Factors ~~ Coulombs = I * Seconds; total number of Coulombs CoulombsGram = 107.868 / 96485; Coulombs per gram of silver Grams= CoulombsGram * I * Seconds ; Faraday's equation Litres = Millilitres / 1000 ; convert millilitres to litres Milligrams = Grams * 1000 ; convert grams to milligrams ppm = Milligrams / Litres; 1 ppm is 1 milligram per litre Seconds = Hours * 3600 + Minutes * 60 ; get seconds Parameters ~~ I = 1e-3; current in Amperes Minutes = 3 ; minutes Millilitres = 250 Results ~~~ Coulombs = 0.360 Litres = 0.250 Milligrams = 0.402 Millilitres = 250.0 Minutes = 3.000 ppm = 1.609 -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour
Re: CS>Argyria cure
Hi Mike, If I had to use only good distilled water I wouldn't have any CS. Exorbitantly expensive and a round trip of 350km and tastes/smells like diesel. If I was selling CS and wanted shelflife then I would go the route of making a double or triple distiller. Yes, I estimated 2 to 5ppm for 2 to 5 minutes. So we are in the order of magnitude there. :-) If 2 to 5 ppm works and is not harmful in any way then why go higher?? And if I am drinking the water anyway, can adding some silver to it make it worse? From my point of view adding some silver is better than doing nothing. Using my rig and iv quality distilled water and no stirring, the current increased slowly and then accelerated (logrithmic?). With intermittent stirring, the current would drop back partway and rise again. I probably still have my notes but it was several years ago. I notice that you have no parameter for electrode spacing; nor for agitation or flowrate past the electrodes. Both are very important practical considerations in my view. As important as current density, which also does not seem to appear in your calcs either. Tony On 12 Jan 2005 at 16:57, Mike Monett wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > Silver electrolysis should only be done with pure distilled water. Why? > > For plain water, and assuming your constant current source goes into > full limiting as soon as current is applied, a current of 1mA for 3 > minutes in 250ml will liberate 1.609ppm of silver ions. > (Calculations provided at the end.) OK > > This is an insignificant amount of silver, and most of the ions will > probably combine with various contaminants in the water. What do you mean by insignificant? Works for me and others. Heh! What are contaminants to you are what make delicious mountain spring water for me. > > If you are relying on this to protect you against water-borne > disease, I'd recommend boiling, or any of the other proven methods > for purifying water. > > It is not possible to calculate the amount of silver liberated in > your distilled water example, since the voltage across the cell is > too low. The initial resistance of the dw will allow only a small > current to flow. The current will build up slowly, but it is > doubtful the current limiter will go into full limiting during the > brew cycle. > > Since we do not know the average current, we cannot calculate the > amount of silver liberated. > > Best Regards, > > Mike Monett > -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour
Re: CS>Argyria cure
Thanks for all the advice on this. I will pass it on to this person. Best wishes, Paul H -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour
Re: CS>Argyria cure
Re: CS>Argyria cure From: Tony Moody Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 10:12:58 http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m76924.html > Hi Mike, > If I had to use only good distilled water I wouldn't have any CS. > Exorbitantly expensive and a round trip of 350km and tastes/smells > like diesel. If I was selling CS and wanted shelflife then I would > go the route of making a double or triple distiller. You mentioned using dw in your first post. Strange it is so difficult to get. Are there any power plants nearby that use deionized water for their boilers? How about hospitals? Can you have it shipped to you? > Yes, I estimated 2 to 5ppm for 2 to 5 minutes. So we are in the > order of magnitude there. :-) If 2 to 5 ppm works and is not > harmful in any way then why go higher?? How do you know it works? Probably most of it combines with contaminants in the water and is not available to kill bugs. You seem to be strong and healthy, and have not yet experienced a life-threatening infection. So you are not yet aware of your own mortality. I used to be like you, but things change as we have different experiences and grow older. You begin to see what can go wrong instead of expecting everything will work fine. > And if I am drinking the water anyway, can adding some silver to > it make it worse? From my point of view adding some silver is > better than doing nothing. Do a google search on purifying water for hikers. There are some extremely dangerous bugs out there. The small amount of silver you are adding won't have any effect on them. You are deluding yourself. > I notice that you have no parameter for electrode spacing; nor for > agitation or flowrate past the electrodes. Both are very important > practical considerations in my view. As important as current > density, which also does not seem to appear in your calcs either. I was the one who alerted the list to the importance of current density in my ULVDC posts several years ago. I have included the full conversion factors at the end for your use. However, I did not feel it would be worth the time to convert your metric dimensions to inches. Electrode spacing is of no concern in your system since you use water with unknown conductivity. Current flow has no effect on the maximum available ppm. Your system is out of control. You have no idea what your initial current is, and it will change every time you dip your glass in a stream. You have no tests to confirm it is working, or if you are actually getting any useful silver ions from the brew. You should at least do a milk test to see the effect of your cs. > On 12 Jan 2005 at 16:57, Mike Monett wrote: >> Hi Tony, >> Silver electrolysis should only be done with pure distilled >> water. > Why? You don't know what contaminants are in the water that will combine with the silver ions and render them useless. Even distilled water needs constant monitoring to ensure your process is working. You have no controls on your process at all, and you don't know if it is working or not. >> For plain water, and assuming your constant current source goes >> into full limiting as soon as current is applied, a current of >> 1mA for 3 minutes in 250ml will liberate 1.609ppm of silver ions. >> (Calculations provided at the end.) > OK >> This is an insignificant amount of silver, and most of the ions >> will probably combine with various contaminants in the water. > What do you mean by insignificant? Works for me and others. Heh! > What are contaminants to you are what make delicious mountain > spring water for me. How do you know it works? Silver ions may have no effect on the common water-borne parasites, especially in the extremely low concentration you use. You do not know what animal may have urinated or defecated upstream, and what kind of parasites have infected it. Also, you do not know if a fish or other animal died and is decomposing upstream. And you have no idea if humans dumped toxic waste in the water to get rid of it. You have no knowledge of any unknown contaminants in the water. These can combine with the silver ions and render them useless. You have no tests to verify the effectiveness of the brew, and you don't know what you are drinking. My guess is a standard milk test with your 1.6ppm cs may actually go bad faster than plain milk:) Mike Monett Complete List of Conversion Factors for Silver Electrolysis ~~~ Coulombs
Re: CS>Argyria cure
Matthew suggests: > Can you collect rainwater on a clean plastic surface > (e.g. nylon umbrella, inverted, or plastic tarpaulin)? And, Tony, if you are in an area where there's a lot more sunshine than rain, how about solar distillers? Be well, Mike D. [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@eskimo.com] [Speaking only for myself... ] -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour
Re: CS>Argyria cure
On 17 Jan 2005 at 15:13, Mike Monett wrote: > Re: CS>Argyria cure > From: Tony Moody > Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 10:12:58 > http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m76924.html > > > Hi Mike, > > > If I had to use only good distilled water I wouldn't have any CS. > > Exorbitantly expensive and a round trip of 350km and tastes/smells > > like diesel. If I was selling CS and wanted shelflife then I would > > go the route of making a double or triple distiller. > > You mentioned using dw in your first post. Strange it is so > difficult to get. Are there any power plants nearby that use > deionized water for their boilers? How about hospitals? Can you have > it shipped to you? Yes that was many years ago while I lived in a city. Not so strange really; this is South Africa. The nearest operating powerplant is about 1200km and is nuclear, so I'll skip that. The other one is about 2000km the other way and those are coalfired. Anyway I wouldn't touch boiler condensate because it has all sorts of stuff including chloramines in it. Hospitals; I try not to go near them. > > > Yes, I estimated 2 to 5ppm for 2 to 5 minutes. So we are in the > > order of magnitude there. :-) If 2 to 5 ppm works and is not > > harmful in any way then why go higher?? > > How do you know it works? Probably most of it combines with > contaminants in the water and is not available to kill bugs. Well it really works very well topically on wounds, scalds and zits. and fairly well on herpes infections ( I think it needs to be applied often to work to completion.) It is an excellent underarm deodorant but doesn't last long enough for me. It stops BO immediately. It is really good and quick for settling upset stomach due to bad food. It works on colds if taken soon enough and often enough. > > You seem to be strong and healthy, and have not yet experienced a > life-threatening infection. So you are not yet aware of your own > mortality. I'm offended by your judgements and assumptions. I'm certainly not going to get into a little pissing contest comparing wounds and diseases with you. > > I used to be like you, but things change as we have different > experiences and grow older. You begin to see what can go wrong > instead of expecting everything will work fine. Umm, I'll just ignore this. > > > And if I am drinking the water anyway, can adding some silver to > > it make it worse? From my point of view adding some silver is > > better than doing nothing. > > Do a google search on purifying water for hikers. There are some > extremely dangerous bugs out there. The small amount of silver you > are adding won't have any effect on them. You are deluding yourself. > > > I notice that you have no parameter for electrode spacing; nor for > > agitation or flowrate past the electrodes. Both are very important > > practical considerations in my view. As important as current > > density, which also does not seem to appear in your calcs either. > > I was the one who alerted the list to the importance of current > density in my ULVDC posts several years ago. I have included the > full conversion factors at the end for your use. However, I did not > feel it would be worth the time to convert your metric dimensions to > inches. Electrode spacing is of no concern in your system since you > use water with unknown conductivity. Current flow has no effect on > the maximum available ppm. Mike, I think you are deluding yourself. There was a heated debate involving many able people and all parameters many years before you made an appearance on this list. I saw "use less than 10.7uA/mm^2" in an email from Ole Bob well before the end of 1999. > > Your system is out of control. You have no idea what your initial > current is, and it will change every time you dip your glass in a > stream. You have no tests to confirm it is working, or if you are > actually getting any useful silver ions from the brew. You should at > least do a milk test to see the effect of your cs. Mike, You do not know what you are talking about. I remain offended by your assumptions. Tony > > > On 12 Jan 2005 at 16:57, Mike Monett wrote: > > >> Hi Tony, > > >> Silver electrolysis should only be done with pure distilled > >> water. > > > Why? > > You don't know what contaminants are in the water that will combine > with the silver ions and render them useless. Even distilled water > needs constant monitoring to ensure
